My manual and a notice below the shifter says not to operate the Sami in 4WD if the front hubs are not locked. Non-Sami guys told me that they had no idea why not.

:confused: Should you not operate the Sami on 4WD if the hubs are not engaged?

:confused: If not, why?

Wayne

:confused: Should you not operate the Sami on 4WD if the hubs are not engaged?


you can if you need to.....you will not hurt anything your front axle just wont engage.........
who reads manuals anyways :rolleyes:

Been doing it for years
What could it hurt?

I worry more about running on the road with the hubs in and in 2wd more than using 4-lo without the hubs locked in. My front driveline vibrates due to bad pinion angle.

My manual and a notice below the shifter says not to operate the Sami in 4WD if the front hubs are not locked. Non-Sami guys told me that they had no idea why not.

:confused: Should you not operate the Sami on 4WD if the hubs are not engaged?

:confused: If not, why?

Wayne
The question is: WHY would you wanna do it? :shaking:
Unless you need 2 Low I cannot see the point... :confused:

The question is: WHY would you wanna do it? :shaking:
Unless you need 2 Low I cannot see the point... :confused:


Towing, for one.

I have been contemplating swapping out my ADD T-100 front hubs for manual hubs for this very reason. Especially if you saw how steep and twisty my driveway is coupled with towing my boat up the hill in reverse to park it.

I use it like 2-lo all the time.
The group I guided at our event thorugh the river trail, I ran 4-lo with the hubs unlocked most of the day until we got to the hill at the end.

I use it in my tow rig all the time pulling the trailer out of the yard and backing up with a trailer to go slow and not work the auto tranny as hard.

The only thing you have to remember is that you must be stopped to shift from 2wd to 4wd and same as normal 4wd, must be stopped to go from 4-hi to 4-lo.

allmost all 4x4 rigs used to say somthing about not running in 4 low without the hubs locked in

it had somthing to do with the rear axle not being designed to handle the extra tork of low range allby itself the manufactures figure the front axle will take some of the load off the rear thefore making it strong enough

I wouldnt worry about it much alot of people are running 6 to 1 t cases and bigger tires and the designers definately never figured on that

the reason you dont see this warning on alot of rigs anymore is alot of them have auto hubs or similar systems

Towing, for one.

I have been contemplating swapping out my ADD T-100 front hubs for manual hubs for this very reason. Especially if you saw how steep and twisty my driveway is coupled with towing my boat up the hill in reverse to park it.
That's right. 2low is understandable. That's what I said. I used to do that all the time on the trail, as my front locker was annoing to steer with (befor the PS went in) and 2 hi got me stalling all the time. :rolleyes: The duals took care of that, though. :D

I just cannot see the benefit of running in 4 Hi with the hubs unlocked, or is it just me :confused:

Yeah, 4x4hi in 2wd wouldn't gain you anything at all, you're correct in that... I think most of us just figured he was talking about 4lo w/ front unlocked, since then you can basically use a cheap 2lo.

I don't have a sami, but I ran my explorer that way at Moab when I blew the front locker on TOWT. No problems at all - just 2 low.

Just a rub, I also made it up an obstacle that way that the sami in front of me had trouble with in 4... :D something to do with power to weight ratio I think...

Yeah, 4x4hi in 2wd wouldn't gain you anything at all, you're correct in that...

I think most of us just figured he was talking about 4lo w/ front unlocked, since then you can basically use a cheap 2lo.


exactly.

Thanks for the response.

Whitefish is correct, in that my question was about 4lo (2lo) w/ front unlocked. I was looking to use the lower gear for my steep gravel driveway and other occasions when I needed lower gears and not need 4WD.

szki272 - I see the logic, just did not consider it. It helps to know why you should or should not do something; you can make a much better informed decision.

MudKick - "WHY would you wanna do it?" Cause I can :rolleyes: . "Unless you need 2 Low I cannot see the point..." That is the point :rolleyes: . LOL. Just picking on you. Actually, several of these guys have posted reasons to do it. Mine, at this point, was the driveway.

Islandzuki - "Who reads manuals anyways?" Silly question. You reach a certain age that constipation is fairly frequent, thus more reading material is required. :D LOL.

Wayne

glfredrick - Sorry about your front locker. Maybe if you had a Sami you could have avoided that? LOL. I appreciate your post; my question actually pertained to all 4WD vehicles.

Something to do with power to weight ratio? Consider the following:

A prostitute once ask a guy with a small penis, "Who are you going to satisfy with that?" He responded, "Me!".

Chemical442/Whitefish - You guys know what I am talking about even if I don't. Thanks.

It's awful not to know enough about a subject to even ask a question. I'll get it though, and talk shit with the best of you.


Wayne

Islandzuki - "Who reads manuals anyways?" Silly question. You reach a certain age that constipation is fairly frequent, thus more reading material is required. :D LOL.

Wayne


:laughing: LOL


"lotsa time? check."

"toilet paper? check."

"owner's manual? check."

From reading these posts , it seems that a lot of questions would be answered by having a t-case that has a 2lo option ,,as for that warning in the manuel i dont recall seeing it in the info window under my shifter i use mine all the time in 4 h and 2lo and have never had any kinda problem ,, with a GOOFY STICK 2LO tcase if you need lo range to tow a boat up a hilly drive way ,, all you would have to do is shift it into 2 lo and tow the boat ,, but a stock sami t-case dosent have 2lo , or even a true neutral position, ,,, is says n on the shifter ,, but thats not neutral that just locked your drivelines together so you cant tow cause the diffrent wheel speeds from front to rear will shear your driiveline bolts in a turn if your lucky if your not it will destroy your u joint and the ears on the driveline , but if you have a t-case that has a GOOFY STICK mod done to it
YOU have 2LO anytime you want and if you want to tow shift it in to a true neutral and you can tow all the way across the country if you want NONE of the front driveline stuff turns
till you want it to

I recall reading in the owner's manual that the vehicle should never be driven over 55 mph also.

but thats not neutral that just locked your drivelines together so you cant tow cause the diffrent wheel speeds from front to rear will shear your driiveline bolts in a turn if your lucky if your not it will destroy your u joint and the ears on the driveline

unlock the front hubs ?

pull the rear drive line ?

buy a trailer ?

who said anything about locking the hubs ?????? locked hubs are ONLY for 4 wheeling ,,,,,,,, you never tow with hubs locked .... as for buy a trailer ,,,, that means that you get to buy a truck too ! and find more parking spaces too ! twice the gas bill too ! that dosent work for me ,,, so I found a better way ,,, and its a lot cheaper to a t-case with 2lo and a true neutral thats why i took mine apart and found a better way ! I call it THE GOOFY STICK 2LO t-case Choose any gear ANYTIME YOU WANT !
And have a true neutral for flat towing AND THATS A REAL NEUTRAL ! ONLY THE REAR DRIVELINE AND DIFF SPIN NOTHING ELSE !

I have the warning in the info window under my shifter in my '91 Zuke.

I am missing something guys. For this newbe, please be patient and detailed.

1. With no mod, hubs unlocked, in 4W (hi or lo), rear turns, front diff turns, and front wheels do not turn with diff. Is this correct?

2. With no mod, hubs locked, in 4W (hi or lo), rear turns, front diff turns, and front wheels do turn with diff. Is this correct?

3. With no mod, hubs locked (or unlocked), in original neutral, rear nor front diff turns. Is this correct?

4. With THE GOOFY STICK 2LO t-case (modified transfer), hubs unlocked (or unlocked), in modified neutral, rear turns, front diff does not. Is this correct?

5. I don't understand how THE GOOFY STICK 2LO t-case (modified transfer), could be in neutral and allow you to choose any gear you want. Is there a modification other than the true neutral?


Wayne

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes
4. I don't know the "goofy stick" mod, but that would make sense.
5. I don't know.

3. With no mod, hubs unlocked (or unlocked), in original neutral, rear nor front diff turns. Is this correct?


IIRC, if the t-case is in nuetral, it still turns the front d-shaft.

The rear d-shaft is connected to the front via the main output shaft for both, once pulled into 4wd, the front d-shaft is engaged to the main out put shaft in the t-case. Therefore, in nuetral the front and rear d-shaft turn.

I lost a d-shaft spacer one time using a dolly, t-case and tranny both in nuetral. It was about a 120 miles haul, and the front d-shaft vibrates some due to poor pinion angle. I think the vibration worked the bolts loose through the spacer and it blew apart.
When I got home two bolts were left, but the spacer was gone.

reddog1 the answers to your questions are (1) YES (2) NO with hubs locked EVERYTHING turns drivelines diffs wheels (3) hubs locked in original N EVERYTHING spins drivelines diffs wheels / unlocked hubs EVERYTHING BUT the F wheels spin , drivelines diffs wheels (4) yes
(5) yes there is more to it then just neutral ,,
Neutral puts the t-case between gears ,,,, just like the trany ,,, when u put it in neutral its between gears and you can let out the clutch and it wont move ,when you push in the clutch u can choose ANY GEAR, HI or LO 2wd or 4wd or u can choose neutral and it wont move ,, no matter what gear the trany is in thats what the goofy stick 2lo tcase does hope that ---clears things up some



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88 sami 1600 8v the original goofystick 2lo 4.16 to 1 tcase toy axles 4.88s spoa OBA celica power stearing and a bunch of other stuff I cant remember

toyparts - When you state "Neutral puts the t-case between gears", is this the factory neutral or the modified neutral?

Wayne

That is so you do not mess up the front spider gears, I Think when the suzuki engineers designed the tranfer case they messed up when making the front shaft spin while in neutral, so with a stock no posi front end on a samurai while towing with the rear drive shaft in and the transfer case in neutral I would lock in just one of the hubs to save the spider gears from running away, i.e. if one of the spindle brass bearings was too tight the other axel would spin twice as fast as you are towing it, say at 55 mph one axel zero and the other axel 110 mph. there for excess wear on the spider gears to say the least!

Why does this thread and the Modified neutral in Transfer thread have blue boxes with a check in them?

Wayne

its the modified neutral the stock neutral isnt really neutral at all ! what it does is lock both output gears front and rear together which are then turned by the r driveline,,,,,, thats what happens when you pull the tcase shifter from 2hi to 4 hi with a GOOFY STICK mod done to the t case it goes in to a true neutral between gears and as i stated before you can choose any gear anytime you like 2/4 hi/lo any combo to 2 lo to 4 hi to 2 hi
you choose which gear you want when you want it






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88 1600 8v origional GOOFY STICK tcase and a whole bunch of stuff that i cant remember

I played with my transfer last night. It appears that it is modified differently than yours.

In the stock transfer shift pattern, you move the stick from 4WD High to the right then up to stock neutral then up further to 4WD Low.

On my transfer, about midway between stock neutral and 4WD Low there is a true (?) neutral. In this position, the front driveline turns freely, and with the Transmission in gear (engine running), the rear driveline is disconnected from the transmission.

It would appear that the only benefit to my transfer mod is for towing.


Wayne

Its the GOOFY STICK neutral A stock tcase dosent give you a REAL neutral
mrfuelish NEVER tow with 1 hub locked that causes HALF of your f drivetrain to turn the whole point of having hubs is to be able to disconnect the f end when not needed I.E. driving on the street ,,, towing , when you tow with a Real Neutral Only the rear diff , rear driveline and rear output shaft of the tcase turn,,, in the front ONLY the wheels turn ! When you lock 1 hub you have now caused the axle to turn and the diff and the f driveline all those parts cause drag ! have you ever driven on the street with 1 hub locked in 2 wd ????? you can feel which wheel it is in the steering wheel ... that is because that 1 hub locks all the parts from the hub to the tcase together and when the wheel turns so does EVERYTHING else axle diff driveline bearings gears ,,, all that stuff ,,, and as i said the whole point of selectable hubs is to be able to turn on OR off the F drivetrain when needed
reddog1 sorry to hear that ,,,,,, as you get to know your sami more you,ll see the need for a t case that gives you 2lo ability ,, and i guess i should have told you to look to see if your t case is painted orange thats the color that the GOOFY STICK 2LO cases are if its not , its not a GOOFY STICK 2LO case one other thing THIS IS NOT LIKE A REVERSE S SHIFTER or any other shifter kit on the market you use your stock sami shifter and gaskets

toyparts - Thanks for the info. As time progresses, I will change the gears in the transfer. Then I will take a look at the GOOFY STICK.

Thanks again.

Wayne