hey,

For those running a 300 behind a Dodge 4500, what seal are you using in the 4500 tailhousing?

AA says use the stock seal, but the stock seal has too small of a bore for the 300's input. And they would not provide me with a PN (to make sure I was getting the right seal). Went to two Dodge dealers and they have three seals, only one even fits in the tailhousing, and , like I said, the 300's input is toolarge to fit in the seal bore.

I was thinking of running it without one, but I'd rather not.

Any ideas? Anyone have a PN?

Charly

R...T....V :flipoff2:

You mill the 300's seal retainer off about 1/2 inches, and install a SKF #6209-2RSJEM sealed bearing.

Why would I need to do that? why wouldn't a seal work?

In the AA NV4500 conversion guide they publish, on page 25 about using an early Dodge unit with a D300 it sez "use stock seal".
I have one of the older, Dodge deep rear retainer NV's and I didn't need to change the seal's size. I was the perfect size for the OD of the D300's smooth input shaft.
Or pick the one of the three choices given to match the ID of the NV's retainer and the OD of the D300's input shaft.
It's not rocket science ...
Dorfs gave you the trick go-around to avoid buying AA's expensive D300 front retainer adapter for the newer shallow NV's.
Another way to do it is to make or buy a clocking ring, which will let you use a standard D300 front retainer with the new, shallower NV by spacing the two apart enough to avoid the two retainers from interfering (contacting) internally.
It is wise to have the correct size seal in the NV's retainer ... though some just do use RTV and allow the trannie oil to seep into the hollow, but sealed, rear retainer area ...


Originally posted by Charly
Why would I need to do that? why wouldn't a seal work?

Originally posted by Jaffer

Or pick the one of the three choices given to match the ID of the NV's retainer and the OD of the D300's input shaft.
It's not rocket science ...



wow, thanks for repeating exactly what I said in my first post.....I obviously tried that, with no luck.

It's not rocket science to read all five posts in this thread.

I know about AA's fix, and I know that the newer tailhousings are shallower, but "depth" is not my issue, seal shaft bore is.....(like I said in the original post).

I have a 3/8" clocking ring on there (depth wasn't an issue without the clocking ring even), but being a rocket scientist, I noticed that ....that doesn't change the seal shaft bore ....hmmmm, I wonder why?

So, what is the stock seal PN that you have? What year tailhousing do you have? I have a 96, AA states that it's newer than 97 that has the shallower retainer (and perhaps, the different seal ID), but I checked 96 and earlier at the dealers, and they were the same.

thanks

Just trying to be helpful as you know...

Is the "seal shaft bore" you refer to the milled cut in the rear retainer that accepts circular seal for the TC input shaft?

Here is one possability for your problem ...

Quote from AA NV4500 manual ...

"The heavy duty Dodge unit has certain characteristics that will make it not compatable for some of the engine and transfer case conversions.
The heavy duty units have a LARGER 29 TOOTH SPLINE OUTPUT SHAFT, a 1-1/4" clutch disc size and a bell housing index diameter size of 5.600" ...

Could it be that you have a HD unit with the larger output ... and that's causing this seal size thing to not add up :confused:

Wouldn't hurt to double check trannie ID tag ...
again, no offense intended ... :p

GM code No. GXD
GM code No. GAKH
Dodge HD 4x4 code No. 18-179
Dodge Std 4x2 code No. 18-183

Seal shaft bore refers to the ID of the seal, not the tailhousing (go look in a CR seal book and you'll see what I mean)

The tranny is a 93 GM 4500 with a Dodge 4wd gas tailhousing and 23 spline shaft that I put in when I rebuilt it.

So, I am fully aware of what it is.
And the 23 spline 300 would not have fit onto the 23 spline shaft mainshaft of the 4500. So I wouldn't even be at this point in the "problem", would I.

I guess you can't answer my question of PN, so thanks anyway.

Next time when you try to help people leave out the "it's not rocket science" comments, especially if you don't know the answer to the question asked. No offense intended.

Originally posted by Charly
hey,
... Went to two Dodge dealers and they have three seals, only one even fits in the tailhousing, and , like I said, the 300's input is toolarge to fit in the seal bore.
... I was thinking of running it without one, but I'd rather not.
...Any ideas?
Charly

OK, sorry, Charlie-
But the presentation of your question betrayed your knowledge.
AA sez use an OEM and thier manuals state it fits the D300 input.
Mine, and most folk's "seal bore" are a perfect fit for this combo and doesn't leak ... and I've had it back out twice since to know for sure.
Your two Dodge Dealers say there's only one seal in the book with the correct OD and Advance Adapter says the same thing and is willing to ship you one... but I guess that would be giving into them, I suppose.
I've never heard of anyone else with this problem, and believe me I did my homework, lots of it, on this install ... but what the heck do I know?
I tried to help check off anything you may have missed ... probably something very simple and I hope your figger it out.
Frustration bites hard but my hide must be a lot thicker ... so go ahead and say I'm :rasta: and slap me.
No hard feelings or offence here either because I'll be in Chokecherry Canyon most of today ... carefree, no RTV, and with a spotless undercarrage ...

Originally posted by Jaffer
Your two Dodge Dealers say there's only one seal in the book with the correct OD and Advance Adapter says the same thing and is willing to ship you one... but I guess that would be giving into them, I suppose.


Actually, I called AA and they said they are not in the business of selling seals, my reply...."well, you sell not only adapters that state 'use the stock seal', but you also sell complete transmissions, so I though you might sell the seals or perhaps have the PN".

And ........

they said no to the PN.

So once again.....

does anyone know what the correct PN is?

or do I need to listen to someone talk about their hide? wtf?

This is fawkin ridiculous.