I'm getting my plan together to finally upgrade to a solid axle. I figured I'd skip outgrowing the D44, and go straight for the D60 :smokin:

Here's what I've narrowed it down to so far:

Chevy D60 front, SOA, shackles foward, 5.13's, open for now, hi-steer
14BFF, 5.13's, 3/4 ton disk brakes, welded or spool, stock rear leaves, SOA

I'll be running 38's, and already have a D300 w/ 4:1.

The things I'm trying to decide on are the front leaves and u-joints (posted in gen4x).

I'm trying to keep the lift to a minimum, and right now I'm leaning towards using BDS 3.5" lift YJ rears up front. It seems like the extra weight of the passport (1995) with my DOR bumper and winch will flatten these out a bit. I like the price ($80 each) and the full military wrap. Looking for any advice or suggestions on this.

I'll probably be running 4"-ish shackles, and move the axle 5-6" foward.

sounds like it will be an awesome rig when its all said and done.

I don't know how much different the frames are between a 1st gen trooper and your passport, but keeping it low and leaving room for your steering and some uptravel can be frustrating.

the best solution to having plenty of clearance for steering and axle movement is full-hydro. but I don't know if you are planning to still drive this thing on the street or how much you are wanting to invest in your steering.

me, I'm going to have to bend my drag link in a few spots for oil pan, oil filter, frame and spring clearance. I'll be VERY lucky to get 3" of uptravel by doing this and keeping it at the height it is now (approx 5" over stock suspension height).

you also might want to consider a longer shackle. with only about 4" you probably won't be taking advantage of all the movement you can get out of those springs.

you are doing 35 spline outers on your 60 right? that would be the first thing I'd do. stock spicer joints should be fine, especially since its open and only on 38's. if you want to upgrade, I'd go with the longfield ujoints--best bang for the buck.

anyway thats my 2 pennies. have fun and good luck!

I'm going to stick with stock steering for now. Maybe full hydro down the road. When I lock the front, it will be selectable, so the non-assist should be liveable for a while.

I'm going to hold off on ordering hi-steer arms till I get the axle mounted. Once I see what the clearances look like, I'll decide on single or double sided arms. Uptravel will be at a premium. The longer shackles are a good idea, and an easy upgrade once I get some springs I like.

What springs did you end up with Paul?

I hadn't planed on upgrading to 35-spline right now. I've already got almost new hubs. I guess I need to look into what all is necessary to upgrade.

I've got waggoneer fronts. well, right now its the wag main and an assortment of what was around. I'm probably going try a different mix, though, because they are way soft right now.

contact highhonda about the 35 spline stuff to be sure, but I think it's just the shafts and hubs that you'll need. maybe a seal or something as well, but I doubt its very difficult, regardless. I was looking into doing 60's and he was an awesome help. Ended up I couldn't find room in my budget for them yet :D

I know its much easier to run the shackles forward, but you should really try to solid mount the springs in the front if you can. This will save you from bending springs in the long run. I fight with steering issues on my trooper with the shackles in the back. My pitman arm binds against my leaf spring at full stuff, but I prefer that over bent springs. Right now im looking at ways to alter my front spring hanger and gain more clearance for the steering.

I agree don't go front shackle mine is and my rs4044's are shaped like a pretzel

Bending the front springs is a major concern. That's why I'm looking for the magic spring :flipoff2: I'm hoping that a bit stiffer spring, with the military wrap will help minimize the bending.

The main reason I'm thinking shackles foward is that it's easier, and will help keep the lift down. I'll also have to deal with less slip in the driveshaft.

Pinkston - what springs and what size shackles are you running? Your front hangers don't look dropped to far. Any problems with too much castor?

I need to look for the Randii's instructions on mounting the shackle through the frame.

94redrodeo - You've got Sammy's old rig, right? Are you SUA?

I'm doing some 'boomerang' / C-shaped shackles in the front to help the front scrape over stuff (kinda like what some of the f-toy guys run in the rear). at full droop they sit against their own crossmember. will it totally prevent bending springs? probably not. will it help a little? hopefully.

front shackles keeps my lift down, the caster workable, my driveline slip down, allows my front suspension to pivot off the longest part of the spring, and keeps my tires out of my firewall.

If I do bend up some springs, yes it will be a PITA, but it's not a huge deal because waggy springs are a dime a dozen.

edit- just thought of something else--if you want to reap all the benefits of front shackles without the hangups, you could run those slider thingies. it may limit some of the travel, and it might be a pain to dial in, but at least its another option. it would be really cool if you could incorporate a johnny joint or something into it... hmm. now the old noodle is sparkin.

edit- just thought of something else--if you want to reap all the benefits of front shackles without the hangups, you could run those slider thingies. it may limit some of the travel, and it might be a pain to dial in, but at least its another option. it would be really cool if you could incorporate a johnny joint or something into it... hmm. now the old noodle is sparkin.

I've looked at the sliders, and I really like the concept. Other than the custom made ones, the sliders I've seen available are a bit short, and would probably limit travel. They would let me use a bit stiffer spring, which would help with bending.

Honestly, I'm not going to be able to take advantage of a ton of flex out of the front untill I can add a doubler. My trans swap ended up shortening my front shaft, so I will probably need to run a limit strap. The sliders might be a good option.

true. my front shaft will be pretty short to begin with too.

I am running rear CJ skyjacker 4" springs in the front of my trooper. Before those I had a set of stock wrangler leaves with an extra mainleaf added. I switched to try and gain a little clearance on the pitman arm. The shackles are about 5".
My front crossmember is up very high, I wanted it like that. I am using degree shims to correct my caster. If I was to do it over I would make it the same way, just drop the front crossmember down.

I am running rear CJ skyjacker 4" springs in the front of my trooper. Before those I had a set of stock wrangler leaves with an extra mainleaf added. I switched to try and gain a little clearance on the pitman arm. The shackles are about 5".
My front crossmember is up very high, I wanted it like that. I am using degree shims to correct my caster. If I was to do it over I would make it the same way, just drop the front crossmember down.

How much correction do the shims give you? You're running hi-steer, right?

yeah I have sammy's old rig its SUA.

I am running 8* shims and high steer. Ill try and get some pictures tomorrow.

Couple pictures

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/6/web/2046000-2046999/2046320_128_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/6/web/2046000-2046999/2046320_129_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/6/web/2046000-2046999/2046320_132_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/6/web/2046000-2046999/2046320_130_full.jpg

Thanks Matt, that's just what I wanted!

Are there any issues with running shims that large?

I did some rough sketches to get an idea of the difference in the two setups.
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e381/soulpatch75/SAS02.jpg

These are based on some measurements and rough estimates. The top is figuring on a 2" drop hanger, and both have 4" shackles. The castor numbers would be in addition to the factory castor with the spring perches level.

The shackles foward would result in the axle farther foward with the same frame extension.


yeah I have sammy's old rig its SUA.

I'm a little suprised you have issues with bent springs SUA. Those are Rancho 44044's IIRC.

Use Rs44044 And Go Shackles Forward. There Is Not Enogh Room In The Front Fender Well Area To Have The Tires Stuff Backwardu
S

Sas, 37" Bfgs

unless perhaps you *gasp* move the axle forward! :flipoff2:

Nice rig Jake! I'd like to end up with a similar height. It looks like the shackles are mounted to the front of the existing frame. Any idea how far foward of stock the axle ended up?

Any more pics?

General question here: would the same spring be more prone to bending with the shackles foward (all other things being equal)?

It Would Be More Prone To Bending, But It Works Great And Rides Like A Caddy. I Do Have The Front Axle Moved Out Quite A Bit. Any More And It Would Have Just Looked Retarded. With The Way Its Set Up Right Now, I Just Have Some Moinor Rubbing At The Back Of The Fender Well At Full Flex And Fully Cranked.

shackle reversal with yj's

shackle reversal with yj's

Are you running this setup? Any pics of your front hanger?

I've used a Toy front axle in mine (Amigo, but similar setup and virtually the same chassis profile and fittings), and moved it way forward... (Which gives shitty bumpsteer with the factory steering box - I think you guys have Scouts over there that mount outside the rail and have forward facing pitman arms? look at that as a must-have)

I used different parts but the problems will be the same I think... I solid mounted the front of my springs (used 2" lift Toy truck rears with the 2 overloads pulled) and used standard Toy shackles at the back
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/images/albums/MUSAS/IMG_1405.jpg

only just (by bending the steering arm on the passenger knuckle twice to get it right) have I got enough room to get any up travel out of the passenger side
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/images/albums/MUSAS/IMG_1294.jpg

...and whenever I get air the driveshaft falls out... (yes, that slip sleeve is nowhere near round any more... they thrash themselves to death if you get air at 40MPH down a beach - don't ask me how I know :rolleyes: )
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/images/albums/MUSAS/driveshaft_woes_2.jpg

Also unless your forward mount the front spring mounts a bit you'll possibly end up with this to overcome as well:
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/images/albums/MUSAS/IMG_1408.jpg

There are a few problems to be overcome, but its doable... Looking forward to seeing a D60'd one... we can't easily get those axles over here... NZ is pretty much a Toyota zone...

Good luck and post pics... looking forward to seeing it... I'm just in the process of doing this all again but with coils on a 5-door trooper (so I can fit the wife, daughter and dog and all the baggage that comes with them when we go away :) )

Steve

Thanks for the pics Steve!

I appreciate everyones input here. I thought about it a lot this weekend, and I think I'm going to stick with my original plan of shackles foward. I think the positives outweigh the negatives, and will help me keep the height managable. I'm going to start ordering some parts, and get this thing moving.

I'll keep you posted

A couple thoughts- You're gonna need beefier springs in the rear. Chevy 56's seem to be working well for Rob.

5.13's suck. Go with a dana 60 or 70 rear and get 7.17s.

Get a locker for the front, you're gonna want one, and theres no point in setting up the gears twice. :smokin:

A couple thoughts- You're gonna need beefier springs in the rear. Chevy 56's seem to be working well for Rob.

5.13's suck. Go with a dana 60 or 70 rear and get 7.17s.

Get a locker for the front, you're gonna want one, and theres no point in setting up the gears twice. :smokin:


Too late :D

The axles are already geared and in my garage.

The front locker won't be too far off, just need to get it rolling first.

I know some upgrades to the rear will be needed. I'm hoping to be able to leave some portion of my DOR spring upgrades in the packs, depending on the height I need. I'm planning on adding ladder bar to the rear before too long.

you can always add a lockright to the front if/when needed. the auto and 4:1's should be fine with 5.13's on the trail. on the street it might struggle a little, but it don't need to be fast if'n it's lookin good shonuf :grinpimp:

Hurry up and get started,we need some new pics to look at:flipoff2:

Hold your damn horses! Just wait till I start calling you at all hours with issues :D

Are you running this setup? Any pics of your front hanger?


no but that it what i am planning, i new a guy who had it and he liked it.

It's been 2 weeks,where's the pics,beeeeoch:flipoff2:

It's been 2 weeks,where's the pics,beeeeoch:flipoff2:

I'm taking it out this weekend to see what I can break off. The rest gets cut off starting next week. :smokin:

It's been 2 weeks,where's the pics,beeeeoch:flipoff2:


x2 :flipoff2:

BRING IT

I just want to wheel it one more time :nuke:

BUMP~~~~~~~~~~~~



Well let's hurry up and start a build thread..........the spring ?'s been answer'd :flipoff2:






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AND.................................








Let's see some pic's of fire and sparks and IFS crap getting cut off:smokin: