These?

AFR 210cc SBC Racing Cylinder Head

These reasonably priced AFR Race Ready 210cc intake port small block Chevy angle plug cylinder heads have 100% CNC ported intakes With 100% CNC ported 66cc combustion chambers and 80cc exhaust ports with a 3/4” thick head deck (ideal for nitrous or blower applications). Standard valves are 2.080 intake and 1.600 exhaust with AFR’s hardened ductile iron interlocking valve seats. The exceptional flow characteristics, 23º valve angle, and standard valve spacing make this the perfect head for 350 to 400 cid engines in bracket drag cars, sportsman oval trackers, and highly modified street class cars operating between 3000 and 7500 rpm (higher rpm ranges possible depending on combination of parts). No special parts are required.


Or would you buy these?

AFR 227cc SBC Racing Cylinder Head

High flowing AFR 227cc intake port small block Chevy angle plug cylinder heads have 100% CNC ported intakes with 100% CNC ported 66cc combustion chambers and 80cc exhaust ports with a 3/4” thick head deck (ideal for nitrous or blower applications). Standard valves are 2.100 intake and 1.600 exhaust with AFR’s hardened ductile iron interlocking valve seats. The 227 has 60/40 valve spacing and piston valve pockets should be checked. The exceptional flow characteristics and 23º valve angle make this the perfect head for 350 to 434 cid engines in drag cars, sprint cars, and late model oval trackers operating from 4500 rpm and up. AFR offset stud girdles are the only special parts required. Some applications require shaft mount rockers for durability and reliability of valve train components. Not recommended for street use, unless shaft mount rocker is used.


They are both the same price, the only difference is the intake volume on one is 210cc's and the other is 227cc's. Also bigger valves in the 227's. Should I get the bigger ones just because?

Is it going to hurt anything to go bigger? With the small cam I am using, I wont be utilizing all they can flow anyway, I just want big enough so in the future, if I want to I can cam it up later.

Cam specs .512/.528 hydraulic roller 112LSA and 220/228 duration.

This is for a mud-drag application, low end power doesnt really matter.....

Nice pictures. What are you doing with this motor?

Go get this months Hot Rod Magazine. Article on the new AFR heads. They are not available yet, but will be soon. Thay made 615 HP with a 383 on pump gas. I'd go with the smallest heads unless you are building a race motor. You will give up a lot of power in the lower and mid range with the bigger heads. Maybe gain some on the top, but not likely with the smaller cam you have.:smokin:

Nice pictures. What are you doing with this motor?

Go get this months Hot Rod Magazine. Article on the new AFR heads. They are not available yet, but will be soon. Thay made 615 HP with a 383 on pump gas. I'd go with the smallest heads unless you are building a race motor. You will give up a lot of power in the lower and mid range with the bigger heads. Maybe gain some on the top, but not likely with the smaller cam you have.:smokin:




Just racing it. It turns about 7000 now with the Dart Iron Eagle 180's I have now. Upping the compression with smaller chamber sizes is my goal really, but as expensive as these heads are, I want to buy the right set and not regret it later.

I guess this means you decided not on the other heads you were asking about a while back? get the bigger ones and a cam to go with them.:D Or you could just put a big block in it:smokin:

I guess this means you decided not on the other heads you were asking about a while back? get the bigger ones and a cam to go with them.:D Or you could just put a big block in it:smokin:


Those were Edelbrocks I was asking about last time, after reading about these AFR's, I will spend the little extra for hopefully a better flowing head.

I like the small block, too hard to get a BB in a Jeep Wrangler too.

If it's strictly a horsepower motor and you're not worrying about lowend torque I would go with the 227's. They will like more cam than what you have, but you already know that.

If it's strictly a horsepower motor and you're not worrying about lowend torque I would go with the 227's. They will like more cam than what you have, but you already know that.



Will it run any worse though?

These?

[img]AFR 210cc SBC Racing Cylinder Head
This is for a mud-drag application, low end power doesnt really matter.....

If I were to choose either of the 2, I'd go with the 210.
When you say Mud Drags, Are you shifting? running 150' or 300'? Peak torque #'s is what I would build for in a 383. With that small of a hyd. roller I would maybe look into a set of the Edelbrock E-Tec 200's. Those things have super mid-flow #'s.

I would imagine you would lose some mid-range torque, but I can't say for sure. You should call AFR and talk to a tech guy.
http://www.nastyz28.com/forum/showthread.php?t=71913 There is a few specs on the 383 that Joe Sherman built and had impressive numbers with, and he used a 195 head. Tony Mamo, the R&D and sales guy for AFR posts on a few boards, includind Speed Talk. Go over there and search and read around. They have so much sbc head tech that your brain will hurt. http://speedtalk.com/forum/index.php

I say go for the 210's unless you want to get more parts to upgrade the cam and valves.

Those were Edelbrocks I was asking about last time, after reading about these AFR's, I will spend the little extra for hopefully a better flowing head.

I like the small block, too hard to get a BB in a Jeep Wrangler too.I can stuff that Fucker in there! I can get the custom headers made too.:D

If I were to choose either of the 2, I'd go with the 210.
When you say Mud Drags, Are you shifting? running 150' or 300'? Peak torque #'s is what I would build for in a 383. With that small of a hyd. roller I would maybe look into a set of the Edelbrock E-Tec 200's. Those things have super mid-flow #'s.


2nd gear, wide open, 150-200feet tracks usually.

I would imagine you would lose some mid-range torque, but I can't say for sure. You should call AFR and talk to a tech guy.
http://www.nastyz28.com/forum/showthread.php?t=71913 There is a few specs on the 383 that Joe Sherman built and had impressive numbers with, and he used a 195 head. Tony Mamo, the R&D and sales guy for AFR posts on a few boards, includind Speed Talk. Go over there and search and read around. They have so much sbc head tech that your brain will hurt. http://speedtalk.com/forum/index.php



I called AFR, the guy recommended 195's, I most likely wont keep this cam forever but really dont want to dump another $300 in it right now until I see how its going to run. I like to change 1 part at a time. 210's is as small as I'm buying I think, 195's will work but I hate to spend the money and wish I had gotten bigger later.

I can stuff that Fucker in there! I can get the custom headers made too.:D



:D Uh no!

Looks like there'll be a nice set of 195 AFR's on sale here in the not to distant future.

You need to KNOW what you WANT it to do and THAT will dictate what you want run....or else we'll see something like "My loss your gain". Seriously, where might you end up with this setup?

I called AFR, the guy recommended 195's, I most likely wont keep this cam forever but really dont want to dump another $300 in it right now until I see how its going to run. I like to change 1 part at a time. 210's is as small as I'm buying I think, 195's will work but I hate to spend the money and wish I had gotten bigger later.


All be damed, the AFR tech guy said the same thing I did. It's almost like I've done this before. I like him.:smokin:

Looks like there'll be a nice set of 195 AFR's on sale here in the not to distant future.

You need to KNOW what you WANT it to do and THAT will dictate what you want run....or else we'll see something like "My loss your gain". Seriously, where might you end up with this setup?



Dunno. I'm in a vacuum pulling class right now, supposed to be stock motors only, shhhh dont tell on me. Anyway, if I can get to where I'm winning consisitantly with this setup, I will cam away and forget vacuum and just go for as much power as I can. If that happens I will most likely swap out the 383 short block for a 427 or slightly larger shortblock.

All be damed, the AFR tech guy said the same thing I did. It's almost like I've done this before. I like him.:smokin:



Pump gas? I'm hoping to run race fuel. Is that dumb? Some one told me higher compression will pull more vacuum allowing me to run more cam eventually.

If you are going to run the vacumm class and they will let you run aluminum, go with the E-TEC 200's, They work check the numbers. If your even thinking about a 427 unlimited motor, the best bang for the $$$, is a Jegs 220 head. I have made over 500hp/500lb. ft with the E-TECS under 6500RPM, 536 @ 6800. With the Jegs heads, I have made over 630Hp, with a solid cam.

If you are going to run the vacumm class and they will let you run aluminum, go with the E-TEC 200's, They work check the numbers. If your even thinking about a 427 unlimited motor, the best bang for the $$$, is a Jegs 220 head. I have made over 500hp/500lb. ft with the E-TECS under 6500RPM, 536 @ 6800. With the Jegs heads, I have made over 630Hp, with a solid cam.

I dont know if they will "LET" me run aluminum, but I will ;)

What cams are you talking about using with those numbers?


I WANT to pull vacuum that is my only concern other than making gobs of power.

How much vacum do you need? I've not heard of higher compresion causing there to be more vacum. More compression will make more power with the right fuel, but its not a huge gain. Race fuel in a motor that doesn't need it usually causes a slight HP loss. Remember- "octane" is basically the fuels ability to resist combustion.
Experience has taught me that the cam specs and the cam timing has the most influence on vacum. Ignition timing will also have an influence. If this is truly a race only deal, you could lock out the advance at about 37 and that will create a bit more vacum. My 2 cents, hope it helps.:smokin:

Motors are my thing. I am new to wheeling hard, but I have built motors for a while. For what it sounds like you want I would go with a set of AFR 195's. They will give better top end that your iron eagles and better mid range to as they have better flow across the board.

I have made 500+ with the AFR heads and a hydro roller around 540/558 on a 110 lobe seperation. These cams were custom, but not much more than a stock roller. Call Comp. These will pull desent vacum to. I made a 400 with these heads and a little more cam that put out 540 LBS and 590Hp at 6700 rpm. Mean...

[QUOTE=Badburn;6404449]Experience has taught me that the cam specs and the cam timing has the most influence on vacum. Ignition timing will also have an influence. [QUOTE]

Absolutely true. Overlap kills vacuum, affected also by your intake choice, dual plane vs. single. It's relevant to the valve sizing chosen to feed the cylinder volume. Small valves in relation to the cylinder cubes can use far more overlap than large valves. Bottom line, the smaller the valves in relation to the cubic inch, the more overlap can be used.
Small hydraulic roller.....consider the 210's, and in time consider changing the rocker ratios to add lift to your existing combo. I've witnessed almost "stupid" amounts of power from those Etecs.