I know that arb air lockers are great but does anyone have the Detroit Electrac lockers? Since they are electric would they short if submerged?

Read this:

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=462276

Then you'll realize your choice should be Eaton E-locker or ARB. Me, I'm going with the E-locker. There's a lot less that can go wrong with one wire that goes to the locker compared to a wire that goes to an air compressor, then air lines through regulators to the locker.

I've had an Electrac in a front D44 for about 3 years now. Never any trouble with the actuator and we do run plenty of mud and water in the midwest. The connector is a GM watertight plug.

I filled it with synthetic lub and moly powder. After a while it started to BANG during tight turns and would take a couple tire revolutions to engage. On their advice I refilled with straight gear lube and after a couple of oil changes its working like new again.

I love this locker. Oh yeah, I have Warn shafts, CTM's and ran 36" tires the first year, now on 40" Iroks.

I know that arb air lockers are great but does anyone have the Detroit Electrac lockers? Since they are electric would they short if submerged?


What are you going to use your rig more?

Off road or everyday rig

What are you going to use your rig more?

Off road or everyday rig
Both but see more off than on.

I filled it with synthetic lub and moly powder.

.


Please elaborate why you would have added moly powder to the diff oil? What does it look like in the diff oil after it is used? Reason I ask is a friend recently had a lockright installed by a local shop. The unit seems unusually noisy so I popped off the diff cover and out came diff oil like i'd never seen before (very silvery- almost like someone had added graphite powder to it) Refilled the diff with 85-140WT and it was fine.

Sorry for the thread hijack BTW :grinpimp: just was curious... thanks

I'm going with an eaton e-locker in the rear of my rig in the near future.

Going on four years with ARBs in the front and rear of a '97 TJ (D30/D44) with a 4:1 and 35s. Only problem I ever had was a faulty solenoid right after having them installed. It was warrantied, and I haven't had trouble since.

go with the ARB. I've been running an Electrac in the back of my Xj for 2 years with nothing but problems. Two broken soleniods (at $120 each), everytime you get rock rash on the cover the shift fork alignment gets f%&ked, and the soleniod gets frozen in the snow and stops working. Everyone i know who's had an ARB has liked them and reccomended them. I'm tossing mine in the next month.

another vote for ARB. 5 years now in my front... Had the connections corrode on the relay once, simple before trail fix. Then I fixed it RIGHT. No problems since.

I went with the ARB's after a lot of thought ..... the tie breakers for me were OBA and price.
You'll be happy with either.

Rock On

Well, I will say something bit funny- there is a wise sentence that can describe the best attitude to the lockers: "If you don't have what you like, you do like what you have" ;)

Please elaborate why you would have added moly powder to the diff oil? What does it look like in the diff oil after it is used? Reason I ask is a friend recently had a lockright installed by a local shop. The unit seems unusually noisy so I popped off the diff cover and out came diff oil like i'd never seen before (very silvery- almost like someone had added graphite powder to it) Refilled the diff with 85-140WT and it was fine.


Yep, that sounds like moly powder. It is a friction modifer, basically plating the gears and such to reduce friction (heat and wear). Works great in my No-Spin (Detroit Locker). Also great in T18-a tranny and BMW tranny (saved me having to rebuild that one).

I would never use it in a clutch pack limited slip. I figured it would be OK in the Electrac since it is all gear construction. What I forgot is it depends on friction between the gears to operate correctly.

go with the ARB. I've been running an Electrac in the back of my Xj for 2 years with nothing but problems. Two broken soleniods (at $120 each), everytime you get rock rash on the cover the shift fork alignment gets f%&ked, and the soleniod gets frozen in the snow and stops working. Everyone i know who's had an ARB has liked them and reccomended them. I'm tossing mine in the next month.

Sounds like you didn't brace the other side of the cover for the solenoid. I welded a spring perch vertically (so it points straight up) and cut the bottom half off. Then bolted the unsupported side of the cover to it. Never had a problem with the solenoid, but never ran it in deep snow either. Deep mud has been no problem.

One vote for ARB from over here. We have nothing but snow and cold and they work 100% perfect if setup right!

But there cannot be voting on what is better. It's like wondering what is better- christmas or easter. It depends on the terrain type where it will be used. I believe that ARB is better for rock crawling- less chance to damage it by hitting a rock and (as I know) you are usually locked then, or unlock for turns etc. It is also better on dry or extremely slippery roads with higher speeds. Electrac is more suitable for mud and snow. It gives better traction constantly, and can be locked if you'll get stuck. It's good for driving slowly on snowy roads. But in case of pushing throttle too much in arb one wheel will spin, and the other will keep you on road, in electrac both will spin... and you know what it means :)
So thinking about E-locker and ARB is the discussion on reliability, price etc. (which is what you guys are doing here now) but about Electrac and ARB- then it's about the desired way of operation, which is different for different people.
So, 5150Jeep- what type of usage do you predict?

When the arb is locked, Both axles are locked!!!!!

When the Electrac is locked, both axles are locked!!!
When the Electrac is not locked, you still have a high bias limited slip!!!

I think Mendelmax said it perfectly. ARB is better for heavy rock and winter street use. Electrac is better for slippery trail use.

Sounds like you didn't brace the other side of the cover for the solenoid

I have a 1/4" strap tieing the Electrac skid to the axletube now, but it sure was frustrating before

Electrac is more suitable for mud and snow

Except that the soleniod freezes up in cold weather. The soleniod is just a stock Chevy unit, anyone who's had a chevy 4wd knows how crappy they engage in cold weather.

Electrac is better for slippery trail use.

The posi in the electrac is just like any other posi off road. Its great for twin track burnouts on pavement, but it's still might as well be open in the slick stuff, get a tire burried and your wonderwheeling 'till you lock it

Except that the soleniod freezes up in cold weather. The soleniod is just a stock Chevy unit, anyone who's had a chevy 4wd knows how crappy they engage in cold weather.

The posi in the electrac is just like any other posi off road. Its great for twin track burnouts on pavement, but it's still might as well be open in the slick stuff, get a tire burried and your wonderwheeling 'till you lock it

You are still focusing only on offroad. Sometimes it is also important how your car will behave ONROAD. Look- you are going to your granny through some snow in winter. You are going slowly because you are carying some cake. The road is icy. Then electrac will be good- you don't need to lock it and it gives you much more traction than ARB will. With ARB you are still loosing acceleration and digging holes in snow because of wheels spinning. With electrac it's different- you still have traction and keep going forward.
BUT
You are going to your girlfriend also on a snowy road. You are driving much too fast. On the curve you give full throttle, and:
with ARB one wheel looses traction but the other one keep you on the road
with electrac both wheels spin and you finish you life on a tree.
As I told- everything depends on conditions where it will be use and driving style. Nothing is perfect. So there cannot be comparrison between this two- they were designed to different types of needs. It's true when someone tells that ARB is better and also it's true when someone says Electrac is better- They are both better one from another when fitted properly to the needs.

when you guys say "cold" what are you talking?

like 30*F?
or 0*F?
-20*F?(<-better put the doors back on)

I can't operate fahrenheit scale well enough, and forgive me- I don't have time to calculate it now, but for me, cold means -20*C, which is normal in few days of winter. Here in Poland there are days, when roads are covered by ice and it would be really nice to have electrac (as for now I bought ECTED) in rear and ARB in front (better steering without compromising the RWD traction of Quadra-trac II WJ). This would be perfect setup for me, but look- I'm still not saying, that one is better than another :)

For serious off-road use, selectable lockers are a pain in the ass, regardless of who makes them. It's like arguing which is better a D35 or a M20 while ignoring the D60, 9", and 14T. If you use your vehicle off-road and need a front locker, get a detroit and be done with it. You never have to worry about if your locker is engaged, if the compressor or electrical crap is working, busted switches & lines, or if the seals are holding air.

The detroit has everything going for it... it's cheaper, requires no thought to operate, and it's bulletproof. In 2wd, you won't know it's there... regardless of if you have hubs on your front axle or not. Everyone I know who competes with selectable lockers has problems with them. I know everyone is probably telling you not to put a detroit in your front axle, but often times what people say and the truth are completely different things. Sometimes you have to look beyond what's directly in front of you to find the best answer.

Hans

I ran a welded rear for a while, and there is a downside, namely increased turning radius. I am very happy with a Detroit locker in the rear.

One reason I went with a selectable front locker was to get the best possible turning radius, most of the trails I run are tight with lots of trees and mud...

So I've given some of those mods a shot. I'm glad they work for you, but they suck for the kind of wheeling I do.

5150 - you still haven't told us what kind of wheeling you do!

Kreep, you must have caught my post before I deleted the paragraph about spooling the rear axle.... my appologies for screwing up the flow of the thread. I just figured I'd stick one controversial thought in there at a time.

Since no one else will know what I'm referring to since the pargraph was just deleted - there was a paragraph in my last post regarding spooled rear axles on street driven vehicles.

In response to you saying you dislike the spool because of tight turns, I have to disagree (not saying you are wrong or trying to be a dick.. just disagreeing). Here's why. They throw tons of tight turns at us in competition... we have to do ridiculous things to change direction to navigate the cones on the course... I love the spool and think it helps in these situations. With the spool you can use the gas pedal to pivot the vehicle. Yes, it takes some getting used to, but in the end, it will turn a whole lot sharper than with an open diff, because you can swing the rear end around and pivot the truck on it's axis. Once you get it down it works like a charm. Again, I'm not saying this to be arguementative, just my input on the subject, and again, appologies to everyone who has no idea where this came from since the pargraph is now gone.

Hans

I ran a welded rear for a while, and there is a downside, namely increased turning radius. I am very happy with a Detroit locker in the rear.

One reason I went with a selectable front locker was to get the best possible turning radius, most of the trails I run are tight with lots of trees and mud...

So I've given some of those mods a shot. I'm glad they work for you, but they suck for the kind of wheeling I do.

5150 - you still haven't told us what kind of wheeling you do!
EVERYTHING, underwater, undermud, on boulders, sand, dirt, mars and the moon.

hmm, then better ARB, because on the moon the fork in eleftrac can work improperly because of low gravity ;)

For serious off-road use, selectable lockers are a pain in the ass, regardless of who makes them. It's like arguing which is better a D35 or a M20 while ignoring the D60, 9", and 14T. If you use your vehicle off-road and need a front locker, get a detroit and be done with it. You never have to worry about if your locker is engaged, if the compressor or electrical crap is working, busted switches & lines, or if the seals are holding air.

The detroit has everything going for it... it's cheaper, requires no thought to operate, and it's bulletproof. In 2wd, you won't know it's there... regardless of if you have hubs on your front axle or not. Everyone I know who competes with selectable lockers has problems with them. I know everyone is probably telling you not to put a detroit in your front axle, but often times what people say and the truth are completely different things. Sometimes you have to look beyond what's directly in front of you to find the best answer.

Hans


Perfect. This is why I think OX Locker's are so appealing, because its cable operated. If you think having to roll forward to just get in to engage, what about the fact all the jeeps i ahve driven require you to go in reverse to pull it out of 4L? Just a thought.

When the Electrac is locked, both axles are locked!!!


This is not entirely true, 1 tire has to rotate approx 1/8 to 1/4 turn for it to engaged. If you change directions it will unlock then relock. So if your in a critical spot where you need the locker NOW the Electrac will let you down. I've seen it happen more than once. We called the eletrac manufacturer and they confirmed this. It also works better with a specific name brand of gear lube, but I can't recall the name.

When an ARB is locked, it is locked.