Since the search function does not work still.. thought I'd ask if anyone has some good links to write ups on using Mini Truck PS on a 76 Fj40.
I have a stock forty that I want to keep somewhat stock but want the PS.
Can I use the stock steering box pedastal?

Berg

Ken I think it's more or less bolt in with some minor welding needed to create a bracket / mounting for the PS pump. It uses a similar box that does bolt onto the stock pedestal and uses the stock linkages including the funky one that goes behind the driver's front tire. My '75 was setup with it before I bought it. Worked pretty well I thought, but for what it's worth it's "power assist" not power steering so it is not massively powerful by any stretch....

No you can't use the stock pedisatal. I see the mini conversion bracket on ebay alot. ALso I think JT outfitters sells them.
IMO I would do the saginaw conversion, or scout. Scout probably being the easiest.

Originally posted by dieselcruiserhead
Ken I think it's more or less bolt in with some minor welding needed to create a bracket / mounting for the PS pump. It uses a similar box that does bolt onto the stock pedestal and uses the stock linkages including the funky one that goes behind the driver's front tire. My '75 was setup with it before I bought it. Worked pretty well I thought, but for what it's worth it's "power assist" not power steering so it is not massively powerful by any stretch....

What about a 60 Series gearbox.. ? same program.. better power ...?

Have your found a good source on that 55 gal drum of Bondo yet?... you can use my drywall tools if you need for application:flipoff2:

Better power but not as good as saginaw or scout I think. Hey that works...

choice 1: GM Saginaw
choice 2: Scout Saginaw
choice 3: 60 conversion
choice 4: minitruck
choice 5: armstrong

I run the scout and like it, but there are disadvantages with it versus the GM Saginaw. Not many, and not significant, but they are there...course, I'd probably wish for the Scout setup if I had the GM one installed...

http://www.ih8mud.com for lots of writeups in the tech corner...

Originally posted by Berg
Since the search function does not work still.. thought I'd ask if anyone has some good links to write ups on using Mini Truck PS on a 76 Fj40.
I have a stock forty that I want to keep somewhat stock but want the PS.
Can I use the stock steering box pedastal?

Berg

You cant use the mini-truck box on the stock pedestal, but you can buy the stock FJ40/FJ55 powersteering box casting(same as the mini-truck, but with a different mounting angle.) and gut the mini-truck box, stuff the parts into the new FJ40/FJ55 box casting, and not have to chop the steering box pedestal off. Yeah, the box casting is $263, but a mini box is $50 or so used. and you dont have to buy the $100 JTO or other bracket, and if you decide to go to saginaw or something else down the line, you can sell your OEM FJ40 power steering box (the one you just made) for way more than you have in it... one went for over $500 on ebay just recently.

Hey Woody (and others) I've been reading up on this conversion for my 66 fj40 and find most articles are on the Saginaw set ups. What I'm not finding is some sort of more detailed comparison between all the setups. I see the Saginaw boxes mounted out in front of the frame cross member and would like to sort out how this affects the geometry of the system. How much weaker is the mini set up? I lean toward the mini conversion as it looks cleaner and simpler, but I don't want to regret not going Saginaw. I don't plan on running anything larger than 33's for the time being, but maybe 35's if the 2F will push them well. A 4" lift is planned also. Thanks for any clarity you all could provide, or steer me toward.

ps. got a mini bracket, a sag box, 2 different style sag pumps, bracket for pump and a line on a reasonable mini box, so any direction is possible at this point.














:confused: :confused:

IMO, one advantage to the other conversions is eliminating the relay rod that runs down the side of the frame rail. I've watched this take out sidewalls on air'd down 33x12.5" tires on a hard left turn...sidewall shifts in and contacts the rod.

IMO, eliminating the added joints and the center arm help a great deal with keeping steering tight, longer term.

GM Sag won't work with PTO setups. GM Sag is tight with the 8274, but doable. GM Sag requires cutting/sleeving the front crossmember, a potential weak point. GM sag doesn't allow for quite as long a tie rod as the Scout/60 setups. GM usually requires a center support for the multiple joints in the steering shaft.

Scout setup can be hit on hard compression with SOA springs, requiring a custom bump for the tie rod link. Scout setup can be contacted by the tire on hard right turns, tho only rubbing occurs. 60-setup has the same issue.

For 33's, the minitruck is perfect, since it will be powerful enuf and easy enuf to install. However, take care to not air down too much, and make sure the clamps on the relay rod have the bolts on the frame-side to save your sidewalls. For 35's, the minitruck is marginal.

Next opinion??

If you ever want to go big and locked in the front, do the Saginaw, scout or front mounted.
I wheeled Jason Harsch's rig on a night run at LCR and bent the relay rod big time, and I have never bent mine doing what I did with his.....payback.
Someday I'll tell the story.......
He has the OEM 79 LC, which is almost identical to the mini....

Butch

Originally posted by texican
If you ever want to go big and locked in the front, do the Saginaw, scout or front mounted.
Butch

I have a another V8 Fj40 with saginaw but I want to keep this one close to stock. You can see why the Armstrong ain't cuttin it.

I did a GM saginaw on my '76 FJ40 and I'm happy with it. My 82 FJ40 has OEM ps and it's nice on a stocker. I'll be going with mini truck on the Troopie. I already had a spare mini truck gear box, FJ60 ps pump, and several extra brackets (smog pump, FJ60 ps pump, alternator) between those I should be able to make it work.

Some of my opinions...

GM sag requires: sag gearbox, sag pump, way to mount the pump, correct pulley for the pump, reinforced frame horn for the gearbox w/ sleeves (do the other side while you're at it). A pitman arm that works with your setup, a drag link that has GM on one end and LC on the other. Modifications to existing steering shaft or new column. Some welding skills or access to someone who has them.

Scout and FJ60 have similar requirements to those listed above.

Mini truck requires: mini gearbox, mini or cruiser ps pump, way to mount the pump, correct pulley if mini truck pump, bracket for the gearbox (can be bought for $75-$100). With the right parts (purchased brackets) this can potentially be a bolt on system that is near OEM.

Also, regarding using the OEM ps gearbox housing, last I heard these were gone, you can't get them from Toyota anymore.

Originally posted by Cruiser Ken


Also, regarding using the OEM ps gearbox housing, last I heard these were gone, you can't get them from Toyota anymore.

I thought so too, but they are around, might take some time, but can be had.

-Brett

I have the Saginaw on my 40 and installed the mini setup on a friend's 40 last year and I agree with dieselcruiserhead. My friend's is what I would call a palm-pushing, wax on, wax off. My runs with a single finger.

I am contemplating p/s for the 45lwb after the 5spd eliminates my current need for the stock box (3 on the tree) I'm leaning towards the 60 box because it eliminates the drag link and center arm. I will be sticking to light duty trails, 2.5 lift and 32s, so it fits my need. I think with bigger tires, I would probably go Saginaw. Then again, I'd hate to lose another ConFerr toolbox!

Originally posted by ranger
No you can't use the stock pedisatal. I see the mini conversion bracket on ebay alot. ALso I think JT outfitters sells them.
IMO I would do the saginaw conversion, or scout. Scout probably being the easiest.

Here is everything you need for the mini-conversion, from another shop.
http://www.classiccruisers.com/pages/conversions.html

Possibly another option? Would an IFS box work? I haven't seen any writeups on the 60 conversion yet, but would it be similar? It is a lateral action pitman as opposed to the push pull type of the earlier ones right? They seem abundant on these boards, and a bit newer all around...just curious if anybody's used one.

Originally posted by Amanda
Possibly another option? Would an IFS box work? I haven't seen any writeups on the 60 conversion yet, but would it be similar? It is a lateral action pitman as opposed to the push pull type of the earlier ones right? They seem abundant on these boards, and a bit newer all around...just curious if anybody's used one.

pitman arm faces back, so to make it work, you would have to mount it forward of the grille, above the framerail.

-Brett

Easy to install. Lots of parts to do it. Worst part was drilling 3" and 2" holes in crossmember. But still easy. I didn't know anything when I did mine. Still easy. Palm steering with a pimp little steering wheel. Check out www.ih8mud.com or tlca.org read the articles. The hardest part is the pump install. I notched my smog pump mount and used and alternator bracket to fit the pump. I bought the high pressure line at carquest for $25 I think it was for a blazer.

Well, that explains why nobody uses the IFS boxes-might as well go Saginaw if it's gotta be in front of the grill. Found a mini box within a 2hr drive for $40, with pitman arm. Fair deal? I've found them for less $$ but adding shipping is a bugger. 'Course gas ain't cheap either. Any advice on how to determine a good steering box from a bad one?

Amanda unless you are a guy with a girls name (there used to be a guy around named Erin :D ) you sound like one badass chick!

FWIW here is an earlier pic my FJ60 setup.
http://www.collegeinternetsolutions.com/cisautoweb/fj55/ps_conversion/100_0434.jpg

I was pissed because as of this morning my pump wasn't working and the replacement was over $300. Then today all of a sudden doing my first errand in the rig the pump kicked in and my steering all of a sudden had a dangerous mind of it's own and started turning the wheel right and left and randomly to the point where I had to fight it. Then I realized figured out that I had the high pressure and low pressure lines backwards and man am I pysched. The pump on the engine was originally a hydroboost pump so I wasn't sure it would work but iut works great... The pump also is pretty much a Sag pump. For shits and giggles drove up to a big rock and was able to push the truck over. I've had a few FJ60s and my thinking now is that I think the pump is the culprit that gives them a weak name. Which I think would make sense. But then again I haven't wheeled it or really tested it at all other than against a rock :rasta:

Also fwiw the IFS boxes are hot items with the mini truck guys, you have to post to the for sale section though, they are a little more anal over there...

Since this is a mini truck PS gear box topic......where can I get a rebuild kit from?

I am looking to take the box apart and replace all the o-rings and teflon seals...maybe the bearings too. So far all I have seen are input and output seals.

What about moving the tie-rod and draglink behind the axle and using a mini IFS box? 4x4Labs makes arms that relocate the tie-rod, I'm sure they could make some that move the draglink too....

I'm sure there's something obvious I'm missing....

Matt

Originally posted by Gil


I'm sure there's something obvious I'm missing....

Matt

yes, it will turn the wrong way :eek:

Originally posted by Gil
What about moving the tie-rod and draglink behind the axle and using a mini IFS box? 4x4Labs makes arms that relocate the tie-rod, I'm sure they could make some that move the draglink too....

I'm sure there's something obvious I'm missing....

Matt

yep, you'd really confuse any would be thiefs... on an IFS box, it is setup for a rear swing pitman and forward facing steering arms. Using it with rear facing arms would result in a right turn when the wheel is turned left.

What you could do it use an FJ60 or scout box and remove and mount the pitman arm so it faces to the back. this will net you the proper arm motion needed for the turns.

-Brett

I haven't found any more info on the set up using the 60 box. Is the pic from your 40 or 55? I haven't stared at them from that angle enough to be able to see a difference! Since I just rebuilt the center arm, drag link, tie rod ends etc, I'm probably going with the mini box. I would like to see more info on a 60 box set up if possible before taking this on...then I can finally install my nice shiny new drive train!:bounce: :bounce2: :beer:

That is on my FJ55. I must say that it was pretty damn easy to put in though. The key is that the 60 box is identical to the Scout box except that the Scout box is beefier, more common in parts stores and cheaper. So, it is a nop brainer, use the Scout box...

More pics here, this is nowhere near what my final setup ended up as, it is now plated, the box is moved way forward, the tierod and drag link are close to parrall and generally it works great. I went for the FJ60 box because I basically bought it for free.

I haven't had a 40 for a while. Neat thing about the 60 box in a FJ55 is that is uses the same u-joints as an FJ60 making it easy. Because 40s use a rag joint, pretty much any setup will do and the most used and recommended is definetely Saginaw...

Here is a great thread I think,
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=137903&highlight=scout+55

And here are some photos of my setup before I totally changed it. I don't think I have a current photo yet but it is setup different and better. But has decent photos of the box...
http://www.collegeinternetsolutions.com/cisautoweb/fj55/ps_conversion/

Here is a photo of the Scout box also on a FJ55 off Morgan's site:

http://www.birfield.com/~morgan/tech/scoutps/jsomervlle/finished_conversion.jpg

The IFs box will work with the 4x4labs steering arms if you rotate the pitman 180*. That reverses the direction of the push/pull

Originally posted by Plowboy
The IFs box will work with the 4x4labs steering arms if you rotate the pitman 180*. That reverses the direction of the push/pull

the box would be back at the firewall though.