I have broke both inner and outer axles several times. The truck is a 86 chevy 1/2 ton. Engine is a 383 smallblock with dart heads.Trans is a 4speed manual with the granny low.Transfer case is a 208.Both ends have spools and 4.56 gears.The 12bolt rear does real well no problems as of yet.Running 39.5 TSL Swampers. Is their any axles out there that will live in this 10bolt front?:confused:

10 bolt+spool+39.5 tsl's=bad news no matter what you do. you can get alloy shafts that woll take a bit more abuse but they will eventualy break depending on the type of wheeling you do. everyone will tell you do get a 60 but the more you progerss you will eventually break shafts and joints in it also. yukon, superior, warn and alot of other companies make stronger shafts for your 10 bolt tho so good luck:D . oh yea be prepared to get flamed

I was thinking about changing to an automatic and a 205 case.Do yall think this would be easier on the front axles? I mostly play in the mud and some light climbing,But I do have a bad habit of using the loud pedal.:D

10bolts with that combo is bad, like rcks4me said. And even worse if you are doing mud boggin. I have a 86 CJ7 w/ SBC 350 pushing 400 ponies, 4.11s, Lok-Rights, 36x12.50 tsl, TH350, Atlas II 3.8, 10bolt front, 14 rear. (Hmmm wonder if I will get flamed for being a jeeper posting on the Chevy boards :evil: )

I fortunatly don't use the skinny pedal like my friend does at the moment due to having only a 10bolt. Really 36s are the limit for them if you wheel hard or do mud boggin. I am going to try and get a set of Warn cromoly and ctm u-joints then send them out and get cryoed. It costs like 300 or so. I have heard mixed reviews on it so this will be interesting. I have a D60 sitting around in case the cryo is bs. D60s would be the prime choice for that application. But get cro-moly, or carry around spare stock shafts. As rcks4me said the harder you wheel the more chance you will break even D60s and mud does not play well with drivetrain components.

Cheers,
Lee

We dont run any mud bog races or anything like that,We just like to find the holes everybody is having trouble getting thru and HIT IT!! Do yall think the warn shafts are worth the money?

You can try, but will probably just last a little longer than stock. Best bet either D60 or drop tire size.

Cheers,
Lee

one thing i have found that makes a stock shaft last a little longer is welding the caps in, my theory is it makes the ears more like 1 solid piece rather than a thin band wraped around a cap.

Switching to a 205 might help because of the difference in low range ratios (I assume you are running low range). 205 is something like 1.98:1 and 208 is something like 2.8:1. An auto might help too, but it depends on what gear your are breaking in.

Of course, that depends on what and how you wheel.

Personally, I would go to a D60. You can probably find one with the gears you are running now for not much more than it would cost to go to alloy shafts.

the one thing that is going to help is the automatic tranny, its alot easier in the preasure aplication department, it doesnt shock load the shafts as much.

you have a big problem here, beef up or unbuild the truck. youve got a great motor, great tranny, mild tcase, big tires and axles that are just piss weak.

you can swap the big agressive tires smaller street type[ta's mt's]

you can pull the motor for less power but that wont releave the stress of the tires

you can lose the spools and go back to opens, wont force the shafts

or find a d60.

nobody wants a weaker, slower, less reliable truck so your choice should be clear.

There is no way you're gonna get a 10 bolt to live with 40" tires no matter what you do. Even with cro-mo's and CTM's the thing is good to 37's max. Welded stock shafts won't even stand up to 35's... and those figures are with a locker instead of a spool in the front axle.

The biggest issue is the spool. You're placing ridiculous force on those front axleshafts when you steer on any hard surface. The weight of the truck and the grip of those huge tires, combined with the fact that you're making the outer axle drag to follow the shorter line the inner tire is taking, makes for instant breakage.

But all this aside, 40" tires require a D60. Even with the 60 and stock 35 spline outers, you'd still break stuff with the spool up front. The only way you could make it live with tires that large and the spool are alloy shafts & ctm's.

What you need to do is save your cash for a D60 front, put a detroit in it, and upgrade the stubs to 35 spline. That should be a reliable combination in the mud. If you manage to break the stock shafts & joints, you can step up to the good stuff, but I'd try the stockers first and see how they work for you.

Throwing money at the stock front axle is worthless for what you're doing.

I know this axle is bad weak,but I really dont have the money to swap to a 60. Does anybody have any 28spline inner shafts they want to get rid of cheap?

I probably have a few of those axles lying around, because my buddy runs them in his blazer on 35's and snaps one pretty much every time he goes out. Do you need the long side or the short side? Either way they're just junkyard pullouts with the inner, u-joint, & stub already attached. Some of the stubs are machined for outer snap rings, some for inner. I doubt you want me to ship one all the way to alabama, but if you really can't find one closer let me know.

The one thing you can do to get a bit more life out of the stock shafts is to weld the caps of the u-joints into the axles with 4 small welds each. You'll have to grind the welds to get the shafts to fit through the spindle bores in the knuckles, but if done properly the shaft will now break at the neckdown before the u-joint lets loose.

I was thinking about changing to an automatic and a 205 case.Do yall think this would be easier on the front axles? I mostly play in the mud and some light climbing,But I do have a bad habit of using the loud pedal.:D

Woah, woah, woah. :barf: :shaking: Did you just say you want to change to an auto? What is wrong with you? Are you retarded? Sticks are by far better than any slush box out there. Autos suck donkey dick. I have the same trans with the low granny gear. The trans you have is bullitt proof, if you don't like doing the 3 footed shuffle then install a hand throttle.
With mud you just mash the thottle anyway. :D

No Im not retarded Im just lazy.:D I was thinking an automatic would be easier on parts and on my wallet.

Read,

The auto will help a little to cushion the blows to the shafts, and the 205's higher low range will help a bit as well to keep the torque multiplied load down on the axles... but none of it is enough to keep the front end together with 40" tall tires.

As for the auto "sucking donkey dick".... me and 95% of the rest of the guys who compete have been using them for years, and I'd never use anything else. Trying to rock crawl with a stick in hairy technical situations is a major pain in the ass... not to mention the fact that you need ridiculous low range to make it possible at all. With that super low range, when you hit the gas, you get no wheelspeed. The motor's at 5 grand and your tires are turning 3 mph - that dosen't work in this day and age of big vertical obstacles.

If you keep the tranny cool with a decent cooler it will be fine. 99% of auto tranny failures are due to heat. You can get a better lauch by going to a higher stall speed converter, and with a manual valve body you can select gears like a stick, but without having to clutch. You can also jam it quickly into reverse if the truck starts to go over backwards to pull out of a roll. Finally, most of the parts of the auto that tend to function incorrectly in extreme situations are eliminated when you go to a full manual valve body. The auto trans becomes a pretty simple device at that point.

But then again, me and the rest of the competitive rockcrawling world must not have a clue. :shaking:

I know an automatic is the way to go. I have been rebuilding automatic transmissions since the mid 80s. I may have a Dana 60 rounded up for both ends of this thing.Are their any problems swaping these axles from a Dodge to my Chevy?

correct me if im wrong but wouldnt mud be easier on the truck verses rocks? becasue on rocks sometimes you get sudden traction which in tern puts alot of stress on the axle. i agree with these other users, save for a dana 60. me right now i have a 10 bolt front and i plan to have 38's or 39.5's. yes i know it is bad but i will leave it open and be easy on the pedal. plus dana 60's are rare and expensive around these parts more than others.

Well, regarding front axle breakage - we break stock welded 1/2 ton front axleshafts with 31's or 33's if it's locked. Mud, rocks, dosen't matter. Anytime there's a shock load, they take a crap. I have a buddy with 35's on the front of his blazer and he breaks a stock shaft pretty much every time he goes out. Even stock D60 30 spline outers aren't up to much bigger than 35's with a locker and serious use. (they aren't much bigger diameter than a D44 stub).

You are correct that it's hard to break stuff with an open diff. This is because if there's a shock load sent to one tire.. the diff will just direct all the power to the opposite tire. Unfortunately without a front locker you're not gonna get very far in serious off-road situations. In my opinion, the only people who will say they don't need a front locker are the guys who have never wheeled a truck with one. Once you are locked & locked, you never go back to open diffs again.

That said, I'd take a fully locked vehicle on 33's over an open diff'd vehicle on 40's any day of the week. I promise you the small tired locker-equipped truck will go places with ease that the open diff'd truck with big rubber wouldn't even think about going. You really have to experience the difference the lockers make firsthand.

right now i am running a d 60 with a detroit and 35 spline yukons. I have 44's, 383 sb with about 450 hp and 460 ft lbs. i use it mostly in the mud and i have not had any problems, and i hammer my rig pretty good. I think running a spool in the front of you 10 bolt is just to agressive, i fyour going ot keep your 10 bolt and your tire size, i would upgrade to the alloy 4340 axles and either leave it open or go with a limited slip so there is some play in your axle. Just a thought

so you got 40s and a 10 bolt and you wanna keep it together.

how much does your truck weigh now? (6000+ lb?)
get your trucks weight under 2700 lbs. that should make things work better.

how much does your truck weigh now? (6000+ lb?)
get your trucks weight under 2700 lbs.
A full size Chevy under 2700 lbs :shaking:

You better go back to the Sammy forum and play with your go carts :laughing: :flipoff2:

Do it right the first time-dana 60...

i second that, d 60 is the only way to go

As mentioned several times you will just be throwing money away if you upgrade to chromoly shafts in the front 10-bolt. Keep in mind that if you put chromoly axleshafts in the 10-bolt than you should also pony up the money to buy some sort of high strength u-joint (like CTM).........but you then have about the same money invested as getting a front D60.

When I used to run a front 10-bolt with 35's and a limited slip diff I always broke the front axle u-joints, which then wiped out the axleshafts.

The biggest issue is the spool. You're placing ridiculous force on those front axleshafts when you steer on any hard surface. The weight of the truck and the grip of those huge tires, combined with the fact that you're making the outer axle drag to follow the shorter line the inner tire is taking, makes for instant breakage.



I agree with most of your points, but the above paragraph is a bunch of crap. A spool should not be any harder on the parts than any true locker. There should never be enough stress on the front axle when simply turning on hard ground to break something (assuming everything is in good shape), plus if you are basically applying any throttle input a front locker would be engaged anyway. There is also a ton more stress on front axle parts when they are actually being used hard on the trail.........like if you are spinning the tires trying to climb a rock face and they are bouncing around. Again, that's tons more stress than simply turning on flat ground.

Going locker over the spool will be a cheap way to make the axles last a little longer. Yes, you should upgrade to a D60. You probably need time to save money for that. My son runs 37s with a lockrite on his 10 bolt and has broken an axle with a very tired 307. A few spare axles are cheaper than a D60 replacement. 50.00 a set is what we normally pay, tops. We just put a 400 in his truck and are upgrading hie 14ff to disc. He will soon be breaking axles every time he goes out.

Going locker over the spool will be a cheap way to make the axles last a little longer. Yes, you should upgrade to a D60. You probably need time to save money for that. My son runs 37s with a lockrite on his 10 bolt and has broken an axle with a very tired 307. A few spare axles are cheaper than a D60 replacement. 50.00 a set is what we normally pay, tops. We just put a 400 in his truck and are upgrading hie 14ff to disc. He will soon be breaking axles every time he goes out.


A few spare axles are cheaper for how long? If you break 1 axle every time you go out how much does it cost you in the long run? Not to mention the amount of time you spend replacing the broken axle rather than wheeling!

I would run a 10blt open until I have scraped the money for a D60 togeather. I don't do like my dad and pay out the ass for quick fixes that I have to fix when I can pay the price one time and not have to deal with it again...

This thread has gone on too long. With the hp and tires you have you only have one option. Run the 10bolt open until you can afford a D60

Woah, woah, woah. :barf: :shaking: Did you just say you want to change to an auto? What is wrong with you? Are you retarded? Sticks are by far better than any slush box out there. Autos suck donkey dick. I have the same trans with the low granny gear. The trans you have is bullitt proof, if you don't like doing the 3 footed shuffle then install a hand throttle.
With mud you just mash the thottle anyway. :D

I see that you don't run mud very often! A stick is the LAST thing you want for mud running, unless you never plan on getting the clutch wet.:shaking:

Going locker over the spool will be a cheap way to make the axles last a little longer. Yes, you should upgrade to a D60. You probably need time to save money for that. My son runs 37s with a lockrite on his 10 bolt and has broken an axle with a very tired 307. A few spare axles are cheaper than a D60 replacement. 50.00 a set is what we normally pay, tops. We just put a 400 in his truck and are upgrading hie 14ff to disc. He will soon be breaking axles every time he goes out.

How much does it cost in your time to keep replacing-or when you can only get out to wheel 5 weekends a year-and you have to light pedal that one obstacle you would really like to hit? I am not knowcking the 10 bolt-I ran (and broke them) before my upgrades-but hindsite-I would have bit the bullet and dumped in at least a stock Dana 60 front. Just trying to give some advice out to a guy that in the same situation I was 5 years ago. Buy an extra set of shafts and save your pennies and start hunting for the Dana 60-yesterday.

just put rockwells under it front and rear and be done with it