I got my SM420 yesterday, thanks Russ! I spent about 20 mins wire wheeling that bassturd and then popped the PTO side cover to take a look inside! Yikes, rust and a bunch of gunk! Looks like I'll be completely disassembling to clean it all out. I probably should anyway as per Charlie's instructions to change the bearins and check for wear. I was looking at the "date" stamp on the side of the case, and I was wondering how to decypher the date using Charlies trivia tip. Charlies was stamped with H3061 = Aug 30, 61 (the day my wife was born, incidently :) ). Mine is stamped with J44. When the heck was this thing produced?? Here's a picture:

Here's how she looked when she showed up!!

And the other side!!

And the inside, yuk

awww...the inside looks fine! run it like that for a week...change the oil...run it again. then change it one more for good mneasure....itll be nice and shinny in there! lol:rasta:

Originally posted by DCruiser138
awww...the inside looks fine! run it like that for a week...change the oil...run it again. then change it one more for good mneasure....itll be nice and shinny in there! lol:rasta:

Well, if I had a complete drivetrain and more than a rolling framer to put it in...:rolleyes: I might as well tear it all apart and do it right. Besides, I'm hooking up with Charlie next week, and have the Mastre teach me proper!!:smokin:

It looks like htere is another number after the 44 that I can't read. I haven't seen one with the mounting points on the drivers side. The date code is also cast into the driver's side of top cover. See if that one is clearer.

Originally posted by Pin Head
It looks like htere is another number after the 44 that I can't read. I haven't seen one with the mounting points on the drivers side. The date code is also cast into the driver's side of top cover. See if that one is clearer.

I thougth it was another number in the picture, but its obvious that its not in person.

I'll check the top cover!!

ya it looks like maybe j447. so it would be October 4th 47. did they make em then? if so...that one looks REALLY ancient anyhow...mines a 69 i think...its way diff looking. top cover and all...:rasta:
http://www.rivercityrockcrawlers.com/~dcruiser138/images/sm420tp.jpg

Originally posted by MD11Fr8Dog

I'll check the top cover!!

J 3 4 on the top!!

Originally posted by DCruiser138
ya it looks like maybe j447.

I thi=oght it was orinally J444 from the picture, but when I went back out to look at it, its not really as raised as it looks in the pic. It looks more like the mark to the left of the J. Oh well, I'll tear it all down and just go with what I got!! <BG>

Just a guess, but maybe they only used a single digit for the year at first. Since they started in 47, then it would be J44 would be Oct. 4, 1954. They would only have to start using two digits in 57.

I've been wondering about mine too- A136 : It has only three numbers. My sm420 has the "ribs" on the outside, which I read somewhere that the 420's were'nt ribbed until the late 60's....

Sorry about the excessive picture size.... Zipp.
http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~bzipp/pig/datestamp.JPG

Originally posted by Pin Head
Just a guess, but maybe they only used a single digit for the year at first. Since they started in 47, then it would be J44 would be Oct. 4, 1954. They would only have to start using two digits in 57.

Maybe, but what about Zipp's 420? He has 3 numbers.

Take a look at my trannie on my driveway. I must admit, it was a gazillion times easier to disassemble than my FJ-40 4spd. It looks a lot different than the exloded view from the SM420 manual. What do you think.

Does anyone know a more comprehensive history to the sm420? It seems like there should be some documentation about different modifications and alterations through the years-

MD11Fr8Dog- Yours definitely looks different from mine- Mounting holes on the driver's side, and angles on the cover....

http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~bzipp/pig/sm420.jpg

Originally posted by Zipp
My sm420 has the "ribs" on the outside, which I read somewhere that the 420's were'nt ribbed until the late 60's....



What do the "ribs" look like??

Had to go crawl under the cruiser- then couldn't find a good pic from the bottom- so here's from up top-

The structural ribs are on the passenger side reinforcing the reverse hump, etc. They require more grinding for the flange and driveshaft to clear....

http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~bzipp/pig/trannyribs.JPG

Sorry bout the pics. My server is acting up.... I'm working on it.
Zipp.

Sean,

I had a similar question on the year of my 420. It has an oil slinger instead of a oil seal on the front shaft. If it is a "slinger" then its prior to 1956'. ( I e-mailed you last night)
Before you put a ton of cash into it, let me get you the details on my F-bellhousing/ index ring/sm420/sm420 workingPTO/ plate adapter. The trans has new syncros and the bearings were in great condition. I had it checked by Tourist Auto in SLC before assembly. I am waiting on the adapter to be returned to me . I was going to sell just the adapter and the $$ never followed the deal . Everything is in great condition and the price will be attractive. I will be at CM2002 on Fri/sat too. I'll hook you up with pics.

Benentt
aka: Ken

A good link for the reverse switch that most of you don't have..

http://members.aol.com/toy4x4s/hole.htm

Originally posted by bennett
Sean,

I had a similar question on the year of my 420. It has an oil slinger instead of a oil seal on the front shaft. If it is a "slinger" then its prior to 1956'.

Ken, here's where I show my ignorance again, what does the "slinger" look like?

Originally posted by bennett
( I e-mailed you last night)
Before you put a ton of cash into it, let me get you the details on my F-bellhousing/ index ring/sm420/sm420 workingPTO/ plate adapter. The trans has new syncros and the bearings were in great condition.

Yep, I emailed you back, with interest!

Originally posted by bennett
I had it checked by Tourist Auto in SLC before assembly. I am waiting on the adapter to be returned to me . I was going to sell just the adapter and the $$ never followed the deal . Everything is in great condition and the price will be attractive. I will be at CM2002 on Fri/sat too. I'll hook you up with pics.

Benentt
aka: Ken

Ken,

Sounds great. CM02 is gonna be fun. I'm looking forward to it! Birthday weekend, surgery the week prior. I'm gonna need some days to have some fun!

Thanks

Sean,

It's fairly easy to tell, look in the front bearing retainer and if there is a rubber seal... you will not have an oil slinger. The other way to spot it is the round metal plate that is in front the the input bearing. That plate will be threaded on the shaft via a reverse thread. You'll see about a 1/2" of threads. Gear oil is diverted back into the transvia the slinger.
here is a link where we got into it a little deeper.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27871&highlight=sm420+slinger

PS........good luck with the surgery, hope all goes well, vasectomies are not that bad! :o)

bennett

Originally posted by bennett
here is a link where we got into it a little deeper.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27871&highlight=sm420+slinger

Clear as mud now!! <G>

Originally posted by bennett
PS........good luck with the surgery, hope all goes well, vasectomies are not that bad! :o)

bennett

Hehehe, not for me!! The Mrs and I are still trying for our first! Speaking of which, I gotta go!!

:D

DAMN! I can't believe you took your SN420 apart like that! Hell I always run them and worry about it later (never had to fix one) I figure it to be easier to swap the tranny than it is to tear it apart and reassmble it! :eek:

Have fun! No wonder your buildup is taking so long...hell, can you say "side track!"

:D

When are you coming to Dallas?

Originally posted by wngrog
DAMN! I can't believe you took your SN420 apart like that! Hell I always run them and worry about it later (never had to fix one) I figure it to be easier to swap the tranny than it is to tear it apart and reassmble it! :eek:

Nolen, this thing was so easy to disassemble, it took longer to power wash the case than it to disassemble it. It was so full of gunk and grit, and the bearings didn't rotate smoothly. Heck, how do I learn unless I tear it apart. Ask my wife, I recently tore our 2 slot toaster apart when one side was not toasting to learn that the "1/2 or 3/4 slice" switch was in the 1/2 position!!:emb:

Originally posted by wngrog
Have fun! No wonder your buildup is taking so long...hell, can you say "side track!"

Yea, probably coulda had it done by now, but with family/friends visiting during 7 of my 10 wks off this winter....well you get the idea. I did get in over 70 days of skiing though!!:smokin:

I'm waiting on some body panels to arrive from Rocky Mountain Cruisers, then I'll teach myself to weld and get my tub done, including the possibility of swapping my 76 firewall into my 75. Then the frame gets cleaned up, then the SOA gets completed (know where I can get some 55 springs - I'm gonna have lots of Qs for you when I'm in town next weekend!), then drivetrain installed while the tub and panels are painted, etc.... Getting side tracked is good because it allows me to think about what I'm doing before doing it half ass and it not being safe or having to do it over again. Call me anal!!

Originally posted by wngrog
When are you coming to Dallas?

I'll be laying over in Dallas Wed, Thur and Fri morning to evening, then a full day in Austin on Sat. Iwas hoping to rent a car on Sat and come on up!

Nolen,

By the way, its still March at my house!! Just look at my TLCA calendar!! In fact, its been March since Dec.!! ;) :smokin:

What is with this latest round of Nebies coming in and digging up these year old threads!

:rolleyes:

Maybe we need to start being mean like in the other forums :D

Originally posted by wngrog
What is with this latest round of Nebies coming in and digging up these year old threads!

:rolleyes:

Maybe we need to start being mean like in the other forums :D
i am partly to blame, as i dredged up the 45 full metal challenge thread :flipoff2: i feel it was partially useful at least!

Originally posted by wngrog
What is with this latest round of Newbies coming in and digging up these year old threads!

:rolleyes:

Maybe we need to start being mean like in the other forums :D

The sad thing is that besides the thread being really old, the tranny is too. It isn't even an sm420, so its pre-1947. Check out the straight cut gears. That thing must whine like a banshee.

Originally posted by Pin Head


The sad thing is that besides the thread being really old, the tranny is too. It isn't even an sm420, so its pre-1947. Check out the straight cut gears. That thing must whine like a banshee.

I was just going to point that out too, but then I noticed the date of the original post. The thing looks like it would probably bolt up like a 420, but man those striaght cut gears would be vicious on the highway.

Originally posted by Pin Head


The sad thing is that besides the thread being really old, the tranny is too. It isn't even an sm420, so its pre-1947. Check out the straight cut gears. That thing must whine like a banshee.

I sent that sucker back to the guy I bought it from, and ended up finding 2 REAL SM420s for about what I paid for that "relic". I still haven't rebuilt one yet:( , though one sits on my garage work bench (right next to my ToyBox) all cleaned up and ready to reassemble:D !! Maybe week after next after I get back from my swing through Asia next Sat!!
http://members.aol.com/~md11fr8dog/SM420Disassembled.jpg