It has less than 100K on it. The motor came out of a company truck which was totalled at 30K miles. They only used this truck around town after he did the motor swap; he guesses he put another 30K - 50 K miles. HE COULD NOT FIT THE INTERCOOLER IN THE OLD TRUCK...COULD IT (motor/turbo) BE DAMAGED?

What should I do (look for) on my test drive?

I can buy it for $3500 (comes in a '89 Dodge dually w/ a flatbed)

727 tranny

Dana 71 rear??? (3.08 gears?)

Do I need to see if it is a 53 block?

What kind of power should I expect?

Started up instantly today after sitting for months.

He said it would drive it anywhere right now.

BTW, I'm just going to use the motor/tranny in my Super Duty.

Watch out for the tranny.

On the engine, I would take the head off and have it checked out. Cracks are pretty common but a cheap and easy fix. I think I had my head fixed up (decked, cracks repaired, valve job, etc.) for about $350. Top end gasket set was about $100 and head bolts were about $120 I think.

Stock tune should be around 160 hp/400ft.lb. Tweaked (spending almost zero money), I think you could make up towards 200-220 with gobs or torque. I would recommned at least a 4" exhaust from the get go. The turbo should have the 18cm exhaust housing, may have the crappy 21cm exhaust housing. You will probably want to upgrade that lagmaster to a 16 or so, or even something wastegated.

Running w/o intercooler shouldn't have hurt anything. Stock from the intercooled trucks to the non-intercooled trucks I beleive the injection pump is tuned slightly differently, which you will probably tweak anyway so who cares. The timing is set different and the injectors are also different. Not sure about the camshaft. So really, there isn't much different from the IC to NON-IC engine, so there shouldn't be any negative effects to the engine for running without the IC. If you are planning on using an IC, I would go with a Powerstroke one for your project or something else larger instead of a stock Dodge one.

Hope that helps some.

You must do a writeup on the swap...Whenever my 7.3 blows I am gonna swap a 5.9 into my '96.

BTW, ain't no way its a 53 block, way too old. From what people say, the 727 is the best transmission dodge ever made(back in the day anyways). Personaly I would rather have the 4100r you have now though.

Thanks BikerSC! I was told the 727 was pretty solid, but that one is weak also?

gotmuddy, I'm trying to get away from computer controlled stuff on my vehicles! That 4R100 would need some kind of computer to control it. I don't even know if there is such a thing for that tranny. I know there is an aftermarket computer for the 700R4.

The 700r4 isnt computer controlled. Maybe your thinking about the 4L60E

Well just in general as most would agree the Dodge trannies are less than desirable. For any use other than daily driving the guys on the Cummins forums all recommend upgrades.

Thanks BikerSC! I was told the 727 was pretty solid, but that one is weak also?

gotmuddy, I'm trying to get away from computer controlled stuff on my vehicles! That 4R100 would need some kind of computer to control it. I don't even know if there is such a thing for that tranny. I know there is an aftermarket computer for the 700R4.

I've personally seen Dodge 727 trannys behind 1st gen cummins dodges with 300k or more miles on them with no problems.

Personally, I really don't think any of the three companies (Dodge, Chevy, or Ford) really have an awesome, solid automatic trans that will last forever behind them. I think a lot of the guys who own other brands of trucks just like to jump on the Dodge trannys as being bad even though they may not have personal experience with them. I personally have had 2 Ford trannys (one E4OD and one 4R100) fail on me at a mileage that I feel was premature. I have yet to have a Dodge automatic fail on me.

While it isn't quite apples to apples, I have a buddy who has raced with a 727 behind his big block for 9 years on a stock rebuild with only a good converter and manual valve body in it. The only reason it came out to be rebuilt was because the sprag broke in it when a ujoint failed.

Well just in general as most would agree the Dodge trannies are less than desirable. For any use other than daily driving the guys on the Cummins forums all recommend upgrades.


Anything newer than a 727 I would agree, but a 727 is a pretty damn good transmission.

Duane

Thanks BikerSC! I was told the 727 was pretty solid, but that one is weak also?

gotmuddy, I'm trying to get away from computer controlled stuff on my vehicles! That 4R100 would need some kind of computer to control it. I don't even know if there is such a thing for that tranny. I know there is an aftermarket computer for the 700R4.

Baumann Engineering makes a stand alone setup for the 4R100:

http://www.becontrols.com/

The 727 is a great tranny, just no OD, which will restrict your top end on the older Cummins.

Chris

The '93 is a good motor. It is an old school injection pump, the rotary. But is good but for semi limited power. Depends on what you want to do. If you really want to crank it up then get a '94-98.5' with the inline pump. Nothing wrong with the rotary pump but I would expect maybe 250 hp at most (which is still a ton of power).. $3500 is a little expensive but there might some value to parting out the truck. You can get 6BTs for $2000-$2500 already pulled I feel like...

Also comments about the turbo are on the money, it will have a big slow spooling turbo that you will probably want to replace at some point, so factor in another $250-$500 for a bare bones used turbo, or much for some something bling.. Or you could buy a cheapo $165 turbo housing 16cm2 that will be great and solve that probably...

If you google it there are some good writeups on benefits/ different years etc. I seem to remember the best are at dodgeram.org
http://www.dodgeram.org/tech/dsl/FAQ/turbo_faq.htm

Unsure of when, buts its around 93 or 94 that went to a lockup converter in the tranny.
I'd aim to get one of those and install a manual switch.

Unsure of when, buts its around 93 or 94 that went to a lockup converter in the tranny.
I'd aim to get one of those and install a manual switch.

AFIK, that would have happened in '94 with the new body style. Those would have also been overdrive trannys by then.

I have been thinking of dropping a CTD into my F250. Does anyone know the smog laws in CA about transfering a diesel into a gas application?

I have been thinking of dropping a CTD into my F250. Does anyone know the smog laws in CA about transfering a diesel into a gas application?

I am no expert on Kommi-fornia, but from what I have mistakenly read that the donor motor has to be from a newer vehicle.

Is the tranny you want to use from the 93 or 89? If it's from the 93 then it's a 518 which is a 727 with an overdrive added to the back. If it were me doing your swap I would want some kind of OD. I think the Fordcummins guys in Montana might have an adapter to your Superduty tranny.

from what I hear you should stay very far away from the fordcummins guys. I bet AA has a adapter for you.

from what I hear you should stay very far away from the fordcummins guys. I bet AA has a adapter for you.

That's what they say on TDR. There is a place in Montana called Autoworld that does Cummins swaps by the bushel. They make good lookin parts.

I think $3500 is kinda steep if you're only gonna use the engine (doubt you wanna use a non O/D trans).
Travis..

I think $3500 is kinda steep if you're only gonna use the engine (doubt you wanna use a non O/D trans).
Travis..

It depends on if the truck he is pulling the motor out of is a 4x4 or not. If it is, parting the rest of the truck out could pay for a portion of the motor or a different transmission if he was wanting something with overdrive.

Just some thoughts here...

Anything newer than a 727 I would agree, but a 727 is a pretty damn good transmission.

Duane

i would agree there i had one behind a dually flat bed tow 20k with no problems stout tranny

It depends on if the truck he is pulling the motor out of is a 4x4 or not. If it is, parting the rest of the truck out could pay for a portion of the motor or a different transmission if he was wanting something with overdrive.

Just some thoughts here...

then he can get the new venture over drive and it will be a good set up
better than my 47rh (piece of shiat)

If your shooting for under 350 HP the Rotary Pump can't be beat! A fifteen dollar governor spring will be your best Mod. The only problem you'll have if you try and push too much fuel thru the pump is that the electric shutdown solenoid will quit working and you'll have to have a manual shutdown cable to kill the engine.

Check out http://destroked.com/ for conversion parts.

Thanks every body. I have a Gear Vendors overdrive laying around that I was planning on using. I have found, the Gear Vendors doesn't do so great with computer controlled transmissions, but I'm hoping it will work well behind the 727.

What rear end came with the '89 Dodge duallies? The guy told me it has a Dana 71 with a 3.08 gear ratio.

The donor truck is a 2wd with a 8 foot flat bed. It does have 6 newer tires on it! I can't think of anything else on the truck that is worth anything. I thought $3500 was a good price for being able to drive it.

I found another 12 valve Cummins that was completely rebuilt and new sleeves installed; he wants $5K. It had 30K miles on it (zero miles since rebuild) but it's out of the truck. It comes with everything to do the swap, except a tranny. That sounded expensive and I like to hear it run or drive it before I drop that kind of money.

So, how will a pumped up 12 valve compare to my stock '03 Dodge Cummins HO?

Chris

I'm also thinking of swapping this motor into my motorhome. The 454 big block makes the motorhome useless because it costs too much in gas. For X-mas, my wife and I drove it from CA to OR to Moab, Phoenix, Truckhaven Hills, and then back to Apple Valley. It cost us $1500 in gas!!!

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c138/EMIEVEL/my%20fleet/12.jpg

It cleans up pretty good but this was after 700 miles of snow and Ice.

FYI, there are several rotary pumped 1st gens out there with 500HP plus now. They tweakers have found ways to push those pumps pretty hard.

Rear axle, yes would be a D71. You can't put lower gears in it, will have to be swapped. Put it up for sale on TDR or DTR, there are some guys always wanting them bad. Nobody makes the gearset for them anymore.

The GV + the 727 would be a pretty decent combo. Just no lockup converter as the only downfall.

Andy

Couldn't I get an aftermarket lock up converter for the 727?

Trans has no provisions for it internally.

AFIK, that would have happened in '94 with the new body style. Those would have also been overdrive trannys by then.


My 93 had/has a loc up torqueconverter and OD started in 92

My 93 had/has a loc up torqueconverter and OD started in 92

You have OD, but no lockup converter. They switched to the A518 in 91.5 model year. The A518 was never lockup. 47rh in 94 was the first year for that.

Andy.

My 93 had/has a loc up torqueconverter and OD started in 92

See, that's what I always thought too. As of late though I've seen some conflicting information claiming that the pre '94 trannys had overdrive but no lockup so I'm not sure what is true and what isn't.

You have OD, but no lockup converter. They switched to the A518 in 91.5 model year. The A518 was never lockup. 47rh in 94 was the first year for that.

Andy.

That's the way I understood it as well.

Price seams a little high for what you are getting...but prices varry in different areas.

I just got a 91.5 CTD 200K miles, 4wd, 3/4 ton, SRW, reg cab, Front d60, 3.55 gears, 5 speed/205, with 10 ply tires, good gooseneck & bumper pull, AC works, brake controler & several different plug styles

for 3250$

You have OD, but no lockup converter. They switched to the A518 in 91.5 model year. The A518 was never lockup. 47rh in 94 was the first year for that.

Andy.

I DO have lockup.....------ or a 5spd auto

Not sure how many of them there are, but I have heard of a few 92-93's with lockup.

And price wise, these things are all over the place. I have seen people get what you are talking about for $2000 from an unsuspecting seller, to $6000 for the same truck. The fact is, is that they are actually worth quite a bit to some people. Like for example, I bought mine from a good friend. He has just (in the past 6 months) spent around $1k on a new injection pump, and $3500 or so for a NV4500 swap with a SB clutch. So for the $5000 I was paying, I was getting those two items and the rest of the package for $500.

Sounds a little steep, don't expect to make much money parting the truck out, theres not much of a market for that shit, I tried. The 727 alone wont make you happy, but would be great with a GV, and be a much better swap than mating it to your current auto. I've never used the 727 but I've heard its one of the best trannies ever built. I have a 6bt non intercooled, and a 2wd A518 for sale, PM me if interested.