Calling it the warranty build to try to rationalize the work I'm doing to my 03 TJ even though it's not paid for yet. Figure if Jeep would do it right the first time I would already have what I want. So that makes all this warranty work.

Bought it brand new a year and a half ago and started like most do with a small lift. Then it just snowballed. Went 32's first. Then 35's on stock drivetrain. Destroyed my Dana 35 first trip out (no surprise I know :flipoff2: ) So I put in a 9" with custom 3 links front and rear and moved up to 36's.

Couple pics of last year on the 36's

http://i2.tinypic.com/rb9tup.jpg
http://i2.tinypic.com/rb9tz7.jpg

So the list for this year includes....

Dana 60's front and rear
Disc brake conversions
Flipped Dana300
42's
Another set of beadlocks
Coilovers
4 link rear
3 link with panhard front
Tube fenders front and rear
Relocate gas tank
Full cage
Snorkel

Started with the beadlocks. Got a set of 8 bolt rims from a local shop (Rocky Mtn Offroad). Picked up some 1/4" steel and had some rings cut. Last year I cut my own rings (pics above). This year I wanted more than just circles so I had them cut by a friend with a CNC Plasma. The shape is basically like Wold359's. First time I saw them in person on his new buggy I thought they were perfect.

Inner Ring welded onto rim
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1apd.jpg




Torquing fawking bolts for hours :mad3:
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1ati.jpg




Finished result was well worth the effort. 42" TSL mounted up
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1aw3.jpg

It's an 03 and you have not cut the ass end out or flat fendered it yet? :flipoff2:

Next I started on the rear suspension.

Housing stripped bare
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1b12.jpg




Truss finished.
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1vld.jpg




Another
http://i2.tinypic.com/qz1vrl.jpg


Wanted to make the uppers adjustable on the axle. In fact I actually made it that way first. But when I slid it under the jeep to find angles it didn't leave enough clearance to the floor for any uptravel. Decided that the low center of gravity was more important than the extra adjustabiliy. Will make lots of options at the frame end instead.

I have lots more pics of everything if anyone wants to see anything specific. Just posting the highlights.

Have the frame mounts and arms built for the rear. Just need to tap the arms for the new 1.25" heims. Waiting on a drill bit for that.

No pics with me tonight though.

It's an 03 and you have not cut the ass end out or flat fendered it yet? :flipoff2:


To be honest I rather like the fendered look of them. But it just doesn't give me clearance for the 42's. I plan to sqeeze the 42's under without lifting it any further than it was with the 36's.

Plus I want to stretch the wheelbase so the sheetmetal is gonna go. Nothing really extreme. But enough for close to 0 deg aproach and departure angles.

That truss/bridge is big, heavy and fugly. I love it! Diggin' the jackstands as well.

hawtness. . .
you gonna stroke it out, when you get 42s on?

I would weld that truss in more than two locations. Those welds don't have much surface area, and only really help with lateral forces. Perhaps you could integrate it into the diff bolts like the BTF truss.

Love to stroke it but not this year. Maybe a supercharger next though. :smokin:


The tab on the back of the truss in the first pic ties to the dif cover like the blue torch ones. Where it mounts to the tubes is welded inside and out on both sides of the truss, with good penetration. Do you think it still needs more than that? Not being an ass. Opinions like this are of value to me. :cool2:

The tab on the back of the truss in the first pic ties to the dif cover like the blue torch ones. Where it mounts to the tubes is welded inside and out on both sides of the truss, with good penetration. Do you think it still needs more than that? Not being an ass. Opinions like this are of value to me. :cool2:


I thought this was how the blue torch ones are done. Just the welds on the tube in 2 spots and the bolts to the cover. Is that right or wrong?

I think the blue torch one also ties into the diff cover,
I like the build, keep the pics coming

EDIT:
yep, it ties into the diff cover, heres the link
http://www.bluetorchfab.com/oscomm/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=121&products_id=388

What was the lift you ran with the 36s?

Optical illusion or is there some serious coning going on with those rings?

Optical illusion or is there some serious coning going on with those rings?


You're right Joey. Plenty of coning from torquing the bolts. Probably could have stayed 10lbs less on them. From everything I've read it doesn't effect performance or safety at all. Last years had no problems. Nylock nuts can't back out anyway so it's just cosmetic. And to be honest in person they look good this way.

What was the lift you ran with the 36s?


Had ....
4" Procomp coils
3/4 spacers
1" body lift (allowed for the flat skid)
and 7" flares that made room for the tires to tuck inside on full stuff.

If you need more info or pics on that version of my Jeep let me know.

yep, it ties into the diff cover, heres the link
http://www.bluetorchfab.com/oscomm/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=121&products_id=388


Thanks for the link. That's how I remembered it. Mine is built the same.

Nah but Brink, tell us about those stands!!!

Sweet ass eh? Dreamed them up one night.

Building my 9" I used Jackstand and the fawking thing would fly off of them while grinding. In fact as I tried to catch it I had an "incident" with the grinder....

http://i2.tinypic.com/r042g5.jpg

Who'd have thought that mechanix wear gloves wouldn't stop a grinder? Weird eh? :shaking:




So this time I wanted to secure the axles to something. Used 2 lengths of tubing, one that slides into another. And some old rims I got from a bodyshop in town for free. Welded the larger tube onto the rim. Then drilled a hole in it big enough to run a bolt through. Welded a nut over the hole so the bolt threaded into it and would tighten against the smaller tube for vertical adjustment. Then welded some 1/4 flat to the top of the smaller tube. And drilled 2 holes spaced for 3.5" muffler clamps to run through. Now I just set the housing up there, throw the muffler clamps around them and tighten the nuts to hold it in place. They hold the pinion angle and height all at once. Makes it great for sliding the housing in and out from under the Jeep and not losing all the setup on it everytime :grinpimp: I marked the floor around the rims where they go under the Jeep so I can pull it out and then slide it back into the same spot everytime without breaking out the tape measure and plumb stick to get it all aligned.

I'll get a couple more pics of them tonight if I remember.

Or do you mean the ones I built for the Jeep to sit way up off the ground on???:confused:

Outstanding. I just ordered a set of 36s to run on 3.5"BS'd beadlocks. Springs will be 5.5RK with a Clayton LA kit. What tranny do you have in the 03? I'm stuck with the auto, 42RLE. If you have any more detailed pics, I'd appreciate it.

Outstanding. I just ordered a set of 36s to run on 3.5"BS'd beadlocks. Springs will be 5.5RK with a Clayton LA kit. What tranny do you have in the 03? I'm stuck with the auto, 42RLE. If you have any more detailed pics, I'd appreciate it.


03 I have a 3550 5 speed. I'll dig out a few pics of the old setup for you. :D

More pics of the rear 4 link.


Rear Lower Frame mounts
http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nrjr.jpg

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nrm1.jpg


I went with parallel lowers because I already know my clearance will be tight on the coilovers. Under full droop triangulating the lowers will pull the tire in which could bring the coilover into the frame too far. Planning to run the coilover through the old shock spot from the 9" setup. I cut and notched the frame so the shock could pass through it.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nucn.jpg

I'm planning to open up the top of this and then run the coilover up into the cab.

Rear Upper Frame mount.

4 positions on it. Should give me an antisquat range from about 70% to 150%.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nurp.jpg

Here's the arms. 2 long ones are the rear lowers. 3 others are all the uppers (2 rear 1 front). Making the lowers the same front and rear. And the uppers the same front and rear so I only need to carry 2 spares alltogether.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nwhu.jpg


http://i2.tinypic.com/r0nxxx.jpg




Made out of 2" x .250 wall DOM. Tube inserts are 1.5" solid 2.5" long that I will drill and tap to the 1.25" heims. Got the heims...got the taps....forgot the drill bit....should be here late this week :shaking: Anyone got a 1 11/64 bit I can borrow??? :flipoff2: Welded in the inserts by drilling 4- 1/2" holes in the DOM and then plug welding it as well as goin around the end like in the pic. If you look close you can see the plugs.

Putting heim at 1 end and bushing at the other.

Last year I used 3/4" Poison Spider heims. This year I'm stepping up to 1.25" Cromo's. I'll grab a comparison pic tomorrow. Words don't do the physical difference justice.

Lowers will have the bushing at the axle end and heim at the frame in an attempt to keep the heims from dragging in so much sh!t. Probably won't make a big difference but oh well.

Uppers are heims at axle and bushing at frame.

I sliced the side of my finger once (not as bad as yours) but the mechanix gloves actually went into my finger and caused more harm than good (infection, not to bad) but now when grinding I use heavier leather glovs that actually do something.

Basic Mechanix gloves are great for handling tube and wrenching but SUCK as fab gloves.

Tonight I got the front lower axle mounts done after a bunch of sitting in a chair....drinking beer....wondering how to do it best.

Trouble was that the short side tube on my 60 is too short to fit the bushing in :mad3: So I ended up making a bracket with a jog in it.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o03a.jpg


Other side was much easier.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o0fo.jpg


Other problem is that the frame turns and points into the middle of the axle for the fronts. But I think that if I build a mount the same as the rear frame mount the heim will have plenty of misalignment left. Plus the axle should be as far "out" as it will be at a neutral spot in the cycle. As the axle twists it will move into the frame and that's the way that I will have all the extra misalignment room. After I build it a pic will show what I'm saying better. Then you can tell me if you think I'm right or not about it.

I sliced the side of my finger once (not as bad as yours) but the mechanix gloves actually went into my finger and caused more harm than good (infection, not to bad) but now when grinding I use heavier leather glovs that actually do something.

Basic Mechanix gloves are great for handling tube and wrenching but SUCK as fab gloves.


They just don't last long as fab gloves either. Even if you don't slice them like I did, the sparks and heat eat them up in no time. And they are too damn expensive for that. :eek:

While it's not close to the level of some of the stuff on the board, it's still nice to see my fab skills progress from the last build. The 9" and old long arm was my first fab experience. Litterally learned to weld by building a suspension system.

Old bracket/welds
http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o2yp.jpg


New bracket/welds
http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o3d3.jpg



But even with the questionable welds and bracket design, the only thing I was able to break all season with the 9" and 36's was a Rubicon Express Tracbar. Litterally the only part of the suspension that I didn't build from scratch. That'll teach me :rolleyes:

By popular demand here's some more pics of my stands. Really not complicated and work fantastic. Built a set of 4 in an evening out of scrap I had in the shop.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o407.jpg


http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o41x.jpg


http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o46t.jpg


Gave a quick run down of how I built them in an earlier post on this thread.



And also made some tall stands for the Jeep to sit on. A lot nicer than the 18" stands on 6x6 blocks I used last winter. :smokin:

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o4f4.jpg

These were a little more complicated since my life is at stake under them. Made out of brake drums from a tractor trailer and teleposts from the hardware store. Can go from about 3' to 5'. And level by lifting and adding a pin through the telepost holes...then spinning the top to dial it in perfectly. The Jeep is sitting perfectly level right now so I can reference all measurements off the shop floor.

Also because I've had several people ask for them...

Pics of the 9" setup I ran last season. Worked really well. 3link (wishbone) with triangulated lowers.

Housing and flat skid
http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o76r.jpg

3 Link Rear
http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o7cz.jpg

You're right Joey. Plenty of coning from torquing the bolts. Probably could have stayed 10lbs less on them. From everything I've read it doesn't effect performance or safety at all. Last years had no problems. Nylock nuts can't back out anyway so it's just cosmetic. And to be honest in person they look good this way.

Right on, and I agree. They do look better coned in like that :) Eric, any idea how much one of those self-locked steelies weights?? Trying to decide if I should go your route, try and lock some H2 rims or pick up some Alum trailreadys...

I will be watching this closely, I basically have the same plans. 60/14B, 42's coilovers etc. Did you mention what you are hoping to have your WB end up at? Hydro assist or Full Hydro?

Going to run the 231 until she splits in half?? I think thats my plan, hopefully it will last long enough for me to collect 94,000 pop cans and pick up and Atlas.

-Joe

P.S. Do you think there would be any problem welding those brackets on the diff etc if you had left the carrier etc in? Or perhaps take your time and you wont melt out the inner axle seals etc? Reason being, just put mine all back together for mock-up, and will need to be buzzing on it here soon.

Don't know what they weigh for sure. I'll throw one setup on a scale tonight and find out. Interco must have the tire weights on their site so we can work backwards to get the new rim weight.

Should end up right about 100" WB. Any more than that and I have tires infront and behind the Jeep. Don't want them actually sticking out that way so that's as far as I'll go.

Hydro assist for me.

Alreay sold the 231 and got a 300. Building a flip for it. Just never really trusted the 231, even with the AA SYE.

As for the welding. I'd think it depends on how far from anything rubber you end up. Pouring the heat right beside bearings and seals sounds bad. But if they are down tube from your actual mounts and you do about 1/4 of the tab at a time you should be ok (I do the tab welds in stages like this to make sure I don't bend the tubes anyway). For the time it's worth it may be better to just pull the carrier and stuff out after you tack stuff on, then burn in the final welds. Plus then you can paint it all before final reassembly.

Is there a commando in the background of the beadlock pic?

Did you buy the Commando from MEANGREEN in Lloyd?

Yep that's a friends Commando (71 if I remember right) and it was bought from Wade. Small world right?

geeezzz, I really hope that you aren't driving that thing on the road. That picture of the "frame notching" is horrendous. do you think that welding in that tower structurally makes up for the lost strength by cutting out the frame?

That front axle link bracket looks really rough on the driver's side. The current bracket doesn't that much ability to counteract lateral forces... it's only welded on the inner sides of the two pieces of steel, you need to weld up both sides. It also looks like the majority of the weld is on the bracket. Those brackets will definitely break off, and that's just scary.

Lastly, the surface area of the truss-to-axle is very small. Think of the forces created when offroading (even driving down the road) that are place on the rear axle... you need a stronger and larger mounting points for the truss. BTF uses extremely thick steel that has been formed, rather than chopped, hacked, and rewelded up. BTF spent a great amount of time engineering and testing that product before they put it out on the market. Cutting up a bunch of pieces and welding them together (and a lot of those welds don't look too good) doesn't equal the same strength as a similar design that has been formed rather than welded.

This is exact reason why more states need to adopt the stringent inspections that California has... so stuff like this doesn't end up on the streets.

sweet, lovin it so far........

geeezzz, I really hope that you aren't driving that thing on the road. That picture of the "frame notching" is horrendous. do you think that welding in that tower structurally makes up for the lost strength by cutting out the frame?

That front axle link bracket looks really rough on the driver's side. The current bracket doesn't that much ability to counteract lateral forces... it's only welded on the inner sides of the two pieces of steel, you need to weld up both sides. It also looks like the majority of the weld is on the bracket. Those brackets will definitely break off, and that's just scary.

Lastly, the surface area of the truss-to-axle is very small. Think of the forces created when offroading (even driving down the road) that are place on the rear axle... you need a stronger and larger mounting points for the truss. BTF uses extremely thick steel that has been formed, rather than chopped, hacked, and rewelded up. BTF spent a great amount of time engineering and testing that product before they put it out on the market. Cutting up a bunch of pieces and welding them together (and a lot of those welds don't look too good) doesn't equal the same strength as a similar design that has been formed rather than welded.

This is exact reason why more states need to adopt the strigent inspections that California has... so stuff like this doesn't end up on the streets.



Hmmm.... well thanks for the input I think.

The frame notch is reinforced in the back side of the frame. No different than a notch to drop a lowrider lower than the frame, but turned on its side adding to the strength if anything. But I was just as concerned as you are about it when I began to do it.

I wish I could weld the other side of that front axle bracket but it's tight to cast pieces on both sides. There will be gussets filling in the bottom of the brackets back to the tube of all the link brackets. That should help some. Maybe I need to get someone who can weld to cast to throw a weld on the other sides of them? Anyone else have input on it?

I don't feel so bad about the rear truss. It's welded inside and out and will bolt to the dif cover. Might be wrong. More input is always apreciated.

The pics don't always do things justice either. I'm shooting pics with a crappy old 2meg camera, a week after the welds went in. Shit 10 minutes after, the coloring of the welds and surounding metal don't look as good. I also need to clean up the lines of the brackets with a flap wheel. Just getting through the mockup now. Prep for paint is yet to come. Grinding smooth lines on tabs and brackets is just easier after its welded on than rotating pieces in a vice.

Had someone take a look at it all in person today. He has fabrication experience and thought it looked good. Hopefully it's just the pics. Last year I did front and back from scratch and all I could break was the RE trackbar (only suspension piece I didn't build). And feel better about this design and execution.

Should I be panicing because of this one post? Do more of you guys see it like this guy? I'm not opposed to critisism here, want it to be the best it can. Obviously it needs to be safe. If it needs work I need to know.

By the way wiggamoe thanks for the polite, friendly, and constructive help you offered :flipoff2: . Nothing like trying to "fit in" on "Pirate". 00pumpkin you see anything that needs changing jump out? Maybe your recent experience with yours can help me here.

Trudging right along then with the latest update.

Here's the comparison pic of the old 3/4 5/8 hiems with the new cromo ones.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r20228.jpg

hey wiggamoe at least he is trying to build it himself you are probably one of those people who gets it built signs the check and tells everyone you built it yourself . lets see what you got and for the record the only time I had to rescue eric off the trail is when the production shit failed (re) wheeled the old set up hard last year and everything held up great . and just how much weight do you think is being supported behind that notch im guessing a couple hundred pounds at most being there is a body mount right in front of it taking up the weight and the gas tank has been moved . nice build eric cant wait till its doneand out of the shop lol:flipoff2:

I still think the thing that needs most attention is that front bracket. As I said before, there is no support against lateral forces. You should make the bracket more like a "U" so you can have more surface area on the axle to weld the bracket. Obviously you can't make the top surface of the "U" extend all the way to the end of the bracket because it will interfere with the link. You might try checking BTF’s website to see if they have any brackets like that.

Haywire: Unfortunately Haywire, I did two solid axle swaps for two Toyota Tacomas last summer, so yes, I do know how to build things myself.
You really think that only "a couple hundred pounds" of force is supported by the frame at that area? Exactly how did you arrive at that conclusion? Obviously you never considered the extra forces encountered when driving at 65 mph and hitting a pothole. It is true that the frame doesn’t have many forces acting on it while it's at rest, but the frame encounters many dynamic forces while the vehicle is in motion. You should take a few physics and statics classes at your local community college; you would benefit greatly.

Think of how much strength you lose when you remove one of the four sections of a tubular structure. Each side supports the other. That frame rail would easily collapse in the event of a side impact collision.

Brink: Why didn't you choose to use such narrow axles? It would have been much easier to have wider axles.

I agree about the axle brackets. The bottom side of them will be fully boxed back to the axle tube. I also think I see what you are saying about the tops. I like the idea of boxing the tops from the tube forward as far as I can without interfering with the control arms range of motion. Part of the problem is I'm posting pics of a "work in progress". It's not unreasonable to get flamed on parts that I havn't finished before I post pics of them.

The axles are full width 60's. Front is 69 and rear is 67ish. Never really thought of them as narrow. Fact is long coilovers just need a lot of space. And the TJ frame gets in the way.

I'll get some pics of the back of the notch for you too. It's not a problem I'm really sure. Crossmember runs from 1 side to the other right at the notch in addition to extra beef that I added right behind it.

Lets not turn this into a pissing contest guys. Thanks Haywire for sticking up for my build. I appreciate you always having my back be it busted on the trail or getting flamed on Pirate. Now let's try to stick to the tech or take it to PM's. :smokin:

Yep that's a friends Commando (71 if I remember right) and it was bought from Wade. Small world right?

Actually, it's a '72. Just to make the world smaller, Wade bought it from my buddy Trevor in Edmonton.:laughing:

yeah the commando is mine now build up to follow on separate thread


and lets not turn this into a flaming match i hate that about pirate cheers Jason

nice build! i,m running a 9 in the rear and 44 front on a 03, and i,m going the same direction you are this summer. so i am watching this build closely. keep the good pictures coming and let us all know how it works when you are done,and i will be curious to see how much better the new setup is than your old one!

Looks good!

I would add a few braces here and there on the axle brackets, just in case, but overall your welding looks pretty good.

I also went with weld-on beadlocks, didn't care much about the weight.

I would go with a longer wheelbase though, especially with 42", you might regret it later.

I understand why you're going 60 in the front, by why the added expense of swapping the 9" for a 60? Kind of a wash there :confused:

I understand why you're going 60 in the front, by why the added expense of swapping the 9" for a 60? Kind of a wash there :confused:


Mostly just because I was changing bolt pattern to match the front 60 anyway. And I needed to change the whole suspension design due to the coilovers and Dana300 that I'm putting in this year. So I sold the rear 9" complete with the entire double triangulated 3 link and crossmember as 1 package. Then when starting over I just decided I may as well get a 60 with the 8 bolt pattern I need instead of getting a 9 inch converted.

Stock form the 9" is stronger than the 60. But that's splitting hairs IMHO. Either axle is a great choice. Both can be built to really good strength levels with aftermarket parts. I do like the higher pinion on my 60. The 9" made driveshaft angles plenty steep at the stock wheelbase.

Looks good!

I would add a few braces here and there on the axle brackets, just in case, but overall your welding looks pretty good.

I also went with weld-on beadlocks, didn't care much about the weight.

I would go with a longer wheelbase though, especially with 42", you might regret it later.


Thanks. Axle brackets are going to get boxed fully on the bottom and as much as I can on the top before it conflicts with the arms.

Fawkin tires are heavy now no doubt. Didn't get on a scale yet (sorry GIS) but I will for you guys to know the rims weight. Pretty much need 2 guys to mount a tire on the axle even if it's not way up in the air like mine are.

What kind of wheelbase are you guys at? Looking at the front end some more last night I think I may kick it out a little more. Another couple inches will give me much better clearances for suspensin parts.

I just want to buy a set of those bead locks!

I'd make you some but the shipping from Alberta would kill you. :eek:

yeah, you're probably right!
But they sure look good...
I wonder what the shipping would be just
for the weld on kit?

After I figure out some weights maybe I can look into it for you. By early next week I'll know what the rim weighs total after so I can figure out the rings from there.

Holy Fawkin deja vu!

Just looked at Goat1's post of the new Polyperformance rear coilover kit.

:eek: Is it ever nice! Looks just like my notched frame :flipoff2:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=233670&stc=1&d=1142035873
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=233671&stc=1&d=1142035873

Need I say more?:smokin:

After I figure out some weights maybe I can look into it for you. By early next week I'll know what the rim weighs total after so I can figure out the rings from there.


Very cool! thanks!
email or pm me.

and to think someone on this thread said your notch was crap and you shouldnt do it . here is a bolt on kit that they are going to sell looks real familiar cheers

and to think someone on this thread said your notch was crap and you shouldnt do it . here is a bolt on kit that they are going to sell looks real familiar cheers


I'm sure it's not actually "bolt in", that still looks to require some signigicant fab. But welded or bolted it's reassuring to see a major player in the industry choosing the same basic idea as I went with a year ago.

I'm just hoping that it can put the notch debate to rest now.

:)


Should be more progress Monday to report. Weekends I end up doing the family thing most the time.

Stay tuned guys.

Don't know where all the pics have gone. I'll try to get them back up tonight.

What a night!

Plasma'd off the old front lower frame mounts. Glad to see them gone. They always embarassed me a little. Just looked weak to me.

Got the new frame mounts mounted up in their place. Now it's looking like the lower arms on the front will need a bend in them to allow the heims to run smoothly within their range. No big deal. Just one more thing to add to the to do list.


From there I spent several hours trying to figure out the upper link/panhard mounting. Just really looks like there isn't enough room anywhere. So I started to think about a triangulated upper setup. Shouldn't be too bad for bumpsteer because my draglink will be really flat. But just not feeling like I will have enough triangulation to feel comfortable with it.

In the end I wonder if I am working too hard at keeping the jeep low. Looking at some pics from other buildup threads it seems like I'm much lower. Raising the jeep up a little more will help a lot.

Anyone able to get me a measurment on theirs? Need it to be on a 42" tired TJ, preferably Dana60'd but anything could help. Need to know how far it is from the center of the axle tube to the seam between the hood and fender (that would be bottom of the hood).

From the threads I could find tonight and the math I did by measuring pics on the screen looks like

P&T's is 34" from center of tube to seam in hood/fender
00pumkin's is 35" from center of tube to seam in hood/fender

Anyone know of any more examples of TJ's equiped like this. Need some pics. Most of the numbers I can work out from there.







I did get around to weighing a tire combo tonight though.

42" TSL with 15" beadlock is 149 lbs.
looks like a 42" TSL is about 106 lbs.

So that makes the steel rims and beadlock 43lbs.

That's ballpark anyway. Pretty tought without weighing everything seperately. And no I won't take one apart for you :flipoff2:

Yeah, you're not the first to notch the frame there. I wheel with a few guys who have done that and drive around 100 miles to the hammers, run the trails, and drive home. They're fine. It's not going to just fall apart.The build looks good.

Cleared off the stock crap from the frame to get a better visual on the front 3 link/panhard. 2 hours to clean up all that crap! Not my idea of fun. After that I finalized axle placement. Lowered both axles 3inches to give me some much needed and more realistic room to make this all work. (Still hoping 00pumpkin or someone with a similar setup can get me some measurments on theirs, thinking I'm much lower still but would like to verify) Moved the front forward another inch or so. As it sits in the pic it is at ride height.

New wheelbase is 102-103.



Now then I'm more prepared to ask some questions if nothing else.

Tonights topic is panhard placement. Here's the pic....

http://i2.tinypic.com/rhn80o.jpg


Looks like 2 options to me. The X or the O. What are your impressions of them?

Thinking that if I used the O and a flat "CJ" style pitman arm I might not need to move the steering box at all. The pitman would move up higher and clear the dif under full stuff. The panhard would be right over the tubes. The rest of the front will be 3 link. Single upper on the pass side. Build the upper mount and the panhard mount together to provide bracing and strength for one another. Suspension travel will be set up for 4 up 10 down or maybe 5 up 10 down depending on final decision on coilover brand and length.


So what's everyone think? Let me have it guys. Am I missing something as to why it won't work to leave the steering box where it is assuming it can clear the dif cover at full stuff?

Holy Fawkin deja vu!

Just looked at Goat1's post of the new Polyperformance rear coilover kit.

:eek: Is it ever nice! Looks just like my notched frame :flipoff2:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=233670&stc=1&d=1142035873
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=233671&stc=1&d=1142035873

Need I say more?:smokin:

It's not bolt on, but all the brackets are of course pre-fabbed and ready to go. Easiest way to put coilovers on your TJ. We also have a badass front kit...its on our website. :D

Got the upper control arm on the front dif.

And the frame end of the trackbar.

Tacked in the axle end of the trackbar. But I'm feeling nervous about it. It seems much too short to me. How much of a factor is it?


http://i2.tinypic.com/rj04m1.jpg
http://i2.tinypic.com/rj047p.jpg
http://i2.tinypic.com/rj04dd.jpg
http://i2.tinypic.com/rj04gh.jpg



Trackbar is 25" long.
Draglink is 36" long.
Upper arm is 32" long.
Lower arm is 36" long.



The pitman arm that's on there is not the one I'm using. The angle of the draglink to trackbar will be closer than it shows in the pic. But not exactly parallel. The trackbar just won't fit anywhere very well.

If you want zero bump steer the trackbar and draglink must be the same length and at the same angle. Any deviation from either will result in a different arc and thus the famed bump steer. I have never run a rig with a trackbar 11" shorter than the draglink but I don't think I would want to. That's 30% shorter.

I would move the trackbar out towards the passenger tire a bit.

I'm changing the trackbar setup this weekend. Will update with pics of the new setup to see if it meets with everyone's aproval. The input is very much apreciated.

Like he stated, make the trackbar as long as possible....Very rarely will you get it the "Same" length of the draglink, but get it as close as possible.

Think about what will happen to the axle location as the trackbar travels on its arc from the pivot point on the frame.

Good luck on the build

Thanks for the input guys. It just felt totally wrong when I tacked it there. So I stopped untill I could come up with a better idea.

Here's roughly how I'll change it.....

http://i2.tinypic.com/rkso60.jpg

.... I'll move it even farther towards the knuckle if I can. Just a rough idea.

Thanks to OnTheSpot for the cool modified pic he posted for me in General 4x4. Will require a couple bends in the panhard to get around the upper mount but should not be too hard. Only possible issue will be clearance to the draglink. Tough to figure that out till it's done and cycled. I'll update pics this weekend when I get to changing it around.

I may be wrong but the track bar mount (frame side) looks higher than the pitman arm. I believe they should be same height.

My 2 cents.

i see you went with the 3 link, looks good. your mounting for the upper link on the axle looks good, it,s very similir to mine. you should be very happy with this setup once you get it dialed in.

I may be wrong but the track bar mount (frame side) looks higher than the pitman arm. I believe they should be same height.

My 2 cents.


Same height or not doesn't matter as long as they run parallel. So if the frame mount is higher on the trackbar the axle mount should be aswell.

Good, good, Im very interested to see how that 60 fits up front, and how the steering works out. I like your style:D

-Ben

OK. Tore out the axle mount of my trackbar today and refabbed it.

Here it is.


http://i1.tinypic.com/rtn8s6.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/rtn8zt.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/rtn975.jpg





But like I asked about before. That would cause a serious amount of custom bending to the bar itself to clear the dif and then the upper mount. Plus it really doesn't look like the draglink will clear the trackbar and axle bracket where the steering box is now. And if I needed to move the steering box anyway I may as well move the frame mount for the trackbar to be a straight line.

Before I moved the frame mount

http://i1.tinypic.com/rtnbjt.jpg


After moving the frame mount

http://i1.tinypic.com/rtnbtl.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/rtnc0o.jpg



New trackbar length is in the ballpark of 33"

That's about as close as I can get it to the draglinks length without getting hung up on my coilovers I think.

Plus I was able to lower the frame mount of the draglink by about 1" or 1.5"

Me thinks your shooting yourself in the foot by welding everything solid before you get all the linkages in there to see whats going to work. Just tack everything, make up some dummy links and make sure its going to work, then weld everything. It'll save you a ton of time and effort redoing crap cause its in the way of something else.

Me thinks your shooting yourself in the foot by welding everything solid before you get all the linkages in there to see whats going to work. Just tack everything, make up some dummy links and make sure its going to work, then weld everything. It'll save you a ton of time and effort redoing crap cause its in the way of something else.


No question you have a great point. Hopefully I'm doing things in the right order. What I've done so far doesn't effect anything that I can't change yet. For example the steering box will move to where it will clear everything instead of everything moving to clear it.

I do agree with your point though. Potentially it can make for a lot of extra work. That frame side trackbar bracket is a perfect example of that. :(

Make sure you go back & give that upper control arm mount (Axle Side) some lateral support. A gusset & maybe even box it in....That will keep it from ripping right off.


Oh..and the new trackbar mounts look much better.

Not a lot new to report. Been a busy week on other stuff so little time for the Jeep.

Made the upper link frame mount for the front axle:

http://i1.tinypic.com/s2fmsk.jpg


The arms are getting drilled and tapped for the 1.25" shank Joints right now on a friends lathe. Changed plans and went with Johny Joints instead. Got 1 for a spare and really liked it. So I sold all my heims and ordered some more. The arms should be back next week.

In the meen time I will be adding all the gussets and boxing needed on the link tabs. As well as doing the finish grinding so they look better.

Coilovers came in today.

Went with Rancho's. Pricing was much better for me than other coilovers. One of my best friends is a Rancho dealer so I can do better than retail on them. When you compare better than retail on these to nothing but retail on SAW's that's a huge price jump. If it was only the $100 that was different retail to retail I may have gone another route, I'm not sure.

Plus I like the idea of the in cab controls or at least adjustable shock valving.

http://i1.tinypic.com/s41aud.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/s41awj.jpg

Over all they seem OK. Although I really have little to compare them to. Fit and finish is OK at best though. Due to poor packaging the aluminum threads are not perfect which made threading on the top nut difficult on some of them. The unthreaded body was not what I expected either. All that's threaded is a sleeve that goes over the shock body to hold the top of the coil. Different than other designs if I'm not mistaken.

Travel is about 15"
Spring rates are 250/350 (12"/14")

That's the other downside. They only have a handful of spring rates to choose from. Where as the other big names are seperate from the springs so you can get whatever you want. If I need to I will have to sell some of these springs and get other ones I guess.

Finished the rear coilover mounts tonight. Pretty happy with them. Finally feels like its getting close to sitting on its rubber.

http://i1.tinypic.com/sgmr2e.jpg

Couldn't resist throwing the tires on it.

This is pretty much the final stance. Front axle might be just a little too far forward in the pics.

http://i1.tinypic.com/sgmrkg.jpg


http://i1.tinypic.com/sgms86.jpg

just curious why you went with tsl's this time over the iroks?

Just got a way better deal on them. A friend wanted to sell them. They had 4 runs on them, and no pavement. Got them for way less than the new price or Iroks

The Iroks are a great tire no question. But for a difference of about $700 I'm pretty happy with the TSL's I think. Plus they are WAY bigger than the Iroks. There's a set of 42" Iroks going on another friends Jeepster in the shop, and the TSL's are physically way bigger.

Killer Build! Your last pic in the post is my new background. Keep us updated

thats badass. I like how you have the jeep in the air like that to, great idea. How the heck did u get it up there though? haha

can't wait to see it done

Sweet build. Keep up with the pics.

Thanks for the props everyone. This thread is great at keeping me motivated with the build.

More pics to come soon. Waiting for the new joints and I need to get my arms back from being tapped. Won't be long and it'll be back on the ground. At least the easy part will be done then. Lots more to do after that.


May long is coming way too fast. :eek:

Lookin badass Eric.

I hope I can be finished around the same time as you and we'll head out kick the shit outta herald creek backwards.

Im stuck in a viscious circle right now. Not enough money to finish, so I take on outside work to make money. Outside work kills my time into my rig. And around an around.:laughing: :laughing:

Expect some more calls as I get further into mine. You're doing a kickass as job buddy.

Oh ya, and gimme them jackstands when you are done :grinpimp: :grinpimp:

Gimme about a week and I can hook you up with the stands for awhile Bill.

Definately shooting for us doing Herald Creek backwards May long. Gotta keep it a small and capable group. That's gonna be a tough run.

Ok progress.

Tonight I welded in the tube that will reinforce the bolt holes. Much bigger job than it sounds because the only tube I could find was a little bigger than the 3/4" hole I had drilled in all the tabs. So I had to enlarge it with my rotary tool to make them fit.


http://i2.tinypic.com/snjgx0.jpg


Also got the rear axle finished. Did the finish grinding and painted it.

http://i2.tinypic.com/snjhud.jpg

http://i2.tinypic.com/snjhxc.jpg

Another productive night. Lots accomplished.

Finished all the tabs and mounts by grinding and painting them. Amazing how great they can look after a little bit of paint :D

http://i2.tinypic.com/sp99i8.jpg
http://i2.tinypic.com/sp99nb.jpg

Arms and inserts are back from the machine shop

Arms drying on the rack
http://i2.tinypic.com/sp99tu.jpg

New Joints and 1 of my tube inserts
http://i2.tinypic.com/sp9a3q.jpg


Also got the front axle done. Made and attached the coilover mounts. Did the grinding and flogged it with paint.
http://i2.tinypic.com/sp9agg.jpg

Picked up the new suspension seats tonight from Rocky Mtn Offroad.

Corbeau Baja SS's

http://i2.tinypic.com/sym5qv.jpg

So cool. Don't know how my ass survived in the stock ones after sitting in these. Even my 6 year old likes em better than her princess chair. Raising her right, no worries.

:jeep3:

Rancho in cab controls for the coilovers arrived today. Pretty bling. Thinking stiffening up the shocks for running on the highway or higher speed sections like fireroads will be a bonus. Especiallly from in the cab at the press of a button.

http://i2.tinypic.com/symeir.jpg

Complete except the airlines for a big $36 on e-bay. Gotta love it.

Looks like you are getting close. But of course it is the little things that take forever towards the end of a project!

I saw this pic and thought SURELY I didn't overlook a Mando build in the background.
http://i2.tinypic.com/snjhud.jpg


.
.
.
.
..
.
.
.
.
.
.
Sure enough I DID.

http://i2.tinypic.com/r0o4f4.jpg

BASTARD !!!!!!! You been holdin out. Is there a build thread elsewhere?????

Nope. Not yet at least.

Guy building that one doesn't have enough done on it to report much yet. But it will come. Very BLING.

What is the intended WB. I'ld really like to see a profile shot.

Just from my own personal experience, and subsequent comments from others who used my Jeep as an example in building theirs, I think you are going to encounter tire/frame contact with the coilovers mounted closer inboard on the axle tube (if still using the factory rear frame). I had to notch the frame, move my towers against the wheel tub, move the tabs to the ends of the ale tubes and get 1.5" wheel spacers to make everything fit. Mabye you have it figured and just haven't gotten to that stage yet, but I just thought I'd point it out to you.


Also got the rear axle finished. Did the finish grinding and painted it.

http://i2.tinypic.com/snjhud.jpg



I am just a poor boy and do not understand cutting up and building up a new vehicle just to play with in the woods, but I am envious of those that can afford to :eek: . I like the build so far, keep up the good work.

Thanks for the heads up Chris. Much apreciated. Frame is notched. That's been covered earlier when someone started flaming me for it. During mock up it looks like all will clear. If not I'll go wheel spacers to bump it out a little more. The straight lowers should help since they won't be pulling the tire into the frame as much. Pretty sure I'm OK on it but I will keep everyone posted.


Buba... if you're asking about my TJ it's gonna be about 102ish. If your asking about the Jeepster :flipoff2: Not covering that build here.

Chris what's your total width out of curiosity? Got me wondering now :p

As for the "new Jeep" thing. Fawk....don't get me started. If I ever thought I'd go this far with it, a new TJ would have been the last thing I'd have bought. But as it is you use what you have I guess :shaking: . The payment coming out every month on it makes me cringe though. More so all winter while it's on jackstands and bank acount is hovering around $0. Beleive it or not I will probably look to sell it once it's done and then grab a YJ and do it all again. But without the $30000 bank loan and new car smell. :cool2:

Straight lowers is my plan once I find a place to build it :rolleyes:

total width? about 2" wider than the fenders on my trailer :p actually its pretty narrow now since I'm rollin on the old bald 265's from my tow rig. I sold the nowhere-near 38" SX's and am buying 39" iroks as soon as I have time to get out to OK Tire and pick them up

Wheel mount to wheel mount must be 70ish with your spacers I'd guess? What backspacing on your rims?

The WMS distance is 69" front and rear. The old wheels were 15x10 4 1/8" backspace and the tires were 14.5" wide if that helps. New setup will be 17x8 4 1/2" with 39x13 tires. I wouldnt worry about your overall width, you should be fine

Think I'm about 67 or 68 WMS. With a notched frame.... 15x11 rims with 4" backspacing 15 wide TSL's.


Hmmmmm..... find out about clearance soon I guess.

yeah figuring out the placement of the coilovers in the rear is a biatch, first mine hit the tires, then they hit the frame, finally got it right but like i said a bitch. Just make sure and tack everything into place and cylce with the tires on there to make sure your good......

Spent most the weekend hating the idea of bending my front lower links. They needed the bend because of the way the frame kicks in at the front of the trany crossmember. The mounts I made pointed in line with that.

Couple reasons I hated them so much....

Obviously they wouldn't be as strong. Although gussetting could probably take care of that.

Mostly though I just hated that my fronts would not be interchangable with my rears. Really want to carry 1 spare and be able to place it front or rear if I need to.




So I made a couple cuts with the plasma....and heated stuff up with the torch...and reaimed them to point straight at the axle mounts.....followed by a bunch of gusseting and reinforcing

http://i2.tinypic.com/t53udj.jpg


Teaser pick with the lower link and front tire mounted

http://i2.tinypic.com/t53x4i.jpg



Front upper link will still not match the rear upper links because I didn't want the pinion to rotate down as the suspension drooped. That required a longer upper in the front compared to the rear to get mounting points closer to equal with the lowers.

Happens to work out that the panhard in the front is the same length as the rear uppers. So 1 spare will do both of them. Clearance is looking tight on the trackbar to the pumpkin though. May have to raise the frame mount by drilling another hole in it....or put a bend in the panhard to gain some clearance. Waiting on the new Johny Joints so I can bolt everything up and do some cycling to find my exact clearances.

Good progress to report. Felt like a big step.

Cut up the ass end a little.
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjbc.jpg

Mounted all the arms and panhard
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjeb.jpg

Got Droop?
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjkw.jpg

Tires mounted drooped a little.
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjsz.jpg

Sitting on its own at full compresion.
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhk41.jpg

Front at full compresion
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhk6v.jpg



Ride height will be 4" higher than this.

Breakover
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhlpl.jpg

Rear
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhlrs.jpg

Front
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhlwp.jpg

Panhard
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhlyd.jpg

lookn good! where are you plan'n to set ride height?

Ride height is going to be about 4 inches higher than in these pics. Planning 4 up 11 down for my coilover travel.

Want it at full compresion to build the mounts for the shocks.

Depending on how that ends up looking/feeling I could mod my upper Panhard mount on the front and drop it down to being only 2inches higher than in these pics. Kinda waiting to see the steering on it so I can decide where my panhard needs to be exactly.

Got Droop?
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjkw.jpg

Tires mounted drooped a little.
http://i2.tinypic.com/vdhjsz.jpg

Looking good. I love these two shots and comments. :smokin:

just a thought.... since you have it all together just twist up the axles and setup for coilovers that way. cause in most situations center up and down shouldnt be much but twisting is going to be where you want your travel balanced.

like i said just a thought not slam'n, i really like the build its clean!

keep it coming, your getting closer to beating on it again!! looks great!

Trying to follow what you are saying here.

You recomend letting 1 side droop and 1 stuff per axle to fab the mounts? Which gets fabbed the stuffed or drooped? I like the idea. Will help set them for in/out from the frame. The way I have it now it will be easy to set for height. Never really thought about twisting it up so I can see clearances between the shock/tire/frame at the same time. That's what you're getting at right?

yeah man, twist it up and mock it up. thats what we did. here is a pic of how we did it.

http://www.delaware4wd.com/modules/pngallery/albums/album24/abn.sized.jpg

Cool I like it.

I'll figure out some way to do that. Thanks for the tip.

What did you set your pinion angle to on the front axle? im doing the same and trying to see what i should set it around so my caster is going to be ok

I set it with the spring perch that's cast into the pumpkin level. By doing that it is at stock caster specs for that axle. From there my control arms will give me enough adjustment to tweak it by a few degrees either way.

Because of the high pinion driveshaft angles were not really a concern at all.

so you went with 16in long shocks in the front did you say FOX and whats your spring rate at and lenght just trying to see cas my is about the same weight im sure since there the same jeep

Better skim through the thread again :)


15" Rancho's
Set up for 4 up 11 down travel.
250/350 in the front

All on page 4.

Hope the thread helps with your build. Keep everyone posted on it.

Sorry not much for updates. Been busy on other projects.

Including helping install an air ride with a friend in this sweet Pontiac.

http://i3.tinypic.com/w1ab1v.jpg

Build the coilover mounts tonight.

Trying out the new bender. Pic are another die than what I used in the end to get the 170deg bends


http://i3.tinypic.com/wju9uw.jpg

http://i3.tinypic.com/wjua9z.jpg

The pieces for the front

http://i3.tinypic.com/wjuaop.jpg

Mounts assembled

http://i3.tinypic.com/wjub28.jpg

Fronts will mount by drilling 2" holes in the frame so the horizontal piece can slide into the frame and get welded all the way around.

Rears don't have the horizontal piece. They will mount right on top of the frame. Just going to weld onto the top of the frame.

Any input on this plan? Will that rear be strong enough?

I made my coilover hoops alot like yours but I just butted the two horizontal pieces to the side of the frame and welded them up, i was confident enough that they would hold. Plus when you add a support bar between the hoops that helps distribute the load better, so far they have held on fine, and if something was going to happen it would have happened on my last wheeling trip cause i definately beat on it hard......you should be fine, just make sure you add those support bars.....

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/8/web/476000-476999/476539_201_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/8/web/476000-476999/476539_168_full.jpg

Feeling good about it. Will have a crossbrace running over the engine from one to the other.

More worried about the rear. With my stock frame I think I need the hoops to go right on the top of it. Not mount to the face like in your pics. Your narrowed frame made all the difference for you back there I'm sure.

Any opinions on welding the hoops onto the top of the frame and brace them 1 to the other back there?

I think you should be fine with that, as long as you out that brace between them, ive seen it done that way plenty of times.....if your worried you can always throw in a 3rd leg on the coilover hoops...........

Looking good. Cant wait to see it finished and wheeling!

what do you plan for running brake lines? i was looking at mine today and was thinking of running my lines for the front brakes to go to the middle of the axle, running steel lines to the calipers and back to rubber so they can turn...that way i dont need such long brake lines at the wheel well and there also protected...but just seeing what you plan on doing and how long yours are? oh yea are you only going to have 3 controll arms up front? i didnt see the arm on the drivers side, the upper one that is?

That's right. Only 3 control arms on the front. 3 link with a panhard.

Planning on just running longer brake lines similar to stock. Keeping them out at the wheels. Just don't really see the need to complicate the build by changing them. I have never had a problem with them in that location before.

Your idea of down the middle sounds cool though. Post up some pics when you have them.

yea ill get some pics up for you when i get that far in the build haha..you dont think theres going to be too much tq applied to the front axle to twist it with one arm?

No. 3 link with the panhard is a pretty common setup. Lots of guys on the board running it. Several really well built, similar size rigs around here that run it aswell. Not really worried about it. I'll get some funky dive when I brake probably but nothing that's a big deal on the trail. Last years was also a 3 link/panhard front setup and it worked amazing. I was really happy with it.

im thinking of panhard bar setup the same as a track bar correct?

im thinking of panhard bar setup the same as a track bar correct?


That's right. Same thing different name. :D

Sweet looking build on this TJ! Can't wait to see the finished product!
Scott

Got one of the front coilovers mounted up tonight.

http://i3.tinypic.com/x10uog.jpg

http://i2.tinypic.com/x10uvo.jpg

Little cleanup and some more gussetting on them but it's pretty much there. Still sitting at full compresion.

What angle did you bend your tub at? looking good

I bent the tube for the hoops to 170deg.

No perticular reason for that number. Just thought it looked about right on the first one. Then made the rest to match.

and were and what brake lines you running, i got some with my kit, but there still too short

Don't know for sure yet. Give me another week or 2 and I'll have them done. Probably go custom braided lines made to fit.

I'll keep an eye on this because your front suspension is exactly what I'm planning on building. Keep up the good work :beer:

still not sold on those shocks though

still not sold on those shocks though




:D Fair enough. Honestly just a budget thing. My pricing on these was half of a set of SAW's or Foxes. Just couldn't swallow the difference.

still not sold on those shocks though

Ive watched a couple sweet buggies running em, and they worked great! Even the 4-seater when launching through the air.:smokin:

Back to our regularly sched. program...

Keep the updates coming!

All coilovers are mounted now.

Front pass side
http://i2.tinypic.com/xle6qc.jpg




Rear
http://i3.tinypic.com/xle780.jpg
http://i3.tinypic.com/xle7as.jpg




I flexed it out in the rear with 1 tire on using an engine hoist. Doesn't look good for clearances. I'm gonna need some spacers. At least an inch maybe 2. :mad3: Was worried about that. Everything is as tight as it can get and the tire will still bind on the coilover at full stuff 1 side/full droop the other.

Still need to make some final cleanup cuts to the sheetmetal around them all. And decide exactly how I will reclose the rear ones to keep mud out of the box as much as I can. Final product will be very clean. Have some ideas in my head.

Also need to crossbrace front and rear. Tabs will be finish welded and gussetted.

Do the hoops need any gussetts/reinforcement where they are welded to the frame?

I had to use 1.5" wheel spacers to clear the coilovers in the back. I didnt like them at first, but I absolutely needed them to keep the tires out of the springs. I check them every few runs and they haven't loosened up or developed cracks yet.

I would also reinforce the hoops, especially if your not running seperate bumpstops. My hoops look the same as yours, and I just had to weld my passenger's side hoop back on after some cracks were found around the weld.

You're rear frame almost looks like mine, although I didnt go all the way into the side of the frame with the notch like you did.

http://www.4x4shots.com/albums/userpics/10025/normal_01-17-06_1755.jpg

Think just gussets to the front and rear of the hoops Chris? Or all 4 directions? What about the front. Top and bottom aswell or just sides? Opinions are apreciated.

What was your rear 60 out of? Late 70's Ford by any chance? If so the 1.5" spacer should work for me too.

At ride height how much clearance between your coils and the frame?

So some pretty big progress.

Front coilovers mounted
http://i1.tinypic.com/zikv1c.jpg

Rear coilovers mounted
http://i1.tinypic.com/zikvbc.jpg


Then came the moment of truth.........















































































FAWK!!!!
http://i1.tinypic.com/zilfsp.jpg

It's way too high!!!! Should be down like 4 inches or so.

What the fawk happened? The springs are way too stiff. The front only compressed 2 inches.

So I have to work out some different spring rates I think.

If you have a Jeep on coilovers post up your rates for me in case I don't find 'em in my searches.

Yoinks! That IS way too high! Unless of course you are crawlin' the mall, then that is PERFECT :flipoff2:

Do those coils break in after and settle out after a little while?
What spring rate do you have now?
Did you weigh your rig f&r to get an idea of what you'd need?

If not, that'd be the next step.

Coils will settle a little. But everything I read leads me to expect less than an inch.

Didn't weigh it. Spent a lot of time talking to others about what rates they have on TJ's. Also talking to vendors about what they are putting on Tj's then bought some based on the results.

Makes no sense to me. This should be pretty close. Wonder if the coils are not the rates I think they are. Seems unlikely but I just don't know what else it could be.

Don't forget that they're brand new springs so they will settle in some - probably 1.5-2". I know it's not 4" but it will be better.

Think just gussets to the front and rear of the hoops Chris? Or all 4 directions? What about the front. Top and bottom aswell or just sides? Opinions are apreciated.

I'll let you know when I figure it out myself. I'll probaby use triangles front and back. Having bumpstops (so the shocks i.e. the towers arent taking that force) will help a lot too.

What was your rear 60 out of? Late 70's Ford by any chance? If so the 1.5" spacer should work for me too.

It's a rock magnet 14 bolt from an 83 1 ton SRW GM pickup. Stock width is 67" it is now 69" to match the stock width of the front 60.

At ride height how much clearance between your coils and the frame?

this much???? :confused:

http://www.4x4shots.com/albums/userpics/10025/01-17-06_1756.jpg

Basically the plate is halfway into the frame. I didnt want to go all the way because the back of the frame still supports my cage.

IMO, the only way to put coilovers on the back of a TJ/YJ is to backhalf the frame and tube it. Otherwise, it just becomes butched. It's on my list as soon as I find a place to work on it.

When I let my Jeep down off the lift, the shocks dont go down all the way. I have to hop on the bumper and jump on it once to get it to settle. It's not the springs, but the shocks. Did you try loading the suspension, or just let the weight down on it slowly?

:evil: :mad3: :evil: Both. After loading the suspension I jumped up and down on the bumpers in a fit of rage :mad3: :evil: :mad3:

did you decide on going with a PSC ram assist? or going to fab up a ram assist or not do one at all

did you decide on going with a PSC ram assist? or going to fab up a ram assist or not do one at all


Planning to just do one on my own. There's lots of good tech on tapping a sag box so it shouldn't be too hard.

yea i was looking at that all day today at work...got my coilovers in today, it looks like you can do (+)(-) 50 psi out of the remote res. according to spring rate

Planning to just do one on my own. There's lots of good tech on tapping a sag box so it shouldn't be too hard.

Does 03 still have the saginaw box?

im sure they do..or one like it that can be changed to work..

Nope. Crappy merc box. I'm switching out to a saginaw because I can't find any info on tapping mine. Even tried to buy the info from someone on here and no way. They want me to send it to them and they will do it. Trouble is me being in Canada kills the idea due to shipping costs.

yea my coils are way too stiff also..i got 225/400 i didnt mean to get 400...i have to get ride of both and get like a (12)150/(14)200 in order to get a 10in sag on vechile weight... with that set up it going to req. 1500lbs even to get 10" drop..at each coner..so that might be a more idea way to go

yea my coils are way too stiff also..i got 225/400 i didnt mean to get 400...i have to get ride of both and get like a (12)150/(14)200 in order to get a 10in sag on vechile weight... with that set up it going to req. 1500lbs even to get 10" drop..at each coner..so that might be a more idea way to go
did you get the ranchos too? couple of us are waiting too see if you guys get these figured out before we order. hope they work out and keep us posted on the spring rates you guys find. where are you located prostock3? have a friend building a buggy and he wants to put the rancho coilovers on but would like more info on them.

im located in Novi, Mi..around liviona/milford area if that helps...i didnt go with rancho i went with Fox

by the way what are people running for spring rate..im going to do a (12)225/(14)225

So a little more progress.

I borrowed some other coils. Thanks to Wolf359 for hooking me up on them.

Here it is sitting on the new rates.

http://i4.tinypic.com/103sgb5.jpg

Think that's not much different than before? Here's a shot of after I did just the front. Before they were within 2 inches of each other.

http://i4.tinypic.com/103sh14.jpg

Couple other angles.

http://i4.tinypic.com/103sink.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/103sh9h.jpg


Needless to say I am much happier with this height. It came down about 5 inches from the old coils.

well what are the other coils rated at?

Now for the tech.

The new rates on the Jeep right now are....

Front 12" 200/ 12"250

Rear 12" 150/12"250



That gives me rates of....

Front 111

Rear 94


Not too bad maybe. Still think it's a little stiff based on Goats recomendations (thanks for the help).

Even more so there is the problem of only having 24" of coil. And only having a 12" coil on the bottom.

Here's what I am talking about....

http://i4.tinypic.com/103spcl.jpg
The adjustment collar on top is where it needs to be for my ride height. So obviously I will need tender coils to keep tension on the springs under droop. Otherwise they will flop all over the place and probably bind up destroying everything. So tender coils. Happen to have some. Trouble is that the plastic slider that would seperate them from the top coil will stop moving up when it hits the bottom of the threaded sleeve. That's what normally stops the dual rate slider. So I'm not sure if I can just cut the threaded sleeve to be 1/2 or 1inch below the top collar so that a tender and slider can work or not. If I cut it what will transistion the dual rate portion of the shock? The dual rate stop won't have anything to run into and the only thing that will stop the uptravel of the top softer coil is when it fully compresses.



Potential problem number 2....
http://i4.tinypic.com/103stbl.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/103stmv.jpg

The 12" bottom coil will be very low when the axle is fully drooped. In fact the top of the coil is below the bottom of the shock body. The second pic if you look really close you can see a line about 1" up the shock body. This is where the top of the dual rate slider is when the axle is fully drooped. So the slider is still on the shock a little bit. Concerned it could still bind up when transitioning from full droop to compression. How are other shocks making this work? They must still be running 12" coils on shocks with 16" of shaft showing at droop. Do I need to be concerned?

So potential fixes for the problems....

I think the rates can still be softer.

Based on advice from a good source maybe

125/250 = 83lb/in

On the front that rate will compress my 2 springs 2 inches more than the 111lb/in on it now. This would allow me to move to a 14" bottom coil on the front to eliminate the problem of the 12" bottom coil being below the bottom of the shock body.

The back it will only change the compression by about 5/8" so it won't allow for an increase in any spring lengths there.

Also it in no way addresses the issue of mounting the tender coils. The front would still need at least 2" of tender and the rear about 5"

besides the coil probs, you seem to have the ride height/ stance nailed.

The only way around the tender coil issue would be to run 2 14" coils. But they would need to be very soft in order for my ride height to come down to where I want it.

That would require a rate of...

67lb/in front
48lb/in rear


Any way that it can work? I stumbled across a Dibble post last night that more or less stated that the coils just hold up the ride height. The ride quality or suspension travel should be controlled by shock valving.

It's possible or maybe even probable that I am just misunderstanding his post. But could that mean that I can use 2 14" coils to get me to these really soft rates. Then keep my Rancho shocks adjusted to a stiffer setting and all will work fine?


I assume not but can anyone confirm or explain it to me?

What about swapping to a 14 inch coil on the bottom with a slightly lower spring rate?

Damn, you beat me to my suggestion...

What about swapping to a 14 inch coil on the bottom with a slightly lower spring rate?

Damn, you beat me to my suggestion...


:D I'm trying here. Keep the sugestion rolling.

Was going threw your build again, after i noticed that my track bar pulls the axle around 4in side to side when going from full drop to full bump stops during the shock travel..i have 14" shocks now how bad does your go side to side? and is there a better way to make this so it doesnt push and pull the axle while traveling threw the susp

Nope. That's what you get for running a panhard. But it's a good thing if you have set it up right. If done correctly that 4 inches should match the arc that your draglink travels in.

If you don't want that then you need to triangulate. This will cause a direct up down travel. But then the suspension cycle won't match your drag link and you will get bad bumpsteer. That means going full hydro to get rid of the draglink

Waiting right now for a few things to happen before I update the coilover situation. All I will say for tonight is that engineers from Rancho have been in touch with me to resolve the issues. I will update with a full breakdown of what has happened when the setup is looking good.

For now I've been doing some work on other systems of the jeep. Gas tank was first. I moved the stock tank to behind the front seats. I originally was going to drop it through the floor as far as I could to keep it low. But when I started to look at it it just seemed like more work than it was worth. So I went home and couldn't sleep at all due to the guilt. Why half ass it now?

Tank skid modified and droped in....

http://i3.tinypic.com/118m3x1.jpg

http://i3.tinypic.com/118m5cj.jpg


From below.....

http://i2.tinypic.com/118m5js.jpg

http://i3.tinypic.com/118m5py.jpg


It was actually a much bigger job than I thought it would be. There are 2 reinforcing ribs in the floor to cut out plus the rear crossmember and body mounts. I will need to fab a new crossmember and rework those body mounts. That's the plan anyway though to reinforce the notch in the frame.

The other thing I've been working on is the seat mounts. I'm about half way through one, but I ran out of mig gas so it'll have to wait till tomorow to finish.

Teaser shot....

http://i2.tinypic.com/118m989.jpg


Originally I was just gonna make a fixed mount. But while mocking up the seat for hight I realised what a bitch it would be to slide in and out if the seat can't move back farther than it would be while driving it. I sit a little closer to the wheel than most guys my height, but I feel more stable and in control that way.

Looks good brink. I hope Rancho will be able to help you with their shocks. Either way this is educational for all who wish to run those shocks. Over time you should think about mounting the seats directly to the cage though. (yeah, my tj needs it too) If something that big goes over, you'll want as much protection as possible.

The seats would be much better on the cage wouldn't they? Just am getting a little anxious to go wheeling. Our season isn't as long as the one in the southern states (I'm in Alberta Canada) don't want to waste it. That will be on my to do list though. More cage work period is required before any serious trails are looked at (stock cage is all I have and that idea scared the crap out of me)

Everyone can expect more info on the Rancho coilovers and my experience with them very soon. Just want to have everything taken care of before I start to say too much about what has happened. At any rate I will say that thus far it has been a positive experience.

what seats are you going to put in

Corbeau Baja SS Suspension seats.

Page 4 I think

But here they are again.
http://i2.tinypic.com/sym5qv.jpg

Not sure how to mount my daughters princess chair yet. Any ideas guys? She'd be pissed though. She loves these Cobeau's. Nothing like a 6 year old watching cartoons sitting in your new suspension seats when there's a perfectly good couch right there.

Corbeau Baja SS Suspension seats.

Page 4 I think

But here they are again.
http://i2.tinypic.com/sym5qv.jpg

Not sure how to mount my daughters princess chair yet. Any ideas guys? She'd be pissed though. She loves these Cobeau's. Nothing like a 6 year old watching cartoons sitting in your new suspension seats when there's a perfectly good couch right there.


I think you should mount the pink seat. :laughing:

Did you get your sliders from Corbeau as well? I just put the ones just like you seats (except with cloth centers) in my yj and they were a PITA to mount to my stock risers. Ended up pie cuting my risers and making 4 brackets per seat.

The sliders are just from a set of RCI fiberglass buckets that a friend has in the shop. They were laying around and I decided at the last minute I wanted sliders so that's what I'm making fit.

I was going to just go fixed mount. But when I mocked up the seat it was looking very difficult to get in and out of the Jeep unless the seat could slide back farther.

Seats are fully mounted now. Drivers has a slide and the passengers is fixed in place.

http://i5.tinypic.com/11k9fuw.jpg
http://i5.tinypic.com/11k9g2a.jpg
http://i5.tinypic.com/11k8r43.jpg

Also picked up my reverse motion steering box. The pitman comes forward instead of back. This will give me the clearance I need between the draglink and the axle now that the axle is way forward of stock.

http://i6.tinypic.com/11k8rhd.jpg
http://i5.tinypic.com/11k8u2u.jpg

Now I just need info on tapping it. Havn't looked at it closely yet. Maybe it's the same as a regular Sag box. Anyone got info on it for me?

i screwed up mine and tapped in the wrong place, so now im waiting on a PSC box

same as any other saginaw box as far as assist ports

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=20532

Any opinions on which way is better.....

Tap into the body of the box:
http://wheelingarizona.com/forums/download.php?id=1724

Or into the 2 caps:
http://img48.photobucket.com/albums/v146/psychobilly/junk_016.jpg
http://img48.photobucket.com/albums/v146/psychobilly/junk_002.jpg



The first pic is the most common way I have come across on the net. Funny thing is that I have seen a couple in person the 2nd way, tapping the caps. But never seen it online untill today.

Pros and Cons other than needing to weld onto the end cap instead of just tapping it?

Also trying to find info on what ram to pick up.

Thinking of a.....
1.5" bore
8" stroke
3/4" shaft

Sound right or wrong? Pros and cons to other options? What will changin any one of the bore/stroke/shaft numbers do? I can't find any threads that explain what to look for in a ram. A few give opinions on what specific models to get (that's wher I picked these specs from) but nothing on why.

I tapped mine as in the first picture. I had a friend tap the caps and had lots of issues with it, you will have to weld a fitting since the front cap is aluminum and can't tap it directly.

I also used a 1.5" bore, 8" stroke, 3/4" shaft, if you change to a bigger bore, the steering will be slow because the pump can't keep up, the stroke is dependent on the travel, always get a stroke size equal or bigger than what you need, (not smaller) because once the steering box reaches its stops, the fluid will be by-passed back to the reservoir (if the cylinder and the box are mechanically connected), as for the rod size, if the rod size is big, the cylinder will have more pull than push because there will be a larger volume on one side, for a 3/4" shaft, the push/pull numbers are close.

I also had a friend tap his on the cap end of the box and first trip out had failures almost imediately. Took one bounce wrong off of a rock and the rock hit the fitting and caused a small leak....it was just enough to cause the system to hold no pressure whatsoever. We ended up strong-arming 42'' TSL's all day in a TJ on 1 tons.

Just the kind of info I needed. Thanks guys.

Tonight I built the crossmembers to tie the shock towers together. Then I promptly forgot to take any pics of them. They will have to wait till tomorrow.

After that I got going on the tube fenders for the front. Those I do have pics of.....

Cut the stock fender...
http://i5.tinypic.com/11u7qyp.jpg
http://i5.tinypic.com/11u7sww.jpg.
http://i6.tinypic.com/11u7tck.jpg

Next I bent some 1.25" tubing to 90deg. Here's the test fit...
http://i5.tinypic.com/11u7tip.jpg

And after some welding and a little grinding...
http://i5.tinypic.com/11u7tw8.jpg



This is only the start. I am goint to do a extended flare following the stock flare lines. Need to keep it semi street legal so I can get it back and forth to the trails at least. It will also be tied into my stinger and shock towers for strength.

More updates after I work on it tomorrow.

More fender progress....

Front just needs a brace back to the shock hoop and some skin...

http://i5.tinypic.com/11w3vab.jpg

http://i5.tinypic.com/11w3vno.jpg

http://i5.tinypic.com/11w3vqe.jpg

Damn...a bit wide eh ?:flipoff2:

hey man just wanted to give u some info on the hydro stuff.

ive run the tap'd caps for like 3 years. here is the thing though. for a few bucks you can get a beef'd cap for the end of the box. just go that route. i tap'd the stock cap in a rush for a comp. we made it though the comp but like 2 days later i was pulling out of a parking spot at a bar when i crank'd the wheel over the front cap blew. basicly the nut on the end of the piston inside the box was hitting the fitting which eventually busted the cap.

i had ordered a cap from emsoffroad before the comp but he hadnt finished them so i ran the stocker. the night i blew the cap i just ran home and swap'd it with the cap he sent me. havent had any isues since then.

http://www.emsoffroad.com/hydroassist.htm

its a BEFFY cap. i was wheel'n about a year ago without my front bumper.... i slip'd off a ledge i was climbing and set the whole front end down on the cap. the thing held!!!!

Damn...a bit wide eh ?:flipoff2:


Yeah the SRD and cops are getting really picky here. If not for them or if I had a trailer already I would just leave it with no extra flair. As it is this is 7" of flair. Same as the Warn ones I ran last year.

Think I'll do the "Flair" part in black to make it look more like a regular flair. If it's all body color it tends to look like a big stupid surfboard in my opinion.

Thanks for the link dustpuppy. That looks like a really high quality piece.

I need to rebuild my box anyway. It's leaking all over the place and has been sitting at a wreckers for who knows how long, so I think I'll just tap the 2 spots on the casting instead of the caps. Always nice to have options though.

Small update on the work...

Shock tower crossmembers...
http://i6.tinypic.com/14icunt.jpg

Mounted in the front...
http://i6.tinypic.com/14icuwh.jpg

Also installed my Dana 300 Flipped. I'll give more details on that in the next few days.

Tonight I got it mounted to the flip ring I modified/made. And built a new crossmember for it. The pics turned out questionable for the crossmember. I'll grab some new ones tomorow.

Not giving up much clearance....
http://i6.tinypic.com/14icxdy.jpg

http://i5.tinypic.com/14icxme.jpg

Also an update on the Rancho coilovers.

Of course when I first installed them the height they put me at was really high. I posted on Pirate to try to find help and a solution to my problem. The spring rates that I had chosen were based on what I had heard others were running for similar rigs.

Not sure if everyone is aware but when I first asked about the Rancho Coilovers on Pirate there was a largely negative response from the powers that be on the board. Mostly sighting customer service as the biggest problem.

While I can't yet make conclusions about the performance of the coilovers (I see no reason to be worried about it) I can very much comment on the customer service at Rancho.

On May 16, a couple days after posting my questions about what I was doing wrong, I received an Email from Chris Batsch. Chris is an engineer at Rancho. His email stated that he was made aware of my situation and wanted to make sure I got it worked out. He asked for my number and a good time to call. I provided my number and said 4:30 the next afternoon would work. 4:31 the next day my phone rings and it was Chris. We discussed my project, and what was happening with the coilovers I had gotten. I fully acknowledged that I had gotten exactly what I had ordered. Chris got some info from me and said he'd call the next day with some possible solutions. In the meanwhile I also ran a lot of numbers to find out where I believed I should be with coil rates. A couple members of Pirate were also a big help in this. Chris and I talked several more times before we felt like we found a solution for me....


Yesterday this arrived at my door...
http://i5.tinypic.com/14id73m.jpg

6 new springs and some catalogues.


Chris has been great to deal with on this issue. He has gone out of his way to be sure that I will be happy with my Rancho product.

There are many great vendors on Pirate, and manufacturers of equipment to choose from. When it comes to customer service, Rancho has ranked right up there with any of them for me.

I havn't gotten them installed yet. The build thread will have more info when they get under the Jeep.

Big thanks to Rancho for taking care of it's customer.

Sweet build thus far man, keep up the good work, id say clean, but it seems everything you own is dirty as hell at the moment!

oh and forget about the sweet buckets, i think you should use the pink disney princess's chair.

Nice customer service by Rancho, now lets hope those coilovers do what you want em to!
Scott

Finally an update.

Damn Jeep has been fighting me really bad for the last few weeks. Seems like anything I try to do just won't work or is a real bitch at the very least. Here's the progress from lately and also some of the setbacks.

Mounted up the new caliper brackets that I have front and rear. Looking forward to not having my rear drums full of mud and ruined after every run.
http://i3.tinypic.com/16023o3.jpg
http://i5.tinypic.com/16023qh.jpg

Front end all pinned together...
http://i4.tinypic.com/16025gk.jpg

Also tapped my Astro Van Steering box (reverse pitman arm)

http://i5.tinypic.com/1602650.jpg

However on an 03 it is NOT a bolt in. The newer style merc box that is on the 03 and up has a different bolt pattern and differenent hydraulic fittings. So I need to move 1 bolt sleeve, and I think I will swap out the steering pump for one off of an older TJ so that it will bolt up. With my luck that won't work either.

And finally got it sitting on its new Rancho coils tonight.

http://i4.tinypic.com/160297c.jpg

The fronts look pretty great. Won't even need any helpers. Running 5" up and 10" down travel. The rear looks like it needs either softer coils or some helper coils to keep tension under droop. Have to see once I have gas and gear in it I think.

Also want to make it known again how great Rancho has been to deal with through all of this. They have gone above and beyond all my expectations again in regards to the customer service on my coilovers. They are well worth checking out if you are in the market for some.

Thanks Chris.

:grinpimp: Dude sweet built, keep it. It makes me wont to get a Jeep sooner



Edit

?????? Thanks I think ????? :confused:

English is not a stong subject in some places??!!?? looking good on the build, and good to hear about the rancho customer service!

It's hard to tell from the picture, but are you going to run 30 spline outers, if you are, then I highly recommend you switch to 35 spline outers, I broke my stock 30 spline stubs with only 38", I was lucky I didn't damage anything else, but they usually do.

Also, if you plan on doing any kind of high steer on those ford knuckles I would plate them around the kingpin caps, because they will break on you.

Finally, from the pictures, it seems that you haven't pushed your front forward enough to run the reverse motion box, take a look at go_vols TJ, do you plan on moving the whole box to the back?

I'm just trying to help you out.

Blue, I thought welding onto cast was a no-no? I have a saved pic of a braced Ford knuckle thinking I want to do that (running hi-steer) but was told it creates heat stresses or crack or something??

How far do you HAVE to move forward to use a reverse box? 5-7" I think I saw before?

Eric, I see you put a new caliper bracket on the front 60, is this so you can run a single piston front caliper? Did you do this because of your rim size? I looked at grinding down a dual piston Ford caliper for 15" rims and quickly dismissed that idea :)

What are the wheel spacers for?

-Joe

It's hard to tell from the picture, but are you going to run 30 spline outers, if you are, then I highly recommend you switch to 35 spline outers, I broke my stock 30 spline stubs with only 38", I was lucky I didn't damage anything else, but they usually do.

Also, if you plan on doing any kind of high steer on those ford knuckles I would plate them around the kingpin caps, because they will break on you.

Finally, from the pictures, it seems that you haven't pushed your front forward enough to run the reverse motion box, take a look at go_vols TJ, do you plan on moving the whole box to the back?

I'm just trying to help you out.

Thanks for all the heads up info.

The 30 spline outers are all that's in the budget right now. 35's are very much on my wish list. Luckily what we wheel up here is not as hard on axles as the rocks you guys see down there. With a little luck they will get me by for the time being. Gonna have to.

I have similar concerns as Joey on the welding of the knuckles. I'll look into it some more though. The idea makes a lot of sense since that is a weak link.

That's really gonna suck if the box won't work. I havn't looked at it enough maybe. I'll mock it up tonight if I get time and see what it looks like.

The front caliper brackets are for running the 15" rims. I don't think you can safely grind enough out of the stock dual pistons to clear.

No spacers in the pics Joey. But I am using some on the rear are for clearance between the coilovers and tires when things are twisted up (1 side drooped the other stuffed). How did you see them?

Ive been spying on you...









Saw the spacers underneath the rig in one pic :)

-Joe

Blue, I thought welding onto cast was a no-no? I have a saved pic of a braced Ford knuckle thinking I want to do that (running hi-steer) but was told it creates heat stresses or crack or something??


Check this thread (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=336816) out. Pre-heat and let it cool slowly. Should do the trick, I'm only running a flipped tie-rod in the stock location, but I was thinking about plating the knuckles anyway.

Flipped tie-rod is my plan aswell. High steer on the pass side for the drag link. With the hydro assist the tie rod should see most the stress, and its mount is not as bad in the stock location right? That's my understanding. The stresses be handled better down there than leveraging from the top of the kingpin.

Bent the tube for the first rear fender tonight.

Went really well. I'm getting a lot better with the bender. Figuring out where it will start and stop and then there's nothing to it...

http://i3.tinypic.com/1628hhd.jpg


But then I got greedy and wanted it tweeked just a little. What a fawking nightmare that turned into. In the end, after cutting it up a little, I finally got it all welded back to how it originally was bent. And go figure I really like it...

http://i4.tinypic.com/1628ieb.jpg

http://i5.tinypic.com/1628jsh.jpg

The square tubing is just temporary to hold it in place while I mocked up. I still need to add some tubing back to the body at the corners of the top bends. Then sheet it in with something.
http://i5.tinypic.com/1628k11.jpg

Also spent some time looking at the steering. I think you are totally right BlueAngel. Thanks for the heads up. That box will but the pitman to far forward.

I have a saginaw box out of a J20. I think I will tap that and build a mount in the right spot, forward and rotated up, from the stock location. Why half ass it now? Should have done that instead of the astro one from the beginning maybe.

Also spent some time looking at the steering. I think you are totally right BlueAngel. Thanks for the heads up. That box will but the pitman to far forward.

I have a saginaw box out of a J20. I think I will tap that and build a mount in the right spot, forward and rotated up, from the stock location. Why half ass it now? Should have done that instead of the astro one from the beginning maybe.

You're welcome. This sounds like a better plan.

More fender progress.

Bending tube is getting to be better and better.

Here's the mirror image of the drivers side for the rear...

http://i5.tinypic.com/168ftcm.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/168ftpi.jpg

Other than the obvious blown measurement it came out great.



Front fender ready for some sheet metal...
http://i5.tinypic.com/168fu9z.jpg

Rear fender ready for some sheet metal...
http://i4.tinypic.com/168fwbl.jpg
http://i3.tinypic.com/168fuig.jpg

Is that sheetmetal going to be strong enough to hold those fenders? It seems that they would break right off if your new fenders were to hit something on the trail.

Not expecting a problem. It's pretty strong already. Will get better when the sheet is welded to the tub the whole way plus the tube. Plus I have 7" of tire still outside them. Tire will contact first.

Our trails are not likely to cause really major side contact in my experience. The rocks you guys play on is a little different.

This is plenty strong. Thanks for the input though.

Not expecting a problem. It's pretty strong already. Will get better when the sheet is welded to the tub the whole way plus the tube. Plus I have 7" of tire still outside them. Tire will contact first.

Our trails are not likely to cause really major side contact in my experience. The rocks you guys play on is a little different.

This is plenty strong. Thanks for the input though.

Ok, just thought I would point that out because my tire sticks out about a foot past my rear fenders because I have crusher corners and no flares and my crusher corners still get rock hits on the trails we ride on.

Looks like it will come together nicely. I'm very interested in the fender work you're doing, keep it up ;)

Ok, just thought I would point that out because my tire sticks out about a foot past my rear fenders because I have crusher corners and no flares and my crusher corners still get rock hits on the trails we ride on.


Crazy. I think that shows the big difference between your trails and the ones around us up here in Canada. If they are going to make contact I will need to reinforce the sheetmetal body where things are fastened. Maybe tie the fenders into the cage or at least plate the quarters with heavier material.

Thanks for the heads up. :smokin:

Crazy. I think that shows the big difference between your trails and the ones around us up here in Canada. If they are going to make contact I will need to reinforce the sheetmetal body where things are fastened. Maybe tie the fenders into the cage or at least plate the quarters with heavier material.

Thanks for the heads up. :smokin:

That is what I would suggest. Since you are good with your metal working skills, I would plate the rear with some 3/16 steel and tie the front and rear into your rockers guards. :cool2:
Do you plan on putting on some body mounted rocker guards?

In case you're looking for hydro assist kits, I got an 8" ram lines and brackets from them for a pretty good price. Ask them if they offer a discount to Pirate folks. Not sure what shipping would be to CAD but might not be too bad. http://www.rocklogic4x4.com/home.php

Same kit I just helped install on a buddies rig. Same thing going on mine ASAP....nice stuff.

I'm really inspired by this build up. I was going to go from 33's to 37's on my little rubi (which is the same color as your TJ, so I know how mine would look if I did that same thing you did.) and just put some alloy's in to be a little safer. After trolling this thread for a while, I think I'm gonna ditch the rubi axles and go with some 60's and 40 or 42" tires. Keep up the awesome work! Guess I gotta get out the sawzall too:D

Sounds like a plan 2001svt. Going 37's may want to get bigger axles even. I don't have a lot of faith in the Rubi 44's. It's a glorified dana 30 in the front :shaking:


Todays update. Good progress....

Steering box moved. This one is the J20 box...
http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg4z6c.jpg

Winch Mount....
http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg515j.jpg

Tube fenders sheeted in....
http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg51t2.jpg

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg520l.jpg

Front stinger pics....

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg547n.jpg

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg54p2.jpg

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg54zm.jpg

Thinking of connecting the stinger and the winch mount still. Something like this....

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg5c7n.jpg

http://i6.tinypic.com/1zg5e9t.jpg

Looking sharp bud. Im so far behind I think Im in first. But at least Im pretty much done the wifes. Maybe she'll let me take it for a spin when you are ready to do a shake down run.


Oh an side note.

The YJ and up d30 got d44 ujoints and balljoints. Unlike the dinky CJ d30's. A newer D30 is more like a polished one, beefed up with 44 parts. Only thing on a jeep 44 unlike most is axle tubes, and low pinion on the front unlike the ol fords.

Otherwise, same balljoint as a 30, 44, and similar to those on ford balljoint d60...................:D :D

Anyways, ttyl. I'll let you know what I figure out on the stupid clip situation.

Good info Bill. Thanks. Lot's of users of those axles around. How do the shafts compare?

When are we gonna see some offroad action:confused:
I've really enjoyed your thread.
Mike

for my first post.... great build! phenomenal craftsmanship, and awesome pics, very detailed!! im doing something similar. im putting some rockwells on a 99TJ. i will have to start a build thread with it. goodluck finishing it, and post up a sweet flex shot once you have it done!

Getting close isn't it. Hoping to have it home midweek. Then I can do the painting and some odds and ends. Realistically could be on a shakedown run this weekend.

Crossing my fingers. :smokin:

Tied up a lot of loose ends this week. Lots of late nights but it's really been paying off for me. (Thanks for the help Jason).

T-case linkage...
http://i2.tinypic.com/1zxmt10.jpg
Yes the driveshaft clears at all suspension cycles. :flipoff2:


The shifters...
http://i1.tinypic.com/1zxmut3.jpg

Limiting Straps all done...
http://i2.tinypic.com/1zxmxw5.jpg

And it roared to life at last. (Way to come through with the fuel line clips Jason!)

Rolled it out of the shop for the first time. Took it for a rip and it feels great. Needs a wheel alignment but drives smooth and stable. The rancho's can control body roll very well by dialing int he shock valving.

Actually drove it home to Sylvan. Did 100km/hr (thats about 60-65miles I think guys) all the way with no problems.

Still have the body work and paint work to do. Not to mention exhaust (hence the
"roaring" to life) That can happen here though. Then it's on to wheeling it. Should happen on the weekend of the 22nd.

http://i2.tinypic.com/1zxmy60.jpg

http://i2.tinypic.com/1zxnn8g.jpg

http://i2.tinypic.com/1zxnnf9.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/1zxnnlu.jpg

Great built looks nice man

Thanks FJ.


Also forgot to mention that the steering is teporary. Need to get my high steer arms and new tie rod/drag link. Aswell as hook up the hydro assist.

looks great man i cant wait to see some pics of it in action...

what kinda of driveshaft angles are you running front and rear? how did you get them not to bind when both axles are drooped? i need at least 45` at my rear driveshaft when full droop..i already blew my rear cv up

i belive im going to use some limiting straps to fix this but still just seeing what your angles are at?
here is a pic of mine i think it might be too high after reading your thread again and seeing your pics..this is on 38.5

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f9/prostock3/done23.jpg
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f9/prostock3/done.jpg

Nice job Brink! We'll have to try and hook up for a trip before the year ends. If you're ready, a few of us are heading out to Prairie Creek the weekend of the 22 and 23 - mostly 40"+ Jeeps. PM me if you're interested.

Great job man! Hope that all works out for ya. Hope to see those coilovers in some action pics!?
Mike-