Looking for any experience here. How well do the 31 spline axles hold up? Did the disk brakes help a lot? Do you know of any problems with the Lock Right for this axle? Any other things I should look out for? Did you do anything to correct the width difference (from an Explorer)? Looks like I am getting rid of the D35, so I just wanted input on the Ford. This will be going in a TJ 4.0 with 4.11s and 33s for now. Probably go 35/36 next set of tires.

-Bart:usa:

First of all, do a search!
To answer the question,
The 8.8 is a really nice axle, especially for 35-36" tire range. Ive got a buddy running 38.5's on his, with a 44 front, and he hasnt broken anything yet, He's also got 5.13's and a detroit. Id say the 8.8 will work out fine for your application. And yes, the disc brakes do help a lot. As far as the width difference, I think there is only like 1/2" difference between the D35 and 8.8, and you won't need to do anything about it, especially if you are keeping the D30 up front.
Scott :grinpimp:<><

Originally posted by 1badjeep
First of all, do a search!
To answer the question,
The 8.8 is a really nice axle, especially for 35-36" tire range. Ive got a buddy running 38.5's on his, with a 44 front, and he hasnt broken anything yet, He's also got 5.13's and a detroit. Id say the 8.8 will work out fine for your application. And yes, the disc brakes do help a lot. As far as the width difference, I think there is only like 1/2" difference between the D35 and 8.8, and you won't need to do anything about it, especially if you are keeping the D30 up front.
Scott :grinpimp:<><

Yup, Even with my 38.5's I havent busted a 31 spline shaft yet. I do have an automatic though, I think that also helps. I keep spares with me just incase :D

Its a very tough axle assembly. The weak link is the stock carrier, but that is eliminated if you go to a full carrier locker. I have seen a half dozen carrier failures, with the stock trak lok. The only axle shaft failures I have personaly witnessed were my own. I never had a shaft failure in 3 years running 36"SX's, and I was pretty rough on them. I did manage to shatter 2 of them running 38.50 SX's, but I had to get pretty stupid to do it.

Originally posted by H8monday
Its a very tough axle assembly. The weak link is the stock carrier, but that is eliminated if you go to a full carrier locker. I have seen a half dozen carrier failures, with the stock trak lok. The only axle shaft failures I have personaly witnessed were my own. I never had a shaft failure in 3 years running 36"SX's, and I was pretty rough on them. I did manage to shatter 2 of them running 38.50 SX's, but I had to get pretty stupid to do it.

Did you stitch weld the tubes to the housing I hear lot's of talk about spinning tubes?
Never seen one spin just heard lot's of talk.
Getting ready to do some 8.8's myself and want to avoid any extra headaches, we did order Detroits for both of them to save on the carrier issue.

I tried a search with no luck. It was telling me 8.8 was under the minimum word length. I will try again. I am going to run 33" Claws off road for a while. Next time I will get 35" MT/Rs or 36" TLs, probably. Maybe Q78s. I plan to run a seperate set of tires on the street, so I should be in good shape. I did go get the axle today. It has factory 4.11 gears, Rubicon bracket kit, Lock Right, new disk brakes, and a new cover coming. Spare shafts, too. I think I should be golden.

-Bart (going to try the search again)

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/search.php?s=&action=showresults&searchid=25187&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending

If a search topic is 3 characters, add a * to it to make it 4. Its like of a wildcard symbol or a placeholder that stands for any character.

Originally posted by GDGMOJO


Did you stitch weld the tubes to the housing I hear lot's of talk about spinning tubes?
Never seen one spin just heard lot's of talk.
Getting ready to do some 8.8's myself and want to avoid any extra headaches, we did order Detroits for both of them to save on the carrier issue.

That is the guy they are all talking about. Only failure I know of.

Thanks a bunch, YJ4Life!

-Bart

Don't worry about stitch welding the tubes to the pumpkin on a TJ, this (tubes spinning in the pumpkin) is only a potential problem on leaf sprung vehicles running a SINGLE traction bar (ie, only ONE SIDE axle tube rotationally stabilized).

Thanks, HB. This one is already stiched, though. Any bad effects to that? I think it should be fine.

-Bart

Originally posted by bart
I did go get the axle today. It has factory 4.11 gears, Rubicon bracket kit, Lock Right, new disk brakes, and a new cover coming. Spare shafts, too.

Damn, you you must be the lucky dude who bought Tator's (Mike's) axle just before I was able to make my offer! :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :D I think you got a really good deal though, I was just wishing no offers would come in before I was able to make him my offer (I was waiting for a job offer I am expecting any day). Let us know how you like it!

Originally posted by Jerry Bransford


lucky dude

I was waiting for a job offer I am expecting any day

That was me, :flipoff2: to you, too. :) I think I will like it. I can quit tearing holes in my seat clenching my butt when I do hard obstacles. I bought a ton of stuff from Mike and was close enough to pick up - good for us both.

Hope you get your job.

-Bart

Originally posted by Hellbender
Don't worry about stitch welding the tubes to the pumpkin on a TJ, this (tubes spinning in the pumpkin) is only a potential problem on leaf sprung vehicles running a SINGLE traction bar (ie, only ONE SIDE axle tube rotationally stabilized).


We are swapping the TJ's to soa in the rear along with the 8.8 swap. ( yes I know we are bad TJ owners I'm tired of all that CA mess. It's just plain too much effort to keep everything tight and lubed, not to mention all the odd handling issues that come with the steep CA angles)
What about adapting to the factory setup on the housing it seems that there is something already there?

Has anybody done c-clip eliminator? I know the c-clip is not an issue as far as strength, but I'm doing an 8.8 in about a month or two and I wanted to go with a spool (budget). I haven't heard much about the strenght of the eliminator. I know its design is based more towards drag racing and not the side to side stresses of crawlin.

Oh yeah here is a :flipoff2: from a newbie!!!

Pretty sure they have spools for the c-clips, do a search on this board, they were talking about them lately.

Yep they make C-clip eliminators. But I have never seen a set that does not leak. The old man ran AHRA and NHRA for about 15 years in the Superstock class so I got to see alot of them on dragsters. They suck and no real reason to do it with a 31 spline axle unless you are planning on snapping them.

As for spools they make a full and mini spool. Full spool runs around 125 bucks and the mini is like 20 bucks. www.differentials.com

Go with the full spool that way you can upgrade the weak carrier that is in the 8.8 (not that weak but it is the weak link in that rearend).

I am right in the middle of this swap also so I am just passing on what I am learing as I go. Anyone have exp with the spooled 8.8?

Let me know if you find anything interesting out and ask questions! who knows I might have just asked the same on.

Almost everything I've ever read on the 8.8, and I've read a lot, has said to avoid installing a c-clip eliminator in the 8.8 when it's going to be used for offroading. A c-clip eliminator is apparently only recommended for drag racing applications. Hopefully I'll be starting my own 8.8 installation in January.

Sorry to bring this back up. But how's the tolerance on the 8.8 as far as swapping the stock carrier out for a spool? I did this with the detroit locker and the stock carrier on my 35c and had no problems at all, this is without resetting the gears or anything. What do you think? Also how bout just welding the spider gears, chances are I'm not gonna go bigger than 37" tires.
-Nate

IF yo can find a D44 do it first Ihave seen a few of the 8.8 c clips fail and axles pop out....dude it stillnoly has a 1/18" by 1/8" of steel to hold all that in.....a c-clip is a c-clip is a c-clip

i have broken my 8.8 with 35's. the spider gears and carrier shaddered due to excessive strain caused by power breaking the 35" bfg's i have. :flipoff2: :flipoff2: i think it is a very strong axle....the axles are slightly bigger then that of a ford 9" under the micrometer

Originally posted by NothernAZxj
IF yo can find a D44 do it first Ihave seen a few of the 8.8 c clips fail and axles pop out....dude it stillnoly has a 1/18" by 1/8" of steel to hold all that in.....a c-clip is a c-clip is a c-clip


The 31 spline 8.8 is so much stronger at the axle shafts than a D44, that I would gladly take my chances with a C clip.

The mass at the ring and pinion of an 8.8 is much greater also. Way more than the ring gear diameters alone, would suggest. If you ever have the 2 of them in your hands in a side by side comparison, there is no doubt which is built to handle more stress.

The C- Clip on an 8.8 is more like 1/4".
Also on the Disc brakes version you would have to snap your calipers off also before the wheel could walk. And with the Calipers and brakes in place, it would be nearly impossible to put enough latteral strain on the C clips to ever have it fail.

I just cant look at a D44 as being a viable rear axle. When used with tires above 35", Ive just seen too many D44 rear axle shafts fail.

The 8.8 weak spot is the carrier, and although I have personaly seen the broken carriers from 6 failures, they have all occurred in the F150 version(28 spline), when the trucks were being used to haul loads that would strain the 10.25 Sterling or 14 bolt. For whatever reason they have all been factory Trac Locks.

8.8 vs D44 : Not even a contest in my book, the 8.8 is far superior in strength and reliability.

IF yo can find a D44 do it first Ihave seen a few of the 8.8 c clips fail and axles pop out....dude it stillnoly has a 1/18" by 1/8" of steel to hold all that in.....a c-clip is a c-clip is a c-clip

C-clips may be small, but they don't have much strain on them, so they don't need to be any larger. I've never seen a C-clip break on any c-clip axles. I've seen plenty of axleshafts break, but never the c-clip itself. Not saying it aint possible, but I wouldn't worry about the c-clip as the weak point.

I've seen plenty of axleshafts break, but never the c-clip itself

Many Dana 35 axles that is, never seen an 8.8 break (just to clarify myself)

Nice info. I am getting an 8.8 for my YJ. Did anyone ever confirm if a cclip can be run witha full spool?? I would like that.

I have seen a broken d35 c clip. but it got ground through the gears. the center pin ripped open the carrier, opened the diff cover like a sardine can then the R/P ate it all and spit it out. It was a mess.

They actually used Duct tape to hold it to limp out to the trailer.

I know a mini spool is available, not sure on the full. Guess I will have to check.

On a side note, if you plan on running a bit of power though a 8.8, you may want to invest in a carrier cap studs and a cap girdle cover. Cheap insurance to help maintain carrier bearing preload when you get on it. There is also a solid spacer kit available to get rid of the dreaded crush collar when setting up the pinion bearings.

I got an 8.8 in the rear of my rig with a 2.5L and 33's and it holds up fine. I am going to remove the lock right and welded that Mo Fo up in a few weeks when i get a daily driving little jap car.

Mini Spools are like $90 for it and to install a FULL SPOOL into it you need a C Clip eliminator kit!

my .02

I run an 8.8 with 35" tires. Stock open carrier with a lockright. The only problem I have had is spinning the axle tubes. Sheldon I know you asked about that. It happened to me the last time I was at Tellico on Hellicopter pad, I was cresting the top and one little bounce and my pinion was pointing straight up. I have the antiwrap bar on the driverside tube and I didn't weld my tubes to the diff. The driverside tube stayed still and the otherside, well you can imagine what it looked like. I twisted the diff back down and put three welds around the tubes at the diff. Its been fine ever since. Still a little scared of it.

Originally posted by Rodney YJ
I run an 8.8 with 35" tires. Stock open carrier with a lockright. The only problem I have had is spinning the axle tubes. Sheldon I know you asked about that. It happened to me the last time I was at Tellico on Hellicopter pad, I was cresting the top and one little bounce and my pinion was pointing straight up. I have the antiwrap bar on the driverside tube and I didn't weld my tubes to the diff. The driverside tube stayed still and the otherside, well you can imagine what it looked like. I twisted the diff back down and put three welds around the tubes at the diff. Its been fine ever since. Still a little scared of it.


Funny you should say that I just finished up my wrap bar a few minutes ago ;-)
Like yours mine is on the drivers side I did stitch weld the tubes, I wanted to fully weld them but got ahskeert.
And like you I am still a little leary about it because my ego level tends to translate to the right foot at times we will see how it holds up. I know that the welds will work it's just the nagging little demons in my head that tell me its not welded enough more more lay down MORE BEAD!!!!
btw I used some 7018 rod and preheated did you do the same or just zap it with a mig or what not?

Originally posted by GDGMOJO



Funny you should say that I just finished up my wrap bar a few minutes ago ;-)
Like yours mine is on the drivers side I did stitch weld the tubes, I wanted to fully weld them but got ahskeert.
And like you I am still a little leary about it because my ego level tends to translate to the right foot at times we will see how it holds up. I know that the welds will work it's just the nagging little demons in my head that tell me its not welded enough more more lay down MORE BEAD!!!!
btw I used some 7018 rod and preheated did you do the same or just zap it with a mig or what not?

Clean and prep your tubes atbthe housing and go back and complete the welds all the way around.
Just dont be in hurry when you do it. Weld (2) 40 degrees of an arch welds(opposite of each other) on one tube. The do the same on the other tube. Just let the welds cool a bit so that you dont warp the tubes at the housings.
You really dont need to preheat the assembly to weld the tubes to the cast housing. All you are doing is strengthening the connection. The tubes are already pressed in and plugged welded.
In fact the stitch welds you have already done, has almost certainly solved the problem, but for your own piece of mind, you can do the full bead weld as mentioned above.
I twisted my driver side tube, while showing off on a trail with a bunch of my Toyota buddies from Fresno (Marlin Crawler, mechanics, and test drivers, on thier unofficial test trail called Spirit World). It is a bitch to get the tubes back to position, and well worth your efforts to head it off before it happens, as you have already done.

well, since i last posted on here about me blowing up my carrier in the 8.8(exactly 3 days ago), i have blown it up again. no power breaking this time though. i dont know what caused it....i think i might go to a 9" this time

i think i am one of the few guys that has broken more parts on my tow rig then off road vehicle

Originally posted by AGGIECJ-7
well, since i last posted on here about me blowing up my carrier in the 8.8(exactly 3 days ago), i have blown it up again. no power breaking this time though. i dont know what caused it....i think i might go to a 9" this time

i think i am one of the few guys that has broken more parts on my tow rig then off road vehicle

Why don't you just load it with a Detroit?
heck you must have spent enough in carriers and other parts to buy one by now?

Originally posted by AGGIECJ-7


i think i am one of the few guys that has broken more parts on my tow rig then off road vehicle

Pretty easy cure. Buy a Chevy.

Sheldon I just put 3 welds on each axle tube about an inch long and I did it with a 200amp MIG turned all the way up, no preheating. I probably should have because it looks like one of my welds cracked when it cooled down. Like you I want to get crazy with the welder to make me feel better.

I just watched the tape of you guys in Tellico last April, I borrowed them from Dave Koons. Hopefully I will go this year. I am looking for a waggy front axle to build for my YJ before I go, but I don't think I will have it in time.

c-clip eliminators:

I definately would NOT run the aftermarket aluminum c-clip eliminators on a vehicle which will carry large side loads on the tires. I have a set of the aluminum Moser c-clip eliminators in my 88 Mustang. They constantly leak, and generally don't take well to side loads like going around a corner hard. Moser, Strange, and Mark Williams all make a conversion kit where you can weld a big bearing 9" housing end onto an 8.8. This uses the large 9" bearing, and requires different axles of correct diameter so the bearing can be pressed on. The new axles are extra cost. However, if you plan on doing a spool anyway, the 31 or 33 spline forged axles wouldn't be a bad idea in the long run. You will probably never break them. I know guys running low 9's - high 8's on 31 spline 8.8 axles in 3300 lb Mustangs. We are talking like 900 hp, 800 ft-lbs at the flywheel here. Another good thing about welding the 9" housing ends on, is it makes it pretty easy to widen/narrow the axle housing per your desire. Just tell the axle manufacturer that you want to do this and they will send axles that are wider/narrower.

Also, the pinion spacer which was mention previously would be a good idea as well. It's cheap, and works well for replacing the crush collar.

If you plan on running 4.56's and lower in an 8.8, the girdle is a good idea, but might not be necessary. It is unnecessary with 4.30's and higher.

Originally posted by Rodney YJ
Sheldon I just put 3 welds on each axle tube about an inch long and I did it with a 200amp MIG turned all the way up, no preheating. I probably should have because it looks like one of my welds cracked when it cooled down. Like you I want to get crazy with the welder to make me feel better.

I just watched the tape of you guys in Tellico last April, I borrowed them from Dave Koons. Hopefully I will go this year. I am looking for a waggy front axle to build for my YJ before I go, but I don't think I will have it in time.

Originally posted by Rodney YJ
Sheldon I just put 3 welds on each axle tube about an inch long and I did it with a 200amp MIG turned all the way up, no preheating. I probably should have because it looks like one of my welds cracked when it cooled down. Like you I want to get crazy with the welder to make me feel better.

I just watched the tape of you guys in Tellico last April, I borrowed them from Dave Koons. Hopefully I will go this year. I am looking for a waggy front axle to build for my YJ before I go, but I don't think I will have it in time.

I think we are going to bail on Tellico this year something else going on. I layed down 4 beads on the tube basically half the tube is welded. I preheated and used my stick with some 7018 1/8" rod so far no problems. I really wanted to lay it in there while welding but held back and just made a nice med sized bead I'm not to worried I have been checking for cracks so far 2 weeks later no problems perhaps if you know someone with a stick that might be a better method.