I just finished my New and improved High steer for the 5th time :rolleyes: This time it is built with 3/4" chrome moly heims, Grade 8 bolts and 1.5 x.250" DOM. My main concern is the stacked heims on the pass side, what do you think, I made a double shear point.

Opinions, Concerns, Flaming ? :D

Thanks

http://www.tpijeep.com/P1010258.JPG

http://www.tpijeep.com/P1010259.JPG

http://www.tpijeep.com/P1010270.JPG

I saw a TJ in Moab last week with his rear links connected to the frame with one 5/8" grade 8 bolt. One side sheared and the other was about to let go. I'd carry spare bolts and stay off the streets. That's a lot of leverage for one bolt.

Looks good,

The double sheer should work fine and a 3/4 bolt will never sheer off on a steer system.

But, that tack is'nt going to last long, I would just take the extra time and weld the bungs all the way around.
( that was a joke, but I'm sure someone is realy thinking that)

ericfilar@fatcity

if it were mine i would reduce the size(height) of the spacer down to a min.(the least you could go so the tie rods barely clear). this would reduce the leverage on the bolt. otherwise looks:smokin: .

Nice.
Like the diff cover :D

Originally posted by larryboy
if it were mine i would reduce the size(height) of the spacer down to a min.(the least you could go so the tie rods barely clear). this would reduce the leverage on the bolt. otherwise looks:smokin: .

Well, I ordered a 5/8" and 3/4" spacer from Avalanche and somehow got shipped 2- 3/4" :rolleyes: So now I need to figure out how to fit my extra 3/4" in my chopsaw and trim it down.... :D

why not just ditch the heims and run ball joints...or make a heim mount drilled into the tierod? no more worries.

(this will require cutting the draglink...no biggie) then just either run the ball joint through the normal hole designed for it...or if you are useing the heims just drill through....and truss it to hell...then bolt 'er on. Should run fine....if the links are on top of each other as they appear to be you should correct the steering box location to make the draglink cleanly in front of the tierod.

What kind of tape is holding your tie rod together? I need some of that. :flipoff2: :D

You asked for opinions, right?

In my opinion, it's pretty bad.

that draglink isn't loaded in any kind of shear, it's loaded in bending, and that is BAD NEWS. Especially so when that same one bolt holds both joints.

Not to mention that the little bracket that supposedly creates your double shear looks barely adequate to me.

In other words, I don;t like it one bit.

Do a search on my name and Hi-steer and see the pasting i took for a similar (but worse) design I once made - many of the criticisms applt to yours too.

You could also check out my steering article for some more info:

http://billavista.tripod.com/Steering/Index/SteeringIndex.html

Originally posted by BillaVista
You asked for opinions, right?

In my opinion, it's pretty bad.

that draglink isn't loaded in any kind of shear, it's loaded in bending, and that is BAD NEWS. Especially so when that same one bolt holds both joints.

Not to mention that the little bracket that supposedly creates your double shear looks barely adequate to me.

In other words, I don;t like it one bit.

Do a search on my name and Hi-steer and see the pasting i took for a similar (but worse) design I once made - many of the criticisms applt to yours too.

You could also check out my steering article for some more info:

http://billavista.tripod.com/Steering/Index/SteeringIndex.html

Okay, release my nuts now, you have my attention.. :D

I looked at your design and I had the very thing but could not mount the TRE below the arm for spring clearance issues, and could not get them close enough together on top to allow me a good turning radius.

After checking out a company that makes the same thing I did without the bracket I figured I would do it and add a bracket for added strength.

Since your design is not an option, been there didn't work, what would you do to make my setup safer?

What about beefing the bracket like the picture below. Heck I thought I hit a homerun with this design :rolleyes: and like it sits now I have full Bumpstop to Bumpstop steering, and since the ram assist it going on tomorrow I figured I would be more than okay...

You got me on the critique, now give me options.. :D

Thanks

Hey TPI,

Looking good man! Don't let BillaVista get to you too much :P

He's correct in theory but from my experiences your setup looks like it should do just fine. There certainly are worse steering setups running around the country, lol.

But, everything can be improved. If I were in your position I would get rid of that tall spacer and use the shortest one that gives the heim full travel. Then, just build your bracket up and mount the top of the bolt in double shear as well. I think an easy way to do this would be to add a back to that bracket. Looking from the front it would be on the left hand side, just straight up and then make it wide enough so that you can add a triangle behind the heim joints to give it strength, if you can add one in front that'd be great too. Then just have a tab come off to mount that upper heim in double shear.

However, if you were gonna start from scratch I would eliminate that middle bracket and stack the heims on top of each other, then build a bracket to mount the top in double shear, that would be the most ideal.

CJ

Originally posted by CJ Lagos
Hey TPI,

However, if you were gonna start from scratch I would eliminate that middle bracket and stack the heims on top of each other, then build a bracket to mount the top in double shear, that would be the most ideal.

CJ

That is doable, I still need the spacer for clearance between the rods but I can build something to go to the top of the bolt...

Thanks

Id also shorten the drag link, and attach it to the tie rod. As it is now, all your steering force is on the top of that bolt, which is really only getting any support from the arm itself. A true double shear would work also

Originally posted by JEEPRZ
Id also shorten the drag link, and attach it to the tie rod. As it is now, all your steering force is on the top of that bolt, which is really only getting any support from the arm itself. A true double shear would work also

This is what I did, shorter drag link, and mounted to the tie rod with the end of an old pitman arm.

-J

TPI, i think that the top of that bolt will break off, but not from steering force, from flex. You need to get the high-mialignment spacers that shank down to a 5/8" bolt. You will easily max out those heims with your current setup, and that bolt will be the single point holding your vehicle's weight. So if you are flexed out, and turn at the same time, POP!

sorry, dude but i think you are gonna have to make that bracketry all over again, and fill in the arm and redrill it...

Why not take the drag link's heim and turn it 90 degrees and make a bracket on the tierod or the steering arm to mount it on? No binding from suspension flex, easilly constructed double-shear, makes it simpler to do a better double-shear for the tierod...

It would be easy on the tierod, just weld 2 tabs on vertically. To do it on the steering arm would be more of a trick, but that's the better way IMHO.

Squash

what kind of spacers are those under the front springs?:confused:

Originally posted by Realsquash
Why not take the drag link's heim and turn it 90 degrees and make a bracket on the tierod or the steering arm to mount it on? No binding from suspension flex, easilly constructed double-shear, makes it simpler to do a better double-shear for the tierod...

It would be easy on the tierod, just weld 2 tabs on vertically. To do it on the steering arm would be more of a trick, but that's the better way IMHO.

Squash

Installing the drag link heim turned 90 degrees on the steering arm might not be the best idea. If there isn't enough rotation in the heim to accomodate the suspension flex, there also might not be enough to allow for the steering to pivot back and forth.

Originally posted by Jekyll


Installing the drag link heim turned 90 degrees on the steering arm might not be the best idea. If there isn't enough rotation in the heim to accomodate the suspension flex, there also might not be enough to allow for the steering to pivot back and forth.

Oh yeah duh, good point :) It sounded good for a little while :zzz:

Squash

I have the same question as Fullsize. What is up with the spacers under the front springs? That just looks like an accident waiting to happen.
Also, it looks like you could remove that bracket that you welded to you arm, drill another hole in front of it, and mount one of your steering links there. That is how my friend setup his high steer. But, if you remove those spacers in the front, you might not have these clearance problems in the first place. Just my handful of change.:eek:

Originally posted by FULLSIZE
what kind of spacers are those under the front springs?:confused:

They're probably wedges to get proper pinion angle, you can only see the fat side from that angle;)

"Why not take the drag link's heim and turn it 90 degrees and
make a bracket on the tierod or the steering arm to mount it on? No binding from suspension flex, easilly constructed double-shear, makes it simpler to do a better double-shear for the tierod...

It would be easy on the tierod, just weld 2 tabs on vertically"



This is a bad idea if you do it with Heims. They do have enough travel to let the steering go all the way but you build in about an 1/8 turn of play in the steering as the tie rod pivots on the draglink heim. Think about it for a second and it makes sense. It works good if you use a tre on the end of the draglink though!

Originally posted by Blair
This is a bad idea if you do it with Heims. They do have enough travel to let the steering go all the way but you build in about an 1/8 turn of play in the steering as the tie rod pivots on the draglink heim. Think about it for a second and it makes sense. It works good if you use a tre on the end of the draglink though!

Read on you fawking newbie :flipoff2:

Squash

Yeah squash I did catch the part where you said to mount it on the steering arm as well which is a good idea. You'll notice I did not attack your good idea! I just mentioned that the first part of your idea is bad. So :flipoff2: too.

BTW the only reason I know that this is a bad idea is cause I had it on my truck. Later

Originally posted by Mustard Dog


They're probably wedges to get proper pinion angle, you can only see the fat side from that angle;)

We have a winner, 8 degree shims that allowed me to rotate the pinion up a bit for a better driveline angle..

All your suggestions are not falling on deaf ears trust me. Looks like the safest and easiest change I can make is to weld a tab on the tie rod and connect the drag link to that...

Thanks everybody... :D

Correct me if I am wrong, but from what I can see, there are two thick wedges on the passenger side, and this a piece of 2"x2" box with a thick wedge on the drivers side. I imagine that the 2x2 box is what you made your spring perch out of. But on the passenger side, there is the housing then the two thick pieces. If these are both wedges, why do you need that much adjustment? Just curious. It seems like that will be problematic area.

Originally posted by Blair
Yeah squash I did catch the part where you said to mount it on the steering arm as well which is a good idea. You'll notice I did not attack your good idea! I just mentioned that the first part of your idea is bad. So :flipoff2: too.

BTW the only reason I know that this is a bad idea is cause I had it on my truck. Later

Good comeback , you passed the test :) It's all in good fun, most newbies take it too personally.

Squash

Well I actually laid down with my teddy bear collection and cried for about an hour before I got up the nerve to post back. :D Later!

Originally posted by ouibus
Correct me if I am wrong, but from what I can see, there are two thick wedges on the passenger side, and this a piece of 2"x2" box with a thick wedge on the drivers side.

Okay your corrected, your wrong.. :flipoff2: One is the 8 degree Steel shim the other is the housing. :p

CJ posted good ideas (which I admit grudgingly...we got history me and him....specially when someoen says "double shhhhhh!" :p )

:D

Honestly, after all the evolutions I went through - I wish I had just joined draglink to tie rod in the first place making an inverted T......otherwise it's a helluva lot of work to make it all fit right.

I work out at Sears Point (the race track)and this fabricator out there always checks out the stuff we build. Your design isn't bad but the problem is with that bolt on top. You need some sort of support, i.e. bracket that goes from the head of the bolt down to the steering arm. They use similar setups to 4x4 crossover on race cars all the time but you will never see one that isn't supported on the top.

Okay TPI, I stand corrected. It just looked like the housing was another wedge stuck in there. Did you look to see if you just can't drill another hole in the arm to mount the other steering link? I think that this would be the strongest way to do it. It looks like you would have room to do this, but I could be wrong. If that is not possible, I would do what you said and build a mount off of the tie rod for the draglink.

I dunno. I did mine with heims and with the tab on the tierod like Squash mentioned. It handles on the road really well. I only have a slight pull to the right I need to work out. Otherwise, it handles without problem and without built in play in the wheel.

OMG...dont even attempt to drive that, it will fall apart before you reach the end of ur driveway ! ?
:eek:

On the other hand it may work just fine for the next 50 yrs ? what do I know ? I,m just a flunkie:flipoff2:

The sugestion of placing a bracket on the tierod and placing the hiem in the vertical plane , is a good idea !;)


All in all ya did a bang up job !:) :flipoff2:


:jeep: __(OIIIIIIIO)__rOkOn:usa:

You have to ask yourself why have you done it 5 times already and what are you going to try for #7.:flipoff2:

I had similar problems with both links need ing to be in the same place. Why not use some of the arms that put the tie rod behind the axle and eliminate the stacking mumbo completely.