I've done some serious digging and have learned a pile, but have been unable to answer one basic question:

Why is SAS preferred over twin I beam? I don't want to hear how much you luv your SAS or how much twin I beam sucks. I want to know WHY. The only reason I've been able to rationalize is to move up from the D44 to a D60. Others?

Also, is there anyone out there still runing their twin I beam that's NOT considering SAS?

There's a ton of experience on this board that's miles beyond me, but I'm also past the guys on all the other boards that don't know one end of a left handed smoke shifter from the other.:D

Let the abuse begin........

The reason I am doing my SAS is because my IFS gets like 3" of flex and there are no descent lifts available so only option I really have with IFS is a body lift, which doesnt cut it for me. Plus I have more locker options with the straight axle, actually no one even makes a locker for my front end.

The reason to do the SAS is simple.....thats it simple......:flipoff2:

The solid axle is far from as complex to make strong than any IFS, it will out flex, by far, and it is 20 times stronger in stock form.....upgrade the carrier, axles, and u-joints with easily attainable products, and you have an axle that outperforms IFS in almost any category.....for far less money.....

see.......simple.......

Brian--

Originally posted by 1uglyranger
The reason to do the SAS is simple.....thats it simple......:flipoff2:

The solid axle is far from as complex to make strong than any IFS, it will out flex, by far, and it is 20 times stronger in stock form.....upgrade the carrier, axles, and u-joints with easily attainable products, and you have an axle that outperforms IFS in almost any category.....for far less money.....

see.......simple.......

Brian--

What he said....give in to the dark side.....mine will be done soon:flipoff2:

the TTB is a favorte of the prerunner high speed crowd because they can can alot of travel out of it....and the solid is a rock crawler favorate cause of strengh and flex

It's simple and strong. IFS is complex and weak.

I have ifs, and its prolly staying that way for a long time.. Got into Muscle cars and All my $$ goes that direction :D

Cool. Thanks for the responses guys. I was wondering if I was missing anything.

Basically it boils down to design simplicity and $$ to upgrade. (in simplest terms).

Gotta wonder about the flex thing though. Is it really possible to get MORE flex out of a solid axle than the twin I beam? I can appreciate it in respect to other IFS systems (Toys for example). Where the A arms are short. But on the TTB the said "A" arm (if you will) is damn near the width of the whole vehicle, i.e. not that much shorter than a solid axle itself. Only in this case, the two sides can move independant of each other and maintain maximum contact patch on both sides. hmmmmmmmmmmm

It is very possible to get some very large travel numbers from TTB. Numbers over 25" are possible on full size setups, and 18- 20 on Rangers/Explorer/broII. That much travel wont come dirt cheap, though. I did get 13 out of mine just by making sure the shocks were long enough. Almost always the shocks limit TTB's flex if you use whats recommended by the lift makers.

A leaf sprung straight axle is by far the simplest thing to have. But a TTB is not near as complex as those IFS systems using control arms and CV joints.

If you need the D60' strength, though, no D60 was made as a TTB.
I think that somewhat solves that dilemma. Gonna have to go solid :D

The biggest problem that I find with the TTB is that it is very hard to get the springs to compress. Unless I am going downhill over an obstacle the coils don't compress very far. Going downhill I have seen the coils compress all the way but that doesn't help when you are going uphill. Sometimes the radius arms bind up on me too. Another thing I have noticed is that in certain situations it is not smooth. The problem is that the axle isn't really suspended, it is attached to the frame so rather than having the springs and shocks absorb all the shock it transmits it through the frame. It isn't always a problem but it can get annoying and does make handling difficult in certain situations. For running quickly across rough terrain it is probably the best stock suspension design to do it but in the rocks TTB will get you through but you might not always enjoy it's quirks. Even so it is much better than any SLA IFS setup. I am getting about 16" out of mine, haven't really measured it accurately though.

1) ttb doesn't realy flex, it travels
2) solid axle-when one tire goes up, it forces the other down.
3)ttb is fun in the desert and dunes but not in the rocks.
4)ttb has one to many u-joints to break
5)like said above,it is hard (read$$$) to make the TTB work and be strong, and ask walker evans i'm sure he'll tell you you can still get up travel out of a solid.
basicaly it depends on how you plan on limiting your self. i have a blast keeping up with my friends in their buggys and bikes in the desert, but at the same time i'm sick of breaking an axle or two every time i want to try to play with the big boys in the rocks. i am going to the solid route as soon as i can afford it.

http://www.heroic.cc/kjell/images/hoofhearted.jpg

Yep, a good ol' EB drivetrain with solid axles.....:D

Brooke Fairbanks, the owner of that rig, is a friggin' riot to wheel with too.

Originally posted by it'll fit
1) ttb doesn't realy flex, it travels
2) solid axle-when one tire goes up, it forces the other down.


Yep. There's no doubt you can get tons of wheel travel from a TTB. This is great for high-speed hits/jumps. But take a yo-yo and spin it on the end of the line, now just barely touch it to the ground so it just scrapes. This is TTB, wheel travel but no weight on that tire. Compare this to #2 above.

Just this weekend i got my buddies truck that we did a SAS on the weekend before through a rock pit, when the TTB (both Fullsize broncos with 35s) went though, big surpize to see the tie rods bend in half, and they were taking the same line

TTB main sucks because the Swing arms, bend very easy, the radius arms bend very easy, Ball joints go bad about 1 year when your running in the 35 inch range, and wheel bearing tend to go as well.

Originally posted by welndmn
TTB main sucks because the Swing arms, bend very easy, the radius arms bend very easy, Ball joints go bad about 1 year when your running in the 35 inch range, and wheel bearing tend to go as well.

AHHHHH.....finally what I suspect as the REAL answer to it all. Like I said before, I could understand about being limited to what you could do to the drivetrain. But I was wondering about the strength of the suspension itself (amongst 10000 other things). Just not worth it to try to beef the suspension components up.

But you still can't make me go to the dark side........and......I won't........and.........you're not my father.........and.......and.....and.....


Thanks for the info guys. Now I just need to get a shop to work in and a butt load of time and $$. Gonna have to run what's there for now :(

ITs easy check it out
http://www.wt4wheeling.com/tech/sas.htm

fyi i've hade good luck with 4" rancho series II lift as far as strength of the kit and ride ect. a little low for 35's but i've beat the piss out of it in all forms of wheeling (rocks, fast bumps/jumps, dunes, the little mud we get here)and have only just started seeing cracks in the radius arms and either the ball joint or i beam bushings are going south cause i get a ocasional death wobble. doesn't help that i've got no bushing in the shocks from over streaching/ over stuffing them. enough travel to soak up 2' woops at 60+. not that i want to keep it just have had good luck with it for know. any body have some of the new james duff arms sitting around they don't want:rolleyes: