Here's the deal: I've been runnin' ORUs SAS kit for 2 years now. No problem, not a bad kit(too expensive), but now I've added a large off road bumper and a 12K winch. My front springs are saggin a little and it's already cost me the housing of my transfer case. Lost 1.5" or so of lift and technically, now my front driveshaft is too short. I hit a large bump and my driveshaft shoves back into the cast aluminum housing of my NP241 and splits it in half.

I've fixed that with 100 in junk yard parts. And I want to get my truck sitting like it should. I've already got a buyer for my old hangers and I'm gonna make some new ones. My springs were custom built and weren't cheap so, they stay.

My welding skills have greatly improved over the last 2 years and I've got a New Lincoln 175 MIG. So I AIN'T SKEERED.

I've got access to all the free metal I need. My uncle builds oil rigs and can get it for me.

I would really appreciate some advice, pics, and even crude drawings of what some of you guys have used on a similar set up for the shackle hanger for the rear of the spring.
What materials, demensions, tips/tricks....you get the idea.

If you need little more lift, put a zero rate in there, that will give you 1". The shackles on the ORU kit aren't square, for some gay reason they are offset, maybe so noone can copy their design. Before you get rid of the shackles, make a set 2" longer....

I need more than 2". I don't want to just use a longer shackle cuz I don't want my caster to be off and screw up my steering.

I was planning on getting 3" more of lift with my new hangers and maybe run a zero rate too. I'm trying to get my truck to sit close to level and that looks like that's what it's gonna take.

My tires are rubbin' a little as is when I turn hard on a side hill or hit a bump while turnin'.

I know alot of guys have built their own hangers. I just want some ideas.
If I can see it I can build it.

Here ya go!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/axisT6/IM000913.jpg

Bear in mind that I have added tabs (you can see on on the ground) to allow for bolting through the bottom and sides of the frame.

For rear hangers (for the front springs) use 73' to 87' 3/4 ton chevy front hangers off of the rear springs.

BTW it is all 1/4" with 1/2" top plate, and a 2x2-1/4" square tube X-member.

Hey you're from Spring. I go to Rice, so I'm in Houston most of the time. If I finish soon enough, I'm wheelin' at Spring Creek Early June. I also have a friend with a shop in Spring he's an awesome fabricator.
Do those 73-87 hangers line up with the spring center from the fronts. Could you post a pic of the rear hanger set up?

Here ya go!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/axisT6/IM000913.jpg

Bear in mind that I have added tabs (you can see on on the ground) to allow for bolting through the bottom and sides of the frame.

For rear hangers (for the front springs) use 73' to 87' 3/4 ton chevy front hangers off of the rear springs.

Bryan round those corners man, 5 second fix, huge improvement on finish. Did you by any chance build backing plates for inside the frame up front?

I will build the backing plates before I install the bracket for good. The pic shown was to mark where the tabs were going to be welded.

Hey you're from Spring. I go to Rice, so I'm in Houston most of the time. If I finish soon enough, I'm wheelin' at Spring Creek Early June. I also have a friend with a shop in Spring he's an awesome fabricator.
Do those 73-87 hangers line up with the spring center from the fronts. Could you post a pic of the rear hanger set up?

What shop does your friend run? Do you also know Toymaker from Spring Creek?

BTW, the 73-87 hangers line up perfectly with the Chevy D60 centers from what I understand. That is why a lot of people want them. Also, mine are all 3/16 thick.:D

I'm runnin a Ford High Pinion Dana 60. I have a 32" spring center I think. Maybe 32.5"
Do you know yours?

I've never wheeled the Creek before. I'm gonna try to meet Halogrinder up there.

My friends shop is under his house. He lives close to 45 in a neighborhood off 1960. It's called Self-Made Fabricaitions. He mainly does sport trucks. His F150 has been in Sport Truck magazine. He doesn't know much about 4x4s. But if I can draw it, he can make it.
He's plannin on buyin a computer controlled plasma table....I can't wait.

So I broke out the measurin' tape and got under the truck today. I was wantin to make some kind of crossmember for the rear shackle hanger, but once think that could be in the way would be the new trans pan I just put on. It was the one from Derale that was featured in Fourwheeler or Peterson's(always forget what I read in which). I've been havin' some tranny issues...(but that'll be another thread).

One thing I did do was jack the front end of my truck up with the high lift till it sat about right and took some measurements. I had to put my Hi-Lift on a 2' pine log to reach my bumper...the tall Hi-Lift.

I need to do it again on level ground. Maybe with the added lift my driveshaft will be out of the way enough to bend some 2.5" Sched 40 or 2x2 tubing and mount tabs to hang some ...stock rear shackles?...rear lowering shackles?(will lift)...build some?

Lend me your 2 cents and I'd really like to see some pics for ideas....I can come up with something, but some of ya'll are some pretty good back yard engineers.
I'm ready to get wheelin.

Oh yeah, My front driveshaft sat in the garage with the slip shaft completely compressed for about a month after I broke my t-case. I couldn't pry it apart today. I had to chain one end to my buddy's jeep and the other to my winch and finally pulled it apart after prying with a screwdriver and a hammer.(I was pullin' the jeep to my truck).
It was a little rusty inside so I sprayed brake parts cleaner and regreased it and put it back together. I had to tap it with a mallet, a bunch to get it down a ways. I couln't move the slip at all by hand.
Any Ideas?

Here are some cad drawings of the brackets I made, and am in process of installing right now. If all of my measurements were at least close it should work out pretty good, if not, well then we'll take it from there. I should know by tomorrow how well everything lines up.

http://www.geocities.com/brentfarina

Here are some cad drawings of the brackets I made, and am in process of installing right now. If all of my measurements were at least close it should work out pretty good, if not, well then we'll take it from there. I should know by tomorrow how well everything lines up.

http://www.geocities.com/brentfarina
It would only let me look at a couple of them. I saw the front hangers and the shackles. Your hangers look alot like ORUs....How much lift you plan on gettin from them?

I'm lookin' for ideas on the shackle hanger for the rear of the front springs. I'm leanin' towards a crossmember out of 2x2 with .25" wall. I checked and my truck's tall enough for it to fit over the driveshaft.

I took alot of measurements on level ground yesterday and I've deciced I need 6" of lift total from my hangers. Just 3" more than they are now. This will make my truck sit about a 1" taller in the front than the rear and gives me the perfect length on my driveshaft. I can easily adjust the rear with some chevy lowering shackles.

Ideas? Comments?

sounds like you need to look at bumpstops to prevent the driveshaft from pounding into the transfercase

I just have way too much sag right now. For my driveshaft to fit it has to be fully complresses(no slip).

Bumpstops to stop it would be ridiculous.

I really think 3" more should solve my problems.

Why not add some leaves to you front springs to gain the needed lift? Getting 6" from hangers alone is kind of scary.

Just go get your shaft shortened so it doesn't bottom out before the suspension. If you have a rake, pull some lift form the back. If you need a block under a 60" hilift just to start unloading the front by the bumper you already have more than enough lift, don't add more.

My Tires are rubbin' when I'm off camber and turnin'.
And I don't want to cut the fenders. I ride in really deep mud and water. I like my height.

I gonna get six total inches with front and rear hangers. I gonna make the front out of 3/8" plate and I'm gonna brace the heck out of it. I probably gonna make the shackle hanger a crossmember out of 2"x2" with .25" wall.

I'm definately not added leafs to my front spring back. They're already pretty stiff. I think I've got everything figured out. But I'd still like to see what other have done. Especially the shackle hanger.

Also: In the rear I did a shackle flip with ORD's 4" kit along time ago. With my stock spring and a 4" block it road real good and flexed good enough for my needs.
When I did the SAS I got 12" Atlas rear springs and mounted them to the 4" ORD hanger. I had been running them angled forward. At first the springs kept wanting to flaten out and the shackle kick up. It would take 3 of us to lift on the bumper and pop it back into place. I ended up adding a leaf to the pack and a 4" block to make it sit right and solve my problem. Well on the rare occassion I would haul a heavy load or hit some hard bumps when off roadin it would still kick out.
Today I turned the ORD hange angle back, but my shackle angle tilts about 3* or so inward of 90 and it rights like an unloaded dump truck. I even put 5 solid concrete blocks, a bunch of firewood and my 200 lb friend and myself(240) in the bed and the springs wouldn't flatten enough to make the shackle move back more than a little more than 90*.
I'm thinkin I have 2 options: Unbolt the hangers and move them .5" or .75" forward and weld them in place.....or....remove the leaf that was added. I'm leanin' towards the latter. Probably give me a little more articulation. The only time I haul more than 300 lbs.(which is rarely) is when I have 6 girls or so in the bed when I go to the beach on spring break....I live on the coast.

Any ideas....Oh and what's the lowest gear ratio you can run in a high pinion, reverse rotation, Ford Dana 60? I know my 14 bolt is limiting me to 5.13 but I might ditch it in the future so I can gear lower. In low range my performance is ok, cuz of the 2.72 reduction of the 241 t-case. I also have around 350 horse power.

I just have way too much sag right now. For my driveshaft to fit it has to be fully complresses(no slip).

Bumpstops to stop it would be ridiculous.

I really think 3" more should solve my problems.

My Tires are rubbin' when I'm off camber and turnin'.
And I don't want to cut the fenders.

sounds like you need bumptops even if you lift it higher, it still has the possibility of crackin your case and remodeling your fenders. also a shorter front D-shaft.
why not just fix it right the first time? I wonder how safe extending your brackets would be, and it would cut into your approach angle and seeing the spring mounted 6 inches under the frame would look pretty shitty.

I'm just trying to lift my truck to where it used to be in height.

For bumpstops to stop the compression on my truck they'd have to be really long.

And I don't care about approach angles on this rig. It is a mud bogger. I'm from the flat land....the swamps.

I might just get 2" with the hangers and then run a zero rate, but I've seen guys with over a foot off lift just from hangers. I have 21" of lift and my truck is not the biggest where I go wheelin'.

Sounds like you have a good plan on the front hangers. I have done a couple of trucks with 6" hangers and it wotked fine. No excess body roll and it looked ok.

Sounds like you have a good plan on the front hangers. I have done a couple of trucks with 6" hangers and it wotked fine. No excess body roll and it looked ok.

Thanks.

This is by no means a show truck. But I try to keep it lookin ok. It's the main advertisement for my shop at the moment.

Still lookin for some pics of some hangers if ya'll got 'em. I guess I need to quit bein' cheap and get a red star so I can show ya'll what I'm doin'.

When I broke the housing to my t-case, I fixed it with some parts I got at a manual transmission shop. It seems to work fine, but I think that it's given me less room for my driveshaft. I used the front yoke that was already mounted to the case half I bought, but it looks just like the old one.
I guess I'll try to swith back to my old one.

If your pretty handy with a torch, you can use a peice of 4x10x1/4 rectangle tubing. Cut your front hanger out as one peice. Works out pretty good and the inside is a perfect fit for the springs and bushings(3 1/2"). I conected that with a peice of 2x6 channel and made a cross member.

I bet that 4x10 is pricey. I doubt the local scrap yard would have that.

I've got a bunch of 3/8" steel layin' around and I just got some 2x2x1/4" tubing from my grandpa's house(for my rear x-member shackle hanger).

The part I hate is making holes in that thick metal. I don't have drill press. I could try to burn 'em in with the torch but I don't want it to look crappy.

I've pretty much got my hanger setup figured. I still like ya'lls info and ideas. My new head scratcher is the rear spring situation. I'm wonderin wether I should move the shackle hanger forward a little and weld it, or if I should remove the leaf that I had added.

Before I moved flip the ORD hangers around with the leaf added to the pack it worked pretty good for driving around and light wheelin', but with over 300 lbs in the bed or driving hard off road the shackles would flip up and the rear of my truck would squat.

Now it's just way too stiff.

I just found out how to do this....let's hope it works.

Here's my rig before all the problems began.
http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/100_0281.jpg

Cracked 241
http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/crackedcase.jpg

Here's me pullin out a YJ on 38" boggers for the 5th time.
http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/stuckyj.jpg

I'll get pics of the rear shackle problem and also the hangers once they are fabbed.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/shackleupclose.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/springandshackle.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/rearshot.jpg

Here's my shackle problem. The rusty leaf is the one that was added. I don't why they didn't paint it.

It definately isn't gonna work the way it is now

I'm feelin' crappy right now because I was stupid and did a little welding on some galvanized and didn't take enough precaution.

I would take the single leaf back out and use some longer drop shackles to get you lift back. Adding the leaf gave your spring more arch and made it shorter from eye to eye.

That's what I'm thinkin'. I could always put the leaf back on if I thought I needed it.
It's easier to do that than weld the hangers on and have to cut 'em off.

What's the lowest gear ratio I can run in my Reverse rotation, high pinion, Dana 60 out of a 78 F350? I'm thinkin of ditchin' my 14 bolt, since it keeps me from going lower than 5.13s.

What would be a good rear axel choice? Dana 70?

Hopefully tomorrow night I'll be posting pics of my new hangers commin' along.

I just ripped my old hangers out...Well, slowly wrenched them out, since my compressor died on my yesterday.
I got the compressor for free because it was frozen and I was able to get it workin' again so I wasn't too pissed but it slowed down the process. I built a rear crossmember/shackle hanger out of some 2x2 1/4" wall tubing and I'll make the front hangers tomorrow.

I'm not sure what front shackles I'm gonna run. I might just make some out of some 1/4" plate.

I'll try to get some pics tomorrow.

I'd appreciate some advice and/or pics.

Ok, so it's become a build thread, well a rebuild for me.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/fronthangers.jpg

my new front hangers the sides and top are 3/8" and are boxed with 1/4"....they're heavy

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/fronthangerstop.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/hangersbolted.jpg

I used 2 existing bolt for my bumper brackets to bolt them into place. I will weld the up and brace them with 1.5" pipe.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/blotedside.jpg

Didn't get a lot of work done due to terrrible weather. So I will weld them up after hanging the springs and my shackle hanger made out of 2x2(pics later). I'm using the frame mounted shackle bushings for a 73-87 K10(they haven't arrived yet) and mounting them in a piece of pipe the appropriate size and the pipe will be welded and braced on the 2x2x1/4" x-member that runs under the tranny. I'll be cutting out my shackles out of 3/8".

What do ya'll think 6" or 7" shackles?

What size inner diameter pipe will fit those shackle bushings?

what size tires are u runnin tawl boy? an do u have a picture of ur front front spring rear shackle hangers?

Fix your pan hard bar. It is supposed to be the same angle/direction as your draglink.

For the shackle bushings, go to Home Depot or Lowes and get some 3/4" 1/16 wall steel tube. It will allow you to use a 5/8 bolt for the springs. Be sure to build your front brackets to where you can bolt them through the sides and bottom of your frame rails. With that much leverage, you will need the support.

tawl boy do u have anymore pics of ur truck?

Hey Axis, I live in Houston and I'm in Spring all the time....do you wheel the creek?

I've been planning on redoing the panhard just haven't got to it. The angle is the same but the direction's opposite. It works fine but I figure it limits what little articulation I have.
The reason it was built like this is when I first did the SAS I was just learning to weld. The guy who helped me with a lot of the fab work insisted we do the trac bar this way even with me arguing. He said that there was more room this wak.

That was over 2 years ago and I've really honed my fabrication skills and have a lot more tools.

Don't really have anymore pics at the moment. The truck's in Orange, TX at my parents house. I work on it every other weekend or so.

The tires are 46/19.5/15 MT Baja Claws.

Oh....I didn't make it clear earlier but I need to know what size pipe the bushing will fit in. It comes with a sleeve. I don't have the bushings yet so I want to have my rear x member/shackle hanger ready to go.

No pics of it yet but I'll get them ASAP.

Keep the comments/questions commin'.

Here's a couple older pics I had on my camera.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/frontnobumper.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/sidenobump.jpg

The panhard is connected to my u bolt plate in the pics of my new hangers and it's not at the anlge it sits at.

In these pics my draglink's disconnected because I was installing my rebuilt steering boxt from west texas off road so I could intall my ram assist steering.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/axel&links.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/shackleupclose.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/springandshackle.jpg

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/rearshot.jpg

Here's my shackle problem. The rusty leaf is the one that was added. I don't why they didn't paint it.

It definately isn't gonna work the way it is now

I'm feelin' crappy right now because I was stupid and did a little welding on some galvanized and didn't take enough precaution.


I'm pretty sure if you look at your ORD Shackle flip, you will notice that it can be flipped to the other side and will make the mount sit further forward and help your shackle angle.
Oh yah and your tracbar is backwards like someone else said, you are causing more bump steer instead of correcting it.

I would take the single leaf back out and use some longer drop shackles to get you lift back. Adding the leaf gave your spring more arch and made it shorter from eye to eye.
That really won't help his shackle angle problem if he adds a longer shackle too. Not only that, but it's not enough help. He needs more of an angle toward the rear than he will get out of removing a spring.

Why so big? Seems pretty pointless to me. I've had a big ass rig like that, and I loved it so much more once I lowered it back down quite a bit. Went from 15" to 6". Maybe you should lose about 6.......... or 10

d70 over 14b? Only for gearing, but not if you already have it geared. I think you need rockwells.

The panhard being the wrong direction is hurting your steering. Ever notice bumpsteer? Think about this. You hit a bump, and the panhard forces your axle to go the opposite direction that it your draglink forces it to go. If they were the same angle, and same direction, they would rotate in unison. Beleeeeee me.

We've already addressed the rear shackle problem earlier in the thread. The ORD hanger was facing the other direction and my truck couldn't handle any weight in the back and sometimes during hard wheeling the shackle would flip up and the rear of my truck would squat. It would take like 3 guys or a hi-lift to get it to pop back up.

After flipping them may angle was bad. So I've decided to remove the extra leaf that was added 2 years ago.
The added leaf was to fix the flippin out problem which happened all the time with the hangers facing the other way. I don't have bumpsteer right now because of the ram assist steering.

I do plan on switching the panhard. It wasn't my idea to mount it that way. All this was addressed earlier in the thread.

About my lift height. I live in the swamps of Southeast Texas and Southwest Louisianna. Deep water and gumbo mud. We lick or rigs tall. It doesn't see rocks at all. I live at sea level on the gulf coastal plain. I do plain eventually to build a crawler rig with insanely low gearing and a low center of gravity in the future. But for what I do with my truck the set up is perfect.

If you've ever seen articles and stuff on people who wheel in Florida, their trucks are generally really tall. Many run ag tires.

My truck is not an all purpose rig it is a mudder. It is my first truck I got when I was 15 and I've been building it since. The second my grandma gave me her '94 buick lesabre before college I tore it apart and sold the IFS to some poor idiot.

I may go to rockwells some day, but I haven't seen a lot of breakage yet and maybe wheen I build my other rig I use these for it.

I really do appreciate the advice. Many of ya'll have been doing this longer than I have and have really good ideas and experience. Just some of the rockcrawlers are a little biased.
Don't get me wrong ya'lls sport is awesome and I eventually plan to get in to it. It'll just be long distance traveling to do it.

OK. I'm finally gonna get to go home for the first time in a couple of weeks.
...I play football for Rice University and we've had summer classes and training since June 5th.

I'm gonna finish all this stuff up. I get Mon and Tues off. My only break this summer. I went ahead and got the shackle bushings for a 73-87 chevy 4x4. They are the ones that go in the frame for the shackle for the front springs.

Could anyone tell me the diameter of the hole in the frame so I could go ahead and get some pipe to build my hangers?

I'll have more pics up shortly, probably over the weekend. I wanna get some wheelin' done soon. It's been a couple of months. Anybody in Southeast Texas and the greater Houston area who wants to wheel or wrench give me a holler.

Everybody have a safe holiday.

So the weather was terrible over the holiday and I didn't get a lot done. My truck doesn't fit in the garage and I don't like to weld in a torrential downpour.

Back in Houston I went to my buddy's shop and fabbed up my shackle hanger for my front springs. Those are also the shackles I cut out of 3/8" plate. I'll be grinding them this weekend and I plan them to be 5.5" from hole to hole. Does that sound good?

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/xmem.jpg

I'll be grinding them and boxing them in before finally install this weekend (knock on wood). The tabs that the pipe is mounted too are 3/8" and welded on both sides. I'm gonna box 'em with 1/4". I'll be making angular gussests and strengthening once it's installed. I didn't have the truck with me when I made it to check for clearance with the trans pan and driveshaft.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/shacklehanger.jpg

It doesn't look pretty now, but I'm gonna do some grindin' and hit it with a good coat of POR15.

Comments/Criticism?

So the weather was terrible over the holiday and I didn't get a lot done. My truck doesn't fit in the garage and I don't like to weld in a torrential downpour.

Back in Houston I went to my buddy's shop and fabbed up my shackle hanger for my front springs. Those are also the shackles I cut out of 3/8" plate. I'll be grinding them this weekend and I plan them to be 5.5" from hole to hole. Does that sound good?

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/xmem.jpg

I'll be grinding them and boxing them in before finally install this weekend (knock on wood). The tabs that the pipe is mounted too are 3/8" and welded on both sides. I'm gonna box 'em with 1/4". I'll be making angular gussests and strengthening once it's installed. I didn't have the truck with me when I made it to check for clearance with the trans pan and driveshaft.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/shacklehanger.jpg

It doesn't look pretty now, but I'm gonna do some grindin' and hit it with a good coat of POR15.

Comments/Criticism?


It looks like unsupported death about to be added currently, Im waiting for the gusseting you say you adding.

I definately won't be driving the truck till I'm positive it's sturdy and strong. I just couldn't strengthen it yet without having my truck around to check for clearance.

Off Road direct had a similar x-member in their oringinal design. But it was made out of DOM. They didn't end up using it on their final product because you had to run at least 10" of lift to clear the front driveshaft.

I talked to one of their fabricators before designing this.

If anybody's done something similar I'd like to see it.

Just a couple things:

It looks like you welded with the bushings in there, there cooked if you did and need to be replaced.

There just to little weld surface area from what it looks like in the pics you provided for those bushings you have attached a the ends to be safe as a suspension mounting point.

I would suggest welding some 1/4" plate to the ends to get a large pad you can bolt into the frame, at the same time Id add a gusset from everydirection to the edge of the plate from the box tube.

I'm boxing in the bushing mounts with 1/4" and welding the hell out of it.

I welded with only one bushing in. I couldn't get it out after I test fit it. It's polyurethane and didn't seem to get that messed up. I'm gonna try and get it out before boxing it in. If not I'll just destroy it and replace it.

I plan on having tons of gussets on it once it's all in place. I'll get pics up when it's all done so it can be critiqued.

dude, please lets remake that peice of shit hanger you have. i now have a bender, and we can make one up for you easy as pie.


if yer gonna be goin to the creek with us, mang, im tellin ya, your gonna be REALLY limited on where you can go, cause of the gimunguous-ness of the truck.

we're goin wheelin/fishin tomarrow :smokin:

in the morning, were getting more tube from SSS steel, cause were bending bumpers and shit like that on the side now.

holla at ya boy :D
~Halogrinder
(alex)

I'm boxing in the bushing mounts with 1/4" and welding the hell out of it.

I welded with only one bushing in. I couldn't get it out after I test fit it. It's polyurethane and didn't seem to get that messed up. I'm gonna try and get it out before boxing it in. If not I'll just destroy it and replace it.

I plan on having tons of gussets on it once it's all in place. I'll get pics up when it's all done so it can be critiqued.

As I have proved just welding a lot doesn't help if the design isn't very good to start with. Again, Im waiting for the pics of it fully gusseted, we will have to see.

If you welded 3/8" to that bushing tube the poly is toast. I welded 1/8" to mine and had it smoking and bubbling before I made a 1/2" bead. Trust me its worth the time to slowly work out the bushings with Vice Grips after pounding out the inner sleeve before welding. They just won't survive under the intense penetrating heat required.

I got the bushing out. It's not horrible so I'll use it for mock up. But I'm gonna get another one before I drive it.

Halo, believe me that is definately not the finished product. I'm now mocking up all the gussets and reinforcement. I'll post pics tomorrow...that is if I can find somebody with some oxygen. I got in too late to get my bottle filled.

If it doesn't come out good after visual inspection by ya'll and I have a friend who builds race cars, then I'll scrap it and take Halo up on his offer. I'm tryin to get my ride up to Houston so I can work on it the rest of the summer. I just need to find a trailer that'll fit it.

I cannot believe I'm reading this on a tech forum at pirate.

Trucks like this belong on the scary steering page, not on pirate.

Wow....How about some constructive critcism buddy.

I'm postin' here because there are alot of people here who know alot about Dana 60s, 14 bolts, Detroit Lockers, GM Small Blocks, and Fabrication. All these things concern me.

I don't know how many times I'll say this, but I'll do it again: I'm a mudder...I'm talkin gumbo mud....the swamps....in no way will this see rocks. Most places I ride are below sea level and very flat.

I'm perfectly aware that the pic I've posted is not an acceptable design in its current state. I'm young but I'm no retard.
I plan on doing some seroius gusseting and bracing. I posted the pic of it as it is because I take pics constantly and I've been bored and haven't posted in while for a number of reasons which I've talked about earlier in the thread.

I will most definately post again once I've got it ready for your inspection.

Look I may not have a zillion to one gear reduction and a really low center of gravity and crazy flex. Those things are cool and maybe that'll be my next project. Not really any rocks around here(aren't we just products of our evironment). But there are others on pirate with rigs like mine and for the same reasons. Pavement sucks and other threads don't have that good of tech.

Some of ya'll aren't the most polite of people and others could make a sailor blush, but it doesn't really bother me. I play college football and take orders from very evil men on a daily basis.

I could care less if you respect me I'm just here so I can build a better overall rig. I'm 21 a full time student and college athelete and I'm currently training over 5 hours a day with combined running/lifiting/"skill development" and not to mention the training room, film and mandatory meetings. I have to drive to the other side of Houston a couple nights a week to fab things at my buddy's shop and every couple of weekends I can drive a few hours back to my parents home and work my butt off on the truck, when it's not raining cats and dogs.
I have no shop.
Oh did I mention I've been in a relationship for almost five years....and she's very truck jealous....I'm sure some of ya'll are familiar.

All that to say, I'm here to get advice and give a little when I've already experience something someone else has gone through and I don't hurl insults and tell people they don't belong.

But whatever floats your boat.

Don't get all bent out of shape man, we are trying to help. If your truck has something wrong with it, we are going to tell you - and we are just like normal guys, we talk shit. If you can't handle it, you need to find another site, or you will be getting all offended over and over again.

I'm telling you man, unless you are in some SWAMPS, you don't need to be that high. If you do run in swamps, then you need different tires (the ag tires you spoke of) for wheeling. This IS a rockcrawler site, and 95% can't stand big tall trucks, as they are pointless to us. In fact, they are also pointless to mudRACERS, aswell. There is no genre of wheeling, other than swamprunning that being that big, and that tall will help you in. Simple fact.

The only reason to have a big tall truck is to go real slow in a swamp, or to tip over at the mall.





PS - Quit telling us to stop "addressing" concerns on your truck. You need more than one opinoin (you should know this being a college athlete with an "evil man" as a coach), especially when your first opinions aren't very correct.

I too am astonished that this made it to three pages on this site. Usually if these get to 3 pages, there are only 2 answers, and 51 shit-talkings. What is happening to the PBB????

im glad it isnt like that any more. (for the most part) weed out the armchair quarterbacks, and you can actually see some stuff be built and some bad ass tech here. if that was the case, my threads would be hundreds of pages long :laughing:


take most peoples advise here to heart. the others are just trying to ruffle your feathers, or make them feel better by insulting others. i say you scrap that entire peice and try something diffrent. you cant pound out a princess from pig shit. you gotta have a tough skin to survive on the PBB, and especially with a truck like yours.

It was late at night and I was typing while watching tv. Oh well.

Believe me there is going to be a lot more metal on that thing.

If ya'll look at reddman's truck on the chevy forum his shackle hanges are just a few pieces of tubing and they seem to have help up through some serious abuse.

I should have some pics up tonight. I gotta wait till my buddy gets off work at 3 so I can use his torch.

Oh...I found a scrap yard in Beaumont yesterday that sell used metal and most of it is in real good shape. Alot of it has primer on it or just mild surface rust. It's a pretty big yard.

I got some 1.25 sched 40 for like $.90 a foot and it's in real good shape. I'm gonna use it for bracing and eventually a rear bumper.

I also have to make a new rear x-member for my rear shock...Never let some random redneck hook the tow strap to your truck. They'll pick the dinkiest thing under it.

Well I got off to a rough start today. My buddy with the speed shop was out of town when I called and couldn't borrow his O2 bottle.
So I called around and eventually found a newer wheelin' buddy who said he'd help me out. But I had to wait till 3 when he got off work.

So I went to Home depot and got a new chop saw blade and grindin' wheel. And I did some more mocking up and got all my templates good to go.

Got all my metal cut and and then chatted for a while so I didn't get home till like 5:30. I hadn't a whole weld when the monsoon came. I have to work in the driveway so this was an inconvenience. I had to run everything into the garage and I got soaked. It didn't last long and then I went back to work and my welder sarted acting up. The wire wouldn't feed evenly. I was worried the drive motor was going out but once I changed to a 10lb spool of wire and it was smooth again.

I've got the shackle hanger looking pretty stout now. I'm not quite done because of the late start I got. I can't post picks because I'm at my parents house for the weekend. So tomorrow night I'll get 'em up.

I got a few more hours of fabbin' to do and it should be good to go.

I think I'm gonna run about a 4-4.5" shackle so I don't have to worry about my driveshaft compressing too much again. I might eventually build a new front driveshaft with a bigger slip. But not right now.

Look man, I own a tall truck too, I am the same age, in college, in a relationship and a lot of the same things you have going on. Nobody here cares about that stuff. When I built my truck originally it had some stupid shit on it, which I am fixing right now.

The guys on this board will bust your balls for the truck you have, but they still offer sound advice. Even if they hate your truck or you they will still tell you how to make your truck perform better and, more importantly, safer. Nobody wants anybody to get hurt or killed because something on a truck breaks going down the road. If these guys see things that need to be fixed they will tell you. Don't take it as an attack, take it as good advice from guys who care enough to keep you and others out of harm.

I know. When you put so many hours into something you can get defensive. I'm sure you understand.

By the way I really like your rig. What kind of wheelin' do you do? How are the michelins in mud?

Ok I got the pictures of what I've got so far:

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/pipegusset2.jpg

I boxed in the first elbow with 1/4" and then welded in a piece of 1.5" Sched 40 with 45s cut on each end.

The elbow that goes under the tranny pan was fist gusseted with 3/8" triangle and then with a section of 1.5" sched 40.

http://www.forumsigs.com/users/dbing/finished.jpg

Here's what I got right now. I also boxed in the shackle hanger pipes with 1/4". One the whole thing is welded into place I'm going to make more gussets out of 3/8" and pipe. Coming from several angles to points on the frame. I'm going to box in the frame behind the hanger to have a good place to brace to. I've already got a template made and will get that cut while here in Houston and try to wrap things up next weekend.

I have more pics but the hosting site is full and I'd rather buy a red star than pay their unlimited fee.

OK Fellas, let me have it....

Well, I have 9 day off and then 2 days start.

So I've already made some progress. Couldn't get my metal becaue the place I go to was closed so that's for monday.

I also need new cab bushings, my are dry rotted. O'Reilly's doesn't carry 'em so it looks like I'm goin to the dealership Mon.

Because of the way my shackle hanger is designed I had to drill a 3/4 hole through the frame so I could run a bolt completely through it, head and all, and run it through the shackle and bushings. I ended up using the shackles that came with the springs I've been running. I think they're 5.5". They worked out great.


http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1493938/40473/user_40473/T1_40473_1493938.jpg (http://www.imagehosting.us/index.php?action=show&ident=1493938)


So I think my shackle angle's just where I want it

I also braced my front hangers with some 1.5" shed 40. And then hit it with some POR 15.

http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1488290/40473/user_40473/T1_40473_1488290.jpg (http://www.imagehosting.us/index.php?action=show&ident=1488290)

Check out my expensive milling equipment.....HF notcher....it works pretty good.

http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1493936/40473/user_40473/T1_40473_1493936.jpg (http://www.imagehosting.us/index.php?action=show&ident=1493936)

I went and got new wheels studs for one hub because they were shorter than the other side and I went a head and pulled off both hubs and hit 'em with POR15.....I got a little in my hair while painting the tubing....it sucks.

So I'll be boxing in the frame about 1.5' from the shackle hanger and bracing it to that with 1/4" and 1.5"pipe.

Once I wrap this up I need to get the rear a couple inches taller(I know...boo...hiss...) to level it. I really want to ditch the 4" lift block too.
I could sell the springs I'm runnin' know and get taller ones, but they'll probably end up alot stiffer. I'm gonna see what puttin' a lowering shackle with the shackle flip will do. And I guess I could always build new hanger for the fixed end of the spring to give lift, but they'd have to be pretty big to ditch the block....I could use a zero rate too, I guess.

Well...well cross that bridge when we come to it.

For some reason this didn't bump up after I posted so maybe this'll work.

eh. i guess it will work, its just ulgy as shit :flipoff2:

man, DONT USE FUCKING CINDER BLOCKS FOR JACKSTANDS UNLESS YOU WANNA DIE.
search for cinder blocks and people dieing. man thats bad ju-ju right there

you seem to have it strong enough, just the design is a little funky.

eh. i guess it will work, its just ulgy as shit :flipoff2:

man, DONT USE FUCKING CINDER BLOCKS FOR JACKSTANDS UNLESS YOU WANNA DIE.
search for cinder blocks and people dieing. man thats bad ju-ju right there

you seem to have it strong enough, just the design is a little funky.


they dont make cinder blocks anymore,

They are concrete blocks. :flipoff2:

They're solid concrete blocks....and I also have the front hooked to an engine hoist to support the weight. But in those pictures it's off the blocks. The springs are connected and the front axel's on jackstands.

It's definately more solid than ORU's hangers. Theirs are 1/4" an mine's 3/8".

I'm about to install the trans temp guage so I hopefully won't burn up any more clutch packs.

.....my next thing I'm considering is upgrading my front axels.
Sure I'd love to get the new longfield chromo inners and outers with cv's but that's a little out of the budget.

Who makes the best 35 spline chromo outers for the best deal? CTMs are expensive as heck. I might go longfield u-joints...they're high but more affordable and they're still lifetime warrantied. Or are there another u-joint I should consider? Do most of ya'll run stock inner shafts?

What have ya'll run? Consider I'm running 46 locked, but I run straight mud.

Has anyone ever had their ring & pinions cryo'ed? Can it be done to a used set?

I'm a Mile Marker dealer so I can get a bunch of their 35 spline hubs for a good deal.

Thanks.

ORU's hangars are 3" tall off the frame, your material may be thicker but your application is a lot tougher. The amount of leverage you now have on the mounting points is obnoxious to say the least, it had better be overbuilt.

have you broken anything on the front end yet? if not why upgrade?

Who makes the best 35 spline chromo outers for the best deal? CTMs are expensive as heck. I might go longfield u-joints...they're high but more affordable and they're still lifetime warrantied. Or are there another u-joint I should consider? Do most of ya'll run stock inner shafts?

What have ya'll run? Consider I'm running 46 locked, but I run straight mud.

Has anyone ever had their ring & pinions cryo'ed? Can it be done to a used set?

I'm a Mile Marker dealer so I can get a bunch of their 35 spline hubs for a good deal.


1. The best 35 spline Chromo outers are Superiors Evolution series in my opinion. See the Billavista tech article on them and decide for yourself. To me the best deal is what stays together, and my Superiors have taken a beating and asked for more.

2. I run CTMs. They have come down in price quite a bit since I got mine. I'm sure the Longfields are a good product as is everything from his shop, but I run CTMs because they are a proven product found on nearly every rock buggy on the trail.

3. No, most of us do not run stock inner shafts. Once you upgrade the outers to chromo and upgrade to a joint that requires the use of full circle clips, you need to either machine your inner shafts (some do it with a grinder, I wouldn't suggest that) or buy new ones. Taking into consideration your tires are pretty extreme in size and width compared to the Dana 60 you're running (even with upgrades to shafts, carrier, etc., you're on the edge of what a D60 is even capable of) I would highly suggest that you upgrade both inner and outer shafts to something stronger. Just like my outers, I run Superiors, and they have no equal in this market in my opinion.

4. If you upgrade to 35 spline outers and use hubs, you have downgraded in strength. 35 spline hubs from any manufacturer are weaker than 30 spline hubs and weaker than a 30 spline outer. The only way to go is to upgrade to a set of drive flanges when you put in the 35 spline outers. I have the Warn flanges but there are many different types on the market and I have yet to hear of anyone breaking one.

5. I have not had a ring and pinion cryo'ed and I wouldn't bother doing it unless I managed to strip a ring and pinion set which has not happened to date in my rig.

Tim, thanks as always.

The only negative I see with drive flanges is that the local wheelin' spot is about 15 miles away. And I drive it there. And occassionally I drive it about 20 miles to my Uncles in Louisianna.

Sure it would be tow only if I had a Tow Rig and a trailer this thing would fit on, but that's not in the budget for a couple of years.

HALO, I'm not upgrading right now. I'm just doin' my research. I'm throwin' lockers in this week and I'm probably gonna start breakin stuff.

But I've been readin' about some guys here on Pirate runnin' 47s on Dana 60s in the rocks, but their rigs are significantly lighter.

Tim, thanks as always.

The only negative I see with drive flanges is that the local wheelin' spot is about 15 miles away. And I drive it there. And occassionally I drive it about 20 miles to my Uncles in Louisianna.

Sure it would be tow only if I had a Tow Rig and a trailer this thing would fit on, but that's not in the budget for a couple of years.

HALO, I'm not upgrading right now. I'm just doin' my research. I'm throwin' lockers in this week and I'm probably gonna start breakin stuff.

But I've been readin' about some guys here on Pirate runnin' 47s on Dana 60s in the rocks, but their rigs are significantly lighter.

There's nothing wrong with driving flanges on the street. I have an auto locker and once I'm in 2wd, there are no strange characteristics from driving it on the road. It's not like any of us can 'wheel without at least driving from the trailer parking to the trail, and the drive flanges haven't made that any more or less difficult.

47s I'd say is pretty questionable on a Dana 60. Good shafts will hold up, but then the weak point has to be the carrier or R&P.

All I can say is WOW....as I'm buttoning up all the little things on this truck, I needed some new rubber cab mount bushings. The old ones were completely rotted. The ones that go under the frame mount and have the metal cap that the bolt goes through.

After trying the local autoparts store I had to go to the dealer. They wanted over $110 for them. Since I'm set up as a shop I was able to get it for $80, but still. I haven't been able to get any steel because there was a small monsoon over Beaumont.

Does any one know how much lift one of those Chevy lowering shackles will give in a shackle flip? I don't have the measurements right off hand.

I think my drag link will be long enough with my new set up as my heims were threaded most of the way in the bar...if not I'll order some weld in threaded bungs and get a piece of DOM.
Back to work.

My heims are sticking out a little further than I'd like.
On my drag link, is this a big deal, since I have ram assist steering?

I could cut and sleeve the panhard, but that would look pretty stupid. I'll eventually have a longer one made out of solid round or do the weld in bungs on some DOM.

After using the imact to put my wheels back on and then airing both front tires up from O psi. My compressor quit working. It's not frozen. It just didn't kick back on one time while I was airing up. I was only using it once it cut off and I'd stop once it kicked back on.

I did get it for free....I used to do maintenance at bank, and they used it to operate the a/c vents in the place. There was a leak in the system and it ran nonstop for who knows how long and froze from overheating. All I dead was use anti seize around the piston and push on it for awhile and I got it going again.
I have another free one when the same thing happened again, this time it broke the rod. But I think the motor will fit.

As I suspected once I started mounting all this stuff to the truck my front driveshaft just touches the shackle hanger. My orignal design took into account the driveshaft location, but when I "redesigned" on the fly, I forgot. I've already ordered the diy4x reindexing ring....anyone used one of these....and I'll use it to clock down. I'm just worried how the linkage will work. I need to look at it tomorrow. Fabbing a new t-case x-member is no big deal. I'm also going to notch a 3.5" diamter half circle into the shackle hanger and weld in part of a piece of drill stem and maybe make a driveshaft loop.
My rig's not that flexy so it shouldn't be a big deal.

Has any one ever fabbed up a cable shifter for a 241? Pics? Just curious.

Like Tim Said Longfields are good product . I have seen and read here of people running them and forgeting about them . They have not had problems , and are reasonably cheaper than ctm's and are great . Whenever I do axleshafts for my d60 that is what I will get .

Well. I finished everything up. After reindexing my t-case down about 15* my drive shaft lines up fine but know it is too long again....I know....the whole point of this build was suppossed to take care of this. I guess I'll just get it shortened now. But my tires don't rub at all anymore.

After reindexing my t-case downward, do I need to drill and tap new fill plug so I can get fluid up to the rear output?

My tranny's got a slight drip comming form the rear seal...which sucks because it only has few miles on it since the rebuild.

I'll try to get some pics up but I have to head out early tomorrow to report for a 2 a days. I'm probably not gonna get to touch my truck 'till december. I'm very sad.

I just wanna wheel....Oh, well time to research future mods and dream up build ideas.