Can/should I beef-up a Dana 30?

[newt]

If I upgrade the axles (Warn's), Hubs (Warn's), and U-joints (CTM's), can I make a Dana 30 just about as strong as a built Dana 44? Where would the week point be (the hub, right)? I would think this would be a very ecconomical way to run ~35"s without breaking (compared to having a complete 44 or 60 built). What do you think?

[XtrmTJ]

Little botton , upper right hand corner..." SEARCH " !:rolleyes: :flipoff2: FNG !:flipoff2:


:jeep: __(OIIIIIO)__rOkOn:usa:

[JIM3030]

[no way. I ran 35's for a little while but with no locker. and if you try to drive over a stone you will be straightening and strenghtening your tie rod

[Dan-H]

lets look at all the screwups so far

1) (obviously) you didn't search or you would have found a thread less than 2 weeks old on the same subject
2) you cross posted the same Q in the jeep and the general boards:rolleyes:
3) you didn't say what kind of a dana 30.

:rolleyes:

[Dan-H]

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=30856

[newt]

I did do a search before I posted this and found almost no information. There was plenty of BS and "don't do anything smaller than a D60," but almost no actual information. Thanks for that one link. I didn't find it in my search. It had some nuggets of info hidden w/in all the crap.

I'm talking about a CJ Dana 30. Aren't the knuckles the same (30 vs 44)? It just seems like such a waste to buy a 44, narrow it, and fill it with all the "good parts" if it won't be any stronger than a 30 with the same "good parts". Apart from the axles, hub, and Ujoints, what is the real benefit of the 44 over the 30?

I may be 'new' but I'm trying to learn. Does any one have the answers to my questions?

[TRD]

concidering my friend just blew out his D44 with 31's i wouldn't mess with a D30

[landusepbb]

What you suggest doing will give you some additional strength, but there is one big problem there is no way around. If you go with decent gearing, say 4.56, 4.88 or better, your pinion gear to ring gear contact is PUNY , you will have a half a tooth contact at any one time on a very small R&P, a recipe for disaster.

[Jeepmangled87]

dont waste the cash either keep the dana 30 stock and leave it alone, or go to a Dana 44 beefed up or even a front Dana 60 if you got the cash but dont waste your money on overpriced Dana 30 bullshit.:smokin:

[Po' riggity]

Wow... lots of opinions here.. Im planning on sticking some 297 u joints in my D30.....


















UNTIL I CAN AFFORD A 44 FRONT! :D
Scott :grinpimp:<><

[Cutter]

with the 297X's in the 30, the 44 won't be an upgrade.

[LAME]

Originally posted by tj7
dont waste your money dude,and do not put in lock outs you will tightening all day long (the bearings that is)i have a high pinion 44 on ebay if you want take a look at it i even have the matchinf 9 inch to go with it :D :D :D ....
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1805025370
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1805031689

Sell him your t-case while you are at it:rolleyes:

[tj7]

what ever he wants i have a couple of them lying around if he wants to do that...

[NothernAZxj]

concidering my friend just blew out his D44 with 31's i wouldn't mess with a D30


So your friend needs to learn to drive....whats that got to do with this post.....

[Po' riggity]

Originally posted by Cutter
with the 297X's in the 30, the 44 won't be an upgrade.
Thats not necessarily true... you get 3 more splines with the 44, a stronger housing, and a bigger ring and pinion.. thats an upgrade in my book..
Scott

[Jakesteramalamajama]

Originally posted by 1badjeep

Thats not necessarily true... you get 3 more splines with the 44, a stronger housing, and a bigger ring and pinion.. thats an upgrade in my book..
Scott

Don't forget the thicker tubes, bigger spindles, bigger steering gear, bigger tie rod ends, bigger balljoints, bigger brakes, and bigger bearings.

Yeah, I'd definitely say the 44 is an upgrade. :D

[Meyer]

I scan down the list of topics and click on ones like these when I need a good laugh :flipoff2:

[landusepbb]

What's so fricking funny about this topic. Sure its been asked before, but not everyone can afford time or money wise a completely different diff in their vehicle. Its people like you that are a joke if you can't understand that. The point is this guy wants to wheel, and do the best with what he's got, can afford, and can do.:mad3:

[CJ-Jeeper]

You can probably pick up a 44 & have it shortened for the $$ you will put into your 30

[ROKCRAZ]

I ran 38X14.50 with Ox locker and 4:88 R/P with my 30 and 35 with detroit on the rear on my TJ, I have no problems. I've been to hard trails, you just got to know how to drive it. I've seen people with 60 and still breaking it..;) :smokin:

[MadMan]

Originally posted by landuseorc
What's so fricking funny about this topic. Sure its been asked before, but not everyone can afford time or money wise a completely different diff in their vehicle. Its people like you that are a joke if you can't understand that. The point is this guy wants to wheel, and do the best with what he's got, can afford, and can do.:mad3:

Hey Brad,
Ease up a bit. The guy is new and just trying (albeit a poor attempt) to fit in. I think he was refering to the flame crap at the start of this post that's all.:)

As to the Dana 30, I would not waste the money, put the money you want to spend on fixing up the 30 into the bank and keep saving, so when you break the 30, you can replace it with a D44 or something better. A piece of shit in a tuxedo, is still a piece of shit.

[Cutter]

Originally posted by Jakesteramalamajama


Don't forget the thicker tubes, bigger spindles, bigger steering gear, bigger tie rod ends, bigger balljoints, bigger brakes, and bigger bearings.

Yeah, I'd definitely say the 44 is an upgrade. :D
bigger, but not a bunch stronger...

[pari_tj]

I just have this to say, yes I am newbie to this board but not to jeepin. I have a '98 TJ that I have been wheeling hard in clayton, ok. I have ran just about every trail there many times.


I have a upgraded D30 and have no problems, i think it is all a matter of who you drive it. I have ran boggers and Xterrain tires with no difference.


You read my signature and see what I have done, with no breakage. I don't even run CTM's yet.

Paris_TJ

[Welby]

And replacing blown axles due to exploding u-joints on a 44 is better than doing the same on a 30 how?

[Keith Strong]

Originally posted by landuseorc
What's so fricking funny about this topic. Sure its been asked before, but not everyone can afford time or money wise a completely different diff in their vehicle. Its people like you that are a joke if you can't understand that. The point is this guy wants to wheel, and do the best with what he's got, can afford, and can do.:mad3:

You are talkin affordable, and what you say makes sense, but from how I am understanding him he wants to spend a BUTTLOAD of money on the D30 :eek:

[JIM3030]

Originally posted by ROKCRAZ
I ran 38X14.50 with Ox locker and 4:88 R/P with my 30 and 35 with detroit on the rear on my TJ, I have no problems. I've been to hard trails, you just got to know how to drive it. I've seen people with 60 and still breaking it..;) :smokin:
That is a more bigger 30 though. 86 and back are ity bity

[RCKRATZ]

Originally posted by ROKCRAZ
I ran 38X14.50 with Ox locker and 4:88 R/P with my 30 and 35 with detroit on the rear on my TJ, I have no problems. I've been to hard trails, you just got to know how to drive it. I've seen people with 60 and still breaking it..;) :smokin: I totally disagree. Yes, how you drive matters, but with your setup it is a :nuke: just waiting to go off. Personally I would save my money and upgrade to at least a 44 for 2 reasons. #1 being the size of the r&p, and #2 being that you can do high steer.

[landusepbb]

This is not advice, just a suggestion, but for $250 if you have a CJ D30 you can get the Superior shafts that use the bigger u-joints. Don't know anyone running them, so I don't know if they're worth a darn, but the price aint too bad, may be the way to go. At least its a start at not throwing big bucks at a 30 like lots of guys have done with 35 rears, Super 35 kit, etc.

[syko]

Originally posted by Jakesteramalamajama


Don't forget the thicker tubes, bigger spindles, bigger steering gear, bigger tie rod ends, bigger balljoints, bigger brakes, and bigger bearings.

Yeah, I'd definitely say the 44 is an upgrade. :D

Hmm, a dana 30 knuckle will fit a dana 44. so were are you getting bigger balljoints.
I have a 30 and a 44 in the garage. The wife is going to get battaries for the digital camera right now.

I will post side by side pics

The advantage to a 44 over a 30 is ring and pinion size (not much) and axle tube strenght. 297x ujoint are stronger then 260x but not by much. I would say if you have already bought a locker and don't break u-joints very much and don't mind spending $400 or more for axles then buy it and wheel it/

If you want wider axles and can afford CTMs and Warn shafts upgrade to a 44.

It's all up to you.

[syko]

Dana 44 on the left Dana 30 on the right

[syko]

Same knuckle

[jeep77cj5]

I ran a 30 for several years with stock shafts and a EZ locker and only broke the locker but never a shaft or joint, but I went with a 44 front just cause it was relatively cheap since I shortened the housing myself, the other nice upgrade over a 30 is the internal hubs vice the externals that like to loosen up once in a while (at least the old 30's), I say leave it alone and upgrade when it breaks!!

[MTUCJ7]

1.Keep the D30 as is.
2.Keep some spare shafts on hand, they should be cheap cause people upgrade to d44 and junk the d30.
3.Save your money for a d44 or d60 and replace shafts when needed.
IMO
-troy

[Chrisjeep7]

Originally posted by landuseorc
This is not advice, just a suggestion, but for $250 if you have a CJ D30 you can get the Superior shafts that use the bigger u-joints. Don't know anyone running them, so I don't know if they're worth a darn, but the price aint too bad, may be the way to go. At least its a start at not throwing big bucks at a 30 like lots of guys have done with 35 rears, Super 35 kit, etc.

for 250 you can have WMS cut you a 44 to fit your Jeep.

Chris G.

[doctor_G]

Cross posting is weak :rolleyes:
Its a newbie thing, some day you'll understand. :flipoff2:

[xBabyJesus]

I've got a D30 w/ Superior alloy shafts and 297's, warn internal hubs and hub fuses. I popped a hub fuse the other day, but the shafts and joints held up. 4:1 on 38's.

I'm wondering if it's worth throwing CTMs in the alloy D30 shafts.

strength diff from D30 shafts and D44 shafts (alloy) ?

-J

[Recluse]

I still run the 260's.Never broken one yet.I've seen a few broken axles.A lot of It's all about the stupid pedal.

[xBabyJesus]

Originally posted by Recluse
I still run the 260's.Never broken one yet.I've seen a few broken axles.A lot of It's all about the stupid pedal.

What size tires are you running? What gearing?

[milkman]

Just my .02$

I have been running a D30 with 297's, 4.56 and ARB for years with 36's. I would like some day to possibly do a D60 or something but $$$$ is problem for alot of us..what I think(not that it matters)is if you know how to drive the D30 with the bigger shafts will hold up for a long time..I cant see wasting all the money on a D30 with the warns, CTMS and all the hupla! If and when I break a axle shaft, I have a spare in the XJ, then I go to my local warn dealer and get a replacement for 90 or 95$ depending on what side it is... To me this is an easy trail fix and a easily replaced FUSE. if you go upgrading the shafts with warns and CTMS.. the r/p size really becomes an issue because that will be more likely to break.. then your screwed on the trail...I think the CTM and warn upgrades are a good idea on bigger axles!

Milkman

[Dan-H]

then I go to my local warn dealer and get a replacement for 90 or 95$ depending on what side it is...

I guess it depends on how often you have to spend that 90 or $95.

If you are breaking stuff regularly, its easy to decide how many fixes will equal the cost of the upgrade.

For example if you went to alloy shafts that could survive a 297 grenading, Then its more like 20 bucks here and 20 bucks there...

How many stock shafts do you have to roast before a stronger shaft becomes cost effective. Then how many 297s do you have to roast before a CTM becomes cost effective. Then how many hubs or R&Ps do you have to roast before a Dana 60 or whatever makes sense.

But, if you aren't breaking anything, does it really make sense to do the upgrade just cuz 60s are cool? Only you and your credit card can answer this one

[Mr.RatBastard]

It all depends on where and how you wheel.I had a freind w/a chevy p/u running 44's and 1 ton running gear ,I had a CJ w/42's and a 360 and stock axles.We ran the same trails ( mostly mud and river bank trails ) anyway he broke every part on his truck ,something new every week,I rarely broke anything (remember " we ran the same trails " ) Some people have skill ...some people have $ some have both,some like my freind could tear up a man hole cover :D You may not need anything bigger...run it til it breaks .

[Recluse]

xBaby Jesus.
33x12.5s ,456s ,with a slushbox.

[syko]

Originally posted by Mr.RatBastard
,some like my freind could tear up a man hole cover :D

I think I know the same guy!!:D (my buddy mike) When he bought his Jeep we were wheelin inside of 45mins. He played for 10mins tops and destoried the dana 30 ring and pinion. Broke about 4 teeth off the ring gear and chewed up the pinion. He has an open diff, built 360, and 33" thornturds. He has boken something every time he pulls the thing off road. Its funny as hell. Mike if you read this :flipoff2:

[milkman]

I dont break all of the time....I have broken 1 or 2 joints/axles in the last 3 years......But if I had a 44 the same failure would have occurred...I hear ya about the money thing... its just not worth it to me. Now if I had broken something everytime I went out... Well then, I would change something.. But til then,, that stout little 30 is my friend!!...

I dont need a 60 to GET IT!


milkman

:usa:

[newt]

Thanks for the input from everyone. It looks like there are plenty of people out there who have run the 30 and are happy with it. I think I'll leave mine alone until I break it, then upgrade what ever breaks (probably starting w/ axles & the 297s). When I'm ready for the spring over and BIG tires, I'll get the beef to match (D-60s). Until then I'll just have to remember to go easy on the stupid pedal.

[xBabyJesus]

Originally posted by Recluse
xBaby Jesus.
33x12.5s ,456s ,with a slushbox.

Well no wonder you don't break anything :rolleyes:

[Recluse]

Like on the Rubicon or Sierra Trek..I can only go as fast as the guy Broken or stuck in front of me..lol

[krb]

Well some of you so called axle experts may call me stupid but all the shiat I have installed in my d-30 has held together for sometime now.Lets see....Warn axles,297 joints,Warn hub conversion,Ox locker,4:56 gears,33's. Your more likely break something if it's pedal to the metal.

[coachgeo]

Good responce mikman

Originally posted by milkman
Just my .02$

I have been running a D30 with 297's, 4.56 and ARB for years with 36's. I would like some day to possibly do a D60 or something but $$$$ is problem for alot of us..what I think(not that it matters)is if you know how to drive the D30 with the bigger shafts will hold up for a long time..I cant see wasting all the money on a D30 with the warns, CTMS and all the hupla! If and when I break a axle shaft, I have a spare in the XJ, then I go to my local warn dealer and get a replacement for 90 or 95$ depending on what side it is... To me this is an easy trail fix and a easily replaced FUSE. if you go upgrading the shafts with warns and CTMS.. the r/p size really becomes an issue because that will be more likely to break.. then your screwed on the trail...I think the CTM and warn upgrades are a good idea on bigger axles!

Milkman

[TDW]

I am running a d30, Warn 5x5.5 hub conversion, Warn inners, 4.56 and ARB (hehe I know, the ultimate polished turd :D ) with 36" SX. Have had a few broken joints over the last couple years but nothing too major. I have even gone as far as replacing axle brackets on the housing :rolleyes:

I am with Milkman's take on the CTM joints being used with the d30. I would rather change out a shaft or joint on the trail rather than r&p. Call me crazy. :D

[xBabyJesus]

Originally posted by krb
Well some of you so called axle experts may call me stupid but all the shiat I have installed in my d-30 has held together for sometime now.Lets see....Warn axles,297 joints,Warn hub conversion,Ox locker,4:56 gears,33's. Your more likely break something if it's pedal to the metal.

OMG 33's!!! :eek: :eek: :rolleyes:

Obviously you don't understand the comparisons we are making here... 'course you're not gonna break shit on 33's, the question here is 35"+ and gearing... Come back when you know your ass from a hole in the ground NEWBIE :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

[Keith Strong]

Hmmmmmmm.....Super Thursday or Thirty Thursday Lame? :flipoff2:

[LOPPY]

The "some of us cant afford to go 60 and just want to wheel something until we can" argument is as stupid as a $3 bill. Before you get back on your high horse and try and hose me, let me explain. Because I know! I've polished a few turds in my day and it was ugly. I spent an ungodly amount of money on alloy shafts, hub conversion, upgraded steering, 297x's, lockers and gearing on a fawking D30. Yes, I've been there. :flipoff2:

Either your too lazy or impatient to find a good 44 or even better, a 60. I got my 91 chebby 60 for $800. Yes they're out there. You can do even better by getting lucky in a P&P, buying a whole one ton truck (selling the rest of the shite) or getting lucky in a farmers field. I threw a lockrite in it I had laying around. Came with 4:11 gears already and I did the steering over myself spending about $150 on one arm, some .250 tubing and some new TRE's. I'm sure I have less than $1100.00 TOTAL in my front 60. And that's paying $800 for the axle! It can be done cheap.

So how much did you pay for your "super 30". :rolleyes:

[rckjeep98]

buy a waggy front d44 and have it narrowed to fit your rig. I've seen these axles for about $200 at pick-n-pull. Add ctm's if you wish for even more strength. you wont regret it

[P&T Jeeps]

Originally posted by rckjeep98
buy a waggy front d44 and have it narrowed to fit your rig. I've seen these axles for about $200 at pick-n-pull. Add ctm's if you wish for even more strength. you wont regret it


newbie, you missed the reason this whole thread has been resurrected. but good point, what are CTM's BTW?

...actually, your part of the reason. no serious responses required. :shaking:

[Keith Strong]

Originally posted by P&T Jeeps



newbie, you missed the reason this whole thread has been resurrected. but good point, what are CTM's BTW?

...actually, your part of the reason. no serious responses required. :shaking:


Hey.....no fraternizing with the enemy :flipoff2: :p

[P&T Jeeps]

Originally posted by Keith Strong



Hey.....no fraternizing with the enemy :flipoff2: :p

I just figured he could teach us about CTM's since were all aready running them...that's all, sorry. :(


:flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

[LAME]

Originally posted by rckjeep98
buy a waggy front d44 and have it narrowed to fit your rig. I've seen these axles for about $200 at pick-n-pull. Add ctm's if you wish for even more strength. you wont regret it

$200? Hows your ass:flipoff2:
Fuck I came outta a pick and pull with 2 44's, one chev, with flat tops, and a Ferd Ftwofiddy with flatties for $150