Bobby has asked me to make this post in regards to the heat treating of the Birfields. many of you have called asking what exactly is being heat treated. here's the rundown. The bell of the birfield is heat treated and a ring is welded on the end of it. The two piece cage is heat treated. The shaft on the Birfield from the bell to the hub end is left untouched. He has stated that he has no control of that end of the axle and it has not been made softer.

thanks for the 411

i got mine today, that video is pretty nutz!

We just received a set at the shop for the 4Runner Jambo give away.... and every thread needs a picture right?

whats a birfield:flipoff2:

If you weld the ring on after the heat treatment aren't you killing what you did by annealing it in the HAZ region of the weld? Or are you welding and then heat treating?

XJPete87,
Good question, I would guess that it's treated after the welding, otherwise it would weaken it at the weld area as you stated. If this isn't how it's being done, then I seriously wouldn't believe that they would be lasting anywhere nears as well as they appear to be.

Physics.

The bell of the birfield is heat treated and a ring is welded on the end of it. The two piece cage is heat treated. The shaft on the Birfield from the bell to the hub end is left untouched. He has stated that he has no control of that end of the axle and it has not been made softer.
Through-treating thick metals generally involves the rough equivalent of large ovens... even if you insulate the shaft or manage to find a way to keep it outside the oven, metal is a fairly conductive substance... it makes sense to me that it would be pretty hard to localize the heat treat. you can flame-treat or case-harden the exterior of an axle, for instance, but through-hardening... well, that's pretty hard to limit to local spots in the axle....

Still skeptical about the process, but becoming slowly more impressed by the product on the trail.

Randii

How can you be a non believer? What's it going to take?

Well, i will ask;
What is his website or email. phone # maybe?

Originally posted by XJPete87
If you weld the ring on after the heat treatment aren't you killing what you did by annealing it in the HAZ region of the weld? Or are you welding and then heat treating? what dose it matter if it works then who cares when he dose it. and it seams to be working.as more and more use them the test gets tuffer and tuffer.hec if he stuck them in peanutbutter and that worked that would be ok with me.you need to spend your time on some thing inportant like how thay got the ship in that bottle:eek:

Originally posted by fabricator
Well, i will ask;
What is his website or email. phone # maybe?

www.toyotasuperaxles.com

Originally posted by randii
The bell of the birfield is heat treated and a ring is welded on the end of it. The two piece cage is heat treated. The shaft on the Birfield from the bell to the hub end is left untouched. He has stated that he has no control of that end of the axle and it has not been made softer.
Through-treating thick metals generally involves the rough equivalent of large ovens... even if you insulate the shaft or manage to find a way to keep it outside the oven, metal is a fairly conductive substance... it makes sense to me that it would be pretty hard to localize the heat treat. you can flame-treat or case-harden the exterior of an axle, for instance, but through-hardening... well, that's pretty hard to limit to local spots in the axle....

Still skeptical about the process, but becoming slowly more impressed by the product on the trail.

Randii

I have a Redline kit you can buy .....

Originally posted by Chris Geiger
Every thread needs a picture right? No, every thread need *two* pictures. ;)

I gotta say that I am a believer and I haven't even run them yet...

Oh yeah, the new outer snap ring kicks ass. Took about 5 seconds to put it on and another 5 sec to take it off. No more whining about the old style snap ring, that used to kick my ass;)

Does he give you one that fits snap-ring pliers with them? I know he's including them.

The stock ones are for lock-ring pliers, which most people don't have the first time. They're not for snap-ring pliers. A couple seconds with a grinder and file, and I "converted"mine:
<img src="http://home.off-road.com/~mithrandir/axlepics/snapring.jpg">

The ones I got with mine had the little o o in them so the snap ring pliers actually have something to grab onto.

"what dose it matter if it works then who cares when he dose it. and it seams to be working.as more and more use them the test gets tuffer and tuffer.hec if he stuck them in peanutbutter and that worked that would be ok with me.you need to spend your time on some thing inportant like how thay got the ship in that bottle"

Good point, toy 4 rox! As long as it works!


"No more whining about the old style snap ring, that used to kick my ass"

Ummm, just go buy the correct pliers and it's no problem.

Originally posted by toy 4 rox
what dose it matter if it works then who cares when he dose it. and it seams to be working.as more and more use them the test gets tuffer and tuffer.hec if he stuck them in peanutbutter and that worked that would be ok with me.you need to spend your time on some thing inportant like how thay got the ship in that bottle:eek:

It doesn't matter. I know they work from the guys on this forum. I think you took my post the wrong way. I'm a Mechanical Engineer this stuff is what I do. I wasn't trying to say the longfields suck or anything, mearly just asking a question for my own purposes. But if its welded than heat treated it would be even stronger then if its heat treated than welded. There may be other processes needed as well to get rid of residual stresses but this isn't a material properties class.:D

Like I said, I am becoming more impressed....

How can you be a non believer? What's it going to take?
Fatty, if you spoke to me from a burning bush, that would convince me. :D :flipoff2: :D Especially if you were holding out two Longfields axle-out and bell-in, and I had a calibrated infrared heat detector to validate that the axle stubs were room temperature and the bells were 350 degrees. :goofball:

Certainly real-world experience is mounting up, but I have been on this ride before, and ended up too many times on a barstool at the Broken Birfield Bar, sharing brew with others who've busted the latest and greatest joint.

As for what does it matter, scroll up to the top of the page, and spend some time studying the location line -- especially the part that appears betwen Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board and Toyota Truck and 4Runner Talk... this is the 4x4 Tech Talk forum.... so talking about the technical background is pretty darn ON-topic. :rolleyes:

Think I'll go dip my Birfields in peanut butter -- I read on the Internet that this'll make 'm indestuctable.... :D

Randii

XJPete87,
No offense intended, I agree that you have valid questions.


Pass the peanut butter, please!

Fatty, if you spoke to me from a burning bush, that would convince me. :smokin:

there should be plenty of peaple running them at the jambo with all that peerpressure.if there going to break this is the place:eek: :D

I actually had the pleasure of holding a Longfield last night at a club meeting and compare it to a stocker. Schit, I'm impressed. I'll take a pair please.