I need some pics of his spring over steering arms for a dana 60 His site didnt have any pics of them. Also if you happen to have any nice pics of others please post those too thanks for your help

ANT made mine, super duper!

2

Originally posted by The Jerk
2

nice spacer on that ubolt

way to get the thread off topic. and im waiting for my new plate as we speak.

The real Mc Coy's......

http://www.mjw.com/amigo/sas/images/day-07-07.jpg

http://www.mjw.com/amigo/sas/images/day-08-11.jpg

http://www.mjw.com/amigo/sas/images/day-13-01.jpg

Originally posted by The Jerk
way to get the thread off topic. and im waiting for my new plate as we speak.

Uhhh - didn't he ask for pics of Bob's arms?? :rolleyes:

Originally posted by TechGuru
I need some pics of his spring over steering arms for a dana 60 His site didnt have any pics of them. Also if you happen to have any nice pics of others please post those too thanks for your help ummm lets see, read his whole post and you tell me what he asked for! jiMMy

Originally posted by The Jerk
ummm lets see, read his whole post and you tell me what he asked for! jiMMy

Quit pulling straws :flipoff2:

Hey Bellydragger, is that a custom diff cover, ? Did you make it ? Looks "Beefy" ! :p


:jeep: __(OIIIIIIIO)__rOkOn:usa:

Originally posted by XtrmTJ
Hey Bellydragger, is that a custom diff cover, ? Did you make it ? Looks "Beefy" ! :p


:jeep: __(OIIIIIIIO)__rOkOn:usa: they are on ebay all the time, some guy back east makes em, there is a site but i have no clue what the url is! jiMMy

Originally posted by The Jerk
they are on ebay all the time, some guy back east makes em, there is a site but i have no clue what the url is! jiMMy

http://www.ronscustomshop.bigstep.com/generic.html?pid=20

http://www.patooyee.com/bigbuildup/DSC00588.JPG

J. J.

Well it looks like we are getting a nice archive of 60 steering arms here, just what I wanted. Jerk ..... I like yours the steering configuration you have is what I want to duplicate draglink in front and tierod behind. Question how close is the tierod to the spring pack does it hit when @ full extention , can you get a couple pics of the whole frontend and behind the axle complete , thanks . Belly Dragger your is super nice and clean looks like you did your homework esp. with the ack. angle ( looks correct ) I like the ram placement and your panhard mount (cool ).Patooyee excellent idea turning the avalanche arms backwards so you have multiple steering speeds ( Good Idea ) Pics of your ram and complete steering as a whole from side to side? What happened to scoutdudes pics I liked them as well and he had the info on where he purchased them and now its gone, anyone else hears of KDS MFG thats wherre they cam from .

KEEP THEM COMMING GREAT IDEAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

I had Ant's arms on my Flatty with the 60 up front. I couldn't run the arm behind the knuckle because the leaf springs got in the way. It may work for some pople running full hydro steer, but not for me with my fron setup. I had a stock 60, no rotation, did not work. I then rotated it with a 10 degree wedge, and still did not work. Somoene else may have a different setup that I was running, but I can tell you mine did not work.

Dimitri

i have a 6 degree steel shim in the front adn they clear the whole time at full lock! dotn mind the wires its an old pic! jiMMy

Anyone have any pisc of D60 arms with hummer wheels? Does Roggy make any? ~dso

I don't have my full hydro on yet. There will be pics as soon as I do though, rest assured. :)

J. J.

Anyone have any pisc of D60 arms with hummer wheels? Does Roggy make any? ~dso

I made a set for Pyro a few years back, he's set-up like The Jerk and is running Hummer's.

Let me phrase this another way: Does anyone have any arms for sale that would fit with Hummer wheels?

~dso

Anyone? Bob, Jerk, Ant?

just cut em and zap em back together space inwards a couple or three inches.

Yes, there is some dude making them, but the are pricey as hell.

http://www.jeepxtremes.com/d60arms.htm

Ed

"just cut em and zap em back together space inwards a couple or three inches. "


Maybe it's just lack of sleep, but I'm not following.
~dso

Sorry, it may be my lack of sleep in describing it. Get whatever cheap steering arms you can find, and cut the arms off of rectangular kingpin cover portion. Bevel the edges of the cut portion, and weld the arms back on to the center section of the arm, spaced towards the center of the axle about 2.5".

Wish I had a digital camera....


Here is a pic that "kinda" shows what I made....

http://www.rocktaxi.com/HydroBoost/SteeringArmRam01a.JPG

Ed

betcha I could make some.
But I don't have a 60 layin around with hummers on it.
Do have some 1" plate layin around
If I had a detailed pic with diminsions, I probably
could help you out.

You've got PM.

I need some Hummer / hy steer arms too! Let me know if any of you guys are making them!

I haven't heard back from fabricator. We'll keep you in mind.

Do you want the tierod in front of or behind the axle? I'd personally like the behind if it will work well.

Anyone else?

~dso

Let me start checking some materials cost. I may be able to make a few sets up if enough people are interested.

If you are interested in a pair, email me at:

questions@rocktaxi.com

and I can start getting some details out to whoever is interested.

Ed

hahahahahh! looks like we are in the same boat and its sinking real fast:eek:
i need some arms also for a d60 king for humvee set-up but...i think ants are the nicest by far and the ackerman angle is still in tact but i cannot use them as i have a hp 60 and well it just will not work...as far as the dude in jersey he is a complete shmuck.i spoke to him a couple of times he no longer is doing them not enough business hmmmm:confused: at 375$ a set i wonder why...
anyways is anyone running humvee's with high steer i am in dire need of some info like if they are running them with regular arms are they using spacers or do the just fit perfectly andwhat about the scrub radius with them .

ahhhhhhh what the hell do i do? i need to do my steering and well i decided on doin rod ends with the drag link on top of the tir rod ....but i need arms......

let me know guys ...lets all just chip in and and design some together....

Did I hear group buy??? :nuke: :nuke:

:D

give me a pic of what you guys are wantin
sorry for the delay in the response. busy.

returned your pm daveO

I'm in the market too so put me on the list of potential buyers.
HP RR 60 w/coils and deep offset wheels to center the wheel pivot
and would like to have the tie rod in back.
It will be a while till I have a mock up though,
but I expect the Hummers are pretty deep so it sounds like what you guys want is what will work for me too.

Put me in this as well. I want the drag link up front, tie-rod in the rear, setup for Hummer rims.

hahahahah!i want a 5'7" blonde with perfect tits and a mohawk, and is a graduate from YALE.:flipoff2:

you guys are great....am i mistaken or is it impossible to have a rear tierod set-up with a hp :confused:
but if it will meet all the angles and the ackerman and have little or no scrub hell put me in line my man....

Yup, the arms can be made for hummer rims with a Standard cut D60 putting the tie-rod behind the axle. With a RCD60 the pinion is in the way unless you seriously raise the height of the tie-rod, but then you run into frame/oilpan clearance problems.

i'd be interested in a set for a standard 60 and hummer wheels. tie rod behind, drag up front.

doesn't 66cjdean make these and the linkages to match? what are his prices?

-russel

Originally posted by Ant
Yup, the arms can be made for hummer rims with a Standard cut D60 putting the tie-rod behind the axle. With a RCD60 the pinion is in the way unless you seriously raise the height of the tie-rod, but then you run into frame/oilpan clearance problems.

What kinda pricing are we lookin at?

Originally posted by The Jerk
way to get the thread off topic. and im waiting for my new plate as we speak.

what the hell do you mean? Why are you looking for new plates?

Originally posted by tj7

... but i cannot use them as i have a hp 60 and well it just will not work...

I have a HP D60 with the tierod behind the axle. However, My axle has been retubed so I don't know how far from stock the currect angles are...but I'm pretty sure that I have the pionion sticking up MORE than the factory setting (5º) with my castor set at 8º. My tierod does get close but this measurement won't change with the suspension cycling (By this, I mean that when you turn the wheels and it reaches it's closest point, it will still never touch).

My arms were build by Lars at KDS mfg. He can be reached at 916/207-5001 and he can also put a bend in the arms to clear springs, frame, etc...

As sweet as those look, they would not work with Hummer wheels. The connecting point for the tie rod has to be inside of the four bolts and cap.

Anyone have the measurements for arms that would work with Hummer wheels? How far apart are the holes? How big is the hole below the cap?

Originally posted by DavidO
As sweet as those look, they would not work with Hummer wheels. The connecting point for the tie rod has to be inside of the four bolts and cap.

Anyone have the measurements for arms that would work with Hummer wheels? How far apart are the holes? How big is the hole below the cap?

Yeah, makes sense..but Lars can make just about anything...might be worth the call

For any fabricators following this thread, this is what I'm looking for:

http://offroadrepublic.com/fj40/chapter6/dana_60_steering_arms_for_hummer_wheels.gif


At least along the lines of...


thanks, ~dso




PS - Thanks Joel, I left a message with your guy.

I can take my stock arms off and make a clearance template if someone wants me to. I will be needing a set in the very near future also. I'm running 44's so they bulge out alot. And depending on how far out the arms go they may need to be spaced in even more for tire clearance. Here's a shitty pic of the clearance. It's a HP ford D60 with hummer beadlocks.

I talked to Lars. I told him that he could plan on selling at least 4 sets of these. When I say "these" I mean ones that would fit a GM D60 with the tierod in the rear. I'm not sure if the Ford is the same bolt pattern. Anyway, based on that, here's the pricing:

$180 for the double arm.
$90 for the single.

So $270 for the pair.

~dso

With these prices are these tapered for the cone washers? and straight hole for rod ends, or tapered for TREs?

Ok, Here's the skinny.

The holes that mount to the knuckle are straight through (just like stock ones). I was thinking they have cone washers inside, but he told me that was only on D44.

The other holes are tapered for GM TREs. He asked me if that's the way I want it. I said yes, he said he's setup for that. He gave me the impression that he could do it either way though.

~dso

The arms I referred to are the one I make. They are $250 a set for behind the axle tie-rod, thats with tapered holes and correct ackerman! Sorry to tell you Scout dude but your arms do not have correct ackerman. Seems you have a lot of lift so pinion clearance in your case was not a big issue.

Are these the same ones that I've emailed and PM'd you about several times without response? :flipoff2:

Last time I talked to you, you didn't have any. You were going to look into having another batch made, but I never heard back. If you have some, I'll send $$.

thanks, ~dso

Originally posted by Ant
The arms I referred to are the one I make. They are $250 a set for behind the axle tie-rod, thats with tapered holes and correct ackerman! Sorry to tell you Scout dude but your arms do not have correct ackerman. Seems you have a lot of lift so pinion clearance in your case was not a big issue.

i would also be interested in a set. let me know what happens with this. thanks- russel

rtroeske@spsu.edu

Originally posted by tj7
hahahahah!i want a 5'7" blonde with perfect tits and a mohawk, and is a graduate from YALE.:flipoff2:

you guys are great....am i mistaken or is it impossible to have a rear tierod set-up with a hp :confused:
but if it will meet all the angles and the ackerman and have little or no scrub hell put me in line my man....

Yeah! I'd like the MoHawk too!
RATZ about the HP problem though ... :(

While I was in Cedar City this past weekend I tried to check out all the competitors front linkage and was surprised to find very few King Pin jobs.
Most were after-market ball joint setups with drive flanges.
I'm told these knuckles aren't as strong but they are light and easy to set up.

Originally posted by Ant
Sorry to tell you Scout dude but your arms do not have correct ackerman.

You know what..you may be right..but I read about having the correct..and it seems that no one gives a fawk...Guess, what, I drive my Scout on the street all the time..I have no Death wobble like others have and I have no problems with my steering...So, fawk it...who needs factory ackerman anyway?;)

so whats the deal then.... do we really need the ackerman to be right or not:confused:

i cant run the rear set up as i have a long arm set up and the arms will be in the way so here we are again i need front high steer for the humvee's should i call this lars dude and tell him what i need or what as far as i know ford and gm are the same.

running a RC on my tj really gives me no room in the rear...i would luv to run ants set -up its trick as hell and well done prolly the best i have seen...

anyone else in the same boat as me...:D

Yo, Scout Dude.
Those discs are sweet!
I need some nice compact units for my RR60 like that.
I going to have a small rim with a deep off-set and need something compact like THAT!
And, I can't start chopping until I get the rim, caliper and off set nailed down
Clue me in, will ya?
Will they work with stock Ford 8 lug hubs :confused:

Originally posted by Jaffer
Yo, Scout Dude.
Those discs are sweet!
I need some nice compact units for my RR60 like that.
I going to have a small rim with a deep off-set and need something compact like THAT!
And, I can't start chopping until I get the rim, caliper and off set nailed down
Clue me in, will ya?
Will they work with stock Ford 8 lug hubs :confused:

Yes to all of that;) ...I have 8 lug, 3.5 bs rims..and now use GM calipers...After looking at different options, I went with the WMS kit..they supplied the rotors, calipers, pads, guide pins, fawk..even the banjo bolts with the copper washers...I think it is $550 though for the kit:eek: ..but no grinding really (I did smooth the flashing on the calipers but didn't have to get into the main part AT ALL!)

The bonus of it is that the caipers happened to be the same ones that I run on the rear too..so parts are easier to remember:smokin:

You don't even want the ackerman "correct". Scout dude has close to parallel steering. With true ackerman when turning to the right if the steering stops were set so the right side axle shaft ujoint just didn't bind, then the left side wheel would not be turned to full lock. That seems like a bad thing to me. I would prefer to have parallel steering, so at full lock both wheels were turned all the way. It really is no big deal either way though. Also most all factory four wheel drives actually have reverse ackerman steering. To clear your hummer rims with rear steer you are going to have a lot of ackerman. To clear them with the tie rod in front of the axle you are going to have a lot of reverse ackerman. I would take ackerman over reverse ackerman to minimize tire scrubing on the slick rock. but whatever, You really can't screw up bad enough that you will notice on the trail with ackerman.

how thick are they?
Anyone with a set up simular to this going to EROCC
next weekend?

okay so what are we sayin here....reverse ackerman is no good :confused: and not enough ackerman is also no good.

who out there has a FORD RR60 wanting or needing humvee rims arms. i am ready to buy a set.who is going to do them for me:D

another real dilema i have is steering set-up....i know i wanna run hight steer now do i wanna run the y-setup using tre or do i wanna run heims ?casey at wms told me he makes a real sweet set -up fpr tj's where the dragling and tie rod are on top of each other and use one hole on the sterring arm.i am so :confused:

what the fawk do i do....

Originally posted by Scout Dude

I went with the WMS kit..they supplied the rotors, calipers, pads, guide pins, fawk..even the banjo bolts with the copper washers...


With RCAA and Cal-Rocs lining up and Pro-Rocks having similar Stock Modified rules, it looks like I'm going to stick to 35s on 8 lug RR60s but no stretched frame.

That kit sounds like exactly what I am after.
I need to get my hubs, brakes, and rims and off-set sorted out and measured before cutting axel tubes.

I searched POR and Google thoroughly for Waggoner Machine's contact info and came up empty with every word combo I could think of.
waggonermachine.com was refered to in a past post but that came up empty.
I asume it is Jeff Waggoner I am looking for...

Could someone help and point me to them, please?

http://www.wagonermachine.com/shopinfopage.htm

Wagoner Machine Shop Inc.
218 N. CHEROKEE
CLAREMORE, OK 74017

Telephone (918) 341-1722

speak to casey he is a good guy...lots of offroad savoy.....

Ahhh! ...
:mad:

... only ONE "G" in their home page URL.
No wonder nothing was coming up.
Thanks!

If someone has proper drawings of some 60 arms for hummer rims I can have them made no problem. What I would think would work the best is one are that is similar to either passenger arm in David O's drawing. only it would have 2 holes at the end of each arm. This way it can be used on either side, front or rear tie-rod. Any one see a problem with that? If you can supply me with either some good drawing and or cad specs I think I could supply you with a set of arms, maybe even a free set if I pull some strings.

If you're making them to be interchangeable, then I would not have a taper. So I would not be able to use GM TREs. right?


The reason I ask is because I was planning on using GM TREs.

~dso

why not?
you could either put in a tapered bushing that had some sort of lock, or just drill it either way once the order is made. I see these arms being cut and drilled with just pilot holes where either the tre or heims would go.
seems reasonablem or am I :smokin:

Sounds good to me.

I'm just curious, where would you find a bushing like that? A nut & bolt place?

tahnks.~dso

yo fred sup my man.....i need arms in the front i dont think the rear would work for me...what are you going to be using tre or rod ends?and i guess you dont care about the ackerman angle:confused:
speak to ya soon buddy...:beer:

If need be we would make the bushing, and yes I would like the ackerman angle to be correct, I'm just not sure what correct is for my application yet.

here is a nifty little link
http://www.auto-ware.com/setup/ack_rac.htm

that link explains why you want different angles and not parralel steering arm angles, however, it also brings up something new about tire slip?!?!?
I'm still a little confused about it all, but maybe Ant can pipe up and drop some knowledge about the mr ackerman for us

BINGO

check this out
it explains how and why the hummer arms would work best in the back of the dif, hopefully they will fit, and my wheelbase isn't too long

http://www.csn.ul.ie/~steviewdr/Racing%20Kart%20Plans/ackerman.htm

If someone had a cad drawing to share,
don't be shy, I could probably make them.
DFX file would be even better.

anyone know If I would be correct in saying that ackerman angle would change depending on wheelbase?

Originally posted by fcfred
anyone know If I would be correct in saying that ackerman angle would change depending on wheelbase?

Technically, yes.

so how do I determin proper ackerman angle?

hahahahah! thats just it freddy everyones rig is different so what ever arm is made for your will not work neccesarily for mine or david-o ....this is why it is so hard to fab up ...man this fawking project is killing me man im getting so sick and tired of changing my mind from tie rods to rod ends to double sheer to fawking Y set-up...:mad:

you know the times when you hate the fawking vehicle and just fed up and just want some one else to finish it or blow the fawker up and collec on insurrance well im at that point:nuke: :nuke:

maybe i will just relax a bit...hey its my b-day today and well i didnt get any jeep presents :mad3:

oh well what can i expect the girlfreind hates the jeep anyways ...
shaw calls me a redneck hahahahah! i keep telling her im from canada not winston-salem like her....:p


anyways who ever designs this shit i need a set right away for a hp d60 (ford)...

Let me see if I understand this then....

Because the ackerman is different by wheel base, it would depend on where and how the tie rod connected to the arms. This is where the Avalanche setup comes in handy.

http://www.avalancheengr.com/parts/steering/imga0093.jpg

The key to correcting the ackerman is having the holes to adjust it as necessary. The 2* angle of the arms (compared to the ground) have nothing to do with it. You "flatten" the angle to make the TRE bolt up flush. That's it. The ackerman is something that needs to be adjusted for on an individual basis.

Yes?

If this is the case then I have a couple more Qs:

If that is the case, does it matter if you correct for the 2* angle?
Is having the holes to adjust the ackerman more important, just as important, or are neither really that important (even if you're going to be on the road)?


OR Are the holes ONLY for adjusting turning radius and the ackerman is already built in to the design of the axle and kingpin setup (meaning that it's something you can't really change anyway).



Thanks to you, almightly gurus.


~dso

These are the arms ANT made for me, with Humvee wheels.

I don't think it's the holes as much as it is the angle of the arm off of the top of the kingpin IE laterally

read that second link I posted about building steering for a go-cart, where they set up the ackeeman angle by running a line from the kingpin to the center of the rear diff. if this is true
WHICH I DO NOT KNOW AND WISH SOMEONE COULD TELL ME
then the steering arms would point out to the sides in the front, and in towards the center in the rear of the kingpin, thus if in the front it does not clear,because of the hummer rims, then you would have put them in the back of the kingpin to get them on the inside, just as Ant has done.
now the only question remaining is
"is this how you set ackerman, and why is everyone else making arms that do not take wheelbase into account?

#2

new POSSIBLE explanation on the purpose of the many avalance hole
from that go-cart site
"The steering arms are firstly however cut to the appropriate length, you may see from some of my photos throughout this site that I have drilled two holes at the ends of both steering arms. This is in case a particular driver prefers a more abrupt turning of the kart with little turning of the steering wheel and visa versa."

so the many holes allow adjustment in things like lock to lock turn ratio and steering component clearance.

Damnit where are all the engineers who should know this stuff, and be able to verify or deny the crap I'm "discovering" I'm just a stupid farmer/artist.:rasta:

Originally posted by tj7


...hey its my b-day today and well i didnt get any jeep presents :mad3:


We have the same b-day:smokin:

So, A couple of updates:

I turned my Scout to full lock and checked to see if both wheels were turned the same angle or if one (the inside one) was turned inwards farther. Guess what, it looked normal to me. the inside tire was turned farther inwards just like the factory set up. Was it set to factory settings? Who the fawk knows..find me a Pass side HP 60 and measure it and I'll let you know.:p

Also, I talked to Lars also today. If someone can e-mail me the measurements, I will probably stop by his shop on my way back from the 'Con this weekend. I can give him them then.

Hey Pyro,

Thanks for the pics. Those are much better than the old ones. I'm not sure if you got my PM, but can you shoot us lengths on your arms?

Maybe we can get cooking on some this weekend.

~dso

OK, just found this in Tex Smith's "how to build real hot rods" which is basically what we are doing.
"If you draw a line from the center of the kingpin to the center of the rear axl, the line should pass directly through the steering arm rod end holes. If not the car does not have perfect ackerman angle."

As for asking Pyro for the measurements of his arms that Ant built maybe you should ask Ant directly as he is the one that figured it out. You never know he may just sell them to you for a fair price so that you can make your own.:D

Originally posted by fcfred


As for asking Pyro for the measurements of his arms that Ant built maybe you should ask Ant directly as he is the one that figured it out. You never know he may just sell them to you for a fair price so that you can make your own.:D


My thoughts exactly, Ant helped me alot to setup this steering, I don't want to just cut him out of the loop, their his product.

So, with that said then perhaps Ford could be taken to lawsuit. They offered the same Dana 44 front diff in their bronco's as they did in their extended cab's. Surely, they don't have the same wheelbase and therefore come from the factory with an improperly set ackerman angle thusly affecting tire wear, handling, performance and perhaps creating tire skid! Dang, I bet I'm the first to think of that since the engineers stated that the 44 would make a suitable axle for a truck....

Man, you guys are nuts. You're talking about exacting measurements on vehicles with tires that have D-shaped bias ply tires, will vary in size probably about 3/4" in height due to inflation and load, have lugs that are 1/2" deep, and rubber compounds that you can scrape with your finger nail. Throw a locker into the equation and whaddya get? Heavens!!

BFD! How many of you guys running beadlocked hummer wheels with the tie rod behind the diff actually depend on your vehicle to pick up the kid from soccer, get a carton of milk and get your ass to work every day? If you do, then perhaps you'll see 5 miles less out of your 38" SX's or 42" TSL's... I can't imagine any of the vehicles you're putting these on will be put on any 4 corner 185MPH tracks?

I'd hate to say it, but ballpark it fellas. What you spec to build, or what you buy is what you get, reguardless of ackerman. As long as you've got your ol' return to center cuz of the caster, then I'd say you're good to go.

I don't know if you figured it out yet, but pyro's pics make it very easy to picture: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachment.php?s=&postid=713092 If you draw a strait line between the kingpin zirc and the center of the rod end (or tre) that line should extend to the center of the rear axle when no steering input is there. You can see how with wide tires used for offroading and/ or deep offset wheels like hummers it is WAY easier to achieve the correct ackerman angle with the tie rod in the rear of the axle. This is because to get it correct you need to push the ends of the tie rod inward to get the "imaginary line" to run thru both pivots and intersect with the rear axle. If the tie rod is in the oem location (front of axle) you can see how difficult it is to achieve "correct" ackerman angle because you have to move the tie rod ends out to get the "imaginary line:p " to pass thru the tre/sre AND the kingpin pivot AND hit the center of the rear axle. Usually this can't effectively be done because there are deep dish wheels or wide tires that would interfere with the tre/sre. Hope this clears things up a bit.


Dang, I bet I'm the first to think of that since the engineers stated that the 44 would make a suitable axle for a truck....Man, you guys are nuts....

Nope! Don't give yourself so much credit where it isn't due. Maybe if this is too much for you to worry about you should go back to your cluged mud roach and forget about the words "steering geometry".

My thoughts exactly, Ant helped me alot to setup this steering, I don't want to just cut him out of the loop, their his product.

This was my post back on 6/4/02 (part of this thread):

"Does anyone have any arms for sale that would fit with Hummer wheels?"

I've contacted Ant several times before. The correspondence that I received back was courteous, but in the end did not lead anywhere. The bottom line is I (and others) just need some arms.

I've PM'd you (Pyro) and Ant more than once. I've emailed Ant several times. From what I can tell, he's not selling them. Maybe it's just not to me, but either way, I still need arms. If he's not selling them, then he's not even IN a loop to be cut out of. From what I remember, he charged a fair price. I contacted him ready to buy.

Pyro I'm sure you remember that I contacted you months ago about this. I was looking to buy then and I got nowhere. I've taken a break from trying to find them but now the need has become more eminent. If you feel the need to protect his design, then that's fine. I can appreciate your loyalty. But since you posted such detailed photos, I didn't think you were trying to keep any corporate secrets. I thought it was being offered up as community information and I was just looking for more detail.

I have cc'd this to Ant to see if he wants to be in the loop.

thanks for everyone's input. ~dso

BFD! How many of you guys running beadlocked hummer wheels with the tie rod behind the diff actually depend on your vehicle to pick up the kid from soccer, get a carton of milk and get your ass to work every day? If you do, then perhaps you'll see 5 miles less out of your 38" SX's or 42" TSL's... I can't imagine any of the vehicles you're putting these on will be put on any 4 corner 185MPH tracks
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thats me man....mine is my daily driver .i drive 90 mph on the hywy too ...no joke:eek:

also ant is the man ...so what we have to do is get our measurements and he will make us the arms ....hahahahah right ant:D ...

Originally posted by DavidO



Pyro I'm sure you remember that I contacted you months ago about this. I was looking to buy then and I got nowhere. I've taken a break from trying to find them but now the need has become more eminent. If you feel the need to protect his design, then that's fine. I can appreciate your loyalty. But since you posted such detailed photos, I didn't think you were trying to keep any corporate secrets. I thought it was being offered up as community information and I was just looking for more detail.

I have cc'd this to Ant to see if he wants to be in the loop.

~dso

You contacted me for pictures(and here they are), not measurements. You need to talk to Ant about the numbers. When I have the time, I help people like you, with what I can BUT when I don't have time, I don't. My rig just got shipped back from a tour of events and I took some pics for you. I don't make the arms, call the guy that did.:mad3:

It's not so much a question of "loyalty" to Ant (i do consider him a friend), I wouldn't ripoff anybody's product and post it on the internet, that's just wrong.

Mr 4wd, thank you for your concern and trying to set us straight on how we don't need to really know the geometry, but rather that we should just get some arms and slap them together, maybe I'll do that with my suspension links and everything else as well:rolleyes:
you may be right that we don't need to be concerned with this stuff, but if, for some strange reason, we were going to run hummer beadlocks on a set of street tires and wanted the vehicle to respond correctly then maybe it woudl be helpful, as we don't all tow our rigs everywhere, I can understand that it may not be important, but would rather know why it works than just assume I don't need it:D

DavidO
grab your tape measure and go measure the distance between the kingpin's center to center, then go measure the wheelbase, do some simple geometry and figure out the angles of your dangle, next measure to see if the a line at that angle will clear the wheel in either the front or back, most likely in the back, then see if a tirrod will fit behind the diff on your set-up. Then do a drawing of the kingpin bolt pattern, with the tierod holes marked at proper ackerman angle, figure out your draglink placement to set up proper steering geometry, clearance and ratio, and then draw it all out on cad or a piece of paper, be sure to figure the clearence needed to get the tierod out of your springs if you're running leaves or your links if you are coils.
I think that should cover everything. you may need to fudge stuff a little here and there depending on clearance, but that should get you in the right area.
Now send said drawing to one of the many people that posted in this post about how they would be willing to build said arms, and you should be in business.
good luck and let us kno whow it's coming along.
pm me if you need some more input

Unless someone has a better Idea

hahhahahaha! fred your fnny as shit.....:D

to be honest with you but seems like to much work for me to do:smokin: see im lazy as hell dude. there has to be an easier way to do this ....let me think of the way ill let ya know...:p

if you beat me or someone else does all the power to ya just keep me in mind i will take two asap...:rasta:

Sorry I don't check my PM's usually, and frankly don't visit the POR BB much any more... to many damn pop-ups. Sorry DavidO if I missed an e-mail from you. No I don't stock arms to sell. I custom make each and every set to fit its application. If someone needs a set shoot me an E-mail. Turn around time is generally about 3 weeks. I don't physically start working on the arms until I get a deposit or full payment. I get quite a few people that say they want arms but never actually send $$ I might have thrown DavidO in that group of people by mistake. I've spent a few hours on the phone with TJ7 so he's loaded with the scoop on arms that can be made for hummer rims.

okay guys i think i have the answers to all of my dilema's....

my best bet would be just going with modified centers like i first originally planned on doing months ago even before i had the humvee rims in my possesion.

4.5 of backspacing i'm going to buy these from my boy dean on the board get in touch with him he has them and they look sweet like a virgin hahahaha! and just weld them in my rims.

this will help my whole steering problem and the lockout problem

tell me if i am wrong here kay

FORD FULL WIDTH D60= 69"
THEN IF I GO WITH 4.5 OF
BS ON LETS SAY A 10" RIMx2 RIMS= 11"

LETS SAY 12.5 TIRE ON A
10"RIM LEAVES ME WITH 2.5X 2 TIRES= 5" (IF THAT) FOR A TOTAL OF 85" INCHES WIDE

am i right or close to being right this would be my total width of the front axle and my rear would be 1" narrower for better tracking.before i had a d44 it was 78" wide and wasnt that bad at alL maybe slap on some wider fender flares and i should be good to go

let me know boys.....

ill shoot it back to the top to see if anyone else can help out....

Working on prices still.

Have a guy working up a deal to see about getting the plate laser cut to shape. Should have some firm pricing by the end of next week.

The arms we are making will allow the tie rod either behind or in front of the axle, and will be drilled for SRE's not TRE's.

I do not have a RC Ford 60 here to fit for clearance over the pinion, but think you can space the SRE up enough to clear the diff.

Ed

Ok, it looks like we have gotten it all nearly worked out for a batch run of Dana 60 High Clearance Hummer Rim Steering Arms.

Estimated time to delivery for sale - 3-4 weeks (depending on when we finalize the design)

High Clearance Dana 60 Kingpin arms WITH an attachment point and separate tab for mounting a Hydro Assist Ram. (Rams are available at added cost along with all required parts/fittings for installation & plumbing)

Allows for mounting the tie rod in front OR behind the axle depending on method of installation. (behind axle mounting excludes high pinion models)

Drilled for Spherical Rod Ends (heim joints), not tapered holes for Tie Rod ends.

Offset properly for installing on Dana 60's with Hummer Rims and up to 16" wide tires.

Anticipated cost of one pair of steering arms & mounting tab - $225 per set.

Email me at questions@rocktaxi.com if you are interested so I can get the machine shop to make the proper number of arms and eliminate excessive waiting times as they reset up the equipment for a second batch a few weeks from now. These will be sold through a 4x4 shop that is local to me to help handle deliveries and shipping. AFM Enterprises http://www.afm4x4.com

Ed

Has anyone made any progress on this yet?

Just wonderin'


Have a good weekend all. ~dso

Ok, we are an estimated 2 weeks from delivery of the arms for sale, and after some price negotiations, we have expanded the deal to include and optional Hydro-Assist system.

Pricing has come in at $225.00 per 3 piece set.

The set includes 2/ea. Hummer Rim Offset Arms and an extra mounting tab for our Hydraulic Ram Assist. The arms allow mounting of the tie rod above the knuckles behind or in front of the axle.

Prepaid orders from this first batch of arms have the option of adding the Hydraulic Assist Kit at a special rate of $124.99 (normal pricing for this Kit will be $199.95) Kit includes: Ram, Ram Fittings Steering Box Fittings for a "tap through the covers" type of installation. (write-up and general instructions and pictures of the prototype will be included on the web site) 10/ft. of High Pressure Hose. Manufacturer to be Gates or Good-Year depending on warehouse stock 4/ea. Hose Fittings, "Field Installation" type / Re-Usable (These are not cheap Chinese Fittings!) Check with Brett to see what just the Hydraulic Assist Kit will be offered for by itself without purchasing the Dana 60 High Clearance Hummer Offest arms.

Customer should Pre-Pay via Credit Card for their protection (if the company that will be selling these doesn't deliver) and mine.

Customer needs to email Brett Burnett, of AFM Enterprises http://www.afm4x4.com/ at - afm.ent@worldnet.att.net - with their commitment to either kit along with all of their personal info such as credit card billing addres/shipping address. They can call the actual credit card number in to me if they want to.

Their card will not be charged until the parts are shipped.

If you have specific questions, please contact Brett by email or the phone number listed on his site. A full writeup with pictures will be up on his site as soon as the arms show up from the machinist.

From this point forward, please contact Brett at afm.ent@worldnet.att.net . I have turned this over to him to handle. Hopefully the pricing has turned out to be competitive and this will meet everyone's Dana 60 with Hummer rim needs.

Thanks!

Ed

Rock Taxi...sorry to bother you, but what is the deal with these arms?

I don't see anything at all about arms on AFM's site.

I was wondering how the ram mounts....to the front hole on the driver's arm (Chevy 60)? if it does, doesn't the other end of the ram interfere with the drag link?

Thanks,

Charly

what kind of demand is there for these arms?

Since you brought it up, I'll post mine. These are AFM arms. I have not yet mounted the arms and such. I'm waiting on shims.

http://offroadrepublic.com/fj40/chapter7/d60_hi_steer_arms.jpg
http://offroadrepublic.com/fj40/chapter7/d60_hi_steer_arms_installed.jpg
http://offroadrepublic.com/fj40/chapter7/d60_hi_steer_arms_installed2.jpg

Them arms there look fairly simple to make.

David O,

What 'shims' are you waiting for? leaf spring shims? are the necessary for clearance of the rods?

What springs are you running? I will be running 44044s on my front (have stock 7 leaf Waggys now).

Are these arms 1" thick?

My concern is with clearance of the rods over the springs.

Also, are you using wheelspacers at all? It is hard to tell from the pics.

thanks

I'm waiting for 6* shims. They're "in the mail." I have a custom outboard setup with stock Cruiser springs. My camber (or is it caster), is WAY off. Once that's corected, the tierod will fit fine. So will the draglink. Worse case scenario is that the draglink needs a little spacer on it. I won't know until I have it bolted together. I'm not running spacers. I'm not sure how thick they are exactly, 1" sounds about right. They're heavy as hell to carry a pair around.

~dso

Ok thanks, one more question...

Are you going to be running a hydro ram? and where are you going to mount it?

It appears to me that if I was to mount the ram off the front hole of the driver's arm that it will interfere with the draglink at the pitman arm.

any thoughts?

thanks

Originally posted by Charly
any thoughts?


I don't know yet, I haven't made it that far. When the shims are installed, I'll see what I have and go from there. If you're still interested, drop me a line in a few weeks and I'll post pics of whatever I did.

~dso

YIKES!! I curious to see how those arms work out....

Whatever. :rolleyes:

Hey David, Keep us updated on these arms, with pics too.:)

Also can you tell me why AFM does not have these on their website?

Thanks,

Scott

Will do. Probably because it's such a specialized item. The impression that I got is that these guys stay pretty busy in their core business. I'm not sure how many they made or what, but they probably just haven't gotten around to advertising them. Brent was REALLY easy to work with though. Good communication and he kept to his word on time & delivery. Thanks again Ed for putting this together.

It's going to be a while before mine hits the trail, but I'll keep posting stuff as things develope.

~dso

OK what about us little guys, when is someone going to make an arm that will work on a D44 with hummers? Should be very simple to do, the flat top arms are simple enough, bend that shit in a bit to compensate..... hook a brother up!! :p

Call Casey at Wagoner Machine. They make them.

Ed

hey guys...

i am in the process of designing my arms...

when i get them made i am in good with a machine shop...i will be able to get more made...i am not expecting them to cost over 100 for the pair...

they are being made for a FORD HP 60 with HUMMER WHEELS and 14.50 swamper tires...

I might even get them cheaper with no holes and you drill them yourself...just the arms...

it will be about 3 weeks...but email if interested....250 is ridiculous! purdue22@aol.com

see ya...k

pdaddy...i can get them for the 44 also...i have a 44 in mine so i will measure it and see what i can do...email above if you want...

it will be about 3 weeks or so and about the same price

Originally posted by Rock Taxi
Call Casey at Wagoner Machine. They make them.

Ed

I'm glad someone is stepping up and making them now, back in July of this year I called all the known fab shops (including WMS) and no one had thought to make any yet. In fact, it was funny to me since all of us on here are talking nonstop about hummer wheels for months, and I call all the shops up and not one of them had really thought to make any.

No one seemed to believe there would be market.

Most were willing to make them, but still at prototype costs (at the time I was looking for 44 arms).

BTW, a friend of mine and I designed and made behind the axle 60 arms that clear hummer wheels. We used 1" plate, water jet them, 10* angle milled the surfaces, and drilled holes for heims. I ended up needing 1/2" spacers on top of the arms (at the tie rod holes) to clear the leaf springs. We used 1" spacers on top of the kingpin springs inside the stock caps. Seems to be working good.

I just mounted up my tie rod the other day and ran into the same issue. I will need a couple more spacers to get it all worked out. I'm glad to hear you're running .5" without issues. That should be fine for me also.

Did you by any chance notice that the passenger side was closer to the axle than the drivers? I found that odd.


~dso

Originally posted by DavidO
Did you by any chance notice that the passenger side was closer to the axle than the drivers? I found that odd.


~dso

YES.....lol.....fawking thing :D

Just some background, I do not have a shackle reversal, am SOA with stock 7 leaf Waggy packs, my tie rod is 1/5" OD tube and I put a 4* shim in to reduce the caster (and provide more clearance for the tie rod). With that set up I still needed the .5" spacers on top of the arms.
I put one or two washers under the misalignment washer on the passenger side heim to even it out.

My passenger side has always drooped ever since I did the SOA.........and that is with several different spring combinations. When I put this 60 in, I even swapped the front packs side to side and there still seems to be some passenger side droop.

Must be the way the perches are cast/mounted. Strange.

It's been like that from when I had the Waggy 44, Chevy 44 and now the 60.

Your jeep is just bent.

MJ

Originally posted by Rock Taxi
Call Casey at Wagoner Machine. They make them.

Ed

DAMN, forget that :eek: 295.00 set for a friggin 44!!! I guess Ill be building my own