Friday question:

"What would you use for a donor to build the best rock crawling rig for under $3000?"

I'm a long time Land Cruiser fan, but will be the first to admit they can get expensive. I'd like a trail rig for less than Nolan's front axle! :D

So it seems a 1 ton capacity 4x4 with stout axles, front disk brakes, reasonably strong drivetrain. So if I find a donor for $1000, I still have $2000 to build something up... but what would you recommend as the starting donor?

Tom "usa"

good luck!

Go with a Sammi, and throw some Toyota truck axles under it.;)

My wheelin buddy back home just picked up a 1984 1 ton chevy Diesel 4x4. Its an ex military 5/4 ton truck. he got it for 1000$ and it only has 84000 orig mile on it. I would suggest this and then put it on a serious diet...remove bed and doors, cut fenders to desired tire size. Cheap steel wheels, tires and lift are attainable used from classifieds somewhere. Buzz the spiders together with a welder and go crawlin. Happy hunting


-j-rOd

Originally posted by roundrocktom
So it seems a 1 ton capacity 4x4 with stout axles, front disk brakes, reasonably strong drivetrain. So if I find a donor for $1000, I still have $2000 to build something up... but what would you recommend as the starting donor?

Tom "usa"

Yep! Find yourself a 1 ton for $1000 - you'll get a v8, stout tranny and tcase, plus 1 ton axles. Toss the bed and build a flat bed, hack up the front fenders or completely remove them. Then weld the rear diff, toss a small lift on it and big tires :D

I would go to China and buy a $3000 lamp and hope a Genie pops out of it and grants me 3 wishes!!! :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

The sammi with toy axles gets my vote also.

Yeah, good luck.

About the only vehicle I could think of that could be built for cheap is a Suzuki Samuria. Buy it cheap, do a spring over using stock springs, throw in some lockrights, and add a low range gear set to the t-case. Throw on some used 31s becuase they're cheap, add a roll cage, and you are done. Sure its no monster rockcrawler with 1 ton axles, but it doesn't have to be.

Maybe Wilson will post a reply. I know he is building a pretty nice sounding zuk on the kind of budget your talking about.

Depends on the kind of wheeling, but for rocks the cheapest thing you can get that is durable is a zuk. You can buy a zuk for a couple hundred, toy or waggy axles for a couple hundred more, and have money left for gears and lockers etc. I've seen built zuks for close to 3000 on this board, ready to run.

Toy trucks can be done for not a lot as well, its just hard to find a cheap truck worth buying.

Well I am attempting to get a pretty built rig for under 3K. I picked up a toyota pu for 500 cause I didn't want the front or rear end and there wasn't anything really good on the cab as far as metal goes, but the engine, trans, and t-case is good. I got a set of rockwells for 700 and some wheels for 140. I am hoping to get a set of 44"tsl's off a guy for 1k which are pretty new. I am gunna have to shell out 400 for another t-case adapter for dual cases. Going 1/4 elliptic rear end so springs are 75 and 4 link about 100. F150 leaves in the front-50 bucks. Then I figure I'll have about 100 bucks in tube work. I might also have 100 or dollars in misc. metal and materials. Course I am doing it all myself so that is a huge thing right there. So I guess that puts me just over 3K but it is using pretty heavy duty stuff and bigger than normal tires. It can be done if you can do it yourself.

Thats easy! There are $300-$500 scouts out there. Most with a v8 and a t-18 or t-19or a 727 hooked to a D20 with front and rear D44s. It is a great platform to build from.

I bought this one for 300.00

Originally posted by jhama78
My wheelin buddy back home just picked up a 1984 1 ton chevy Diesel 4x4. Its an ex military 5/4 ton truck. .................................................. .................................................. ..................... Happy hunting


-j-rOd

Anyone else see a problem with that truck size??? 5/4ton....hmmmmmmm :rasta:

Anyway my vote goes to the 1-ton truck idea.:nuke: :beer:

any 1 ton truck for $1000 will more than likely need $2000 worth parts. i like the sami with toy running gear. thats possible. kinda like the miniature version of a jeep with 1 ton running gear.:D i put my heep together for under $5000. took along time to find all the good deals though.:beer:

Originally posted by Cliffhanger


Anyone else see a problem with that truck size??? 5/4ton....hmmmmmmm :rasta:



Did you fail school? 5/4 ton is the same as 1 & 1/4 ton -common military rating :p:p:p ;)






As for building a trail rig for under $3k - sure. I will one or more of the following things though:

1. Just "happen" on a "deal" (check my 77 3/4 ton Dodge thread down the page :p )
2. Wait it out and come across enough deals to put one together
3. Come across someone wanting to get out of the sport and has done most of thw work for you on a project rig.


$3k can be done, but I can guarantee for $5k it can be done EASILY.

sami, waggy d44 axles, wrangler springs, 5.89's, weld the rear, lockrite front, you could build it nice for under $3k tires and all but what will push you over will be the sumo t-case gearscause unless you are running 33's the 4to1's won't be enough. even with 5.89's.

Get a running J-truck, take the bed off, go SOA and buy new tires.

i have two rigs right now that were built for under 3k each. one is a zuk on 33s a 4.16 t case welded tracker rear with 5.12s and a 5.12 samuria front. the other is a fj 62 with a soa 5.29 gears a lockrite in the front and a welded rear on 38.5 sxs on home made beadlocks. it just takes some shopping and making do with what you can get cheap. both of these rigs have been to moab, s.w.colorado and clayton. and have done very well.
http://bbs.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/53-690881-Dscn1913.jpg i had the land cruiser under 1800 with tags and inspection, but then i bought a new set of sxs got tired of the bald 38sxs that i bought at pate swap meet for 150 bucks.

two nice trucks in the for sale section. i don't know either of these guys, but both seem to be good deals.


http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33837

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=44272

get a free Scout. That's what I did. Actually I got three of them. I'm building 1. My goal was to get it on the road for under $500. did not make it. But I will pull in under $1000. If I had another two grand - WOW! I could get bead locks and good gears.

Check my web site for more details. You can build a good rig under 3K.

Ritch :flipoff2: http://home.off-road.com/~nwmud/images/thm71stripped.jpg

Where are you guys finding all the scouts? I'd love to have an 800, but around here the only thing you find is a pile of rust chips covering a pair of axles;)

Originally posted by oldjeep
Where are you guys finding all the scouts? I'd love to have an 800, but around here the only thing you find is a pile of rust chips covering a pair of axles;)


Own a scout and they will come. I bought this one for a hundred bucks. A buddy and I were working on his Scout out in front of my house. There was a little girl and her dad riding by on bikes. I heard her say " look daddy there is another one of those ugly trucks". I started to laugh and the father approached us with a deal . He had bought a house that came with a scout in the side yard and he wanted it gone. The truck had suffered from a small electrical fire on all the ignition wires. We hot wired it and drove it on to the trailer!.:D :D

Just start with a fullsize, so you have the drivetrain you want. You just can't care about mashing sheetmetal.
Scott

I started looking for parts for my YJ project about a year ago. Here's what I managed to scrounge up.
1989 YJ - 258/ax-15/np-231
1970 3/4 Ton chevy - 350/sm465/np205/eaton rear(with detroit)/44 front both with 4.56 gears.

The YJ was 1300 (all CDN dollars) and the chev was 600 with a dana 60 rear thrown in and a extra set of rims.

I sold the tires, rims, motor, tranny, t-case, softtop off the YJ for 1600 (still trying to shake the 60 and the YJ axels......)
Brought another softtop with full soft doors for 200. Got a built 350 with projection for 1100 and a open knuckle 44 for 100 bucks.

So as it stands right now i'm, in to a rig for 1700 and I got enough to put it together. I stil need rims, tires, brakes, shocks,misc parts....
I set a budget of $5000 CDN which is around $3000 USD. So if I can get the rig put together for another $3300 I'll end up with a trail rig for approximately $3000...


Ya just got to look for deals and wait till you get everything..

Tom..go with the Samurai. I bought one for $500, have less then another $100 in it and it's running again. I'll do the buildup slow (no $$) but will have fun with it and it's the right size for Barnwell, Clayton etc.

Cmon out and see it sometime :)

I have seen a few Sammi's already built for under $3K on the sale board here.

Originally posted by oldjeep
Where are you guys finding all the scouts? I'd love to have an 800, but around here the only thing you find is a pile of rust chips covering a pair of axles;)

True

A guy in my club has a 800 with around 40K miles on it sitting at his cabin in CO.

Can't wait untilhe starts hacking in to that rig:)

Heres a pic of what I am talking about, its a 5/4 ton a.k.a. 1 and a quarter ton chevy with d 60 front and14 bolt rear.

http://www.militaryvehicles.com/vehicle_10.shtml

Heres a site with some other pix of Army vhehicles for your viewing pleasure.

http://www.armytrucks.com/page2.html

-j-rOd

whatever you can find cheap is the right one. I paid $350 for my cj-3a, another $20 in sheetmetal patched the floors (actually built them from scratch) engine ran with only a little smoke, spoa was cheap (stock shocks fit ok if you reverse the plates) 33's from the local wrecker was another $200, used 15x8 white spokes $50, welded the rearend, lengthened the driveshafts with some spare cage tubing, $300 for the cage, seats were free from the back of the shop where they were molding. off we go wheeling

what i am saying is if you take time and don't expect the ultimate set of wheels right off you are good to go, if you expect a lot you will be spending lots of money.

oh yeah that cj-3a was a match offroad for some of my buddies $15,000 cj-7's although the suzuki's gave me a run for it.

Originally posted by Dr. Lame


True

A guy in my club has a 800 with around 40K miles on it sitting at his cabin in CO.

Can't wait untilhe starts hacking in to that rig:)

Like this;)

http://www.oldjeep.com/images/Scout/T19installed.jpg
http://www.oldjeep.com/images/Scout/framefrontnew3.jpg

Belongs to my neighbor. I stuck a 304/T19 from a scout 2 into it for him. Make big hole in floor:D He got the 800 in North dakota. Really decent shape, floor rust but the rest was nice.

I'm trying to get Ryan, a club member of ours to reply. You'll be sick.

Here ya go:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=459383#post459383

Well, I don't have a 1 ton rockcrawler, but I do only have $2500 in my rig:

78 CJ5 with T18a/D20/258 (running condition): $850
33x12.5 TSL: $500
Scout rear D44: $75
SOA with CV driveshaft: $800
'other parts' to keep it running: $500

http://archiegallup.homestead.com/files/AGMud01.jpg

Originally posted by nwmud
get a free Scout. That's what I did. Actually I got three of them. I'm building 1. My goal was to get it on the road for under $500. did not make it. But I will pull in under $1000. If I had another two grand - WOW! I could get bead locks and good gears.


I started with two carcasses dragged out of the junkyard for free. One had a decent (rolled) body and frame, the other had a rollcage and a dead motor and dead trans, and an axle.

Bought a third runner from the junkyard for $300, sold $150 in parts off it that day.

Had to buy the front end, high steer conversion parts, a set of tires/wheels, some wire, etc.

One looong week of thrashing after 3 months of prepping..

I exceeded my $1000 budget by about 50%.. had $1500 in it.

Junkyard 304V8 (piston slap), fresh 727 ($100 in parts), high-steer disc brake SOA front, SOA rear, full width.. 'cage..

The $1500 figure doesn't count all the parts I sold that I didn't need - the rear seat, an extra frame and grille n' such, the dead 345 block, windshield frames, doors, etc.

$500 for a pair of Lockrights and some bigger tires, and you're good to go.

As it sits, it's at 3700lbs w/o crew n' gear. Pretty light for a 'Binder.

Scored 950@25-deg first time I put it on a ramp.

With the 4.88 gears it'll crawl halfway well, too. 50mph on the highway is all that's comfortable.

Heck, it even has caster and handles better than my 4" lifted SII..

Ran it like that for a year or two before I put a hotter ($4k+) motor and trans in, reversed the front shackles (had to get a custom 'shaft at that point) added more gauges, etc.

Still.. for $1500, I was good to go.

cheap way to go is a chevy. you can be wheeling for way less than 3k

Got my scout for $850, plan to have it wheeling and nice for under $3k.

sami or scout

Just decide what you want and start shopping. I bought my 68 bronco for $600. after i took the guy i bought it from thru the rubicon in it he had to have one again. We went to Wyoming and got 2 of them for $300. They are out there if you look.

go the Sami, LWB if you Know any Canucks throw some Toyota stuff (seems the US way of doing it) and have a blast

Originally posted by DRM


Did you fail school? 5/4 ton is the same as 1 & 1/4 ton -common military rating :p:p:p ;)
.

Nope didn't fail school, but I forgot to wear my decoder ring to help understand the "SPECIAL" military rating system:flipoff2:

Tom,
My vote is for a pre 84 toy truck.
Since Texans prefer the Full size rigs the older toys can be had for around $1500 if one is patient.
Add $400 for a lift, $600 for cheapo steel wheels and tires, $750 for a marlin crawl box and shazam.. a wheeler for around $3250. Maybe less depending on the lift and wheel deals you can get.
CAS

get an 85 or earlier toyota. I got $2095 in mine. It all started with a $300 84 4runner.

$300 for the 4runner
$600 for the 38" swampers 90% tread
$ free rims, already had them
$19 Ford frount shock mounts
$90 (4) shocks
$375 dual case adapter
$400 Hy-Steer
$80 F&R SR5 seats
$ free 2.5 sq tube rear bumper, traded srcap metal for tube
$ free ifs p/s box already had it
$ free 4" lift front springs, already had them
$30 chevy reat springs, U-Pull-It yard
$ free spring plates, friend gave them to me
$25 tube for rock sliders
$1 welding rods for lincoln locker
$20 fror pitman arm incert
$40 tube for sq tube front drive shaft
$75 winch mount
$40 u-bolts
$40 SR5 gage cluster
$ free second t-case, already had it


Here's a pic of it on 33's

another on 33's

Well it's not hard to do unless you're in a hurry. I've also been into the sport for a long time so I can avoid doing things 2 or 3 times to get them right. I also have a bunch of tools and do almost everything myself. I have two project rigs that I'll have under $3000 in when they hit the rocks. Granted I don't have Dana 60s and 42s but I've had fun in stock junk with 235/75s so the big time stuff can wait until I have more money then I need.

I bought my '81 Toyota Longbed 11 months ago for $500. I bought it for a work truck and drove it into the ground. The damn thing was so reliable I couldn't bear to part with it so I built it up.
Parts truck for axles, tranny, tcase, seats, and misc. $500
Balding 33x15.5 swampers on 15x10s $120
Marlin $464
Crossover steering $85
brake lines $65
Springs $100
Steel $85
Rear driveshaft $50
This brings me up to ~$1969 and it'll hopefully be on the rocks next weekend. I have a $400 Supra motor and a Dana 44 front I'm cutting down at the shop which put me at the $3000 cap.

My other truck is a '67 Scout I bought for $300 and those damn things build themselves it should hit the rocks this summer under $3000 with:
Tourque monster IH 345 w/ projection
6.32 first T19
Twin stick Dana 20 w. 2.54 lo range
3/4 ton chevy axles
4 wheel discs
36" Swampers
8000lb winch
beard front seats
ect.

It's hell being without a wheeler while you wait for those killer deals, but if your broke like me it's the only way to go.
Travis

Originally posted by roundrocktom
Friday question:

"What would you use for a donor to build the best rock crawling rig for under $3000?"

I'm a long time Land Cruiser fan, but will be the first to admit they can get expensive. I'd like a trail rig for less than Nolan's front axle! :D

So it seems a 1 ton capacity 4x4 with stout axles, front disk brakes, reasonably strong drivetrain. So if I find a donor for $1000, I still have $2000 to build something up... but what would you recommend as the starting donor?

Tom "usa"


Any Samurai $800-$1500
Spoa= at least $300(w shocks)
Tires=at least$450 (31")
Steel rims black or white walls=$225
4:1 tcase gears $400
Lockright=$189

With a $1500 Samurai your at $3064 plus tax:)
Oh and this is all new stuff minus Samy

THANKS!

Lots of good idea's from everyone. Idea is the "best bang for the buck" with a reasonable target.

As you can see my FJ40 is too clean (very stock, with a lift & 33" tires) to cut up those rear fenders for larger tires. So the idea of building up a FJ40 trail rig ($$$) is cool, but also like the idea of "run what you have, and have a good time"

My kids & the 40:
http://www.tomwalter.com/fj40/fj40_emerson.jpg

So keep those idea's coming. THANKS! :D

I hate mud!

Tom :usa:

Get a 1ton chevy for $1000, strip the drivetrain. Get a wrecked YJ from a salvage yard with no drivetrain and some minor body damage for $500. Use the additional $1500 to fill in missing pieces. motor mounts, wiring harness, wheels. cheap tires. Then wheel it for a year or so, get used to it, save some more $$$ and get lockers and big meats when you can afford them.

good luck!

Here's one I got for under $3000 :D it was FREE all I had to do was tow it away. 71 toyota LC

Originally posted by Bill4rest



Any Samurai $800-$1500
Spoa= at least $300(w shocks)
Tires=at least$450 (31")
Steel rims black or white walls=$225
4:1 tcase gears $400
Lockright=$189

With a $1500 Samurai your at $3064 plus tax:)
Oh and this is all new stuff minus Samy

This is my point, why would anyone put all brand new parts on a budget 4x4? $450 for 31s, I've bought a set of 33s and a set of 35" BFG muds for $300 with over 75% tread. 31's are a dime a dozen go look in the tire pile at any off road shop. And $225 for rims, do you really need anything better then the cheapest out there? Even if you have to buy new wheels for some dumb reason you can get new ones for $40 a piece. If you pay over $100 for a used set of steel wheels your not shopping very hard. Long travel shocks can be had for free too. Go to your local 4x4 shop and get some take offs from a new Superduty Ford. They aren't RS9000s or bilsteins but they work. Now the Tcase is gonna cost bucks there's no way around that but a Lincoln locker will get you just as far down the trail as a lockrite for $189 less. If you shop smart and take your time the only high dollar items should be gears and possibly driveshafts if you need long travel or CV. So yes if you need all shiny new parts, and gotta have it done right away you couldn't build a free truck for under $3000, But if you take your time find the killer deals and do the work yourself the right way the first time you'll have a nice truck you're proud of and gas money to go wheel it.

Travis

My heap of ford junk has cost me over $3000 for just the stuff on this list, not including other crap put on it...

Rebuild rear end $400.00 (previous owner gernaded the 60 on dry pavement on balding 33's!)
headers $405.00 (These are cool!)
starter $240.00 (Waay overkill for motor)
motor mount pads $97.00 (was a dumbass, could have modified a stock part saving about $60)
Clutch $350.00 (centerforce dual friction)
Rebuild tranny $200.00
Re-seal transfer case $60.00
body lift $70.00
Body Bushings $60.00
MSD Ignition $170.00 (cool for watchin buddy zap shit out of himself ...)
seats $450.00 (ass has to be happy right??)
new gas tank $30.00
steering shaft $220.00 (hate sloppy steering)
currie twin stick $160
elec. fuel pump and filter $80

I still dont have the suspension lift (add another $800) and the tires.. who knows how much that will add.....

I am trying to "fix" all of the maintenance stuff before it becomes a problem. so I have rebuilt almost everything that breaks in the hope that "it" doesnt (ya right.)

I have been dillegent on being jewish, doing what I can myself, buying the best I can afford on a pohr mans budget and the total keeps getting higher, and higher, and higher... Someday I will learn the way of the force...


Bwahhhh!!! :crybaby2:

$3000 (maybe a bit more) for an M715 . . . go wheel.

Seriously, I would love to just get an M715 and wheel it 'till it breaks, then worry about lockers or whatever

Phil

:D I told my wife under $3000 also :D

Scout II w/ dana 30 front.

sell axles, swap in 14 bolt & 44 from a GM 3/4 ton. pony up for cross over steering. build cage, add tires/wheels and go.

NQS

like some have probably aleady said but it also depends on what fabrication you can do yourself...
You have to ask yourself, is it worth it to spend extra $$ to weld something up if I could eventually learn to do it myself.
You'll find that more patience you have, the cheaper your rig might be to build.
You also need to determine intended use and practicality.
A daily driver/wheeler might cost more than a strict wheeler.
For instance, my '81 is a trail only truck. I saved some green by welding my rear end instead of buying a locker. 3
Dumb luck is also a factor. I happend to find I a guy selling a brand new set of swampers (listed in my profile) on stock waggy wheels for about $350. Then again, some asshole stole my orig. carburator as well.
good luck, man.

oh yea, a solid axle 'Yota P/U gets my vote.
Just remember, supply and demand...

Originally posted by Kyron
:D I told my wife under $3000 also :D

:D Love it.... Being single does have it's advantages... Then again the g/f is game for house hunting for a larger house with a good size work shop :)

Thanks folks... lots of good idea's. Biggest concern is three or four seater! Still lots of options and good idea's.

Ya, it is possible... so I'll keep my eyes open for that ideal donor/project!

My son spotted the custom buggy (BF Goodrich ad, buggy sported a Ford Emblem) as what we should be building. Hmm, with the right donor. :rolleyes:

Tom :usa:

Originally posted by Dive30
$3000 (maybe a bit more) for an M715 . . . go wheel.

Seriously, I would love to just get an M715 and wheel it 'till it breaks, then worry about lockers or whatever

Phil

I actually was talking to a guy in Ft Worth a month or 2 ago who had a M715 for sale for $3000. Seemed like a nice truck, had a Chevy 350 swapped in and looked pretty good. Gave it serious thought before going with the Samurai