any idiots this weekend?

[ridin44s]

just curious if anyone saw anything last weekend on the trail that angered them (diggin ruts, f-ing up the trail) or anything positive as well.

just bored right now.

I tried to edit your language to get it in synch with this PG-13 forum, hasn't taken yet -- randii

[The Jerk]

no reports here. just waited for 45min for 1 million lil jeeps open open spinning tires coming up one section before walker.

[arcthedog]

This weekend was great as far as traffic goes, maybe counted 15-20 rigs all weekend. But my wife agrees with me when i say that the rubicon springs is kinda trashed. we were camped in the campsite directly across from the rope swing and there was broken glass and trash all over our camp site. actually it was like that all over the upper part of the springs. we spent more than our fair share of time picking up after people. it's hard to believe how people could treat such an area like this.

[randii]

Get over it, man. I'm not particularly happy about the way it went down, but it is done.

I have never seen so many people on the trail that had no business being there. As jiMMy stated, sprung under open open jeeps with small tires, there was a group of toyota guys running j-arm steering and the stock pinky tie-rod (that turned into a rainbow of corse)..
Like it or not, the Rubicon gets more use, and every year we see newbies... I haven't seen more this year, IMHO. Not all of them will have lockers or high-steer, and I remember when many of us better-equipped folks had lesser equipment.

All I can suggest is trying to remember what it used to be like back before all the gear, and being prepared to assist other 'wheelers off the trail to allow traffic to flow. IMHO, that's just about the first thing to do in a breakdown, in any case -- secure the vehicle and occupants for safety, THEN GET THEM OFF THE TRAIL, and lastly fix the break.

Randii

[jeeperrick]

All I can suggest is trying to remember what it used to be like back before all the gear, and being prepared to assist other 'wheelers off the trail to allow traffic to flow. IMHO, that's just about the first thing to do in a breakdown, in any case -- secure the vehicle and occupants for safety, THEN GET THEM OFF THE TRAIL, and lastly fix the break.

Randii

Nicely put Randii. Now when I run across that situation I try to think of it as an opportunity to help educate some lesser experienced wheelers. Just my .02.

[OakieOffroad85]

Hey Arc I dont think I saw you this weekend unless I saw you coming out by loon when we were going in. But the trail was awesome this weekend. Not too much traffic. Only had to let people go by a few times that were comin the opposite way. I do have a question tho about the names of one of the obstacles. Going from loon to wentworth springs after you go in the bowl and make your way to the top and back onto the trail toward the springs. Theres this really hairy down hill obstacle with a thick upsloped granite slab to your left and a sluice style rock pile to navigate down. I will post a pic for you when I get the chance. Just wondering if anyone knew what it was off hand. It was definitly the hardest obstacle from loon to wentworth.

[arcthedog]

Hey Arc I dont think I saw you this weekend unless I saw you coming out by loon when we were going in. But the trail was awesome this weekend. Not too much traffic. Only had to let people go by a few times that were comin the opposite way. I do have a question tho about the names of one of the obstacles. Going from loon to wentworth springs after you go in the bowl and make your way to the top and back onto the trail toward the springs. Theres this really hairy down hill obstacle with a thick upsloped granite slab to your left and a sluice style rock pile to navigate down. I will post a pic for you when I get the chance. Just wondering if anyone knew what it was off hand. It was definitly the hardest obstacle from loon to wentworth.

we camped in rubicon springs all weekend-so we probably never came near each other. as far as names of places on the trail goes, i'm still trying to learn them.
I'm pretty sure i know where you are describing, but no clue what the name is

[randii]

I used my moderator mojo to tweak the language in the first post, and then zapped it again to combine a thread Jeremy started and closed (I think because it was in better synch with this one). I've knotted them all together into this thread, with essentially the same discussion, so sorry if it gets a bit twitchy with order-of-posting.

I miss the mid-90's when there was far less traffic up there... and from talking to the folks with more gray hair, there was even less traffic earlier than that. Today's traffic can be frustrating in either of those contexts, but the other alternatives are permits and closures. :(

Randii

[cruzila]

Went in for a day run on Saturday. I have never seen so many people on the trail that had no business being there. As jiMMy stated, sprung under open open jeeps with small tires, there was a group of toyota guys running j-arm steering and the stock pinky tie-rod (that turned into a rainbow of corse).. Then the "as usual" part was they were all standing around "petting &*@$ with the chickens". It appeared that nobody had spare parts or a clue what do to. So the attitude was: lets just drink some more beer and #$%#$% hold up traffic....
They should have never blown up those rocks.. At least if they were still there, those knuckle heads may have broken earlier and not been in everyones way... :shaking:
I had to edit your language to get it in synch with this PG-13 forum -- randii
I can't let this go by anymore. Here's the deal. If anyone, and I mean anyone suggests that a type of 4 wheeler is not to be allowed on the Rubicon in any form, you are no better than the left leaning enviros we all disagree with. They want to keep someone or a group of someones off public land. It is nothing but exclusionism. Self centered righteousism.

Everyone has a right to take their 4 wheel drive vehicle and tackle the famous Rubicon Trail. So not letting them go because of the rig they drive is the same to me.

Meaning, if I decide to go "back to basics" and buy a new Rubicon TJ or old Toyota truck, I have every right to use the trail with my many years of seat time. Who is to tell me I can't??

Scott

rant off

ps continued swearing in here will only get you banned. keep it clean. If you don't know what that is look up DRM here and ask him.

[MellowYellow]

I miss the mid-90's when there was far less traffic up there...

I have never seen so many people on the trail that had no business being there. As jiMMy stated, sprung under open open jeeps with small tires

I miss the 90’s too, where my CJ with small tires could easily run the whole trail and I was cheered for when I tried the box. I guess I have no business being on the trail.

I’m sorry that the trail has been knocked back a couple of tires sizes too, now people won’t give me a thumbs up when I make the gate keeper look easy.

I sure there was more to this story regarding blocking the trail, drinking, etc., but the whole “little guy should stay home” thing really burns my biscuit.

Yes, I have ditched my 32’s this winter in favor of 35’s, but it bums me out that it was becoming necessary to save my under-carriage.
Sorry for the off topic rant. I can’t wait to get up to the trail soon.

[cruzila]

just curious if anyone saw anything last weekend on the trail that angered them (diggin ruts, messing up the trail) or anything positive as well.

just bored right now.

I tried to edit your language to get it in synch with this PG-13 forum, hasn't taken yet -- randii

I almost deleted this thread because I though it a little silly that a bored person would try to incite debate or argument over nothing in particular. but then I thought hey that is rather Pirate................so I let it go.

Language is the only issue.

[randii]

I guess I have no business being on the trail.
Hogwash.

Big rigs bitching about the little rigs is just as silly as the little guys claiming that the big tires always tear up the trail -- the truth is ALWAYS that it comes down to the guy behind the wheel.

I understand that most folks probably like their own build better (why else would they have built it?), but we need to be able to welcome anyone with low range, a willingness to learn, and good enough trail etiquette to allow other traffic to pass if there's a slow-down... tire-size or steering type notwithstanding.

Randii (remembers jiMMy's little blue cruiser before it had ARBs in the stock axles)

[IMUZ ME]

I can't let this go by anymore. Here's the deal. If anyone, and I mean anyone suggests that a type of 4 wheeler is not to be allowed on the Rubicon in any form, you are no better than the left leaning enviros we all disagree with. They want to keep someone or a group of someones off public land. It is nothing but exclusionism. Self centered righteousism.

Everyone has a right to take their 4 wheel drive vehicle and tackle the famous Rubicon Trail. So not letting them go because of the rig they drive is the same to me.

Meaning, if I decide to go "back to basics" and buy a new Rubicon TJ or old Toyota truck, I have every right to use the trail with my many years of seat time. Who is to tell me I can't??

Scott

rant off

ps continued swearing in here will only get you banned. keep it clean. If you don't know what that is look up DRM here and ask him.

I was in NO WAY saying that people do not have a right to go to a public trail. I whole heartedly support it!! I guess I should have made my point more clear: Yes at one time we were all in those shoes, but. In any case each driver owner should make every effort to be properly prepared, or atleast when that happens envoke all energy and effort to move their rig, enlist help of others to move the rig, (instead of standing around "petting poo with the chickens",,,,, maybe they will make a few new friends rather than holding up traffic and having people mad at them. Lord knows I am privledged to know all the guys/gals I do on the trail from traffic jams caused by "sillyvillians" that are broken.


And Yes I closed the other thread and moved my post over because it was more in line here.

Just my .02.... I think everyone should be able to experiance the trail, but come awn, be prepered.... Know what your getting into at the least, and when your stuck or broken, be proactive and don't expect others to save you all the time.

so: #&*# #&% :flipoff2:

[The Jerk]

Hogwash.

Big rigs bitching about the little rigs is just as silly as the little guys claiming that the big tires always tear up the trail -- the truth is ALWAYS that it comes down to the guy behind the wheel.

I understand that most folks probably like their own build better (why else would they have built it?), but we need to be able to welcome anyone with low range, a willingness to learn, and good enough trail etiquette to allow other traffic to pass if there's a slow-down... tire-size or steering type notwithstanding.

Randii (remembers jiMMy's little blue cruiser before it had ARBs in the stock axles)heheheheh. it always had arbs in there. no power steering through and sprung under. i think what was trying to be brought up or convayed was that there is a time and place for everything. it also goes both ways.

EX: I will never just jump in and start trying to help unless it HAS to be said. I would not want some guy blabbing to me on which way to go unless i openly asked for help or ideas.

I was just more crabby that i had to sit there and wait. who wouldnt? but what ever, got to see some stockers and old timers out with the wives enjoying a nice saturday now that i think back on the day. did i want to get home earlyer? YES I DID. did i? nope.

[cruzila]

I was in NO WAY saying that people do not have a right to go to a public trail. I whole heartedly support it!! I guess I should have made my point more clear: Yes at one time we were all in those shoes, but. In any case each driver owner should make every effort to be properly prepared, or atleast when that happens envoke all energy and effort to move their rig, enlist help of others to move the rig, (instead of standing around "petting poo with the chickens",,,,, maybe they will make a few new friends rather than holding up traffic and having people mad at them. Lord knows I am privledged to know all the guys/gals I do on the trail from traffic jams caused by "sillyvillians" that are broken.


And Yes I closed the other thread and moved my post over because it was more in line here.

Just my .02.... I think everyone should be able to experiance the trail, but come awn, be prepered.... Know what your getting into at the least, and when your stuck or broken, be proactive and don't expect others to save you all the time.

so: #&*# #&% :flipoff2:


Now why didn't ya say that in the first place? Heck that sounds like somthin' I'd have written right there. That's the deal, help a guy out if he's in over his head or broke. We are all in this together, like it or not the Feds call ALL of us wheeled vehicles by definition. So we all win or lose together.

Now how about a nice group hug:barf:

Moral of the story: Be prepared.

[microtus]

..... and good enough trail etiquette .....

Easier said than done as this has roots well beyond being on the trail. So many people can care less about their actions day to day much less on the trail.

I was in a parking lot this week and watched a kid (probably 10 or so) walking with his mom to the car. He was opening a candy bar and throwing the wrapper on the ground. I mentioned that he droped something and might want to toss it in the garbage and all I got in response was a verbal barage from his mom. Trash raising trash to throw trash.:shaking:

This goes on all around us each and every day. No consequences and no cares. These are also the people that include the ones that some day just might be on the trail. Holding up the trail by being ignorant, driving off the trail/resource damage, litter/vehicle/human waste, unattended campfires, crank the stereo as they drive by a camp at 1am ect ect.

Some of it we can regulate ourselves and usually with success but at times it sure seems like we are outnumbered.

[ridin44s]

in my original post i said f-ing not the real word so therefore i did not cuss. i also started this thread to hear from those that had been up and whether or not i should be prepared to sit around for awhile or just get in and get out. this whole forum thing is getting pretty political if you ask me.

flame on

[arcthedog]

it's gotten a bit off topic here

[microtus]

just curious if anyone saw anything last weekend on the trail that angered them (diggin ruts, f-ing up the trail) or anything positive as well.

just bored right now.
[/i]

kk the weekend before last ( 6/10)

negative:

Dirtbikes and quads drivingoff trail. Talked to one that actually stoped. He stated he recieved a $125 ticket for riding without a helmet earlier. Talked with him about what is going on with the trail, LE, resource damage ect at which point he turned around and drove off the trail again.

Rigs in too big of a hurry going through GK. Drove off the trail around another rig because they didn't want to wait (the slower rig wasn't stuck) :shaking:

Multiple eople driving past a camp at 0'dark 30 at night and gunning it "cuz their cool?" Funny thing is you can hear them coming down the trail and their mellow until they get by a camp.

Never saw a single USFS or LEO

Positive:

Very few people on the trail.

Didn't see that much garbage on the trail though did pick up quite a bit at Ellis.

Didn't hear the midnight gunfire of years past over and over and over

Never saw a single USFS or LEO

[atvobsession]

Just a comment on the people on the trail that weren't prepared. If any of you old timers remember Uncle Tex....

In his words. "It's all part of growing up"


Sometimes, you just have to get out there and realize...Hey...I am NOT prepared in order to "get it".

And as we all know....you can't take everything. Which is why we stick together. As long as the person I meet who needs help is thankful, respectful...offers a cool beverage or whatever in return...the hope is someday, someone else will pay it back to me.

To me....It's not so much about how many pounds of spare parts they brought....but their attitude.

[Tim Florian]

I just got home 30 minutes ago, and I must say I had a great time. The trail traffic was light (from my experiance, 3 trips)
There were some broken rigs that were blocking the trail, but we either turned around or got out to offer a hand and met some new people. :D

This was my first trip up there since the spider lake closure, and that really got to me. I know it's been talked about alot already but it didn't really hit home till I got there and realized that it was really closed.:(

I picked up a few cans here and there but I didn't see any toilet paper anywhere:cool2: which was alot different from the last time I went up there.

For the people that were there, I had the buggy with the purple flames.

[jopes]

I was in a parking lot this week and watched a kid (probably 10 or so) walking with his mom to the car. He was opening a candy bar and throwing the wrapper on the ground. I mentioned that he droped something and might want to toss it in the garbage and all I got in response was a verbal barage from his mom. Trash raising trash to throw trash.:shaking:



thumbs up for doing this.


Isn't there a way to turn these people in so they think twice next time before throwing trash on our trail?

[BEAR]

I've ALWAYS had a good time on the CON, traffic or not.
Every trip I have met new people that were cool.
Yes alot of people go unprepaired but I doubt they know it. My first time, I turned tail at GK(early 90's), I went home did a SOA and threw on 32's then came back, ran the trail and didnt have a clue what I was in for:laughing: I remember being at the top of walker asking an old timer "hey, does it get any worse farther up?" He laughed at me in his cj5 on 33" AT's. I still laugh:flipoff2:
I have broke and been stuck many times over the years and because of it, I have met some of the coolest people in the world. I am proud to return the favor.
I will always help someone and enjoy meeting people on the trail.

THAT BEING SAID:
In recent years I have seen some real A-holes, just like in the city, they dont pull over for faster traffic, they play thier music too loud, litter and plain just dont care about anyone but themselves:mad3:

[OakieOffroad85]

I just got home 30 minutes ago, and I must say I had a great time. The trail traffic was light (from my experiance, 3 trips)
There were some broken rigs that were blocking the trail, but we either turned around or got out to offer a hand and met some new people. :D

This was my first trip up there since the spider lake closure, and that really got to me. I know it's been talked about alot already but it didn't really hit home till I got there and realized that it was really closed.:(

I picked up a few cans here and there but I didn't see any toilet paper anywhere:cool2: which was alot different from the last time I went up there.

For the people that were there, I had the buggy with the purple flames.

Was that the silver buggy purple flames krawler tires, rollin with the youngster in the front seat?

[Tim Florian]

The tubing is blue the panels are white with purple flames, and yes my 9 year old drove from the wentworth/loon juction all the way to the box:grinpimp: Including doing the soap bowl obsticale with an open front end.

[OakieOffroad85]

The tubing is blue the panels are white with purple flames, and yes my 9 year old drove from the wentworth/loon juction all the way to the box:grinpimp: Including doing the soap bowl obsticale with an open front end.

Yeh I'm pretty sure we ran into you going toward wentworth from loon lake. You were heading toward the bowl. I was in the yota and my friends dad was in the brown jeep along with my friend in the chev.

Heres a pic.
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j29/kinkrider510/redtop1116.jpg

[Tim Florian]

Yeah I rememeber seing ya, that was on our way down to the dam for some gas. On the way back to our camp at the box my boy was driving.

[OakieOffroad85]

Yeah I rememeber seing ya, that was on our way down to the dam for some gas. On the way back to our camp at the box my boy was driving.

Yeh I remember you driving up and thinking how sick your rig was. I was like man that thing has got to be owning everything on this trail. Those krawlers sure had alot of rock rash on em. :smokin:

You wouldnt know the name of the obstacle between where I saw you and wentworth where there it starts going down hill with a huge granite slab on the left. Almost a sluice type area except downhill and easier. Hopefully ill have some pics tommorow because im trying to get familiar with the area and learn the names of the trails. It was my first time up there this weekend.

[Tim Florian]

The only things I know the names of are the soup bowl, little sluice and old sluice. I've only been up there 3 times myself and never with anyone that really knows the area enough to tell me the names of everything.

[cruzila]

You wouldnt know the name of the obstacle between where I saw you and wentworth where there it starts going down hill with a huge granite slab on the left. Almost a sluice type area except downhill and easier. Hopefully ill have some pics tommorow because im trying to get familiar with the area and learn the names of the trails. It was my first time up there this weekend.

That is called the Devil's Postpile.

[rockalot]

IMHO all of us (newb & veteran) who are in a big hurry would ultimately enjoy themselves, the trail, other wheelers, their surroundings, the day, etc.. much better if we slowed down a bit.

Maybe its just me, maybe its my carburated 22R, dunno? but going slow allows me to enjoy EVERYTHING 4wheeling has to offer. We may not get back home on time, may not get as far as we had planned, but when we do get there we will be stress free and smiling :D

[OakieOffroad85]

That is called the Devil's Postpile.

Thanks cruzilla for the info.

I finally got some pics of it but their kinda crappy. Heres one as you start from the top.

http://myspace-801.vo.llnwd.net/00848/10/84/848184801_l.jpg

Here is the slab but it is on the right as the picture was taken from the bottom.

http://myspace-238.vo.llnwd.net/00848/83/29/848169238_l.jpg

[randii]

You wouldnt know the name of the obstacle between where I saw you and wentworth where there it starts going down hill with a huge granite slab on the left. Almost a sluice type area except downhill and easier.
That's Devil's Postpile, if I understand your description well:
http://www.rubicontrail.com/ph-postpile-mm-1.jpg
http://www.rubicontrail.com/ph-wentworth-del-1.jpg
http://www.delalbright.com/Images/Rubicon/ww04_rocks_road_web.jpg

Brandon has some god trail-reference pics:
http://www.rivercityrockcrawlers.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=20&Itemid=33
...as does Del, on the FOTR website:
http://www.rubicontrail.com/photos.html

Hopefully ill have some pics tommorow because im trying to get familiar with the area and learn the names of the trails. It was my first time up there this weekend.
I highly recommend finding an experience trail-hand to go along with you -- not just for route-finding and help working the trail, but also for the value of identifying the parts of the trail as you go past them.

Hope you had a blast, regardless -- I well-remember my first trip on Rubicon. :cool2:

Randii

[OakieOffroad85]

Oh wow right on with the help Randii. Much appreciated. I went with my friends dad who has been through the whole trail numerous times but can't remember the names of alot of things. He turned out to be a very good guide just bad with names :D .

Thanks for the links! Now I can tell him the names next time. :smokin:

My first time on the Con was definitly a lot of fun. I just got back 2 days ago and I already wanna go back.

[RCKRATZ]

haha Randii's wrong Randii's wrong :flipoff2:

That is after you hit the slab area at the top of Devil's Postpile. Don't know if it has an "official" name, but our group has always called that the forgotten sluice.

Damn now that I think of it.....where does the official trail go? Are you supposed to follow the slab route from the postpile to the intersection with Loon or can you still go this way?

[OakieOffroad85]

Yeah now i remember after you go through the obstacle i mentioned you go down to a huge boulder with that steel plate on it that says rubicon trail adopted in 1984 by , I forgot the name. There was a few bullets and coins on top. We took the liberty of putting one of our friends business cards from 4 wheel parts up there with a rock. Just to see if anyone gives him a call and was like hey i saw your name on the rubicon. :laughing: :laughing:

[patfo]

You wouldnt know the name of the obstacle between where I saw you and wentworth where there it starts going down hill with a huge granite slab on the left. Almost a sluice type area except downhill and easier. Hopefully ill have some pics tommorow because im trying to get familiar with the area and learn the names of the trails. It was my first time up there this weekend.

The area he is talking about is between postpile and the merge, out on the slabs. I'm not positive but I don't think it is part of the "official" trail. It is a fun little area though.

[cruzila]

Forgotten Sluice. I spent 3-4 hrs there one Sunday in February many years ago. Two flat tires, one of them cut and the wheel bent. Snowing like a maddog the whole time. Never forget that. If it is not the trail it should be.

Randii's pics are of the postpile. Actually the postpile is 100yards off the trail to the NE of that area,but to call it the postpile suffices.

[randii]

haha Randii's wrong Randii's wrong :flipoff2:
Ask my wife... it happens ALL the time. :p

Randii

[OakieOffroad85]

Forgotten Sluice. I spent 3-4 hrs there one Sunday in February many years ago. Two flat tires, one of them cut and the wheel bent. Snowing like a maddog the whole time. Never forget that. If it is not the trail it should be.

Randii's pics are of the postpile. Actually the postpile is 100yards off the trail to the NE of that area,but to call it the postpile suffices.


Yeh it was definitly a good part of the trail. After I went down I just had to try and go back up. And of course I did it. Then I got to come back down again. :D

Ill have some pics and vids of it all as soon as my friend gives em to me. Keep your eyes open in the toyota forum for em.

[Foolsize]

oh man this whole subject is old...all you can do is try to educate.i wish someone told me i should'nt run the trail until i have mongoloid tires and oodles of money into my suspension, like said before we all have a right to run the trail. yeh sure there is a smart way to go about it but everyone has to learn. i mean if you don't like it go somewhere else. its not like this is a new trend on the Rubicon. its funny cause all the newbies this year will be talking trash about the newbies next year, its nothing new guys. lets move on. the main issue here is poop and trash on the trail lets focus on that.


Sean

[ridin44s]

oh man this whole subject is old...all you can do is try to educate.i wish someone told me i should'nt run the trail until i have mongoloid tires and oodles of money into my suspension, like said before we all have a right to run the trail. yeh sure there is a smart way to go about it but everyone has to learn. i mean if you don't like it go somewhere else. its not like this is a new trend on the Rubicon. its funny cause all the newbies this year will be talking trash about the newbies next year, its nothing new guys. lets move on. the main issue here is poop and trash on the trail lets focus on that.


Sean
i agree with that. i have only been wheeling since i was 18. ( i am 19 now) i have gone from a soa yj with stock axles and 33's, then lockrights, after a long winter i am on 1.5" springs soa with waggy 44's, dual cases and 36" and i hate on all the newbs eventhough i am still one. what a great sport.

[Foolsize]

i agree with that. i have only been wheeling since i was 18. ( i am 19 now) i have gone from a soa yj with stock axles and 33's, then lockrights, after a long winter i am on 1.5" springs soa with waggy 44's, dual cases and 36" and i hate on all the newbs eventhough i am still one. what a great sport.


atleast your honest

[ridin44s]

i try. i am really motivated towards educating the public and keeping the trail open also. i always try to educate my friends on tread lightly and to not spread b.s. about closing the trail and such. unfortunately i have school and work most saturdays for the next month but i will try and make as many work weekends as i can.

[rockalot]

Here's a couple Devil's Post Pile pics near the beginning on the way in...

http://www.creationnonstop.com/images/board/devilspostpile1.jpg
this is the center line straddling the two boulders that the one fellow is humping

http://www.creationnonstop.com/images/board/devilspostpile2.jpg
and this is the line to the right

[OakieOffroad85]

Ohh ok i went through devils postpile as well except i went down and i took the line a little to the left. I used my sliders on both sides and just squeezed between em.

[borregobandito]

It suprises me that everyone seems to be describing such logjams.
I went through the trail two weeks ago with two other Land Rovers (read:lots of body work and 32" tires). We broke everything imaginable and took 5 days just to go end to end, but there were hardly any points at which we weren't able to let people by. The only time other people on the trail were waiting for us is when they stopped to lend a much appreciated hand (thanks POR and GLDNNGT). Maybe we just got lucky and managed to bust in the right spots.

[Rollie]

It suprises me that everyone seems to be describing such logjams.
I went through the trail two weeks ago with two other Land Rovers (read:lots of body work and 32" tires). We broke everything imaginable and took 5 days just to go end to end, but there were hardly any points at which we weren't able to let people by. The only time other people on the trail were waiting for us is when they stopped to lend a much appreciated hand (thanks POR and GLDNNGT). Maybe we just got lucky and managed to bust in the right spots.
Your welcome.:D

[Curly]

Your welcome. Glad to be able to lend a hand. I know you guys took some pics of us cutting the bumper down. Any chance you can shoot them over to me (email)? Fun stuff to look back on over the years ya know.:D

[borregobandito]

Your welcome. Glad to be able to lend a hand. I know you guys took some pics of us cutting the bumper down. Any chance you can shoot them over to me (email)? Fun stuff to look back on over the years ya know.:D


We shot 1200 photos with a Nikon D70 and about 500 more with a Canon 20D.
There will be an edited gallery up in about a week and I'll post up the link.
Should be good.

[ErikB]

Forgotten Sluice. I spent 3-4 hrs there one Sunday in February many years ago. Two flat tires, one of them cut and the wheel bent. Snowing like a maddog the whole time. Never forget that. If it is not the trail it should be.

Randii's pics are of the postpile. Actually the postpile is 100yards off the trail to the NE of that area,but to call it the postpile suffices.

Forgotten Sluice- now I know! :cool2:

I accidentally did a nose-wheelie there a few years ago... :eek:

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/pics/concleanup03/Eric%20Con%20Clean%20Up%2010-03%20(7).JPG

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/pics/concleanup03/Eric%20Con%20Clean%20Up%2010-03%20(6).JPG

Instead of me sliding over the boulder, the boulder decided to roll with me (yes, both rear tires are up in the air!) :laughing:

[OakieOffroad85]

Forgotten Sluice- now I know! :cool2:

I accidentally did a nose-wheelie there a few years ago... :eek:

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/pics/concleanup03/Eric%20Con%20Clean%20Up%2010-03%20(7).JPG

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/pics/concleanup03/Eric%20Con%20Clean%20Up%2010-03%20(6).JPG

Instead of me sliding over the boulder, the boulder decided to roll with me (yes, both rear tires are up in the air!) :laughing:

Haha yeh I gave that boulder a piece last weekend. I nailed it with my slider each time i went by it. It even dented my Marlin sliders. Should have a video pretty soon here.

[AggieDog]

Sometimes I think the 35's should be outlawed. Then you will know who really knows how to wheel. I'm one of those old grey hair guys, and I dont need a catapillar to go 4 wheeling. What the H...L kind of challange is that........

[randii]

Sometimes I think the 35's should be outlawed. Then you will know who really knows how to wheel. I'm one of those old grey hair guys, and I dont need a catapillar to go 4 wheeling. What the H...L kind of challange is that........

Rubicon isn't much of a challenge -- it is a great trail into the scenic Sierra, and an opportunity to get away from it all... at least most of it.

If you want a challenge, go to MoonRocks, Johnson Valley, or somewhere with extreme obstacles. Rubicon ain't it...

I sincerely enjoy watching the (gray hairs) 'wheel their clapped out CJs on 33s and a single powerlock that last frictioned a clutch in the 70s... it is awesome to see what driving skill can really do. That said, it is sad to hear the (gray hairs) whine about what once was, when they won't work to improve the experience that it has become today. FWIW, that sentence reads the same when you put just about any user group in place of (gray hairs).

You may indeed be a better driver than most, but the holier-than-thou attitude is gonna make for a lonely campfire.

Randii

[XJTANDA]

On our way from buck to loon on sunday morning,we filled a trashbag with trash we picked up on our way.[ a lot of beer cans] and stuff in fire pits people tried to burn. We also put out a fire still burning.We were told who did it, but it is just here say and I won't spread rumors.

[The Jerk]

Sometimes I think the 35's should be outlawed. Then you will know who really knows how to wheel. I'm one of those old grey hair guys, and I dont need a catapillar to go 4 wheeling. What the H...L kind of challange is that........it sure makes it more relaxing and piece of mind to roll in by yourself in the evening and know you dont have to worry about anything though.....

[Rollie]

it sure makes it more relaxing and piece of mind to roll in by yourself in the evening and know you dont have to worry about anything though.....
SHOOT me when I get old & complain about my tires.

[randii]

SHOOT me when I get old & complain about my tires.
Ron, you're already old! :p
jiMMy -- chamber a round, he's bound to compain about the tires soon! :laughing:

Randii

[Rollie]

Ron, you're already old! :p
jiMMy -- chamber a round, he's bound to compain about the tires soon! :laughing:

Randii
I knew that was coming :flipoff2:

[Rockhugger]

just curious if anyone saw anything last weekend on the trail that angered them (diggin ruts, f-ing up the trail) or anything positive as well.

just bored right now.

I tried to edit your language to get it in synch with this PG-13 forum, hasn't taken yet -- randii

well this question is about 2 weeks old now, but I think it shall live on for an eternity on Pirate. I happened to be cruising another forum and ran accross some Rubicon activity and imediately took interest, the link below will take you to what I read:

http://www.bayarea4x4.com/forums/index.php?topic=5956.new;boardseen#new

Nothing bad just an observation . I couldn't think of anywhere else to post this so I thought it would be consistant with the question that started it. have a great 4th everybody. :smokin: :beer:

[Rockhugger]

oh yeah, the point is that it looks like the foerst service handed out an infraction or two and the fine is fairly hefty.

[peesalot]

Going left of trail there to climb that rock is the exact trail widening shit that gets problems started. It was totally easy , flat trail , just drive it stupid. Why go there ? Just cause ? Thats what they will say when the feds try to close it. Thank god for corp interest.

[randii]

He got a ticket -- and got off light, only $300. When I talk to the LEOs and FPOs, I always lobby for higher tickets, especially for repeat offenders. $300 is gas money and a tire for a weekend -- I doubt it will change anybody's mind. Get it up to $500 and it hurts harder, and becomes more of a deterrent.

FWIW and FYI -- resource damage can be ticketed for up to five grand and/or six months in jail, with the officer's discretion about mandatory appearance at court. Either bolded part should be worth of note, but the six letters between are even more worthy of note: and/or. What that means is that the court may elect to fine you, jail you, or BOTH, based on the act.

Stay on the trails and this is not an issue... wander off the trail, and I'll be one of those folks rooting that you be made an example in a very expensive fashion. I'm tired of seeing the beauty of our trails tore up by idiots.

Randii

[Rockhugger]

Yeah I thought that was light also, I would venture to say that considering the process of trail marking is still under way and the word is still spreading, this was possibly the ramping up of the fine levels , and we are on the lower levels of the ramp, next year for example the fine for the same infraction in the same location might $ 1,000 . I'd say that particular LEO - FPO was just firing a warning shot in the air. ooooohh boy, I bet them fines and warning shots are gonna be flyin this weekend .

maybe it'll be strike three - we take your rig now . buy buy , go home or ride with a buddy .

[randii]

maybe it'll be strike three - we take your rig now . buy buy , go home or ride with a buddy .
I like that idea, but impound would be a pain. How 'bout after strike three, the Sheriff's XJ gives you a ride out, and on the way, posts the sign: FREE PARTS!

[tacomamike]

well this question is about 2 weeks old now, but I think it shall live on for an eternity on Pirate. I happened to be cruising another forum and ran accross some Rubicon activity and imediately took interest, the link below will take you to what I read:

http://www.bayarea4x4.com/forums/index.php?topic=5956.new;boardseen#new

Nothing bad just an observation . I couldn't think of anywhere else to post this so I thought it would be consistant with the question that started it. have a great 4th everybody. :smokin: :beer:

I hope the dude gets hosed.

In that spot it's really obvious where the trail goes. He was fawking around off the trail and got busted. I would like to see the FS make examples out of a couple of these cases, and get the word spread around.

Later,
....Mike
http://www.toy4x4.net/

[mtnbronco]

after viewing the BA4x4 site it appears the real problem is the way people think down there and everywhere, since the issues are not in their face on a regular basis. This is the reason trail patrol needs to make a an effort to change the minds of the mavrick wheeler. The ticket should have a mandatory education class on the enviroment to go with the fine. Like alcohol classes for DUIs..

[kellymoe]

We shot 1200 photos with a Nikon D70 and about 500 more with a Canon 20D.
There will be an edited gallery up in about a week and I'll post up the link.
Should be good.

Come on already, how long does it take to get 1200 pictures together:flipoff2: :D

[SeanP]

It's very clear from reading that link that the reason he got the ticket was that it was hideously ugly. :D


Stay on the trail.

[Fman]

Went in for a day run on Saturday. I have never seen so many people on the trail that had no business being there. As jiMMy stated, sprung under open open jeeps with small tires, there was a group of toyota guys running j-arm steering and the stock pinky tie-rod (that turned into a rainbow of corse).. Then the "as usual" part was they were all standing around "petting poop with the chickens". It appeared that nobody had spare parts or a clue what do to. So the attitude was: lets just drink some more beer and hold up traffic....
They should have never blown up those rocks.. Atleast if they were still there, those knuckle heads may have broken earlier and not been in everyones way... :shaking:

Did you pull over and offer to give them some help? Some folks are new and have no idea how to repair some broken items on their rigs.... karma.. what comes around - goes around.

[Al Kaholick]

yes the idiots were out in full force. Bottle rockets at buck island was the worst that I saw

[Rock Tractor]

Some folks are new and have no idea how to repair some broken items on their rigs.
:shaking: Then they should'nt be out there till they have some CLUE

[RichieOTR]

Idiots will be what they are. When we hit the trail Tuesday the 27th we came across a couple of idiots in A white CJ who had broken both rear axles and one front. They were in there alone with no other rigs and had been there since Saturday! No food No water no good camping gear. So rather than enjoy a Margarita or two at camp we towed them from the Stairsteps outside of Spider to the top of the dam. Towed them better than 2 miles and when we told them never to go out alone again they said, "there were a bunch of people out there over the weekend" Friggin Dumbasses :mad3:

Did I mention they had like a 7 year old kid with them, and at some point had rolled their Jeep.

On the positive side there wasn't much trash on the trail (except a CJ) and I dig those reflective trail markers.

[Bronchole]

well this question is about 2 weeks old now, but I think it shall live on for an eternity on Pirate. I happened to be cruising another forum and ran accross some Rubicon activity and imediately took interest, the link below will take you to what I read:

http://www.bayarea4x4.com/forums/index.php?topic=5956.new;boardseen#new

Nothing bad just an observation . I couldn't think of anywhere else to post this so I thought it would be consistant with the question that started it. have a great 4th everybody. :smokin: :beer:

I seriously doubt that any ammount of trail marking would have kept this fine example of A$$hat from doing what he did. Glad to see he got a small portion of what he has coming to him. The only way you are going to contain this type of person is to errect 8' tall concrete walls on each side of the defined trail. you might be able to convience him to refine his ways with idiot tax (the ticket he recieved) but it's going to have to be allot stiffer than $300.

Dan

[XJCREEPER11503]

hey guys.. i just got back from my trip through the rubicon for my first time today and man let me tell you.. it shure was fun.. i have an xj with a 4.5'' lift and 31's and it was a little tuff but i made it to spider lake and got to finaly experince what a real trail is like.. i had the greatest time of my life!! i stayed clean and i picked up after some people on the trail also.. but had a great time.. and i want to thank the guys who i ran into that guied me through the whole trail and had a fun time with a rookie..:D so thanks guys if you read this.. and thanks to the guys who put on the show at 12:00 at night in the little sluce box.. hahaha!! well i hope to meet some new people to run the trail with so i dont have to run it alone agen...:smokin:

[OOP'S]

My first trip all the way through the Con was in 1966, three drunken fools in a 1946 totally stock Military Jeep with stock military non-directional tires. We made it in two days and five cases of beer

[XJCREEPER11503]

HAHAHAHA!!! i thank i made it to spider lake in about 2 1/2 hours... but it was all worth it.. i seen alot of stock jeeps out there that were getting all hung up on rocks.. that was cool to see..

[XJCREEPER11503]

oohh yeah.... but i only had one case of beer...:smokin:

[jeeperrick]

We just got back last night from a 4 day trip, spent camping at Buck Island,it was a pretty quite weekend up there. We did see quite a few FS personnel hiking around Buck, and yes they where handing out citations for parking your rig to far from the trail, and the fine was higher if you where parked on vegetation.
One thing that we did notice was a large amount of people wheeling out there by themselves, in relatively stock vehicles.:shaking:
The trail markings looked good Randii, did notice one or two on the granite bowl are trashed though.

[randii]

The trail markings looked good Randii, did notice one or two on the granite bowl are trashed though.
Thanks for the good words -- can you tell me a bit more about 'trashed?' These are pretty hard to hurt...

Randii

[ROCKLIMO]

.. and thanks to the guys who put on the show at 12:00 at night in the little sluce box.. hahaha!!


Thre is a good example of being part of the problem.why don't dumb F@#&$ like like the show guy stay home:mad3:

[Rockhugger]

Idiots will be what they are. When we hit the trail Tuesday the 27th we came across a couple of idiots in A white CJ who had broken both rear axles and one front. They were in there alone with no other rigs and had been there since Saturday! No food No water no good camping gear. So rather than enjoy a Margarita or two at camp we towed them from the Stairsteps outside of Spider to the top of the dam. Towed them better than 2 miles and when we told them never to go out alone again they said, "there were a bunch of people out there over the weekend" Friggin Dumbasses :mad3:

Did I mention they had like a 7 year old kid with them, and at some point had rolled their Jeep.

On the positive side there wasn't much trash on the trail (except a CJ) and I dig those reflective trail markers.

That is like saying Im gonna go hike mount everest with just a bottle of water and this power bar- ahhh if I get hungry, the sherpas will feed me, and if get mountain sickness, they'll carry me home. C'mon son wanna go ? scarry . BTW that's a lot -A- broken S...!!! :nuke:

[Rollie]

Thre is a good example of being part of the problem.why don't dumb F@#&$ like like the show guy stay home:mad3:
You know I think He was talking about me. :flipoff2: If it was friday night. I don't think we caused any problems laughing at the box as we came through and continuing on our way. If you weren't their don't assume their was trouble or the same old sh% from times past. The box is legal trail.

[Trailer Guy]

You know I think He was talking about me. :flipoff2: If it was friday night. I don't think we caused any problems laughing at the box as we came through and continuing on our way. If you weren't their don't assume their was trouble or the same old sh% from times past. The box is legal trail.
The box is legal trail and there was a group of us from Redding there on Friday night and I must say, when you all rolled through the box it was done with the upmost respect to the trail. I don't believe the skinny pedal was used hardly at all, maybe enough to keep engines from stalling.

[Rollie]

The box is legal trail and there was a group of us from Redding there on Friday night and I must say, when you all rolled through the box it was done with the upmost respect to the trail. I don't believe the skinny pedal was used hardly at all, maybe enough to keep engines from stalling.
Thank You :smokin:

[T&A-XJ]

Idiots will be what they are. When we hit the trail Tuesday the 27th we came across a couple of idiots in A white CJ who had broken both rear axles and one front. They were in there alone with no other rigs and had been there since Saturday! No food No water no good camping gear. So rather than enjoy a Margarita or two at camp we towed them from the Stairsteps outside of Spider to the top of the dam. Towed them better than 2 miles and when we told them never to go out alone again they said, "there were a bunch of people out there over the weekend" Friggin Dumbasses :mad3:

Did I mention they had like a 7 year old kid with them, and at some point had rolled their Jeep.

On the positive side there wasn't much trash on the trail (except a CJ) and I dig those reflective trail markers.

Sorry for the OT but what part is the stair steps? We hit the trail Monday (6/26) and I dont remember seeing a white CJ broken down. The trail was pretty calm and clean from what I remember, picked up a few things here and there but nothing big. The diamond shape trail markers were a big help for us as it was my 1st time leading and driving through the trail, thanks!

[TatorZuk]

My first trip all the way through the Con was in 1966, three drunken fools in a 1946 totally stock Military Jeep with stock military non-directional tires. We made it in two days and five cases of beer


I almost stopped reading on page 2...glad I didn't...I love these kinds of storys...VERY VERYcool.

[Pooze]

2 personal port-a-poties left in the trees with a bunch of trash. I took out 2 trashed Ice chest left on the trail

[Curly]

We shot 1200 photos with a Nikon D70 and about 500 more with a Canon 20D.
There will be an edited gallery up in about a week and I'll post up the link.
Should be good.

Up yet?

[arcthedog]

I just got back last night from the con and it was full of drunken clowns who go by the name "dirty dozen jeep club". These guys threw a big party in the lower part of the springs saturday night. we ran into one of them in the upper springs and he invited us to the party later. a few of us walked down there later just to realize we had to cross water to get to there campground. So we leave our wives with a friend there while we go back for the rigs so we can shuttle across the pond. while we were gone getting the rigs, a couple of drunks from the party came up to our wives on a quad and started hitting on them and asking them to get on the quad with them and so on and so forth. 10 minutes later we show up with the jeeps, pick up the wives and cross the water towards this party. as soon as we get across, we are met by a couple drunks who tell us that this is a private party and we cant come in. I confronted these jerk offs about being invited and about them trying to get our wives in while we were gone and they just denied everything and walked away. we said f%@# it and went back to camp, just to listen to either m80's being set off or gunfire, not sure which. I'm really starting to hate people.

watch the language in this forum... randii

[ROCKLIMO]

after viewing the BA4x4 site it appears the real problem is the way people think down there and everywhere, since the issues are not in their face on a regular basis.

Based on that I say the Rubicon should be reserved for the exclusive use of the property tax payers of EL Dorado County :p , after all it IS the tax payers of El Dorado County funding all this EIR, EIS and what ever other BS study/report that is now required because of all the bay area jerks!! :mad3:

watch the language, vince. -- Randii

[randii]

I pay taxes primarily in Sacramento County, but I volunteer significantly in Placer and Eldorado counties, and while I'm up there, my sales tax and hotel taxes flow directly into those counties. Most of the studies are being funded from grants outside of the county, regardless.

I know you are partially joking about this, Vince, and are mostly frustrated at the influx of users, but we need their volunteer efforts, their letter-writing, and their state votes especially.

Randii

[cruzila]

Rocklimo, I know you are upset, but you keep pushing the boundaries of our PG-13 forum. Keep it clean please.

[atvobsession]

I just got back last night from the con and it was full of drunken clowns who go by the name "dirty dozen jeep club". These guys threw a big party in the lower part of the springs saturday night.[/i]


That's the annual Midnight Rubicon formerly run by Bill Root. I guess it's been resurrected. I ran that run from 9th Annual to 20th Annual when all the old timers that ran it, decided to hang up their lockers.

It is invitation only...but if you're invited over...Jeesh.


And there are 2 beverages of choice....Night Vision (White Lightning and Grape juice) and "Shackle Grabbers" (Relska Vodka, Almaden Rhine Wine and Grapefruit juice).

[tgariano]

well my club was up at Buck Island the 7th,8th and 9th. Everyone we came across was pleasant and polite.more so than normal.No drunken obnoxious people.No one tearing up or going off trail .

The bad now. Starting from 10 feet to 100 yrds behind and on the sides of the camp sites it was a meadow of white flowers and fudge bars. With a few personal buckets left in the trees. What got us the most was the fudge:mad3: and white flowers:mad3: left square on the granite with in two feet of the creek running behind the camp site. the three camp areas to the left before the creek crossing at buck island.

[cruzila]

Haul it out folks. You can get wag bags at Roundeyes.com, Big 5 in Placerville, and many other places. It is not that hard to do.

I realize that "most" of those that poo badly had a terrible youth and were beaten by their drunken parents. Too bad I have to defend their right to access the Forest. sarcasm.............

[NOODLES]

well my club was up at Buck Island the 7th,8th and 9th. Everyone we came across was pleasant and polite.more so than normal.No drunken obnoxious people.No one tearing up or going off trail .

The bad now. Starting from 10 feet to 100 yrds behind and on the sides of the camp sites it was a meadow of white flowers and fudge bars. With a few personal buckets left in the trees. What got us the most was the fudge:mad3: and white flowers:mad3: left square on the granite with in two feet of the creek running behind the camp site. the three camp areas to the left before the creek crossing at buck island.
I was at the last one on the left before the creek crossing, in that camp, there was a dog turd. that was saturday through sunday. the spots to the left was a big group, but did not wander over there. there was a little trash left on the table that was nailed to the tree. but maybe I didn't walk far enough behind camp, there were just too many skeeters.

[chartdog]

It is sounding more and more like the theory is true.....Buck is becoming the new Spider.........and will soon follow it's fate. :mad3:

[afecko]

I had an interesting conversation with a coworker yesterday, who's family spends a couple of weeks up at Loon every summer, just camping, fishing hiking, etc. He was telling me what a great time they always have, except for the weekends. He said when the "Jeep people" move into camp, the volume goes up ten fold. Music playing loudly till very late/early morning, beating/banging on rigs, revving of engines, etc. Because of this experience, he does not have a favorable opinion of the 4x4 community.

This is a member of the general public, not an enviro-whacko. How do we combat this part of of our image problem? I believe it to be impossible, as it seems to be a general character flaw of many 4 wheelers to be inconsiderate of other users of natural resources. I hope I'm wrong.

[chartdog]

Many people have developed a basic "Rudeness" in their character but keep it in check (sort of) when they have to by obeying societies rules (again, sort of).

To many, off roading means a freedom from the rules and as a result many get an attitude that they can do as they please. In a way that used to be true when there were very few people off roading.

This enjoyment of the freedom means they do not have to control their rudeness.

Simple: selfish and rude, same thing that has eroded society, especially the young.

Another part of my silly philosophy sees a difference in the type of people using the outdoors. Those that know the outdoors and now happen to wheel tend to take better care of it. Those that have never really spent time outdoors until the wheeling craze hit tend to be less considerate.

[Rockhugger]

Many people have developed a basic "Rudeness" in their character but keep it in check (sort of) when they have to by obeying societies rules (again, sort of).

To many, off roading means a freedom from the rules and as a result many get an attitude that they can do as they please. In a way that used to be true when there were very few people off roading.
agreed.

This enjoyment of the freedom means they do not have to control their rudeness.
90% agreed , I have been surprised by the niceness of
someone who otherwise looks like they'd be rude.

Simple: selfish and rude, same thing that has eroded society, especially the young.
Sad but true.

Another part of my silly philosophy sees a difference in the type of people using the outdoors. Those that know the outdoors and now happen to wheel tend to take better care of it. Those that have never really spent time outdoors until the wheeling craze hit tend to be less considerate.

I totally agree with this. The promotion of off roading recent years has definately brought with it a different breed or type of people, maybe younger and normally not so concerned about the outdoors, but ones that see 4 wheeling only in the EXTREME sense, like an " EXTREME SPORT " ( think adrenaline rush ), thrill seeking with no foresight beyond tommorow and the impact thrashing has. If something gets in the way just mow it down. For those, it's not about the environment , it's about the activity and how awesome they looked in front of friends. Your theory or " philosphy " is not silly, but very realistic.

stay positive.

[chartdog]

There are many good people out there wheeling, no doubt about that. There are also many who are working their tails off to save the sport.

I even bummed myself out with my post so I'll will stay positive and keep up the good fight to help it all change.

:D :D :D

[NOODLES]

I totally agree with this. The promotion of off roading recent years has definately brought with it a different breed or type of people, maybe younger and normally not so concerned about the outdoors, but ones that see 4 wheeling only in the EXTREME sense, like an " EXTREME SPORT " ( think adrenaline rush ), thrill seeking with no foresight beyond tommorow and the impact thrashing has. If something gets in the way just mow it down. For those, it's not about the environment , it's about the activity and how awesome they looked in front of friends. Your theory or " philosphy " is not silly, but very realistic.

stay positive.
the young ones are just as concerned about our sport/recreation as the older folk, do not classsify them as a different kind of wheeler. that is like saying jeepers/ toyota drivers/ and so on, are a different kind of breed. I didn't meet a rude person up there this last weekend. tell you what though, the patience of all people on the trail is getting shorter I have noticed. it is this impatience that is making the trail wider between the slabs to the fork where wentworth and loon lake trail come together (in just a few years), and again just before soup can(the last 3 years has gotten worse). And I can't beleive the amount of people out there that actually have to have a "spotter" for a simple trail run like the rubicon do they not watch where thay are going, and remember the placement of the rocks when they are finally on top of them.

[steveh]

Another part of my silly philosophy sees a difference in the type of people using the outdoors. Those that know the outdoors and now happen to wheel tend to take better care of it. Those that have never really spent time outdoors until the wheeling craze hit tend to be less considerate.

Hammer meeting nail square on the head. Well said!

[arcthedog]

And I can't beleive the amount of people out there that actually have to have a "spotter" for a simple trail run like the rubicon do they not watch where thay are going, and remember the placement of the rocks when they are finally on top of them.

I spent a few hours on sunday spotting for my wife. she had never been anything but a passenger before that. she had a great time driving the trail. You shouldn't just rip on someone for having someone spot for them is all i'm saying. experience levels differ greatly on the trail.:D

[NOODLES]

I spent a few hours on sunday spotting for my wife. she had never been anything but a passenger before that. she had a great time driving the trail. You shouldn't just rip on someone for having someone spot for them is all i'm saying. experience levels differ greatly on the trail.:D
were you with the ladies in the tj's. they didn't need your help, and they weren't listening to you anyways.

[arcthedog]

were you with the ladies in the tj's. they didn't need your help, and they weren't listening to you anyways.
whatever you say jackass. :flipoff2:

[kellymoe]

were you with the ladies in the tj's. they didn't need your help, and they weren't listening to you anyways.

Ah, ignorance is the privilege of youth:flipoff2: The spotter comment just drives it home.

[Rockhugger]

the young ones are just as concerned about our sport/recreation as the older folk, do not classsify them as a different kind of wheeler. that is like saying jeepers/ toyota drivers/ and so on, are a different kind of breed. I didn't meet a rude person up there this last weekend. tell you what though, the patience of all people on the trail is getting shorter I have noticed. it is this impatience that is making the trail wider between the slabs .

I appreciate what your saying. However I was not purposely trying to implicate young guns or say they are the breed of destruction... in no way was that my intent, I appologise if it was taken that way. I did say " maybe younger " and probably should've said some younger and some just new or just drawn that way, and really age is irrellevant. In regards to concern about the " sport /recreation " as you said, I think we all know it ( the sport ) is doing fine, the environment the sport is in maybe not . My emphasis was on those that do it with out concern for the ENVIRONMENT they are playing in or that have that I can do whatever I want attitude as previoulsy described. that's all .

I will say this though, if any age group young or old, new or veteran is concerned, step up and show it. It doesn't suck. AMEN

I agree that impatience bites and can spoil the party as well as widen the trail. That should be left at home as soon as you leave for the trail

[elarsen]

I had an interesting conversation with a coworker yesterday, who's family spends a couple of weeks up at Loon every summer, just camping, fishing hiking, etc. He was telling me what a great time they always have, except for the weekends. He said when the "Jeep people" move into camp, the volume goes up ten fold. Music playing loudly till very late/early morning, beating/banging on rigs, revving of engines, etc. Because of this experience, he does not have a favorable opinion of the 4x4 community.

This is a member of the general public, not an enviro-whacko. How do we combat this part of of our image problem? I believe it to be impossible, as it seems to be a general character flaw of many 4 wheelers to be inconsiderate of other users of natural resources. I hope I'm wrong.

Hey- does this guy have a dog named "butters"? We camped next to a guy with 2 kids that said the same thing. He was very nice (even told me a few fishin tips about Loon Lake :D ). Only noise we made was crying kids @ 3am.

[Curly]

"Crying Kids"? Are you out of your mind? What the hell were you thinking? Didn't you hear? There was a big meeting about this issue!!! "Crying kids" has been outlawed in the Eldorado National forest.:flipoff2:

[G.C. Bandit]

I spent a few hours on sunday spotting for my wife. she had never been anything but a passenger before that. she had a great time driving the trail. You shouldn't just rip on someone for having someone spot for them is all i'm saying. experience levels differ greatly on the trail.

I agree with this statement, but there is a time and place to let someone new behind the wheel start driving. Not when there is a line of rigs lined up behind you.....
Other wise go for it!!

[elarsen]

"Crying Kids"? Are you out of your mind? What the hell were you thinking? Didn't you hear? There was a big meeting about this issue!!! "Crying kids" has been outlawed in the Eldorado National forest.:flipoff2:


Rules are made to be broken. Sometimes I run with scissors just for fun.:flipoff2:

[NOODLES]

whatever you say jackass. :flipoff2:
I knew it :D

[arcthedog]

I agree with this statement, but there is a time and place to let someone new behind the wheel start driving. Not when there is a line of rigs lined up behind you.....
Other wise go for it!!
there were no rigs except the ones in our group behind us when she drove

[borregobandito]

Up yet?


at long last:

http://www.expeditionexchange.com/rubicon/

spot yourself!

[Curly]

thanks.

[arcthedog]

I just got back from my 4th rubicon weekend in the last 5 weekends. awesome trip as usual. only thing that bothered me- on the way out from the springs sunday morning towards tahoe, there was a traffic jam 3/4 of the way up cadillac. we were stuck at the graves for about an hour and a half to two hours. while we were waiting there and consuming our favorite beverages, a bunch of dirt bikes came up the trail passing us. no big deal except one of the bikes(blue bike, blue helmet) cut through the actual grave site and spun his tire on the stones making up the ring on one of the graves and sent the stone flying about 6 feet. never stopped, just kept hauling ass up cadillac. dissapointing to say the least. :(

[scotte]

while we were waiting there and consuming our favorite beverages, a bunch of dirt bikes came up the trail passing us. no big deal except one of the bikes(blue bike, blue helmet) cut through the actual grave site and spun his tire on the stones making up the ring on one of the graves and sent the stone flying about 6 feet. never stopped, just kept hauling ass up cadillac. dissapointing to say the least. :(
That sounds exactly like the same group of dirt bikes we encountered earlier on Sunday AM doing the same sort of stuff. Instead of waiting a bit for the stockers we were helping get through a rocky hill and a tight spot, they went around off trail and nearly ran over a couple people stacking rocks (including myself). One guy was intentionally spinning his tires to kick rocks up on rigs. They even got the Sheriff all riled up with a bunch of BS (I'll save that story for an around-the-campfire chat). Very disappointing to see that sort of attitude and lack of respect for others on the trail.

[e cliff]

the young ones are just as concerned about our sport/recreation as the older folk, do not classsify them as a different kind of wheeler. that is like saying jeepers/ toyota drivers/ and so on, are a different kind of breed. I didn't meet a rude person up there this last weekend. tell you what though, the patience of all people on the trail is getting shorter I have noticed. it is this impatience that is making the trail wider between the slabs to the fork where wentworth and loon lake trail come together (in just a few years), and again just before soup can(the last 3 years has gotten worse). And I can't beleive the amount of people out there that actually have to have a "spotter" for a simple trail run like the rubicon do they not watch where thay are going, and remember the placement of the rocks when they are finally on top of them.


sorry but i have found more young pleople then old people doing things they should not, not always true but?????:flipoff2:


the weekend before the fourth i ran into some clowns right before buck, they were doing stupid shtuff, and neither one had a lic plate or green sticker, i did get pictures of them and video of the one clown going off the trail and i ran up and confronted them, they acted like it was big deal. but what can i do???:shaking:

cliff

watch the language here, cruzila

[peesalot]

Dirtbikes have no place on the trail. The fire roads up top fine , but IMO only a trials type bike should be brought into the rocks. The guy who ripped the graves should be cited for more than just going off trail , what an a$$$@@@.
Did the owner of the rig that the biker intenionally slung rocks at pick up a mellon sized rock and throw it real hard right at his head ? I mean the head of the motorcycle engine of coarse:D

[jethrodeg]

While I agree that anyone that intentionally causes resource damage should not be allowed on the trail saying that "Dirt bikes have no place on the trail." is no different than the "environmentalist" saying no off-road vehicles should be allowed on the trail. This approach serves no one. Punish the ones doing damage not an entire group. Just my opinion.

[peesalot]

I say no punish , let em come on thru . I just mean the trail itself is not condusive to 2 wheel bikes at many points.

[renolaw]

Just this Sat. about 3pm between DD camp area and mid-way to the springs, i had to stop for a quick repair. There are a couple places near there marked off-limits by yellow tape or rope. Some have a sign that reads, generally, "Don't go this way or you will be asked to leave the property." They're getting ready for JJ next w/e as well. So i'm underneath bolting up the driveline and along comes a group of tubed out toyotas. They tore down the tape and kept driving. Young male driver and a female passenger w/ a nasty potty mouth. Bystanders confronted them about resource damage, trail closures and the attitude was "F you all, its private property so we can go where we want" and similar comments. Caretaker Kevin was in the area just before that, but they kept moving along toward the springs. We now know Kevin monitors CB 3, but not at the time. And no one had a camera at the ready. Some of the Sierrastompers were there and they were the ones to really verbally shame these 'wads.

Anyone else see this? Oh yeah, after they tore down the yellow tape and drove off, the Stompers went over and tied the tape back up.

hope they get theirs...

mb

[randii]

...the attitude was "F you all, its private property so we can go where we want" and similar comments....
This attitude is going to screw us. :( The owners of Rubicon Springs have been pretty tolerant of public use, and if they keep encountering knuckleheads like this, they'd be entirely within their rights to run a fence on either side of the trail from Rubicon River all the way to Miller Creek. :mad3:

Some of the Sierrastompers were there and they were the ones to really verbally shame these 'wads.
This is the best way of dealing with schmucks like this, IMHO. Kudos to those hat stepped up and said something, then repaired the tape line. Next time, have the cameras at the ready and post up pictures to spread the word.

Randii

[Simple Man]

Get me a better description of the vehicles and I'll follow through. I remember seeing a group with that description pass our work party. Some in our group knew them. Before going hunting, I'd like to confirm who it is I'm hunting.

[ridin44s]

That sounds exactly like the same group of dirt bikes we encountered earlier on Sunday AM doing the same sort of stuff. Instead of waiting a bit for the stockers we were helping get through a rocky hill and a tight spot, they went around off trail and nearly ran over a couple people stacking rocks (including myself). One guy was intentionally spinning his tires to kick rocks up on rigs. They even got the Sheriff all riled up with a bunch of BS (I'll save that story for an around-the-campfire chat). Very disappointing to see that sort of attitude and lack of respect for others on the trail.

edited: violence may be something you like to think is a problem solver but it really is not in this case. I have times when I'd like to just be the vigilante, but know it won't teach anyone anything.

[cruzila]

Get me a better description of the vehicles and I'll follow through. I remember seeing a group with that description pass our work party. Some in our group knew them. Before going hunting, I'd like to confirm who it is I'm hunting.

This kind of hunting I am game for. Between Doug, myself and Del, we can follow through for sure. Just remember, if you are turning in pictures and a story, it is up to YOU to follow through, we can only grease the skids for you. Witnesses are best, even over pictures. Keep some notes.

Now, if I am there and witness something, that is a whole nutha story.

[ROCKLIMO]

Now if I am there and witness something, that is a whole nutha story.

What EXACTLY do you mean by this statement:confused:

[arcthedog]

Some of the Sierrastompers were there and they were the ones to really verbally shame these 'wads.

Anyone else see this? Oh yeah, after they tore down the yellow tape and drove off, the Stompers went over and tied the tape back up.

hope they get theirs...

mb

That would have been Frank in the gold TJ and Casey in a green flatty. I will contact and see if they remember what they looked like.

[arcthedog]

I just called Frank and showed him the thread. he's signing up a user name now and will try to post shortly with more details.

[lazyfrank]

That would have been Frank in the gold TJ and Casey in a green flatty. I will contact and see if they remember what they looked like.
The only rig I remember was a white Toy pickup.

[arcthedog]

The only rig I remember was a white Toy pickup.
:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

[The Rooster]

That sounds exactly like the same group of dirt bikes we encountered earlier on Sunday AM doing the same sort of stuff. Instead of waiting a bit for the stockers we were helping get through a rocky hill and a tight spot, they went around off trail and nearly ran over a couple people stacking rocks (including myself). One guy was intentionally spinning his tires to kick rocks up on rigs. They even got the Sheriff all riled up with a bunch of BS (I'll save that story for an around-the-campfire chat). Very disappointing to see that sort of attitude and lack of respect for others on the trail.

I think we saw these same guy's. (I was a group with two Samurai's and my K5 Blazer) We had pulled over to let this group of four or five H3's get up this section (We were heading towards Tahoe, they were heading towards Loon.) and along came a couple of motorcycles. One guy just blew through while the other one got held up for a minute. Maybe two minutes, but either way he took off and roosted one of the H3's. Later on, they told the Sheriff that these H3's were holding up traffic for hours (it wasn't even close to that long) and the Sherrif came up the hill barking and all pissed off at the Hummer group. It was pretty surprising to see a Sheriff get all pissed off before even assesing the situation. But once everyone explained to the Sheriff what was going on he calmed down and was very cool. I didn't mind waiting (at that point we hadn't broken everything yet) for the group to get up the hill.

I don't understand how some people can get so impatient. You should expect to be held up on the trail. It should be part of your plan. Especially if you have capable rigs like me and my friends because you know you're going to come up on groups. We know we're going to wait, because we're faster than a lot of guys out there. And we remember being the slow group that got out and spotted every little rock and obstacle. Don't just sit in your rig and get pissed off. Get out, relax, and help out however you can. You will need the favor returned someday if you do this long enough.

But for the most part, and I mean by a very large majority, people on the trail seem to be friendly, easy going and very helpful. I'd like to thank everyone who gave us a hand this weekend, as we had a nightmarish time. It was one break after another. My buddy broke a panhard mount and he needed to be welded up, and I'd like to thank the guy with the wire feed welder who helped us out, and the other guys later on who lent us some welding rod, jumper cables and a mask. Later on, after I had broken my front driveshaft I was stuck going up Caddilac hill and a pair of Jeeps came along and lent me a hand with a winch to get me up and over where I was stuck. And try as we may, nobody would accept our money for their help. Thanks again everyone.

[peesalot]

See , there are helpful people along with the shticks.

[cruzila]

What EXACTLY do you mean by this statement:confused:


I EXACTLY mean that I will do everything in my ability to "document" said offence and pursue it to completion. Exactly what I have been preaching.:D

Now what I'd really like to do......................:evil:

[Bebe]

I think we saw these same guy's. (I was a group with two Samurai's and my K5 Blazer) We had pulled over to let this group of four or five H3's get up this section (We were heading towards Tahoe, they were heading towards Loon.) and along came a couple of motorcycles. One guy just blew through while the other one got held up for a minute. Maybe two minutes, but either way he took off and roosted one of the H3's. Later on, they told the Sheriff that these H3's were holding up traffic for hours (it wasn't even close to that long) and the Sherrif came up the hill barking and all pissed off at the Hummer group. It was pretty surprising to see a Sheriff get all pissed off before even assesing the situation. But once everyone explained to the Sheriff what was going on he calmed down and was very cool. I didn't mind waiting (at that point we hadn't broken everything yet) for the group to get up the hill.
Hi Rooster,

I was in the Black H3 at the bottom of the hill. I just want to say thanks to your group for being patient and friendly while we we working things out.

As for the Motorcycle rider that spun rocks all over my truck, and the H3 in front of me, all I can say is what goes around comes around.

Everyone we ran into on the trail was awesome. We had a fantastic time our first time on the Rubicon, due mostly to the message that people at FOTR work so hard to get out.

Thanks. It was an incredible experience. I can't wait to go back.:D

[resqme]

Got a couple of comments:

I encountered this group of Hummers too. They were polite and considerate, a pleasure to talk to, knew they were moving slowly, and made every effort to leave the trail clear when they could. I'm glad the sherriff listened to reason.

My other comment is this: We need to be resolute about getting the "Stay on the trail" message out. Some folks I try to educate about the Forest Order understand it right away and others hear it but apparently don't realize its importance or just don't care. Either way, we need to keep talking about it politely and educationally to everyone we meet on the trail...the more folks hear it, the more they will pay attention, and soon those that want to "tear it up" will be off to Johnson Valley where they belong. I'm not being exclusionary, just saying there is a place for all types of wheeling, and ENF and the Rubicon is the place to stay on the trail and enjoy it for what it is.

Be resolute: keep talking to people (about the Forest Order, hauling garbage, the human waste problem, carrying toilets, staying on the trail, resource damage, etc.), keep educating, keep taking pictures of offenders, keep reporting them, and keep up the fight to protect the trail from closure at the grass roots level. The politics, ROC, etc., are VERY important, but so is what every individual can do.

my .02

[randii]

I don't understand how some people can get so impatient. You should expect to be held up on the trail. It should be part of your plan. Especially if you have capable rigs like me and my friends because you know you're going to come up on groups. We know we're going to wait, because we're faster than a lot of guys out there. And we remember being the slow group that got out and spotted every little rock and obstacle. Don't just sit in your rig and get pissed off. Get out, relax, and help out however you can. You will need the favor returned someday if you do this long enough.
There are so many good, true statements in here, that I wanted to quote it. The Rubicon is a heavily-used resource, and we all should plan on waiting, and use that opportunity to get out and say hello to other folks. I'm not saying to camp out in the middle of the trail and further block traffic, but c'mon, RELAX a little.

Well stated, Mr. Rooster. :grinpimp: :smokin:

Randii

[MellowYellow]

The don't call it a "past time" for nothing. :D

[afecko]

The don't call it a "past time" for nothing. :D


I just hope we don't haved to call it a "passed time" anytime soon! :D

[atvobsession]

There was a complete moron in the Springs this weekend. Friday night....this guy comes blasting in at 12:30AM with a V8 Bronco....Gunning the gas, instead of quietly slinking into the Springs. He parks on the rocks, between the camp across from Rope Swing and the other camp, closer to the falls.

Then....on Saturday, after the group closest to him, politely asked him to keep it down....He decides at 10:30PM to drive around the granite rocks....for nearly 45 minutes...We had to go stand by people sleeping in tents, so that he wouldn't run them over.

White bronco...black half doors...44" tires...One of the most inconsiderate people I've ever encountered in the Springs.

[randii]

Ken, I have got mixed emotions on this. I love the sound of a healthy V8 and I love a screaming guitar (the second solo in Santana's 'Open Invitation' simply can't be played loud enough for my taste -- I've tried, myuch to the detriment of mutliple speakers) ... but there's a time and place for everything.

A campground after midnight ain't it. By the appluase I heard at the Sluicebox when somebody turned off their jams on Saturday, it seems that even midafternoon at the Sluicebox isn't the most popular place to rock out, either, though it was pretty funny watching the guy run up and down the slabs to change tracks. :laughing:

People need to show some consideration. The sad thing is that if it isn't volunteered, it may soon become mandated, when the counties begin a more active management phase. I'd rather trust individual responsibility than rely on government, but these days, I have little faith in either, so I pack a set of earplugs in my camping gear.

Randii

[Jeepndel]

The point of this post is that vehicle types and styles and mods don't matter -- it's the guy/gal behind the wheel that matters. I believe we must keep that in mind. Hummers are the ONLY folks at the corporate level who have chipped in (both in money and manpower) to HELP the Rubicon Trail. They have been on two cleanups/work weekends, and have kicked in well over $2000 in supplies, money and gear.

One weekend they had 8 strong back workers on the Placer side. then on the big August weekend, 5 Hummer folks showed up from Hummer of Sacramento to help us dig and work.

Just my way of saying not to lose track of our purpose....to keep the trail open for ALL.

Del

[atvobsession]

Ken, I have got mixed emotions on this. I love the sound of a healthy V8 and I love a screaming guitar

I LOVE both too....just not at 12:30AM and 11PM at night. The "V8" was for color...it could have been a Pinto engine...:) I'm sure he was drunk..., not that I haven't been or wasn't at that moment, in a similar condition. I just wasn't driving around people's tents on the granite.

I was tripping over the granite on the way to my tent.....big difference. :)

The second night was the most annoying...since he was asked nicely to curb the late night wheeling around camp.

Did I mention guitars?

Circa 1985
http://www.racerxband.com/pictures/headway.jpg

[randii]

What a lovely collection of unfortunate haircuts. :flipoff2:
Been there, done that! :D

Is that you on the base, Ken? :eek:

Randii

[atvobsession]

Yup..played bass in that band.

[Rockhugger]

What a lovely collection of unfortunate haircuts. :flipoff2:
Been there, done that! :D

Is that you on the base, Ken? :eek:

Randii

Dude is that the Scorp's ( Rock me like a hurricane )?:D
shoot... we need a hook-em horns smilie

[d2photo]

Yup..played bass in that band.
Ken...... had HAIR..

[randii]

I love it! As you guys know, I'm hanging onto my rock-n-roll comb-over. :p

Before/After:

[SeanP]

we had that problem (late night V8 jackassery and loud stereo) at Meadow Lake a few years back. Offender was well known on this board. Offender would not listen to folks politely suggesting it was time to go to bed (1AM). Offender ultimately got popped in the jaw. Offender went to bed.

I have reached into rigs to turn off music in strangers jeeps in the wee hours explaining the subtle nuances of living in a civil world. Too many p******s in this world as far as I am concerned

(I know, I speak very tough from behind the wheel of my web rig :flipoff2: )

[Rockhugger]

I have reached into rigs to turn off music in strangers jeeps in the wee hours explaining the subtle nuances of living in a civil world. Too many p******s in this world as far as I am concerned

(I know, I speak very tough from behind the wheel of my web rig :flipoff2: )

Yeah... besides the fact that your spelling of p******s is totally wrong. Pshhhh tough guy!!! :flipoff2: :D I usually just skip all that and get the potato gun. For the record, the twice baked potato seems yield the most effective results.

[resqme]

Saw this problem solved one night in the springs by duct taping the offender to a tree until he sobered up.

Very effective.

I don't recommend the approach though...EDSO may take a dim view of the whole kidnapping aspect.

[SeanP]

Saw this problem solved one night in the springs by duct taping the offender to a tree until he sobered up.

.

love it man. You always know there is a 1.6:1 ratio of rolls of duct tape to rigs, too.

[Mariodesmo]

My buddies and I did the duct tape trick once, many years ago.

I don't think it's actually kidnapping since I think for it to be an official kidnapping, you have to TAKE the person AWAY against their will. If they're just laying there in the dirt, all taped up, then it's simply a joke.

That's what the Forest Ranger thought when he came around and saw what was going on. He laughed and drove away... but that was about 20 years ago...