73 Powerwagon Front Disk Brake Conversion?

[CCF]

Hey all-
I FINALLY bought myself a old PowerWagon, and let me tell you, it was WELL worth the wait. I found a '73 W100, shortbed fleetside, with 318/727/np205/8.75 rear, and 44 up front. It is absolutely gorgeous, coming froma 96 year old guy, with 64,000 original miles on it. I have receipts showing a new 318 put in it by a Dodge dealership in 1989, because the old guy lost a rad hose and didnt know and seized the motor, and the mileage reading in '89 was 34,000. It is SUPER cherry, all original except the wheels, 33" tires, flowmasters, and 340 intake and edelbrock carburetor. Here are some pictures for whoever wants to see it: http://www.bigbluez71.com/multimedia/Kyles%20Pictures/
The first couple pages are of me and my welding stuff, but there are some of the truck in the later pages. Tell me what you think.
Anyways, my reason for posting.....the ONLY thing I dont like about the truck is the fact that it has drum brakes in all 4 corners. I have been looking for a disk conversion kit for the 44, but have had no luck. Yesterday, I was at my buddies house, who has a '90 Dodge 4x4, with what looks like a 44 in the front, with disk brakes on it. Now, knowing how Dodge always seemed to use interchangeable parts, would this front axle bolt right into my truck with the disk brakes on it? I just happened to notice he had disks, and it got me thinking. What do you think? Im sure I could find a front axle out of a late 80's early 90's Dodge truck. As long as the gear ratio is the same, do you think it would bolt right in?
THANKS IN ADVANCE!
Kyle

[FULLSIZE]

your D44 drum brake knuckle has the same spindle bolt pattern as the GM disc brake stuff.;) then use a Ford rotor/hub assembly with the correct wheel bearings to match the GM spindle you use to get the 5 on 5.5 bolt pattern. its a little more involved than it sounds but should go together pretty easy.

[CCF]

sounds pretty easy actually. can you, or someone give me a complete breakdown of EVERYTHING I need, and from what year/make/model of what vehicle they come from. this swap woud be easier than just replacing the entire front axle? probably cheaper i guess....???
thanks a bunch!
kyle

[76dodgecrew4u]

Don't do the ford rotor/chevy hub /international bearings on a toyota hybrid axle stuff. Just find an '80 to early '84 front axle with the same gears as your truck and swap the whole axle. Starting in 1984, mid year, Dodge went to the CAD system which uses a vacuum pod to engage the front axle. They often stop working because rotted vacuum lines or a worn actuator. You can use one of these axles, matter fact on ramchargercentral.com in the tech section they tell/show you how to make a CAD axle work. Also starting in 1980 Dodge went back to the 5 on 5.5 bolt circle so you won't have to get seperate rims. Very nice truck, I had a 73 long bed same color combo. I sold it to a guy in Florida.
Please for simplicity sake just put a dodge axle in it

[CCF]

sounds good 76. thanks for the year combo and all that. think that is something i could find at a local dismantler/pick-n-pull?
thanks again!
kyle

[Afireinside]

swapping a whole axle is harder and will cost more.do a search for flat top knuckles and you will find everything you need.
good luck
O yeah what does toyota have to do with anything i'm curious and dont just search the dodge forum.

[FULLSIZE]

Don't do the ford rotor/chevy hub /international bearings on a toyota hybrid axle stuff..........


toyota stuff? WTF are you talking about?

i think swapping the outers is the best way, because you kill 2 birds with 1 stone. disc brake swap and inspect/replace worn parts.

brian

[CCF]

Okay. Etiher way is fine with me, and being only 17 on a limited budget, the cheapest is always better! As for the flat top knuckles....just ANY G flat top knucle will work? I still havent been able to find fomr what year vehicles all of the parts come from. Anyone know?
THANKS!
Kyle

[wheelieking71]

damn fine truck kyle! heres the deal on getting disks on your 44 and keeping the bolt pattern the same. find any part time 4 wheel drive dodge, 80'-93' in the boneyard. take everything from the knuckles out, including the axle shafts. i would actually reccomend buying the whole axle, and parting it out yourself. chances are that you wont find a front from those years with the same gear ratio as yours, but you need so many parts off the axle assembly it really wont cost you much more to buy the whole thing. (the shafts are the main money maker for the boneyard) now, if you buy a CAD equipped axle thats OK. just replace the drive flanges with lock-outs, and use your passenger side inner axle shaft, and you will be good to go. it is all a direct bolt together swap.

[CCF]

hey wheelie. first of all, thanks for the compliment on the truck. it defenitely taught me a quality life lesson, that being, sometimes it is worth waiting. i cant tell you how long i have been looking for a truck like this, and was so close to settling for others numerous times. anyways, so i need to just buy a complete front 44 avle out of a part time 4x4 dodge? preferably 80-84, but newer ones will work? are all the 4-wheel drive trucks in this period equipped with a dana 44 in the front? what do you think this would cost? more than a couple hundred?
thanks soooo much guys!
kyle

[76dodgecrew4u]

I appologize FULLSIZE it very hard to type and show sarcasm, I'm still a noob and was just trying to say he can get everything from a dodge that he needs to convert. You can use a CAD axle like wheelieking was saying. I just find that with the bone yards where I'm at they charge more if it has that "fancy sophisticated auto front axle"(bone yard owners words,not mine). I can pick up fronts that are 80-83 here for $100-$150 where a CAD equipped one will run $250 and up. That is where I base my theory. Again, very very nice truck way to go!!

[CCF]

thanks to you also 76. one more question...i am planning on finding one out of a 80-84....will EVERYTHING I HAVE BOLT ON!? i dont want to buy it then go, "o shit"...and be screwed. will my warn locking hubs work also?
thanks!
kyle

[FULLSIZE]

I appologize FULLSIZE it very hard to type and show sarcasm, I'm still a noob and was just trying to say he can get everything from a dodge that he needs to convert. You can use a CAD axle like wheelieking was saying. I just find that with the bone yards where I'm at they charge more if it has that "fancy sophisticated auto front axle"(bone yard owners words,not mine). I can pick up fronts that are 80-83 here for $100-$150 where a CAD equipped one will run $250 and up. That is where I base my theory. Again, very very nice truck way to go!!


i guess your right, since i was also being sarcastic.............add this :flipoff2: at the end of the first line in my post and it makes sense.:D

i recommended to use the mismatched brand stuff because usually the dodge stuff is gone at local pull-it-yourself yards and dodge stuff from local wreckers has a "rare = big $$" attitude attached. at least around here it does.......

brian

[Elwenil]

It may just be the location. I can still find dodge D44s pretty cheap around here, but I'm in BFE. I too would probably keep my truck all Dodge, mainly just out of pride and stubbornness. Plus I think putting GM parts on my Dodge would cause the whole thing to fall apart. Then again, there's all the ribbing I'd take from my GM friends. :D

Sounds like you found a good truck, Kyle. I have 2 '74 models, a 1/2 ton and a 3/4. The gearing in your W100 is most likely the same as mine, which is 3.55. Dodge still offered the 3.55's through the 80's but normally you will find D44s with 3.23s so finding a complete axle to bolt in might be a little problem, but you never know until you look. Good luck with your truck.

[76dodgecrew4u]

I agree totally with Elwenil. chevy on Dodge or ford on Dodge is just sacrilegious. Dodge through and through.

What state are you in? If I'm close I might be able to help you out on a front axle.

[CCF]

hey guys-
my truck actually has 3.91's in the back and 3.90's in the front. my dad said the front were always a hundreth of a ratio off??? 76, i am in california, so unfortunately, i dont think you would be able to help me...but thanks sooo much for offering. as for putting other manufacturer parts on the dodge, my dad said the exact same thing....NO WAY! haha. he is mopar thorugh and through and wont let me buy anything chevy or ford, lol. i am probably going to the local dismantlers this sunday with my dad, as he wants to look for some parts for his 75 plymouth 2wd trailduster also! ill update everyone when I get back.
THANKS!
kyle

[Elwenil]

Ahh, 3.91s are pretty scarce. Normally find them in old US Forestry trucks. I had a chunk with 3.91s out of a car 8 3/4 that I thought about using, but I couldn't find any 3.91s for the D44 for any reasonable price. Now that I'm scrapping the W200 for the engine/tranny and transfer case for the M715, I'm just going to swap over the 8 lug 4.10 stuff. Good luck in the yard, shouldn't be too hard to find what you need.

[Afireinside]

Like I said in my first post what does toyota have to do with anything?Second I don't see why putting chevy(or any other american)parts on your dodge is bad most front axles of the time are made buy Dana anyways so.
The chevy stuff is usually cheaper and easier to find and its stronger.
If you SEARCH this has been covered several times :flipoff2:
Good luck whichever way you go.

[EarlKann]

Some '83 Dodge 4x4 axles for sale here (non CAD disk brake) ORE classified (http://www.offroadexchange.com/modforums/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=3159)

Also some good Dodge tech write-ups on that site as well.

Looks like a really clean truck. Congrats.

[76dodgecrew4u]

Hey different strokes for different folks. Some people may like to remember what all different makes of parts they have on their truck, not me. Personaly, I like to go into the parts store knowing that my truck is all Dodge and thats the only vehicle the parts cames from. Again with the toyota deal, I was just being sarcastic. :flipoff2: We are all just giving this kid some advice, I have talked with him and I believe he is competent enough to read through all the posts and decide his plan off action.
Matter of fact my brother had a 76 SWB chevy 4x4, He broke the front pumkin 3 times, cracked right at the bottom of the housing, chewed up 4 hub/spindle setups and had two axle tubes snap at the welds. He also had a friend whose truck ( a chevy of the same vintage) and it had the same kind of problems. These were two street driven trucks!
I have seen old Dodges that have had the dog$h!t ran out of them and never broke. That is why I won't put chevy parts on my Dodge, and like Elwenil said

I too would probably keep my truck all Dodge, mainly just out of pride and stubbornness. Plus I think putting GM parts on my Dodge would cause the whole thing to fall apart.

[FULLSIZE]

............. broke the front pumkin 3 times, cracked right at the bottom of the housing, chewed up 4 hub/spindle setups and had two axle tubes snap at the welds. He also had a friend whose truck ( a chevy of the same vintage) and it had the same kind of problems. These were two street driven trucks!


so were they dana axles or corp 10 bolts?

these failures are most commonly the fault of the average GM mechanic (or lack there of) that is doing the service work on his truck by shinning up the chrome wheels or polishing the add-on flames in the grill and not topping off the gearoil or checking for loose parts.;)

i'm in total agreement that GM builds alot of junk and they require more attention (having owned 1 before), but as i have found, a dana 44 is a dana 44 my freinds. :D

[76dodgecrew4u]

The first axle was a 10 bolt. The replacement was a 44, but he had a buddy set it up. I hate to dog my brother out, but he was, an average GM mechanic (or lack there of) that was doing the service work on his truck by shinning up the chrome wheels or polishing the add-on flames in the grill and not topping off the gearoil or checking for loose parts.

I was wrong in my statement, Dana does make very good parts and it most always comes down to the mechanic but this:

The chevy stuff is usually cheaper and easier to find and its stronger
is completely contradictory, so I'm calling out a bull$h!t. Dana supplied chevy, Dodge and ford, so how could chevy parts be "stronger"

[FULLSIZE]

The chevy stuff is usually cheaper and easier to find and its stronger.



i totally agree 76dodgecrew4u, major BS................

the only arguement i can come up with for him is the dana parts on the chevy "seem" to be stronger than on a dodge because they last longer than most of the other GM parts around it. :D

[FULLSIZE]

BTW kyle, that truck is in really good condition.:bounce: :bounce2:

http://www.bigbluez71.com/multimedia/Kyles%20Pictures/images/100_1591.JPG
http://www.bigbluez71.com/multimedia/Kyles%20Pictures/images/100_1575.JPG
http://www.bigbluez71.com/multimedia/Kyles%20Pictures/images/100_1606.JPG
http://www.bigbluez71.com/multimedia/Kyles%20Pictures/images/100_1600.JPG

[Elwenil]

Yes, I have to say that has got to be one of the cleanest unrestored trucks of that era I have seen. Try to take good care of it and don't mod it too much. It's your truck and you can do whatever you want, but it would be a shame to see a nice truck like that beat up like mine are, lol.

[CCF]

thanks guys. i am not looking to do a ton to it, as i want to improve on my fabrication shop and supplies...building up my inventoryof tools needed to build world class drag race cars. actually sold my little rice rocket so that i could buy my tig welder i now have, which i waited for 3 yrs to get, and also the truck! :) thanks again for the compliments.
kyle

[Afireinside]

I didnt mean to get you guys fired up and you are right that a dana 44 is a dana 44 but gm uses bigger tre's and usually but not always uses better spindles and bearings and my key word was CHEAPER. You are all right about a d44.
Good luck either way.

[FULLSIZE]

not fired up here just havin a little internet fun bud.:D

chat with you fellas later.;)

brian