Ok, did a search, and my conclusion is" Yes a 1600 16 valve is the way to go no matter what the cost or time down". Point being its not my rig, its a college kids daily driver, and it needs a motor over the weekend. Oh, and his budget is about $125....

So, that being said I have what I belive to be a swift 1.3L short block. Its 1298cc, and is designated as a G13b engine. It has a long waterpipe out of the water pump, leading to the theory it was a sideways mounted motor...It also have flat top pistons with small valve reliefs identical to a samurai. What I think this is is a 90+ samurai fuel injected block basically. Its Crank and Rods look identical to a standard samurai cast crank and rods.

So, anyone know if we can bolt on a carborated samurai head and accesories? If it is a swift motor, what should it have for a crank and rods?

I run a swift(1298)block with my 1990 samurai head, intake, throttlebody and all the rest of the sami components so it is possible. I'm no expert on engine building but the answer to you question is yes you can run the setup in question. Use the swift crank and rods that are already in it. Get a second opinion on this though. Hope this helps :trooper:

Since the subject got brought up I no that the 1.6 has more torque but if what I heard about the swift 1.3 they produce alot more horespower So if this is true as long as your rig is geared
diffs and t-case wont a 1.3 EFI work just as well?

I don't get it.....

You want to take a 1298cc bottom end then put a carb choked sami head on it? You do realize that you are going to end up with a just another Sami motor, don't you? The block is 1298cc (with a little more compression), it does not matter what it came out of, the Sami head (mainly cam) is a spud! It's a small torque setup. Swift's HP came from RRRRs, which was done with the head! If you take away the head, you take away the RRRRs and HP..... :(

Now, if you want to make a screeming 1.3. I'd like to see someone plop a 1.6 8V head on the 1298 block, and put in a serious cam! The bigger valves and intake should really let that motor breathe! :D That would be a HOT 1.3 :p

But a 1298 carb motor.... That I don't get...

my friend is running a swift motor in his sammy, it works great. carbed with a little head work and a cam, he would consistantly hit 7k+ and had quite a bit of power

personally i would see if you could get the swift injection. i heard the newer swifts are distributor-less EFI, good stuff if ya ask me

I've got swift 1324 with a 1298 head. The engine came out of a FWD car. I changed the oil pan and pickup, the water pump neck, and I pulled the flex plate and installed my flywheel. I also had to change the water pump because the car was set up for a serp belt. I've also had the head shaved 20 thou and installed 1.6 exhaust valves and a large cam (Thanks Dave :D ) I am very happy with it. I run 33's with the 3.73's still in the diffs and I can still run 65mph on I-15. If I had to do it over again I would. However I WANT a 16v 1.6. I ran with a guy in Moab with this setup and he had power to spare.

Oh I also have the 4.1 t-case gears so my high range is a tad bit lower.
The 1.3 has alot of potential. I'm thinking about building a screamer and putting it in my wifes sami.
I forgot to mention I used the sami's intake and I still run the factory carb. F.I. is in the works.

Generally speaking, there are 2 different versions of the 1.3 (both 1298cc) used in the Swift: The regular one, and the GTi. The blocks are the same as the Samurai's but the pistons are different in both for different compression. Obviously, the 16-valve GTi pistons are very high compression and have 4-valve reliefs cut in them. You can bolt all the stock Samurai goodies to either shortblock.

I have the GTi bottom end (which is substantially beefier than any Suzuki 1600 or 1300) with an AAPA Go-Fast head. The reason I didn't use the 8-valve 1600 head is because the ports are too big for the smaller displacement, and thus hurt low-end torque. The exhaust valves are the significant bottleneck in the Samurai head, so one of the Go-Fast head's modifications is larger valves.

So yes, I am using an 8-valve head (milled down 20 thousandths) over the GTi's 16-valve pistons. No big deal, as long as I keep a good timing belt on there. With a Weber 32/32 downdraft, I regularly peg my tach and keep my foot pinned to the floor. This motor laughs at 9000rpm. I can rev the snot out of it and its power curve doesn't seem to top out. The torque cam also makes a BIG improvement in off-idle torque, perfect for rockcrawling.

With bigger and substantially heavier tires than my buddy's 8-valve 1600 equipped Samurai has, my little 1298 blows the doors off his on the road. I have just a bit less off-idle torque than his 1600 (which has the Isky torque cam) but I have about double the RPMs to work with, and much lower gearing. Not that his setup doesn't work well, but he's wishing he had my setup now. He can run about 80mph tops on the highway, I can do about 85mph. This is with my frame about 13 inches higher off the ground than stock, 400+lbs of wheel/tire, and all the super-aerodynamic off-road goodies mounted. :D

The best thing is that my motor weighs no more than stock. 85lb long block, baby! And much cheaper and simpler than a 16-valve 1600. After over 10,000 miles on it, I'm very happy with this combo.

Originally posted by okcrawler
I don't get it.....

You want to take a 1298cc bottom end then put a carb choked sami head on it? You do realize that you are going to end up with a just another Sami motor, don't you? The block is 1298cc (with a little more compression), it does not matter what it came out of, the Sami head (mainly cam) is a spud! It's a small torque setup. Swift's HP came from RRRRs, which was done with the head! If you take away the head, you take away the RRRRs and HP..... :(

Now, if you want to make a screeming 1.3. I'd like to see someone plop a 1.6 8V head on the 1298 block, and put in a serious cam! The bigger valves and intake should really let that motor breathe! :D That would be a HOT 1.3 :p

But a 1298 carb motor.... That I don't get...

Mark

you have to use a carb, if you want to use the 16 valve head and anything other than a stock cam....stock EFI will not run any other cam. the GTI head has high rpm cams.....so we have went to Samurai 8 valve heads and cams to get more torque.

Brent did the 16 valve Kick head on his GTI bottom end.....ran great.....however (I can't speak for him) he does the wires, whereas no one else does......so ya got to add that cost into it...and still end up with a non torque engine..

the GTI crank and rods are the strongest Suzuki has ever built....
so going GTI bottom end, Zuki head is a "bolt in" strong torque monster! that will scream past redline.....and cost less than all those 1.6's to plug and play

Originally posted by Arizona Zuk


Mark

you have to use a carb, if you want to use the 16 valve head and anything other than a stock cam....stock EFI will not run any other cam. the GTI head has high rpm cams.....so we have went to Samurai 8 valve heads and cams to get more torque.

the GTI crank and rods are the strongest Suzuki has ever built....
so going GTI bottom end, Zuki head is a "bolt in" strong torque monster! that will scream past redline.....and cost less than all those 1.6's to plug and play

I think zukiman has the answer. The desire is the GTI crank and rods, indicated by the 4 valve recesses. The block casting (G13B) is the same as the Sami EFI motors I have in my garage. So the question being, does SkyMfg's pistons have 4 valve recesses?

I do mostly rock crawling, so I went for the long stroke 1.6 and 8V (for the EFI compatibility) in max Torque config. However, I spend a lot of years in the racing sports and I still have that screamer side :). So I made some notes as I went along. The 1.3 carb cam is a dud. It's low lift, minimal duration and overlap make for a very flat but unimpressive RPM curve. The 1.3 EFI cam is a little better, with some added lift and duration (minimal). The 1.6 (8V) goes a little farther with the lift and duration, but they have weaker valve springs than the 1.3 (guessing lower redline for the 1.6 block). However, the 1.6 8V head and 30% larger intake runners, intake valves, and exhaust valves (exhaust runner is not measurably larger than the sami). All that, with the ability to bolt on Sami carb setups, now there's some potential.

You have to sacrifice one to get the other. To get HP (with the same displacement) you must add RPM (hp=tq * rpm). When you add RPM, you are going to loose bottom end torque. To get both requires variable valve timing (way beyond us Sami drivers). For an all out screamer, and still using Sami intake and exhaust components (cheep and available), I would have to go for the 1.6 8V head. Of course, the 16V would be better, if you can feed it properly! ;)

Originally posted by Arizona Zuk


Brent did the 16 valve Kick head on his GTI bottom end.....ran great.....however (I can't speak for him) he does the wires, whereas no one else does......so ya got to add that cost into it...and still end up with a non torque engine..



Hey Dave, I think you got it backwards. Brent put the GTi 16 valve DOHC head on the 1600 block. I don't know how well it ran, but knowing how Brent builds stuff, I'm sure it kicked ass. But there's still the problem with the OBD complexity and distributor clearance at the firewall. 'Course, for Brent, that stuff's all child's play to fix. :p

Originally posted by zukiman


Hey Dave, I think you got it backwards. Brent put the GTi 16 valve DOHC head on the 1600 block. :p

Newbie Rambling's :flipoff2: => me

This is what I am doing now, I will be running this set-up with a cosworth cam (grind BD-10) to chase after low end torque and dual weber side drafts. I am told by Ross Mackensy, at Rospen Motor sports in Austrailia that this should be a very hot set-up for a sammy. He has done this set-up several times in Swift GTi's but never on a sammy. The biggest problem with the GTi head is that it needs to be restricted a little bit to get any torque out of it, but if you have enough gears, who cares go for HP and let the gears deliver the torque.

http://members.iinet.net.au/~rospen/index.html

Some-one mentioned that the stock GTi cam is for high RPM's and I whole heartedly agree, if you use the Gti top end you must swap the cam. Unless of course you wanna put some drag slicks on the back of your zook. lol

I will let everyone know how well it works in a couple of weeks when I finish it up. I just have a few more deatils to work out.

just my .02 cents
:beer: :flipoff2: :D :flipoff2: