I am currently putting a 6BT into my Rover Camper and I am thinking the 1310 uj's being a weak link. I know that permanent 4WD will spread the load but standard UJ's are small and the camper weighs in at 10500 lbs. The front is getting a double cardon driveshaft , I have the larger flange for the LT230 end and the front axle end will be standard 1310 UJ. So if I put a bigger driveshaft with either 1350 or 1410 ujs at both ends of the rear driveshaft the front will be the fuse in the system because there will be a 1310 uj in it. If I break it I can put the difflock in and carefully drive home on stronger rear. Am I being overly concerned? has anyone else done this? which size if I do upgrade? I will obviously have to get a couple of adapter flanges made up to make this happen.
So any ideas or thoughts?

Gaza

I Think GkN in Britain already do an adaptor flange to fit larger UJ's to the old 101 FC Landies.
Bill.
Edit. Unless you have a Salisbury front axle assembly with 101 CV joints, your fuse will probably be a diff, axle or birfield joint rather than a driveshaft UJ

http://www.propshaft.co.uk/

Give these guys a bell in Bradford. They did my custom wide yolk, narrown diameter shafts for the Tonka. They are very cost effective, big Land Rover fans (used to have a shop comp buggy as I recall) and will work with you.

Use a front output flange from a Disco II with a double cardan front shaft. It will fit in the rear with some minor machining. Redrill for 1410 flange type U-joint (drill the drum as well). There is enough meat for the larger pattern. Voila, bomber rear driveline at the T case.

For the diff end, I am not sure if the regular Dana 60 yoke fits the rover stuff. If so, you could use a 1350 D60 yoke on the diff.

My recommendation would be not to use the stock 3/8 studs/bolts and small pattern with the 6BT. I redrilled mine for Toyota shafts (using Gr. 8 7/16 bolts) and they are holding up fine despite my best attempts at destroying them. The 1 ton driveline is cheap insurance, not really for ultimate strength but for the torque input, which is likely to be triple anything that is stock Land-Rover once you have turned the pump up. I think the 1310s would give up the ghost quick.

I Think GkN in Britain already do an adaptor flange to fit larger UJ's to the old 101 FC Landies.
Bill.
Edit. Unless you have a Salisbury front axle assembly with 101 CV joints, your fuse will probably be a diff, axle or birfield joint rather than a driveshaft
UJ

I have never heard of this do you have anymore details or a link?
I do have a front salisbury, don't have the 101 cv's though. Do you have any idea how much this costs?

Handbuilt the D2 double cardon joints are an option but I don't think they are as well built as the genuine GKN ones, also I have a disc handbrake and to clear the caliper I would need an adapter with a 1310 on LT230 end and a 1410 flange on the other. The rear prop is quite long and angles are good so I wouldn't need a DC rear I don't think .

RPR I will have a look at www.propshaft.co.uk I actually only live about 70 miles from them... cheers.

I have been told 1410 are 2X strength of a 1310 but do I need it? If I do get an adapter made up for rear or buy one from GKN as suggested I may aswell go for a 1410.

Gaza

I have never heard of this do you have anymore details or a link?
I do have a front salisbury, don't have the 101 cv's though. Do you have any idea how much this costs?

Handbuilt the D2 double cardon joints are an option but I don't think they are as well built as the genuine GKN ones, also I have a disc handbrake and to clear the caliper I would need an adapter with a 1310 on LT230 end and a 1410 flange on the other. The rear prop is quite long and angles are good so I wouldn't need a DC rear I don't think .

RPR I will have a look at www.propshaft.co.uk I actually only live about 70 miles from them... cheers.

I have been told 1410 are 2X strength of a 1310 but do I need it? If I do get an adapter made up for rear or buy one from GKN as suggested I may aswell go for a 1410.

Gaza

No, no... Not the double cardan joint, the flange for the double cardan joint which is on the front of a DII LT230 T case. The part to which the double cardan joint bolts up. it has a larger pattern and can be redrilled for the larger 1350/1410 pattern. The original flanges are too small to be redrilled. The double cardan joint is crap!

Who cares if you need it or not, it's the same cost and complexity and the u joints will last a lot longer!

No, no... Not the double cardan joint, the flange for the double cardan joint which is on the front of a DII LT230 T case. The part to which the double cardan joint bolts up. it has a larger pattern and can be redrilled for the larger 1350/1410 pattern. The original flanges are too small to be redrilled. The double cardan joint is crap!

Who cares if you need it or not, it's the same cost and complexity and the u joints will last a lot longer!

I'm glad we agree. I have 2 of the larger flanges already they are from an armoured 110 salisbury front. Don't know if they are exactly the same as the D2 but sounds the same.

Gaza

I have never heard of this do you have anymore details or a link?
I do have a front salisbury, don't have the 101 cv's though. Do you have any idea how much this costs?

Handbuilt the D2 double cardon joints are an option but I don't think they are as well built as the genuine GKN ones, also I have a disc handbrake and to clear the caliper I would need an adapter with a 1310 on LT230 end and a 1410 flange on the other. The rear prop is quite long and angles are good so I wouldn't need a DC rear I don't think .

RPR I will have a look at www.propshaft.co.uk I actually only live about 70 miles from them... cheers.

I have been told 1410 are 2X strength of a 1310 but do I need it? If I do get an adapter made up for rear or buy one from GKN as suggested I may aswell go for a 1410.

Gaza

I read about the GKN larger U joint conversion a couple of years ago in a UK 101 club newsletter Titled ''6 stud''. A search around the British forums may turn up a link;
The 101 CV Joint conversion is anything but straighforward and requires that you either convert a complete 101 front end to coil and link bracketry including cutting and turning the swivel balls to tilt the diff, or grafting the 101 swivel/ hub assemblies to your existing Salisbury front end in such a way that the 101 inner halfshafts are the correct length. Either way you'd need to adapt 5 stud Landy hubs to reworked 101 spindles/stub axles, unless you prefer to carry 2 spare wheels. I have done the conversion once but it's a big job, requiring a fair bit of machining and welding. It may be worth trying Ashcrofts or Longfield heavy duty replacements for your current CV's first.

I built a 6x6 Landy back in the 1970/80's and found during extensive testing that both rear axle assemblies needed to be as strong if not stronger than a single axle on a 4x4, because when driving crosscountry axle articulation often gets used up causing all the vehicles rear weight to be concentrated on only one of the tandem rear axles, leading to bending of the housing, halfshaft failure, or ring and pinion failure (modified Rover diffs).
Have your rear axle housings been reinforced over standard?
bill.

I read about the GKN larger U joint conversion a couple of years ago in a UK 101 club newsletter Titled ''6 stud''. A search around the British forums may turn up a link;
The 101 CV Joint conversion is anything but straighforward and requires that you either convert a complete 101 front end to coil and link bracketry including cutting and turning the swivel balls to tilt the diff, or grafting the 101 swivel/ hub assemblies to your existing Salisbury front end in such a way that the 101 inner halfshafts are the correct length. Either way you'd need to adapt 5 stud Landy hubs to reworked 101 spindles/stub axles, unless you prefer to carry 2 spare wheels. I have done the conversion once but it's a big job, requiring a fair bit of machining and welding. It may be worth trying Ashcrofts or Longfield heavy duty replacements for your current CV's first.

I built a 6x6 Landy back in the 1970/80's and found during extensive testing that both rear axle assemblies needed to be as strong if not stronger than a single axle on a 4x4, because when driving crosscountry axle articulation often gets used up causing all the vehicles rear weight to be concentrated on only one of the tandem rear axles, leading to bending of the housing, halfshaft failure, or ring and pinion failure (modified Rover diffs).
Have your rear axle housings been reinforced over standard?
bill.

Bill,

Is there anything you haven't done?

Bill,

Is there anything you haven't done?

A woman.


:flipoff2:

Bill,

Is there anything you haven't done?

One thing I'm afraid I haven't managed to do JL, is locate a Stage one V8 grill for you. Your email address doesn't work for me either, as emails come back as undeliverable.

In a 4wd sense, I admit to having experimented with many of the concepts a lot of offroad enthusiasts think about. I've been a mechanic and hopeless offroad addict for more than 40 years, so it should be no surprise that there aren't too many things ''I haven't done''. I still managed to make time to partake in the pleasures of female company however.
Bill.

I built a 6x6 Landy back in the 1970/80's and found during extensive testing that both rear axle assemblies needed to be as strong if not stronger than a single axle on a 4x4, because when driving crosscountry axle articulation often gets used up causing all the vehicles rear weight to be concentrated on only one of the tandem rear axles, leading to bending of the housing, halfshaft failure, or ring and pinion failure (modified Rover diffs).
Have your rear axle housings been reinforced over standard?
bill.

All 3 axles are Salisbury, the front & back are HD sals from an armoured 110 these are only different from standard sals in that the axle tubes are about twice as thick. No probs so far. All 6 springs are HD 110 rear, yes including the front. The front axle is a 1986 so the CV's are the bigger ones, not as big as 101's I know. There are pics of my chassis on the link I posted but you can't see the axles clearly. The front 1/2 shafts or axles are ashcroft uprated ones. If/when I break something I would like to put difflock in and drive home on the rear which is why I am asking about bigger uj's in rear prop. I think mcnamara make 1.5" 35 spline 1/2 shafts for rear.

Gaza

All 3 axles are Salisbury, the front & back are HD sals from an armoured 110 these are only different from standard sals in that the axle tubes are about twice as thick. No probs so far. All 6 springs are HD 110 rear, yes including the front. The front axle is a 1986 so the CV's are the bigger ones, not as big as 101's I know. There are pics of my chassis on the link I posted but you can't see the axles clearly. The front 1/2 shafts or axles are ashcroft uprated ones. If/when I break something I would like to put difflock in and drive home on the rear which is why I am asking about bigger uj's in rear prop. I think mcnamara make 1.5" 35 spline 1/2 shafts for rear.

Gaza

It really does seem as though you have most of the bases covered. I assume the rear propshaft you are concerned about is the one from the transfercase to the power divider that drives both rear axles? Does it run reasonably straight and level ? On my old 6x6 ,due to having a lot of interaxle articulation I made all propshafts with a sliding joints on both ends, so in the event of U joint failure of the first rear driveshaft I could borrow the slip joint and UJ from the front one to get home on. I never needed it but my rig only weighed about 4000lbs.
bill.