I figure a TeraLow with the 2wd Low is around $1400 if not more before it's all said and done....

The Atlas should be around $2800 (not sure) with rebuilt driveshats...

My 4.56's are good on the road with 33's, but offroad, especially on the rocks - they just aren't enough...I already have the JB SYE, and I figure the teralow would be the most cost effective...I have a D30 front, Dana 44 rear with Detroits.. going to 34" swampers...

Any opinions appreciated...

Thanks,

Jason

Neither!

Flip a D300 and put it in. 4:1, twin stick shorter than atlas and almost as strong for around $1400. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

This is more like a JU topic, <IMG SRC="smilies/thefinger.gif" border="0"> but the way I see it.... If you stay with a 4 cyl. or I6 then the Tera is fine. If you are planning to go V8 spend the money and go for the strength. IMHO

I disagree. 4 cyl, yeah I guess terra low. But 6 cyl or up I want ATLAS all the way (probly cause I got one <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0"> ) I like to abuse my chit...and the Atlas can take some real punishment <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Agree with the above post. Unless you are way hardcore running 38" tires or bigger and serious power, just put in the teralow.

Atlas. By the time you spend all the money on a 231 to get the 4:1 and the 2wd low, you could have spent a little more and have the atlas with all that already on it. Plus you can sell the 231 with the SYE to recoup some of the cost of the Atlas.

Originally posted by Billy Badass:
<STRONG>Atlas. By the time you spend all the money on a 231 to get the 4:1 and the 2wd low, you could have spent a little more and have the atlas with all that already on it. Plus you can sell the 231 with the SYE to recoup some of the cost of the Atlas.</STRONG>
You can do the same by flipping a 300, save yourself at least $800 and unless your running 38+ you'll never break the 300 <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Atlas. Keep checking around on price. The one you posted strikes me as high, even w/ the d/s included. Also, you can cut down on your cost by having the front d/s shortened to use on the rear.

[ 10-09-2001: Message edited by: AzJeep ]

If you are going to modify your jeep anymore in the future, deffinetly go with the Atlas. If you are going to stay with 34s and nothing more, go with the 300. If you throw money into a d300, it is still just a 300. It is the D44 vs D60 logic, why not go bigger?

ATLAS Rustys has the cheepest I have seen. Why spend so much money to still have a chain drive? Good if you go bigger, Good if you get a second trail rig. Just good all together.

Originally posted by Eddie Mcstiff:
<STRONG>ATLAS Rustys has the cheepest I have seen. Why spend so much money to still have a chain drive? Good if you go bigger, Good if you get a second trail rig. Just good all together.</STRONG>

where is rusty's? also what is the price for the optional hd front output? 1350 yokes? do they make 1410 yokes for the atlas? just curious. thinking of getting one soon.

www.rustysoffroad.com (http://www.rustysoffroad.com)
$1990 for the 4.3 $1820/ 3.8 Call for other prices and info.

Originally posted by high5:
<STRONG>where is rusty's? also what is the price for the optional hd front output? 1350 yokes? do they make 1410 yokes for the atlas? just curious. thinking of getting one soon.</STRONG>Yes, I believe 1410 yokes are available at additional cost however. <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">

This does sounds sbit JUish, and it sounds like a tera kit will do this fella just fine.
I am planning for an Atlas myself. Like Keith"When my trailers a rockin don't come a knockin" Strong said, I don't believe the tera will hold up to even a 6cyl.

I also think the 300 Flip Kit is the way to go, maybe because I got one and I love it. I think if you can afford the atlas then get it after all it is the best tcase out there, but if you want to save some money and still get a cast iron gear driven tcase w/ twin sticks then order the Flip Kit. Just my $.02

The altas is only marginally stronger than the 300, upgrade the to the Advance mainshaft and their equal, plus the 300 is shorter <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by JasonTJ:
<STRONG>The altas is only marginally stronger than the 300, upgrade the to the Advance mainshaft and their equal, plus the 300 is shorter <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


Plus if you go to 60's later, you can just flip the 300 over and have pass side drop. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Hey, there you go, just do the 60's at the same time! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Push the rear axle back buy a Klune and run a level transfer case and have the best of all worlds.....till that chain breaks....

Thanks...appreciate all the help....

Guess I need to save for the Atlas...I have the 6 cylinder...dammit...

I went with the Atlas. I didn't want to spend the money and still have to worry that someday, sometime I might break or need to upgrade. I sleep well at night knowing I have a Atlas..
<IMG SRC="smilies/glasses.gif" border="0">

i guy up here on my local board has made the flip kit and a underdrive for the dana300. it is a sweet looking unit. i am wondering if anyone out there has done the same thing (home made flip). i am trying to figure out how to do it cause i don't want to spend 1000 cdn on the kit. so any ideas. here are the pics of the home brew unit. http://www.bc4x4.com/ubb/Forum4/HTML/000535.html

Originally posted by BIG PERM:
<STRONG>Thanks...appreciate all the help....

Guess I need to save for the Atlas...I have the 6 cylinder...dammit...</STRONG>


i am using the tera low, but soon will be goin to atlas and a 435 tranny.....


the tera has held up pretty damned good, runnin 39.5's at this time... the atlas was not or just out when i bought my tera, i would of went atlas if ida known....

btw i know a place you can get a used tera <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Just got my Atlas 4.3 install done. It is worth the money. Total cost with new drivelines was under $2500 for everything. Install, flat skid work and drive shafts. Had to do some of the work myself but it drives nice.

I am running the Teralow and couldn't be more happier. It was an easy enough install and the peformance is great, it was just like that feeling after getting lockers for the first time of oh wow this actually makes a huge difference and I can't believe I lived without it!

Originally posted by JasonTJ:
<STRONG>The altas is only marginally stronger than the 300, upgrade the to the Advance mainshaft and their equal, plus the 300 is shorter <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

What strength tests is this based on? I must have missed it.

D300, flip kit, 4 to 1, twin stick, mainshaft upgrade---what does this all cost?

just curious

Originally posted by TJoop:
<STRONG>What strength tests is this based on? I must have missed it.

D300, flip kit, 4 to 1, twin stick, mainshaft upgrade---what does this all cost?

just curious</STRONG>

Good point, sounds like the D300 setup may be the most expensive option of all.

And lets all stop pretending that the D300 is even in the same league as the Atlas. An Atlas is actually designed closer to an NP205 than any other case (actually a D300 design is pretty similar to an NP205 also, but the size of the parts don't even compare). The D300 is designed for light vehicles like stock Jeeps and is similar in strength to a 231, D20, D18 etc.

Originally posted by Monster-Z:
<STRONG>Good point, sounds like the D300 setup may be the most expensive option of all.

And lets all stop pretending that the D300 is even in the same league as the Atlas. An Atlas is actually designed closer to an NP205 than any other case (actually a D300 design is pretty similar to an NP205 also, but the size of the parts don't even compare). The D300 is designed for light vehicles like stock Jeeps and is similar in strength to a 231, D20, D18 etc.</STRONG>

The Atlas design was based on the Dana 300, but where the Dana 300 starts to fail is with HIGH HP and 38"+ tires, call advance and ask em your self. That's what the Atlas was designed for. The 300 is gear driven and is closer in strength to the Atlas than the 231. ITs not as strong as the atlas because of the output shaft.

As far as $$$, I spent $1400 for a 300 with a flip kit, and a 4:1. The local shop quoted me $2300 for an Atlas II not including shifters. You tell me what is cheaper???

So basicly MHO is you are running a Jeep with no plans on going 38+ and a built V8, than an Atlas is overkill and a waste of $$$, unless you have it to spare. Let's face facts most ppl would never break the 231.

Originally posted by JasonTJ:
<STRONG>The Atlas design was based on the Dana 300, but where the Dana 300 starts to fail is with HIGH HP and 38"+ tires...</STRONG>

I guess I am just biased against the TeraLow D300. I had one in my Scout with 33" tires and a 180,000 mile V-8 (read: very tired) and I managed to strip the teeth off the low range gears <IMG SRC="smilies/mad.gif" border="0">. Another person in my club actually broke the rear low range gear in half with a 4.2 and 35's. In fact, 3 of the 4 people I know with D300 4:1's have broken the low range gears. I've never seen the supposedly weak rear output break.

Have you ever looked at how thin the low range gears are in a D300? They're less than half the thickness of Atlas gears (which are about the same as NP205 gears).

I agree with your last statement however , most people will never break the stock 231, especially with a HD SYE. <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

[ 10-12-2001: Message edited by: Monster-Z ]

The 231 is fine untill the Fwakin chain starts to strech and makes fun sounds in 4-low!

Originally posted by JasonTJ:
<STRONG>
As far as $$$, I spent $1400 for a 300 with a flip kit, and a 4:1. The local shop quoted me $2300 for an Atlas II not including shifters. You tell me what is cheaper???

</STRONG>

ok so d300, flip kit, 4 to 1 --- $1400

Add around $500 for output shaft upgrade and let's say (guessing) $100 for twin stick
and you are at $1800


There are Atlas' out there for near that price. And they all include shifters. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by Monster-Z:
<STRONG>Have you ever looked at how thin the low range gears are in a D300? They're less than half the thickness of Atlas gears (which are about the same as NP205 gears).

</STRONG>


Exactly.

If anyone is lookin for a Atlas give me a call Monday should be able to beat any price 1-800-504-jeep

Originally posted by TJoop:
<STRONG>ok so d300, flip kit, 4 to 1 --- $1400

Add around $500 for output shaft upgrade and let's say (guessing) $100 for twin stick
and you are at $1800


There are Atlas' out there for near that price. And they all include shifters. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"></STRONG>


The flip kit includes the twinstick shifter...duh!

Originally posted by DUG:
<STRONG>
The flip kit includes the twinstick shifter...duh!</STRONG>

Oh now that changes everything <IMG SRC="smilies/laughing.gif" border="0">

If I get one more prob with my 231, it's getting ditched....Although the cost of the Atlas out here is pretty hideous at the end of the day there's no comparison.

The 300 Flip Kit was designed to be an upgrade in vehicles equipped with a N.P. 231.
The Atlas is a great case but it's not for everyone, neither is my flip kit. If you want to run 350hp+ and 40's or 44's by all means you need an Atlas. More often than not I see guys in TJ's that are running 33's or 35's blowing chain's and looking for an upgrade that won't break the bank! A 300 with a flip kit(includes Twin Stick) installed in a YJ or TJ for under a $900
The front shaft only's has to be shortened and have a new one built for the year. Same thing as a SYE. As for a 4:1 and a HD output shaft, By the time you add these in the price is close. Keep in mind there is a new 4:1 kit and HD output coming to market soon and as these will help drive the price down.
You have got to remember A.A. does not want come down on the HD output in fear of loosing Atlas sells. We tell people not to do the HD output until you break your stock one. A 300 flip kit and 4:1 are $1400 and with a 4.0L you are more likely to get struck by lightning than break a output shaft.

Alright guys, I'm totally stressing about this decision, so help me out, make it for me please.

I've got a tired four-banger YJ, but also a SM420, so it's 7:1 going into the xfer. I've already got the output conversion, but I've got to go into it again for a true neutral conversion (don't ask) and prob. chain (it's got 120k miles, quite a bit of off-road). So that's at least $250. A Tera in there and it would be about $1300

An Atlas 3.8 would be $1820, plus $300 in driveshaft mods (I carry spares). I understand it is 100lb heavier, and hangs an inch lower (that last is kinda a biggie).

Gotta make the decision now, cuz I'm pulling the tranny for a new seal, gonna build a new skidplate, and I need that true neutral.

Oh, I run 35s, and may stay with 'em for a while, due to 4 cyl. and D30.

Sooo...?

if you can swing it, go with the Atlas. A lot of terra users eventually go to the Atlas, but who with an Atlas ever yanked it out for stocker with a terra kit?

Got the money go with the Atlas got more money? by two atlases and give one away. <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/usa.gif" border="0">

Anyone who wants to give an atlas or a good 231 away I need a new case for my XJ and I'm broke <IMG SRC="smilies/frown.gif" border="0">

Originally posted by squarefour:
<STRONG>

I understand it is 100lb heavier, and hangs an inch lower (that last is kinda a biggie).
</STRONG>


The Atlas weighs around 110 lbs. As far as hanging down, it can be clocked in several positions.

As far as Atlas or Tera... There is nothing to think about here Atlas all the way unless you want a weak point in your driveline chain driven or gear driven come on!!!!!!

As far as that flip kit fuck that shit.... You guys prices are off big time......

Flip Kit - $800
Dana 300- $150-$200
Tera Low- $750.00
Any adapters that you mide need $$$$$
So when all said and done you are looking at $1,800.00 or maybe a little more.

Atlas= $2000.00 with sticks pay more than that your an idoit whoever told you 2,800 for a atlas is out of there mind, many shop will do it for $2000.00 with sticks. So maybe a little more but you have the strength of a bulletproof T-case and its much stronger than the 300 its just based on the D300 that about it....

I went through the whole shit myself and when down east 4x4 told me 800 bucks for a flip kit get the fuck out of here... So I have an Atlas now well worth it......

Well what if your in my position. I finally got all of my other shit done, now im left with engine, tranny and transmission then im all done. I want a 4.1 but dont want to spend the money and put it in the np231. If i get an atlas, i know down the road ill be getting a different tranny, so then the atlas wont even work any more. And your probably saying do it at once. Well i wish i could afford to do a swap like that at once.

What tranny are you running know?? I mean I got my Atlas for my T18 know I am going to run a NP 435 it will still work just need the right adapter and everything will bolt up the atlas will fit a bunch of trannys..

I mean your rocking 38's everything else seems bulletproff and you want to weaken your drivline with a 4;1 in a 231, you are going to want to uprade anyway i figure do it once get the tranny you want and go with the atlas..

Originally posted by JasonTJ
The altas is only marginally stronger than the 300, upgrade the to the Advance mainshaft and their equal, plus the 300 is shorter <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">


You are smoking crack dude...If you look at the catalog, they compare the gears of the 300 with the Atlas and the Atlas is about 30% bigger...the output is not the only part that is better!

I run the teralow in my XJ. I got it brand new for $750 shipped to my door. I also went for the 2wd low kit. The first case Tera sent to me was the wrong spline count. After having the customer service guy pretend he was the tech, they overnighted me a new case when all I needed was the 23 spline input shaft. After ripping apart the case numerous times before a trail ride the next day it still wasn't right and all types of shit was wrong. Tera messed up again and sent me a 23 spline that was too long. Missed the trail ride as a result. I ended up putting the new input shaft in and that worked. But, The 2wd low kit was machined wrong and was notchy and not engaging right. Take the case back apart again and rip the 2wd low out and send it back. Its finally in and works awesome but it is super noisy like a mexican street fair. Tera has a big ego and poorly informs there customers. Me and my buds have over 30 hours into my Tcase because of all the shit tera put me through. A Atlas would have saved me all that hassle and headache. As for the D300 I am still skeptical about the kit for money and the lubing process.

The atlas is the way to go hands down. I regret building my 231 , I also regret building a cherokee. However, I dont regret getting it on with some big ol black chicks.

:smokin: :beer:

Originally posted by Scout Dude



You are smoking crack dude...If you look at the catalog, they compare the gears of the 300 with the Atlas and the Atlas is about 30% bigger...the output is not the only part that is better!

Yeah, but when was the last time you saw damage other than the output shaft on a 300 (other than the cheap gears tera origionally marketed with their 4:1) ? Overall length does also have an advantage to some of us :D

Its hard to find any application where the Atlas II wouldnt be the best hardware for the job, if cost is no concerne.
But a D300 with all of the upgrades and ratio improvements, is right at the top also.
An NP231 with all of the upgrades, and gearing, is also a good T case. But the strength of the Atlas and D300, become increasingly more valuable as Horsepower increases.

But, I can think of no down side to using an Atlas as your 1st choice, even when cost is factored in.

Atlas all the way.....

both :flipoff2:

hey, not all of us have $2200 to fork out in our rigs. The tera low is good for the people that take small steps while building their rig. Not everyone runs 38"ers and dana 60's. In fact, i'd say the VAST majority of people do not run a setup like that. It just seems like it here on the pirate board.

"WIDEJ"

"hey, not all of us have $2200 to fork out in our rigs. The tera low is good for the people that take small steps while building their rig. Not everyone runs 38"ers and dana 60's. In fact, i'd say the VAST majority of people do not run a setup like that. It just seems like it here on the pirate board."


True.... but the debate was about D-300 with the flip kit and all the other upgrades versus the atlas, if you are going to spend $1700 - $1800 why not spend a little more and get the bullet proof atlas......

I have nothing against the Tera low, A buddy of mine runs it in his XJ I mean he is an asspipe homo but anyway, he likes it and it works well. If your budget is $1000 bucks for a T-case than building up the 231 is the way to go. But if you want to do it once and do it right than you got to go Atlas.

I mean I look at it like this, I want to have the performane of the best pair of Nike Air,s out there, But I am rocking the Air Force Ones that i bought at K-mart with the double velcro straps, I am not going to send them out to nike so they can upgrade them to be like the hottest nikes out.... No I am going to spend the cash and get the Nike Air's YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN JOEY!!!!!!::
:smokin: :smokin:

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeezus !!

I had to open this thread to see if the fifty fawkin one responses was a typo or just one guy saying "Atlas" and 50 other guys saying "what he said".

Man - I hate a tech question that turns into a bunch of guys defending their own prior decisions to the death, no matter what.

Why the fawk doesn't anyone ever admit their mistakes ('cept you Rob.....let's see - 30 hrs, even at $25 /hr is $750!). Man - I'm the king of polishing turds - I have a hybrid D30/D44 with a Detroit and new Spicer Gears and Moser shafts!!!! Shoulda built an RR60!

Here's the facts.......The Atlas is the best tool for the job. If there's any way you can afford it, buy it. If you can't afford it, then you have no decision to make ....buy the best you can afford.

if you can swing it, go with the Atlas. A lot of terra users eventually go to the Atlas, but who with an Atlas ever yanked it out for stocker with a terra kit?

THIS is a very good point - and holds for most things in life. When have you ever spent the extra for quality (tools, furniture, whatever..) and looked back in 2-3 years and thought....damn, i wish I'd bought the cheap crappy Harbout freight / IKEA / whatever junk.

H8Monday - what the fawk are we going to do about this place - it's gone to the dogs ! I must be as bored as you (fawkin MIG machin ran out of wire on Boxing dat, halfway through getting the Rockstompers on...nice planning !!) By the way - I learned a neat jeep trick...my tire pressure gauge fits in the glove box :D

...the thread does say "Atlas or Tera Low." I'm just a little out of order.

I'm just a little out of order.

You're out of order.....I'm out of order....this whole damn thread's out of order :D

(what was that movie?)

Originally posted by BillaVista


You're out of order.....I'm out of order....this whole damn thread's out of order :D

(what was that movie?)


"Scent of a Woman"

And I oughta take a flame thrower to this place!

Hooowaah

Right actor, wrong movie... it was And Justice for All

Ahh, uhh, Atlas. Save your $ and do it right first time.

I guess I am just biased against the TeraLow D300. I had one in my Scout with 33" tires and a 180,000 mile V-8 (read: very tired) and I managed to strip the teeth off the low range gears . Another person in my club actually broke the rear low range gear in half with a 4.2 and 35's. In fact, 3 of the 4 people I know with D300 4:1's have broken the low range gears. I've never seen the supposedly weak rear output break.

gee you know that many on the rock crawling circuit use the dana 300 for reliability...sounds like your group needs lessons on driving.....I would guess you guys are mudders huh?

Every person that I know that had the terra low 4 to 1 in their dana 300 broke them. When I inspected them the gears had a very wavy pattern across the tooth of each gearset from different drivers. After examinig 5 sets all with the same patterns I contacted terra , that went real far! Every tooth including the ones not broke had fractures in them visable by the eye. All of these gears were purchased at the same time at the same place so I would say that the were faulty!


GO ATLAS AND YOU WILL NEVER REGRET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111:D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Every person that I know that had the terra low 4 to 1 in their dana 300 broke them. When I inspected them the gears had a very wavy pattern across the tooth of each gearset from different drivers. After examinig 5 sets all with the same patterns I contacted terra , that went real far! Every tooth including the ones not broke had fractures in them visable by the eye. All of these gears were purchased at the same time at the same place so I would say that the were faulty!

I bet you guys took pics huh?....I mean if atheyare that bad then you will need the evidence.....how about showing us the pics