Increasing sidewall height of an existing structure???

[AthlonAJ]

Ran into a guy I know in construction and got to talking about how much I hate my ceiling height (8'-sucks big). He suggested I jack up the whole structure and build some sidewall extensions to get the height I want. I honestly have never heard of this, blame my sheltered life, but seriously, how do-able?

Some details of the shop which was built before I bought this place. It's 2x4 sidewalls, concrete floor, tin siding/roof and fully insulated with wood interior walls. One window that I really could care less about, 3 garage doors. He said obviously there would be some reframing for the entry door and window(optional). Wiring I'd have to extend and lower. Garage doors I could add more track and an additional panel (more height there is a HUGE bonus). I'd probably get rid of the one side garage door as I never use it anyways. If it's possible I'd like to raise it a minimum of 4', preferably 6'. I'm guessing this extension would be 2x6 construction.

Labor isn't much of a factor as it would be him and I with a few other guys I know. So really it "sounds" like a good alternative to building a whole new shop! But...anyone done it?

[Landslide]

How large is your garage?

It's possible, but I would raise it more than that. I have a 9.5' to the bottom of my rafters and I which I had at least 12'. So if your gonna do it, do it big...

Main thing would be raising the whole roof structure safely. I've seen it done using a crane when they moved an old church but that'll be $$$. I don't see why you couldn't secure a bunch of jacks to the walls and ceiling and raise it up slowly/evenly. Have your extension panels already built so all you have to do is slip them in as soon as you’re high enough.

It won't be a walk in the park but do your home work and it should come out ok.

Oh and 2x4 extensions sould be fine - bolt the new section to the exsisting wall. 2x4 top plate - exsisting wall, to the bottom 2x4 on the new extension wall. Tie all the new top sections together and it'll be soild as it is now.

[BRAD D]

you could jack it up and makee a brick or concrete footing arount the bottom.

[AthlonAJ]

It's roughly 30x40. I'd really like to go 6' with it if I do it to make it worthwhile. My buddy just built a new shop and has 14' ceilings, perfect for what I want but not so high as to make problems with heating. It's funny because the florescent light fixtures I have now are meant for a higher ceiling (came out of a factory) so light output would actually be better. Thinking about the electrical with all the outlets being 6' higher I think the easiest way would be to make a bunch of drops out of conduit. Take the wall plate and outlet right out of the existing box, screw a shallow box right over that to the wall. Then use either plastic or metal conduit for the drop. Makes things a lot easier. About the only real PITA for electrical I see is extending to the main panel as I need to keep that at the same level it's at now.

I don't really like the idea of blocks to raise it just for the fact of it being poor insulation and cost. Was something like -13 today.

[1track]

it isn't really all that hard, just time comsuming setting up the cribbing and jacks and making sure everything is square. Dad has done this before several times (he's a contractor) and it takes a lot of patience, prepwork, and a slow easy hand at jacking it up. With a 6 foot raise, you will need to jack some, recrib, jack, recrib,etc so as to not have it all up in the air tetering. You could easily have it done in a weekend if you have all the supplies.

You may need to look at you wall struture too. Some building codes require thincker walls for height requirements.

Cory

[AthlonAJ]

Definitely a good idea then to have experienced guys on hand. Thanks!

Building codes? I bet I could pack hay bales under the walls and sit them on that and no one would say a word. Pretty much non-existent except for insurance.

[1track]

a-hah, didn't realize you were in Iowa, duh. Yeah for rural settings building codes don't really apply. I know our old place you could do anything and get away with it, but in Louisville, they will nit pick everything just to fine you.

[Landslide]

Just don't do it on a windy day :eek:

[uschristys]

dont use jacks u will kill your self use a damb fork lift just brace the walls around the door openings u said u have wooden interior walls should be sturdy if at least 1/2 plywood. real easy just make sure your plate is loose first,this is done all the time and is quite common,we make sure after the framing goes back under we stager the new siding both interior and exterior to help support.think like u will put it up on stilts easy

[AthlonAJ]

A forklift? As in one? How the hell would that work...let alone 2 or even 3. I guess I don't see what you're thinking here.

When I'm talking about jacks, I'm not referring to shop jack you know.:shaking:

[uschristys]

with a boom fork or just a strait up lift u could do it with 2 and i do belive my FLOORJACK WILL DO 6' high what the hell are u thinking, move to the gulf u see it done all the time, thats right your from iowa! u could do it in a weekend my crew could do it in a day. get real its not that hard,have you seen houses moved they dont have cribing just going up with house jacks but its a shop and you can drive from the inside! just get some beer and insurance and u will be good and have some fun that u can look back and say damb that was fun

[Travis Waldher]

Every time I have seen a house jacked up, they used hydraulics and cribbing.

I've NEVER seen nor heard of a forklift manuever.

[AIRZUKI]

I once moved a entire carport with a 753 Bobcat in one shot... drove underneath, lift up until it balances, drive away with carport ...:D


house raising companies have balanced hydraulic systems to do this properly
though

[BPRCJ]

We raise homes all the time. FORKLIFT????? Well maybe, with some I-Beams and a few lifts. I would use hydraulics and cribing. You really dont want to tweek the structure. LIft it a slow and even as you can. Then it s just reframing new walls. Two to three days with a good crew that knows what they are doing.

[uschristys]

its not a house its a small shop open floor plan why not make it easy cocrete floors to drive on just going up. find a link to post a jack that will go 6'2" oh ya lots of cribing to and see how pratical it is, call a rental yard for the advice and see what they would recomend or a contrator that wants all of your money do it how ever you want but mine or my clients i would want cheap and easy and RIGHT and that would be my way, how ever you would do it good luck

[ironpig70]

never unbolte a roof or walls and jacked them up. but i have jacked up a whole house after a fire to redo a foundation. slow and steady is the moto

[85 Chevota]

We just did one last summer on a 24x32 shop. It was the third one i have done. I also lifted my own house and built a new basement.

First thing you wanna do is remove the bottom 2 feet of drywall all the way around the walls. Lag screw a horizontal 2x6 rail around the perimeter directly to the studs about 2" down from the drywall. Three 3" x 3/16" lag screws into every stud. Bridge across any man door and vehicle door openings at the same time. On top of this rail you will place 10' long 2x6 corner braces at all 4 corners to keep the corners square when lifting. Now you need cross ties to keep the walls from spreading. These can be made from 2x6's as well. Space them every 6' or so running them in the same direction as the trusses. You may need to use 2 or more lapped at the center to span the width of your shop. These attach to the sidewall studs directly under the rail you attached earlier. If they need to be lapped at the center, make sure they overlap by a few feet.

Unbolt the walls from the slab/footing/whatever. Now grab 6 jacks (floorjack, hilift, bottle jack, whatever), and some blocking and get ready to lift. You can lift directly off the crossties as close to the walls as you can. Go slow and keep it cribbed up.

We always have laid block to make up the height. You could use concrete block, or frame a 2x6 wall section. The building inspector will make the call on attachment details and any reinforcing that he deems neccesary.

The last one we did took 2 full days for 3 guys to do, not including the finishing details such as drywall, insulation, and electrical.

[AthlonAJ]

its not a house its a small shop open floor plan why not make it easy cocrete floors to drive on just going up. find a link to post a jack that will go 6'2" oh ya lots of cribing to and see how pratical it is, call a rental yard for the advice and see what they would recomend or a contrator that wants all of your money do it how ever you want but mine or my clients i would want cheap and easy and RIGHT and that would be my way, how ever you would do it good luck

What's the name of the company you work for so I can make sure to tell my friends to RUN when they here your name. Any clue as to how much a fully insulated, steel exterior, wood interior 30x40 shop would weigh? And you really think you could lift that with 1 or 2 and not tweak it all to shit...you're full of shit. I gotta run this by some of the local pros, they'll get a kick out of this one.:shaking:

[AthlonAJ]

We just did one last summer on a 24x32 shop. It was the third one i have done. I also lifted my own house and built a new basement.

First thing you wanna do is remove the bottom 2 feet of drywall all the way around the walls. Lag screw a horizontal 2x6 rail around the perimeter directly to the studs about 2" down from the drywall. Three 3" x 3/16" lag screws into every stud. Bridge across any man door and vehicle door openings at the same time. On top of this rail you will place 10' long 2x6 corner braces at all 4 corners to keep the corners square when lifting. Now you need cross ties to keep the walls from spreading. These can be made from 2x6's as well. Space them every 6' or so running them in the same direction as the trusses. You may need to use 2 or more lapped at the center to span the width of your shop. These attach to the sidewall studs directly under the rail you attached earlier. If they need to be lapped at the center, make sure they overlap by a few feet.

Unbolt the walls from the slab/footing/whatever. Now grab 6 jacks (floorjack, hilift, bottle jack, whatever), and some blocking and get ready to lift. You can lift directly off the crossties as close to the walls as you can. Go slow and keep it cribbed up.

We always have laid block to make up the height. You could use concrete block, or frame a 2x6 wall section. The building inspector will make the call on attachment details and any reinforcing that he deems neccesary.

The last one we did took 2 full days for 3 guys to do, not including the finishing details such as drywall, insulation, and electrical.

Thanks for the detailed info! We were just talking this weekend about going with a 2x6 wall section instead but there is the matter of that loss of 4" of shop space...oooooo..lol. A man's shop is like a woman's purse though. No matter how big it is, you'll find enough shit to fill it in no time flat.:flipoff2:

[rockdog57]

If you do this, I would suggest that you block up the six foot or if you do frame it. Make sure you put strong back bracing to tie the lower walls to the uppers. The shop won't be structurally sound without the vertical strongback bracing if you frame the lower section. Framed homes for years and my dad was a general contractor. Not criticizing, I just was always taught that its better to over build than to be sorry later.

[Landslide]

its not a house its a small shop open floor plan why not make it easy cocrete floors to drive on just going up. find a link to post a jack that will go 6'2" oh ya lots of cribing to and see how pratical it is, call a rental yard for the advice and see what they would recomend or a contrator that wants all of your money do it how ever you want but mine or my clients i would want cheap and easy and RIGHT and that would be my way, how ever you would do it good luck

Fawk man... You give me a headache trying to comprehend your dribble:shaking:

[Dave_Lucas]

Silly question from a non construction guy but…


Wouldn’t it be easier to put the extensions on top of the walls instead of under? That way you would only need to lift the roof and would not have to mess with the door openings, windows or any of that stuff?

:confused:

[Dave_Lucas]

Like this?

[MT4Runner]

Yes and no.

A lot of the weight of your structure is in the roof. You now have to lift that weight from 8' off the ground to 14' off the ground; instead of 0' to 6'. This would be the biggest argument against it. If you have access to a crane, it would by far be the easiest way!!

Many of your electrical lines will run through the ceiling/attic space. Plan to rewire _everything_. If you lift from the bottom, you may only need to extend things at the service (put a small step ladder by your electrical box--ha!!).

Doors are easy--just add framing above the opening. Windows could be left, or moved down.

[De Ranged]

how about another cowboy approch.... I have done this on farm buildings before :smokin: use a 30 ton digger, it will lift 6-7ton at reach if the tracks are in the right place and cost is a qauter what it costs for a crane :eek:

brace across under the gable on your roof where you plan to lift from and use plenty of 2 1/2ton tiedowns, they are cheap and you can ratchet with these to adjust balance and help keep the roof straight, then with low revs and on the softest setting lift very gently...
To line it up a couple of ropes off the corners and your all good

The easyest one I've done was a steel framed shed, the farmer had got extentions premade to bolt in place took 3hrs to do :smokin: he didn't clad the gap as he wanted air flow to help dry hay

Cheers Reece

[TLCObsession]

get 6 20 ton jacks from HF and have at it. There is good advice in the posts above. I did it twice. You do need to have some shear overlap, so if you are going to go up 6' takeoff the exterior siding another 2' so you can use 8' sheets of plywood.

With 6 20 ton jacks, some cribbing and some 2x6 bracing it is an easy job.

I am going to be doing it again on a smaller scale to my boathouse - likely next summer.

[Landslide]

Like this?

That's pretty much how I would do it, especially if it's built like a pole barn with 6x6's for up-rights like mine. I really don't see how a short extension on top of the existing walls would jeopardize the integrity of the strength of the structure. So long as it's all tied together it should be fine. You're on the right track checking things out and doing youre home work.

[AthlonAJ]

If the walls were open I'd probably do just that, lift the roof. But everything is enclosed so there would be a massive amount of tear out.

Rockdog what do you mean by strong back bracing? Is that basically the same as TLCObsession is talking about? Really do appreciate any and all opinions.

Mentioned it to my buddy today and he says, "why don't you just build a new shop in the lot next door"...oh yeah easy for him to say. He just built a new 40x60 shop with 14'high ceilings, 12' doors, radiant floor heat...just to work on his precious turn left only dirt track car. Dildo.

[rockdog57]

Strongback bracing serves the same purpose as he describes. But is 2x4's nailed together in an L shape. Then nailed to the wall studs vertically. You need some kind of shear strength to keep your two walls tied together. Picture the studs in the wall now. They run continuously from sill plate to top plate. So they have good strength laterally. (As in strong wind pushing sideways against them.) If you join two walls in the middle, you need something to resist that side shear from strong wind, etc. I'm not to good at explaining things. I hope that makes some sense to you. You could also use steel angle lagged to the studs or something similar, but you don't want to go to all that work and have the wind knock your shop to the ground. I'm not a structural engineer, but I framed buildings for a lot of years.

[MT4Runner]

Think of the joint at the top of your knee wall as a ...knee. You don't want the knee to bend.

[rockdog57]

Think of the joint at the top of your knee wall as a ...knee. You don't want the knee to bend.

Exactly, perfect description!

[TLCObsession]

BTW - If your foundation is level and you want to go up 4 feet, you could pre-make all your wall sections. I would make a corner section that would allow me to lift from (for example) 6 feet from the corners. Have a diagonal brace across the corner that is a bit further out. Get your building up, tip the corner section in (to get it over the foundation bolts) and lower it down.

With good planning and 2 - 4 people, you could get it in the air and back down in about 2 hours max.

Jim

[PTSchram]

Once again, you guys are making it WAY harder than it really is.

Floor jacks, some cribbing, etc. it's a done deal!

Get it awn!

[AthlonAJ]

Think of the joint at the top of your knee wall as a ...knee. You don't want the knee to bend.

Ahhh...ok. Gotta put it into simple terms for my simple mind.

[stock 87]

You guys are all nuts!!! I run a Construction Co. Two guys two, three hours MY ASS!! Were not talking a tree fort. This is a 40x30 Building. If your plans are to almost double the wall height by just building knee walls your out of your mind.

You would have to run studs, at least every other one the full height of the wall. Then in about 3-4 places run permanent braces from the new joint in the wall to the roof truss. This should make your building hold up to increased wind loads.

I'm sure I,ll get shit for this one but I'd just get used to what you have.

[TLCObsession]

Well I wasn't talking about doubling it. I can tell you that local code (based on IBC says that any knee wall more than 4ft must be built/framed as if it were a second story. Using plywood inside and out will make the connection plenty strong. I would use a 3" nail pattern on the edges like an ABP.

BTW - I was not saying that the whole job would only take 2 hours. I was saying that if you prep (strip siding, do your bracing and build your knee walls ahead of time that you can lift and set your garage back down in 2 hours. That was based on my own experience of having done it a few times.

[AthlonAJ]

Plans are always subject to change....especially when it's 2 degrees outside and snow on the ground. He stopped over last night to look at things and we pretty much decided to figure it out based on 4' even. That will just simplify a lot for both of us. He already has panels for the one garage door, same style and everything. Two of those measure out at 41" so we'd just need to fill in the top space and drop the tracks down. He's got the longer tracks for both doors so I'd just have to find 2 extra panels for the other which he thinks he can find pretty easy.

Have to wait until this summer but that gives me plenty of time to consider all options. Sure a heckuva lot cheaper than adding onto the front of it with a high bay area.

[PTSchram]

You guys are all nuts!!!

LOL, if you think I'm nuts, you should meet the guy I used to work for! He was the guy who had me run a chainsaw around the roof of a single story house and then had me jack the roof off and crib it with railroad ties while I built new walls to add a second story.

The work was done over a three-day weekend so we could do it without a building permit!

Three of us had the second story added by late Monday of the three-day weekend.

When I replaced the walls on my rental house garage, I did it alone over a three-day weekend and passed the inspection the following week.

[tonka22]

some of you are hacks. If your gonna lift it lag the new section on and sheet inside and out with plywood. the best way would be the 6 jacks. But remember to have temp blocking, cause floor jacks don't have a 4' stroke.

[actionpaintball]

Just do some research on raising houses...