Formula Toy #23

[FYRDUDE]

Here's another Formula build. I know your probably tired of these things by now. But what the heck, here you go. First, we have to remember the good 'ol days. Enjoy.

[FYRDUDE]

Here's another.

[FYRDUDE]

O.K. Gag! That's enough. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Here's why the build has started. Don't ask. All I have to say is it involved a Corona or two, maybe more. Unfortunately I wasn't driving, I was riding shotgun.

[FYRDUDE]

The aftermath.

[FYRDUDE]

Now it's time to tear it up.

[Hammer Hog]

:eek:
Looks like a Garage Sale :eek:



:laughing:

[FYRDUDE]

Get some!!! :D

[FYRDUDE]

More lame pics.

[FYRDUDE]

Another.

[FYRDUDE]

This started to get fun.

[FYRDUDE]

Heap!

[FYRDUDE]

What's to come.

[FYRDUDE]

So purdy.

[FYRDUDE]

Frame is stripped and all the holes are welded shut. I'll save you the agony of seeing all those pics.

[FYRDUDE]

The hampster is out of the cage. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Relocated the front hanger up into the frame. We'll see how well this works.

[FYRDUDE]

Stripped down the rear axle.

[FYRDUDE]

AP's rear buggy's. Took a chance on these. Not too much feedback on these yet. I guess we'll find out.

[FYRDUDE]

Hangers for the rear inboarded springs.

[FYRDUDE]

Rear hanger made. Man I love go-fast holes. The plan is to incorporate just as many go-fast holes as possible. You should see my tooth brush.

[FYRDUDE]

With the Johnny Joints. These things may not stay. This could just be temporary. I still haven't decided. It may end up on top of the hanger. Stay tuned.

[FYRDUDE]

Hanger mocked in place. I saw on the Hendrix site that the chasis is 152" long. Not that I didn't believe Mike but I measured the chasis with a laser and sure enough 152" exactly. So that's what I cut it down to. Hope this works. As you know tack weld everything.

[FYRDUDE]

I'll post up more tomorrow. Can't give it all away right now.

[OnTheSpot]

cool cool :smokin:

[penguinofdoom]

saawweet.. glad to see more joining the fray :D

[nightcrawler]

FYRDUDE - Check your PM and keep posting pics. :D

[blacktoy]

looking good :smokin: , keep us updated...

[FYRDUDE]

Today is a new day and it looks like I might get some more work done today. Finish rebuilding the front axle. New bearings and such. Been playing around with some axle truss ideas. We'll see what happens.
Also got the engine stripped down to the bare essentials. This baby is going to be a clean air vehicle. That's right, LPG. Might get that ordered today as well. Everything I build always has to be a little different.

[FYRDUDE]

O.K. Here's a couple more. Enjoy. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Some of these pics are blurry, I don't know what happened with the digi.
Check out my crazy contraptiont o get the suspension mounts to sit how I want and get the wheel base kind of lined up. Right now the wheel base is sitting at about 104"

[FYRDUDE]

Before plating the rear section.

[FYRDUDE]

Don't ask why. It just seemed like a good thing to do at the time. May be removed. Trying to keep this thing lite as possible.

[FYRDUDE]

Shot of rear. The shackles are just mocks. Will get cut down eventually. I decided to cut the rear corners a little in hopes that it won't be as bad when I drag the ass end.

[FYRDUDE]

Trying to keep everything from become a rock anchor. Here's the leading edge of the rear spring. May be changed. This thing is pretty much glued together at this point.

[FYRDUDE]

Another pic from the rear. I also may end up cutting down the point of attachment for the Johnny Joints. A little too long for my taste.

[FYRDUDE]

Rear spring perches fabbed. Wasn't sure of the AP design so I dreamed this thing up. Not completely done. Still will be gussetted. I hope it works. Anyone made something like this? How'd it work?

[FYRDUDE]

The perch has three holes, each and an inch apart. Help me with that wheel base.

[FYRDUDE]

Top portion. The shocks will be mounted to the tops of these. So they are still missing those brackets that will also act as gussets on an opposite plane.

[FYRDUDE]

Side view. Wish I had an Iron Worker like some of you big dollar guys. Have to resort to caveman stuff here in my garage.

[FYRDUDE]

Mounted on the spring. Hope it works. :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

On its home for a short while. Have to get the hampster back in with tranny and t-case to figure out drive line angles. :rolleyes:

[FYRDUDE]

Engine mounts tacked back 8". This is still a questionable location for me. May still be moved forward a bit. Stay tuned. More to come. :D

[psychotoy]

Awesome build man, keep the pics coming, I would love to build a f-toy, but snow wheelin' would be miserable :D

[FYRDUDE]

Yeah, I already thought about that. It's all about the snowboarding clothes.
I might even get one of those Mojave heaters from Summit.

[Renaud33]

Here's another Formula build. I know your probably tired of these things by now.
I am not getting tired of seeing build ups. I learn a something new from reading about build ups. Maybe its because I am still a newbie. :grinpimp:

Looking good, keep posting up progress pics.

[nwrunner86]

i never get tired of build ups. yours is awsome it looks good. keep the pics coming

[Lazybum]

Great looking build so far. Are you planning on competing when it's done?

[Arya Ebrahimi]

I really like the way you did those rear perches. Not sure about the bolts vs. u-bolts thing, but the way it wraps around the tube is great. I ripped the perches off the 8" under my old cherokee twice. Not sure why, welds were solid, kept ripping the housing. I will definately be doing something similar when the time comes for new perches on the current project.

Ary

[FYRDUDE]

The answer is Yes. I do plan on hitting the competitions. But we shall see how that goes. Thanks for the input.

[FYRDUDE]

Filled the steering stops, then boxed them in. Shouldn't move now. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Another angle of the stops. :rolleyes:

[FYRDUDE]

Old crappy Hydro. ram mount. Another victim of the torch. This thing was built the night before a run in haste.

[FYRDUDE]

I had an idea :idea: for an axle truss so I'll give it a try. Instead of the square type, I decided to go for the single fin. To give the housing a little extra beef I took a piece of 1/8" and heated it up and formed it around the housing with a hammer. Talk about a lot of work. I tacked it in place as I went otherwise it moved all over. Next I used a piece of cardboard to form the 3/16 fin. Instead of periodically welding it around the perimeter I opted to burn the whole thing in. Stay tuned for more go fast holes. :D

[FYRDUDE]

After torching and beating.

[FYRDUDE]

Another.

[FYRDUDE]

Here's the single fin. Not sure about this, but we'll give it a try.

[FYRDUDE]

Top view of the fin.

[FYRDUDE]

Engine stripped down, getting ready for propane. :D

[FYRDUDE]

I want to take a moment to thank :D MARLIN CRAWLER :D for sending out the U-bolt flip kit ASAP. I ordered it yesterday morning and had it this morning. Thank you for the fast and friendly service to the guys over there. I was going to make the same set up as the rear, but in an effort to save time I went this route. :D

[FYRDUDE]

My wife is the best :D :D :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: My Valentine's Day present. This will be put to good use. A guy can get very thirsty while fabbing. Now I have another reason to hang out in the garage. :D

[Hammer Hog]

My wife is the best :D :D :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: My Valentine's Day present. This will be put to good use. A guy can get very thirsty while fabbing. Now I have another reason to hang out in the garage. :D


Gotta be carefull with that thing...It's rumored this guy had gotton a little bit too thirsty while building his F-Toy :eek: :laughing:

[FYRDUDE]

I have to try to keep it to a minimum or it could look like that. :D

[Izeloz]

Ouch! Zing, a2b! Hehehe.

[FYRDUDE]

Poor fella :D :D

[FYRDUDE]

Anyone know were I can plug my vacuum advance into. This is an '84 22r.
Also, correct me if I am wrong but the computer of the 22r was only used for emissions. I may be smoking crack but I was almost certain it would run without this box.

[Heywood]

Anyone know were I can plug my vacuum advance into. This is an '84 22r.
Also, correct me if I am wrong but the computer of the 22r was only used for emissions. I may be smoking crack but I was almost certain it would run without this box.

Plug it into the thottle plate of the carb, You will be keeping the carb throttle plate with propane. You can really clean up that intake of all that crap. I think the only thing youll need on there is a water temp sender, and if your getting a new gauge it will come with a sender.

[Hammer Hog]

...correct me if I am wrong but the computer of the 22r was only used for emissions. I may be smoking crack but I was almost certain it would run without this box.


Yup, mine too had it and I took it out and it just has the MSD and runs well :D

BTW, your rig is looking really good :D Nice fab work too :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks for the info. guys. I'm taking the manifold off and going to the local shop and finding plugs for all of the holes. I'm also looking at converting the alternator to a GM 1-wire. I think the stock only puts out approx. 70 and the GM 1-wire puts out about 100. This will help with running winch, lights, and accessories.

[FYRDUDE]

I didn't know I needed the carb. throttle plate. Good to know. I guess I better go pull that out of the scrap pile. :rolleyes:

[vikingsven]

Looks good!
I hope you didn't bend your front housing when you welded the fin gusset! If you didn't, it should work good.

What did you use to cut the speed holes and JJ rear hanger mounts?

[a2b]

looks good :)

thanks steve for the plug. i apprecaite it :p

ya, be care ful welding onto the housing. it may warp, ask me how i know :eek:

[FYRDUDE]

This STATE OF THE ART milling machine. It set me back about $15. I even removed one of the handles for lighter weight. :D The only bummer about owning one of these POWERFUL machines is that it took me all day to cut that rear crossmember. :(

[FYRDUDE]

I haven't tried to put the shafts back in the axle. I'm keeping my fingers crossed and saying a prayer that it didn't warp. I welded it in segments. The entire time I was welding I could still touch the bottom of the axle with my bare hand.

[FYRDUDE]

Nothing new, but hopefully today and tomorrow I should be able to get it on its legs.

[FYRDUDE]

Bad News! After all the work on the front axle it ended up warping as a result of welding. :rolleyes: I was being so careful too. I'm a little upset that this set me back a few days. :mad3: Fortunately, I have spare axles. The one I decided to use is off an '83. This one doesn't have the gusset on the bottom and that should help as there is not as much hanging under the axle. Cleaned it up today and cut off all the brackets. I think I might just order an axle truss from Sky Manuf. and be done with it, save some time.

[a2b]

its alright dude. just live and learn. mine is a little tweaked too. i want a front axel like your new one. no trussing under the front is nice. my next axel housing will be like that. good luck man!!! you have alot of time left before april..no rush :)

[Air Ride]

The only why to weld a truss on an axle without it warping in to put the axle in a jig and stress it the opposite direction. When we truss toy rear housings we stress them a ¼” before welding the truss on.

[FYRDUDE]

Would it work if I welded the axle at both ends and the center to a table so that it can't move. Then weld the truss on. Also, do you think that the single fin of 3/16" would work as well as one of the pre fab ones from Marlin, Sky, or AP.

[FYRDUDE]

Here's the new old spare axle all cleaned up and ready for attempt #2. Hopefully I will get it right this time. Maybe this was a blessing in disguise. I have a friend coming over to help me get this one stressed or welded to a table to keep it from moving. If you can think of any other secrets, let me know. I still can't believe even the slightest heat can make these things warp so bad. :D

[Air Ride]

Stick a piece of all thread through the bearing hole and weld them to the table. Put some big washers on top and turn the nuts down until you have stressed it about a 3/16” to a ¼”. Then weld on the truss. Use a piece of 2x4x.120 rectangular tube for your truss. Much stronger than a single piece of plate that would end up weighing more than the rectangular tube.

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks Mike! :D That's a hell of a lot easier than what I had in mind. I have a scrap piece of 4x4 tubing, 1/4" thick to use as a "table". I even have a bunch of all thread. Ordered the solid truss from Marlin. Don't want to waste my time on making another truss. :D

[familybeast]

Shouldn't you be studing for you 5 call???? :shaking:

[CronusTRD]

Don't weld it all at once.

Do an inch or to at a time at different locations, walk away, do something else, then come back.

[SanDiegoCJ]

Here's why the build has started. Don't ask. All I have to say is it involved a Corona or two, maybe more. Unfortunately I wasn't driving, I was riding shotgun.


http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=173054&stc=1


How pretty. :flipoff2:

[familybeast]

Passed Phase 1.
Do an inch or to at a time at different locations, walk away, do something else, then come back.
Go study your protocols, let the smoke clear and get back to work with a clear head.
Less fumes and beer :shaking: More studying , we will see you next tour.
The Preceptors :smokin:

PS - Don't forget the flags, the book, Sunpro and the STUDYING :flipoff2:

[408_jigga]

FYI, thats a 79 or 80 axle, not an 83. ;)

[FYRDUDE]

A big THANK YOU TO THE PRECEPTORS!!! :bounce: :bounce2: :bounce: :D
Not working on the rig until this is all behind us. Sorry about the log book and the Sunpro, promise to get that done. :D Enjoy the 4.

[FYRDUDE]

408 Jigga,
Yeah, you are correct. I got it cornfused with another one. :D
And by the way. I have spent much time on the side of Hwy. 17 myself. :D

[a2b]

FYI, thats a 79 or 80 axle, not an 83. ;)

thats what i was thinking

[fullsped]

What up Jesse!!!
Man those first pics brings back some memories. Frank Rains, Rubicon, Niagara Rim, Hollister, clear creek and all the other trails I remeber your 4-runner on. Good times were had by all. Now to the new phase of that 4-runner. (Should add you have had that thing since high school. So after a roll you couldn't just let it go, you had to make it bigger and better, into a formual toy!)
Man, it is looking sweet! You should be on the rocks in no time and I can hardly wait. Been missing you on the club runs since it was rolled last June. I'll be by today hopefully or sometime this week to shoot the s&!T. You have made a ton of progress since I saw it last. Nice work!!!

Eli

[familybeast]

You should be on the rocks in no time

No you should be studying, studying, studying so you don't fail :D

Go back and read your protocols again. :p

The Preceptors :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

I've spent the day studying and plan too this entire week. Failure is not an option. No play until my work is complete. I'm calling it my "Full-Speed Five Call". Kinda catchy, huh. I promise to have a book in my hands this week and not a welder. :D I'll see you on the other side Brother Dirt. :D

[familybeast]

I'll see you on the other side Brother Dirt.
I will be there brother :D

[Roc Dog]

Nice work Jesse! Got your PM. I did sell the runner and bought a Razor buggy from Tony K. at Rockequipment. Dont really have any pics but looks like we will be wheeling soon enough. You going to have this done before the Jambo at the Hammers this year. Another month and a half? Keep in touch and good work!

[FYRDUDE]

I passed my test and now I can build again. :D :bounce: A big shout out to the PRECEPTORS :smokin: Thanks for your support, help, patience, and great teaching skills. I could not have done it without you guys. :D

So, I got sick of studying the other night and had to release a little energy. Started working on the new/old front axle. I fabbed (again) the steering stops and welded the Marlin axle truss that needed much grinding to fit and looks great. Thanks Marlin crew. :D Then I drilled go fast holes in the diff guard. Here are the pics.

[FYRDUDE]

Truss, diff guard and steering stops done. Welded the truss on by just welding a few inches at a time and letting it cool down.

[FYRDUDE]

Knuckles rebuilt with new bearings and a fresh coat of primer grey

[FYRDUDE]

Picked up this electric fan new for $40 from a friend, never used. Anyone have experience with these fans. It's a DERALE.

[FYRDUDE]

pic.

[FYRDUDE]

Had a question about the weld on perch plate that AP gives with it's lift springs. Welded it on my '84 axle years ago and now I'm building an older axle. Are the perch heights the same on an older axle? Or are they unequal like the '84? Hard too tell by eyeballing it. Was going to throw the lazer on it but thought asking might be easier. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Anyone know about that fan?

[SanDiegoCJ]

Anyone know about that fan?


I don't know about that specific fan, but I did see a neat trick on another
rig with an electric fan. Get yourself a sheet of 0.188" aluminum that's big
enough to cover the core area of the radiator. Cut a round hole just big
enough to match the rotating blade area of the fan. Then bolt the fan to
the aluminum sheet and mount the whole thing to the radiator as if it was
the stock fan shroud. Nice solid way to mount the fan and it also improves
your cooling. This is the basic idea, but with two fans. You can do the same
with your one fan.

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks SanDiegoCJ. I'm on! Like the shroud idea. :D

[fullsped]

Bump for you Jesse as this thread was buried.

E

[FYRDUDE]

:D Thank you. By the way, thank you very much for dropping off the axles. Haven't been home much recently but will start building again in a few days. Have many more pics to update to this post but just haven't gotten the time. I'll be calling you soon for some help.

[FYRDUDE]

Got the steering box mounted. Frame braced both sides.

[FYRDUDE]

Other side.

[FYRDUDE]

Arms are as parallel as I could get them.

[FYRDUDE]

Rear guard to match front.

[FYRDUDE]

Tranny ready to go in.

[FYRDUDE]

T-case ready to go in.

[FYRDUDE]

My next project 1972 FJ40. FOR FREE :eek: :eek: :eek:
Engine was just overhauled and carb. rebuilt. Runs perfect. Already collecting parts for this build. :D :D

[FYRDUDE]

Axles for LC build. Have to finish Formula first.

[FYRDUDE]

Got the engine, tranny, t-case all mounted in the frame today and started building cross member.

[FYRDUDE]

Mounted in the frame rails. :D

[FYRDUDE]

:d

[fullsped]

Looking real nice. Should be on trail in no time. Hey by the way I didn't drop off any axles. Don't know what your talking about. Perhaps the axles gods smiled upon you? Anyway let me know when you are ready to get the chassis on the frame or any other help you may need.

Eli

[yota83]

lookin good.. now hurry up and finnish so you can post more pics

[FYRDUDE]

Ran into a few problems after dropping engine, tranny, and T-case in.
My wheelbase is 104" and can stretch it a little more to 105". This is causing a problem with driveline angles. I want to keep it a flat bottom but I'm not sure if that will work. I may have to lower everything about 1.5". :(
Don't want to do this though. I guess I shouldn't have cut the frame down to the length of the chassis. That severely limited what I could do with the wheel base without having a crazy shackle angle. Try to work out the kinks tomorrow.

[LAWMAN]

If you look at doing a shackel set up like lisa did or the one we copied, F-toy 27, you can mount the spring back a little further.

[FYRDUDE]

I've thought about doing this setup. I even thought about mounting the joints to the back of the frame. This would probably be a bad idea. I may need to go the route you've taken.

[FYRDUDE]

Started the cross member cradle and am now waiting for some bushings from Poly Perfomance. This is version #2. The first one just wasn't what I wanted. Man, I wish I had a plasma cutter and a iron worker.

[FYRDUDE]

Got the spring hangers fabbed. Sure wish I had a plasma cutter and an iron worker. Would turn a day of work into an hour of work. Oh well, work with what you've got. :D

[FYRDUDE]

another :D

[FYRDUDE]

top :D

[FYRDUDE]

Cross member cradle started. This is the 2nd version. Waiting for bushings from Poly Performance to finish.

[FYRDUDE]

:d

[FYRDUDE]

another

[FYRDUDE]

Think this D line angle will work?

[FYRDUDE]

This is the top angle

[FYRDUDE]

Bottom angle

[FYRDUDE]

Overall view. I think it might work. What do you think?

[FYRDUDE]

Try not to make fun of that super drive line :smokin:

[Pook]

just check it with the suspension drooping and flexing to make sure cv doesn't bind.

[FYRDUDE]

Anyone know what's better: CV vs. regular joint?

[Pook]

regular joints easier to fix on the trail, but give bad vibrations when the pinion is tilted that far up. They also have more play before they bind.

[Hammer Hog]

Anyone know what's better: CV vs. regular joint?


Depends on what you want to do.

Regular joint for the rock, and CV for fast trail stuff :D

[BrettM]

i seem to recall Jesse (of High Angle) say that the Toy joints/shafts get more angle without the CV. I've found by personal experience on 3 different rigs that u-joint angles aren't nearly as picky as we give them credit for as long as you start with new joints. I, and 2 buddies, have 2 joint drivelines (no CV) with the pinion pointed right at the t-case. After putting in new u-joints none of us have vibes and all of us have put several thousand street miles on our trucks.

[FYRDUDE]

I've decided to cut off the CV and put back the regular joint. Never will see the street.

[Pook]

Let us know how it works out for you.

I ordered my formula toy last week :) can't wait to get going on it.

I must say its all the formula build ups that really helped convince me it was the way to go. :beer:

[ghettowheeler]

how did you drill all of those huge go fast holes.

[tj40ounce]

how did you drill all of those huge go fast holes.

Drill and holesaw? :confused:

[FYRDUDE]

This expensive, high tech, very powerful $15 machining tool. :D :D

[a2b]

how much time have you added to the build drilling holes everywhere :laughing:

and sweet. another sqaure shaft. my front is sqaure, by rear is round but it might as well be sqaure cuz i didnt it my self and its not balanced :laughing:

[FYRDUDE]

I've spent considerable time drilling all those holes and it's only going to get worse. Or better, however you see it. :D More well placed holes are in the works. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

The front and rear drive shafts are both square. I've bent more round drive shafts than I can shake a stick at.(The thick custom one's get expensive to replace, even when you build them yourself.) Once I went to square, I've never bent another. It's awsome to see the drive shaft spinning on a rock and seeing chunks of rock flying through the air while your standing on the skinny peddle :D

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

I measured mine (cage #29) this afternoon and at 30 degrees it is definitely not going to work. I will be calling the drive line pro's next week for a high angle design specific to my needs. Your progress looks good......keep the faith and keep building.

[FYRDUDE]

Here's some update pics. Do you think this x-member will be up to the task? I think I will add some gussets on the tubes.

[FYRDUDE]

Another view at the inside. The whole thing only weighs about 10 lbs.

[FYRDUDE]

Installed. Fits nice and snug.

[FYRDUDE]

Simple motor mounts. I am trying to build this along the K.I.S.S. method.
Keep It Simple Stupid.

[FYRDUDE]

I can't believe it's finally on its home. I think I busted a nut and produced a hemroid or two lifting this on my shoulders onto the frame by myself.

[FYRDUDE]

I went with 2" between the frame and the chassis. I still might lower it down. I think this might be more comfortable in the cab and will allow more room for bigger tires. What are you formula guys running between the frame and the chassis?

[FYRDUDE]

Front to back fits perfectly on the frame. 152" on each. :D Very short wheelbase.

[FYRDUDE]

Here's a look at the backside.

[FYRDUDE]

Might have to move the rear shackle back a little bit more. May have to be mounted on the back but then it leaves it vulnerable to rocks. I'm pretty sure that those Johnny Joints work best when they retain a round shape.

[FYRDUDE]

I'll be ordering seats from PRP this weak. Also get the Propane hooked up along with the steering and brakes. Hopefully this shouldn't take as long as the other stuff. Hope to have it running in less than a month. May have to call in reinforcements to help with this stuff. :D

[a2b]

mine is 1.5" off the top of the frame. lisa's has the middle of the bottom side chassis tube lined up with the top of the frame. others are sitting on the frame. and then others go up to 2" off the frame. personally, i just put my seats in, then put a helmet on, then put my fist above my helmet and thats where the chassis landed.

[Hammer Hog]

I went with 2" between the frame and the chassis. I still might lower it down. I think this might be more comfortable in the cab and will allow more room for bigger tires. What are you formula guys running between the frame and the chassis?

Here are a few pix of mine:
Front Drop Hoop:
http://www.sandtastictoys.com/FrameSitting19.JPG
http://www.sandtastictoys.com/FrameSitting16.JPG

Rear Frame:
http://www.sandtastictoys.com/FrameSitting18.JPG

Side Rail:
I have the center line of the lower side rail exactly level with the top of the truck frame.
http://www.sandtastictoys.com/BellyPan3.JPG

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

The Formula #29 cage ended up .75" above the frame. I used PRP mounting hardware and welded it right onto the frame, the seat height worked out great for me personally. I am using the PRP competition high back seats.

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks for the help. I think I'm going to order the seats and then mount them and go from there. Try not to get ahead of myself. Probably going to come down significantly. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Any comments on the cross member? Think it will be strong enough?

[LAWMAN]

If your motor mounts are like ours, and they appear to be. Your motor probably doesnt move on torque, therefore even the lightest crossmember will work, so the answer would be yes.

[Hammer Hog]

Any comments on the cross member? Think it will be strong enough?

Probably, but if not, I know of one that is.

I had Bud do me a custom crossmember/skid.
He modified one that he produces.
I don't remember what he charged, but I do know it was very reasonable :D

http://www.sandtastictoys.com/BudBuilt1---.JPG
Note: There is a gusset up in the upper portion that is out of view. It's very beefy and not too heavy at all.

[ACE-CAGE-#29]

What bushings did you use for the motor mounts....are those the same ones used for the leaf springs?

[FYRDUDE]

These are the same bushings used on suspension products. Poly Performance hooked me up with these. Good people over there at Poly Performance. They called me after the product was delivered to ensure that I received it with no problems. Hats off to them for great service. :D

[fullsped]

"I think I busted a nut and produced a hemroid or two lifting this on my shoulders onto the frame by myself."

What! I can not believe you did not call me to help out like you said you were going to. Here I was thinking you were slacking on the time too, but really your just into self torture.

[TNToy]

What bushings did you use for the motor mounts....are those the same ones used for the leaf springs?
http://offroaddesign.com/catalog/bushingassemblies.htm
http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/home.php?cat=25

[Speedy125]

Got the spring hangers fabbed. Sure wish I had a plasma cutter and an iron worker. Would turn a day of work into an hour of work. Oh well, work with what you've got. :D


What are you guys using to make those holes ?

Hole saw bits ??

[FYRDUDE]

Hole saw bits and that awsome drill press. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

What's up Fullsped? How ya been? I would have called you, however I decided to try to do that in the morning when nobody was around. I should have been patient and waited till later when you got home. I am collecting the rest of the parts I think I am going to need and having a work party at the house to button up as many things as we can. Probably next weekend, If I can round up all the parts in time. Hopefully we can get it started that weekend. :D

[FYRDUDE]

More progress pics. Chassis is mounted on the frame at 2" above. May come down but that's were I'm going to start.
One problem I ran into was that I cut the frame down to the same length as the chassis. When I mounted the rear springs and set the wheelbase to 105" I found that this was as far back as I could go. It looks as if the tire is going to come into contact with the chassis. I'll cycle it and see for sure. Also have to move the rear shackle hanger back past the rear of the frame to get the proper shackle angle.

[FYRDUDE]

Front pic. The distance between the frame and the chassis is kinda far, but that is what 2" above will do. Looks sweet on tires and wheels. :D :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Shackle angle still needs to be corrected.

[FYRDUDE]

Added a gusset to each side of the cross member. With a little notch to clear the drive line.

[FYRDUDE]

Other side. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Got the rear axle center under the frame and rotated the pinion close to were it will stay and tacked it in

[FYRDUDE]

Back shot. 14" between the frame and the chassis here. Check out the shackle angle :eek: Needs to be moved back behind the frame a little bit.

[FYRDUDE]

Here is were the problem may occur. When suspension cylces tire might hit chassis. :mad3: Should find out soon.

[FYRDUDE]

Go fast holes in shock mounts. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Free steering wheel from a guy who races cars at work. Got the quick steering wheel release from Longacre Racing. :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Freebie :eek: :smokin: Same guy gave me these Auto Meter gauges from Longacre Racing. Thanks Ken. :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Getting close. I can feel it. Hope to have a work party soon and get a lot of this thing done. Hopefully can have it running under it's own power in a week or two. :D

[fullsped]

Hey there Fyrdude. Looking good. Give me a call when your ready and I'll be there. I just got done installing some new stuff. An AGR supper pump, AGR rock crawler steering box, power steering lines, radiator hoses, mean green 200 amp alternator and a couple other little doodads. Getting the white beast ready for this summer. Won't be able to go to the hammers though. Stupid work. Have to go to Sin city for a conference that week :-( Anyway I hope all is well with you and yours and we should BBQ soon as the weather is sweeeet..........

E

[FYRDUDE]

PRP seats came and they are sweet. Very impressed.
I also purchased the PRP slider kit which had some issues and will tell you about that in the next picture.

[FYRDUDE]

The slider kit from PRP is about 2" tall and is for a Manx buggy. Everything is very beefy in design except for this small wire that connects the two slider releases. I mounted the seats to the sliders and then to the mounting brackets. The moment I pulled on the lever to release the seat this little wire let go immeadiately :nuke: :eek: I was a little upset but thought this was just dumb luck and the other would work out fine. So tried the other one with the same result. :mad3: So I set off to fix the problem in the easiest way I could find. Used a small turnbuckle and some small rings to make this. PRP might want to think about beefing this wire up. Other than that I was very impressed with the products. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Problem solved. Could have used aircraft cable and done the same thing but this was less of a hassle and can be adjusted to any of the mounting holes. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Floor, peddles and steering should be mounted in the next few days if everything goes as planned. :D

[fullsped]

What up J,
Stuff was looking really good on Friday when I stopped by. You need to get some fresh pics up here to show what you've been working on. In any case here's a bump for ya as this thread was buried.

E

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks for the bump E. I've been meaning to post up progress pics. but I spend what little time I have building. I'll get some up tomorrow. :)

I got the floor in, peddles hung, steering all tacked in and then found that I needed more clearance for my mellon in a helmet. I fit but wasn't happy with the clearance. A little tight for my taste. Maybe it's all those vehicle extrications with people missing parts of their heads that makes me nervous.

Tore the whole floor out and started again from scratch. Got most of it back in. It's about 1" lower and it makes a huge difference. Now I have to lower the peddles and steering. :shaking: It's all trial and error. Getting close though. Stay tuned and check back tomorrow evening. :D

[familybeast]

Hey bro, Looking good :smokin: Glad to see 'er coming together. Got anymore new pics?
Curious, Are ya going to use a longer front shackle or just reposition the existing one, or both?
See ya later, FB

[wv4runner]

Nice build man.

You should save all the holes your drill out and weigh them when your done to see how much weight your shaved. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Hey bro, Looking good :smokin: Glad to see 'er coming together. Got anymore new pics?
Curious, Are ya going to use a longer front shackle or just reposition the existing one, or both?
See ya later, FB
Hey there FB, hope your doing well. I have a bunch of new pics but have been so busy building and not enough time on the computer. I promise to get some up soon. Maybe tomorrow. The plan with the shackles is to use stock length and move the mount forward. Or the other thought is to go forward and high to achieve a longer shackle with more travel. And notch the frame so the spring can tuck up and into the frame. Right now I just want it to roll. Hopefully we can go wheeling soon. :smokin: Take care buddy.

[FYRDUDE]

Nice build man.

You should save all the holes your drill out and weigh them when your done to see how much weight your shaved. :D
I should have saved all the metal I drilled out. It probably would be fun to see how much I actually saved. The crazy part is that I still have more go fast holes to drill. :eek: Have to go get another hole saw. I smoked a few already. Looking for a circle cutting guide for the plasma cutter I borrowed to make the task a little easier. Thanks for the compliment. :)

[Pook]

I should have saved all the metal I drilled out. It probably would be fun to see how much I actually saved. The crazy part is that I still have more go fast holes to drill. :eek: Have to go get another hole saw. I smoked a few already. Looking for a circle cutting guide for the plasma cutter I borrowed to make the task a little easier. Thanks for the compliment. :)


use a piece you have cut out as a guide.

[FYRDUDE]

I actually thought about that. Great idea. :idea:

[Pook]

if you drill a small pilot hole and start the cut there you'll go through less tips. piercing the steel is the hardest on the tips. :beer:

[FYRDUDE]

Here are a few update pics. The floor is version #2 and so are the pedal positions and hangers. Trying to keep it simple. The drivers side seat was lowered to be flush with the frame. The slider setup takes up a lot of room.

[FYRDUDE]

Drivers side. Another view.

[blacktoy]

looking good :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Passenger side mounted 1" higher than the drivers side. The seat slider wouldn't clear the transfer case. I ended up cutting the center section of the seat slider apart to fit over the t-case. It fits nice and tight. It kinda bugs me that it's 1" higher but there is nothing I can do. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

Pedal assembly #2. Hope this one works. :rolleyes:

[FYRDUDE]

Lower portion of steering. Yawn.

[FYRDUDE]

Seats mounted. Kinda tight to the t-case. But what can you do. Glad I didn't order the 2" wider PRP seats.

[FYRDUDE]

That seat is just staring me in the face. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

I guess it's not so bad. :)

[FYRDUDE]

Tied the chassis to the frame and still have more to do. Need the tubing bender still.

[FYRDUDE]

Another view of the down tubes. Hopefully these won't get hung up too much. :)

[FYRDUDE]

Trying to figure out were I want the wheel to be. Setting it up for myself with the seat in the center position. Then moving the seat forward and having my wife sit in it and make sure it's not harpooning her in the chest.

[FYRDUDE]

More pics to come. Getting the battery mounted and the exhaust semi routed. Also going to have the brackets mounted for the tanks. Stay tuned. :smokin:

[camo]

looking good.

spend alot of time getting the ergonomics right. you will enjoy your rig alot more if it fits properly.

hint: use a stock truck as a basis to take measurments from. seat to steering wheel, seat to pedals. steering wheel to pedals...stuff like that

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks. It feels good to be this far along.
I did use your idea of the stock truck as a guide and it helped mucho.
The pedals are mounted to the stock height and the seat is mounted (center position) back from the pedals. Same as my other 4-runner. It took a few days to get this all figured out.
5' 5" to 6' 5" and you should be comfortable. Wanted anyone to be able to drive this thing. :D

[FYRDUDE]

What are you guys using for headers? Don't really want to use the stock ones if I can help it. Also, what are you using for muffler? Don't have a ton of room.

[RE:Todd]

What are you guys using for headers? Don't really want to use the stock ones if I can help it. Also, what are you using for muffler? Don't have a ton of room.
I used the stock manifold for a long time. I just recently got hooked up by Montezuma and JackFab with a Doug Thorley Tri-Y header. For the muffler, I've got a 2 1/4" Dynomax.

[FYRDUDE]

Thanks for the info. I'm going to check those out. The Dynomax looked like a good buy. Was also looking at the Spintech. For now I've got the stock one in there with all of the ports welded shut. Hopefully that should work for a while.

[fullsped]

Is this piece ready to wheel yet? Think it's going to be ready for Deer Valley next month or Swamp lake the following month?

[FYRDUDE]

What's up fullsped?
I've been working on the buggy and haven't updated any of the pictures lately. The radiator is mounted and the drivelines have been modified with new joints. Winch has been mounted and steering has been completed. The exhaust system is almost done and brake parts are almost all here. The plan for this week is to get the exhaust and brakes run and start on the propane. The electrical parts will be ordered tomorrow hopefully.
I am want to make these runs. I am overdue for a wheeling trip. I will be calling everyone out for a build party once all the brake, electrical, and propane stuff is all here.
Unfortunately life happens. :shaking:
I'll post up pics tomorrow.

[mobil1syn]

is there really a reason for the passenger to slide? set it far back so big people could ride and you might be able to set it down they inch like you want.

[FYRDUDE]

I thought about this before I installed it and again after. I'm kicking myself for not doing that. So I am probably going to do what you just said as soon as I get the rear seat set were it needs to be and then set the passenger seat.

[FYRDUDE]

Hydro assist mount tacked to pumpkin. This is much better than the last version.

[FYRDUDE]

Another view of the ram. I tried to mount the ram as parallel as possible to the tie rod as it cycles through the steering. I know people have clamp style mounts that clamp onto the tie rod, but I just welded on a tab. The ram is a 6" stroke. My steering cycles approx. 4.75", so I just split the difference with the tie rod mount. I now have approx. 5/8" unused ram on full steer in both directions. Just don't want to hold the wheel at full lock.

[FYRDUDE]

Radiator is now mounted. Kinda too simple, not to sure I like this design. May change this out but I'm kinda getting tired of doing things over again. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

I had ordered a sami. radiator but cancelled the order when I read that Chris was having over heating issues with the Marlin Formula. I'll stick with the stock for now. 14" Derale fan mounted with plastic ties.

[FYRDUDE]

The rad. is tight up against the engine. Can barely fit my hand in there.(why would I want my hand in there anyway.) The winch was mounted and that was a pain in the ass.

[FYRDUDE]

Winch mounted. :smokin: The 8274 has served me well over the years. Besides it weighing more than a small elephant, it's worth the weight :shaking: I have never gotten around to getting an actual Warn winch controller. I have a switch taped to what started as a beer tap, the tap eventually broke so the switch was jammed into a rad. hose. and again taped to that. The winch doesn't have a plug on it. Warn had not yet invented that cool feature yet. :shaking:
I contacted Warn and at first they said they didn't make parts for this thing anymore. :rolleyes: After talking to about 3 service people they finally found the parts breakdown and told me that a new style plug cover could be mounted to the front of it.
This will be much better than the trailer cable I have now.
This things line speed smokes. :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

Side view of how tight it is.

[FYRDUDE]

Roller fairlead vs. Hawse. What should I use? I've got the roller already but it weighs another 10 lbs. I guess it doesn't matter when the winch is heavier than @$%^&&*

[FYRDUDE]

This damn thing fought me all the way. This winch did not want to go in. The mounting holes just fit between the front cross member and the chassis hoop. The bolt heads wouldn't fit so I had to make the mounting surface out front. I don't really like this, so it's probably going to be re-done. I'm going to cut the hoop up more, like I should have done in the first place. :shaking:

[FYRDUDE]

Also, I've always just kinda eye-balled the shackle angle. What is an optimum angle at which you want the shackle when the rig is dry?

[FYRDUDE]

BTW that is 48 degrees. :eek:

[FYRDUDE]

Anyone?

[Pook]

Another view of the ram. I tried to mount the ram as parallel as possible to the tie rod as it cycles through the steering. I know people have clamp style mounts that clamp onto the tie rod, but I just welded on a tab. The ram is a 6" stroke. My steering cycles approx. 4.75", so I just split the difference with the tie rod mount. I now have approx. 5/8" unused ram on full steer in both directions. Just don't want to hold the wheel at full lock.

Put some spacers inside of the ram, that way the ram bottoms out on itself, instead of the knuckle limiting it. The ram is made to bottom out on itself and can handle it much better than your knuckles. I have a feeling this is the main reason people are breaking knuckles with hydro'

[RE:Todd]

BTW that is 48 degrees. :eek:
The more vertical the angle, the better the climb, and the worse the ride.

[a2b]

Also, I've always just kinda eye-balled the shackle angle. What is an optimum angle at which you want the shackle when the rig is dry?

there is alot of variables. every spring is different and of course they will settle. its a trial and error deal, hit or miss. most people end up moving thier hangers or what not to get the right shackle angle when dealing with new springs.

[FYRDUDE]

Put some spacers inside of the ram, that way the ram bottoms out on itself, instead of the knuckle limiting it. The ram is made to bottom out on itself and can handle it much better than your knuckles. I have a feeling this is the main reason people are breaking knuckles with hydro'

I didn't even know they could do that. I'll give the local tractor place a call and see what they charge. I guess I will have to get the steering stops set to exactly were I need them and then measure the steering cylcle distance.
Thanks for the heads up :D :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

The more vertical the angle, the better the climb, and the worse the ride.

I cut them off the other day and I have them at close to vertical and tacked them in. Now I have to make some brackets that will hold the hanger, since they now stick out past the rear end of the frame.
Bonus that they will climb better at a more vertical angle. :smokin:

[FYRDUDE]

there is alot of variables. every spring is different and of course they will settle. its a trial and error deal, hit or miss. most people end up moving thier hangers or what not to get the right shackle angle when dealing with new springs.

Probably going to be moving them even again. These springs are very soft and I'm guessing they are going to drop a bit. Only time will tell. Have you heard any feedback about AP buggy springs?

[penguinofdoom]

the downside to having a verticle shackle angle is that there isn't a whole lot of room for the shackle to angle down more, and so you might limit your droop if it is too verticle.

everything is a trade-off :D

[Pook]

I didn't even know they could do that. I'll give the local tractor place a call and see what they charge. I guess I will have to get the steering stops set to exactly were I need them and then measure the steering cylcle distance.
Thanks for the heads up :D :smokin:

I know some buddy's of mine have been just using washers on the rod for the stroke side. I'm not sure what they are doing on the other side though, pretty sure its nothing fancy, I guess each ram would be different and you just need to take it apart to see what would work. Good call on the going to the tractor place I'm sure there are "proper" ways of doing it.

[FYRDUDE]

I found another place nearby that rebuilds hydro. cylinders. I'll have to see what's cheaper. Maybe the guy can teach me how to do it myself. That would be a pretty cool write up if it hasn't already been done :D

[Pook]

I found another place nearby that rebuilds hydro. cylinders. I'll have to see what's cheaper. Maybe the guy can teach me how to do it myself. That would be a pretty cool write up if it hasn't already been done :D

would be a great write up, cuz the more I think a bout the more I'm sure this is why alot of people break knuckles. Just think of where all the force gets concentrate, write were the knuckle bearings pivot. breaking the arms off and cracking the knuckles.

[FYRDUDE]

Are tranny tunnels required for F-toys? Or is it just the fire wall?

[Chris Geiger]

Are tranny tunnels required for F-toys? Or is it just the fire wall?

The tranny bellhousing must be covered.

We will soon be updating the safty rules to bring Ftoys up to current CalROCs/ProROCK standards. The new rules will take effect at the beginning of the 2006 series. This will include requirements for full engine firewalls and transmission covers.

[OnTheSpot]

I think shackle angles all depend on the individual spring. I run a very flat spring and have about a 45 degree shackle angle to allow for a lot of drop. If my spring had more arch to it I would have the shackle angle maybe aroung 55 to 60 degrees to allow for more compression. I also agree it is kind of hit or miss. Just play with the angle until it works for your rig. Thats what I'm doing

[FYRDUDE]

The tranny bellhousing must be covered.

We will soon be updating the safty rules to bring Ftoys up to current CalROCs/ProROCK standards. The new rules will take effect at the beginning of the 2006 series. This will include requirements for full engine firewalls and transmission covers.

Thanks for the updated rules. I just made a tunnel for the bell housing and the tranny but can't fit a cover around the t-cases. It's way too tight in there. Starting the firewall frame work tomorrow.

[FYRDUDE]

I think shackle angles all depend on the individual spring. I run a very flat spring and have about a 45 degree shackle angle to allow for a lot of drop. If my spring had more arch to it I would have the shackle angle maybe aroung 55 to 60 degrees to allow for more compression. I also agree it is kind of hit or miss. Just play with the angle until it works for your rig. Thats what I'm doing

Waiting until I have the rig completely built before re-adjusting the angle. :D

[FYRDUDE]

Attention F-toy owners! Were did you mount your battery master switch? I thought I remember seeing somewhere that the switch has to be easily accessable from the outside. Is that true?

[Chris Geiger]

We put ours on top of the dash, it's the little red switch...

[Hammer Hog]

I centered mine so it could be easily accessed from the outside from either side as well as from the driver's seat. It's a top of the red post just right of the dash.

http://www.sandtastictoys.com/SafetyEquip1.JPG