I am thinking about turning my DD 5.9 ZJ into a do it all vehicle. I use it tow about a 4500 lb trailer (have been for about 3 yrs) and want to add trail riding to its list of chores.

So far i'm thinking an 8.8 swap, air lockers f and r, 231 t case, 4.10's, amd either one set of 33" mt's or a set of 31/32" at's for dd/tow duty and some more aggressive 33's for wheelin'. Anyone have experience/suggestions on suspension choice. It needs to be stable enough to tow w/ and be descent offroad. If it drove nice everyday that would be a bonus.

Thanks in advance

I am thinking about turning my DD 5.9 ZJ into a do it all vehicle. I use it tow about a 4500 lb trailer (have been for about 3 yrs) and want to add trail riding to its list of chores.

So far i'm thinking an 8.8 swap, air lockers f and r, 231 t case, 4.10's, amd either one set of 33" mt's or a set of 31/32" at's for dd/tow duty and some more aggressive 33's for wheelin'. Anyone have experience/suggestions on suspension choice. It needs to be stable enough to tow w/ and be descent offroad. If it drove nice everyday that would be a bonus.

Thanks in advance

Sure it can be done! If it should be done may be a different story. If you build it pretty moderatly and keep up with the maintenance than you can keep it nice and still do some towing etc with it. I have a few friends that DD their 5.9's or other ZJ's and wheel them fairly hard. If you're just starting out wheeling and wheel light then you'll probably be fine.

Check out Mallcrawlin.com for more ZJ info as the site is suited 90% to grands. There is plenty of info on here but another place to search for different suspension options.

I would run aadco sway bars front and rear to help with handling especially when towing.

be sure to get a suspension like rubicon express-dont go cheap on some other one.

I would run aadco sway bars front and rear to help with handling especially when towing.

X2 1st upgrade I would do

be sure to get a suspension like rubicon express-dont go cheap on some other one.

X 30 billion

Definitely don't cheap out w/ the suspension. If it were me....I'd do a Rubicon Express 3.5" lift.

Ummmm, one thing though. Usually when you add lift your springs are softer so that they have more flex. Maybe I'm wrong, if so it wouldn't be the first time.

FYI I put a car trailer with a front loaded ZR2 on my ZJ with the 4.5 superflex two nights ago just to move it around the driveway. HAHA no way, squatted that SOB all the way down, wasn't happenin'. Granted the truck should be backwards on the trailer, but hey I didn't load it.

If you have your trailer balanced very well, which it sounds like you do since its 4500 lbs maybe you'd be alright?

http://www.tntcustoms.com/webv5/ZJCatalog.asp :smokin:


I would install the C-clip eliminator kit for that 8.8

C clips :flipoff2:

sitting behind a 5.9 that could be bad :p

I'd get a decent lift kit, with front and rear disconnectable sway bars for tow duty.

As far as the rear springs being soft... Since you plan on running ARB's, get an air-bag setup for the rear that goes inside coils, so for towing you can air the bags up to about 70 psi and that should prevent the rear end from riding the bumpstops. Let the air out for trail duty (depending on how much travel you have, size air bags accordingly so they aren't limiting the droop)

I'm running air bags in the rear coils right now. Air Lift helper springs. They keep it level when I hook up the trailer (about 35psi).

I've been looking at the long arm kits from RE and Rusty's. Anybody have an experienced recommendation? I would rather have the lower height(4.5 vs 5.5") of the RE kit but there is a healthy price difference. Maybe I'll call em and ask about spring rates.

I'm running air bags in the rear coils right now. Air Lift helper springs. They keep it level when I hook up the trailer (about 35psi).

I've been looking at the long arm kits from RE and Rusty's. Anybody have an experienced recommendation? I would rather have the lower height(4.5 vs 5.5") of the RE kit but there is a healthy price difference. Maybe I'll call em and ask about spring rates.

I've not heard many good things about rusty's, but I'm in the process of installing TNT's stuff and I really can say that I like the quality and stoutness of them. Their shipping could use some help and they can sure use some help updating stock numbers, but their products are quality stuff. RE is good stuff too, but I haven't seen a whole lot of guys running the long arms they sell. Mostly short arms. If I were to do it, I'd say TNT stuff, RE springs, and airbag helpers in the rear. I'd get a Currie swaybar in the front and an aadco rear and make discos for the rear. TNT's stuff is good for 4.5", so you can get RE springs and TNT stuff no prob.

i have a xj and a mj my xj has the 4.5 rustys offroad with 35's and i love the way it drives and rides also the flex is the best i have been around yet ; the mj on the other hand has 6.5 rough country lift with 33s and i hate it the ride is bad and there is no flex i know its not a zj but thats my 2 cents i like rustys they are on top for me

Claytons is great stuff as well. Also run a weight distribution hitch and sway bar. This will help control the trailer behind the grand.

The RE Superflex 4.5" provides actually about 5+ inches of lift this year. I read it somewhere else online that the springs were coming in longer than spec'd. Mine is at least an inch taller than my buddies ZJ with a 3.5" with 2" pucks.

If you want to get a hellar deal on RE stuff, join JU and contact a member named 4wheelcustoms. His price WITH shocks was a couple hundred bucks cheaper than anybody else WITHOUT them. And I recently puchased a ton of builder parts for a build I'm doing on a buddies truck and he easily saved us another couple hundred bucks.

Good Luck!

I don't know why you'd only want to do an 8.8 swap if you plan on doing all this. I don't see the logic in skimping on your axles if you plan on using it for things that are going to put high stress on those parts.

You want to trail ride and tow, so like was already said about the suspension, do it right the first time - don't bother with something that is (or could be) inadequate.
Go straight to 60s, keep them full width to help maintain stability.

doesn't the 5.9 grand have a 44 in the rear allready?
(mine came with it)

I tow about 6K with mine, not really ideal, but it works.

1tons and 33's would pretty well suck on the trail. You'd likely have less ground clearance than you do now with the added width.

If its got the 44 I don't know why you wouldn't just add a lift and 33's and wheel it. Get air bags that will hold for towing and not limit travel on the trail and it should tow well (with good sway bars)...

not really ideal, but it works.

Yeh...I guess you could say that. :flipoff2:


It did do fine though. Didn't seem squirrelly at all and stopped ok enough.

doesn't the 5.9 grand have a 44 in the rear allready?
(mine came with it)


1tons and 33's would pretty well suck on the trail. You'd likely have less ground clearance than you do now with the added width


If its got the 44 I don't know why you wouldn't just add a lift and 33's and wheel it. Get air bags that will hold for towing and not limit travel on the trail and it should tow well (with good sway bars)...

Its a D44a - aluminum center section. I've already put bearings in it once.

And yeah I agree 60's would be a bit much.

Its a D44a - aluminum center section. I've already put bearings in it once.

And yeah I agree 60's would be a bit much.

yeah, how much of a pita are those? cuz i need to change mine out.....

A couple bearings every other year though worth the 8.8 swap?

I realize there are other drawbacks to the aluminum center section, is it worth the 8.8 swap though?



Yeh..... I guess you could say that
I didn't know you took pics of that shit....

I'll trade ya that old ass cummins straight up :)

yes 8.8 swap is worth it they handle v8s everyday. 8.8s are stronger stock to stock than a 44. you will have no problem out of the 8.8 if you put that in there with 33s. just do a full case locker, cause if you do a lockright or a aussie it will blow up the carrier. its thin around the cross shaft. and you can get them with 4.10s already. and abs and they are the right lug pattern

Id go with a ford 9 in. They're strong, reliable, relatively cheap to build, especially if you start with a used housing, and are the king of aftermarket products. You can also do a rear disc set up on them for about $125. Actually you might be able to find a housing thats already got'em

Id go with a ford 9 in. They're strong, reliable, relatively cheap to build, especially if you start with a used housing, and are the king of aftermarket products. You can also do a rear disc set up on them for about $125. Actually you might be able to find a housing thats already got'em

The 8.8 would be a much cheaper and easier option then a 9". A narrowed BB ford 9" would be cool, but the 8.8 is just more logical.

The 8.8 would be a much cheaper and easier option then a 9". A narrowed BB ford 9" would be cool, but the 8.8 is just more logical.

Cheaper and easier, yes. More logical? I dunno. Why wouldn't the added strength of the 9" be more logical? He obviously doesn't plan on being easy on his rear end, so the added security against breakage would be a bonus.
Towing and off-roading are two of the more brutal activities when it comes to wear-and-tear on a vehicle.

Obviously, my suggestion above of 60s was a bad one, as was pointed out, they give away too much ground clearance. The 9" is the best compromise.

I didn't know you took pics of that shit....

I'll trade ya that old ass cummins straight up :)

Hmmm, that's a pretty good deal....no. :D
Now you might be able to talk me into trading for the bus.

Back on track!

Personally, I'd buy a cheap tow rig just for cheap insurance but this is a pretty decent choice for a multi-tasker, I guess. Are you planning to swap out the front too?

Cheaper and easier, yes. More logical? I dunno. Why wouldn't the added strength of the 9" be more logical? He obviously doesn't plan on being easy on his rear end, so the added security against breakage would be a bonus.
Towing and off-roading are two of the more brutal activities when it comes to wear-and-tear on a vehicle.

Obviously, my suggestion above of 60s was a bad one, as was pointed out, they give away too much ground clearance. The 9" is the best compromise.

You do realize that the 8.8 is Ford's direct replacement for the 9" rear end right?
It's comparable in strength to a 9". The only real advantage the 9" has over the 8.8 is the dropout third, and aftermarket support for everything.
The 8.8 is a ton lighter though.
There's a lot of guys running 8.8's in mustangs around here behind built 302's taking 100 shots of nitrous at the strip. Do you really think towing a trailer is as hard on an axle as a 4200 RPM launch at the drag strip?

do your self a favor and trade it in for a 5.2. they have a tow rating 2000lbs greater than the 5.9. you will get sick of it over heating. you can probably get a 5.2 for a third of what a 5.9 costs and not feel bad about beating on it.

do your self a favor and trade it in for a 5.2. they have a tow rating 2000lbs greater than the 5.9.
How the hell does that work? :confused:

I believe the lesser tow rating deals with the ability to keep the 5.9L engine cool.

Elec.fan 5.9 vs mech.fan 5.2. Good for a few hp not as good for towing. I've already got the 5.9 and have owned it for over 3 years, 50k mi. (about 10k towing), and it only runs warm when its over 90 w/ the AC cranking. I probably will get a mech. fan to throw on it. I'm really just curious if anyones had any luck towing w/ a mildly lifted (3.5 to 4.5) ZJ and what they recommend.

I dont know much about Tennesse or the the places you plan on going, but where i go , the hill climbs are long and steep. With my 5.2 loaded with camp gear on 32" tires, it gets pretty hot. if most of your trails are not huge hills, you should do just the same mods as most ZJ owners. D44s, 4.5" long arm kit, ?air helpers?(i thought of doing this but is it safe offroad?), addco sway bars. I wish i had a 5.9 for street racing >:D

I would suggest using a different tow vehicle

I've had a 3-1/2" JKS SA lift and I am currently at 5" Clayton LA lift on a 96 5.2L. Although the ZJ towed my 3000# boat just fine when it was stock, I wouldn't tow it more than a few miles to the local lake an back with the ZJ now.

I use it tow about a 4500 lb trailer

What kind of trailer?

Travel Trailer with 65 sq ft or more of front wind resistance?
Hybrid trailer?
Boat?
Car Hauler?

If you are pulling a 4500# Travel Trailer then you are already pushing the limits of the ZJ. Any height you add to the suspension to make it articulate better off road decreases its ability to tow large, heavy trailers safely.

Trailer sway wreaks havoc on C clip axles, trackbars and hitches mounted to unibodies. At a minimum I would suggest a Hensley Arrow hitch to negate sway.

I upgraded to Vanco brakes on the ZJ and I would suggest the same as well as making sure the trailer brakes are in perfect working condition before every trip.

Addco sway bars would be a must and airbags would help, although I'm not sure the ones inside the coils would survive much aggressive offroading.

There is some good reading about towing at:
http://www.rvtowingtips.com/
and
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/listings/forum/41.cfm

You do realize that the 8.8 is Ford's direct replacement for the 9" rear end right?
It's comparable in strength to a 9". The only real advantage the 9" has over the 8.8 is the dropout third, and aftermarket support for everything.
The 8.8 is a ton lighter though.
There's a lot of guys running 8.8's in mustangs around here behind built 302's taking 100 shots of nitrous at the strip. Do you really think towing a trailer is as hard on an axle as a 4200 RPM launch at the drag strip?

Actually, I didn't realize that the 8.8 was the direct replacement. I really like the dropout third, but that's another thread.
I'm not really into drag racing, so I don't have a clue what guys are running.
That's good info - thanks for that.

I occasionally speak from my rectum, my bad. :emb: I usually stick to posting about stuff that I know, but sometimes the noob comes out and I need a good slap in the face. :flipoff2:

What kind of trailer?

Travel Trailer with 65 sq ft or more of front wind resistance?
Hybrid trailer?
Boat?
Car Hauler?

If you are pulling a 4500# Travel Trailer then you are already pushing the limits of the ZJ. Any height you add to the suspension to make it articulate better off road decreases its ability to tow large, heavy trailers safely.

Trailer sway wreaks havoc on C clip axles, trackbars and hitches mounted to unibodies. At a minimum I would suggest a Hensley Arrow hitch to negate sway.

I upgraded to Vanco brakes on the ZJ and I would suggest the same as well as making sure the trailer brakes are in perfect working condition before every trip.

Addco sway bars would be a must and airbags would help, although I'm not sure the ones inside the coils would survive much aggressive offroading.

There is some good reading about towing at:
http://www.rvtowingtips.com/
and
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/listings/forum/41.cfm


I pull a 16 or 18 ft steel trailer w/ wood deck. Usually loded down w/ my road race car. The car sits low enough as to not "stick up" too much and create drag. Plus the car is light (about 2800lbs). I also pull 3 or 4 atvs now and then and have also pulled a V8 YJ on 60's and 37's (too much drag).

I'm considering getting a very light 15ft alum. trailer that weighs less than 1000lbs to offset things. I typically don't have any problems w/ trailer sway. Maybe a 3.5" RE short arm kit and some 32's would be OK? Then I can trim a little and throw some 33's on for trail riding.????

Thanks for the feedback. I'd get another truck to tow w/ if I wasn't already dealing w/ "you have too many vehicles" from the wifey.:shaking: