Way
06-03-2002, 03:04 PM
O.k. Didn't really relate to the full hydraulic post that I had earlier so I figured I would start a new thread that is relevant to the topic. Went to Avalanche this morning and learned that they send everything to HOWE and then install it for you. There is a tractor supply next to the facility that they get the lines from. They really know very little, and basically just weld a bracket on axle and make a custom mount for pump and add a nice percentage to the cost of the Howe system.
Here is some information about our rover systems that I found in my tech manual. The pump is a Hobourn Eaton V-Series 200. Operating pressure straight ahead at idle is 7 kgf/c^2 (99.54 PSI). At full lock at idle pressure is 28 kgf/cm^2 (398.16 PSI). At full lock at 1000 rev/min operating pressure range is 70-77 kgf/cm^2 (995.4-1094.9 PSI). The pump GPM right now is around 2.88 from what my basic calculations yield.
If you want Hydraulic assist you will need to take your box, pump and resevoir off of vehicle and send to Howe. They disassemble and modify existing parts so that GPM is as high as possible. Because of the small output of the pump it is most likely that a 1" or 1.5" ram will have to be used. The problem with going to a 2 or 2.5 is that the pump cannot press the volume quickly enough to meet ram requirements (under panic operations ram could bind if steering to right quickly then left or vice versa,etc.). The output of a howe pump is 1300 PSI and puts out close to 5 GPM (and 1600lbs of force). Because of this a 2"+ ram can be used.
Since it costs $250 to have our pump modified and rebuilt it makes sense to me to pay $325 for the bigger pump that Howe uses. Downfall is that a bracket will have to be made to attach their pump to our engine. Their pumps are a modified Saginaw unit. I do not know if rover ever used a saginaw pump in their vehicles with the 3.9 liter motor, but if they did I am sure a factory bracket could be purchased.
The rams (although) filled with fluid still have friction in them especially under high load situations. Because of this a filter is used. For this they use a modified Toyota filter. They can make it remote resevoir or have it attach to the pump I think. Without this the fluid will turn black very quickly according to Howe.
When they tap the box they use one of the three fiting sizes. #6, #8, or #10. There kits do not include lines so a local hydraulic shop will need to make them. They recommend the blue 2000 lb (9000 lb burst rated) line with steel fitting only.
The cost break down is as follows ballpark.
$475 modified box
$325 Pump (or have yours modifed for $250)
$150 for filter system
$186 for ram (regardless of size)
$? Shipping costs
$150ish for custom lines in your town
=1286ish + shipping both ways (does not include dismantle or fluid replacement)
Kind of expensive, but if used on the highway it is recommended to have the GPM and ram match. Plus I can't imagine most of us can tap our own box and modify the inside to allow unit to work. Super nice people at tech support there.
If anyone decides to do this ( I am saving now), send to the attention of Chris and send to the Howe address. I called the 1-619-561-7764 number. This set-up can turn 44 inch tires no problem at very low pressures. For our heavy vehicles (Range Rover owners like me) drop that size down a bit to get a more accurate reading. Even at 7000lbs with 37" tires this system should have no problems. I asked about single throw because I already have the bracket made on my axle, but for others, I recommend a double throw. Single throws have a different thrust (push or pull) each way. the pull is always less becasue of the reduction of cyclinder area due to piston rod. Double throws are equal both ways.
Before you send in system. Mark center line of tie rod. Turn to the full stop left and put a mark on axle housing of how far tie rod line mark went. Now turn to right. Again measure how far tie rod line mark went. Place mark on axle housing. Move vehicle steering to center. Measure the distance from tie rod mark (in center of tie rod) to left side. Do this for right side also. Provide these measurements when sending rover parts for Howe so they can build the custom ram to suit your vehicles geometry etc. With all of the changes we do to our vehicles I recommend everyone perfroms their own calculations. The ram will releave a lot of the pressure on the sector rod in our units and most likely improve the longevity of our units. Not to mention allowing us to pick any line while rock crawling
Way:D
Here is some information about our rover systems that I found in my tech manual. The pump is a Hobourn Eaton V-Series 200. Operating pressure straight ahead at idle is 7 kgf/c^2 (99.54 PSI). At full lock at idle pressure is 28 kgf/cm^2 (398.16 PSI). At full lock at 1000 rev/min operating pressure range is 70-77 kgf/cm^2 (995.4-1094.9 PSI). The pump GPM right now is around 2.88 from what my basic calculations yield.
If you want Hydraulic assist you will need to take your box, pump and resevoir off of vehicle and send to Howe. They disassemble and modify existing parts so that GPM is as high as possible. Because of the small output of the pump it is most likely that a 1" or 1.5" ram will have to be used. The problem with going to a 2 or 2.5 is that the pump cannot press the volume quickly enough to meet ram requirements (under panic operations ram could bind if steering to right quickly then left or vice versa,etc.). The output of a howe pump is 1300 PSI and puts out close to 5 GPM (and 1600lbs of force). Because of this a 2"+ ram can be used.
Since it costs $250 to have our pump modified and rebuilt it makes sense to me to pay $325 for the bigger pump that Howe uses. Downfall is that a bracket will have to be made to attach their pump to our engine. Their pumps are a modified Saginaw unit. I do not know if rover ever used a saginaw pump in their vehicles with the 3.9 liter motor, but if they did I am sure a factory bracket could be purchased.
The rams (although) filled with fluid still have friction in them especially under high load situations. Because of this a filter is used. For this they use a modified Toyota filter. They can make it remote resevoir or have it attach to the pump I think. Without this the fluid will turn black very quickly according to Howe.
When they tap the box they use one of the three fiting sizes. #6, #8, or #10. There kits do not include lines so a local hydraulic shop will need to make them. They recommend the blue 2000 lb (9000 lb burst rated) line with steel fitting only.
The cost break down is as follows ballpark.
$475 modified box
$325 Pump (or have yours modifed for $250)
$150 for filter system
$186 for ram (regardless of size)
$? Shipping costs
$150ish for custom lines in your town
=1286ish + shipping both ways (does not include dismantle or fluid replacement)
Kind of expensive, but if used on the highway it is recommended to have the GPM and ram match. Plus I can't imagine most of us can tap our own box and modify the inside to allow unit to work. Super nice people at tech support there.
If anyone decides to do this ( I am saving now), send to the attention of Chris and send to the Howe address. I called the 1-619-561-7764 number. This set-up can turn 44 inch tires no problem at very low pressures. For our heavy vehicles (Range Rover owners like me) drop that size down a bit to get a more accurate reading. Even at 7000lbs with 37" tires this system should have no problems. I asked about single throw because I already have the bracket made on my axle, but for others, I recommend a double throw. Single throws have a different thrust (push or pull) each way. the pull is always less becasue of the reduction of cyclinder area due to piston rod. Double throws are equal both ways.
Before you send in system. Mark center line of tie rod. Turn to the full stop left and put a mark on axle housing of how far tie rod line mark went. Now turn to right. Again measure how far tie rod line mark went. Place mark on axle housing. Move vehicle steering to center. Measure the distance from tie rod mark (in center of tie rod) to left side. Do this for right side also. Provide these measurements when sending rover parts for Howe so they can build the custom ram to suit your vehicles geometry etc. With all of the changes we do to our vehicles I recommend everyone perfroms their own calculations. The ram will releave a lot of the pressure on the sector rod in our units and most likely improve the longevity of our units. Not to mention allowing us to pick any line while rock crawling
Way:D