OK, so yesterday I saw the 9" (31 spline) vs. 44 thread, today I'd like to get opinions on the above comparison.

Let's make it a D60 with 35 spline, 1.5" shafts and a 9" big bearing 35 spline, 1.5" model. Both running spools.

Which is stronger and why?

I know obvious things like R/P are larger in the 60, but is that really a huge concern?

I'm looking to do one of these in the near future and can't make up my friggin mind. :D

i think the centersection of the 9" is stronger, but overall strength would go to the 60 because it is full floating.

go here (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=47054)

Originally posted by 9-Volt
i think the centersection of the 9" is stronger, but overall strength would go to the 60 because it is full floating.


why is full floating stronger??

Originally posted by 9-Volt
i think the centersection of the 9" is stronger, but overall strength would go to the 60 because it is full floating.

Full floating :rolleyes: He didn't mention anything about a full floating 60 :flipoff2:

Originally posted by Jason M



why is full floating stronger??

because full floating takes the vehicle weight off of the axleshaft so that all that it has to to is transfer torque, not weight.

oh and i just assumed he meant full floating 60 because MOST D60s were full floating and ALL 9"s were SF.

so i went with the majority vote, so to speak.

Originally posted by 9-Volt


because full floating takes the vehicle weight off of the axleshaft so that all that it has to to is transfer torque, not weight.

oh and i just assumed he meant full floating 60 because MOST D60s were full floating and ALL 9"s were SF.

so i went with the majority vote, so to speak.

I would love to see actual stress tests on a semifloating axle vs a full floating axle (identical axle shafts). I just cannot see a big difference between the strenghts of the two. All other things being equal..
The only reason I can see to run FF is ease of replacing axle shafts when they break and safety...

full floater or semi floater....either way I think that a 35 spline 9" is probably the same strength as a 35 spline 60. Think I"m full of shit? Well take a look at the pinion on a 9"!Plus the extra bearing on the end of the 9" pinion. I do think that 60's have stronger housings....I'll keep my 60 thank you:flipoff2:

Originally posted by Jason M


I would love to see actual stress tests on a semifloating axle vs a full floating axle (identical axle shafts). I just cannot see a big difference between the strenghts of the two. All other things being equal..
The only reason I can see to run FF is ease of replacing axle shafts when they break and safety...

I don;t have any actual facts, but have ever seen a semi floter in a 1 ton truck?
some enginger found out they were stonger and went that way

I think the 9 and 60 are equal, the 9 has that lower pinion entry point so that gives it a lot of beef, but then again that pinon hangs low and i do wack it on alot of things

The a reason for the FF on heavier duty vehicles is the larger bearings and the use of 2 wheel bearings per side. This is much better for stability of the bearings.

As for the strength issue between the two I say its a wash. The 9" has HUGE R&P and the 3rd pinoin bearing. I would take either.....but went with a D70 instead. :flipoff2:

Originally posted by Scout Dude
go here (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=47054)


I like!!!

I've not seen mention of the fact that a nine is 50 some pounds lighter than a ff 60.

The fact that a dana 60 is very often full floating is a definite plus. Especially in rockcrawling or heavy heavy offroading. On the ford 9" you have the ease of changing the pinion should you trash the ring and pinion.

Ok so do this:

build a hybrid with a ford 9" center and FF dana outers. Axles are easy to turn and spline :D And be sure to use the currie high pinion center section. Actually this wouldn't be a bad combo

Originally posted by Scout Dude
go here (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=47054)


Originally posted by Aggro
I like!!! (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=47054)

OK, screw you guys!! :flipoff2:

I'm bored today, been mulling this over for a while now and just wanted to get a couple more opinions on the subject.

So you two may partake of my ass, orally. :D

Originally posted by Putzboy


OK, screw you guys!!

So you two may partake of my ass, orally. :D

A perfect example of JU tech talk! :D

I've not seen mention of the fact that a nine is 50 some pounds lighter than a ff 60.

But I did say that a 9" housing is probably weaker:D

Originally posted by sfazr2
And be sure to use the currie high pinion center section. Actually this wouldn't be a bad combo

yeah it would be.

currie HP 9 is an 8.8 gearset and is much much weaker than the 9" centersection. i say build a good skid for the pinion and run a standard pig.

Originally posted by The Rockslut


A perfect example of JU tech talk! :D

Oh yea, well, yo mama!! :flipoff2:

Originally posted by desertCJ
plus the extra bearing on the end of the 9" pinion.

there is a reason a ford 9" has a 3rd pinion bearing and the 60 does not. the other two bearings on the 9" are pretty colse togther so the 3rd bearing is there for support. on the dana axles, the two pinion bearings are spaced out much further so the 3rd pinion bearing is not needed.

i would also like to add that i have heard of more snapped pinions on a 9" than on d60's in off-road rigs. weather it is caused by hitting objects as a result of how low the pinion is or not i don't know.

i say this but i do think the 9" is a good rear but if i had the two sitting side by side i'd take the 60. that being said i run a 14bolt in the rear. :D it's stronger than both:flipoff2:

...And weighs more, and has less ground clearance and has less locker selection...I'll stop now!

Originally posted by Aggro
...And weighs more, and has less ground clearance and has less locker selection...I'll stop now!

Who needs locker selection for the rear, WELD IT

Originally posted by Aggro
...And weighs more, and has less ground clearance and has less locker selection...I'll stop now!

Locker selection??? How many welding rod options are there on a 14bolt? Oh ok 7018,7018AC,6011,6013...I'll stop now!

I am running the infamous c&c 14bolt. On a side note I called Randys R&P today to price pinion bearings and when asked what I was working on i gave the POR reply of "Its a cab and chassis 14bolt" his response was"Oh so that is one of them rigs with the cab that tilts to get to the engine?"Hahahahahahahahah no.

So my undesired opinion is the d60 wins my vote for the simple fact that we need all the pinion height we can get here on the 38s or bigger board. I also agree that the housings are weaker and I have heard of way more 9ins breaking all parts and very few d60s.

Originally posted by high5


there is a reason a ford 9" has a 3rd pinion bearing and the 60 does not. the other two bearings on the 9" are pretty colse togther so the 3rd bearing is there for support. on the dana axles, the two pinion bearings are spaced out much further so the 3rd pinion bearing is not needed.

i would also like to add that i have heard of more snapped pinions on a 9" than on d60's in off-road rigs. weather it is caused by hitting objects as a result of how low the pinion is or not i don't know.

i say this but i do think the 9" is a good rear but if i had the two sitting side by side i'd take the 60. that being said i run a 14bolt in the rear. :D it's stronger than both:flipoff2:

I don't know which is stronger, but I have seen the pinion ripped clean out of the rearend - twice in Moab a couple of years ago on a friend of mine's rig. Granted that was with a 460, 42's and a good bit of axle wrap. Don't know whether a 60 would have survived in the same situation.

Originally posted by Putzboy


Oh yea, well, yo mama!! :flipoff2:

Oh yeah, well tell yo mama to that her chin tickles my sack. She needs to start shaving that thing. :flipoff2:

Oh yeah, well tell yo mama to that her chin tickles my sack. She needs to start shaving that thing.


:rolleyes: Any ways, the 60 is stronger... 9 inch has a weaker housing, stronger hypoid mesh, at the expense of a very low pinion entrance. The 3rd bearing is to support the two other closely spaced pinion bearings, although the 60 has two much farther apart bearings...Axle shafts can be equally strong, although you need more $$ to get what the 60 has stock...R+P, the 60 has the edge (.75" )...So I go with the 60...

I dunno, the numbers say the 60 has a stronger r&p but I think the 9" is pretty beefy. There is a reason they are used in 500 horse power hot rods:flipoff2: How many 60's have you seen under rod's? I still like my 60 :D

Originally posted by desertCJ
I dunno, the numbers say the 60 has a stronger r&p but I think the 9" is pretty beefy. There is a reason they are used in 500 horse power hot rods:flipoff2: How many 60's have you seen under rod's? I still like my 60 :D

Hmmm... What axle was behind the Chrysler Hemi? Oh yeah, I remember! It was a DANA 60!!!

OK OK, so maybe there are exceptions:flipoff2: But by now this is pretty pointless. We all know that they are both strong and have good and bad points. It's up to the poor sap dishin out the green to decide:D As for me, I choose 60:rasta:

Isn't thier a full floater kit out their for the 9" then you would have a full floater 9 vs full floater 60 and I wonder if you could get the 35 spline 9 to be full floater?

Originally posted by Jeepskickass


Hmmm... What axle was behind the Chrysler Hemi? Oh yeah, I remember! It was a DANA 60!!!


Yeah right. Like Chrysler would ever use a Ford axle anyways. Pick something that's valid for comparison. Like what rodders today would use, not what the factory used.

Not that I've looked specifically, but I've seen a lot of stuff for the 9" in street rod and circle track related catalogs, but never any Dana 60 stuff. I can't say this speaks to strength though. Maybe the 9" is more popular with those guys for other reasons. It's lighter, easier to change gears yourself on, the low pinion doesn't matter as much on a rod, etc.

--Dan

Originally posted by houlster



Yeah right. Like Chrysler would ever use a Ford axle anyways. Pick something that's valid for comparison. Like what rodders today would use, not what the factory used.

Not that I've looked specifically, but I've seen a lot of stuff for the 9" in street rod and circle track related catalogs, but never any Dana 60 stuff. I can't say this speaks to strength though. Maybe the 9" is more popular with those guys for other reasons. It's lighter, easier to change gears yourself on, the low pinion doesn't matter as much on a rod, etc.

--Dan

Okay NewBIE...We're sorry, you know it all....


Actually, a Dana Axle is a Dana product, not a Ford Product....And Chrysler did use them....And I know a few people who ran D60's in the CARS!

I don't know why the 9" won the popularity contest, but I suspect that it was due to the easily changably center section. Street gears for the week, swap in deeper gears for the weekend races....

Yea, I'm familiar with the 9" popularity with the rodders, but that's a totally different situation. A 500 HP engine puts out a lot of torque, but it isn't compunded at a 100:1 either.

I'm glad someone brought up the HP third as well, that's what I REALLY wanted to run. But everyone seems to be down on 8.8 R/P's.

Given the choice now, between a "regular" 9" and 60, I would go with the 60 for pinion height alone. And since everyone seems to think the HP 9" center is not comparable to the 60 in strength, then I guess we're all stuck with 60's, huh?

How about this, what if you limited yourself to no larger than a 38" tire? Think the HP 9" with 35 spline shafts and spool would hold up, or am I "doomed" to be with the crowd and run a 60?

Ziiiiipppppp, flame suit on.

Someone should ask Currie Enterprises who are THE Ford 9" pimps, why they run a DANA 60 in their Fire Ant. :p

Originally posted by Putzboy

How about this, what if you limited yourself to no larger than a 38" tire? Think the HP 9" with 35 spline shafts and spool would hold up, or am I "doomed" to be with the crowd and run a 60?


Currie runs 37" tires on their Fire Ant. :p

I beleive rodders use 9" axles because of their availability and the ease of narrowing. Alot of 9" axles have an offset diff so that when they narrow them they can cut the long side down and use another short shaft, rather than re-splining..... now that I think about it....Arent some 60's offset as well?

Also, lots of 9" axles came from the factory with disc brakes.

Now I got myself all :confused:

Arent' they running a tera 60? I'm guessing they switched to 60 because they were using the high pinion 8.8 and it's weak shiznit:D They probably thought about going standard 9" but couldn't stand the thought of the low pinion on a competition crawler. I'd still like to hear what excuses they could scrape up though:rasta:

Someone should ask Currie Enterprises who are THE Ford 9" pimps, why they run a DANA 60 in their Fire Ant. :p
Someone has, Dana-boy. :p They had pretty good luck with their HP9 on 35s, but they didn't want to run 37s on it (which makes sense if you look to their warranty).

Their choice of the 60 was less a strength issue and more a clearance issue... woulda been tough to have more than a few inches of driveshaft.

I think a built-up 9" is just as strong as a 60 with equivalent axles, but the 14-bolt takes the good parts of the 9" (extra bearing support) and the good parts of the 60 (massive ring gear) and delivers the utmost in 1-ton durability, IMHO.

And no, I don't want to talk about high-pinion rear axles... I still think that's too big a sacrifice in strength for a lousy 2.25" of driveshaft clearance at the pinion. :flipoff2:

Randii (stir, stir)

Originally posted by houlster



Yeah right. Like Chrysler would ever use a Ford axle anyways. Pick something that's valid for comparison. Like what rodders today would use, not what the factory used.

Not that I've looked specifically, but I've seen a lot of stuff for the 9" in street rod and circle track related catalogs, but never any Dana 60 stuff. I can't say this speaks to strength though. Maybe the 9" is more popular with those guys for other reasons. It's lighter, easier to change gears yourself on, the low pinion doesn't matter as much on a rod, etc.

--Dan

Okay, how about the Chrysler 8 3/4? Same style axle as the Ford, with a dropout center section and a stamped steel housing. There are a few differences, but very similar. Which did they choose? 60!

Rodders use the 9 inch because they are cheap, easy to narrow, easy to regear, and light weight. And any serious race wouldn't use a stock housing. Most are using either a seriously reinforced housing, or a Fab9 type.

BTW, I've got a buddy that runs low 9s on a 12 bolt. Does that mean I want one in my Jeep?

Originally posted by randii
Someone should ask Currie Enterprises who are THE Ford 9" pimps, why they run a DANA 60 in their Fire Ant. :p
Someone has, Dana-boy. :p They had pretty good luck with their HP9 on 35s, but they didn't want to run 37s on it (which makes sense if you look to their warranty).

Their choice of the 60 was less a strength issue and more a clearance issue... woulda been tough to have more than a few inches of driveshaft.

I think a built-up 9" is just as strong as a 60 with equivalent axles, but the 14-bolt takes the good parts of the 9" (extra bearing support) and the good parts of the 60 (massive ring gear) and delivers the utmost in 1-ton durability, IMHO.

And no, I don't want to talk about high-pinion rear axles... I still think that's too big a sacrifice in strength for a lousy 2.25" of driveshaft clearance at the pinion. :flipoff2:

Randii (stir, stir)
BS, they had good luck... They broke, and often, with their own HP 9...On 35s.
And the 14 bolts are badass, if you have a 3/4 ton or bigger, 40s or bigger, and need 5.13s and higher...

Originally posted by Scout Dude


Okay NewBIE...We're sorry, you know it all....

Actually, a Dana Axle is a Dana product, not a Ford Product....And Chrysler did use them....And I know a few people who ran D60's in the CARS!


One would think a crusty ole' critter like yourself would've learned by now to read a fawking post before responding to it. I never said a Dana axle *wasn't* a Dana product. Neither did I say that Chrylser didn't use them. Nor did I say a Dana axle was a Ford product.

If you actually read what I said before spewing off, you'd see the point I was making is that Chrysler would not use a Ford axle. Meaning that regardless of the D60 vs 9" pros and cons, Chrysler would *never* use a Ford 9" over a D60, so it's not a valid data point.


-Dan

Dana 60 gets my vote, but then again I went with a 14 bolt for the rear. Yep its shaved, waiting for the spool for it, and it has 5.13's, and easily bolted on disc brakes, and the availability for bolt on 67"wms-wms, or a 63"wms-wms!!!!! I just love it when I drive in town somewhere, and people walk up to my ride and say what axles are those. I tell them 1 ton axles, then they proceed to tell me that I should have ran a 9" in the rear:laughing: :laughing: .

And the 14 bolts are badass, if you have a 3/4 ton or bigger, 40s or bigger, and need 5.13s and higher

You do not need 40's or bigger to run a 14 bolt and not drag ass. You just need a razor and then you shave it:D