I was looking through a bunch or pics and how does everyone keep there rigs so perfect... mid season and they are cherry..

Lances looks good, Mikes, ect.. I go out for a good rock weekend and come back with half the paint missing and bent side bars, smashed hood, ect.. Is there so much Money in it now that these guys are "rebuilding there rig" before each event... I mean cmon the axle tubes are perfectly black? no rock rash... Shit its like Nascar:rolleyes:

Is it now become a clean sport again? The old days.. last week.. where if your rig was granite coated then you where pretty hardcore...Now if your rig is clean and built like a buggy your hard core....??? what happened??

Maybe they just drive better than you. :flipoff2:

I personally think it is cool when you see a clean rig that is doing the tough stuff, but I agree that it must take a lot of coin to keep them clean. Maybe sponsors don't want to put their sticker on a dented up rig? :confused:

Thats funny Mike!

I paint my junk after rough trips. It only takes a couple $3 cans of spray paint to stop the rust. I know quite a few others who do this also. It looks good in photos, but if you're close you can tell it's rattle can. I'm guessing they do similar. I just do it because I don't want clean scrapes to rust up.

what you haven't seen the new anti-scratch ARCA paint? it strengthens all metal by 75% and is garenteed shine for an entire season if waxed religiously :D

So are most of the ARCA guys fully Sponsered?
That would make sense
Mike-

a lot of the time.. they have to go thru and clean their vehicles.. Shaffer.. when he rolled in victorville.. had to spend the next few days replacing bent tube and sheet metal.. because of a photoshoot for summit.. A lot of the time.. they dont necessarily rebuild everything.. they just repaint.. sand.. replace broken peices..

They look really clean in the pictures.. but when you get up close you will see damage.. Jason bunch.. his fiberglass hood is cracked.. and has been for a while.. I bet lance has some damage here and there.. shaffer.. i know has some.. but not a lot..

and some of those rigs.. that seem all shiny and they always place high.. they just keep the rubber side down.. i can almost bet.. most of those rigs that always look perfect.. are not running the same body/sheetmetal that they were at the last comp

James

And by the way mike.. your neice.. and adrianne.. i was the james they asked about

I am seeing almost no rattle can in ARCA.... these are sweet paint jobs and lots of lexan... thats alot of time and $$$$

Mike-

mike

i don't compete but i probally use 3 to 6 cans of ODG after every trip repainting my rig from all the rock rash. i also debur all the tubes so i dont rip myself open. i just like it that way and always have. i also probally spend 10 hours preping my rig before each trip just doing maintance like making sure stuff is tight and replacing worn parts.

When there is THAT much dinero involved, the rigs have to be shiny and clean. The big name sponsors aren't gonna' ante up the cashola to show off a bunch of beat up, backwoods, Indiana rigs that looks like shiat in pictures.

Even for those guys who don't have sponsors, they have to look good to attract them.

I don't know the answer to this one, but do the RCAA events charge spectators to watch the events? If so, then the thinking is much like the "SUNDAY, SUNDAY, SUNDAY" stock car races at your local track. The races are more of a "show" than anything to attract paying spectators to come watch the races. The spectators arent' gonna' come watch a bunch of hillbilly rigs. They wanna' see the good looking stuff.

cmk

ya but Camo you didnt replace tubing and sheet metal... It would take me 3 hours to replace a bent door bar that I would just bend again... Some of the buggys have exposed tube frames that have to get dented... that would be nuts to replace a frame section for a couple dings... UNLESS... Bondo?

Mike-

HAH! Body lead! (so it still looks right when the paints ground off ;) )

Ken Shupe replaces bent and dented tube on his rig between competitions. He just re-did his cage because he though it "looked a little too boxy up top".

They definitely do throw a ton of money into the sport.

Thats awsome they can replace everything ...it just blows me away that there is that much $$ going into it. Next year the winnners purse will be a 1/4 Mill....

Mike-

Originally posted by bigdude
Ken Shupe replaces bent and dented tube on his rig between competitions. He just re-did his cage because he though it "looked a little too boxy up top".

They definitely do throw a ton of money into the sport.

DO these people have jobs?

Originally posted by cmk
When there is THAT much dinero involved, the rigs have to be shiny and clean. The big name sponsors aren't gonna' ante up the cashola to show off a bunch of beat up, backwoods, Indiana rigs that looks like shiat in pictures.

Even for those guys who don't have sponsors, they have to look good to attract them.

I don't know the answer to this one, but do the RCAA events charge spectators to watch the events? If so, then the thinking is much like the "SUNDAY, SUNDAY, SUNDAY" stock car races at your local track. The races are more of a "show" than anything to attract paying spectators to come watch the races. The spectators arent' gonna' come watch a bunch of hillbilly rigs. They wanna' see the good looking stuff.

cmk

cmk pretty much nailed it. For those (like Mike and I) who are sponsored, they expect your rig to look perfect (or close to it) for every event. They don't want their name on a POS looking hillbilly ride. And for those guys who are not sponsored yet, they need to keep their rigs looking pretty to attract sponsors. You aren't going to get a big sponsorship if your rig is all hammered looking.... Look at Tracy Jordan. He is one of the best out there. And he doesn't have any big name sponsors, because his rig looks like a total POS. Guess what? He's building a new ultra pretty "Toyota Matrix" to attract the sponsors....

Rigs get smashed up every event. And like desert racing, we go home, and fix them back up to look good for the next event. If you notice the pics of the Reno CalROCS, you'll notice Mike is running different body panels than he runs in RCAA. That's simply because nobody sponsors us for CalROCS, and we run the "used" body panels, and save the pretty ones for RCAA where Summit sponsors/pays us to look good, and perform good.

Yep, there's a lot of money in these comps. It's just like any other motorsport. You marry the sport. All of our time and money go into it. It's not a half ass thing anymore that we start working on the rig the day before the competition. Hell we practice EVERY week, work out (yes, my fat azz lifts weights :flipoff2: ) etc... We take it VERY seriously.

Originally posted by welndmn


DO these people have jobs?

I don't. :p

Originally posted by Lance
Hell we practice EVERY week, work out (yes, my fat azz lifts weights :flipoff2: ) etc... We take it VERY seriously.

Is chasing someone to the cooler after the comp considered "working out"? :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

But seriously most of the high $$ rigs I saw looked good from 10 feet and pics but up close you could tell they were getting used. A few hours of sanding and 10 mins in the paint booth can go a long way to making a rig look good.

Originally posted by Lance


cmk pretty much nailed it. For those (like Mike and I) who are sponsored, they expect your rig to look perfect (or close to it) for every event. They don't want their name on a POS looking hillbilly ride. And for those guys who are not sponsored yet, they need to keep their rigs looking pretty to attract sponsors. You aren't going to get a big sponsorship if your rig is all hammered looking....

So, it is all about the bling bling.

In addition to above there's the guys who run rigs built at thier own shops. I know if I owned a 4x4 fab shop I sure as hell wouldn't be running a POS lookin' rig. I'd be runnin' some sweet 'glass or metal. Why?? As much as people want to attract sponsers; Fab shops want to attract customers. You just gotta look good in events that are this public.

Originally posted by Lance


.....where Summit sponsors/pays us to look good, and perform good.


Lance do you have any links to Summit's sponsorship. I've been trhough the site and have not found any.

Originally posted by jdjanda


Lance do you have any links to Summit's sponsorship. I've been trhough the site and have not found any.

Summit only sponsors Mike and Shannon Campbell. They don't have a "program" or anything like that.

Dang...

I dont think I would ever have time to do that. With all the customer rigs to work on how can a shop have a full time ARCA rig? Dang...

Mike-

Originally posted by Lance


Summit only sponsors Mike and Shannon Campbell. They don't have a "program" or anything like that.

I'm looking for photos, write ups on the Summit site, even checked out the Truck Time Summit or what ever the hell it is called.

Lance How much time do you have a month into Competing?

Mike-

Originally posted by jdjanda


I'm looking for photos, write ups on the Summit site, even checked out the Truck Time Summit or what ever the hell it is called.

On the Summit Truckstyle homepage, there is this image:
http://www.summitracing.com/landing/truck/img/00/offroadlogo.gif
Which links to this page:
http://www.summitracing.com/landing/truck/offroadteam.htm

Here is another link:
http://www.summitracing.com/landing/truck/ln_02feature.htm?ID={68BD926B-D2CB-4BD0-8E20-E4965E735C1F}&Type=5#FeatTop

Actually, even though it cuts out the weekend warrier I think it is bad ass that the competetions are getting more and more sponsor oriented. I hope the prizes and sponsors get bigger and names like Lance Clifford will be as knows as the nascar drivers :beer:

someday i'll be able to tell my kids, yeah i saw Lance Clifford flop his rig on the first turn at calrocs, and mike shaffer built my buddies rig. And they'll be like "wow dad that fawkin rules" and then i'll bitch slap em for cussin :flipoff2:

Dallas

One of the local Shops here was into the the comps really big for a while. (Hich Country 4x4) Last time I was down there I mentioned that I had seen their rig on some pics on the net. The guy said nope not ours anymore. We got out of it. It cost them WAY to much money to compete. The rigs were always breaking something and that was eating a ton of their profits up I guess.

I think my uncle said it best:

"Gee, if I were you, I'd make more money so I could afford to build a GOOD vehicle and be competitive."

It's totally a matter of priorities. If you want to win bad enough, and are willing to spend as much time and money as it takes, you will(both win and spend';). It's no accident that the guys that win win. There will definitely be a lot of people flocking to the sport as the purses go up(and they are, both the people and the purses), but the guys that have already been paying the price for as long as they have, and have gained the experience they have, will be extremely tough to bump out of competition.

Lucky for me, my major sponsors(depending on your definition of a 'major sponsor') are all construction companies, so they don't care if the vehicle is trashed or not:D They also get a big kick out of pit crew duty, which I have absolutely NO problem with. We broke on every obstacle the first day of UROC in Cedar City, sometimes multiple breaks, and still made it to every obstacle in time, with breakdown time left at the end of the day. If you break as often as I seem to, pitcrew can save your butt:D

Originally posted by Ryan
I think my uncle said it best:
If you break as often as I seem to, pitcrew can save your butt:D

Yep a good support team is critical. We give our support person a percentage of our winnings. They have made $1000 per event this year follwing us around on the quad. Not too shabby! :cool2:

Originally posted by Lance
Yep a good support team is critical. We give our support person a percentage of our winnings. They have made $1000 per event this year follwing us around on the quad. Not too shabby! :cool2:

Damnit! I'm playin' pit crew monkey for the wrong team! :D

http://pages.prodigy.net/coolmank/pics/rdm/06-01-02/rdm3003.JPG

cmk

It all boils down to a matter of pride and class ...

Didn't have fun cuz it ain't durty?
Nope, had a blast ... then blasted it clean again ...

See above.

O.k. so how many guys are buying turn key buggies and competing vs. guys building them on there own? Has ARCA brought in more "racing sportsman" into rockcrawling than rockcrawlers?

Mike-

I haven't been to an RCAA event this year, but I just looked over the scores from Vernal, and it looks to me like most people are still building thier own vehicles *kinda*. Meaning that they are building the vehicles, but having other people build a lot of the parts, like chassis, motor, axles, etc., as contrasted to a turnkey vehicle like a Sniper or Scorpion.

Then there's a whole slew of competitors who own their own shop, or something of the sort, and they would definitely be classified as building thier own vehicles.

There's a few who pretty much bought a turnkey vehicle, but most likely designed or dreamt up some, most, or all of the vehicle, and then just contracted someone to build it for them(which is definitely what I would do if I had the cash).

As far as guys that are competing, but wouldn't know how to change a u-joint to save thier life, it doesn't seem to me that there are too many of them(if any).

As many guys as there are chomping at the bit to compete that have built thier own stuff before, or at least know what they are doing, I don't think the millionaire looking for a new hobby will be too prevelant in the competitions. It seems like to devote the kind of time and money necessary to be competitive, you reeeallly have to have it in your blood, not just want to try it out once or twice. Sure, Walker, who had most likely never been rockcrawling in his life until he decided he wanted to compete, just walked right in and started competing(and winning), but he definitely already had a passion for *something* relative to wheelin'.

I don't think RCAA has brought more "racing sportsmen" than rockcrawlers into the sport really(at least not that are competing). Of course Ned Bacon might disagree with me though:D

Mike,

Your question about Bondo reminded me of a very cool piece of equipment my Dad told me about.
He and and good friend of his restore and build custom cruisers. For detail pieces, body fills, hard-to-find trim, etc., they have a tool call (if I remember) a metal sprayer. It's like a welder, sorta, but it's used to build-up, or add metal to panels, etc..

Depending on the types of alloys you can get for these sprayers, they might be a kinda cool tool for the comp crowd..

Different kinds of metal sprayers too. The two I have used are a powder sprayer (not much), and a sprayer that uses Oxy/Actylene and compressed air(too much).

As for using it to fix tubes, or metal work, it's awfully brittle, and wouldn't work well at all under any tension. We used it to repair bearing surfaces, which are under compression(bearings are pressed on).

I have seen a dented tube repaired by filling it with 10PSI compressed air and gradually heating the tube with a torch, and then cooling it with a wet rag as soon as it gets to the right size. I would definately not recond this, but maybe some of these guys are doing that.

How much do the sponsors like Summit etc take out of the winnings?

Originally posted by welndmn


DO these people have jobs?

Shupe owns his own shop that does extremely well. So he doesn't have to have too much time involved there anymore. Bryan Hamilton is another guy I've run with. He had Chris Durham build his tubed "Cruiser" and he owns a well drilling company. That is very profitable and affords him the free time. Durham does fab work and builds rigs when at home, but he's got so many sponsors that competeing doesn't cost him much (if anything).

We run ERoCC and my partner owns a 4x4 shop. He handles most of the "paperwork" so he's always fresh to work on the competition rig at night. We keep our Jeep pretty to try to attract more sponsors. We also tried to keep a full bodied stock looking (except for the stretch) Jeep for competition hoping we could find a different niche with sponsors (vs. tube buggies).

Originally posted by xj4rocks
How much do the sponsors like Summit etc take out of the winnings?

Most sponsors kick down more cash or parts if you win

They have their wives get busy on it with a brillow pad *bling**bling*:flipoff2: But maybe some day when the ol'man gets sick of it he will remember and kick down LOL YEAH RIGHT:flipoff2:

Walker keeps two bodies. After each event the whole body comes off and gets replaced with the freah one. The wekend old body gets repaired or replaced and repainted.

I don't know about guys like Lance, Mike and Shupe, but I would think that cleaning up a vehicle actually makes it better in comps. If you clean a vehicle, you are more likely to find problem areas that need attention instead of finding them at the comp.

I clean and touch up the paint on my Legends rig before every comp, and I usually find something that needs repair or replacement. Of course that rear fender that is crunched, that will be repaired before next year... got to have strait panels to put sponsor stickers on :D

Originally posted by snobrder


I clean and touch up the paint on my Legends rig before every comp, and I usually find something that needs repair or replacement. Of course that rear fender that is crunched, that will be repaired before next year... got to have strait panels to put sponsor stickers on :D

I'm with Mike on this one... I've got lots of crunched sheetmetal after the last ERoCC comp that I am working on fixing now. Rig will look pretty clean again for next season, and will try to keep it decent looking for each event I make it too.

For the "little" guys, straight out replacing body panels all the time is probably out of the question, but we can do wonders with a cheap set of body hammers, dollies, slide hammer and a porta power set. Sand and paint and the rig starts looking pretty presentable again. You can still tell its used, but it will look decent.