Anyone gotten ahold of Ox's new front u-joint? Saw one in 4 wheel magazine today, no pricing, but interesting design. The "caps" are really rods that go into the joint body. Curious how strong that is, would sure make them easy to install.

All I can say is CTM............Just put mine in last weekend and they are the Shiznit. CTM joints are proven many times over and I am not big on copycat parts.

I am sure they are stronger that a 297x but if you want a little more strenght just get the Spicer 760x I have yet to break them.

June 2002 Peterson's 4wheel and off road
Bottom of page 103
Drivetrain Direct add
FYI

Originally posted by UGET IT
All I can say is CTM............Just put mine in last weekend and they are the Shiznit. CTM joints are proven many times over and I am not big on copycat parts.

I am sure they are stronger that a 297x but if you want a little more strenght just get the Spicer 760x I have yet to break them.

I'm not a big fan of single supplier parts - competition = better pricing and better parts. Not everyone can or wants to spend hundreds on a u-joint.

The 760x has the same problem as the 297x - weak caps. Since they're the same price, I'd use them, but they are not much of a cure.

Originally posted by oldjeep


I'm not a big fan of single supplier parts - competition = better pricing and better parts. Not everyone can or wants to spend hundreds on a u-joint.

The 760x has the same problem as the 297x - weak caps. Since they're the same price, I'd use them, but they are not much of a cure.

Just remember that when we are all dying for someone to build a new joint to replace the scrawny 297X, all of the companies that had the technology to do it, were just sitting on their asses, selling you new axles without warranties that covered broken U joints. It was in there best interest to let you keep busting joints, so they did.
One guy came along and took his own risks and developed a new joint. He built it, tested it, and now backs it with a Lifetime warranty.
OX and Superior have been stroking everyone about these joints for 6 months now, and the only reason tghey are is because they are losing thousands of sales to CTM.
You wanna play up to their dog and pony show,.... go ahead.
But the next time your looking for new and innovative parts, dont be surprised when your stuck with waht ever the corporate giants are willing to give you.
Me, my money is going to the guys who deserve it.

I totally agree H8, I just think a few years ago if someone on the
trail came up and said "For 300 bucks I can gurantee that you will
never break these u joints again or your money back! I would have jumped on it! I know it cost me a BUNCH to switch over to
the front HP 60. If those joint would have been out when I had
my 44 , I would have probably kept it! Bottom line is spend the
bucks on the CTM's and wheel your bootie off!

Nicely put H8. I cant wait for the day when i can afford some CTMs

Dallas

Originally posted by oldjeep


I'm not a big fan of single supplier parts - competition = better pricing and better parts. Not everyone can or wants to spend hundreds on a u-joint.

The 760x has the same problem as the 297x - weak caps. Since they're the same price, I'd use them, but they are not much of a cure.

Whatever bro.....I have seen CTM's in action and I mean serious shit so the bottom line is you get what you pay for and if that means paying more I'll do it.
You are correct on the caps for the 760x, but I have only broken the cross's on 297's so I could give a hoot about the caps in my application. I know the cross's are stronger that the 297's due to them being forged.
CTMs have the 300m caps so that wont be a concern for me. Until I see a thees new flashy "Yellow" u-joints at a Comp or slaming through the Hammers they are just another "catch-up" product that will fail against CTM's.

I ditto H8 comments as well. As a wheeler I try to support the innovators and risk takers in our sport not the million dollar 3 page add retailers.


UGET IT

I agree but a little competition is healthy. I would never run these joints in any axle until they have proven to be as strong as the CTMs and that could be hard to do. I do think that having the caps be rods that press down into the joint body is a great idea however, that allows bearings inside of the joint and caps are solid you get the full diameter woth of strength. this transfers all the stress into the joint body. It is a great design but I have a feeling that a large company like drivetrain direct will skimp on the materials due to the stronger design. That is how large companies work. If they are made out of 300M then I am all for them but I have a feeling there not. Maybe if there not, someone will use that design with forged or 300M parts and it will make an even better joint than anything out there right now. just an idea. I agree with you on supporting the smaller manufacturers because they are the one on one guys who will really meet wheelers needs. I just5 hope that OX and drive train direct havnt locked up the design so no one else can experiment with it.

Looks to me like he's talking about a different joint. Sure, Superior is developing a joint similar to CTMs (a 300m cross with spicer needle bearing caps -- not as strong as a CTM but will require less service due to the needles) and you might be able to argue that this joint is a CTM knockoff
...but DTD/Ox is developing an entirely different joint. The DTD/Ox joint I think oldjeep referred to is dramatically different design than a standard spicer joint, or the CTM joint (essentially a spicer-style joint made from better stock)

Searching would have yielded this earlier post:

The body of the DTD/Ox joint is bored, and the 'caps' stick INTO the body... this allows more bearing length (to better spread the load) and a thicker effective trunion. The trunion, in this case, is on 4 pieces, each of a solid cap that sticks into the bored trunion.
Conversely, on a Spicer joint, the diameter of the trunion is limited to the inner diameter of the cap, minus any bushings or bearings used.
It is the difference of an 'innie' vs. an 'outie' :D

These DTD/Ox joints also used a rather unique 'latch' to retain the four 'caps.' I don't recall whether this 'latch' is a supplement to clip-retainers, or a replacement.

I'll tell you, though, when you hold one of these things in your hand, you'll be impressed. CTMs are damn nice, but you have to know the metallurgy behind them to be really impressed... the OX joints are impressive from a mechanical perspective... creative AND they look sexy, too.

Here's a coupla pix... http://www.outdoorwire.com/gallery/trailshots//Trade_Shows/SEMA_2001/Highlighted_Parts/tn_pb010106.jpghttp://www.outdoorwire.com/gallery/trailshots//Trade_Shows/SEMA_2001/Highlighted_Parts/tn_pb010107.jpg


They weren't allowing pictures of the disassembled joint at SEMA... but with the camera put away, they did allow me to take it apart. I described the results above -- the 'caps' are actually elongated and fit INSIDE the body. Cool!

Randii

If they are made out of 300M then I am all for them but I have a feeling there not.
I don't really care what they are made of -- if they are stronger (dunno, just speculating), then why does it matter what they are made from? Campfire bragging rights? :rolleyes:

I just hope that OX and drive train direct havnt locked up the design so no one else can experiment with it.
You can't have it both ways -- you want us to be loyal to an innovator in one case AND have non-innovators be able to develop it in another case? :confused:

Consumer loyalty is a great thing, and I'll pay more to buy certain things from vendors I like, if the product is the same -- but the bottom line is that I'll buy what I think are the best parts I can buy for my application.

Randii

Well, I am all for competition as a means of both improving the bread and reducing consumer costs. Having said that:

1) The superior joint, if it uses standard spicer caps, which it appears to, would seem to be inferior to the CTM joint.

2) The superior joint is advertised all over the place, including with pictures in the latest mags, yet has anyone heard anything about availability or price???????

3) The OX joint might be great, but so far it is not going to be produced??? or I think that is what I heard.

Point is the CTM joint is here and now. While I am all for 'competition', I wish the competitors would finally get it out there so we can actually see what is what. Right now this reminds me a lot of what we in the software industry call 'vapour ware'.

While I am all for 'competition', I wish the competitors would finally get it out there so we can actually see what is what. Right now this reminds me a lot of what we in the software industry call 'vapour ware'.
Amen to that -- I was holding the joint pictured above in my hand at the SEMA show last November, and I'm itching to see the real-world implementation.... it makes a helluvalot of sense to me!

If you want to upgrade your joints TODAY, CTM seems like the best choice.

Randii

Nice pics of the OX Randii, so for now CTM seems to be the ticket. I cant wait to get on the trail and give mine a spin.

Originally posted by ChadLloyd
Well, I am all for competition as a means of both improving the bread and reducing consumer costs. Having said that:

3) The OX joint might be great, but so far it is not going to be produced??? or I think that is what I heard.


The ox joint is for sale, they are advertising it, June issue of 4wd Mags - but I guess no one has tried it. The point of the post wasn't another rah-rah CTM thread :rolleyes: - I'll agree there stuff looks great, but what has that to do with Ox's joint ?

Originally posted by oldjeep


The ox joint is for sale, they are advertising it, June issue of 4wd Mags - but I guess no one has tried it. The point of the post wasn't another rah-rah CTM thread :rolleyes: - I'll agree there stuff looks great, but what has that to do with Ox's joint ?

Hmmmmm a thread about super joints for a D44,.....no I guess I cant see where the CTMs would pop up in the conversation.:rolleyes:

If they are available, go ahead and give em a call and let us know when the delivery date is, and how much they cost,...I wouldnt hold my breath if I were you.
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

Originally posted by UGET IT
All I can say is CTM............Just put mine in last weekend and they are the Shiznit. CTM joints are proven many times over and I am not big on copycat parts.

I am sure they are stronger that a 297x but if you want a little more strenght just get the Spicer 760x I have yet to break them.

The OX joint is not a copy cat of the CTM joint, while it does the same thing as the CTM joint, it is a totally different way to get there. Which one is better, who knows yet, but OX is taking some time to develop it because they are testing it, possibly patenting it, and they will release it as soon as it has been proven and the lawyers give the go-ahead.

Originally posted by H8monday


Hmmmmm a thread about super joints for a D44,.....no I guess I cant see where the CTMs would pop up in the conversation.:rolleyes:

If they are available, go ahead and give em a call and let us know when the delivery date is, and how much they cost,...I wouldnt hold my breath if I were you.
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

Original post-
"Anyone gotten ahold of Ox's new front u-joint? Saw one in 4 wheel magazine today, no pricing, but interesting design. The "caps" are really rods that go into the joint body. Curious how strong that is, would sure make them easy to install."

I have sent DTD an email to check on pricing and avaliability. Again, point of post was to see if anyone had actually used one and what their impressions were. Not an endless stream of - I've never used one, or seen one, but the CTM is superior. Nobody is disputing the quality of the CTM product - but nobody was asking about it either.

The joint in the mag looks something like the pciture that randi posted, the shape was more square though- still has the "rods" instead of caps, and is nothing at all like the CTM joint (other than the fact that it is a u-joint)

One other question springs to mind with Ox's design. Installation looks easy, but how the heck would you remove them?

Originally posted by oldjeep


The ox joint is for sale, they are advertising it

Sorry, but that doesn't mean its for sale - I called and was told 4-6 weeks and it may be for sale. I'll believe it when I see it - Randy's and Superior were supposed to have induction hardened 4340 shafts out "in 4-6 weeks" for the past year.

I called and talked with the rep. at Superior Axle, (Foote Axle) and he said they were NOT coming out with their own desing on a u-joint, that they were going to sell and use the OX Joint in conjunction with their new 4340 axle shafts.

If their front shafts are anything like their rear ones, they are going to ber a very good product and should be cheaper than warns. Maybe it will make warn drop their price some, but I would not hold my breath.

Depdog:usa:

well said h8.... i doubt that id ever get the customer service that ive gotten with jack! not only does his product kick ass.... but so does he...... and that is just as important.... i would rather support the small guy...... than some big industry.... i have always been that way and will continue to be

I agree that more people making the parts does make price drop. Thats a given. Because I bet that if CTM is making there's efficiently, they are making well over 50% on them. And good for them. I would too if I was them. But compitition drops prices.

And who cares which one is made out of what material?? I have no idea what the OX joint is made of. 300M is great, but if most applications could last with 4140 or 4340, then why pay extra for 300M?? Just a thought. 4340 should last as a u-joint. 300M is only "modified 4340". We don't need 300M axle shafts, 4340 works just fine.

I like to support the small guys as well. But $150 for U-joints is a lot. $100 sounds a bit better in the long run.

I have a pair of Superior's 300M u-joints. I haven't done my D44 swap yet, but when I do they are going in. And I am sure they will last.

JMO

Response from dtd:

We should have those units on our shelf ready to ship in early June.
Pricing is $159.00 per side and we are currently pre-selling the units. Let
me know if you'd like to place an order for them.

Thank you,

Brian Palazzo
Manager
(888) 584-4327 x123
brian@drivetraindirect.com


So price doesn't seem any better than CTM - still curious about the design though.

so we all go to the super duty U joints....whats gonna break next...what do you use for a drive line fuse.....It only takes me 10 minutes to replace an axle assembly in my junk....I carry spares...have never held up a run yet.......so what fails next?

Originally posted by NothernAZxj
so we all go to the super duty U joints....whats gonna break next...what do you use for a drive line fuse.....It only takes me 10 minutes to replace an axle assembly in my junk....I carry spares...have never held up a run yet.......so what fails next?

According to H8 the hub grenades.

Not cheap, but cheaper than custom length shafts..or waiting for new ones.....

whats gonna break next...what do you use for a drive line fuse

I use the front driveshaft u-joint as the fuse. It's got to be the easiest damn thing to change. Just swap in the spare shaft, it's 8 bolts and 5 minutes. Or just change the joint, 5-10 minutes. (I don't run CTMs though, my Spicer 60 joints should hold just fine)

H8 - I agree with your idealistic ideas !

But....isn't that innovative little guy description EXTREMELY well suited to the OX guys (or at least the originals...I dunno what the corporate state of affairs is now)

While all the TAD "gig guns" were pissing and moaning and battling Toyota etc. These guys built the ox locker in their basement (or something like that)....

Do they not deserve the same "respect / support market" as Jack?

I dunno any of the players, nor much of anything else tho:flipoff2:

Originally posted by Kicker
I agree that more people making the parts does make price drop. Thats a given. Because I bet that if CTM is making there's efficiently, they are making well over 50% on them. And good for them. I would too if I was them. But compitition drops prices.

And who cares which one is made out of what material?? I have no idea what the OX joint is made of. 300M is great, but if most applications could last with 4140 or 4340, then why pay extra for 300M?? Just a thought. 4340 should last as a u-joint. 300M is only "modified 4340". We don't need 300M axle shafts, 4340 works just fine.

I like to support the small guys as well. But $150 for U-joints is a lot. $100 sounds a bit better in the long run.

I have a pair of Superior's 300M u-joints. I haven't done my D44 swap yet, but when I do they are going in. And I am sure they will last.


How much $ were the Superiors Joints? Do they have needle bearings? Are these the Yellow ones in the mags?

JMO

"I have a pair of Superior's 300M u-joints. I haven't done my D44 swap yet, but when I do they are going in. And I am sure they will last. "



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm curious, how did you get the joints? No one
else seems to be able to get their hands on them.

Hey Guys,

I recently went to the Ox production facility and i saw the new joints and the way they produce them.

I will be the first person to have the production u-joints when they come out for testing and a product review on JeepsUnlimited.com. I will post a link to the article as soon as it is done.

Ox ran them at EJS 2002 in their TJ and they worked great, they death tested them by driving from florida to moab and wheel all week then drive back to florida. They found no problems with the durability of u-joints and their design is great.

Right now they are testing the joint using other metals and they will be in production at the end of may.

You should start seeing them on the market at the beginning of June just like DTD said.

I will keep you all informed when i get them.

Originally posted by H8monday
OX and Superior have been stroking everyone about these joints for 6 months now, and the only reason tghey are is because they are losing thousands of sales to CTM.
You wanna play up to their dog and pony show,.... go ahead.
But the next time your looking for new and innovative parts, dont be surprised when your stuck with waht ever the corporate giants are willing to give you.
Me, my money is going to the guys who deserve it.


Funny... Is OX some "big corporate giant"? I was not aware of that... I thought they were a small company who started out making wheel spacer/adapters, then came out with their own custom manual diff locker, now a custom U joint...

I guess if CTM has been second to come out with it you would be calling Jack a "corporate giant" and making him out to be the bad guy :rolleyes:


The OX joint will speak for itself once it is out there being used... I think that will say more than anything else written here...