Hydraulic tube Bender Question

[cebby]

The pump uses a o-ring on the output, and appears to use a NPT return.

My input and output were both o-ring (mine came with a standoff on the valve already). I needed to add a straight adapter to the other side also since the pump motor gets in the way of tightening everything down.

http://rigs.corequipment.com/Cebby/Shoptools/Bender/Progress521%20010%20(Medium).jpg

The cylinder from Jay K's writeup also uses an o-ring fitting (larger than the pump fitting IIRC)

[guinea13]

I got this unit:

Cheap pump (http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2005080100434183&item=9-6410&catname=hydraulic)

and a the prince ram just like Jay's Hydro Bender (http://www.mindspring.com/~jayk5/bender/) along with hose and control valve.

For those looking - Northern Tool changed a few of the fittings part numbers.

They are now:

51ARC008 - 90 deg 1/2" NPT elbow
51CSC128 - reducer bushing 3/4" M-NPTF to 1/2" F-NPTF

I got my o-ring and NPT swivel fittings from the Carquest in Vallejo.

The pump uses a o-ring on the output, and appears to use a NPT return.

No, I haven't done anything more with it at this time.

My current cart plans is different from what everyone else has posted - my driveway is level in one direction only, so I'm planning on going vertical with the bender and ram. I also need the ability to unbolt and lay it all flat for storage. I almost have more tools than garage space now.

I also believe this will make certain bends easier, for I will be able to simply level the tube with a bubble level straight up and down and bend away.


That Pump and Cylinder combination will only be able to put out about 3.1 to 3.9 tons of force. The limiting factor being the pump having such a low operating pressure of 880 - 1100 psi.

I don't know it will be enough to bend tube.

Mine is overboard but pushs out between 8.4 - 11.? tons (if I am right, Can't remember anymore) and pushes between 2500 and 3200 psi.

[tdavis]

That Pump and Cylinder combination will only be able to put out about 3.1 to 3.9 tons of force. The limiting factor being the pump having such a low operating pressure of 880 - 1100 psi.

I don't know it will be enough to bend tube.

Mine is overboard but pushs out between 8.4 - 11.? tons (if I am right, Can't remember anymore) and pushes between 2500 and 3200 psi.

a) the pressure relief is adjustable, and set for 1100 from the factory. It really is easy to up (pull the cap, turn the screw, replace cap).

b) Look at jay's page, the specs are close; his is at max 2000psi.

[guinea13]

a) the pressure relief is adjustable, and set for 1100 from the factory. It really is easy to up (pull the cap, turn the screw, replace cap).

b) Look at jay's page, the specs are close; his is at max 2000psi.


1100 PSI is is the maximum pressure according to the specs. on the suplus page. Unless I am missing something your not going to get anymore out of it.

I did see jay's page. Read the whole things about a year ago. His setup will run a max of 2000 psi which nets to about 7 tons of force with his ram setup.

Adding 900 psi of pressure adds about 3 tons of applying force.

[tdavis]

Well, that's possible.

It could also be a typo - why put a 1100psi adjustable bypass on a 1100psi pump? Something doesn't look right to me.

I'll let everyone know when it works..

[chadjans]

Is there anyway to have the electrics come on only when the valve is open so you don't hear the motor going all the time?

Chad

[cebby]

Is there anyway to have the electrics come on only when the valve is open so you don't hear the motor going all the time?

Chad

The pump isn't loud at all. Turn on the radio. :flipoff2:

[cebby]

I'm making a modification to the bender. Due to how difficult to it is to remove the center die pin, I've decided to drill out the die pivot hole in the arms (both the stationary and movable arms) for a 1 1/4" bushing. This should eliminate some of the binding I'm experiencing (when trying to remove the pin). I don't have a bit this big, so I'm having a buddy (who has a metal shop) enlarge the holes for me.

Here's the bushings:
http://rigs.corequipment.com/Cebby/Shoptools/Bender/Bushings%20(Medium).jpg

McMaster Carr
P/N 7815K56 (http://www.mcmaster.com/ctlg/DisplCtlgPage.asp?reqtyp=catalog&CtlgPgNbr=1007&sesnextrep=526323327756947&CtlgEdition=111&k1=7815K56&t1=PN&ScreenWidth=1920&McMMainWidth=1713#scroll)
Alloy 932(SAE 660)BRNZ Flanged-Sleeve Bearing, For 1" Shaft Diameter, 1-1/4" Od, 1" Length

[guinea13]

Why not just sand the hole a little so it has some play and add a little grease.

[cebby]

There's a little more to it...

I tried sanding the hole/greasing the pin. Didn't seem to make much of a diffference unfortunately.

What's happening is the bottom movable arm is "riding up" on the pin and digging in. The bushing should minimize/eliminate that since it will isolate the pin from the arms.

The other thing this will help with is that the arms won't be flopping around when I pull the center pin to remove the die.

[cebby]

Here's the bushing installed. I need to run my 1" drill bit down through the hole in the bushing. Seems to be a hair too tight to get the pin in.

http://rigs.corequipment.com/Cebby/Shoptools/Bender/Bushings%20001%20(Medium).jpg

[guinea13]

Looks good. I wonder how it will hold up (the bushing that is). Let me know how the testing goes.

[Wazzobie]

my M-tech5 bender comes with a bushing and it seems to hold up fine


Since I'm posting I guess I will share some of the few things I found anoying about the M-tech bender


The main thing that sucked about the M-tech bender was that the follower shoe dose not come with any spacing to space up the follower shoe if you dont realize (like me) it will bend the shoe while retracting the hydro ram.

The 2nd anoyance is the line of site to line up where bend starts is very hard to see with no previsions designed into the bender for that. I have to say for the $ they charge for these things they could have easyly designed it a little different to make it a user friendly unit. :rolleyes:

[cebby]

When I saw the M-Tech came with the bushing, I figured it would be a good addition to my JD2. Should hold up just fine. Hell the bushings are $4 or so each, so when (if) they wear out, they'll be replaced.

[cebby]

Finally got my writeup done... :flipoff2:

Cebby's Bender (http://reference.toolandfab.com/writeups/hydrobender_webpage/index.htm)

[Wazzobie]

Finally got my writeup done... :flipoff2:

Cebby's Bender (http://reference.toolandfab.com/writeups/hydrobender_webpage/index.htm)

I think it looks killer


actuly the colors not that bad either :cool2:

[Sloppy]

Awesome write up...

[Rokcrler]

WOW!!! Kickass man... :beer:

[fabcam]

Nice job Cebby,

The write up has got to be one of the best I have seen.

[cebby]

Nice job Cebby,

The write up has got to be one of the best I have seen.

Thanks all - I'm planning to enhance it just a bit further - still want to add a pic identifying all of the hose connections (my Photochop skill are a little rusty) and I'll be adding a downloadable/printable PDF with full size pics in it to the writeup.

[cebby]

The tweaks are done. Added a downloadable PDF version of the writeup and PDF of just the Parts List.

[guinea13]

Very nice writeup!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the props.. :beer: :beer:

[cebby]

Very nice writeup!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the props.. :beer: :beer:

I give credit where it's due my man! Thanks!!

[w83toy]

Well I don't know how much time I spent reading this but wow :eek: Nice work you guys have done. Just might have to give it a shot building one myself now :) I was all set in getting a manual bender but was reluctant because of the space required and a fixed mounting spot.

[cebby]

so what's the difference between the protools dies and the jd2 dies? the position of the holes?

anyone have drawings for the protools dies?

Thanks

This goes the whole way back to post #320. :flipoff2:

I want to add some info to my writeup about the differences between the JD2 and Protools models (arms and dies). Anyone know the differences?

I also need to get a few pics of some Protools dies (I have my JD2 dies for other pics). I need 800x600 size pics if anyone can help me out.

[raiderfanz1]

Hi everyone, new to the forum so be gentle. I need info on an electric hydraulic pump. It's a single-phase 220/230 volt 2 hp motor. Similar to the one used on the model 4 bender (1.5hp). It even has the hand remote. I can get it to run fine (fluid out) but when I push the return button nothing happens. Does there need to be pressure in the line or is it wired wrong. Any thing helps.

[cebby]

Hi everyone, new to the forum so be gentle. I need info on an electric hydraulic pump. It's a single-phase 220/230 volt 2 hp motor. Similar to the one used on the model 4 bender (1.5hp). It even has the hand remote. I can get it to run fine (fluid out) but when I push the return button nothing happens. Does there need to be pressure in the line or is it wired wrong. Any thing helps.

We need more info. Could be the control button/wiring or the valve.

[cebby]

so what's the difference between the protools dies and the jd2 dies? the position of the holes?

anyone have drawings for the protools dies?

Thanks

This goes the whole way back to post #320. :flipoff2:

I want to add some info to my writeup about the differences between the JD2 and Protools models (arms and dies). Anyone know the differences?

I also need to get a few pics of some Protools dies (I have my JD2 dies for other pics). I need 800x600 size pics if anyone can help me out.

Anyone?

[rubyred]

hi my name is ryan im looking to make a tube bender with hydros the only thing i dont get is how to put the mandrols on it what is the esaiest way to make one pics help a lot

[raiderfanz1]

I have a few pumps available, some with hand controls. They're 2hp 220/230 volts but can be wired for 110/120 volts. They're the same ones used on the Model 4 benders. All you need is the control valve.

[Sapper]

Okay Here is what I know about this unit.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=212229&stc=1&d=1130374058

PARKER PUMP MOTOR POWER UNIT

COMES WITH A BALDOR INDUSTRIAL MOTOR

M14A 91871313-01
SPEC M34F12-282
1HP
VOLTS 230/460
AMPS 3.6/1.8
R.P.M. 3450

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=212228&stc=1&d=1130374058


I was going to run this on 230V but when I got it and was about to wire it up I noticed that it looks like the motor is ment for a 3 phase power supply? Am I missing something here? There is only 2 hots and a ground on normal 230 VAC household power but this motor has 1 set of leads that would be tied together and capped and then 3 other sets of lead and the ground is inside the case?

I know that when you have a 3 phase motor that to reverse rotation all you have to do is change any 2 wires to change rotation, and this motor says "Interchange any 2 wires to reverse rotation"???

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=212230&stc=1&d=1130374058

[guinea13]

I think it is saying change 1->7 and 2->8 to 1->8 and 2->7 or change any of the of the combinations of lines 1, 2, 3 to 7, 8, 9 to get reverse rotation.

As for phase: What does it say on the panel? I can't read it from the picture. It looks like 3 phase. Do you have 3 phase? Because I don't think you can run a 3 phase motor on single phase power without a phase converter to generate the 3rd leg.

[Sapper]

No I read the panel again and it is a 3phase motor. I got the assembly off of ebay for $180 but it never listed the motor as 3 phase. I guess I will have to get a new motor as I don't have 3 phase power in the residence. If I could do everthing at work I would be fine.

Anything special about 1Hp motors for this application other than 3450 Rpm?

I took the motor off of the pump and it has a roll pin threw the keyed shaft on the motor output and it is a flat adaptor (almost like a screwdriver) that drives the pump.

[guinea13]

I am assuming you are keeping the pump assembly.

If so, you are going to want to get a motor that will mate up to the that pump. Check the frame type, bolt mounting pattern, shaft size and shaft length. Also try keep the HP the same.

[TheBandit]

I did see jay's page. Read the whole things about a year ago. His setup will run a max of 2000 psi which nets to about 7 tons of force with his ram setup.

Can anyone verify that the Haldex-Barnes power Jay and Cebby are using actually puts out 2,000psi? Via gauge preferably?

It has a 2,000psi relief, but the motor is only 1hp, corresponding to about 1,180psi for the given pump flowrate (0.097in/rev @ 3450rpm). 2,000psi with the same flowrate would require about 1.7HP. I'm worried that loading the pump to 2,000psi for extended time periods could overload the motor. Sample calculation attached.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=216347&stc=1&d=1132712611

[cebby]

I'd guess that 1180 psi is no load and 2000 psi is full load, right?

I got an instant headache when I looked at that formula, so I'll just go buy a T fitting and a gauge soon.

[TheBandit]

No... 1180psi is at rated load (1hp). Unloaded, there is no pressure delivered by the pump. I am guessing the 2,000psi relief is for when the cylinder hits the end of its stroke. That short period of operating the pump at 2,000psi is probably not going to hurt the motor. But running it at 2,000psi for a significant duty cycle could damage the motor.

Let me know when you install a gauge, I would love to verify my bending calculations against your operating pressures (while bending tube)

[guinea13]

Did the database go down or something. I can't find any of the posts I made yesterday?

Anyways,

I don't feel like typing out what I wrote last time. So, here is the short hand version.

The valve has a bypass or pressure release which will just recirculate the fluid back to the tank. Cebby's bender has a valve with a 1000-3000 psi range and his is set at 1500 psi from the factory.

I will try and get you some pressure measurements (since I have a guage on mine).

[customfab]

Rule of thumb:
Horsepower=(GPMxPSI)/(1714xEfficency)

So if you want 3 GPM@2300psi(g):

HP=(3GPMx2300psi(g))/(1714x0.95Efficency)
HP=6900/1628.3
HP=4.23 with 5HP being the closest motor.
Use the right graph to figure out what RPM you need to spin the pump with your 4.23/5HP motor to achieve 3GPM@2300psi(g).
From the chart it looks like right around 3000 RPM would acheive what you want (The Red Lines).
Left graph appears to be HP vs. GPM.

FYI. The assumption of "left graph appears to be HP vs GPM" is INCORRECT. The x-axis for each graph is RPM. So left is HP vs RPM.

[Sapper]

I purchased my cyclinder this weekend but after looking at all the pictures mine seems huge in comparison to what most people are using. I purchased a 3" bore 24" stroke cyclinder but it just seems so large.

I rememeber in one of the write ups that was the size to use but it looks to me that most are using 2.5" bore?

[cebby]

I purchased my cyclinder this weekend but after looking at all the pictures mine seems huge in comparison to what most people are using. I purchased a 3" bore 24" stroke cyclinder but it just seems so large.

I rememeber in one of the write ups that was the size to use but it looks to me that most are using 2.5" bore?

I used 3x24. Yes, it's big and heavy.

[guinea13]

I purchased my cyclinder this weekend but after looking at all the pictures mine seems huge in comparison to what most people are using. I purchased a 3" bore 24" stroke cyclinder but it just seems so large.

I rememeber in one of the write ups that was the size to use but it looks to me that most are using 2.5" bore?


Mine is a 3" bore by 24" stroke. Yes it is large but very nice and pushes like all hell.

You need to calculate what tonage you want to get out of the bender. That way you can figure out what combo of pump and cylindar you will need.

With my pump I wanted around 11+ tons of force so I went with the 3" bore.
Plus mine can handle 3000 PSI of pressure which is around what my pump can put out so that is why I made the choice to use that one.

[Sapper]

Okay I guess the pictures just make them look smaller. My cylinder is rated for 3000 psi also and my pressure relief is set at 2800 psi on the pump which a single HP pump 230v.


Now I just need my lines and a valve. Trying to find the valve I want/like. I found one that had a detent to return the cyclinder to the rear once complete (similar to a log splitter valve) but you had to pull it back and it would lock/hold until the cyclinder was fully compressed/extended and then release.


Also I had made my base plate and top plate up is CAD to get laser cut to save me some time later but is there an online source for a cyclinder mount?

[customfab]

I purchased my cyclinder this weekend but after looking at all the pictures mine seems huge in comparison to what most people are using. I purchased a 3" bore 24" stroke cyclinder but it just seems so large.

I rememeber in one of the write ups that was the size to use but it looks to me that most are using 2.5" bore?


You guys have been a big help to me but if you think 3" inch is big you should see what I have to offer. I have a 4" and everytime I lift the sucker I feel that I've been doing deadlifts at the gym. I never realized how much over-kill a 4" cylinder was until it arrived. But then again I have a 5 hp, 21 amp 220V GE motor pushing my tiny little 0.571 cu/in Haldex pump. Damn that pump looks small, hard to believe a 5HP motor needs to push it for 2000 psi. Very hard to believe. The one question I have is about the flow rating. My instructions state the it is rated a 4GPM at 0 psi. So the rating is with no load.....huuummmmm?
So anyway, I added something that you guys have mentioned. A adjustable pressure control valve and two fluid filled pressure gauges (one fore & aft the control valve). My calcs show (off Haldex's ratings) that my ram with be fully extended within 19 sec so I wanted to adjust the speed depending on the radius of bend. Should be a nice feature.
I'll see what I can do to put together a write-up. Chebby did a fantastic job. I also posed a few questions directly to you guys.
BTW, I'm running Pro Tool 105HD arms.

[jasonmt]

But then again I have a 5 hp, 21 amp 220V GE motor pushing my tiny little 0.571 cu/in Haldex pump. Damn that pump looks small, hard to believe a 5HP motor needs to push it for 2000 psi. Very hard to believe. The one question I have is about the flow rating. My instructions state the it is rated a 4GPM at 0 psi. So the rating is with no load.....huuummmmm?


So anyway, I added something that you guys have mentioned. A adjustable pressure control valve and two fluid filled pressure gauges (one fore & aft the control valve).


The flow ratings of 4GPM@ 0psi are correct if it is being driven at 1800 RPM, post what style and order code of Haldex/Barnes pump that you have as the one I am thinking of is also rated 8GPM @ 3600RPM @ 0psi as well (GC 32). The flow at 0 psi is going to be a function of RPM, displacement and volumetric efficiency. Volumetric efficiency in most different styles of pumps is typically above 90% across the entire operating pressure range. If you take a look back at the pump curves posted in the beginning of the thread and mislabeled by some overwrought donkey you will notice that pressure has a negligible effect on flow rate at a given RPM (think incompressible fluid) but a large effect on HP requirements. If you have an adjustable pressure relief and an AC amp meter you can check this by setting the pressure relief as low as it will go and watch the amperage increase as you increase the relief pressure.

I am assuming that you are using an 1800 RPM motor and direct coupling it?


For controlling approach, retract and bending speeds I hope that you bought an adjustable FLOW control valve not an adjustable PRESSURE relief valve. Most spool valves have a built in adjustable pressure relief valve already.

[customfab]

The flow ratings of 4GPM@ 0psi are correct if it is being driven at 1800 RPM, post what style and order code of Haldex/Barnes pump that you have as the one I am thinking of is also rated 8GPM @ 3600RPM @ 0psi as well (GC 32). The flow at 0 psi is going to be a function of RPM, displacement and volumetric efficiency. Volumetric efficiency in most different styles of pumps is typically above 90% across the entire operating pressure range. If you take a look back at the pump curves posted in the beginning of the thread and mislabeled by some overwrought donkey you will notice that pressure has a negligible effect on flow rate at a given RPM (think incompressible fluid) but a large effect on HP requirements. If you have an adjustable pressure relief and an AC amp meter you can check this by setting the pressure relief as low as it will go and watch the amperage increase as you increase the relief pressure.

I am assuming that you are using an 1800 RPM motor and direct coupling it?


For controlling approach, retract and bending speeds I hope that you bought an adjustable FLOW control valve not an adjustable PRESSURE relief valve. Most spool valves have a built in adjustable pressure relief valve already.

Nice. Ah, accurate knowledge. I misspoke when I said pressure control. It is certainly a flow control valve as I'm running a closed center system. Thanks for the clarity on the pump rating and efficiency. I'm running model 10567 which is rated a 4GPM at 1800rpm and 8GPM at 3600rpm. And yes my GE motor runs at constant 1800rpm (http://catalog.geindustrial.com/dataSheet_motors.jsp?PID=178158&PN=N772&FAM=ac_motors&FAMID=201&Lang=EN&CC=MA&Profile=). Flow control should be a nice feature as I have no direct experience with hydraulic benders. Don't know what it too fast or too slow for my liking so why not make it adjustable.
I posted the error in that overlabel of which you speak. It had me confused at first. Same old deal on pirate...double & triple check your info.
Thanks again for the good info.

[cebby]

Someone over on TOOLandFAB asked for dims for the layout of the top half of my bender, so I whipped up the image below. Thought others might want it.

Note, my top plate and channel are different lengths - but are flush at the bender arm end. I also included dims of the notch on my top plate to clear the arm bolt when retracted.

Click image for the huge version...
http://rigs.corequipment.com/Cebby/Shoptools/Bender/PSD-topframe-dims%20(Medium).jpg (http://rigs.corequipment.com/Cebby/Shoptools/Bender/PSD-topframe-dims.jpg)

[v8eater]

I guess this is directed to Manning, cebby, or guinea13. Do any of ya'll have a sketch or diagram of the Manual arm, the one with the notches, that comes with the benders? I don't really need a hydralic right now but will be bending smaller tube like 1" - 1.25 for an upcoming sandrail.

Thanks, James L.

[guinea13]

I guess this is directed to Manning, cebby, or guinea13. Do any of ya'll have a sketch or diagram of the Manual arm, the one with the notches, that comes with the benders? I don't really need a hydralic right now but will be bending smaller tube like 1" - 1.25 for an upcoming sandrail.

Thanks, James L.


Sorry I don't. Never needed one. Maybe someone else has one.

[-MOSES-]

This is the Pro Tools Arm

[Sapper]

I guess this is directed to Manning, cebby, or guinea13. Do any of ya'll have a sketch or diagram of the Manual arm, the one with the notches, that comes with the benders? I don't really need a hydralic right now but will be bending smaller tube like 1" - 1.25 for an upcoming sandrail.

Thanks, James L.

$20 and shipping and you can have mine. I converted to hydro last year and don't need the parts anymore.

[fiftyfifty]

http://copperheadfab.com/index.php?action=productview&productid=162

[firehawk7]

I have a question regarding cebby's style bender.

I built mine from just looking at the pics on his build page, then last night I saw the dimensions on here.

But my question is regarding the return stroke of the ram. I need to lift the bottom arm and ram for it to close fully, the lower moveable arm hits the lower stationary arm. I thought about chamfering the lower arms so they act like a ramp to slide on over the other.

Has anyone else experienced this?

Mine looks like this

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/000_0374.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/100_0535.jpg

[cebby]

I have a washer between my fixed and operable arms. It measures .074".

Make sure you take something off of the spacer between the operable arms to account for this thickness so you don't get binding when trying to remove the die pin (if not, it makes the bender arms operates like a pipe clamp on the pin and makes removing the pin a major PITA)

[firehawk7]

Ok now ready for hydraulic lines and I have this on my pump

The model number is Yuken DSG-01-3C60-024-5090

What is it and can I use it instead of the 3 way valve?


http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/100_0536.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/100_0539.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/100_0541.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/firecat7/100_0542.jpg

[nutz4sand]

Hello
I just got done reading all the pages of this bender thread and was looking for input and to avoid mistakes as I am in the process of setting my PT-105 bender up on a stand and adding hydraulics to it.

My question is this. A person asked if there was anything you would do different and Guinea13 stated that you would in fact move the legs back from the die (approximatly a foot or so) due to them getting in the way of second or third bends.

I guess I am not understanding this completely but wanted to make sure I address it as mine will have more cleanrance on the die to the edge than yours did in the pics (page 10 or so) but not quite a foot and I would prefer to not build an interferance into my bender/stand.

Are the bends you had hit the legs in different planes?? (as in tube rotated certain degrees after the first bends?) Most if not all of MY bends should be in the same or close plane as the first bend I put in a tube as I am planning on mini sandrails but if I can avoid building a situation into my bender-stand then I sure wish too!

By bending in the same plane I should only need clearance off in the direction of the first bend. If you know better PLEASE shed some light for me!

I guess I am a little confused as to how you were hitting the legs and wondered mostly about that. Thank You Bill

p.s. I tried to send a email directly but I am not sure if it sent it. Thanx!

[J Hulsey]

What is the problem? I am doing the same thing and mine wants to twist the main arms up. I moved the ram to the other side and am pushing the sing arm in the direction of the swing and seems to help. There is an initial raise and then flattens out. Does this sound familiar?[QUOTE=KrebsATM02;2349189]I've been working on mine. I'm having some problems though. I mounted my bender stright off the end of a piece of 4" channel. The way it is now if I attatched the ram to the side of the channel I think it would push the swing arm straight. With a piece of tube in it there is no angle on the ram at all. Any one else have this problem?

[guinea13]

Hello
I just got done reading all the pages of this bender thread and was looking for input and to avoid mistakes as I am in the process of setting my PT-105 bender up on a stand and adding hydraulics to it.

My question is this. A person asked if there was anything you would do different and Guinea13 stated that you would in fact move the legs back from the die (approximatly a foot or so) due to them getting in the way of second or third bends.

I guess I am not understanding this completely but wanted to make sure I address it as mine will have more cleanrance on the die to the edge than yours did in the pics (page 10 or so) but not quite a foot and I would prefer to not build an interferance into my bender/stand.

Are the bends you had hit the legs in different planes?? (as in tube rotated certain degrees after the first bends?) Most if not all of MY bends should be in the same or close plane as the first bend I put in a tube as I am planning on mini sandrails but if I can avoid building a situation into my bender-stand then I sure wish too!

By bending in the same plane I should only need clearance off in the direction of the first bend. If you know better PLEASE shed some light for me!

I guess I am a little confused as to how you were hitting the legs and wondered mostly about that. Thank You Bill

p.s. I tried to send a email directly but I am not sure if it sent it. Thanx!


You hit the nail right on the head. If you are making multple bends on different planes the bends will tend to hit the legs (on some occations). I have had only a couple of time this has occured and only needed about a foot or less to clear it. Once you build a bender you will build alot of different things so I would say you will never run into it.

I also would change my 12V system to a 115V system. Don't get me wrong I like have the ability to move bender around without a wire but I can't bend a whole cage on one battery and need to put it on a charger while I finish up. The power and pumping capabiliy of a 12V system is awesome and lets not forget the main reason which is price. Until I find a resonable price for 115V that can pump like the 12V with controls like the 12V (I can buy the controls seperate) I guess I will stay with 12V.

[guinea13]

What is the problem? I am doing the same thing and mine wants to twist the main arms up. I moved the ram to the other side and am pushing the sing arm in the direction of the swing and seems to help. There is an initial raise and then flattens out. Does this sound familiar?I've been working on mine. I'm having some problems though. I mounted my bender stright off the end of a piece of 4" channel. The way it is now if I attatched the ram to the side of the channel I think it would push the swing arm straight. With a piece of tube in it there is no angle on the ram at all. Any one else have this problem?

Is your ram not straight? Sound like to much play somewhere and it is causing an angle in the ram which in turn will cause everything to twist.

Don't get me wrong. My rig twists but one about 1/4 at the most when I bending something really nasty. You can post up some pics for us to look at to see if we can spot the issue.

[nutz4sand]

You hit the nail right on the head. If you are making multple bends on different planes the bends will tend to hit the legs (on some occations). I have had only a couple of time this has occured and only needed about a foot or less to clear it. Once you build a bender you will build alot of different things so I would say you will never run into it.

I also would change my 12V system to a 115V system. Don't get me wrong I like have the ability to move bender around without a wire but I can't bend a whole cage on one battery and need to put it on a charger while I finish up. The power and pumping capabiliy of a 12V system is awesome and lets not forget the main reason which is price. Until I find a resonable price for 115V that can pump like the 12V with controls like the 12V (I can buy the controls seperate) I guess I will stay with 12V.

Thanx for the input. I will see if I cannot eek a little more out of mine distance wise from the pin to the base but that sorta interferes with my layout. I was concerned about this for some time with this layout and figured after looking at literally hundereds upon hundreds of buggy pics most buggy bars are in the same plane. If I do need a 90 I cannot bend with my bend I will make it a different tube and notch it.

Before I scored this 115 volt pump/motor/reservoir I got I was looking at the 12 votl systems as well. I would have bought on if the right deal had came up simply becuase I like the idea of no cord.

I recall you have like a 900 and some CCA battery. Ever think of adding a second? You could simply switch the battery leads if need be or go a little fancier with a RV battery separator/charger. Switching leads would be easy and two battery chargers (one for each) would be simple and pretty cost effective. I am also pretty sure they also sell manual switches like hotrod cars have to disconnect the battery but for RV's its a switch to switch from one to the other.

Any chance you have a pic of you doing one of those bends that comes around to hit the bender stand? If not no biggy but I am just curious. Thanx either way. Bill

Oh yah I almost forgot. The saw horse style bender stands have that cylinder pinned at one end and the moving arms of the bender holding the other. This causes the bender pins to bind and may be part of the twisting problem too. You need to figure out a way to support the cylinders weight.

I hope its not considered a bad thing but here is a link to another site where the guy figured out his bind problem and a way to support the cylinder. Its why I have a trunion mount cylinder to help balance it. But if I ever go to a tie rod type I will do something similair to this.

http://www.offroadfabnet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5112

[J Hulsey]

I didnt take any pictures before I changed it but I moved the ram to the other side of the main beam and helped alot. I guess pushing more in the swing of the arm helped.

[puppy]

Here is mine. Built it several years ago.

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee110/puppyjp/Bender/IMG_1179.jpg