OK, who's running Rancho 44044's on their Scout II??




















O-wait, ME!!

Few pics of last nights project: Ripped out the IH 2wd PU springs I tried, NICE and flat, LOTS of negative arch, but dissapointing droop.

IH springs on top, 44044's under:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000001.jpg


the 44044's instauled: If you look closely you can see where I redrilled the front towers. 1" up and 1" back. The frame was extended 3" from stock.
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000006.jpg

Front flex: remeber, cold, NEW springs, should limber up some more, but ALLOT better than what I had before, about 34" under the forks:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000008.jpg

Side: MUCH better droop then the PU springs:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000009.jpg



I know, pics are hard to make out, it was dark. I'll try and snap some more as I finish it up. Still a bit to do and I haven't had a chance to drive it yet......

Looks pretty good, Mark.

How did you extend the frame? I see some steel on the outside of the corner at the front core support body mount.. but the front view looks like you might've sleeved inside the frame..

Looks like the 44044 springs have an offset center pin.. why not just reverse them?

Are they significantly longer than the 1110 springs?

If I just kept the frame stock and built the towers and put the spring bushing pin as far forward as possible, would the tires stay out of the firewall? :D

How about some "axle to bump stop bracket" or frame measurements to compare with other rigs.

See just how much "lift" is in 'em.

Ben, didn't you have those springs on your Scout? Why did you not like 'em again?

Originally posted by tsm1mt

Ben, didn't you have those springs on your Scout? Why did you not like 'em again?

Nope, I run ProComp 51413s in the front of my pile. I thought about the Rancho 44044s but they are more expensive and 2" longer, and I would have had to redo my hangers. I really like the springs I have in now, the ones I didn't like were stock CJ-7 Rears w/ and add-a-leaf, they were too sagged out.

Looks good Mark. http://www.pirate4x4.com/ubb/icons/icon14.gif

I'm the one that has them on the front. I hope they work better for you than they do for me. I am pulling a leaf out of them before I go out again....

Originally posted by Scout Dude
I'm the one that has them on the front. I hope they work better for you than they do for me. I am pulling a leaf out of them before I go out again....


Are they too stiff then?

Mark's running an SV 392.. vs. a 305 SBC.. maybe with the extra weight they'll work better?

Originally posted by tsm1mt
Looks pretty good, Mark.

thanks :D

How did you extend the frame? I see some steel on the outside of the corner at the front core support body mount.. but the front view looks like you might've sleeved inside the frame..

3"X4"X1/8" rect. tube, welded off the original frame. I then added a 1/4" thick plate to the side for added stregnth. The towers are 3.5"X3.5"X1/4" square, which gives me the 3" ID for 2.5" springs. They are also set at a 31.5" center line, as opposed to the stock Scout 30.5" BTW the frame on a SII is only 33" outside to outside, not as nice as an 80/800.


Looks like the 44044 springs have an offset center pin.. why not just reverse them?

Are they significantly longer than the 1110 springs?

yep, 2" off set, 47" long (opposed to Stock Scout 43), the short side IS to the front :D. The 1100 springs I was trying were 46" with a centered pin, hence the frame extended like it was. The 44044's allowed me to to move the front mounting point back, I'll trim/reshape my towers shortly.


If I kept the frame stock and built the towers and put the spring bushing pin as far forward as possible, would the tires stay out of the firewall? :D

duno, maybe, have to play on a ramp some more. I'm at like 102.5" now. Looking at it, I could probably have used my old towers (all-a Jim Weed, but shorter) and been fine, but that wasn't the original plan. Besides, the winch is getting burried were the crossmember used to be, so my approch should be MUCH better than with the old winch bumper. All told it should be only 4" longeer than if there was no bumper at all.

How about some "axle to bump stop bracket" or frame measurements to compare with other rigs.

See just how much "lift" is in 'em.


bumps stops??? I ain't got any anymore. Have to measure to the frame and subtract what the bracket would have given.


so far so good on the springs, not sure why Scout Dudes are so stiff, but IIRC, he has a Chebby motor, were as I have the IH anchor. They get nice and flat when stuffed. I hope to see how they perform after the new year... or sooner if the gods smile on me:D :D

http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000010.jpg

Originally posted by RustoleumWhite


3"X4"X1/8" rect. tube, welded off the original frame.


Just welded onto the face.. 'k..


duno, maybe, have to play on a ramp some more. I'm at like 102.5" now.


Thinkin' on it.. the more forward the better. If you want to run bigger tires you'll have interference problems with the firewall, which is a lot more work to fix than just cutting the fenders forward a bit more.

OTOH, move it too far and you might need to be careful about axle to pan clearance.

http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000010.jpg

Ahh, yes.. spring, meet pitman arm and draglink.. pitman arm/draglink, meet spring..

We need to find a pitman arm with less drop.

I don't think there's enough room to flip the draglink to the top of the pitman arm - unless you tilt the steering box down just a little (rag joint up).. but moving it just a tad would be a PITA with the frame holes..

Cool, Mark!

Go take it wheelin' so you can tell me how well it works so I can decide if that's what I need to do. :flipoff2:

:D

Did you have to move your shackle back any??? Not sure if you did the shackle reversal before or after the new lift.......looks good.

Can you post another pic from the side so we can see how tall it is sitting now por favor.........

Damm, nice looking work there. Can't wait to see the trail pics.

Originally posted by jdjanda
Damm, nice looking work there. Can't wait to see the trail pics.

Trail pics????? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA You wanna go play this weekend Mark:flipoff2:

:flipoff2: :flipoff2: Kevy-poo


I would LOVE to go run this weekend... Expecialy since I'm spending the weekend at the cabin..... but I'm having "issues" with my prototype high-steer. Won't be resolved completely till after new-years:(

There is a temporary solution, but that probably won't be done this weekend, and there are some other things that need to be done before it trail-beatable again.... such as new shackles, what I have now is less than desirable... got some solutions, just need to do it.

Also got a set of XLC's for the rear, level it out, probably some extended shackles back there as well.

And it needs a tune-up, been too long since its had a nice, hard, long run:(


Dingo: ya, I'll get some more pics, if it wasn't pissing down rain:mad: No, I didn't move the shacke. Same spot I put it the first time I did my RS, but I never liked it, too far back IMO, I'll try to dig up some old pics. With the 1100 springs it didn't get much better, but these ones I was able to shove it back even farther and get an angle I liked
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/P0000004.jpg

Tommy: yep, Mr. Draglink and Mr. Spring meet... well, they just *barely* don't. Would be nice to find a new pitman arm that was as long (or maybe a hair shorter), but more strait.... cource then you may send the nut into the frame.

Hey Mark, how much arch is left in those springs with the weight of the scout on them. That would help me figure out if I still want to use them. I need a good idea of how much lift I will get.
Nice work man. Looks like you been real busy.:)

hee hee, it stopped raining and I decided to snap some more pics.

you can go here and look at all of them. http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/


heres a taste:

for Dingo:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/q0000003.jpg
Sits a little higher in the front than my current rear. Guess: I would say about 6.5" of lift with the new front. I have about 5.5" in the rear IIRC.


here's a good low side pic.
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/q0000006.jpg

and a better in the wheel well pic:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/q0000007.jpg


Have a little contact issue with one of the spring clamps, cut off wheel will fix:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/q0000009.jpg

Good one of the front towers with the old 1100 holes visable. 8' from top of frame to bolt.
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/q0000010.jpg


This is where I really had some fun:eek: :eek:

http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/r0000013.jpg


Lots of droop this way:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/r0000015.jpg

The other side:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/s0000017.jpg


this is about 30% of available flex :D:D
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/s0000018.jpg

Nice negative on the down side:
http://www.nwbinders.net/MemberRides/MarkA/s0000019.jpg



hmmm, I LIKE IT!!!

-mark

Originally posted by Scoutaholic
Hey Mark, how much arch is left in those springs with the weight of the scout on them. That would help me figure out if I still want to use them. I need a good idea of how much lift I will get.
Nice work man. Looks like you been real busy.:)


with out actually measuring, I'd have to say about 1-2" of arch. Pretty flat, not insane IMO. Wheels turning in your head rick...... :D

Originally posted by RustoleumWhite
hee hee, it stopped raining and I decided to snap some more pics.


Nice pics, Mark. starts to look a little tall n' mean from the front. :D

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RustoleumWhite
[B]


They are also set at a 31.5" center line, as opposed to the stock Scout 30.5"

Good planning, your already set up for full width gm :)

Originally posted by Tony Sobrito
[QUOTE]Originally posted by RustoleumWhite
[B]


They are also set at a 31.5" center line, as opposed to the stock Scout 30.5"

Good planning, your already set up for full width gm :)


Actually, the axle under there is a narrowed GM D44. 7º shims welded to the stock perches, and the perches where ground (well the cast one), a 1/4" angle on top of that. The other one was taken off and relocated.

31.5 isn't *much* of an andvantage, to fit anything under there and get the pinion right (at t-case) its going to take some work on the perches.

I swear I had some pics of narrowing the housings......

Originally posted by tsm1mt



Are they too stiff then?

Mark's running an SV 392.. vs. a 305 SBC.. maybe with the extra weight they'll work better?

Yeah they are too stiff for me. My motor is shoved WAY back so I don't have a lot of front end weight. Also, when I set it up originally, I used stock Waggy springs. They were so wore that my shackles are now in the wrong location for the new springs. They are straight up and down. Looking at the pics, I'd say that his SII will be able to flex them a whole lot better than mine. I can't get mine to go negative like he did. Once I change my shackle mounts, they may improve a bit. If not, the 1 leaf that I pull should be enough. I still have the stock waggy springs so I can alway mix them together too.

Originally posted by RustoleumWhite
Wheels turning in your head rick...... :D
The wheels are always turning in my head. I just wish they would turn in the right direction more often. More like grinding gears in my case.:D
I am going to tear into the front soon and have heard lots of good thng about those springs.

Nice very nice

gee you think they got a softer ride then mine:eek:

where did you get the PU 2wd springs (year model)?????

Originally posted by Chief Yelling Alot
Nice very nice

gee you think they got a softer ride then mine:eek:

where did you get the PU 2wd springs (year model)?????

'69 or '70 D-series 1100 PU. Short box :D I got some '69 1/2T t-all 4WD spings as well, but they are the same length as Scout II springs.... you need something????

Originally posted by RustoleumWhite


'69 or '70 D-series 1100 PU. Short box :D I got some '69 1/2T t-all 4WD spings as well, but they are the same length as Scout II springs.... you need something????

nope just wondering, gathering ideas

this is about 30% of available flex that was funny:D BTW there was a guy who used a Ford Van pitman arm that was straight on his ScoutII. Somebody's got to know him on a personal level. He did a diesel conversion on his ScoutII & also has a type of exo cage along with a BARPIN shackle setup in the rear, its like a dark green or black ScoutII. I just dont remember his name. He did have a write up on his scout in 4Wheel offroad mag.

Your probley talking about my buddy Eric Stude, his 76 scout 2 sounds like what your talking about. 6.9 Ih/ford diesel, t-19 wide, dual t-cases, dana 60 front/61 rear, Pined scissor shackles front and rear, Camo Green, partial exo cage 38's(had 35's when he was in the mags awhile back) I belived he used a Dodge van pitman arm (1970's Dodge van pitman arms are flat) he's full hydro now. I see him acouple times amonth so i can ask him what he used for sure.

Your probley talking about my buddy Eric Stude, his 76 scout 2 sounds like what your talking about.
Yeah, thats him, Eric Stude, to me his was the trickest ScoutII at the time.

Ya Erics truck was way before everyone else with the fancy suspension stuff, And it has surved him will over the last 10 years. He is planning on retiring that truck and using all the stuff on him 1965 scout, the body on the 76 is not safe any more do to the 7+ rolls it has been in. It will be sad to see that truck gone.

ya terra, if you see him, ask him about that arm, if its flat and beafy, but shorter, it may be what I'm looking for, and more common than the waggy arm I've been told about (and probably beafier).

thanks
-mark

Originally posted by TERRA-IZER
Ya Erics truck was way before everyone else with the fancy suspension stuff, And it has surved him will over the last 10 years. He is planning on retiring that truck and using all the stuff on him 1965 scout, the body on the 76 is not safe any more do to the 7+ rolls it has been in. It will be sad to see that truck gone.

Eric's gonna stick a 6.9 in a 65?

Excuse me while I drool

NQS

I will ask him the next time i see him about what arm he used, i think it was a 70's Dodge Van arm, but i will check for sure. And hes either putting the 6.9 out of his 76 in the 65 or the 5.9 Cummins he also has in it. I'am going to put a CN6-33 in my 68 once i go and pick up the motor, Desel rock, i love my 1980 SD6-33T.

thanks terra

BTW, whats the CN6-33???

It's the first Diesel in Scouts 76-79. CN6-33 Chrysler-Nissan 6-33, its the same as the SD6-33 but was imported through Chrysler and painted Yellow instead of Blue. It's noturbo and rated at 92HP@4000 Rpm and 137.5Lb-FT@2000Rpm.

I talked to Eric today and ask him what pitman arm he used, he said he tried a lot of them but he one that worked the best was one off of a Ford F-150. It queiken up the steering a bit, but wasted as good as the scout 2 one for lock-to-lock.