Okay...Here's the rear links starting to take shape...Burned them in today...Got a nice coat of primer on them....Here's some shots of the tacked up version prior to the burn in...

More of the same...

Again...

This is all I could get out of the jack(s)...No binding what so ever....It's got a lot more in it...Time to start getting ready for the limiting strap mounts!

All's a-okay...Time for some pretty welds!

The carnage pile growith!

O'yea...Here's some pic's of the bed starting to take shape...Lot's more work and a good coat of paint and she'll be ready to go on...Right after I spring the rear...

Awe heck...Here's some more...SOMEBODY has to use this site!

Upper links...:zzz: :zzz: :zzz:

Looks great Doug! Thanks for sharing the photos. Looks like some good penetration on the welds.

Way

Lookin' awesome!

That thing is gonna be badass!

-Jon

Doug,

Please oh please tell me that drivers side jack stand is NOT floating unsupported the way that it looks in the pics! AAAAAHHHHH!

I *think* that it must be supported, because you haven't said that the truck has fallen off of it, AND because I know you're not a dumbass to overlook something like that. It just *LOOKS* like it's going to tip at any second! :eek: :eek: :eek:

The rear links are actually very nice (haha, WTF do I know???), and I am intrigued how they will perform. Look pretty sound to me (again, WTF????).

I like the rear frame treatment, and the bed looks like it'll do nicely with a couple a coats a camaro grey primer on it.

Hey, are you using your front and/or rear fender flares? I want to run NO fender flares on the 145, but there is that 2 inch gap between the fender and the inner wheel well.

Looks good.

I especially like the artful play you have going with the interaction of shadow and highlight in your photographs. Nice composition, good focus, good exposure. I can really SEE that you're working the subject.

:flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

J/K

Kickin' some ass down there pahdnah! Keep it up!

I got my drivelines for the 145 this week. Painted them up and put the front one in last night. The rear one is nearly 6 feet long and 4 inches in diameter. I'm goin to paint it like a barber pole. No joke! :vader2:

It's a couple days late, but.... 'May the 4th.....be with you'.

Later,

Michael

Hee, hee, hee! I was wondering when/if someone would notice those jack-stands! Actually there is very LITTLE weight on the rear jack stands...I can lift the rear up (off the rear x-member) with one hand easily. The front stands are as far forward on the frame as I can get them, and guess what? That's very near the balance point of the vehicle as she sit's now with no bed, tank, light-weight frame rails etc. SOooooo when I jacked the axle up, and it started swinging in it's arc, it was lifting/shifting the truck on the front jack-stands...Which btw, are very solid....Believe me...I was inching the axle up and down in those shots....Then right before I was lowering the fin' D70 slipped off one of the floor jacks and 'cablamo!" it fell to the dirt! Nothing happend, but I was certain I was gonna see my rig sitting flat on it's frame-rails at that very moment. Even the tac-welds held, and the 70 is a big mo-fo.

I'm gonna' put a couple of gussets on the upper JJ mount tabs...Probably doesn't need them, but what's a couple of pieces of steel in the long run...?

Get some pics of that bus your building! Inquiring minds want to know!!!

--D

Nice work! Man, that JB weld sure looks like it is the way to go! :flipoff2: just kiddin'

You have plans for the old rear crossmember? If not it would look great sitting in my shed while I ammass the rest of the parts I need.

-Jeff

easy, breezy, beautiful, sawzall

diggin the bed.

And am I the only one who finds the rounded top of a D70 pumpkin irrestitable?

Ron

PS you have some nice stuff in your junk pile.

Originally posted by evilfij
And am I the only one who finds the rounded top of a D70 pumpkin irrestitable?

Rounded on the bottom too! It's like the thing is turned inside-out or something. Very *slickery*.

I'd be whilling to part with the old x-member btw...PM me if interested.

--D

D-

Progress looks good! I especially like the magnetic angle finder hangin' from the driveshaft!

Have you worked out shock bracketry for the rear yet?

Johnathan

Originally posted by Jtisdale
D-

Progress looks good! I especially like the magnetic angle finder hangin' from the driveshaft!

Have you worked out shock bracketry for the rear yet?

Johnathan

So THAT'S were that damn angle finder is! Thanks man! :smokin:

Yea the rear shock hoops and axle mounting location is cake. I'm doin' a simple 90deg bend in a section of 1.75 x .120 tubing....Mounting it on top of the frame with a 10deg cant towards the outside of the frame-rails...I don't want too much angle inwards (towards the CL of the rig) of the shocks...A'la increased stability...I'll do a simple bolt-on/off x-member tying the two shock-hoops together and maybe a brace or two from the main shock-hoop to the frame (lateral reinforcement). I'll mount the shocks as far towards the axle ends as practically possible, and the rear will be "done".

The front end is gonna' be the challenge!

-D

D-

Are you getting any bind at the frame-end heim? It looks like, from the pic, that the heim is close to binding. Misalignment washers would be really cheap insurance if those hiems ever failed since it looks like you are keeping them in single shear.

I'm assuming(since I don't know anything about Johny Joints) that the JJ on the axle end is basically a sperical bearing?

This is kinda cross threading, but I was talking to Roverwrench at Uwharrie a few weeks ago about running SG HD trailing links in place of the upper radius arms on the three link for added length/flex and having the mobility of a heim instead of the bushing on the outrigger mount. This is only interesting to you because I noticed that Greg did something similar on his buggy that may help you in conceptualizing your front end.

http://www.safarigard.com/Project%20D90.htm

http://www.safarigard.com/Project%20D90.htm

Johnathan

Originally posted by Jtisdale
D-

Are you getting any bind at the frame-end heim? It looks like, from the pic, that the heim is close to binding. Misalignment washers would be really cheap insurance if those hiems ever failed since it looks like you are keeping them in single shear.

I'm assuming(since I don't know anything about Johny Joints) that the JJ on the axle end is basically a sperical bearing?

This is kinda cross threading, but I was talking to Roverwrench at Uwharrie a few weeks ago about running SG HD trailing links in place of the upper radius arms on the three link for added length/flex and having the mobility of a heim instead of the bushing on the outrigger mount. This is only interesting to you because I noticed that Greg did something similar on his buggy that may help you in conceptualizing your front end.

http://www.safarigard.com/Project%20D90.htm

http://www.safarigard.com/Project%20D90.htm

Johnathan

Well the JJ's (spherical) are MUCH stiffer to articulate than the heims'...Heck, I read the guage on the shop press when I was putting them together and it showed about 900lbs right before the snap ring was in place. The heim will "bind" slightly before the JJ kicks in...But nothing like it would with a standard poly bush...And yes, there will be misalignment spacers AND double shear at the frame rail mount...However I'm convinced it's (double shear) really not necessary with a 3/4" grade 8 bolt (and 180hp).

As far as the front goes, I'm going to use the stock radius arm frame mount (for simplicity sake), and a simple poly-bush at the axle...No need to go with a hiem there because the link rotates around with the frame mount bush...Heims would *look* cool, but they would LIMIT the articulation with a link configuration rather than enhance it...Essentially you would need to go with a JJ at the axle end (like my rear links) to maximize the articulation and prevent the heim from binding at the frame (same problem the SG HD links are having now with a 9012 shock).

For the front I'm going to go with my original 3-link concept...That is, I'm going to use a standard Rover radius arm as the 3rd link. It will be just a hair (2-3") left of center, and mounted to a x-member utilizing round poly bushes. Of course the x-member is going to have to be helly stout for sure...I'm thinkin' 3/8th wall 3" x 3" box with a gusseted 1/2" plate for the bush. All this will keep the front nice and free (and strong), and I'm not re-inventing the wheel a whole bunch. Not to mention it won't cost more than a c-note to build.

Greg's design is nice (4-link) but IMO he sacrificed too much ground clearance for the sake of having a true 4-link. At least it *looks* like the lower links are below axle centerline in the pics...Could be wrong there...Grego' is pretty stingy with detailed shot's of the front links!

--D

Doug,

Where would you estimate your current cg is for-aft based on your balancing experiments?

If you don't know, perhaps you can tell us where you put the front jack stands and about how much force it took to lift the back at the rear of the frame.

To all:

There really is not much reason to go to a 4-link in the front, especially if one runs a link between the pitman arm and the upright (as opposed to 100% hydraulic with the ram mounted directly on the axle). If one runs a pitman arm/drag link set-up, then a parallel panhard rod will give less bump steer than a four link and take up less room.


Rich

Originally posted by rhills
Doug,

Where would you estimate your current cg is for-aft based on your balancing experiments?

If you don't know, perhaps you can tell us where you put the front jack stands and about how much force it took to lift the back at the rear of the frame.


That's all the critique I get? I was hoping for a little more from you Rich! Now's the time to speak-up, before the shock mounts go on and such!

I would guestimate the CG (without the tank, bed and rear (heavy) x-member) to be right about at the front of the seat boxes (right behind the t-case lever). Or 1/3 of the distance of the vehicle from the front. Now, that's really just a guess. I have the front jack-stands right up against the sway-bar mounts (to keep the jack-stand from slipping forward into the wheel arch). With that position, I can lift the rear of the truck (as she is now) with one hand...I'd say about 40-50lbs of lifting force. So all that said, I would say that the rig is very close to a 50/50 weight bias with a full 16 gal tank, a stock trim bed and some junk...Maybe even 40/60 with spare.

I was surprised how light the rig became in the rear after all the *stuff* was removed...Heck my *bed* is about 100lbs now (about 75lbs estimated removed). And my rear x-member is about 50% lighter than before (estimated 100lbs originally)...Of course with the cage, fuel cell, and tube bracing a lot of that weight savings will be gained back...But I still think I'll have a better balanced vehicle in the end.

--D

Doug,

If you really want a critique:vader2:

The pictures look good. The only concern I have is the bridge over the diff. Looks like (even with the mount onto diff-cover bolts) than it could fold backward. I would suggest a piece that is welded onto the top of the diff that ties into the bridge. A simple way to do this is to weld a long rib (say 5" long) along the top of the diff (going for-aft) and weld the south end of this into the bridge. Jeff Wood has done several of these and they seem to work well. The 10" of weld area (5" on either side of the rib) seems to hold up well.

Rich

Rich...Thanks...I've been toying with the idea of a rib to the bridge...However the Avalanche rock ring is 1/2" plate...BUT! There are only two 3/8th's bolts holding the bridge to the 1/2" plate...And considering that the upper links act in tension, it could potentially shear the two bolts and fold forwards...Or do I have this backwards again? The bridge is .25 x 1.5" tubing with about 7" each of welded area on the axle tubes themselves...Hmmmmmmm.

Here's what Avalanche has on their site...Look similar? :flipoff2:

Looks really good Doug.

I see what you mean about the amount of trianglation that you are getting out of the top links but I still think that it will be fine.

I sort of agree with Rich about the strength of your top diff mount he said that if could fold backwards but I think that it would fold forwards :flipoff2: . Like Rich said weld something to the top of the diff housing or you could beef up the mount to the diff cover bolts (I did this)

Still got more to say but got to go.

Sam

All right you guys. Forward it is. :zzz:

Rich

As Sam pointed out in an earlier posting, the stress builds up where things are the stiffest. Based on a quick look, I suspect that the vertical plate and the point where this transitions to the diff ring will take most of the stress, at least until you get some plastic deformation in this area :( and more of the forces get transfered to the bridge.

By the way, I'll be gone the rest of the week so will be pulling a Hills. I'll be visiting some goverment Lab outside of Santa Fe where the employees are overpaid and underworked:rasta:, unlike us hard working college profs.

Rich

Thanks guy's...I love this board! I couldn't imagine doing this w/o the help of the PBB!

Sam, keep the comments coming!

Rich, I hear ya' man...I posted the same pics to the General board and they are saying a mixed bag...Some okay, others use the gusset...I've decided I'll put a single piece of 3/8th's (triangle) gusset down the CL of the pumpkin to the bridge...I'm just sick of grinding plate to shape! :emb: But it will give me good practice welding to nodular iron!

I'm also going to put a small gusset between the two JJ mounts...I think in a lateral bind I might get some deformation of the A36 in that area...Again cheap (and easy) insurance....Pushin the 42's as hard as I want to push them is gonna put a lot of stress on demdare mounts! YEE HAW JETHRO! (I just love hill-billy talk!).

Sam, I'm thinking I'm going to put two more JJ's at the x-member mounts in place of the polys. The JJ's won't have any flex to them (well, VERY little), and should eliminate my lateral movement and the triangulation issue.

Rich...If your pullin' a "Hill's" and are gonna' be in the area, stop by or call my work #...I'll run ya' by the shop and we can discuss in real-time. And if your nice, I might let you buy me dinner! Hey we all need a little time off anyway!

L8r, guy's!

-D:flipoff2:

Looking at the top mount again, I think that it will be fine because the rock ring and the two 3/8 bolts that mount to it are off the shelf components and I would guess that other people bolt the bridge to them in the same way (like the other pic you posted) and they dont have any problems so you shouldnt also.

Its just that in my mind when I look at anything that is designed for strength I try to make everything balanced, meaning that the strength of every component is as strong as the next thing that it is bolted to. In this case you got the two jonny joints with (i guess) 1/2 in bolts mounted in double shear connected to the rock ring with two single 3/8 bolts. The forwards and backwards loads in your bridge will be supported almost entirly by the rock ring plate cause this is the stiffest route. If the rock ring mount wasnt there then the bridge would probably flex a good 1/2 in forwards and backwards without bending and the rock ring mount wont move anywhere that much so it will take all the load.

The jonny joints are mounted above the bridge and will try to rotate (twist the actual tube) the bridge forwards. The bridge, because it is connected to the rock ring at the rear, will therefore try to move down and it wont do this cause it is trianglated downwards on each side to the axle tubes.

This is why I dont think any of it will bend and it should be fine. I would be just happier if the bolts to the rock ring plate were bigger and then if the rock ring plate was wider and picked up more of the diff cover bolts with more metal.

Now because people support their bridges using the same rockring setup means that this will be strong enough.

If it was me I would still weld a support to the top of the diff. But remember that this support will have to be made as if it was the only support component in terms of forwards backwards loads(as if the bridge wasnt there or the rockring support) because once you weld to the top of the diff this is where all the stress will go.

What sort of missalingement can you get out of the jonny joints. From the close up pics it looks like its almost maxed out and the body of the jonny joint is a bit rotated compared to the fixed poly bush at the other end. I would guess that your going to need about 15 degrees misalingement out of the jonnies and the hiems for the amount of flex that your going to run, do they get this much???

Its looking great though!!! Sorry to sound so critical cause you really are doing a top class job. As opposed to me who is really just a butcher a best and just welds on any old crap that is lying around in the shed to get the job done. Actually Ill post a pic tomorrow of what mine now looks like. It will be good for a comparison (and a laugh :D )

What sort of spring rates you thinking of running????

:beer:

Sam

Originally posted by Strange Rover
What sort of missalingement can you get out of the jonny joints. From the close up pics it looks like its almost maxed out and the body of the jonny joint is a bit rotated compared to the fixed poly bush at the other end. I would guess that your going to need about 15 degrees misalingement out of the jonnies and the hiems for the amount of flex that your going to run, do they get this much???

Its looking great though!!! Sorry to sound so critical cause you really are doing a top class job. As opposed to me who is really just a butcher a best and just welds on any old crap that is lying around in the shed to get the job done. Actually Ill post a pic tomorrow of what mine now looks like. It will be good for a comparison (and a laugh :D )

What sort of spring rates you thinking of running????

:beer:

Sam

Thanks again Sam...I've heard that the JJ's can go to 30deg w/o any problems...In the picture, there is probably another 10 in the joint, although it does look close to max...But what you can't see is the poly bush surrounding the washer...I don't think pushing them much past 20 deg is a good idea, but a re-build kit is only $12.

Don't worry about sounding critical! That's what I'm looking for! I'm not the type that gets his feelings hurt all that easy...Especially when the criticism is constructive and well thought out.

The spring rates are...Rear: 450/250/80 Front: 350/250/80 Although I might reverse the front to rear main coils now that I know my weight bias is more like 50/50 now with all the "weight removal" I've done...Before I always felt too heavy in the rear...Especially on steep ledges...With little anti-squat I would sit down too much and drag over...Hence I went with a stiffer rate in the rear....Here’s a pic of one of the shocks I keep in my office for motivational purposes!

man that shock is pretty

Hahaha...your boss prolly gets a kick outa the fact that you keep that monster shock in your office. Not to mention all the "work" your gettin' done with the Pirate BBS on the computer!
:D :D :D :D

Johnathan

Hee, hee, hee! I thought the PBB in the background was a nice touch!

-D

That coilover looks bloody awsome - you should keep one of your 42s in there as well. That would get you motivated - you could use is as a seat.

How do the springs work. I have never seen one up close.

Do all the springs sit on top of each other with the spacers so that you get a constant spring rate all the way (unless one of the coils bind) or do the spacers have some sort of stopper mechanish that stops the spacers moving up so far so that when you compress the whole thing you get the soft combined spring rate until the spacer hits the stopper and then you only get the bottom spring working and thus a much higher spring rate.

Why do you build up the spring set with such different spring rates???

Sam - newbie

Originally posted by Strange Rover
Do all the springs sit on top of each other with the spacers so that you get a constant spring rate all the way (unless one of the coils bind) or do the spacers have some sort of stopper mechanish that stops the spacers moving up so far so that when you compress the whole thing you get the soft combined spring rate until the spacer hits the stopper and then you only get the bottom spring working and thus a much higher spring rate.

Why do you build up the spring set with such different spring rates???

Sam - newbie

Yup you got it in your first analysis...Essentially it's a triple rate...The first "traveler coil" keeps both lower coils together should I extend the shock too far...You see, with a coil-over you have about 12" of threaded body on the shock itself...So you can tune your ride height as you need. If you drop the rig all the way down via the shock, then you could potentially have a spring come loose as you go to full droop. No big deal, but it's annoying...The traveler is always in full bind until it unloads at full droop. The shock is adjusted by the ring at the top. We went with a softer 2nd stage for compression when crawling, and a stiffer third rate for romping and full bind scenarios.

I let King do the work for me when figuring out the spring rates...I gave them the weight of the rig sprung and unsprung (estimated), the wheeling I like to do, and the went from there...I didnt' even get into valving and all that. The owner of King has been getting into this rock-crawling stuff over the past 6-7 years, and has a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't...Kept the guess-work out of it for me...If I find that the spring rates are too stiff/loose valving isn't right etc., they will do a swap and make it right w/o $. Good guy's...Good service.

Think I just worked it out. You get the differing spring rates as the shock extends. As the stiffer springs get to there free length the upper softer springs stay attacher and give you the softer spring rates in the more extended positions.

Sam

And like you say you got the stiff bottom spring so that when you are going fast and the upper springs compress till they bind then you still got a 450 lb/in spring to go and you would never bottom that sucker. Almost like a really good bumpstop.

mmmmmmm, looks good although you wont get the stability advantages of your previous setup with the springs retained top and bottom which starts to pull up on the axle at big extensions. With this setup the coilovers will push out all the way untill the shock bottoms.

Sam

Ahhhhhh. Yes...The old reverse pull...Yes I liked having the reverse pull effect by retaining my springs top and bottom, I'll tell ya' it REALLY ragged out my springs in a hurry. Dunno' why this happened, but I was sagging within' 3-4 runs...I just don't think standard springs are supposed to act in tension....At least in the amounts that I was pullin' them.

To combat sway I'm going to do two things...First is a sway-bar...Like the Currie (see below) AND limiting straps...Gotta' have the straps with coil-overs such that I'm not bottoming the shock continuously, and having the shock shaft and body act as the limiter...Hey, it was fine with a pair of $60 Rancho's...But not with these babies!

Old Scout posted a link to build your own (have all the aprts in different sizes, etc). I am also planning on doing a currie style sway bar sometime in the future. I have a few pictures here and there installed on buggies for when you get closer and are looking for some ideas. Do a forum search on sway bars and you should be able to pull it up.

Way

P.S. tell me more about your sprins sagging because of stretching. My ride height has been sagging minutely over the last year and a half I have had it on. I thought I would get rid of the sag within a month or so, but it seems to keep getting shorter. Oh yeah my tires are shrinking too. Those 33" look Very tiny. Any ideas on how to get those to look bigger:D

Way,

OME springs are notorious for sagging and sagging and sagging. I'm done with them, even though they are a client and I love them to death, I just don't like either the springs or shocks for the way I have my trucks set up and the way I like to drive.

I'm getting some RTE springs this week (hopefully by the weekend), and will install them on the LWB to see how they pan out.

Oh, one way to make those tires look bigger is to increase air pressure! Be careful tho! Ever put a raw egg in a microwave??? (don't go try this unless you like scrambled eggs)

Later,

Michael

I agree with you on OME. I have custom springs (much taller and heavier spring rating) than OME by a company called Valley Spring Works. I thought the springs being higher quality would prevent sagging and sagging and sagging. If there is truth to a spring sagging by stretching it out under articulation, then I assume that may be my problem.

Way

P.S. Just aired up my tires and they still do not look like 37", I even kicked them. Still...no good??? Any other suggestions:D They *REALLY* look tiny after my recent fender trimming. Went a little overboard :)

Way,

A while ago I did some research on airbags, valve blocks, etc...for a completely manually adjustable, fully air-sprung truck I was going to build.

9/11 happended and my priorities changed, the truck got mothballed indefinitely.

BUT, the whole spring thing has me re-thinking about completely developing the air-springs and having them be a bolt on. I will need rear airsprings in the LWB, and probably will need them in the 145.

I have the bags chosen, and all the ancillaries. Now I'm getting to work on the adapter plates for the top and bottom airbag perch. Yeah, airbags are a little stiff, but not stiffer than these OME HD's that's for sure.

So, the plans for the air-bag replacement system are back on the drawing board. I might actually throw them under the Serious One as well. I can't seem to find a front spring that has the height/suppleness that I want. Airbags are the only way I know of to have an infinitely adjustable spring.

Don't hold your breath, but I just wanted you to know that there are options in the works *other* than steel springs.

Later,

Michael

Heres a pic of my new bridge support that is mounted off the diff cover bolts. I always intended to put this on when I first swaped in the axle but never got around to doing it until a bent the bridge.

Sam

Yea...Looks like it should have been made from 1/2" material...:flipoff2: Although it's kinda' hard to see all that clearly!



:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

WTF - wrong pic. Hang on I think I lost my pic. Gota go and retake it. Arnt computers a PITA. Cool pic though I might leave it there.. Back in a sec.

Sam

i do not think that airbags are infinately adjustable. they are adjustable as far as spring rate and ride height goes, but the only way to increase spring rate is to increase ride height. so there is a very definate tradeoff. therefore, i do not see the advantage aside from if you wanted a largely variable ride height. the guy that owned my truck before me had a full air suspension system on it with about 11" of ride height adjustment in it. the only time that the suspension was anything other than super super soft is when it was at full height and he had the ranchos cranked all the way up.

as far as infinitely adjustable spring rate goes, i think the only solution is to go with coilovers. they may not be as easily adjustable as bags, but they are far more so. you just swap out the springs for another stiffer set, and your ride height stays the same.

Try again

See what I mean about me being a rough bastard

:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

But its doing the job. :D

Sam

Originally posted by Serious One
Way,

A while ago I did some research on airbags, valve blocks, etc...for a completely manually adjustable, fully air-sprung truck I was going to build.

9/11 happended and my priorities changed, the truck got mothballed indefinitely.

BUT, the whole spring thing has me re-thinking about completely developing the air-springs and having them be a bolt on. I will need rear airsprings in the LWB, and probably will need them in the 145.

I have the bags chosen, and all the ancillaries. Now I'm getting to work on the adapter plates for the top and bottom airbag perch. Yeah, airbags are a little stiff, but not stiffer than these OME HD's that's for sure.

So, the plans for the air-bag replacement system are back on the drawing board. I might actually throw them under the Serious One as well. I can't seem to find a front spring that has the height/suppleness that I want. Airbags are the only way I know of to have an infinitely adjustable spring.

Don't hold your breath, but I just wanted you to know that there are options in the works *other* than steel springs.

Later,

Michael

Should start a thread on air bags, cause damn have I got some good theories on this shiat.

Im gonna do them one day.

Sam

Originally posted by Strange Rover
Try again

:barf: :barf:





:flipoff2:


Actually it looks pretty good for a Aussie hill-billy, wana'be engineer!

You said you were bending the bridge before? Where, and how? Sorry, but I can't remember what you made the bridge from in the beginning...As I vaguely recall, it was 2x2x.25 box tubing?

--D

The bridge was actually made from 65mmx8mm (2.55in x .31in) flat mild steel with a bit of 25mmx12mm (1in x 1/2in) welded on the back (so the section is an L shape) it is the face of the 1in x 1/2in that the cover brace is bolted to and the bigger flat section extands away from the camera and it is this that the bal joint socket is welded into. I triad to keep everything low so that I didnt get convergent angles on my top and bottom links (anti squat) so I made it this way.

With the lower links on the bottom of the tube everything worked fine. I even managed to twist an axle with the bridge unsupported.

Then came the big tyres and then came the bouncing and so I moved the lower links to on top of the axle tube (I lifted them about 3in) With the links a lot closer together (about an inch closer than stock) the increased loads bent the bridge where it was welded to the axle tube. It didnt actually deform the bridge material but instead bent (dented) the axle tube where the bridge was welded to it. This was a fair old stuff up.

So I straightned the axle tubes (by welding and letting it cool - each end of the tubes were bent up by about an inch so the thing was fairly bent) and then I had to cut the bridge and bend it back and reweld it. Then I bolted on the brace that I was always going to. :rasta:

So now its really strong.

Sam

With your setup if the bridge wasnt bolted to the rock ring then my feeling is that you would bend the bridge way before you could give those big mofo 1.5in axles any dramas.

With the rock ring bolted to it all the tension force from your upper links will be transmitted to the 3/8 bolts and to the rock ring. Essencialy none of the force will through the bridge because although the bridge is strong it is flexible and the rock ring is very stiff so the rock ring wont flex and it will take all the load.

Your links attach to the bridge above the tube and will therefore try to twist the tube so in your current setup the ridge will handle this type of twisting load easilt and generally keep the whole connection stable and the rock ring will take the brunt of the force.

I still think it would be OK as it is now but the big force is on the two 3/8 bolts and the rockring. If the bolts were bigger or there were more of them and the width of the rockring extended plate was bigger then it would look more balanced strength wise.

Welding a gusset down to the diff will also make it ultra strong but remember that the bridge is not only trying to move forwards but it is also trying to twist forwards as well so you gotta stop the rotation as well.

Sam

PS damn you are gonna love this machine when you get it going. Mine is absolutely fucken awsome:bounce: :bounce2: .
The difference over its previous configuration is incredible. The tyres have got so much grip on the big stuff and with no approach and departure angles I can just point the the thing at anything and it will drive it. The shiat im driving now is unbelievable, basically I havent found any thing that it wont drive. If I can fit my rig in there and keep my chassis off the rocks then I can drive it and where talking big vertical rocks like 3ft high (way higher than half the tyre) and it just idles over em (oh well with me ridding the clutch). Its a lot of fun. Amazed that I havent broken it yet. Im am driving it harder than ever. There was one bit last weekend trying to get up a 3ft ledge (the right side had a slightly undercut 3ft ledge and the left had a short series of smaller ledges) getting the front up was easy but to get the rear up was unbeliavable I could see the right rear tyre. The rock compresses the tyre to about an inch of the rim. I would ride the clutch (I tried to give it some momentum to pop it up but the tyre would just jam) and start everything turning. The rig would hop and move a bit as the tyres fought for traction and then it would finally get the grip and up it comes. Had to drive the arse end up the same bit about 3 times cause I kept getting hung up on ather shiat.

Bloody good fun. Now theres two other guys that are gonna build buggies to run big tyres. Its catching on.

:smokin:

Sam

Michael,

I assume you're planning on using Firestone bags? I found a set at a show but can't seem find a vendor that sells them. I saw them stretch to some ungodly amount and they don't pop off easily either. I think they stretched to almost two feet or something like that. The jeep that had them went from 0 to 7" lift.

Let's discuss some options on this matter.

Ali