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straight wall rifle cartridge questions

16K views 95 replies 37 participants last post by  NVScouter 
#1 ·
As the title states. What is the hot ticket? Which caliber and why do you say so...? Anyone have an idea as to which will shoot the flattest? I'd like 200 plus yard capibilitys... Good retained energy? Best all around caliber for whitetail deer sized game and the occasional coyote, some nice affordible range shooting ... You know a nice all round gun.
Thanks
Sean
 
#28 ·
You might want to consider a pistol caliber.
44 mag out a rifle is pretty hot and effective at 200 yards.
I hunted with a 45 colt lever rifle this year.
I shot one deer with it. I shoot about 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards with open sights and sandbag. At 150 yards I consistenly hit a 10" circle.

The 45 long colt can be loaded to about 95% of a 44 mag. and components are cheap compared to other calibers.

The short cartridge also cycles quickly and allows the magazine to hold 10 rounds making it lots of fun to plink and practice.
 
#29 ·
I shoot about 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards with open sights and sandbag.
I have a Winchester 94 in .45 LC and it groups the same. I have a Marbles adjustable popup tang mounted peep sight for it, but have not yet installed and zeroed it.
 
#30 ·
I almost got my mod 94 in .45LC but since I already had several .44's, it was more practicle for me to get it in .44 mag. I've had it for about 15 years and have fired bucketfulls of rounds through it just plinking, but I've never hunted with it. I'm thinking of taking it hog hunting next month.
 

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#32 ·
I am looking for a straight walled cartridge for deer hunting. In Illinois you can set up a TC Encore pistol in any length barrel. I shoot from a box blind with a rest so weight of gun and a long heavy barrel with a muzzle brake will not be an issue.
So far I am locking in on the 444 Marlin with an 18" or longer bull barrel.
Is there any other straight walled cartridge that matches or beats the 444 in ballistics & energy?
I need to buy an Encore pistol frame or an Encore pistol
I would also purchase an Encore rifle if the price was right for a usable barrel.
Any links or advice would be appreciated.
 
#38 ·
I would go with 45-70 because I already have one and I reload for it. I have it in a Marlin Guide Gun.

If you reload, it can be loaded down to mouse fart loads up to Elephant stompers, provided you're not using an old trap door design. (Marlin or Ruger No 1 or 3).

Straight walled cases aren't known for the flatness. Unless something has changed, the Hornady Leveluotion bullets aren't sold as componets.

Does Procomp reload?
 
#44 ·
agree here. Even a .357 magnum out of a rifle will be devastating to a deer. I met a guy a few weeks ago who killed several of them in Indiana last year with a .357 rifle, H-110 powder and some variation of a Gold Dot hollow point. He said that one of them which turned from broadsize to facing away from him was so badly destroyed that he had to bury it


I find it hard to believe that a 357 magnum could destroy enough of a deer that it would have to be buried. There had to be something usable on that deer. Or perhaps the guy telling the story was full of shit or just too lazy to do something with the deer.
 
#46 ·
When I was living in N. KA. I used a 94 Marlin in .357 with 158 gr jsp at 2400 fps behind H110 and never had a deer destroyed by it. Ive taken 7 with it all one shot kills also & with very little meat damage. I feel that story is overflowing with BS myself & from actual use with the .357 on them.
 
#45 ·
50-120 Sharps why bother with the little ones....:laughing:

I have also used the 45-70 for elk with 1 shot kills out of my older Marlin 95 lever gun with a 300 grain jacketed flat nose speer bullet at 2000 FPS.

Way overbore for a Whitetail or Mulie though with that load, but it will peg it to the ground & then some from doing it once, went back to a smaller caliber for deer.
 
#47 ·
500 fpe @ muzzle was the legal minimum for handgun hunting when I lived in IL.
For .357 only "premium" factory ammo will will exceed 500 fpe, so it's a borderline cartridge.

.357 158 gr JHP H110 max load 17.0 grains.
1309 fps
= 601 ft/lb of energy

That's enough to be legal, but not enough to "badly destroy" a whitetail
 
#54 ·
Please take your hunting license, tear it into small pieces, and flush it down the toilet.
I don't have a hunting license, fucktard. It's not even legal to hunt with a rifle in the state that I live in. Read the thread or shut the fuck up.
 
#60 ·
I guess somebody in legislature owns one, because it looks like an exception to the maximum brass length given in the reg.

I noticed 460 S&W wasn't on the list so I checked. Sure enough, it has a 1.800" case length (over the reg).

500 S&W is *exactly* at 1.625" (their max limit).
 
#65 · (Edited)
Totally ignoring the hunting drama and going back to the main question. Don't think you can go wrong with a 45-70. .450 Marlin has nothing on 45-70 hand loads if you rifle is strong enough to deal with the cup rating. The flexibility available when loading your own 45-70 should make it a no brainer for just about anything on the planet (North America at the very least).

Some super good reading that is focused on the Marlin 1895 but has a TON of 45-70 info -- http://www.realguns.com/archives/036.htm

Edit: And for the record - I have one - hella fun :D
 
#68 ·
I have never done much shooting with slugs, but I have read of some slugs being pretty accurate. I cant imagine a pistol bullet being anymore accurate than a slug. Time to do some searching.
 
#69 · (Edited)
Okay, I found this from the Hornady website. its about their new SST slugs:

"Hornady’s NEW SST™ Shotgun Slug allows you to bring unheard of accuracy and terminal performance to slug-only areas. The super-accurate SST™ bullet delivers sub-2" groups at 100 yards; and the flattest trajectory on the market."

At 200 yards, they claim:
velocity: 1341 fps
energy: 1198 ft/lb
trajectory: -6.2" when zeroed at 150 yds

I'll bet there are some other slug manufacturers that can equal that, I like the ballistic tip design of the Hornady slug though.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
The 45 long colt only has a muzzle energy of 460 ft/lbs.
Even the 454 Casul only has 1100 ft/lb of energy at 100 yds.
The 500 S&W has 1939 ft/lb of energy at 100 yds. only 146 ft/lb more than the SST slug at the same yardage. But a box of 20 500 S&W costs $ 73.00

Granted it would be slightly more with a rifle, however it would not be close to Hornadys slug. I got the pistol information from the Remington home page, they have a lot of good information with a ballistics program you can download for free.
With the restrictions on case size and I was dead set just dead set on hunting with a rifle, I think I would spend my money on a good slug barrel and look for some good quality slugs.
 
#75 ·
Take a gander at the latest copy of Outdoor Life, they spent a fair bit of time testing and compiling data on accuracy, MV etc. of the various slugs and saboted slugs made (roughly 10,000 rounds out of a bench gun), interesting read iffen yer a detail addict.

D.
 
#71 ·
It would be hard to beat sub 2" groups at 200 yards with any pistol cartridge, even out of a rifle. I shoot 180gr Hornady xtp's with the plastic sabots in my muzzleloader and cant get below 6" at 200 yards
 
#73 · (Edited)
How about the 405 Winchester for Illinois? Illinois does not have a cartridge length limit. Just straight walled cartridge.

I have shot 4" groups with my Knight disc at 200 yards, 3/4" groups at 100 yards.
 
#90 ·
Actually the ballistics on the new slugs are more than what you might think. They ain't like the slugs of yesteryear. My cousin made a clean kill at 200 yards plus a little. Not that I would recommend making that shot but he felt comfortable with it and new his bullet drop.
I shot a 3 inch group with my Knight disc at 200 yards. With a range finder you can stretch your limitations a little.
For some reason I never got notification of idiot boys reply. I just couldn't let that pass unanswered.
May be an old thread but it's a goody.
I'm shooting the 444 Marlin Leverevolution ammo & liking it.
 
#93 · (Edited)
I'm purty sure I had you pegged the first time around. I read and participated in the whole thread so maybe it was you that didn't read the thread & all of the included posts thoroughly.
Silly boy

What black powder shoots to 300 yards? I might want one. Or at least the specifics.
I'm looking for a crossbow as I can't draw a bow anymore. Good attitude you have for us old broken folk. Idiot. Oops I did it again. So sorry you're a dumbass with a lot of mouth
 
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