I just thought that I would throw the drive train that I am assembling up here and see what you guys think will break first. I should have all of this together in the next month.

SB 350 - Cast Iron bellhousing - ranger 27% overdrive 10 spline in and out - muncie 420 10 spline in and 23 spline out - 2.72 klune V 23 spline in and 32 spline out - dana 300 with 4 to 1, twin stick, rear disc emer. brake, 32spline input and 32 spline outputs front and rear - 1410 driveshafts by high angle - 2 rockwell frontends with detroits and lockouts - hummer wheels - 42 inch TSLs

allright, I figured if there was anywhere where probably all of these parts had been broken at one time or another, it had to be this board so let me know what you think will :nuke: :nuke: :nuke:

the 4-1 gears. maybe one of the rockwell axles.:beer:

Honestly,..from what I have seen. The Rockwell axle shafts will be the 1st to let go.

without a doubt - the D-300 output shaft.

Originally posted by the frog
without a doubt - the D-300 output shaft.

If he is running the upgraded AA 32 spline output shafts, there should not be a problem, they are supposed to be very tough.

On the other hand, I see more Rockwell axle shafts break than I see 35 spline D60 axle shafts break.
For the life of me I cant figure why anyone would want the heavy, wide rockwells, over a well built D60, when they seem to break way more often.
I think its just overbuilding gone haywire.

Originally posted by H8monday


I see more Rockwell axle shafts break than I see 35 spline D60 axle shafts break.
For the life of me I cant figure why anyone would want the heavy, wide rockwells, over a well built D60, when they seem to break way more often.
I think its just overbuilding gone haywire.

H8

1- do you know if the rockwell axleshafts you saw brake were the u-joint kind or the other two kinds(bendix & rezepa)?

2- rockwells are not that heavy compared to D-60. a front rockwell is about 125 lb more than a front D-60, which is not as
much as one may think.

3- i still think that a well taken care of rockwell is much stronger than a D-60, ESPECIALLY when running 44"s!

Originally posted by the frog


H8

1- do you know if the rockwell axleshafts you saw brake were the u-joint kind or the other two kinds(bendix & rezepa)?

2- rockwells are not that heavy compared to D-60. a front rockwell is about 125 lb more than a front D-60, which is not as
much as one may think.

3- i still think that a well taken care of rockwell is much stronger than a D-60, ESPECIALLY when running 44"s!


No idea what kind they are. I know Brutus has broken two of them.
I do know for a fact, that no one including Chris Durham has been able to break a D60 with 35 splines and CTM joints.
125 extra lbs at the front axle is equivelant to having an 800lb gorilla trying to throw you off your line when your nearly vertical and on the throttle.
Like I said, for the life of me, I cant see why anyone would run a Rockwell over a D60. I didnt think that my opinion would be the last word, or that there wouldnt be oposing opinions.

brutus runs the u joint type. he also runs 48s and is very heavy on the gas. they a tough but they do break. i'm stayin with the 4 to 1 gears.:D

I know Brutus has broken two of them.

yeah, with 48's and a AMC400, and a lead foot. 60 axles would break under the abuse that he puts on his rig. Chris Durham is not winning any conservative driver awards, but he is running smaller, lighter tires. Honestly, i think that a chro-mo 60 shaft is stronger than a rockwell, but i think that the CTM joints are not as strong as rockwell U-joints. I have never heard of a rockwell U-joint getting busted, the shaft always goes first.

So, logically the ultimate combo would be 300M shafts in a rockwell, with the huge yokes and 17series u-joints...

ya baby! thats what i'm talkin about.:D

i say gears in the 4-1 kit on the 300, especially with those tires, my friend runs a dana 20 and 39.5 boggers and goes through a transfer case every 2 competitions his rig it is the red right hand drive scout that use to run w/ the Wagoner Machine Shop guys he has built rear 70 and front 60 from wagoner machine shop yall might know him his name is Sean...anyway there are less teeth on the 20 gears which make them bigger which in theory should make them stronger than the 300...it's still a dana 20 though (but i like my 20) Those gears on the 4to1 kit are thin and with those size tires will be worn out and trashed in theory though. ive never ran a 300 so im just saying this in THEORY

Originally posted by the frog
without a doubt - the D-300 output shaft.

You got my vote too! Been there, done that, got the new output... :shaking::D

Originally posted by H8monday



No idea what kind they are. I know Brutus has broken two of them.
I do know for a fact, that no one including Chris Durham has been able to break a D60 with 35 splines and CTM joints.
125 extra lbs at the front axle is equivelant to having an 800lb gorilla trying to throw you off your line when your nearly vertical and on the throttle.
Like I said, for the life of me, I cant see why anyone would run a Rockwell over a D60. I didnt think that my opinion would be the last word, or that there wouldnt be oposing opinions.


i think i will be very satisfied with my 60's..... cant say never but i dont see me wanting or needing rockwells.... cool as hell but i personally dont see the need either.....

im going with the rockwell axles.

he has the 32 spline outputs for you guys not reading. the same outpusts the atlas has. and i havnt heard of anyone breaking one yet

can nobody read! he has 32 spline input and 32 spline outputs front and rear. :rolleyes:

i beat yah to it fullsize

The Dana 300 input gear is still 30 splines... not the splines on the input shaft,(he has upgraded them from 23 to 32..) the splines on the gear.
This is where I think it will break as the HD output shaft is driven through this gear

Also do you have a custom mainshaft for that 420? as all I have seen are 10 spline output.

Originally posted by yjtj
i beat yah to it fullsize


I beat you both to it, about 10 posts ago:p

ya but it was re-posted by someone even slower than the first guy.:rolleyes: damn kids:D

the new input and output shafts are coming from Novak and they are made of 8426 gear steel which I am told is just about twice as strong as 4340 chromo. I both want to and need to run rockwells because I have heard horrible things about 60s in rear steer applications. I know that you can run CTMs and that helps but I still think that they would :nuke: . Just look at the titan axles. They are running dana 80 outers and I have heard that they are having problems with the joints going in them. I still think that the 1700 series joints are much better and shafts are cheap if I do blow them up and when I get oiut of school and am making some real money I will order a set of 300M shafts from CTM I have been told they are 1500 an end and I can see it if I am having problems with the blowing up. I mayhave the detroit and lockouts broached as well and upgrade to 40 spline. That price also includes a set of 1700 series CTM joints. I dont think I put down that I will be running rear steer on here so I am sorry about the confusion. I think 60s are a good axle but I think you get more for your money with the rockwells and I am willing to take an extra 100 pounds or so for the benifits.

also about the gears in the t-case I will nly be using them to crawl with seeing as I am getting the klune 2.72. anytime that I am on the throttle (which is rare because I hate not being able to crawl something) I will use the klune and just throw it in first on the 420. this should be plenty low for that type of a activity. I have heard from the guys at tera that their gears for the 300 are not meant for high rpms and are instead meant for crawling. When you heat them up it ruins the tempering and the teeth get weak. Also I will be running new gears so they will be the five gear version instead of the three gear version.

with all that said, i think you're wallet will break first!:flipoff2:

Originally posted by FULLSIZE
with all that said, i think you're wallet will break first!:flipoff2:


I was thinking the same thing.

i would personally would not spend that much $$$ on a dana300. get an atlas. just my op.

Originally posted by high5
i would personally would not spend that much $$$ on a dana300. get an atlas. just my op.

Sound advice indeed!

Originally posted by jeeper111
I have heard from the guys at tera that their gears for the 300 are not meant for high rpms and are instead meant for crawling. When you heat them up it ruins the tempering and the teeth get weak.Interesting. I have a buddy on his third tera-low now.

Specs are AMC401/T176/D300/Ford 9 & D44 w/ 3.54s and detroits. Don't know what's going on there (or why he hasn't hurt the T176 instead) but he's on Tera set #3. The last one went when he hadn't unlocked the front hubs, and even though he was in 2-hi it locked up the whole front drivetrain at 40 MPH, killing every shaft, the gears, and bot joints in the D44.

I am wondering how all that stuff is going to fit in your Wrangler?

Are you streching the WB it a little?

I roughly calc it out at about 4 feet from the egine to the tail shaft.

That is alot of stuff:D

Rob

WHEELBASE- WHEELBASE- WHEELBASE!!!!:D

Im going to 107 inches.

i think jeeper111 is going to break... down and cry when he realizes that he will never drive his jeep again :flipoff2:

why the hell do you want all those gearboxes? I bet a NV-4500 and an atlas would serve you just fine, and would be lighter and more compact. If you do run it, it will be kinda funny because even with 107" wheelbase your drivetrain will be so long I bet you still need a CV rear shaft.

Oh yeah I vote for the gears in the tera case too

becasue even with all these gear boxes I still will have spent less than a 4500 and an atlas. I also would never run that setup because every dickless idiot who worships every half assed word that the magazines print is running that setup. I have a 420 and a ranger and I have more speeds and more options, a lower granny gear for over a thousand less. The difference almost covers the price of the klune and when you combine that with the difference in the t-case prices it more than covers the klune v. Also I have the room so why not. I will have 32 foward gears instead of 10 and I also like that better. You should be a little more creative and you will find that there are better options out there than what those :rainbow: magazines, who are only interested in pleasing their advertisers, push on you.

dana 300 with 4 to 1, twin stick, rear disc emer. brake, 32spline input and 32 spline outputs front and rear


So where are you getting this stuff?
I know of everything but the 32 spline input and front output.


Rob

Originally posted by jeeper111
You should be a little more creative and you will find that there are better options out there than what those :rainbow: magazines, who are only interested in pleasing their advertisers, push on you.

LMAO! I can't disagree w/that! In the latest 4WOR they were stroking themselves for building a Currie 9" for $2300, and saying 9"s if properly built can handle well over 1000hp. :rolleyes:

I'm thinkin' POS 9": $2300.... junkyard 14 bolt: $60 (or $19.95 on sale weekends). Hmmm, difficult choice.

Back to the original question. The D-300 with the 4:1 internal gears will break before the rest of your proposed drivetrain will. I've broken my D-300, FIVE times. Never broke it when it was stock, only after the 3 gear then some 5 gear sets. My woes with it seem to be settled now that I have the latest incarnation with better hardening/oiling/ etc. It's lasted a year now, and I only use one t.case and that tinky little 4.4L, I-6, and only 130:1 reduction.
My recommendation is to let the D-300 stay at 2.61:1 stock low gearing and do the Klune with higher numbers. Also, remember the gear reduction for the 2nd t.case in line has a lot more torque multiplication running through it than the first case does, so the D-300 being 2nd in line......
regards, as always, jefe

well the gears Iwill be puttng in it will be the new ones. I dont want to run the klune with the higher numbers because I have heard that they whine on the street and that makes me uneasy. As far as the front output and input. I am getting them from novak. They have made the front input as part of there adapter series for a while now but recently I convinced them to develop a front output kit that was 32 spline. Also the rear ouput shortens the t-case by 2.5 inches I think. Well anyway they say it is as short as a dana 20. The front output will come with a yake, new bearing and seal. It will be in the 160-170 dollar range. Call them if you are interested in them and they will put you on the list for one.

One thing I think that was overlooked was the cast iron bellhousing. I've seen them break on the trails, and you are really,literally screwed. Your z-bar can bind, throwout fork won't move enough to release, on and on. For the 160$ (or so) I highly recommend a quality Lakewood steel bellhousing. I have one on my rig, and being steel it is also handy to add small brackets to.:)

Originally posted by weps
\. Your z-bar can bind, throwout fork won't move enough to release, on and on\

Hmmmm. Every hear of hydraulic master and slave?:rolleyes:

this housing does have a hydrolic slave cylinder. It is not a cable linkage.It came out of a 61 chevy dump truck and according to the guys at novak they are the strongest stock bell housings that you can find.:flipoff2:

no offense but it sounds like you have your head so far up novaks ass, i dont know where they end and you begin!:flipoff2:

I think with a driveline that stout you won't have to worry about breakage.

Build it NOT to break.

I hate all of this talk about "fuses" and "weak links"

You should be able to throw your entire might at that driveline in a 3500# Jeep and wheel without breakage for years.

What I see break most often on "built" rigs are stupid thinkg s that could have been avoided with a 30 minute "pre-flight" inspection in the garage before hitting the trail.

Have fun and Giddy up!!

P.S......I go with the D300 being the 1st to go...;)

The reason I push novak so hard is because I worked with them in getting that 32 spline front output together. When I called them they agreed to go ahead and do it right off the bat. I would like to see you do that with advance. They are way to big to serve individual wheelers needs.Also they are cheaper and in my experience way more knowledgable than the guys at advance. There adapters are also better designed and higher quality from what I have seen. I just figured that other wheelers would like to know about another good place to get stuff, but you can stick it up your ass for all I care.Judging from the number of posts you have, you obviously dont do that much wheeling anyway so who cares what you think.:flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2: You bore me:zzz: and you are :rainbow: FULLSIZE asshole!!!!

FULLSIZE it sounds like you have a compensation problem...You have to get on this board and rag on Actual wheelers...maybe you need to get off your ass and get in some trail action...Novak is a good company so why not use them. It looks like Jeeper111 will have a way better rig than you, so maybe you just have some envy issues!

Lets see:

Crawl ratio: 7*2.7*4*6.7=500:1
(roughly and I think I got the r&p right)

RPM @ 65mph: (0.73*6.7)*65*336/42=2600

Your highway cruising would be great (rpm wise) but who needs a 500:1 crawl ratio? It seems a little silly to me. I'd swap the Dana 300 for a NP205. Save your $$$ and its plenty strong. This would still give you a crawl ratio of ~250:1 which is more than anyone could need. It should save you $$$ because you won't need an adapter too.

I love the 420 to Ranger idea though. What a great way to get a better set up than the NV4500 and be cheeper too. I wish they made one to go between my T18 and AMC V8.

well really man it is not the 500 to one that I am interested in. It is all the options in between that I am interested.I have seen a truck running 200 to one with 35s and I still could see a use for going slower in a tight boulder field. Maybe not 500 but 300 or 350 might be nice. you have to remember that it is a pertcentage gain. You gain the same drop in speed when you go from 40 to 80 as when you go from 200 to 400. they are both twice as slow. Anyway, I just found out that JBconversions and Novak are going to be building a 4 to 1 set that does not have the problems that the tera set does.You can check out the post on the board. I am sure this willbe strong enough for the way I drive seeing as I love to crawl and I really dont use the go pedal unless I have to. As far as the ranger is concerned. I dont know about going to a AMC motor but I am sure that advance makes an adapter bell housing from AMC to chevy pattern and I also am sure that the ranger will fit on a T-18 because they listed that transmission in the liturature that I got with it. When you order one you tell them what tranny you have and they will custom build it for that as long as it is on their list. Here is the list.

NP 435
SM 420
SM 465
T-18

That is all the ones I
could find that they offer them for.

I got it so that I would have a good RPM on the highway with 42s because this is my daily driver:rasta: . Good luck man.

Originally posted by AKJeepGirl
It looks like Jeeper111 will have a way better rig than you, so maybe you just have some envy issues!

I would say if Fullsizes rig can drive over a curb its a better rig at this point.
Right now Jeeper111's rig is just wet dream, anyone can talk about what they wanna build. If he quit typing long enough to start welding maybe we could see some pics.
Ill believe it when I see it.
I agree with Fullsize, it sounds like he is so high on Novack that he is missing out on getting the best T case available just to push some Novak stuff
Well to each his own I guess, but ther is no better T case than an Atlas , even if the off road rags do try to shove it down the throats of every drone willing to open the pages of their fish wrap.
I say quit talking about it, build it, drive it, and tell us how it works.
Time will tell.

Originally posted by wngrog

You should be able to throw your entire might at that driveline in a 3500# Jeep and wheel without breakage for years.



Hahahaha, youve got to be kidding, with that engine tranny and axles, ther is no way that thing will weigh any less than 4500lbs.

Your right though it should be plenty tough to handle the abuse.

Originally posted by jeeper111
well really man it is not the 500 to one that I am interested in. It is all the options in between that I am interested.


I have to agree,
With the HP and torque you will have available with a SBC engine, the extra range will be well apreciated.
The 4:1 range is often to low, I very often start out in 3rd gear with the 4.3 range in the Atlas, that only leaves one more gear to shift up to. I may install a 2.7 Klune in my rig for the same reason of more choices. The 2.7 would be awsome for running the sand dunes, or just general trail cruising.
I cant imagine I would need the 360:1 but the 2 seperate ranges of low range would be very cool.

Next step: Less talk, more fabricating.

FYI Brutus has broken a Rockwell Detroit locker.... :p

I am not saying that the 300 is better or worse than the atlas. For me it is better because I want front hi so that I can have two front lows with the klune and also I would use it to drive around in the snow when I finish school and move back to alaska. So for me, building a 300 is the best choice. I considered a 205 but it did not offer the low ranges that I wanted and since the 4 to 1 klune has problems with whining I dont want to use it on the highway. I think that the atlas is an awsome case and I was planning on running it until I found out that the gear pattern does not include front high. I am sure you could modify it to do it but I just couldn't pull a 2500 dollar case apart and start goofing around in there. The other issue is that I can find spare parts at almost any junk yard anywhere instead of having to get parts strait from advance. I dont want to be sitting on a trail somewhere 15 years from now and blow something in the atlas and then all the sudden realize that they quit making them like the saturn overdrives or something like that.I will always be able to find parts for a 300 and that means something. Plus I can build the whole thing for a litle over a thousand bucks so if I really wanted to I could carry a whole extra t-case with me for the same price as the atlas. Also the 300 is shorter by alot so for me with this long of a drive train that becomes important. Anyway I think that the atlas is a cool case and definitely a good choice, just not for me. And as far as being hung up on Novak, the only reason that I say anything about them is because they have great customer service and are small enough and willing to work on custom stuff for wheelers. I think that everybody will agree that is rare in the offroading world. You hear about tons of different places that are horrible to deal with and I thought that it would be nice to hear about one that wasn't.

Jeeper111

I read your other post about Novaks new 4:1 gears and output shafts. In that light it comes off a lot more sincere about what they are trying to build and test, than to back door it as a "Look what Im gonna run" post, thats been not so subliminaly padded with a bunch of Novak fluff.
I wholeheartedly agree with pushing potentialy good products from innovative companies, willing to try to improve the status qoue.
Hopefully they will build a good product, possibly sponsor a few rigs to brutaly test for them and then make good money selling their product.
I hope they are giving you a good deal as the original guinea pig and spokes person.
Let us know how it performs.

And you can come right out and just say its a Novak post next time:flipoff2: Haha Just fawkin with ya

The other issue is that I can find spare parts at almost any junk yard anywhere instead of having to get parts strait from advance. I dont want to be sitting on a trail somewhere 15 years from now and blow something in the atlas and then all the sudden realize that they quit making them


But most everything in your proposed D 300 is Novak except for the case,so you would have to rely on them for parts also.

yeah I like Novk alot but I like advance too. The ranger I got is bad ass and I cant wait to run down the highway with it. What I really like about it is that if all I am doing is driving around town then I can leave it in 1 to 1 but if all I am doing is driving on the highway.When you pull off to piss you dont have to shift out, just leave it. It sort of gives you 2 gearing ranges, City and highway. wierd thought but cool. Plus it splits all my low gears another time and gives me 32 foward gears with the klune. Probably more than I need but what the hell, I like options.

That is true that it is all novak but the parts are interchangeable with stock parts in case I had to run to a junkyard to find something to get me home. All you would need is some conversion joints for the drive shafts and swap in the input and I could limp home on a otherwise stock t-case. You cant do that with an atlas no matter how good it is.

Also Iknow why Brutus blew a detroit in a rockwell. Those tires are a little over 300 pounds and the wheels aren't lite either. He probably has about 350 pounds of stuff spinning on the ends of those shafts and I dont even want to think of the leverage the edge of the tire has being 24" from the center line. Those tires are big but in my opinion they are not practical.

How the hell to you balance something like that?

jeeper111 no offense but what i think your gonna end up having is a 6000 pound expensive pile of shit, i can see it now u wating at the bottom of the hill trying to decided which of ur 1 million gears u want to run, and damn man u say u need 4 wheel high for the snowy road, and u dont want a klune cause it whines, trust me u wont need rearsteer and all that shit if u plan on driving this thing on the road, use the 420 the ranger and the atlas and be done:rolleyes: post pics of all this stuff to ide like to see it:rolleyes:

I will be sitting at just about 4300 pounds with all my tools loaded and I dont think that is unreasonable and who cares how long I sit at the bottom as long as I get to the top when I want to. I agree it will take some getting used to with all the different ratios but anyway you look at it I want the 2.72 for fast running in the dunes and I want the 4 to 1 for crawling and that is really the best setup for having both those ratios. I have the room and adding the klune only adds 30 more pounds or so. Well worth it if you ask me. I think you have all been brain washed into getting these atlas t-cases and that is fine because it is not my money you are spending. If you like that t-case so much than go get one for yourself and sell your 300 to someone else who doesnt want to get raped. I said it was a good t-case but not for me. It doesnt have what I want so I am not going to get it. The Atlas weighs 130 pounds and I cant see the 300 weighing anymore than that. So the only proposed change you say I make is a 30 or so pound klune V. How is that going to make my jeep go from 6000 pounds to 4000. I dont get it.

good luck getting a jeep on rockwells to weigh 4200 pounds with a 350 and all those crawler boxes my friend has on with rockwells a 350 a turbo 350 a 203/300 doubler, 44s an he wieghs 6000 so best of luck i think ur smoking:smokin:

Jeeper111 whatever works in your mind is cool. Have fun building it. If you take sh!t here just deal with it like you have.

But you shouldn't have to go get a girl to help defend you :laughing: :laughing:

FULLSIZE it sounds like you have a compensation problem...You have to get on this board and rag on Actual wheelers...maybe you need to get off your ass and get in some trail action...Novak is a good company so why not use them. It looks like Jeeper111 will have a way better rig than you, so maybe you just have some envy issues!

Both of you from Waco? Looks like a tag team on FULLSIZE:eek:

:D

hey thats my sister and she did that on her own man. She is on here all the time and threw that up. cant blame her for trying to help her big bro out but yes I can defend myself. I dont know where you guys are getting 6000 pounds but elf cruiser went and weighed his cruiser which start off heavier than jeeps. He has the strait six which is as heavy as a small block from what I have been told, a 465 to 8 inch long cast adapter to a 205 with 1410 shafts to rockwells front and rear with steel wheels and boggers, and his truck still only weighed in at 4500. You can ask him yourself. I dont see why two aluminum housed crawler boxes should add that much wieght. that 205 weighs alot more than this 300. believe me I helped with putting it in. Also that klune and ranger are pretty light. I can pick the ranger up without any real effort, even laying on my back in the parking lot stabbing it is easy as hell. I cant see the klune and the ranger together taking up more than about 80 pounds at the most. Also that cruiser body wieghs alot more than a wrangler body and especially one like mine with no fenders in the front and the back cut strait out.

Besides iam not really that worried about wieght. Eventually when it comes time for a new paint job I will go to a fiberglass hood and probably a kevlar body tub. Also when I rebuild my motor in about 70 thousand miles or when I get the urge to, I will change to an aluminum intake and heads and that will drop alot of weight right there. I know that my friend dropped 70 pounds by changing his manifold on his 401, and the heads are even a bigger drop than that. I will have this truck for the rest of my life so if I have to whyeel with it at 4500 pounds for a while then so be it. I am not worried about it. Most of the time weight helps anyway. Itis just in those extreme vertical situations that it doesnt do you any good.

hey thats my sister

pics:question:

:D

I bet you would like pics. Shes got a TJ with a long arm and 38s and this summer I am going to hrow in a 700R4 and my old 231 with 4 to 1, 2lo, and HD mainshaft.

All you assholes better stay away from my baby sister now. I tend to get protective and Iown guns. hAHAHAHAHA!:flipoff2: :nuke:

I tend to get protective and Iown guns

I own guns too. In fact I was born with mine. They are roughly 20" around and I bet she'd like them:p

:D

Did I just hear someone loading shells.... ;)

Hey this is AKJeepGirl and my account isn't working right now but I just wanted to say hey what's up to bigdude!!! do you have any pics???:D J/K anyways you guys can't blame me for sticking up for my big brother !!! He is also my installer of parts so I have to stick up for him!

OK good it is working again!

Originally posted by jeeper111
I will be sitting at just about 4300 pounds with all my tools loaded

Not a chance of hitting that weight with a stock frame and tub, and Rockwells.

I have shaved every extra ounce of weight off of my rig and I have 500lb less than you in axles alone. I am barely at 4000lbs now. Your tires will be another 200 lbs over my 38.50's, your engine weighs a good 125 lb more.
Ive pulled out the heater core, the floors, half the body has been tubed framed, no radio, no console, etc... just to get to 4000lbs

I say build it and weigh it.
And anyone who says they arent concerned with weight, well they arent going steep enough or they will be concerned soon enough,..... gravity is relentless.

But then again we always get into these little debates when its all talk. :flipoff2:

thats what im trying to tell him h8,my comp jeep is stripped and im at around 4 so theres not a chance in hell hes gonna hit 4300 :rolleyes: , and if your not concerned about weight why are u concerened about rearsteer and klunes:rolleyes: i think u need to sit back and think what u really NEED, for example why with only 42s... why are u gonna attach those boatanchor rockwells to your rig

quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by high5
i would personally would not spend that much $$$ on a dana300. get an atlas. just my op.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by H8monday


Sound advice indeed!



I did spend all that money on a 300 and it :nuke: :nuke: on me, now the Atlas is on it's way over. By building the 300, I thought I was saving money too. And your going to be multiplying the torque going into it with the crawl boxes? My educated guess would be the 300 will go frist.

I am just telling you what I know. I know for sure that I will not break 5000. 4300 might be a little low but not that low. besides I guarantee that the drive train setup that I am going with does not weigh any more than a 4500 to a 205. I am positive of it so how bad could it be to run all that stuff. And if I only have to swallow another 250 pounds for the strength of rockwells then it is worth it to me. Like I said before I will drop weight down the road in stuff that is not vital but I dont worry about it so much when I am thinking of drivetrain. I dont have a back seat or a stereo or a console or that is not totally necessary anyways.

i know novak makes some good shit, i'm gonna buy there 32 spline rear output. just givin ya some shit ya puss!:flipoff2: and who the hell are you to tell me to go get some trail action? bring it!!! i wheel on hard stuff at least once a week(sometimes twice if i dont break) so kiss my white ass! but then what do you know.......................:rolleyes:

you still bore me:zzz: but :beer: to you if you actually get to go wheeling that often. :flipoff:

Hey Jeeper111, you sure talk a lot of smack, for someone who hasnt shown that he has ever even gone off road.

I dont know how to tell you this, but talking about building an overbuilt rig does not make you an extreme wheeler, nor does having a sister with a TJ and 36" tires.

How about a little less yappin and lets see some pics of you actually wheeling, or even actually fabricating.:flipoff2:

The "Im so tuff", blow hard crap, only plays so long without a little proof that you have ever even gone off road.:rolleyes:

Originally posted by bigdude


I own guns too. In fact I was born with mine. They are roughly 20" around



I felt the wrath of those guns, he was pushing me across a parking lot on a snap on chair, and threw me to the ground. Causing a serious injury to my beer. that son of a bitch. :flipoff2:


ps how's the acid plant?

:zzz: rockwells:zzz: 32 spline everything:zzz: 44" tires :zzz: blah,blah,blah:flipoff2:

Just bought the little star so pics are on the way of me wheeling. Also pics of my new setup coming together. I love the fact that this has gone from what will break to I dont wheel and shit but whatever.:flipoff2:

he was pushing me across a parking lot on a snap on chair, and threw me to the ground. Causing a serious injury to my beer. that son of a bitch.

Fond memories:D (I still feel bad about that too). And the acid plant sucks, thanks for bringing it up..... hmmm...... maybe I don't feel so bad after all;)

Hey this is AKJeepGirl and my account isn't working right now but I just wanted to say hey what's up to bigdude!!! do you have any pics???

AKJeepGirl I'll pm you some pics so that 111 doesn't know (oops guess he does now) Sounds like little sis might be grown enough to get out of your reach there 111:p I talked to someone who knows you two and now lives in the Tampa area, he said you're a bonafied hottie AKJeepGirl. You better watch out 111 I feel a road trip coming on;)

Just curious what you're getting from Novak for all of the promotion you're doing for a product that has not been released.
I'd still go with the Atlas case for simplicity. I just don't see how having many tcases stacked together will be more reliable than having 1 tcase. Atlas tcase are expensive, but then, so will the D300 be when you finish building with 32 spline outputs and 4:1 gears.

I'm going with a SM420 and D300 with 32 spline upgraded output.

7.05 x 2.61 x 4.88 = 89.79:1 crawl ratio. I think this will be just fine for me. I just don't see the need for 300:1 crawl ratio and 30 different forward gears.

My 2 pesos.

Charles

well I am not getting anything other than the fact that the more people call them the less the kit is going to cost and the faster I will get it.

Hey bigdude, I dont think you can afford this girl man. She requires a guy who can afford all the most expensive jewelry and the most expensive parts. Not an easy thing to do. :p

Hey bigdude!! sounds good too me...I am always down for some good action...on the trail I mean!!! hehe:rolleyes: My bro might be right though it is hard to please a girl who has expensive hobbies!!

My bro might be right though it is hard to please a girl who has expensive hobbies!!

:D

Just an FYI- Chemical Engineers don't work for peanuts;) (so maybe you shouldn't rule me out just yet:p )

Originally posted by H8monday


I have shaved every extra ounce of weight off of my rig and I have 500lb less than you in axles alone. I am barely at 4000lbs now. ...Ive pulled out the heater core, the floors, half the body has been tubed framed, no radio, no console, etc... just to get to 4000lbs...

:flipoff2:


HE HE HE! My heavy cruiser is 3550lbs with gas, tools, and gear-wheeling. You just keep slapping on more weight all the while trying to lose it!!!!!!!!!:D :rasta:

Originally posted by Aggro



HE HE HE! My heavy cruiser is 3550lbs with gas, tools, and gear-wheeling. You just keep slapping on more weight all the while trying to lose it!!!!!!!!!:D :rasta:

Well I have the disadvantage that I use i t for a second vehicle. Its my girlfriends daily driver, I also have to keep it so that I can install a rear seat when my daughters are wheeling with me.
I still dont know how you can get your cruiser down to 3500, when the Jackyl wieghs in at 3400.
Every person I have ever talked to about weight, has had his rig gain 500 lbs when we had the 4 corner scales on hand.
Still Ill take you on your word about the weight, I just dont know how you do it.

Mine is also daily driveable, with the exception of a little death wobble!! All I know is it is a certified scale. I will also gain 50 lbs when I put in my back seat too. I built my entire rig from a stripped frame up with the intent to be light. You've got to do it every step of the way. I think lance's rig is lighter than mine- but then there's not much to it. The jackyl is big and has lots of tube.

Originally posted by H8monday
Hey Jeeper111, you sure talk a lot of smack, for someone who hasnt shown that he has ever even gone off road.

How about a little less yappin and lets see some pics of you actually wheeling, or even actually fabricating.

The "Im so tuff", blow hard crap, only plays so long without a little proof that you have ever even gone off road.:rolleyes:

Originally posted by jeeper111
Just bought the little star so pics are on the way of me wheeling. Also pics of my new setup coming together. I love the fact that this has gone from what will break to I dont wheel but whatever.

I'd just like to join the flame war!!! :)

So...where are the pics??

Just to show I'm not that much of a newbie...here's me at EJS this year. Crossing the Golden Crack!!!

Yah, you all'd probably call it a stocker...but I get it out there!
http://www.fundamentallydriven.com/webmaster/images/Jeep.2002-03-27.34.JPG

Just in case you didn't notice...it doesn't take a star to post a picture ;)

Originally posted by jeeper111
Judging from the number of posts you have, you obviously dont do that much wheeling anyway so who cares what you think.:flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2: You bore me:zzz: and you are :rainbow: FULLSIZE asshole!!!!

Allright lets get this fuckin straightened out quickly and finaly.

Jeeper111, you are the one that started getting your fuckin panties in wad and turned it into a mini flame war.
I know what guys like Fullsize are doing with there rigs, and Im impressed.
I dont have any idea what you do with your rig, or if you even have a rig, but so far Im not impressed by anything that you have said or shown that you can do, other than shop around on the phone for potential parts. I usually have my girlfriend do that part so you may be a super wiz on the phone but who cares.
I could also give a rats ass what you are dreaming of building or how light or heavy or how many gears you want it to have.

Build the fuckin thing if your really gonna, and show us what it looks like, drive it on the trail and tell us how it works, these stupid dream projects always turn out hurting the dreamers feelings because those of us who have to turn a wrench and weld some steel to go wheeling get tired of listening to wanna be's, talk about "someday, im Gonna......."

Build the fawkin thing already!:flipoff:

those of us who have to turn a wrench and weld some steel to go wheeling get tired of listening to wanna be's, talk about "someday, im Gonna......."

Well said.

SMACK! SMACK!

Originally posted by Jeep_Jam






Just to show I'm not that much of a newbie...here's me at EJS this year. Crossing the Golden Crack!!!

Yah, you all'd probably call it a stocker...but I get it out there!
<img src="http://www.fundamentallydriven.com/webmaster/images/Jeep.2002-03-27.34.JPG" width=50% height=50%>


Is everyone going to let this go?? this must be what a newbie gettin' it looks like :shaking:, I have always wondered...

um, broken windshield? looks like he rolled it to me:p :beer:

um, broken windshield? looks like he rolled it to me

I saw that too along with the hood and fender dents. Unless those are from shopping carts I'd say he gives it hell with what he's got :beer:

I rolled my f-in metro so what.

:flipoff2: :flipoff2: welcome stocker newby!!:flipoff2:

This post is getting to the point of being ridiculous, no one is giving any helpful suggestions so why don't you boys lower the testosterone level just a tad and stop your bitchin'

are you bitchin about us having too high of a testosterone level? :p

Originally posted by FULLSIZE
um, broken windshield? looks like he rolled it to me:p :beer:

:D is that all it takes? our standards are dropping :rolleyes: :flipoff2:

No I like men with testosterone, I am just saying that it has clouded the issue on this post and turned it into a bitch fest!

turned it into a bitch fest!

huh, I don't see a lot of girls posting on here :D

*running for cover*

i wouldn't have gone their!! it was nice to know you............:flipoff2:

HAHA funny!!not! you should run for cover!!! :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

point well taken H8monday. This has gone from a tech post to a bunch of usless arguing and just to show you that this isnt a dream vehicle I will be posting pics in the next couple of days of the new motor ranger and tranny in and to show you where I am now and see if you have any suggestions on anything you like. I am sure there will be plenty but I am open to anything. Hows that for a good attitude? As far as chemical engineers go I dont know what they make but I still think your treading on thin Ice. It may mean no more toys for your truck. :flipoff2:

I still think your treading on thin Ice. It may mean no more toys for your truck.

My sh!ts done for a long time. I just did everything in my sig over the past 2.5 months:)

Originally posted by bigdude


My sh!ts done for a long time.


Hahahahahah,......hahahahahaha,..famouse last words!

Originally posted by jeeper111
I will be posting pics in the next couple of days of the new motor ranger and tranny in and to show you where I am now and see if you have any suggestions on anything you like. I am sure there will be plenty


I look forward too seeing it, Im sure youll get plenty of input on your direction and progress.

I have a question for all you 1 ton guys. what is the minimum drive shaft joint you would put in a front axle? what is equivenlant to a D60 axle joint?

I know CTM is coming out with 1310 replacements, but are spicer 1310's too small for a 1 ton set up?

i would call a spicer 1310 the FUSE in a 1 ton drivetrain.:D

Originally posted by mudlite
I have a question for all you 1 ton guys. what is the minimum drive shaft joint you would put in a front axle? what is equivenlant to a D60 axle joint?

I know CTM is coming out with 1310 replacements, but are spicer 1310's too small for a 1 ton set up?


It depends, what gears and tires are you runnin?
If you are running 5.38 gears and 37" MTRs the front shaft really isnt a lot of load at the drive shafts. Now if your running 4.10 gears and 39" Boggers, you are gonna wreck a lot of 1310 joints.
In any case the 1310 would seem a bit scrawney considering your running 1 ton axles. I would say 1350 joints would hold up fine under nearly any condition.
Of course if Jesse comes along and says anything, contradictory to what Im saying, I would go with his recomendations, he does after all know a thing or two about drivelines.

The CTMs have still not been tested, so I wouldnt count on them yet. Jack wont let them go out for sale untill he knows he has a good product.

the u-joints in the 60 are 1480s but I dont think you would want to run that in the driveshaft. I would instead run 1350s or 1410s but the 1410s might be overkill.

Originally posted by Aggro
I rolled my f-in metro so what.

:flipoff2: :flipoff2: welcome stocker newby!!:flipoff2:

Thanks for the welcome!!

You're all right. 3/4 roll about an hour before the Golden Crack. The fender was bent before, the hood and windshield were from the roll. Got it righted, cleared the hydro-lock and drove up the obstacle that I rolled on (dumb driver error the first time).

I'm a newbie (been wheelin since September '01), I wheel, I break stuff and I fix/upgrade it myself. It's Jeepin' & it's fun!!!

The funny thing is, before I bought this thing (the most life changing purchase ever), I would have had problems changing my oil. I replaced the transmission with some help from friends back in Dec., lifted it in Jan. and I'm working on a transmission t-case swap. I've got the NP435 and I'll order the other parts once I've got some of my questions figured out (not a lot of people keep the 2.5 ;) ).

But...till it's in it's still a dream, right?!?!:rolleyes:

It cracks me up to hear people's opinions of my Jeep. Here in the midwest my 33's are monstorous. I get all kinds of google eyes when I drive it to work. I knew that the folks on this board would think it was a stocker. It's all relative. That's all right, it gets me there...when the t-case isn't leaking. :eek:

gotta love those 231s, more holes to leak out of than spunge. You can put them together without leaking though. it just takes patience.

Bigdude if your sh*t is done, props to you my version of done changes every day so somehow I see no done in sight...I get new tires and overnight they somehow shrink ect... Hey it's cool your from brandon I used to live around there.

Mine's leaking because an abused tail shaft. My drive shaft is still stock with 3.5" lift springs. Too much leverage on the slip yoke. I'm not putting any more money into this 1/4 ton drivetrain. The cost for the NP435 & D20 will be less than my 231 rebuild (not to mention replacing the ax5). Yes, I'll have to fork out some dough for adapters and/or custom machining, but putting a 3/4-1/2 ton combo behind a 4cyl I should never have to worry about them again.

yeah but what about when you go to V8 and dont say that you wont go to a V8. I ran a 4 cylinder for 5 years always avoiding the motor swap. I ran 40s on my 4 cylinder with 5.89s and I even tried to supercharge it. Finally when the supercharger killed it I decided it was finally time to bite the bullet and give in. I took alot of ribbing from my buddies over my years of saying that all you need is a 4 cylinder. And when I finally did swap I probably should have just done the six to save weight and it would have been enough power probably but I had so much lost time and irritation with that damn 4 cylinder that I needed the extra power of the v8 to calm my irritation. besides, since then I have decided to go to 42s and I will probabluy need the power anyway, even with 6.72 gears. :D :eek:

Yah, so some day I want to go V8...I pull the 4 and the transmission, swap inputshafts on the transmission, get a Ford bellhousing and bolt the 435 directly to the HO 302. It's a 3/4 ton transmission...I think I'll be okay.

If I decide that the wiring for a V8 isn't worth it...I stroke a 4.0 and modify my adapter to work with the ax15 bellhousing...it's still a 3/4 ton transmission and I'll probably still be okay!! ;)

For now, I'd like to stay okay with my 4cyl *sheesh* I'm not made out of money and I own a Jeep....so I probably never will be. You're bumming me out with the supercharger news. I was kinda hoping I could keep the 4 cyl forever and supercharge it. Just to be a little different and to laugh at the naysayers.

<from right after I rolled> Hey...someone stole 2/3's of your engine, Dude!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! never supercharge that piece of shit. I workedon mine for 3 months to get it to run right and it never did. finally it killed my motor and when I took it off I really couldn't feel a difference. the only difference was that it died all the time.

Bigdude if your sh*t is done, props to you

Well I just took it out on the interstate and around town. Nothing fell off and I only heard a few squeaks, so get those props ready.........

Because my sh!t is done:D (at least for a year, 1 tons are expensive)

I thought you chemical engineers didn't work for peanuts...your rig is always worth the money!!! But it is cool I wish I could do my axle swaps sooner!:angel: :bounce2: :bounce: :bounce2: :emb3: