Formula Toy - Cage #29

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I just wanted to introduce myself to all of the current Formula Toy People. My Name Matt Messer and am from Fresno Ca. Thanks to the Chris at Marlin's donating a frame my Formula Toy is offically underway. I just purchased cage #29 from Mike at Hendrix Motorsport today. I am planning on competing in April, so I will look forward to meeting eveyone face to face then.

[Keith]

you are not gay are you?

[larryboy]

you are not gay are you?

quit hittin' on the n00bs,ya prevert.







:D

[EvlDodge]

Right on, make sure you take too many pictures of your build up and post them all here!

[Chris Geiger]

His wife says he's not gay.

Ok here are a couple photos he sent me to post up. Let Formula Toyota #29 begin!

http://www.marlincrawler.com/ftoy/06897.jpg

http://www.marlincrawler.com/ftoy/06903.jpg

[camo]

best first post ever...:D

welcome to PBB.

start building and keep posting

[a2b]

http://www.marlincrawler.com/ftoy/06897.jpg






ummmmmmm...you might want to address that "toe in" problem :flipoff2:

[Lowtorious]

I want a damn forklift!!

[Hammer Hog]

Welcome aboard :D
Post plenty of pics of your build and don't worry about asking stupid questions, whereas there's a bunch of stupid people out here :D

Good luck on your build Matt :D

[SanDiegoCJ]

ummmmmmm...you might want to address that "toe in" problem :flipoff2:



Hobie............................................. :p

[Chris Geiger]

Did you notice it was a Toyota forklift. Now that's using the right tool for the job.

[drsmash]

welcome!!!

[Lemoore-on]

Hey Matt, did I meet you at Marlin's last saturday? This is THE place. Search all the F-Toy posts and ask questions, learn from everybody else's mistakes :D I know you were asking Todd about his. From what I've seen, this class works together alot. Everybody would rather beat you/or be beaten on the course than in the pits!

[Tim Florian]

I wish I could fit in a f-toy :( You people are all so nice to each other.

[Chris Geiger]

I wish I could fit in a f-toy :( You people are all so nice to each other.

Why can't you fit into an Ftoy? It's got more head and butt room than the rig you bought from me.

Yeasterday I put the seats in, and figuring what's going where. It's very roomy.

[jwag]

Congrats Matt, Here's a few links to start

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=179495

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=304363

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=304363

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=247606

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=247606

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=225093

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=188709

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I really appreciate the warm welcome to the BBS and to Formula Toy. I have really gone off the deep end with this....I am constantly thinking about it. I will continue to post pics myself or via Chris G.

Thanks again,
Matt

[a2b]

matt,
here's my site full of pics and stuff...

http://formulahobie.vze.com

also, watch this to keep you motivated to get'er done! (http://www.s-10crewcab.com/hobie/FormulaToyotas.WMV)

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

I wish I could fit in a f-toy :( You people are all so nice to each other.

You're not that big Sasquatch :flipoff2:

I fit very safely in Todd's. You couldn't fit in Hammer Hog's, but that's cause he raised the seat 4" when he heard you wanted to drive it :flipoff2:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

After shortening the frame, rear hangers were welded on.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/rearhanger.JPG
Front hanger.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/fronthanger.JPG

Checking front spring fit
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/checkingsprings.JPG

Me wondering what have I gotton my self into? (Dang that Geiger Guy, got me again!!)
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/ohcrap.JPG

I will post more images tonight. A full day of work will go into the project today.

:cool2:

[Hammer Hog]

Looking good Matt :D

I'm looking at the front of the rear spring hangers, I see a square tube running between them. Is that going to clear your driveshaft? Or is it just there to mock your mounts?
As for mine, I couldn't do it.

[Chris Geiger]

That's a front spring hanger mounted at the front of the rear springs. This will allow him to inboard the rear springs.

[Hammer Hog]

That's a front spring hanger mounted at the front of the rear springs. This will allow him to inboard the rear springs.


That I understand, but that tube that runs across may interfere with the driveshaft.

[Chris Geiger]

Matt will be running our springs and crossmember, so his frame will be higher than our FT frame is and his tcase will sit lower in the frame. That will lower the drive shaft and should clear the rear spring crossmember.

[a2b]

i had a tube between mine just to hold them in place and get the right measurements.

BTW, matt, nice shop!

[Air Ride]

Looking good, I would suggest moving that steering box mount as far forward as you can get it.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

As for the rear drive shaft. It is going to be very, very close to hitting the spring hanger tube, I might have to notch the tube slightly. I won't know foresure until everything else gets fit checked.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Welded front gussets in.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07943.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07944.JPG

Inboarding of rear springs, just tacked inplace for now.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07945.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07946.JPG

Front Springs Mounted.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07949.JPG

Rear Springs Mounted.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07951.JPG

Hendrix Motor Mounts tacked 8" to the rear from stock position.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07952.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07953.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07954.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

One last Pic!
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07959.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I almost forgot the picture of lucky number #29 from Hendrix Motor Sports.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC07964.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

The Front Axle is finally complete and should be bolted up tonight. YEAH!!!
(A BIG THANKS TO ROCKY AT MARLINS!!!)


http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08182.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08183.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08184.JPG

Thanks to PRP my seats are in-house and ready to go. SWEET!
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08185.JPG

[a2b]

i like those seats. are those the all pro springs that are a bit too short? just wondering about that front shackle angle is all. and i would weld up the steering stops before you put the housing on. its alot easier when its not bolted in. and i am with mike, the steering box needs to go way forward. and i dont see how the rear drive shaft is going to miss that rear cross member between the hangers :confused: i hope you make it to the jambo!!! good luck :)

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I will weld the stops up tonight, thanks for the reminder. The rear crossmember will mostly be cut out. It would be a miracle if the drive line actually cleared it. The front shackle angle is questionable, but I think it will be acceptable after weight is added from the motor and trans. (they are Marlin springs)

I am not sure about the steering box yet, I need to see how everything is going to layout.

[wv4runner]

Weld up those steering stops.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Welded Steering Stops Complete
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08188.JPG

She's on Wheels! - This is a huge milestone.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08191.JPG

This is the first fit check for the motor and the trans. We decided to set the cage on because we were so excited with our progress.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08193.JPG

[EvlDodge]

Is that rust I see on that sweet cage?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Cross member completed
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08218.JPG

Cage is now tacked in place
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08216.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08220.JPG

Working on the Pedals
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08223.JPG

[ft13]

welcome to the faimly. progress looking good im robert i live in oakhurst were's your shop i'd like to stop by & say hi

[camo]

nice progress...get it coming

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

It is going to be a real push to make April....This is still the goal. Thanks for the good comments

[CronusTRD]

Is it me or does it look like the chassis is mounted higher than everyone elses?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

The Cage is 1.75" above the frame and is only tacked. I thought this look like a good starting point. I want to make sure that I have plenty of clearance under my seat for those hard drops as well as some room for my helmet.

It will most likely come down to around 1.25" to 1.50"....

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08350.JPG

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[ACE-CAGE-#29]

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08499.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08500.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08501.JPG

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http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08512.JPG

[Chris Geiger]

I think you have solved the drive shaft problem with that hoop.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Drive shaft will fit ok now, it looks to be about 30 degrees.......AWFUL ANGLE!!!!

[hobiewife]

cool. i like the hoop for protection. BTW, mine is 1.5" off the frame. but it could go 2"...it gets the chassis up out of the way of rocks a little bit. but does raise the COG. i went thru an obstacle once like it was nothing but steve had a hard time cuz his chassis was lower and he kept getting hung up. but either way. i would just get it comfortable. hope you make the jambo!!!! :)

[Heywood]

It is going to be a real push to make April....This is still the goal. Thanks for the good comments

Looks like you will make it at the rate you are going :smokin:
I think the April comp is still up in the air, but the Jambo is on!!
It would be cool to do a run with all Ftoys out there.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Steering Column Completed....Finally
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08562.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08563.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08565.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08566.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

CRAP....I guess these seats are not fire proof. Aaron from PRP, if you see this post let me know if you can fix the burn. FYI - do not forget to cover your seats when you are welding near them... Dang that sucks.....
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08570.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08573.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08577.JPG

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http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08580.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08581.JPG


Boy that looks really good.......OH CRAP WHERE DO THE REAR SHOCKS GO?
It was late what can I say. Lucky enough the tanks can be moved closer together to allow for proper shock mounting. I picked up the shocks today from Chris. Should get them installed tomorrow evening.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08582.JPG

[Heywood]

Nice, another one with propane :smokin:

Are those 8 or 10 gal tanks?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

They are 8 gallon....who all is running propane at this point?

[Heywood]

They are 8 gallon....who all is running propane at this point?

As far as I know, we are, you are , and I think someone else was talking about it.

Ive never had propane before, Im pretty impressed with it so far, its been working real good :grinpimp:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Did you loose any power? I am a little concerned about power lose, but Carey from "Got Propane" assures me that I will loose no power and will mosly likely gain power.

I guess I won't know until I fire it up.

[Heywood]

Did you loose any power? I am a little concerned about power lose, but Carey from "Got Propane" assures me that I will loose no power and will mosly likely gain power.

I guess I won't know until I fire it up.

I cant really say if I lost any power or not, as my last rig was V6,

I do know there is two black stripes out side my shop about 30' long that say its got plenty of power :D

The power seems real good, Id really like to run it around with some of the other ones to see how it does. The thottle response is Imediate, and it just runs so fawking smooth :p I think Cary is right we he says it probably has more power, after stripping off all that bs from the carb and intake.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

That's cool, thanks for the positive feedback. I should be able to see first hand if there is a power lose or not due to the fact that I am using the same motor from my trail rig that is in the Formula.

[Propane]

You guys do the nicest work! One heads up, the tanks have a locating peg that is supposed to face downwards. No big deal if the brackets are turned, but the tank has a siphon tube so it can pull a liquid. I'm jealous :grinpimp:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Propane....thanks for the heads up on the tank positioning.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Heywood,
Did you block everything off like this. Looks so clean with all the CA smog crap gone.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08564.JPG

[Heywood]

Heywood,
Did you block everything off like this. Looks so clean with all the CA smog crap gone.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/CRAWLER08564.JPG

Yea thats the best part, I think I pluged 13 holes. You could really clean that thing nicely if you can weld alum.

[FYRDUDE]

They are 8 gallon....who all is running propane at this point?
My propane setup is in the works. Should see some pics coming shortly. :D

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Sweet!, can't wait to compare notes.

[FYRDUDE]

Building mine using a local propane guy who's been doing conversions for 20+ years. Working out great having him in town. I'll be putting up a step by step of the setup with pics. Can't wait to compare it to the other engines I've run. :D

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Mounting Shocks
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08836.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08837.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08838.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08839.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08841.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08842.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08844.JPG

[Chris Geiger]

The hoops came out looking good!

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Good progress was made on the floor boards today.

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08846.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC08848.JPG

[ghettowheeler]

looks great,are you goin to make the jambo

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I hope to make it! This will be a crucial week of building.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Tanks re-mounted. Much better idea after shocks have been installed
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09155.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09156.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09159.JPG
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09160.JPG

[408_jigga]

Nice job. Thats a lot of work! :)

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

GM 105 AMP Alternator (All they had was chrome....I guess it looks ok) It was pretty easy to install. I milled about 1.00" off of the existing mount and then modified the tension arm mount.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09386.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09388.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09390.JPG

It's nice to have an Electrical Engineer working for you...DAVE workin the Panel Over!
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09382.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09383.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09392.JPG

[a2b]

matt, nice alt. :flipoff2:

i cant tell for sure, but it looks like that alt. doesnt have a bracket that attaches on either side of the lower mount of the alt. it looks like just a bolt goes thru to mount to the motor. if so, that alt is going to vibrate itself off and to pieces.....ask me how i know :shaking:

bitichin panel too :smokin:

[drnut]

:smokin: one nice build up! I am starting to get the $$ for my F-Toy! I can't wait!!

[jchio]

Super nice work, keep it up!!

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Alternator reworked with new bracket
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09448.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09449.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09450.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Gotpropane.com equipment installed!
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09626.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09632.JPG

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[ACE-CAGE-#29]

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09631.JPG

[Chris Geiger]

Did you start it yet? Does it live?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Not yet. It should roar (no muffler yet) to life on Monday afternoon. I am still planning on next weekend. Probably will not have a hood or panels completed.....will just take it one day at a time.

[a2b]

are you trying to make cougar buttes matt?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Yes, the plan is make it to Cougar Buttes this next weekend. It is going to be a crazy week, but I think I can make it happen. Even if the Ftoy does not make I am planning on coming anyway.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Shes Alive and running smooth! We started the motor at about 8:00p.m. All of the gages are operating perfectly along with the electric fan. I drove it up and down the street and into our loading dock. What an incredible ride, this weekend should be awesome.
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09685.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09675.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09677.JPG

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http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC09683.JPG

[wv4runner]

Nice work.

I like the wheel/tire combo, are you the first formula with krawlers?

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

No. I think there is one other. The tires are red label and incredibly soft.

[FYRDUDE]

Strong work :smokin: Very nice. Can we see some day time pics? Can't wait to see that thing in person.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Strong work :smokin: Very nice. Can we see some day time pics? Can't wait to see that thing in person.

Are you going to Couger Buttes this weekend?

[FYRDUDE]

Was planning on it, however it hurts far too much see other people wheeling right now. :shaking: I'm having serious withdrawls. I think I need a patch or AA meeting or something. Being on the PBB can bring tears to my eyes on lonely nights. :crybaby2:
I think I'm going to try to get some much needed work done on the buggy.
I'll be there in spirit. Have a great time. :D

[Turtle Bite]

What kind of paint are you using on the radiator/ tube/ brake booster? That wheel and tire combo looks great on a formula toy. Makes me want to build one! Awesome work.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Was planning on it, however it hurts far too much see other people wheeling right now. :shaking: I'm having serious withdrawls. I think I need a patch or AA meeting or something. Being on the PBB can bring tears to my eyes on lonely nights. :crybaby2:
I think I'm going to try to get some much needed work done on the buggy.
I'll be there in spirit. Have a great time. :D


Don't lose heart, stay positive. Just keep working on one section at a time and it will finally all come together.

I will post some new pics tomorrow after painting is complete.

The exhaust was completed today, puurrrs like a kitten.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

What kind of paint are you using on the radiator/ tube/ brake booster? That wheel and tire combo looks great on a formula toy. Makes me want to build one! Awesome work.

Metallic "Cast Iron Grey" - Rustolem - looks pretty good for a rattle can job.

[a2b]

matt, good deal! i am glad its up and running. btw, krawlers suck for comps :flipoff2:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Here are some pictures of #29 from the Calrocs event yesterday. We didn't break anything and we didn't roll it either so I am really happy about that. The vehicle ran great and the performance overall was awesome. I really need to get the ram assit installed though.....

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC01164.JPG

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[ACE-CAGE-#29]

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]

[a2b]

nice finish matt! clean rig too :smokin:

did the trip go alright? yall all packed in that truck like sardines :laughing:

way to miss the meeting :flipoff2:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

nice finish matt! clean rig too :smokin:

did the trip go alright? yall all packed in that truck like sardines :laughing:

way to miss the meeting :flipoff2:


It was pretty tight in truck and it sucked when someone floated one, but we made it home safe. I needed to get out back home to another engagement for today. Sorry I had to rush out. Send me an email with the meeting information.

[a2b]

It was pretty tight in truck and it sucked when someone floated one.


:laughing:

[toyrunner]

It was pretty tight in truck and it sucked when someone floated one,

TMI!
Good meeting you Matt. First run and you were awesome! :D
Danny

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Here is what was happening 12 hours before the Calrocs event. We were workin it. The panels weren't even dry when we applied the decals.

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/decalin.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/di-pro1.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/di-pro1again.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/di-pro1cocpit.JPG

I am making the final welds on the steering colunm right before we put the buggy onto the trailer (the colunm was still only tack welded). This was a last minute save......Thanks for reminding me Dave!

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/lastminute.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/panelman.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/screwinaround.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/Dcp_0007.jpg

[LIKES2CRAWL]

No. I think there is one other. The tires are red label and incredibly soft.
what do you mean RED LABEL?

[yotacowboy]

what do you mean RED LABEL?


krawlers come in two rubber compounds/durometers: red labels are the softer "competition" compound. blue labels are the harder general use compound.

[LIKES2CRAWL]

krawlers come in two rubber compounds/durometers: red labels are the softer "competition" compound. blue labels are the harder general use compound.
Thanks for clearing that up for me, I guess I do learn something new every day. :D

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I guess those 30 spline longfields really are strong.....hence the weakest link images below. This sounded like Hobie's drive line breaking in the last comp. BOOM!
http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC00121.JPG

http://www.diprooffroad.com/images/formulatoy/DSC00122.JPG

[UGET IT]

I remeber doing that to 2 sets of 5.29's.......................

I havent had that issues with my Dana 60's as of yet!

[RE:Todd]

I guess those 30 spline longfields really are strong.....hence the weakest link images below. This sounded like Hobie's drive line breaking in the last comp. BOOM!
Damn Matt, looks like mine after the Jambo comp :D :D

[nightcrawler]

Mark - What size tire are you running? 37"? Any plm with twisting the splines on the rear axle shafts?

[Chris Geiger]

He's running 37" red lable MTR's. No problems with the rear axles yet.

[muddogbob]

How'd the ARB hold up?

[Chris Geiger]

How'd the ARB hold up?

The ARB's are working well. No problems to date.

[LIKES2CRAWL]

He's running 37" red lable MTR's. No problems with the rear axles yet.
MTR'S COME IN RED LABEL TOO?

[Chopperman]

Cryoed 4.10's ?

[Stealthrunner]

ya need to get a set of heat treated and cryoed gears from bobby long!!

[Chris Geiger]

We just installed a winch on Matt Ftoy this week and I thought I would post a few photos of the results...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/winch1.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/winch2.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/winch3.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/winch4.jpg

[mobil1syn]

what about some radiator protection

[Chris Geiger]

This week we installed PSC's 1500 psi pump and reservoir on our Formula Toy. The pump moved 4.5 gallons per minute. We combined it with the ram assist we are working on. Here are a few photos....

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/steering1.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/steering2.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/steering3.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/steering4.jpg

[GETTINTHERETOY]

Did you guys make up some sort of engine protection bar yet.

[Chris Geiger]

Did you guys make up some sort of engine protection bar yet.

We have placed support bars for the hood on the frame. How we are waiting for some aluminum to finish the hood.

[Chris Geiger]

This week we installed a trac-bar to eliminate axle wrap. We used some custom brackets and one of our long spline drive shaft kits. Two inch 1/4" tubing should handle the rocks.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/bar3

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/bar2

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/bar1

[tanman2003]

nice working with what you have, and it looks super strong.

[generalee7]

Is that female piece of the track bar splined as well? I know for that type of setup, you need the track bar to slip and twist to allow the axle to flex. Maybe it twists through that single johnny joint at the top? :confused:

[Chris Geiger]

Is that female piece of the track bar splined as well? I know for that type of setup, you need the track bar to slip and twist to allow the axle to flex. Maybe it twists through that single johnny joint at the top? :confused:

Yes it is splined. The twist is accommodated by the Johnny Joint. The two joints at the axle end allow for side to side motion as well.

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

Yes it is splined. The twist is accommodated by the Johnny Joint. The two joints at the axle end allow for side to side motion as well.


Why spline it?

[Roksamy]

Why spline it?

Most of the anti wrap bar designs I've seen incorperate a shackle at the top end for the bar to pivot & have fore and aft movement. The splined section of Chris's design takes the place of the shackle. Great idea , Chris!

[Chris Geiger]

Why spline it?

We had the spline material handy and it has a great fit to it. There is no slop or looseness with the splined material.

[Chris Geiger]

Most of the anti wrap bar designs I've seen incorperate a shackle at the top end for the bar to pivot & have fore and aft movement. The splined section of Chris's design takes the place of the shackle. Great idea , Chris!

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/bar4.jpg

We can get really good for and aft movement from a 12" slip spline without much loss of ground clearance. Notice how tucked up we were able to make it.

[tanman2003]

it looked like you needed a traction bar pretty bad, i saw one of the TGTV episodes, and the Ftoy was having alot of axle wrap, i noticed that you removed the spring clamp bolts, and maybe removed a leaf or two. the leafs were spapping eachother. this should be a big help, i look forward to seeing you guys test it out in the next episode.

[Chris Geiger]

it looked like you needed a traction bar pretty bad, i saw one of the TGTV episodes, and the Ftoy was having alot of axle wrap, i noticed that you removed the spring clamp bolts, and maybe removed a leaf or two. the leafs were spapping eachother. this should be a big help, i look forward to seeing you guys test it out in the next episode.

I have done some front wheel stands and the axle wrap is totally gone. Now when you drop the clutch it just moves! It hooks up like my linked truck.

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

Most of the anti wrap bar designs I've seen incorperate a shackle at the top end for the bar to pivot & have fore and aft movement. The splined section of Chris's design takes the place of the shackle. Great idea , Chris!

I didn't ask why the slip... why the spline? I understand completely why you need the slip, We used the same design on Todd's car two years ago (I think it's still there now).

What I don't understand is the spline. It adds nothing and most likely will cause binding. One joint will not give you enough twist and the axle end provides no twist either.

[Chris Geiger]

We used the spline material for two reasons. We had it handy and it has a great fit with no play.

We checked the suspension before and after with a forklift. We were able to lift a rear tire 43" without lifting any of the other tires before the link. After installing the link we can lift one rear tire 40". So we lost 3" of travel. On the forklift the front Johnny Joint is at it's max angle.

We are considering making another one to see if any of that loss can be recovered using two sections of tubing that slide on each other.

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

We used the spline material for two reasons. We had it handy and it has a great fit with no play.

We checked the suspension before and after with a forklift. We were able to lift a rear tire 43" without lifting any of the other tires before the link. After installing the link we can lift one rear tire 40". So we lost 3" of travel. On the forklift the front Johnny Joint is at it's max angle.

We are considering making another one to see if any of that loss can be recovered using two sections of tubing that slide on each other.

Don't get me wrong, I think what your doing is cool. I would think you could cut cost and increase performance with just a tubing interface.

d

[generalee7]

I didn't ask why the slip... why the spline? I understand completely why you need the slip, We used the same design on Todd's car two years ago (I think it's still there now).

What I don't understand is the spline. It adds nothing and most likely will cause binding. One joint will not give you enough twist and the axle end provides no twist either.

My thoughts exactly... :D

[desertoy]

Looks good. If you decide to use a tube inside of a tube make it beefy. Todd's is 1.125 cold roll and we bent it.

[Wilson]

Use a threaded joint at the top and it will twist all you want. I think the JJ's fit inside of the 2" tube as well. Looks like a good idea to me, now if only I can manage to fit one under my cruiser.

[Chris Geiger]

I was thinking of using the same link tubing we are using on our other projects. It's 2" 1/4" wall DOM. In side of that I would use 1.5" DOM out the front and in to the joint.

[desertoy]

This is why we went to the shackle design on the ones we build now. It seems to work better all around.

[Pook]

yep shackle design works awesome. I also use rubber oem style bushing instead of urethane at the diff and frame mount and then just a single jonny joint on the traction bar end.

[Chris Geiger]

For the 2007 year, Team Trail-Gear will be adding bumping up the horsepower on #029 in a big way with a new, DOA Racing Engines Motor. As you may recall our last motor had a very ruff year, getting a temporary head replacement mid season after this end over end roll over at We-Rock in Globe.

http://www.trail-gear.com/events/2006werock-globe/mattroll.gif

The new motor is being built now, and is being designed to take advantage of the high octane rating of Propane fuel.

Here is a photo of the head after Tim Jenkins performed a complete port and polish...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/20r.jpg

[Chris Geiger]

After loosing a couple of inches of articulation with the last anti-wrap bar, we made a new one without using drive shaft spline material. This one uses 2" X .25" wall material for the outer tube and 1.5" X .25 wall for the inner tube. This allows the tubes to slide in and out of each other. This design does not limit travel at all and we now get 45" under one rear tire without lifting the other tires. The rear axle has zero axle wrap with this bar.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/wrap4.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/wrap5.jpg

[Booger Weldz]

price check please??? ive got a nearly new botom end that needs some good head...

[Tim@DOA]

price check please??? ive got a nearly new botom end that needs some good head...


This particular 20r head package for either the early, or late block is 1150.00.
245 int. CFM @ .500 / 210 exh. CFM @ .500 Flowed at 16" water, on a 3.661 bore. NOTE: Inches of water during test is a HUGE factor in the final advertised CFM. Testing @ 23" + is going to yield a much higher result. Superflow 600 benches starting pressure I believe is 23", the 100 SF allows pressures as low as 1" water. This is important to know, because a better flowing head shows less advertised CFM under a lesser inches of water test. Valves are Ferrea Race series, springs are CS dual, keepers and locks are moly, guides are bronze, porting is D.O.A., surface RA is 50, which allows both a MLS, or composite gasket to be used. Order away!!!!!

[Booger Weldz]

This particular 20r head package for either the early, or late block is 1150.00.
245 int. CFM @ .500 / 210 exh. CFM @ .500 Flowed at 16" water, on a 3.661 bore. NOTE: Inches of water during test is a HUGE factor in the final advertised CFM. Testing @ 23" + is going to yield a much higher result. Superflow 600 benches starting pressure I believe is 23", the 100 SF allows pressures as low as 1" water. This is important to know, because a better flowing head shows less advertised CFM under a lesser inches of water test. Valves are Ferrea Race series, springs are CS dual, keepers and locks are moly, guides are bronze, porting is D.O.A., surface RA is 50, which allows both a MLS, or composite gasket to be used. Order away!!!!!

going on a 'factory' 1991 22re shortblock, will it pass smog with all the CA emisions stuff(going in a 1986 4runner with a K&n open element, 1991 TB assembly and a doug thorley header)...??

[Tim@DOA]

going on a 'factory' 1991 22re shortblock, will it pass smog with all the CA emisions stuff(going in a 1986 4runner with a K&n open element, 1991 TB assembly and a doug thorley header)...??

You'd be looking for our re head upgrade. Same price, bigger SI valves, C270 cam. Definitely smog legal, same stuff as on the 150hp. RA finish allows either composite, or MLS gasket. Thorley header was a good choice too.

[Chris Geiger]

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/001.jpg

Today our new DOA Racing Engines motor arrived. This motor features 20r head with oversized valves, custom cam shaft, ported & polished intake and exhaust. The block is board out .060, balanced and blueprinted. We will be installing this very soon!

[Izeloz]

Please get that FRAM piece of junk off there. Hehe....otherwise looks good.

[a2b]

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/001.jpg

Today our new DOA Racing Engines motor arrived. This motor features 20r head with oversized valves, custom cam shaft, ported & polished intake and exhaust. The block is board out .060, balanced and blueprinted. We will be installing this very soon!

wow...i am sooo envious:smokin:

[tanman2003]

Please get that FRAM piece of junk off there. Hehe....otherwise looks good.

im sure DOA thinks its a piece of junk, thats why they use it...:flipoff2:
i think they know what they are doing. plus it looks larger than a stock toyota filter.

[Im4yotas]

What block are you using with that motor? Looks nice:cool2:

[Izeloz]

I won't turn this into a big thing, but I am currently working as a grease monkey (oil change guy) and FRAM filters have poor anti-drain back valves. Luckily the 22R series engines never had much of an oiling problem. I'd recommend Napa Gold, though. Just my .02 cents.

[steveh]

The Larger filter is a Ford PH8A.

As long as you do regular Oil changes, Frams are fine (Here I am saying this and I either use Toyota or Napas ........ :shaking: :rolleyes: )

[SeaBass44]

The Larger filter is a Ford PH8A.

As long as you do regular Oil changes, Frams are fine (Here I am saying this and I either use Toyota or Napas ........ :shaking: :rolleyes: )


I have used fram for 26 years, yet to see an engine failure related to a fram filter.hell when in bypass mode the filter isn't even used:flipoff2:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

wow...i am sooo envious:smokin:

I love it long time!

[DHONDAGOD]

Cut open a Fram filter and look how its made, then cut open a Toyota filter and compare.... Then make a decision....



Nice motor BTW....:smokin:


Chris:cool2:

[Roksamy]

The Larger filter is a Ford PH8A.

As long as you do regular Oil changes, Frams are fine (Here I am saying this and I either use Toyota or Napas ........ :shaking: :rolleyes: )

I wish you guys wouldn't call it a ford filter (It's a Landcruiser application also):D

Wix #51515
Napa Gold # 1515

[punisher85]

hey matt
your formula toy #29 what kind of electric fan you ues on radiator?

thanks bud

[Chris Geiger]

hey matt
your formula toy #29 what kind of electric fan you ues on radiator?

thanks bud

It is a Flex-A-Lite fan. It's been doing a good job.

[punisher85]

It is a Flex-A-Lite fan. It's been doing a good job.


great
thank chris

[Chris Geiger]

After pulling the engine, trans, tcase etc, we applied a new coat of paint on the chassis...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/003.jpg

The DOA motor dropped right in to place. After cranking for about 1 minute the oil pressure came up. Then we popped in the plugs and the motor fired right up. We let it idle for about 10 minutes while we checked everything for leaks. After that we pulled the rig out and took the rig out for a test ride around the shop. We saw a huge improvement in power over the old worn out motor. This new motor really changes the way the truck accelerates and the torque available at low RPM's.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/002.jpg

[offroad_joe]

So I won't need a gas mask to ride behind that thing anymore?:flipoff2:

[Chris Geiger]

It’s BYOIR now.

Bring Your Own Insect Repellent

So I won't need a gas mask to ride behind that thing anymore?:flipoff2:

[offroad_joe]

It’s BYOIR now.

Bring Your Own Insect Repellent


I see, he had a insect repellent smoke machine for a motor.
I think I'll stick to OFF-SPRAY.

[Chris Geiger]

Looks like the smoke problem has returned. This time it is not coming out of the exhaust pipe this time!

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/tirespin.jpg

Video Clip:

http://www.trail-gear.com/videos/tirespin.wmv

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

The new motor TOTALLY GETS IT! Tim from DOA built a nice one. This motor changes everything for me.

Matt

[TBItoy]

whats up with those leafs??

[Im4yotas]

Short traction bar, lotsa anti squat. Not axle wrap, just wheel hop.

[Tim@DOA]

Looks like the smoke problem has returned. This time it is not coming out of the exhaust pipe this time!

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/tirespin.jpg

Video Clip:

http://www.trail-gear.com/videos/tirespin.wmv I think the really impressive thing about the pic is this was starting in fifth gear, parking brake locked tight, no drive shaft, and only one plug wire connected!! Good to see you're following proper break-in procedures Matt ;-) ENJOY!!

[zorack15]

Looks like the smoke problem has returned. This time it is not coming out of the exhaust pipe this time!

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/tirespin.jpg

Video Clip:

http://www.trail-gear.com/videos/tirespin.wmv

Man those bfg krawlers got freakin sticky during that burn out. How dunbar like the smell of his office after that :laughing:.

[Chris Geiger]

The whole shop was full of smoke for about two hours after that even with all the doors open.

[Chris Geiger]

We have been hard at work on Ftoy #029, getting it ready for the 2007 competition season. The new DOA motor is really working well. We built up a new dual case assembly, this time with 23 spline gears and a Bobby Long Cromo output shaft. We installed a new set of 37" BFG Krawlers on Creeper-Locks wheels. New paint and graphics give it a nice touch.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/004.jpg

We pickup up a new trailer to better hold all the spare parts and tools we will be bringing this year. It is a 24' long Pace Race trailer...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/009.jpg

The old motor has been moved to second string and will serve as a backup....
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/005.jpg

Last year we brought a set of axle shafts with us in the back of the truck. This year we are bringing complete front and rear assembled axles ready to bolt in. The axles, spare tcase and drive shafts all bolt up to this rack....
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/006.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/007.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/008.jpg

[steveh]

Looks like the smoke problem has returned. This time it is not coming out of the exhaust pipe this time!

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/tirespin.jpg

Video Clip:

http://www.trail-gear.com/videos/tirespin.wmv

Damn, that cloud hit PV as well!!! That's fully gettin' it!!!!!

[Chris Geiger]

Check out this high clearance housing we are putting under the front of Matt's Ftoy this week. The tubes have been offset up for additional clearance. Most of the gusseting has been moved to the top of the axle to prevent anything from hanging up on the under side.
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/013.jpg

This is a photo of the 83 style axle behind the new axle up front. You can see the difference in clearance.
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/010.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/011.jpg

Here is a Table that shows the clearance under the axle...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/014.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/012.jpg

[Mr_DIY]

that's a badass housing! nice ftoy

[locktup]

Looks a little different from when I last saw it. When does it get bolted up.

Jason

[Chris Geiger]

Looks a little different from when I last saw it. When does it get bolted up.

Jason

Yes, we made a few adjustments. I hope your not offended by the slice we cut out of it. We now have room for four u-bolts!

The axle is now under the Ftoy. Tomorrow we slide in the Birfields. Flogging is scheduled to begin this Saturday at the Trail-Gear ranch.

[locktup]

No big deal you had to make it work some how. Are you going to put the steering bump stop thingys on?

[FYRDUDE]

Would that axle fall under comp. legal? Just wondering.

[Chris Geiger]

Would that axle fall under comp. legal? Just wondering.

Yes, as long as it uses a Toyota 8" third and Birfields.

[Chris Geiger]

We ran in to some problems with the steering today and had to pull the axle out again.

The raised tubes caused a conflict between the leaf springs and the tie rod. We will need make new perches that sink down in to the housing tubes.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/2007-1543.jpg

[stomper4x4]

lol all those engineers you guys have and your just figuring that out now...:flipoff2:

[Brian Ellinger]

Here is a Table that shows the clearance under the axle...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/014.jpg



huh 3/4" ...interesting.

Where'd the 1.5" clearance gain go, that you "checked many times"

[Brian Ellinger]

lol all those engineers you guys have and your just figuring that out now...:flipoff2:

R&D my friend. You have to do RESEARCH.

[Chris Geiger]

These numbers are for the front axle not the rear.

You can't improve things with out trying new stuff. Sometimes when working with new ideas you run in to little bumps along the way. Nothing a little more fab work won't fix.

[tj40ounce]

huh 3/4" ...interesting.

Where'd the 1.5" clearance gain go, that you "checked many times"

Wow, someone is butthurt... :laughing:

[Brian Ellinger]

Wow, someone is butthurt... :laughing:

I get that way when lied to, and when customers are being lied to I get very annoyed.

[stomper4x4]

LoL i just find it funny that you guys have all these engineers who can design suspension, 6 stud knuckles, wheels, and what not but you failed to realize that if you raise the centerline of the axle tubes and leave the knuckles in the original location that there is going to be clearence problems...Hell common sence would tell you that.....

[yotacowboy]

here we go again!

it's the drama llama's baby's mama...

[Chris Geiger]

A new set of spring perches have been installed. These new perches are a low profile design and rest directly on the top of the axle. The heads of the spring pins have been ground down so they are only as thick as the perch material.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/015.jpg

Now we have the needed clearance for the steering rods...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/016.jpg

The 2 stock 7mm hub pins were removed by welding a U bolt to them and twisting...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/017.jpg

The bearing hubs are being drilled out to accommodate 6 larger, 8mm dowel pins and our new heavy duty drive flanges will be installed. These new drive flanges are forged from 8620 tool steel and have additional material added around the spline section to prevent stripouts.
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/018.jpg

[MiniSimp]

The raised tubes caused a conflict between the leaf springs and the tie rod. http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/2007-1543.jpgNo shit....that's wierd!? :shaking:

Don't you have Pro-Engineer or solid works? :rolleyes:

[tj40ounce]

No shit....that's wierd!? :shaking:

Don't you have Pro-Engineer or solid works? :rolleyes:


It's not nearly as cool as your ghetto fab pivot blocks.. :shaking: :flipoff2:

[SeaBass44]

It's not nearly as cool as your ghetto fab pivot blocks.. :shaking: :flipoff2:


got a link to the ghetto blocks:laughing:

[tj40ounce]

got a link to the ghetto blocks:laughing:

only because you asked...

http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=8233.0;id=25689;im age
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=8233.0;id=27018;im age

The aftermath...
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=8233.0;attach=6703 1;image
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=8233.0;attach=6675 1;image

Gee, how did anyone ever develop/create without pro-engineer or Solid Works :shaking:

[MiniSimp]

What I can with what I've got.

If I was a company I would probably care.

Gee, how did anyone ever develop/create without pro-engineer or Solid Works :shaking:My point was, they have one of those programs, they have the resources, they should have the housing in one of those programs already, why not test it in there?

[tj40ounce]

What I can with what I've got.

If I was a company I would probably care.

It's not like they ran it like it was and broke down on the trail and held a bunch of people up or something. :shaking:

Why do you even care? You are anti- TG, but you are reading their threads anyway? :laughing:

[MiniSimp]

Just asking a simple question that I probably won't get an answer to. :flipoff2:

I'll be the first one to tell you that my fab skills suck, I'm not saying I could have done it better.

[TheBandit]

Would that axle fall under comp. legal? Just wondering.

According to the website, the custom housing is legal. But it looks like it may have six stud knuckles, which I don't think are comp legal. Here are the rules pertaining to the front axle from http://formulatoy.org/php/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8&Itemid=28

Front Axle
• Front axle must be a front axle from 1979 - 1985 Toyota Pickup or 4Runner
• Aftermarket/custom housings are allowed
• Aftermarket birfields allowed
• Aftermarket inner axles allowed
• Must use Toyota 8" third members (FJ80, V6 or 4cyl)
• Any factory or aftermarket ring & pinion gear sets
• Must use oem Toyota Pickup/4Runner knuckles
• Differential shaving allowed
• Trussing and diff armored allowed
• Birfield eliminator kits not allowed, must use Birfields.

Raising the axle tubes is a cool idea. But the problem you ran into with tie rod clearance could be a real problem when running thicker spring packs, even with the low profile perches. *EDIT* I saw locktup posted the suggestion to recess the perches into the tubes. That may be the ticket to clearing thicker packs.

[CDunbar]

Just asking a simple question that I probably won't get an answer to. :flipoff2:
.....

The front axle housing was not designed in any form of CAD. We had a friend of the company build one for us as a prototype so we can use it for reference and see what one would look like with offset tubes and clearanced bottom. We can now take the general idea and create a solid model with SolidWorks and get a production peace that looks sweet!

We do not always use CAD right off the bat when trying out new ideas. Sometimes it is beneficial to wing it and see what you can come up with. CAD is usefull most of the time but I would think everyone knows the real world MAY conflict with CAD.

[MiniSimp]

Thanks for answering Chris.

[Chris Geiger]

This year, during Ftoy competitions, we only run 4 Studs and we weld the steering arms on to the knuckle to prevent any possible problems. This has been approved by the Ftoy BOD.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/019.jpg

[TheBandit]

Cool.

I just noticed it looks like your TRE is welded to the tie rod. Any particular reason for this? Was it a repair?

[Chris Geiger]

Cool.

I just noticed it looks like your TRE is welded to the tie rod. Any particular reason for this? Was it a repair?

We weld both tie rod ends to the rods to prevent the hydro ram from rotating in position. Each rod end is turned opposite to each other. Then the nuts and ends are tacked in place. With this done, the ram stays level and does not hit the flip plate on the left side of the truck.

http://www.trail-gear.com/images/hydro-assist-rotate-600.jpg

[a2b]

chris, put the fill plug on both of your housings on top of the diff, so you can check for ring breakeage without pulling the third.:)

[Chris Geiger]

That's a good idea Hobie.:cool2:

[mtbrjon]

A new set of spring perches have been installed. These new perches are a low profile design and rest directly on the top of the axle. The heads of the spring pins have been ground down so they are only as thick as the perch material.

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/015.jpg

Now we have the needed clearance for the steering rods...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/016.jpg

The 2 stock 7mm hub pins were removed by welding a U bolt to them and twisting...
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/017.jpg

The bearing hubs are being drilled out to accommodate 6 larger, 8mm dowel pins and our new heavy duty drive flanges will be installed. These new drive flanges are forged from 8620 tool steel and have additional material added around the spline section to prevent stripouts.
http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/018.jpg



Looks like it took 1" or so from your ride height as well.

[Chris Geiger]

The offset front and rear axles are working great on the Ftoy. We are moving forward on producing a production version of these offset axles. Here are the first samples of the axle ends...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/axle-end.jpg

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

The offset front and rear axles are working great on the Ftoy. We are moving forward on producing a production version of these offset axles. Here are the first samples of the axle ends...




So what's your official gain?

[Chris Geiger]

The center line of the axle is moved up 3/8". This version is designed for use with .250 tubing and will provide 3/8" of additional clearance under the axle tubes.

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

The center line of the axle is moved up 3/8". This version is designed for use with .250 tubing and will provide 3/8" of additional clearance under the axle tubes.

What happened to the full inch of clearance you were originally claiming? Looks like you came up 61% short of your promised gains.

[Chris Geiger]

We will be using the same idea but to a lesser degree. This design will not add any cost to building the axles, will accommodate any after market inner axle and will be much stronger.

Here is a drawing showing the front knuckle end...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/knuckle-end.jpg

[JeepRecoveryTeam]

Trail-Gear is happy to announce we are in the development phase of an innovative a new design for Toyota axle housings. This new process involves offsetting the tubing one inch upward. This adjustment in the tubing results in an additional 1" ground clearance under the axle.


I got that off of your board because you deleted all the threads off of PBB



I did not promised that we would bring the exact axle we are using on the Ftoy to market.


Promise/advertise/tout/claim.... it's all the same. You came out with a vapor ware axle housing that 'claimed' gains that were physically impossible. You stepped on other vendors to make it seem like your 'new' housing was better. When you got called on the claims you tryed to turn it around on them and make it seem like they were wrong. All anyone asked was for you to sell your product on your own merit and with truth in your advertising.

I'll be the first to admit your product is completely 'out of the box' and original. Good on you for that. But why can't you just step and say, "Hey, we were incorrect with our original calculations... here's the best that can be done... and we're the only ones doing it"

[Chris Geiger]

There were no "calculations" done on the first axle. It was a hand made protoytype. The prototype came in and we installed it. I measured a 1" difference between the stock and modified housings. Don't believe me, then measure it for yourself. We bring it to each competition.

I really don't know what was done or how that axle was put together, I was not there when Jason made the housing. What I do know is that our engineer says that he believes that this is as far as we can go on a production unit without creating expensive custom parts/tools, sacrificing housing strength and allowing internal space for current aftermarket inner axles.

As you may understand, competition often pushes the technology. You can't always take parts directly off of a dragster and bolt it on to your daily driver but developments on the track often lead to improvements in production cars.

These new axle housings will offer increased clearance over other axles currently on the market. They will be made with all new materials, no cut-up housings will be used. They will be far stronger then stock and they will be offered at a great price.

[Chris Geiger]

Today Andrew installed our first production rear axle housing in the Ftoy...

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/021.jpg

http://www.trail-gear.com/bbs/ftoy/022.jpg

[yotawatts]

so what happens when you want to change the pinion angle on these high clearance housings?.. seems that if you do you will loose the extra clearance and defeat the purpose of this housing.

[Chris Geiger]

You will get a minimum of 3/4" extra clearance over stock in the worst case.

[yotawatts]

You will get a minimum of 3/4" extra clearance over stock in the worst case.

I thought that the clearance gain was reduced to 3/8" at best..is it back to an inch now... mabe i'm missing somthing.

[Chris Geiger]

I thought that the clearance gain was reduced to 3/8" at best..is it back to an inch now... mabe i'm missing somthing.

3/8" under the tubes, 3/4" (minimum) under the 3rd member.

[yotawatts]

3/8" under the tubes, 3/4" (minimum) under the 3rd member.

oh ok.. i like the design btw.. defanitly different

[LIKES2CRAWL]

How thick are the tubes? I must have missed that part, it looks good though.

[Chris Geiger]

> Tubes <

The first phototype was .200, this production sample is .250

[MT4Runner]

What did the TG FToy do this season?

Matt, any chance you could (someday) re-link all of your build photos? This rig ended up really clean--I'd love to see how it started!!

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

The photos were lost. I have some that I can repost. The TG f-toy did not compete this season.

[ftoy507]

The photos were lost. I have some that I can repost. The TG f-toy did not compete this season.

What about next season??????

[MT4Runner]

The TG f-toy did not compete this season.

Oh, I know that!!! It's probably the shiniest rig I've seen--in 07 it was usually in every issue of CRAWL mag WE-Rock west coverage! :laughing: It was notably absent this year.

Did you guys get it on the trail at all this season?
Miss it at all after driving your Unlimited buggy?



Are you going to be rusty in the ProRock comp against John James? :stirthepot:

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

Oh, I know that!!! It's probably the shiniest rig I've seen--in 07 it was usually in every issue of CRAWL mag WE-Rock west coverage! :laughing: It was notably absent this year.

Did you guys get it on the trail at all this season?
Miss it at all after driving your Unlimited buggy?



Are you going to be rusty in the ProRock comp against John James? :stirthepot:


I still trail ride in the f-toy all the time, so I am still getting pretty good seat time. I do love the HP and capabilities of the Unlimited rig though. You can bet on seeing the F-toy all next season......I wonder who will be driving it????

Matt

[MT4Runner]

You can bet on seeing the F-toy all next season......I wonder who will be driving it????

Is that a teaser or a job posting?! :laughing: