Congratulate me! Blew apart the T-5 like it was a candle on a birthday cake!

Which tranny would be the best replacement?

1. What is the best option, cheap? (Possibilities: Ford T-18 or the Ford NP435? Any more?????)

2. Second best option scavenging used bell housings or having to shell out minimal $$$ for adaptors.

(I don't have the $$$ to buy the NV4500, so don't list it. I need to do this as cheaply as possible: I would like to keep the driveshafts the same length so I don't have to shell $$ out to shorten them. And I don't want to have to buy any advanced adaptors parts.)

I have a 1979 CJ-7 with the 304 V8, Dana 300, and the crappy T-5. Also has 4.56 gears, moser 1 piece axle shafts in rear, 36" boggers and lockers both front and rear. Run in both mud and rocks; more rocks now that I found Paragon.

Thanks for the help.


:usa:

Well since you don't want to spend any money on modifications that go along with a tranny swap just get another T-5 and be done with it until it breaks again. I think any other tranny will require driveshaft mods, bellhousing mods etc.

When your ready to grow up get an NV4500 and be done with it!

:D

heheh well i know you dont want another t5 but ive got one if you need it.

I vote for TF 727 out of wagoneer.......bolts up.Use wagoneer column for shifter.Or if you have to have manual I say T-18:beer:

oh never thought of that.... if you want an auto i know where a grand waggy with a 727 is sittin.

Don't think you can do a NP 435 or a T-18 with a D300 without buying an adapter. Since you've got to buy the adapter anyway, go with whatever you find cheapest. I think either one with the adapter is about the same length as a T-5 so you don't have to modify the driveshafts. If you would consider losing the D300, you could get a T-18 and D20 out of a J-truck or a Cherokee. Might be cheaper than buying the adapter. Since T-5s and D300s didn't come in 79 CJs I assume you or a previous owner must have swapped them in. Any old parts left from that?

I say NP435, probably because I just finished it.

Get a tranny from a Ford for around $75-$100 and the adapter for about $400 to the Dana300 and you can do the project in about a day once you have all the parts. You'll also need the pilot bushing that is about $20. You'll need to get either a T-150 or mustang 10.5" clutch disc, have your flywheel resurfaced, another pressure plate and probably get a new throwout bearing while you're in there.

You will need a T-150 or T-176 bellhousing from a Jeep, which is different than your T-5. Find in a yard or from a fellow Jeeper.

There are no driveshaft modifications if you have the T-5.

If the tranny looks like crap when you get in there, you would have to rebuild it. I don't think that is expensive though. I think it is about 100-150 for a complete kit w/ bearings, seals, gaskets, synchros and whatever else needed.

It will cost around $600 w/out rebuild or $750 w/ rebuild, but I think it is worth it. If you go auto, it will probably cost you at least that to get it rebuilt and strong enough to be able to wheel it hard.

Just my .02. I can't really back it up yet because I haven't driven it yet. Still have to put the new body on.

If you want to be REALLY cheap, then I say put in a T150/D20 combo. You can pick em up for $50 still connected together. Won't be the best for wheeling, but will be stronger than the T5. Not sure on the length of the T5/D300 vs T150/D20, should be close enough.

If you get lucky, get a Scout T18 or T19 from 1980. That will bolt up to the D300.

Tell me more about the t-18 swap from the scout. I have a friend who rebuilds Scouts so I could get one easily. You said it would bolt up to the Dana 300, what about to the v-8? Will I have to use an aftermarket adaptor?

Some posts say that the T-18 will bolt to the 300 and the other says it does not. Will one manufacturer bolt up (Scout) and another (Ford) will not?

The NP435 sounds like a lot of work and $$. But, I'd like to hear how the swap went for you.

I'm not sure if I want to rebuild the T-5. Everyone on POR says they are like match sticks and they do not rebuild well.....

Dust Puppy- let's talk....

(Grandpa Jeep- you are very observant about the Jeep. However, I do not have any parts left over. I bought the Jeep with the Dana 300 and the T-5 already installed- sorry!)

Anyone have an NV4500 cheap? Trade hardtop and doors and tires...

Thanks again

Only 1980 Scouts came with the D300, all the rest came with the D20.

Just so you know, the 1980 Scout D300 is hard to find and usually cost a lot (if someone knows what they are). Its the only D300 that has a T18 bolt pattern.

In other words, you would need to find a Jeep T18 and a Scout D300. I personally just use a D20, but thats just me.

email me...

im gettin ready to pull EVERYTHING from the CJ goin 360,turbo400, d20 so i have a 258, and t5 that im not doin anything with (the 300 is goin in the puppy) and i know where a 727 is sittin in that waggy.

lemmy know

Originally posted by RSQJEEP
Tell me more about the t-18 swap from the scout. I have a friend who rebuilds Scouts so I could get one easily. You said it would bolt up to the Dana 300, what about to the v-8? Will I have to use an aftermarket adaptor?

Some posts say that the T-18 will bolt to the 300 and the other says it does not. Will one manufacturer bolt up (Scout) and another (Ford) will not?

As someone else already said, the 1980 Scout did come with a Dana 300, but it is different from the Jeep D300. A Jeep D300 will not bolt up to any Scout or Ford tranny. The Scout D300 will bolt up in place of a Scout or Jeep D20. The Scout T-18 and the Jeep T-18 are identical as far as the transfer case end is concerened. Either will bolt up to a D20 or a Scout D300 with the factory adapter. The Scout T-18 will not bolt up to your engine however. (unless you get one that was originally in a Scout with an AMC 6) You can swap the Scout input for a Ford input and use a Jeep T-150 bellhousing though. This swap also requires a special pilot busing as does any of the Ford tranny swaps. I'd say it's worth talking to you Scout rebuilder friend. He may have something that will work for you.

Originally posted by RSQJEEP
(Grandpa Jeep- you are very observant about the Jeep. However, I do not have any parts left over. I bought the Jeep with the Dana 300 and the T-5 already installed- sorry!)


Actually, I wasn't interested in your parts. Just asking to see if you already owned anything (such as the original T-150 bellhousing or D20 t-case) that would make the swap easier.

Find a T-176 4 speed trans. It is the strongest stock trans put on a CJ. It is backed up with a Dana 300. I have 35 Boggers and a
v-8 and never had a problem with the trans. Broke everything else though!!! Later model CJ's came with them '84-'86.

Dust Puppy- I e-mailed you. Get back to me or give me a call please. RSQJEEP@yahoo.com

I'm debating between the T-176, T-18 A and another crappy T-5. I was looking in the Advanced Adaptor catalog last night...holy #%*! All of the adaptors are at least $500!

A couple more questions...

1. ) Does anyone know if the Heavy duty T-18 A that came with the 6.32 first gear will bolt to the AMC V-8 and the Dana 300? I know it came in 1977- 1979 CJ-7's with 232/258's. (The other small problem with the T-18 A is that it measures 11.85" as opposed to my current T-5 of 15.817", so driveshaft will need to be lengthened. I guess this isn't a bad thing, but more $$. Maybe I could use a different Jeep bellhousing to make up for the difference?)

2.) I know the T-5 has a better 1st gear ratio of 4.03 and the T-176 has 3.82. But, which case will hold up better overall to V-8 power?

1. ) Does anyone know if the Heavy duty T-18 A that came with the 6.32 first gear will bolt to the AMC V-8 and the Dana 300? I know it came in 1977- 1979 CJ-7's with 232/258's. (The other small problem with the T-18 A is that it measures 11.85" as opposed to my current T-5 of 15.817", so driveshaft will need to be lengthened. I guess this isn't a bad thing, but more $$. Maybe I could use a different Jeep bellhousing to make up for the difference?)

yes, the way you do this is to get a Ford 2wd T18a and buy the AA conversion kit for ~$500. This converts the T18a to bolt up to your engine and adapts it to a D300.

(The other small problem with the T-18 A is that it measures 11.85" as opposed to my current T-5 of 15.817", so driveshaft will need to be lengthened. I guess this isn't a bad thing, but more $$. Maybe I could use a different Jeep bellhousing to make up for the difference?)

The T-5 is 15.817" including the adapter. The T-18 is 11.87" not including the adapter. The D300 adapter is 3.25" so the installed length is 15.12". Your driveshafts can probably absorb the 3/4" difference or you can shift your engine rearward. I agree with Archie, if you decide to go this route, get the Ford tranny. It should be much cheaper than the more rare Jeep tranny, and both require the adapter.

Also look at Ford NP435s. You may find one cheaper than a T-18. The adapter is the same cost and installed length is the same so no driveshaft mods.

Originally posted by palmer
Find a T-176 4 speed trans. It is the strongest stock trans put on a CJ. It is backed up with a Dana 300.

I agree, I ran a T-176 behind a 327 and 350 SBC and never had a problem. The only one that I know of that has failed was behind a healthy 401 w/ Nitrous and the guy was Hot Rodding it on the street, showing how he could do a wheelie.

My '82 CJ-5 had a T-176 And my current Jeep ('81 CJ-7) had it (currently has an Auto) I believe my brother's Jeep had it too ('80 CJ-5?) It is essentially the 4 Speed version of the T-150. Although it is not geared as low as some of the other 4 speeds. I think it is around 3.5:1 first gear? The brother of this tranny, I think was used in Ford trucks had a 3.8:1 first gear -- the T177, I don't know what t-case this will bolt up to though.

This website may give you more ideas. (http://www.4wheelingplus.com/tranny.asp)

It was between '76 thru '79 that the T-18 was offered as a stock option in the CJ-7. I don't think it matters much if it's the A or B, both perform outstanding off road. As for the D300, look at a d300 and a D20 side by side. The D20 is far superior in strength and is a direct fit for the T-18, now mix that with some 4:11's or lower and you're cooking with gas:D The D20 can also be modified with the lower gears and still be stronger than the D300.

I know that Jeep had the T-18 for a few years, but was it backed by the 258 or a 304?

Will the T-18 mount to the Dana 300? Dana 300 wasn't used until 1980+.

The other reason I want the T-18 A specifically is because the T-18A version used from 1977-1979 in CJ's features a granny low first gear(6:32:1.)

I would consider using the Dana 20, but I already have the Dana 300, so I don't want to have to spend more $$ buying that too.

I thought we had this cleared up. Here it is again:

The T-18 was offered behind either the 258 or the 304. Anything that will bolt to any AMC 6 will also bolt to any AMC V8. The Jeep T-18s were only offered with the D20 transfercase. They were never offered with the D300 from the factory. Therefore, there are no factory adapters to adapt the T-18 to the D300. There is no way to use a T-18 with a D300 unless you buy a ~$500 adapter. There is no way to use any granny tranny (ie. the T-18, NP435, SM465 or SM420) with the D300 without buying a ~$500 aftermarket adapter. You might be able to find a used one from another Jeeper, but you not will find anything like that in a junkyard.

I'm afraid this is a case of if you want to play you have to pay.

Thanks for clearing that up. I only asked again because I was looking through the advanced adaptor catalog and they did not list the T-18 as being used in Jeep behind the 304; only listed the tranny as used behind the 258.

Looks like you are right; gotta pay to play.

Maybe I'll just carry spare T-5's around in the CJ. Everyone seems like they willl pay you to get it out of their junk pile.

Looks like it will be easiest now to do the T-176 now and save up to do a real tranny swap later.

Why are the adaptors sooooo expensive? Why isn't anyone else making them?

thanks for the advise guys!;)

Originally posted by RSQJEEP
Thanks for clearing that up. I only asked again because I was looking through the advanced adaptor catalog and they did not list the T-18 as being used in Jeep behind the 304; only listed the tranny as used behind the 258.

AA might be right about that, but like I said earlier, it doesn't matter anyway since any tranny that will bolt up to a 6 will bolt up to a V8.

Originally posted by RSQJEEP
Looks like you are right; gotta pay to play.

Maybe I'll just carry spare T-5's around in the CJ. Everyone seems like they willl pay you to get it out of their junk pile.

Looks like it will be easiest now to do the T-176 now and save up to do a real tranny swap later.

Why are the adaptors sooooo expensive? Why isn't anyone else making them?

thanks for the advise guys!;)

Novak (http://www.novak-adapt.com/) also makes adapters, but they're not a whole lot cheaper. I think the reason they're soo expensive is there just isn't much demand. I have no idea how many adapters they sell, but I can't imagine it's more than a few hundred a year total. They have to pay the bills some how. I guess we should count ourselves lucky that there is something available at any price.

Originally posted by RSQJEEP
The other reason I want the T-18 A specifically is because the T-18A version used from 1977-1979 in CJ's features a granny low first gear(6:32:1.)

I would consider using the Dana 20, but I already have the Dana 300, so I don't want to have to spend more $$ buying that too.

The T-18 b has a "Granny low" as well and is also 6:something:1 and would make a fine candidate for your your swap. As for the D300, I would try to sell it, alot of guys run 'em, but with a T-18, stick with the D20, it's STRONGER and you could pick one up used for cheap and the best part is that everything will bolt right up. The question here is, do you want to wheel? If so and you don't want to spend a ton of bucks, this is the way to go. The basic answer to your question is: T-18a/b w/D20 GOOD, T-18a/b w/ D300 BAD. Why spend the bucks on an adapter ($500) to an inferior, weaker transfer case? You'd spend twice as much on half the strength, not to mention that you would be going through transfer cases left and right. I know plenty of people who carry extra D300's with them and don't know anybody that carries an extra D20.