I have a Toy that I was wanting to put 404's and 42's or 44's on but I heard that they may not stand up to a tire that big. How true is this? I don't want to put the axles under my truck if they won't handle the tires. I'm still running the 22r/propane and don't have any v-8 plans. What do ya'll think?
Thanks
Kane Smith

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=430500

EB with 49's and 404 axles.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=246869&highlight=404%2A

Toy truggy.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=339084&highlight=404%2A

Another toy

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=392613&highlight=404%2A

Basic info.

Thats not a very good example really.

Both Puffdragon and I have broken the gears in the portal boxes on our 404 axles. I run 42's with 150hp/250ft/lbs diesel with about 200:1 redux. Puff is running 39.5's with a mildly modded mog 6. Both of us hammer it HARD. Mine broke whilst bouncing around trying to get up Nemesis 3 in Cruces. Puff broke his on a nice ledge in Socorro hitting it moderatly hard. My break fractured the portal case, Puff's didn't. With both breaks we pulled the axle shaft and drove the trucks out.

Bill

404's will be plenty strong for you in almsot any situation. That being said, I jsut had to order a new gear set for my right rear portal due to a slight case of being broken.

404's strong? yes
404's strong enough for 42's? yes
404's Unbreakable? NO!!

I would not hesitate to put 404's in a rec wheeler. I might think twice on a comp truck, but Im not sure.

As with any axle, the aftermarket eventually addresses every weakness and Mog 404's are no different (although it has taken awhile.)

Axle shafts and recently the portal boxes have become available--although both are pricey.

Your Toyota 4 cyl would sure love the 7.56 final ratio--especially with 42 or 44's. Go with the 404's and IF you break something then upgrade at that time.

After recent developments, I dont think anyone has addresed the 404's weakness. Shafts as far as i know have never been a problem, the diffs are pretty much bullet proof minus a few locker issues, and the portal cases are at minumum strong enough to break gears without breaking the case. I jsut dont know. I thought it was all about the cases, but now I am having my doubts. I am thinking about cryo work or something of the like on the portal gears.

I cryoed some for a comp rig and we didn't feel it was worth much. The cast gear still breaks but that was the only thing so some results there, no box breakeage. I think they were 404's but not that up on my mog stuff.

I assumed as much.

although, I am pretty sure their are no cast gears in the portals. They are all forged.

Frankrover-That was my very nice way of saying, the info is here get off your ass and search. Took me about 30 seconds to find those examples of 404 uses. To find how strong they really are you would need to find out the success of each rig from the owners. I just don't like coming off as being an e-tough guy. Its more fun to do it in real life:flipoff2: . By the way your rig is f-ing awesome, its my favorite here on the board.

Helical gears as used on the 404,s are theoretically stronger than straight cuts, but later mogs use straight cuts. Anyone know why? Any company make stronger helicals or straight cuts for 404 portals. I believe there is a company that makes stronger gears for the much rarer Volvo portals, so why not for the much more popular and numerous 404 Mogs?
Bill.

I've been competing (UROC, CALROCS etc)on narrowed 404's (Rear steering)since 2002. That would be 2:28 to 1. water in both front tires, LC Racing motor, rolled over probably 30x's at almost every angle. Only problem was a broken horse collar. I switched to MOG/9's last season and had issues with 9" housing but nothing MOG. If you think MOG's arn't strong enough for everything your going to be doing, you are crazy. Everything breaks eventually. However, the MOG's break less and in less situations. Keep in mind most (however rare) box failures occures in the rear and without a steering axle.

Frankrover-That was my very nice way of saying, the info is here get off your ass and search. Took me about 30 seconds to find those examples of 404 uses. To find how strong they really are you would need to find out the success of each rig from the owners. I just don't like coming off as being an e-tough guy. Its more fun to do it in real life:flipoff2: . By the way your rig is f-ing awesome, its my favorite here on the board.

No worries man. There was only one or two links on yours when i posted mine. So I thought (in error) you were giving an example of that rig on Big tires only.

My bad. Thanks for the compliment.

Bill

Strange Rover on here has a comp Land Rover with 404s and 44's, a Ford V8, and F truck box and transfer. Afaik he had a very good run out of the axles for a few years, until he converted to rear-steer. He has AFAIK now broken a couple of boxes/gears in the rear. It is a comp truck and gets driven HARD - usually by people who don't own it.

http://tuffevents.com/albums/23-Haultech/MogRover.sized.jpg

Nice truck, I thought you said COMP truck! I havn't seen swampers in a competition in a couple of years:flipoff2:

My truck is heavy (5000lbs), has a 475ft/lb-406 SBC, 226:1 crawl (when it had the NV4500). I've run 39.5 Boggers, 44 TSL's, 46 Claws, 44 Boggers and 42 Iroks on it with no issues...well, I broke a front axle shaft but it was narrowed by a cut and weld, it broke right on the weld. I have competed in several events (we don't have much rock around here) and the truck has been beaten on. I have no worries about strenght. Don't drive like an asshole and you should be fine:flipoff2:

BigToy, that has to be the baddest Toyota I've ever seen. Wanna sell it?

That Toyota is f-ing sweet.:smokin: Is there a build up thread here on pirate?

I assumed as much.

although, I am pretty sure their are no cast gears in the portals. They are all forged.

Im sure. Bad choice of words on my part, but you know what gear I am speaking of.

BigToy, that has to be the baddest Toyota I've ever seen. Wanna sell it?

What are you offering?:cool2:

Nice truck, I thought you said COMP truck! I havn't seen swampers in a competition in a couple of years:flipoff2:

Not in Australia. It has won almost every comp it has been in.

didin't sams mogrover have 46 mickey tompson's at we rock?????????

That Toyota is f-ing sweet.:smokin: Is there a build up thread here on pirate?
Are you serious? As a matter of fact, there is...
Big Toy Freak ('nuf said!)
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=246869

I've run 39.5 Boggers, 44 TSL's, 46 Claws, 44 Boggers and 42 Iroks
And that was all in the space of just a few months if I remember correctly.:flipoff2:

didin't sams mogrover have 46 mickey tompson's at we rock?????????

I think you are right serg - I remember hearing something about that (lost touch a bit over here).

I think it still had the 44's on when it won woodpecker - and even when it competed in TT.

When I designed and built my portal boxes for my Rover axles I chose to support the gears on taper roller bearings. Because I am paranoid about the possibility of breaking gears I pull them down regularly to check bearing preloads etc and am surprised at how much the bearings settle in, and I use straight cut gears. I believe the helical gears on 404,s would cause the bearings to wear more quickly than straight cuts.A slight amount of wear in a pair of taper rollers will allow quite a lot of gear deflection so I am considering replacing them with parrallel rollers or ball bearings which would have to be totally screwed to permit any real gear deflection.
PuffDragon has mentioned the importance of setup on other threads on this subject and I agree 100%. I wonder how many people just buy a pair of 40 year old 404 axles and just throw them under their rigs without first stripping them down and checking setup. I suspect a lot of those portals are as sloppy as a very sloppy thing which may account for some of the breakages.
Bill.