I do not know much about the new nylon cables. However I have heard good things about them. I do know this is the 2nd warn steel cable I have broken. I would like some opinions from people that have one or have A friend with one and been around it. I do not want blind opinions. Thanx...:question:

Well if your ever going to compete in any competitions, I'd suggest buying the rope, I believe most promotors are going to require their use by the 2003 season, for safety reasons. I'll be requiring them for the 2003.
Rich Klein
CalROCS

everything about the nylon cable sounds good except the fact that the first time ya winch and scrape it againts the rocks its messed up. not sure if id trust it after that.

what kinda winch?

I have both. I have also seen 3/8th masterpull fail on a good friend of mine's truck. The reason . . . the POS stock warn roller fairlead had just enough space to allow the rope to get along side a roller and snag and fail. Of course the end result was a 10ft fall backwards off a vertical ledge into a river (only damage a bent bumper and a knocked out light :))

I have also seen the stuff melt from use on planetary winches. If you have a little smoker (anything electric but an RE, Husky or 8274) you have to be carefull not to lower yourself down against the brake, power out for extented periods, or abuse the winch where it heats up. Amsteel UHMPHE (something like that) starts to break down at 150 degrees and fails at 300 degrees. It also acts as a blanket whereas steel acts as a heat sink.

But it is very safe to use and when it breaks it just falls to the ground as opposed to the death whip of steel. That is worth the price to me if I know less carefull people are going to be using the winch. I seem to be happiest with 3/8ths steel all things considered.

All and all lots to consider, not the least of which is cost which was the determining factor on my last purchase.

Ron

PS www.recoverygear.com has good wire rope prices

The rope sounds better. But on the durability issue, How easy is it to mess one up on A rock. I am A little abussive to winch cables. Hope thay are not real easy to mess up. I have A warn 9000. Also where is the best place to buy one if I decide to buy one.

everything about the nylon cable sounds good except the fact that the first time ya winch and scrape it againts the rocks its messed up. not sure if id trust it after that.
I'm guessing YJTJ, but have you used this, or just heard about it?

I run the Plasma Rope and I can tell you that it doesn't get easily 'messed up.' I dragged mine across rocks up and down the Sierras, and then again in Moab, and it has held up fine.

There is visible wear, but only in the sense that there's some fuzz... no obvious broken braids.

I won't go back to steel cable.

Randii

PLASMA :D

One of our Oz 4wd magazines did an article on this type of rope versus steel cable and they also contacted Warn for comments.

Warn made mention that it shouldn't be used with the winches that generate a lot of drum heat as it could be weakened etc (can't recall which one it was but probably the 8274 Ron mentioned) but other than that they didn't appear to have any real concerns about its use.

Is the Plasma rope smaller than the wire cable? I was just wondering if it would be possible to add more length to the wench cable, w/o loosing pull rating?

plasma is smaller diameter so you can run more or larger rope. 8274 is NOT a winch that produces heat in the drum. it is hollow. nothing in there to generate heat. I believe it is the hs series that have guts in the drum.:p

Aggro, what about the Warn M10K, M12K and M15K? I have an M10K with the cable still in decent shape, but since moving to DC from Arizona (no comments, please, still mourning) the cable is starting to @#$% rust...

Randii, Is the plasma rope A different type of rope. Or is it all the same. Im asking because I never heard it called plasma. Also im glad to hear it is holding up. How much did it cost and where.

Having used both alot, the rope rules! I still have cable on my 8274, but a friend that I wheel with and spot for has rope on his hs9500. Your spotter will thank you, it is so much easier to handle than cable. He has had no abrasion problems after alot of rock crawling. When it is time to replace my cable I have no doubt it will be rope.

A thought for rock crawling competitiors;
Because rope is so much lighter and easier for the spotter to use, I would consider it an advantage time wise if it needed to be used in competition.

http://www.outdoorwire.com/4x4/reviews/masterpull/

Originally posted by Aggro
PLASMA :D

You got it!!!

I've used it all over the place, dragged it over rocks, through mud, over trucks.. no problem. And, when it gets real nasty, unspool it and throw it into the washing machine.. good as new!!

Yes, you can tell it's been used because it gets a little fuzzy, but I don't think that really weakens it.

Warn says don't use it because it's not proven not to weaken with heat. So... freespool it out, don't power it out unless you have to.

I think they also don't recommend it because they don't sell it, but maybe I just think they're money grubbing fools. Don't get me wrong, I buy their products because they are good winches, but I wouldn't trust their customer service!!

masterpull is a good place to get it or www.gourock.com (http://www.gourock.com) sometime has sales.


I value my head, I like the extra safety!!!! :flipoff2:


-John

Deffinitaly sounds like I will be buying rope thanxs guys. And this is why this board rocks. (the information is good).

The outside covering is merely there to protect the Spectra Fiber core.. The Spectra is the stuff that does the work........

The nice thing about Spectra fiber is that it iis hard to cut (with a Knife)
I have some Fish Filetting gloves made from Spectra, you can saw at them all day with a Reallly sharp knife and you will not cut them...........Kewl stuff....

:D

The outside covering is merely there to protect the Spectra Fiber core.. The Spectra is the stuff that does the work........
Nope. This is not a standard sheathed rope... it is a simple braided line (with no sheath).

On this rope, fuzz is OK, per the manufacturer, because that is a frayed fiber. When you worry is when you have a braided strand that looks damaged.

I'm tickled with the stuff -- once you pull this rope uphill, you'll never want to go back to traditional cable, with the weight, hand-slicing snags, and memory-coiled snarls that it inevitably has. Hell, my *WIFE* will pull cable for me! :D

Randii (not one to gush, but VERY impressed with the stuff)

If you get the "yellow hook" make sure to keep it well greased.

seen a couple siezed

Ron

Originally posted by THE BONE COLLECTOR
Deffinitaly sounds like I will be buying rope thanxs guys. And this is why this board rocks. (the information is good). I agree.... :cool:

don't get another cable. I didn't like the sound of your old cable hitting the back of my blazer.:rolleyes:

The boss says that using a plasma cable on a warn winch voids the warranty. because the casing, drum and steel cable are used as a heat sink for the electric motor. You can do whatever you want to do, but I will just stick to a steel cable and replace it as I see the need too. :)

Originally posted by Robeakin
The boss says that using a plasma cable on a warn winch voids the warranty. because the casing, drum and steel cable are used as a heat sink for the electric motor. You can do whatever you want to do, but I will just stick to a steel cable and replace it as I see the need too. :)

Let's see. I just lowered myself backwards down a 30 foot long, 50 degree incline. The anchor point was 90 feet past the top, when I get to the bottom, where did my heat sink go?

For those running the Master Pull type rope on your winch All Pro now carries an aluminum fairlead...

"Finally a fairlead designed specifically for winches running synthetic winch rope. This fairlead is machined from billet aluminum and maintains a smooth machined surface. Unlike traditional steel fairleads, this fairlead will not fray or tangle the winch rope. In addition, this aluminum fairlead weighs only a fraction of the steel hawse and roller fairleads. Each aluminum fairlead comes with mounting hardware as shown."

WARRENTY... My winch is 7 years old. I dont think it is under warrenty. Hay Chris Grieger, Do thay make one with rollers for the rope, Or are thay saying it does not need rollers. Seems bad on it without them. However I dont know if Id trust the roller I have now with A rope because my cable sometimes gets jammed in the corners

The rollers catch the rope in the corners, and it causes fraying. The rollers also fall apart when you hit the fairlead on the rocks.

I'm thinking I'll just be using the pipe from the pre-runner style new winch mount I'm having made do the fairlead for my new plasma rope.

Any thoughts on that?

Also I got my rope from Scott at RockStomper http://www.rockstomper.com he has some great prices.

IMO i like the synthetic better than the steel. the syth wont stand up to any sort of abrasion (rocks, trees, etc) as well, but when it does break, it falls RIGHT to the ground. NO recoil whatsoever. it just kind of goes POOF, some confettit falls to the ground, and then you jut take the broken ends and tie them together in a good strong know, and youre good to go. no splicing needed.

This is a great thread! I'm in need of a new cable and was leaning toward being cheap and sticking with steel, but after reading the above comments, I'm going with the "rope".

Thanks guys:D

Is the RockStomper winch rope the same as the Masterpull rope?

I see the 125' of 3/8" Rockstomper rope is $250!

What does the Master pull rope go for?

Which rope resist abrasion the best? Seems like the Rockstomper rope has the edge, with the protective collar. (sorry, no pun intended):p

Originally posted by bwickert
Is the RockStomper winch rope the same as the Masterpull rope?

I see the 125' of 3/8" Rockstomper rope is $250!

What does the Master pull rope go for?

Which rope resist abrasion the best? Seems like the Rockstomper rope has the edge, with the protective collar. (sorry, no pun intended):p

Check www.masterpull.com

I bought some of the MP 3/8 plasma rope but never fitted it.

The reason is it weighs around 100 LB less than the steel cable of my Warn.

Most people would probably be glad of the weigth saving but having a TJ I want to keep some weight up front.

I have yellow rope and a yellow safety hook. Both brand new and never used.

Email me if you are interested in a killer deal ;)

DS

evil.ted@verizon.net

What about my M12000, can I use the 3/8 rope? Since this stuff has such a high break rating won't the 3/8 be fine?

Originally posted by DippStick
I bought some of the MP 3/8 plasma rope but never fitted it.

The reason is it weighs around 100 LB less than the steel cable of my Warn.

Most people would probably be glad of the weigth saving but having a TJ I want to keep some weight up front.

I have yellow rope and a yellow safety hook. Both brand new and never used.

Email me if you are interested in a killer deal ;)

DS

evil.ted@verizon.net

100 lbs less??? I run 125 feet of 3/8" steel cable on my 8274 and one of those huge yellow hooks and I don't think it weighs 100 lbs total especially since it came UPS.

That aside, how much you want for the rope, I have a buddy that wants to run it.

Originally posted by Big Rich
Well if your ever going to compete in any competitions, I'd suggest buying the rope, I believe most promotors are going to require their use by the 2003 season, for safety reasons. I'll be requiring them for the 2003.
Rich Klein
CalROCS

Last time I talked to the marketing dept at Warn, I was told that if I required synthetic rope on their winches, that they would not sponsor the event. If you are having Warn as a sponsor, you may want to make sure about that before you make the rule change.

Originally posted by THE BONE COLLECTOR
Hay Chris Grieger, Do thay make one with rollers for the rope, Or are thay saying it does not need rollers.

I'm not chris but They say it doesn't need rollers with that hawse, which makes sense with rope running over that smooth surface UNLESS you were to nick it somehow in there and raise a jagged edge - just watch out for that. Also, 80 ft of 5/16 cable weighs 12 lbs (just weighed my spare) so 100 ft of 3/8 should be under 30 lbs.

Not that yall care what a newbie wants, but I'd like to hear more about the fraying issue especially combined with heat - take a 90&deg day (if it truly starts to weaken at 150&deg ) and a hot winch and lots of scraping against trees and rocks, are you risking failure on the last pull of the day? Otherwise it sounds great.

[edit - fckn winking smilie interfering with my html escape sequence for the degree sign]

what about when it gets packed with mud and stuff? also when I am winching myself the cable isn't moving just my vehicle so the abrasion(sp?) isn't too bad but what about when you are pulling someone else? The rope is being dragged over whatever is in the way?

Very good thread! I need a new rope and want to lower the weight on the front too! :bounce: :bounce:

If you are winching yourself out of something then the ROPE doesn't move. Only the vehicle will move, hence no damage to the ROPE. Just be carefull when winching other towards yourself :)

Originally posted by Matt K
If you are winching yourself out of something then the ROPE doesn't move. Only the vehicle will move, hence no damage to the ROPE. Just be carefull when winching other towards yourself :)

Sure it moves, back and forth several inches each way while being fully stretched, exactly the circumstance most likely to cut a strand. Run you winch cable over a rock ledge to an anchor point and have your buddys winch it up while you watch the contact point.

Originally posted by oldjeep


100 lbs less??? I run 125 feet of 3/8" steel cable on my 8274 and one of those huge yellow hooks and I don't think it weighs 100 lbs total especially since it came UPS.



A Warn 8274 with steel cable tips the scales at 110 lbs. :eek:

You'd prolly lose like 30-35 lbs or so going to rope. maybe a little more on this winch since it has more rope that some others. (150 ft vs. 125....)

Originally posted by 92xj


Sure it moves, back and forth several inches each way while being fully stretched, exactly the circumstance most likely to cut a strand. Run you winch cable over a rock ledge to an anchor point and have your buddys winch it up while you watch the contact point.

You may get some movement out of the anchor if it is attached to a tow strap around a rock, but you won't get any movement from the rope stretching.

That is the inherent value of this product. It doesn't stretch. No stretch, no stored energy, no stored energy, no snap when it fails.

3/8" IPSWR weighs in at a whopping .23# per foot. So your 150' of wire rope on a 8274 should weigh in at about 35#. Yes you can fit 150' of 3/8" on a 8274 because that is what I run on mine, mostly because it was free.

Originally posted by shaggyk5


A Warn 8274 with steel cable tips the scales at 110 lbs. :eek:

You'd prolly lose like 30-35 lbs or so going to rope. maybe a little more on this winch since it has more rope that some others. (150 ft vs. 125....)

Sounds about right on the total weight - using the stock 5/16 wire rope , then add about 40 lbs for the mounting plate. But he was saying that his cable weighed 100 lbs - more like 25-30 lbs maybe. So switching to the nylon rope might shave off 20 lbs.

Originally posted by evilfij
If you get the "yellow hook" make sure to keep it well greased.

seen a couple siezed

Ron

I don't like the "yellow hooks" that come with the Master Pull rope. I think they are a PITA..

It was my understanding talking to a manufacturer that the winch ropes do NOT stretch like steel cables. Let me check my rope's specs again.

A few other things to keep in mind. Wind the first layers tightly on the drum. I tried to unspool mine after a few uses and it knotted up on the drum from overlap.

When anchoring, don't combine it with a wire extention. The wire cable, if not attached to fixed points, will try to unwravel itself under load because the winch rope doesn't have any stored energy.

It is a great product, I have to admit I was a bit sketched out on my first vertical pull up guardrail on a wet day. The rope was dragging over the top of the rock face and if it let go, I'd a been tumbling down the mountain. It held up and just got fuzzy as others mentioned.

Johnathan

Originally posted by Jtisdale

When anchoring, don't combine it with a wire extention. The wire cable, if not attached to fixed points, will try to unwravel itself under load because the winch rope doesn't have any stored energy.

Johnathan

What are you saying - that if you use a extension on your wire rope, it will unravel??? If this has ever happened to you, I would be very suspect of the quality of the wire rope you used. The only time wire rope will "unwind" and bunch up is when it has been subjected to shock loading. If this is the case, the wire rope is junk, and should not be used again under any conditions.

If you use a wire extention on rope it can "birdcage" this is because you have an effectively "ends free" situation.

Try it. It happens.

Ron

I have used a 30' nylon sling as a extension many times and have never had any birdcages on the winch cable. Does the birdcage happen to the wire rope extension or the winch cable??.