Why cross tie-down straps

[Honkylips]

I see a lot of rigs tied down with the straps crossed, you know, right rear of the vehicle to left rear of trailer, and so on. What's the benefit of this?

[Jrod-13]

no clue on straps.. those are for tieing down rubermade totes.. ;)

But the reson for crossing your CHAINS to your rig, is to help keep it centered on the deck of the trailer.

[ramv]

In order to apply force equally in three dimensions, (given the right rear, you want to pull down, left and back) you ideally would want it at 45 degrees to all planes. In order to get the left to right angle crossing gives you more distance to work with. Its just a geometry thing, some people think its required, others don't. I like to on mine, but I also use straps, so I guess I must be wrong.

[4x4not]

Well I use straps and chains, and cross the front and rear. Just keeps the rig more stable. I have seen guys cross the back and not the front, and visa-versa. I'd post pics but my web server is down for the time being

[dubbyx]

so was anything ever decided if it was better to strap off the frame as opposed to the axles?

I've heard as many opinions on this as I have crossing straps/chains...

[n9emz]

I don't know that one way is any better than another....I tie down the frame because I don't like bouncing going on back there. I guess one way of looking at it is, where does the factory locate the transport brackets?

[withamc]

I recently switched from strapping the frame down to a chain over the rear axle and ratchet straps to the front axle. I had had one or two times where the ratchet straps had come off on rough roads. It's been fine since, although I haven't had an emergency lane change under hard braking yet either.

Chris

[DRM]

I can tell you one thing - if you lose one strap or chain while crossing them you pretty much just defeated the entire system. At least if you tie down in a "burst" pattern and lose one of the 4 corners, you still have the opposing corner on the other end to keep things relatively snug.

[SanDiegoCJ]

no clue on straps.. those are for tieing down rubermade totes.. ;)

But the reson for crossing your CHAINS to your rig, is to help keep it centered on the deck of the trailer.



Oh B.S. on the dissing straps. :rolleyes:
Proper straps, properly attached work just fine.

[Jrod-13]

so was anything ever decided if it was better to strap off the frame as opposed to the axles?



Personaly, I'm a fan of chaining the axles, and then strapping the frame to control sway, if needed

[SanDiegoCJ]

so was anything ever decided if it was better to strap off the frame as opposed to the axles?

I've heard as many opinions on this as I have crossing straps/chains...



I've heard people claim that attaching the straps or chains to the body keeps
the load (vehicle) more stable on the trailer. Well, I have both a SOA CJ7 and
a rock buggy that I have trailered and I always strap them down by the axles.
Both of them are very softly sprung and I don't feel them bouncing around at all.
I've had NO stability problems. It's been a non-issue.

[Po' riggity]

My jeeps frame has holes perfect for the hooks in the straps to go into, so I'll attach the STRAPS (no chains for me) to the frame front and rear, and cross them as well... IF I can ever get my damn trailer done.
Scott

[n9emz]

Clusterhook straps rock!:D

[scout254]

I have heard bad news in the past about strapping your axles down with CHAIN. When I loaded my 5600 lb scout down on a trailer, I did four individual chainbinders, 1 per corner, and bought nylon straps to wrap around the axle tubes. I believe Calif requires four tie down points.

[4x4not]

OK, webserver is back up....

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chains_rear1.jpg
I use straps around the axle and then chains crossed in the back. The hanging chain is just the excess held up with a bolt.

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chain_hook_trailerside.jpg
3500lb WLL hooks on the trailer end

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/straps_front2.jpg
And combo axle ratchet straps in the front, also crossed.

My junk doesn't budge at all once tightened down.

[xfaktor]

Personaly, I'm a fan of chaining the axles, and then strapping the frame to control sway, if needed

x2

Body can bounce around and let the link loosen up/un hook. The axel dosent bounce. I then put 2 strap on each side on the rocker guard to control boucing/sway of the body.

[85blue4runner]

might want to look at professional auto transporters. they cinch the vehicle down to the bumpstops or pretty darn close to it. you never see a car tied down on a large transporter by its tires or axles. even if you cant see up into the underside of the car, the wheels will be stuffed into the wheel wells, showing that the body and frame are pulled down tight. Not saying that there is not any other way. Just looking at the people who make a living doing it day in and day out all year...

[B-rock]

Oh B.S. on the dissing straps. :rolleyes:
Proper straps, properly attached work just fine.


X2 I have a set of mac's straps, VERY quick and VERY stout. Reinforced where they wrap around the axle.

[withamc]

might want to look at professional auto transporters. they cinch the vehicle down to the bumpstops or pretty darn close to it. you never see a car tied down on a large transporter by its tires or axles. even if you cant see up into the underside of the car, the wheels will be stuffed into the wheel wells, showing that the body and frame are pulled down tight. Not saying that there is not any other way. Just looking at the people who make a living doing it day in and day out all year...
Yes, but almost all of those vehicles have about 2" of wheel travel. I have done it both ways - just recently switched to strapping axles instead of frame and I gotta say I prefer the new way better. Like I said, I've lost a strap when hitting a bump with the frame tie down method and also bent one end of the trailer heading into JV a couple years ago when the suspension compressed and rebounded.

[jchio]

I use chains from the front and rear bumper to compress the suspension and keep it tight.

Then a pair of straps from the axles, all of them in the >< pattern. Never had a problem with it. It keeps the vehicle from shifting from one side to another...

[Eskimo]

Personaly, I'm a fan of chaining the axles, and then strapping the frame to control sway, if needed

Ditto.

I chain the rear axle in a X, strap the front axle, and then run straps to the sides of the rig (rock rails usually) to control the body roll, but they are not cinched down really tight, just enough to take the slack out of them.

My 3500 doesn't care about the rig flopping around on the trailer, but it's just more secure.

I have had to perform an evasive maneuver (thanks to my dumb ass being inattentive) with the rig strapped down like this, and if the frame wasn't held in place at all, I don't think the trailer would have tracked as well because of the weight shift.

basically, it was nail the brakes as hard as possible to scrub off speed, then release, steer around the stopped car in front of me (that I didn't notice because of said dumb-assness), then back on the brakes again hard once straightened up.

A couple of the hot shot guys I know/talk to have been using straps over the tires of cars, and are very pleaseed with the results.. That's how my Audi was transported when I sold it, and the body kit wouldn't have allowed using the frame tie-downs anyway. I think Porsche and Ferrari both say to not tie down to the frame, instead, use straps through the wheels? Anyone know for sure?

[DRM]

OK, webserver is back up....

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chains_rear1.jpg
I use straps around the axle and then chains crossed in the back. The hanging chain is just the excess held up with a bolt.

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chain_hook_trailerside.jpg
3500lb WLL hooks on the trailer end

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/straps_front2.jpg
And combo axle ratchet straps in the front, also crossed.

My junk doesn't budge at all once tightened down.

The way you have that hooked up it pretty much defeats the purpose of the X pattern. No way I'd strap my rig that way.

[4x4extreme]

The way you have that hooked up it pretty much defeats the purpose of the X pattern. No way I'd strap my rig that way.


I agree

One of the most important things is to strap the outer most part of the axle tube then go to the other side of the trailer

The advantage to the x pattern is to hold the rig from moving side to side and front to back

[4Mogger]

Seems to me strapping down the axles is the most secure (impossible for the vehicle to "hop" because of suspension movement.)
Then a couple of light duty straps run to the sliders to keep the body from bouncing around if you notice that it is prone to do so.
I think the "X" pattern would be the worse placement IF you had a tie down failure. The "starburt" pattern anchored well away from the vehicle (as opposed to straight down) to me makes the most sense.
Also, since I chose a short trailer (14') I run my front axle straps/chain to the rear deck rings and the rear axle straps/chain to the front deck rings. Again, the greater the separation (within reason) the more secure the load. Just my .02:flipoff2:

[4Mogger]

pro car transporters tie down the body because the car is inches away from the trailer structure, not because it is more secure.

[BlueAngel]

I use 5/16" grade 70 chains in the back, 2 straight back from the axle and 2 crossed at the frame, Then, I use 2 10K straps angled on the front diff to pull the jeep forward, finally I hook the winch cable up front to slightly compress the suspension. With practice, it takes me about 15 minutes to load and 10 minutes to unload now :)

[4x4not]

Why is the way I cross my straps "useless"? It puts the straps at almost a 45° angle front to back and side to side. Unless I'm not seeing something here... ??

[4Mogger]

Why is the way I cross my straps "useless"? It puts the straps at almost a 45° angle front to back and side to side. Unless I'm not seeing something here... ??
I wouldn't say useless but not as effective as it could be. Your straps converge at *almost* a single point which minimizes the effect you are attempting to achieve. How well would your rig handle if the rear axle were as wide as the points you are attaching to? What you have going there is close to a "rotisserie" point. In an accident, it is conceivable that it would roll off. But, I have seen a lot worse.

[4Mogger]

Why is the way I cross my straps "useless"? It puts the straps at almost a 45° angle front to back and side to side. Unless I'm not seeing something here... ??

With a shorter trailer, you may even consider running the rear chains to the front axle (as far out as you can, close to the wheels) and the front straps to the rear axle.
Remember that the rear tie points on the trailer will then be controlling the majority of the load (the entire vehicle by the front axle) in a panic stop or a front collision which is the most common accident. In my estimation, this is a good thing.

[4Mogger]

Clusterhook straps rock!:D

You and those clusterhooks!!!:flipoff2:
I really need to get my hands on some to try them out. I have been doing some reading (after you told us about them) and apparently they are also helpful in a situation (recovery) where some bonehead has his new SUV out where he shouldn't and there are no other suitable attachment points from which to pull. Not a great idea, I admit, but if you have no other option then it is good to have these around.
Any other pearls of wisdom for towing noobs like me?

[coyote]

jeesh...I loop the rear and straight strap the front...of course my trailer has pockets designed for the tires so it's centered and captured...I don't go to the body, just the axles...

[4x4not]

OK, I get your point there. I guess I could strap the front to the inner knuckles, but I don't really have a better place in the rear.

[4Mogger]

OK, I get your point there. I guess I could strap the front to the inner knuckles, but I don't really have a better place in the rear.
Even just the front is 1000 X's better. The rear straps then are just preventing movement forward.

[DRM]

With a shorter trailer, you may even consider running the rear chains to the front axle (as far out as you can, close to the wheels) and the front straps to the rear axle.
Remember that the rear tie points on the trailer will then be controlling the majority of the load (the entire vehicle by the front axle) in a panic stop or a front collision which is the most common accident. In my estimation, this is a good thing.

IMHO - the way you strap yours down is even worse. There is no way that method shown in your pic can keep that vehicles secured to the trailer. It may be securing it front to back, but there is no way that method can keep it pulled down ON the trailer, I don't care how tight it is.

In an accident, the front or rear of that vehicle on the trailer would simply lift off the trailer and flip over.

it is basic physics.

[DRM]

Oh, and if you doubt what I am saying, all you have to do is remember one of those jacob's laddar toys you might have had as a child... the concept is shown quite simply with that ;)

http://www.frik-n-frak.com/assets/images/Novelty/jacobs_ladder.gif

[4Mogger]

IMHO - the way you strap yours down is even worse. There is no way that method shown in your pic can keep that vehicles secured to the trailer. It may be securing it front to back, but there is no way that method can keep it pulled down ON the trailer, I don't care how tight it is.

In an accident, the front or rear of that vehicle on the trailer would simply lift off the trailer and flip over.

it is basic physics.

I agree with you. BUT the load is much more likely to see a massive shift forward than a rollover. I can simply run a chain from my bumper recovery points straight down to make it more secure--Which I will do next time.. thanks for the heads up.

[DRM]

I agree with you. BUT the load is much more likely to see a massive shift forward than a rollover. I can simply run a chain from my bumper recovery points straight down to make it more secure--Which I will do next time.. thanks for the heads up.

Yes - with the additional support at both the bumpers going straight down - that looks like a VERY secure method of tying it down.

[4Mogger]

It only hurts the first time you agree with me...

I'd have to say it wasn't really all that bad...:flipoff2:

[n9emz]

You and those clusterhooks!!!:flipoff2:
I really need to get my hands on some to try them out. I have been doing some reading (after you told us about them) and apparently they are also helpful in a situation (recovery) where some bonehead has his new SUV out where he shouldn't and there are no other suitable attachment points from which to pull. Not a great idea, I admit, but if you have no other option then it is good to have these around.
Any other pearls of wisdom for towing noobs like me?

Yeah....if they were fuzzy, warm and well-lubricated, I might hit 'em....they're the ratzass. I was filling in for one of my brother-in-law's drivers while out in CA a few years ago, used a set, and put them on my "to get" list. Took me until last year and I'm stupid for waiting so long. You slip an R or T hook in a vertical frame slot and they won't come out unless you take them out. Straps wear out and when these do, I'll be using the clusters with chains. Get some....you'll be glad you did.:grinpimp:

http://home.bluemarble.net/~n9emz/Miscellaneous/clusterhooks.JPG

BTW....I don't think it makes any difference whether you secure the the axle tubes/wheels or frame....both are secure methods when the attachments are "triangulated." As long as the tires are planted, the body of the rig bouncing doesn't cause me any handling problems with the towrig....I just hate the movement in my rearview and sideview mirrors. It's distracting.

[4Mogger]

What do you think of these?
I have purchased from these guys before and they sell some cool and very unique stuff.
https://www.expeditionexchange.com/recoverygear/

[4Mogger]

have this::grinpimp:

[4Mogger]

and this:
Plus about half the other crap on the recovery list

[4Mogger]

Yeah....if they were fuzzy, warm and well-lubricated, I might hit 'em....they're the ratzass.
http://home.bluemarble.net/~n9emz/Miscellaneous/clusterhooks.JPG


For 20$ a piece, I'll give it a shot:flipoff2:

[n9emz]

Yeah, Mog....that's a good price.:grinpimp:

[MudTJ]

I do mine very simply. 2 chains and one binder. rear chain goes from rear corner of trailer under axletube, over pinion and back under the other axle tube to the other rear corner; I hook it up as tight as i can with the jeep a few inches farther back from where i want it to sit, then pull the jeep up till the chain is tight then run the other chain from front corner of the trailer, over the axle tube to the other front corner with a binder. I guess it doesn't do much for side to side movement but i've never had it shift on me and ive had to do a few hard stops/swerves. Even better is that it takes less than 5 minutes to load and secure.

[saprobe]

Personaly, I'm a fan of chaining the axles, and then strapping the frame to control sway, if needed

thats how i do mine. hook chains around the front axle,pull it tight with chains and binders on the rear axle. single straps front and rear to compress the suspension about halfway. i also leave it in 1st or reverse,in 4wd.

ive never bothered with the X thing cause my rig has never tried to slide wideways off my trailer :p

my frined does the X thing and when i watch him from behind,i can see it moving enuff that the chains get loose as it bounces,even tho hes compressed the suspension,and thinks its tight enuff ;)

ive told him how it looks,but hes stubborn like all the rest of ya that do it that way :flipoff2:

in all fairness both of our rigs are secured to the trailer and neither of us has had one fall off,this is just another one of those things that everyone does their own way cause there are so many ways to skin the cat.

[jpboyjeep]

With a shorter trailer, you may even consider running the rear chains to the front axle (as far out as you can, close to the wheels) and the front straps to the rear axle.
Remember that the rear tie points on the trailer will then be controlling the majority of the load (the entire vehicle by the front axle) in a panic stop or a front collision which is the most common accident. In my estimation, this is a good thing.
http://www.glfwda.org/forums/uploads/1137465266/gallery_25_25_28685.jpg


Searching for brake controllers and came across this pic....that looks VERY scary!!! I'd think the vehicle would "flip" forward in a panic stop, or an accident....? It would want to pivot on the front tires, pushing the rear up in the air because there isn't anything trying to keep the rear DOWN!

??

Lucas

[Old Scout]

What do you think of these?
I have purchased from these guys before and they sell some cool and very unique stuff.
https://www.expeditionexchange.com/recoverygear/
You can save yourself ~25% buy not shopping on a rover site!:flipoff2:
http://www.awdirect.com/awdirect/catalog.cfm?dest=itempg&itemid=10058&secid=89&linkon=subsection&linkid=395

[Travis Waldher]

I run four straps to the end of my leaf springs and cross to the outer edges of my trailer. I will get around to D-Rings on each corner when I redo bumpers.

I can sinch the front end down hard enough to completely compress the suspension. The rear I just sinch down as hard as I can.

I've been towing this way for a long time and have had a couple emergency moves mixed in. My load has NEVER shifted, neither side/side or front/back.

I have tied other rigs by the axles on the same trailer... and while my tow rig never minded the swaying motion of the rig on the trailer. Whenever I looked in the rear-view it creeped me out.

btw - carry spare straps if you use straps. I had one break and ended up having to use my winch cable to tie down the one corner of the rig. Until I could get to the very first store that sold appropriately sized straps. I then payed a premium for that strap. :laughing:

[dieseldave]

around the axle anyway you want, the only way to do it is with unsprung wieght, not to the body or frame, pulling from the back and to the front, this is the way we do our trail rigs and the way PUCO makes us do our bulldozers, back hoes and other equipment

[Travis Waldher]

ahh... but if you can go to the frame and sinch down hard enough to fully compress the suspension, those tie down points essentially are unsprung weight. :flipoff2:

anytime I have seen a bulldozer, backhoe, etc. out here tied down, it was gone to the frame. That includes every pieces of military equipment I've seen on a trailer. ;)

But, this gets in to that age old debate, we all just gotta agree to disagree on. When done right, one is just as safe as the other.

[VerticalTRX]

OK, webserver is back up....

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chains_rear1.jpg
I use straps around the axle and then chains crossed in the back. The hanging chain is just the excess held up with a bolt.

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chain_hook_trailerside.jpg
3500lb WLL hooks on the trailer end

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/straps_front2.jpg
And combo axle ratchet straps in the front, also crossed.

My junk doesn't budge at all once tightened down.

Dude, wtf are you trailering a virtually stock jeep for? :shaking: :laughing:

[woody99]

OK, webserver is back up....

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chains_rear1.jpg
I use straps around the axle and then chains crossed in the back. The hanging chain is just the excess held up with a bolt.

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/chain_hook_trailerside.jpg
3500lb WLL hooks on the trailer end

http://abusiveoffroad.com/storage/images/dodge/trailer/straps_front2.jpg
And combo axle ratchet straps in the front, also crossed.

My junk doesn't budge at all once tightened down.

That is exactly how you should strap your rig down! To the Axle at an X pattern. It won't go sideways and it won't go back and forth but obviously every body has their own opinion... :rolleyes:

[4x4not]

Dude, wtf are you trailering a virtually stock jeep for? :shaking: :laughing:
My junk may not be a half-tube truggy running on 44" boggers, but it gets the job done. I trailer more for the driving comfort and if I break something.

BTW, I see your wheeling rig is a full size on 33x12.5s? My "Stock Junk" would be able to outwheel the crap out of yours. Think before you run your mouth :rolleyes:

[Hyena]

What do you guys think of this way? 1 strap to each corner of the truck around the axles. Truck didn't move at all. flexy suspension and we didn't feel/see any roll at all. I now use a different trailor with tie downs rings on the deck, but this is how i did it a couple times.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v674/Hyena84/bluelakes8-14-04009.jpg

[n9emz]

Looks good to me. Whatever keeps it on the trailer.:D

[ScottFJ40]

I've heard people claim that attaching the straps or chains to the body keeps
the load (vehicle) more stable on the trailer. Well, I have both a SOA CJ7 and
a rock buggy that I have trailered and I always strap them down by the axles.
Both of them are very softly sprung and I don't feel them bouncing around at all.
I've had NO stability problems. It's been a non-issue.
HOLY CRAP, I agree 100% with Gary, I use straps, and go to the axles on my cruiser that's sprung over in the back, and has fox airs on the front,NO problems whatsoever.

[Honkylips]

Dude, wtf are you trailering a virtually stock jeep for? :shaking: :laughing:

I know you think it's cool to try and be all hardcore and bad ass because you're on Pirate4x4 bb, but relax a bit. He trailers his junk because he wants to, and because he can. Why do you give a rats ass?

[ScottFJ40]

IMHO - the way you strap yours down is even worse. There is no way that method shown in your pic can keep that vehicles secured to the trailer. It may be securing it front to back, but there is no way that method can keep it pulled down ON the trailer, I don't care how tight it is.

In an accident, the front or rear of that vehicle on the trailer would simply lift off the trailer and flip over.

it is basic physics.I agree, there is NO way I'd strap my rig down like that. Just by looking at it, I can imagine bad things happening in an accident.

[TNTMUDMAN]

For California this is what it says:

CHAPTER 1. TOWING EQUIPMENT

(3) Any vehicle transported on a slide back carrier or
conventional trailer shall be secured by at least four tiedown
chains, straps, or an equivalent device, independent of the
winch or loading cable.
It is located here: http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vcpdf/vehcode.pdf

I was also told by CHP that a vehicle on a trailer has to be tied down by 4 chains that were crossed as of Jan. 06. I still can not find that in writing though.

[VerticalTRX]

My junk may not be a half-tube truggy running on 44" boggers, but it gets the job done. I trailer more for the driving comfort and if I break something.

BTW, I see your wheeling rig is a full size on 33x12.5s? My "Stock Junk" would be able to outwheel the crap out of yours. Think before you run your mouth :rolleyes:

:laughing:

Tire size means very little to me, the rest of the vehicle setup is what counts. I purposely went with 33's, 1. because the idea was to build a 4x4 sleeper, something that was fairly capable but didn't look it, obviously you would have fallen for it too, and 2. because that’s all that a D44 and 9" will reasonably handle with lockers f/r, 110:1 gearing, and a torquey motor. Oh, and yeah your heep probably would out wheel it right now, considering that I'm still in the process of building the damn thing. :shaking:

[Todd W]

For California this is what it says:

CHAPTER 1. TOWING EQUIPMENT

(3) Any vehicle transported on a slide back carrier or
conventional trailer shall be secured by at least four tiedown
chains, straps, or an equivalent device, independent of the
winch or loading cable.
It is located here: http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vcpdf/vehcode.pdf

I was also told by CHP that a vehicle on a trailer has to be tied down by 4 chains that were crossed as of Jan. 06. I still can not find that in writing though.

I just had the buggy inspected by CHP and I had it on w/straps and got no hassle or even a blink of the eye. A strap in each corner, to each side of the axle (strap almost touches the tires). No x pattern.

My concern with strapping down the body seperatly than the axles is that what if it lets go on a turn and launches it 1ft upwards... may get nasty. I dunno

[Mechanos]

What do you guys think of this way? 1 strap to each corner of the truck around the axles. Truck didn't move at all. flexy suspension and we didn't feel/see any roll at all. I now use a different trailor with tie downs rings on the deck, but this is how i did it a couple times.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v674/Hyena84/bluelakes8-14-04009.jpg
Running the straps over the sharp edge of the trailer like that without using corner guards is hard on the straps and is asking for trouble.

[Hyena]

I only towed it twice like that as my original post says. I now strap it to tie down points (D-rings) on the trailor deck with a different trailor.

[Dhorn33]

At the risk of looking completely retarded...
I only run 2 chains with binders on mine - because that is what the guy who sold me the trailer did and it seemed to work fine. I run one up through a shackle that is in a front receiver and down to each corner of the front of the trailer and the other just goes up and over a receiver hitch on the back and to each rear corner of the trailer. My rig seems to sit very securely on the trailer and although I have not yet had to do an emergency manuver - it seems like both the front and rear receivers are extremely secure and more than adequate. Am I crazy?

[DRM]

To be honest, lately I have one chain that goes over the front axle and attaches to each side of the trailer, near the front, at D rings.

I then drive the vehicle backwards to pull that chain tight, put in gear, and set parking brake.

Then I use one large ratchet strap across the rear axle from one side of the trailer to the other, near the rear, on D rings like the front.

The trail rig never moves at all.

[Campy]

ahh... but if you can go to the frame and sinch down hard enough to fully compress the suspension, those tie down points essentially are unsprung weight. :flipoff2:

anytime I have seen a bulldozer, backhoe, etc. out here tied down, it was gone to the frame. That includes every pieces of military equipment I've seen on a trailer. ;)

But, this gets in to that age old debate, we all just gotta agree to disagree on. When done right, one is just as safe as the other.

I can't tell you the last time I saw a bulldozer, back hoe w/ springs:eek: :flipoff2: When I strapped the HMMWV's in the Army, it's ran that way because there is no where near the spring flex that most of us SHOULD have in our rigs.:grinpimp:

I agree with strapping the axle in a x style. But, it does seem worth the extra minute to strap the body off as well to prevent sway.:D

[Wes in TN]

To be honest, lately I have one chain that goes over the front axle and attaches to each side of the trailer, near the front, at D rings.

I then drive the vehicle backwards to pull that chain tight, put in gear, and set parking brake.

Then I use one large ratchet strap across the rear axle from one side of the trailer to the other, near the rear, on D rings like the front.

The trail rig never moves at all.

That's exactly how I do it except I use straps front and back. I plan on switching to chains and binders f/r rear soon though.

[Travis Waldher]

I can't tell you the last time I saw a bulldozer, back hoe w/ springs:eek: :flipoff2: When I strapped the HMMWV's in the Army, it's ran that way because there is no where near the spring flex that most of us SHOULD have in our rigs.:grinpimp:

I agree with strapping the axle in a x style. But, it does seem worth the extra minute to strap the body off as well to prevent sway.:D

Well, woulda been more accurate to say that I've only seen equipment tied down by the chassis (not the axle or whatever). With one exception. Tracked vehicles get tied down by their tracks.

Hey... I have the spring flex I should, it's just that it's almost all droop. :flipoff2:

[ScottFJ40]

To be honest, lately I have one chain that goes over the front axle and attaches to each side of the trailer, near the front, at D rings.

I then drive the vehicle backwards to pull that chain tight, put in gear, and set parking brake.

Then I use one large ratchet strap across the rear axle from one side of the trailer to the other, near the rear, on D rings like the front.

The trail rig never moves at all.
This might be a big "IF", but if the chain breaks, you have nothing holding the rig from that end. That could be scary, especially from the rear.

[ScottFJ40]

Hey... I have the spring flex I should, it's just that it's almost all droop. :flipoff2:
Amen to that, droop bias is where it's at.

[Travis Waldher]

This might be a big "IF", but if the chain breaks, you have nothing holding the rig from that end. That could be scary, especially from the rear.

I've seen that happen before. Actually i was riding in the truck. We came to a stop, listening to KKKSSSHHHHRRRR!!!!!

We got out of the truck, saw the ass end of the truck on the ground, thought SHIT! the leaf springs broke! then looked up and realized the jeep was MUCH closer to the truck than it shouldn't have been. another 2' and it would have been in the bed. :eek:

[Oxjockey]

I generally X the rear around the pumpkin, X the front if I can, outside the leaves on the axle, but ALWAYs use a 5th strap on the frame to keep the front suspension compressed.

[bigassjeep4u]

I have a fairly heavy jeep see sig.... and I have always used 4 straps- 2 x'd on each axle and have not ever had any problems even going cross country on some pretty rough roads. But my buddy had his yota strapped to the frame and the front strap broke when we hit a big dip in the road due to the rebound of the susp. So i say go to the axle.

[Wildcat455]

For the most part, you guys beat this to death with how to tie a vehicle down. Not that it matters, but I tie off using crossed chains at each corner of the vehicle chassis, to each corner of the trailer, with the rear chains angled back and the front chains angled forward. I use Chain binders, and wire them shut for safety. (There's a hole for it in my set.)

But I didn't really reply to talk about that. I wanted to bring the frame/axle debate into focus.

The "Tie off to the frame" or "Tie off to the axles" may best be answered by springs.

If your trailer has springs, you "Should" tie off to the frame or chassis of the towed vehicle.

If your trailer is a solid axle mount, you "May" tie off to the axles.

From my understanding, this is why:

If you do not seek to isolate your vehicle's suspension while transporting it on a trailer with springs, oscillations between the trailer springs and your load vehicle springs "May" occur, which could introduce some "Interesting" handling characteristics. These "Handling Characteristics" may not be evident during "Normal" driving, but, may in fact show up at the most inopportune time, like during an evasive manuever.

If your trailer has no springs (Solid axle mount) tie off to the axle may be an acceptable way to "Suspend" the vehicle load, and reduce shock introduced to the towed vehicle. Frame tie off is still probably OK, since tires and remaining suspension travel can help suspend the load.

The only real consideration here is you don't want something so rigid as to introduce trailer hop or bounce, which, again probably wont happen during "Normal" driving, but May happen during an evasive manuever.


In closing, you decide what's safest for you, and hopefully, a court will find your solution to be safe, if something were to go terribly wrong and someone got hurt or died.

[DRM]

This might be a big "IF", but if the chain breaks, you have nothing holding the rig from that end. That could be scary, especially from the rear.

Yep, no different than any other tie-down method that restrains the vehicle by putting tension on the vehicle *outwards* at the ends.

The vehicle is in gear, 4wd, Tcase parking brake set (all 4 tires). I can also see where the chain and strap are attached on my side - and if they are slack or missing.

Remember, rollbacks tow with just a winch cable up front, and a T chain in the rear...

[randii]

Remember, rollbacks tow with just a winch cable up front, and a T chain in the rear...
IMHO, chains are less likely to fail than straps. I'd rather have chains in back and straps in front (if I had to use both). I'm more likely (and capable) of slowing quickly than accelerating quickly!

Randii

[johnny_boy02]

Stupid question time. How does a chain "binder" work? Anyone have a picture of one in use so I can see it. I know the basic idea, just never seen one up close.

[Oxjockey]

Stupid question time. How does a chain "binder" work? Anyone have a picture of one in use so I can see it. I know the basic idea, just never seen one up close.

It basically takes two lengths of chain at a certain distance and "folds over" on it self and locks in this position - creating a shorter distance and tension on the chain. Watch your fingers, when it starts to get all the way folded over it could snap into the closed or locked position.

[ScottFJ40]

Yep, no different than any other tie-down method that restrains the vehicle by putting tension on the vehicle *outwards* at the ends.

The vehicle is in gear, 4wd, Tcase parking brake set (all 4 tires). I can also see where the chain and strap are attached on my side - and if they are slack or missing.

Remember, rollbacks tow with just a winch cable up front, and a T chain in the rear...
Yes, but if your strap in the rear brakes upon a sudden stop, your load could end up in the back of your head. At least with 2 straps you would have some redundancy in that scenario.

[sbrem]

It basically takes two lengths of chain at a certain distance and "folds over" on it self and locks in this position - creating a shorter distance and tension on the chain. Watch your fingers, when it starts to get all the way folded over it could snap into the closed or locked position.


There is also the type of chain binder that ratchets. Much safer then the fold over kind, IMO.

[DRM]

Yes, but if your strap in the rear brakes upon a sudden stop, your load could end up in the back of your head. At least with 2 straps you would have some redundancy in that scenario.

Actually, if the strap in the rear broke it would only move forward a few feet - because the front chain would still be attached to over the axle and to the trailer. And again - it would literally have to *fly*, because 4 16" wide swampers locked solid don't skid too well :p

But even with "X" or crossed straps, and you lose one in the rear - the vehicle is NOT secured very well in a panic stop there either - if there is enough force in your scenerio to throw the vehicle forward, then the crossed straps will just let the vehicle go forward and off to one side - possibly causing a worse situation with the vehicle half off the trailer.

I understand your point about redundancy... but 2 straps are not necessarily better than one - it all depends on how they are hooked up.


I guess if I wanted to, I could attach an eye in the middle of the trailer, attach a pulley, and run the trailer winch to the pulley then up to the belly pan. Seems like an easy enough "safety" feature for a little extra security, and not too hard to hook up.

[DRM]

IMHO, chains are less likely to fail than straps.

Nonsense. All things equal - both are just as strong. Either can be worn/damaged and fail. Both have their flaws.

Considering chains less likely to fail than straps is a logic jump - you *think* it should be that way, so it *must be*.

not buying it :p

[CanuckJeeper]

Here's a picture of both types:

http://www.res-q-jack.com/aaabinders.jpg

Top one is a ratcheting type - two screws with reverse thread pull in (or push out) the hooks as racheting is applied

Bottom type is locking or clamping type. You pull the lever (in this case, from left to right) to tighten the chain ends, and the lever locks into place.

Personally I like the ratcheting type as it has a finer level of adjustment, whereas the bottom one can only be adjusted by moving the hooks one link at a time on the chain.

JP

Stupid question time. How does a chain "binder" work? Anyone have a picture of one in use so I can see it. I know the basic idea, just never seen one up close.

[ChiXJeff]

Nonsense. All things equal - both are just as strong. Either can be worn/damaged and fail. Both have their flaws.

Considering chains less likely to fail than straps is a logic jump - you *think* it should be that way, so it *must be*.

not buying it :p

David, David, David....... THINK about what you just spouted.

Straps are susceptible to chafing and edges to a MUCH higher degree than chains. Sand and grit aren't a problem with chains while it will cause trouble with straps.

Yeah, I know. Chains rust. Chains stretch. But they ignore their environment a lot more than straps.

[sbrem]

Here's a picture of both types:

http://www.res-q-jack.com/aaabinders.jpg

Bottom type is locking or clamping type. You pull the lever (in this case, from left to right) to tighten the chain ends, and the lever locks into place.



JP

There are also locking type binders that have a spring on them as well. They work better then the ones without the spring. But I agree with you 100% that the ratchet type is best.

[ScaldedDog]

And again - it would literally have to *fly*, because 4 16" wide swampers locked solid don't skid too well :p

As I demonstrated to myself, while towing my 4Runner in our neighborhood at <20mph but unstrapped, this isn't true. The 4500lb on cut MTR's - ebrake on, hubs locked, 1st gear, dual transfer case in double low - slid a foot and half with no trouble, and only stopped because it hit the rail of the trailer. Nothing special about my trailer, either, just a plain ol' wooden deck PJ.

Perhaps because of lessons I've learned from work, I believe in two of everything. Two straps on each axle, cranked tight. A safety chain on each end: The rear one wrapped around the bumper and tied to a different point on the trailer than the straps. The one in front wrapped around the bumper and trailer tongue. I don't keep the chains really tight, as they are just there to keep the rig and trailer assembly together if I wad the thing up in the median.

As with most things, IMHO, it's better to have 'em and not need 'em, than to need 'em and not have 'em.

Mark

[Travis Waldher]

David, David, David....... THINK about what you just spouted.

Straps are susceptible to chafing and edges to a MUCH higher degree than chains. Sand and grit aren't a problem with chains while it will cause trouble with straps.

Yeah, I know. Chains rust. Chains stretch. But they ignore their environment a lot more than straps.

True, straps will wear out faster than chain. won't argue that fact. It just means you may have to replace your straps more often. It's just a maintenance item.

I prefer straps over chain for their weight and flexibility. If I run in to a spot where I have to run a strap over a sharp edge, I'll use chain of course.

[johnny_boy02]

I see it now, thanks guys.

[randii]

Nonsense. All things equal - both are just as strong. Either can be worn/damaged and fail. Both have their flaws.
Considering chains less likely to fail than straps is a logic jump - you *think* it should be that way, so it *must be*.
not buying it :p
Sense. :rolleyes: I stated my opinion, after qualifying it as such. You responded with a general rejection, a generalization of strength, and a dismissal of my logic. Do you have specific concerns for the 'flaws of each,' as they relate to strength or failure?

Examples of specifics that relate to strength and failure of chain/straps:
* chains degrade slower when subjected to abrasion
* chains degrade slower when tensioned across sharp edges
* chains degrade slower when subjected to particulate wear
* chains degrade slower in extremes of temperature
* chains are more resistant to strong acids/bases/solvents
* straps are more resistant to oxidation, absent strong acids/bases/solvents
* chains are easier to clean and maintain
I'm open to being made aware of other strengths of straps or weaknesses of chains. FWIW, I'm open to changing my habits, as well.

Convenience of use doesn't relate well to strength. FWIW, I run appropriately-rated straps up front for convenience, and chains in the rear for better resistance to failure.

Randii

[BigWhiteStroke]

I can tell you one thing - if you lose one strap or chain while crossing them you pretty much just defeated the entire system. At least if you tie down in a "burst" pattern and lose one of the 4 corners, you still have the opposing corner on the other end to keep things relatively snug.


Amen...

[rotozuk]

Call me silly but I run a single strap over the centered rear pumkin, then a strap front and rear off the body to pull the suspension down. But then again I have a special trailer. :)

-Wayne

[hotwheelsYJ]

Call me silly but I run a single strap over the centered rear pumkin, then a strap front and rear off the body to pull the suspension down. But then again I have a special trailer. :)

-Wayne
With as tight as your buggy fits your trailer I still think you could just weld on some brackets and make disco pins from the trailer to the buggy around the wheelwell/rocker area.:smokin:

[randii]

Silly. :flipoff2: