ARB question

[spork2367]

just bought a 96 disco and my christmas present to myself is an air locker. only one right now though. the question is, with everything else stock for now, should i put the locker in the front or rear. i have a bunch of other wheeling vehicles, but only locked rears and limited slip fronts, so i don't have any front locker experience. i don't care about steering issues either, purely interested from a traction standpoint. being a new rover owner, i'm not sure what the weight bias front to rear is either. thanks for the help.

[Nomar]

rear.

[cptyarderho]

I have heard arguments for both.

Me, I would suggest putting the locker in the rear. I did.

[96owner]

rear but upgrade your axles

[DChapman]

If you're leaving every thing else stock, including axles, I would leave it on the shelf.

[jymmiek]

It depends on what your plans are for the truck, do you plan on putting another locker in later? If so, I would put the ARB up front and a Detroit in the rear. If you are just going to ad another ARB later I would put it in the rear. Either way I would get HD shafts.

[spork2367]

as far as leaving it "on the shelf" i just paid 4000 for the vehicle and i can only afford one mod right now, so logically a locker is the most bang for the buck with the exception of tires maybe, but i'm waiting until i lift it to pick a tire size. as for axles, i highly doubt i'll break the stock shafts with stock 235 bfgoodrich long trails, especially not east coast wheeling which is more slippery leaves and logs than rocks. i'm putting an air locker in the other axle eventually, so i think i'll stick it in the rear...that doesn't sound right...i am a machinist and do a lot of custom fab work. i'd like to build custom toyota based 8 inch axles for under it, but it's hard to justify the cost based on the fact that i only want to run the metric equivalent of a 33x10.5. as far as axle shaft upgrades, what are my options? thanks for the help.

Thad

[FiveO Disco]

I ran stock shafts on 32s then 33s with arbs for quite a while. I thought my maturity:flipoff2: and lack of heavy gas pedal would save me. Then it happened, bang. broke shaft. now I have Keiths rear axles.

You can't beat Rovertracks shafts, especially for the $

If I could start over I would just do Dana 60s and call it good forever.

[spork2367]

dana 60's for 33's...um...i have a 1971 scout 800 running 35x12.5's bfgoodrich mud terrains on recentered hummer internal beadlocks (135 lb. tire wheel combo) on stock scout II dana 44's. it's behind an inline 6 with a decent amount of torque. i know it wouldn't hold up on rocks, but i'm not easy on it either. with 33's on dana 60's your diff is only going to be 8 inches off the ground.

[FiveO Disco]

dana 60's for 33's...um...i have a 1971 scout 800 running 35x12.5's bfgoodrich mud terrains on recentered hummer internal beadlocks (135 lb. tire wheel combo) on stock scout II dana 44's. it's behind an inline 6 with a decent amount of torque. i know it wouldn't hold up on rocks, but i'm not easy on it either. with 33's on dana 60's your diff is only going to be 8 inches off the ground.


Hell no! No 33" on 60s At least 35". I'll stay at 33" with the rover stuff now that I've "invested" money in them. I was trying to say If I'd have done Dana 60s or even the Toy conversion I'd be on 35-36" now. Sometimes I don't write so good.:flipoff2:

[red90rover]

If you are on a bugdet...

Put a Detroit in the rear with aftermarket shafts. Rovertracks is a good price (Revor on here).

Stock shafts won't take 33s.

Then watch out for the CVs breaking they are quite fragile in these particular axles. The Longtracks Cvs (see other out of control thread) are what you want there. Then you should be fine for 33s.

[spork2367]

gotcha on the 60's. i'm not really on a budget, as the other things will just have to wait until i have the money. i'm just running stock tires on the stock shafts with the ARB, and really only on low traction stuff, not rocks. thanks for the heads up on the stock shafts though. i'm not going to put big tires on until i can afford to do everything and do it right. i'm eventually looking for minimal lift (2 inches) with lots of fender cutting and 33's. thanks for the info.

[aloharover]

Stock shafts won't take 33s.


Do you mean with a locker they won't or not at all?

Very funny statement of you mean at all. Because if you look at open difs, then
9x16 are closer to 35" then 33" and the "stock" stuff holds up to them.
I ran 33" tires in wet muddy terrain for 4 years with no problems.
And stock fronts have held up fun with Q76x16 in the mud.

[FiveO Disco]

gotcha on the 60's. i'm not really on a budget, as the other things will just have to wait until i have the money. i'm just running stock tires on the stock shafts with the ARB, and really only on low traction stuff, not rocks. thanks for the heads up on the stock shafts though. i'm not going to put big tires on until i can afford to do everything and do it right. i'm eventually looking for minimal lift (2 inches) with lots of fender cutting and 33's. thanks for the info.

Disclaimer: I'm no expert here especially compared to the folks on this board.

So with that out of the way here goes. I ran stock shafts for several years locked front and rear with 4:11s. They held up until I attempted some large difficult rocks. I broke the rear long side. My driving style (or lack of skill:flipoff2: ) had more to do with it than anything. If you run alot of slick stuff like snow and mud you may be fine. I kinda get the multiple terrain here, snow, some mud and rocks so it was probaly inevitable I would brake. I put in a set of Keiths rear shafts and all is good. After x-mas I hope to buy his f CVs and front shafts.

My point is if I could do it again I would strongly consider 60s Or the toy conversion. Hind sight is 20/20. I can't complain about my set up now and it will be even better when the new long tracks go in.

You may have better luck with 33" on a 2" lift with trimming than I did. But I tried it a day and went 3" with new arms and links DC drivesafts etc.

Just my very humble opinion, Cheers Andy

[red90rover]

Do you mean with a locker they won't or not at all?

Very funny statement of you mean at all. Because if you look at open difs, then
9x16 are closer to 35" then 33" and the "stock" stuff holds up to them.
I ran 33" tires in wet muddy terrain for 4 years with no problems.
And stock fronts have held up fun with Q76x16 in the mud.

Well dead stock, the diffs will blow up first, so you normally need aftermarket diffs to break the shafts. People kill them on stock 29" tires. You need to try harder. I am only talking about late model full floating axles here, BTW.

IMO, there is little to be gained with locakers in mud anyway other than bigger holes.

[luvs2getmuddy]

I have a Q. Looking at Rovertracks, it seems pretty much all they carry is the 24 spline stuff. I have a 1990 RRC, where owuld i look at getting Axle shafts and CV's.
Mind you, I am still in the process of lifting my rig, then getting Detroit oout back, and prolly won't run larger than 32'.

[DChapman]

I have a Q. Looking at Rovertracks, it seems pretty much all they carry is the 24 spline stuff. I have a 1990 RRC, where owuld i look at getting Axle shafts and CV's.
Mind you, I am still in the process of lifting my rig, then getting Detroit oout back, and prolly won't run larger than 32'.

When you upgrade your diff's, you will likly convert to 24 spline. At least, you should. 10-spline stuff is good for boat ancors or, in some places, yard art.

[KevinNY]

I have a Q. Looking at Rovertracks, it seems pretty much all they carry is the 24 spline stuff. I have a 1990 RRC, where owuld i look at getting Axle shafts and CV's.
Mind you, I am still in the process of lifting my rig, then getting Detroit oout back, and prolly won't run larger than 32'.

You will need stub axles and hubs off a Disco or newer RR to fit hd 24 spline rears. Easy to find off a parts truck.

[SeaRover]

You will need stub axles and hubs off a Disco or newer RR to fit hd 24 spline rears. Easy to find off a parts truck.

yes - easier way to think about this: you need ABS stub-axles and hubs from RRC or D1. If your '90 happened to catch ABS then you are already set.


p.s. check the FS board :grinpimp:

[luvs2getmuddy]

What is one sure way to find out wether or not I have ABS? I mean I have never felt pulsating from the pedal, and never had the wheels lock either...
Looking at the Master brake cylinder, I don't see it saying ABS anywhere, but it is huge with what looks like a pump. Any sure way to check??

Also why is the 24 spline better than 10? I was left with the impression it was the other way around?
Do any companies make lockers for 10 spline?

Edit: Detroit makes them in 10 spline. why would i need to upgrade?

thanks?

[KevinNY]

Because your 10 spline axles will snap like Joe Theismans leg with a detroit in there.

ABS stubs are the short ones, non abs are longer with wider bearing spacing.

[Slunnie]

The 10 spline are smaller in diameter, have a deeper spline cut and wont take the torque that the larger 24 spline shafts will.

[spork2367]

stop hijacking my thread number one, and number two, if you can't identify a vehicle with ABS and one without, you don't need to be here.

[luvs2getmuddy]

ABS stubs are the short ones, non abs are longer with wider bearing spacing.

Sorry, do you mind being a little more specific? What 'stubs"? Where do I check. Sorry for the newb Q.
I can take pictures if need be to help identify.
BTW Mine is a 1990. february buidl date I believe. It is my understanding they put the ABS in 1990 for the first time.
stop hijacking my thread number one, and number two, if you can't identify a vehicle with ABS and one without, you don't need to be here.

1) sorry for hijacking, but it is somewhat related

2) I am sure you weren't born knowing everything(As seen by this thread), so Please don't be a dick.
Everyone has to learn one way or another, some of the good fella's here don;t mind sharing their knowledge to newb's like me.

[spork2367]

the axle question is related, i don't mind that. identifying whether or not you have ABS is not related. i'm not trying to be a dick, but pirate4x4 isn't really the place to learn that kind of stuff, maybe in the newb forum if anywhere. try google'ing ABS or go to www.howstuffworks.com. if you can't identify an ABS setup, you are in no way ready to swap axle shafts.

[luvs2getmuddy]

the axle question is related, i don't mind that. identifying whether or not you have ABS is not related. i'm not trying to be a dick, but pirate4x4 isn't really the place to learn that kind of stuff, maybe in the newb forum if anywhere. try google'ing ABS or go to www.howstuffworks.com. if you can't identify an ABS setup, you are in no way ready to swap axle shafts.

Believe me, the LAST thing I will be doing is swapping axles. Just learning here and there and everywhere.
Just trying to answer the Q that arose from your thread, which is good for me to read as well as I will be locking my truck in the future (hoepfully)

[Slunnie]

stop hijacking my thread number one, and number two, if you can't identify a vehicle with ABS and one without, you don't need to be here.

the axle question is related, i don't mind that. identifying whether or not you have ABS is not related. i'm not trying to be a dick, but pirate4x4 isn't really the place to learn that kind of stuff, maybe in the newb forum if anywhere. try google'ing ABS or go to www.howstuffworks.com. if you can't identify an ABS setup, you are in no way ready to swap axle shafts.

I agree.

Now back to.... do I put the locker in the front, or in the back. :flipoff2:

[bowtracer]

IMO, there is little to be gained with locakers in mud anyway other than bigger holes.[/QUOTE]

ah no!:flipoff2:
rear!