Background:
The wife and I bought a new house back in April of this year. Our old place was fine, but I had FAR outgrown the shop space with no options to build. Tried the commercial space route and it sucked. I like having all my junk in one general area not spread accross the county.

The new place sits on about 1.6 acres, with a pond, a 2 car attached garage, and a 2 bay DEtached with a bonus room over it. Plenty of room to expand, plenty of room to park my junk.

The existing detached was nice, with a 9' door and plenty of room (about 24 X25). But the problem is it's too low for a lift on a truck (a low rise for cars would be fine, but not for the junk I work on. Happily my wife enables my addictions.

We began this process about 5-6 months ago. I have learned lessons, some have been expensive, but we're nearing the end and I finally feel like I have something Pirate-worthy to post up. I've been tracking this on a couple of other forums, but thought I might share here too.

The plan:
Build up the area around the existing garage for a couple of additions. This will require a retaining wall and some back-fill.

If you want to see the full album with the rest of the pics, you can look here:
http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Shop%20build/

Phase One: The Great Wall Project

The property layout the red is the wall, the green is the fill:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/Plat.jpg

Our existing attached-
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0048.sized.jpg

The existing detached (before)-
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0049.sized.jpg

Here's a pic of the interior of the old garage. For a frame of reference, the truck in the picture has 39" tall tires. If I were doing just cars, I could probably go with a low-rise lift in this space but as you can see I need a bit more vertical space. The real problem is the beam that runs across the space, right behind the garage door opener. It comes down a good bit.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0051.sized.jpg

The plan is to add on an additional 18' wide bay, with a reverse gable, and a 14' wall, and cathedral roof for maximum clearance on the lift. We demo'd the existing/crappy lean-to.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/Model_1.jpg

Floorplan --
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/Floorplan.sized.jpg

The challenge is that had to completely replace a retaining wall, and will have about 140' of new wall down the side, creating a new side parking area beside the bay.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0050.sized.jpg

This entire bank will be contained by a new 10' poured concrete wall and we will have new/level area behind the shop.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0053.sized.jpg
(Yes, you are seeing it correctly, the previous owner never put stairs to the loft above the detached. Those will be forthcoming after this project is complete.)

Site Prep -- Lose the trees

There were some REALLY healthy trees, in kind of a tight space, while I could have dropped them myself, I couldn't have done it as easily and it wouldn't have been all in one day. Another bonus is that they took all the trash with them too! For that kind of service, I don't mind writing a check, they EARNED every penny!

Here's a shot to give you an idea of where the wall will be going in (red lines), the trees immediately behind it are all 30-50' or more:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0054_001.jpg

Here's a shot of all the trees that are to be removed (red spots):
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0659.sized.jpg

Here's a shot of one of the taller ones. It's sitting 10' below-grade, the lean-to is about 8' tall, and the tree has already been topped.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0658.sized.jpg

Here's a good shot of the crew topping (2nd time) the one in the previous picture so you can get an idea of the scale.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0662.sized.jpg

Before:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0050.sized.jpg

After:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0057.jpg

The Big Dig

The bottom of the retaining wall:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0071.jpg

Same leg from the opposite direction:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0073.jpg

Bottom corner of the wall looking uphill:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0072.sized.jpg

Top of Wall looking downhill:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0077.jpg

Couple of big root-balls that had to come out:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0075.jpg

Footer for the retaining wall.

Rebar:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0001.jpg

More Rebar:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0003.jpg

MORE Rebar:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0006.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0009.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0008.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0017.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0018.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0037.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0038.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0046.jpg

The Great Contractor Drama:

About the time they finished the footings, I had some pretty serious contractor-drama. Long story short, the guy spec'd the wall WAY too low and I was already over budget with JUST the materials and labor for the footers. Then they got uncommunicative and I fired EVERYbody's asses and told them to go home. Took about a month to get all this straightened out, pay off some people, and get money back out of others. I was lucky, it was expensive, but I made it through. I was painfully over budget, but in the end I feel like I got the wall I paid for and it was designed like I wanted it. When it was all said and done we had 140' of 12" thick wall with a double-matt of rebar in it.

Another good thing I managed to get done was to get rid of the lean-to that was on the left side of the garage.

Before:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0049.sized.jpg

After:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0030.jpg

So then we pick up with a new wall crew in for the finish on the wall:

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0050_001.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0051_001.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0055.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0058_001.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0060_001.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0067.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0071_001.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0075_001.jpg

Here we're complete on the wall. Just have to wait on curing to back-fill.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0085.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0087.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0086.jpg

Here we started back-fill. Had 16 tandem loads of fill, with 2 loads of #57 for the drains and 2 loads of crush-n-run.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0088.jpg

After the drains and the 1st couple of lifts:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0090.jpg

The remains of the old/pathetic retaining wall:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0099.jpg

The bob-cat artist... I've known this man a long time, but I never realized the skill it takes to run one of these things as well as he does, always a pleasure to watch!
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0110.jpg

Every now and then it never hurts to have a little, green wacker...
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0121.jpg

The back-fill has been finished about a week and they started forming for the foundations.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0156.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0159.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0160.jpg

Forming up slab:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0168.jpg

Setting up for new sidewalk:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0170.jpg

AND THEN THERE WAS MORE CONCRETE DRAMA
Long-story short:

Slab pour started off fine, first truck unloaded and they were screeing it out.
Had to leave the house for about 30 minutes and came back to the second truck already unloaded.
The second truck had 1-2" of water standing on TOP of the concrete.
The original truck in the back section was fine, but the wet stuff still hadn't set well enough to finish in EIGHT HOURS.
Met with the concrete company today and they are gonna come jack-hammer out the new slab and replace it with the correct spec concrete. The concrete vendor is going to eat the damages.


Pictures:
first part of the pour, things still going well
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0187.jpg

Second part of the pour where things started to ger f'd up, this is about an hour after the concrete was poured from the truck:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0197.jpg

This is probably the worst part with about 2" of standing water on top of the cement mix:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0198.jpg

Notice how this looks like a LAKE on top? That's cause it IS. Again, about an hour after the pour.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0200.jpg

Here's what it looked like when complete, it's hard to tell, but there's a distinctive color change from front to back.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0220.jpg

So the slab was so wet they couldn't work it that night. They came back the next day, threw out some sack-crete and put a skim-coat on the surface. This is what started happening within about 8 hours of THAT:

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0222.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0225.jpg

Out with the OLD:
After raising hell with the concrete people they agreed to come take out the bad part of the slab.

1st attempt... Hammer the shyte out of it with a track-hoe (failed):
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0260.jpg

2nd attempt.... we gonna get a lotta air in here:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0265.jpg

3rd attempt.... two jack-hammers running constantly for about 4 hours:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0267.jpg

Hard to believe we're in the middle of a drought here in Georgia, here's the old slab gone:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0269.jpg

Rebar down and ready to pour (you can see the piers I had them put in for the lift in the closer part of the slab):
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0274.jpg

Poured (the original spec on the slab was 8 yards, the new section with turndowns is a little over 16 yards):
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0279.jpg

Framing package was delivered the night before and framers showed up in the morning. Took off all the extra junk and started the first wall:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0284.jpg

Wow, these guys are fast... 1st wall already raised. They've been here for a little over an hour and a half.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0290.jpg

So when I got home from work that evening, I found all four walls up, sheathed, the joists set and before they left, they had probably 90% of the rest of the roof structure in place.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0293.jpg

Notice when I had them frame in the garage door openings, they set the header at the top and framed down to the opening. This will allow easier access later if I want to have a taller door.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0297.jpg

From behind/below:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0295.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0299.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0300.jpg

Another update from before work the next morning:

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0305.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0306.jpg

The framing is done and the roof is decked!!!

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0309.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0311.jpg

Better interior shots:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0315.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0312.jpg

This brings us up to current day, today:
House-wrap and roofing.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0321.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0319.jpg

The rest of this week should see garage doors, and vinyl siding. Next week the Rotary Lift gets installed.

WOW.. That really sucks about having to rip up the concrete and redo it.. but nice that it got fixed..

Looks very nice..

Nice!!!!
?

What I find incredulous, is that the people working the concrete didn't stop the pour immediately. Dang, who the heck was the 'boss' in charge of the finishers? He should've know from the moment it started coming down the chute that something was fawked up. But it's good that they ripped it all out. They did rip it 'all' out? If you paid for one continous slab, and didn't get it....I'd be asking for a bit of 'consideration' on the bill.

Edit: Oh, nice shop build. Nice house. Looks like a nice neighborhood. I'll bet you've got a drop deap gorgeous wife that loves you. Did I say I hate you?:flipoff2:

i'm not the smartest guy, but i do work in commercial construction......what is the need for the 20,000 dollar retaining wall? they overbuilt that, you should have built your walls on that thing. i mean that wall is way over done! it's amazing you got contractors to give you money back and come back and fix their mistakes....that's a rareity....

did you think about tearing out the dividing wall and replacing it with a big beam? that would really open that shop up.... i know it would cost you, but it would be pennies compared to that bling bling retaining wall

What I find incredulous, is that the people working the concrete didn't stop the pour immediately. Dang, who the heck was the 'boss' in charge of the finishers? He should've know from the moment it started coming down the chute that something was fawked up. But it's good that they ripped it all out. They did rip it 'all' out? If you paid for one continous slab, and didn't get it....I'd be asking for a bit of 'consideration' on the bill.

They didn't take ALL of it out, they took about 2/3's out, then did another tunddown and pinned it. I haven't had the money discussion with the concrete people yet, but rest assured, I ain't paying full boat price. I think the job they did was good and as far as the architecture for mounting the lift, I think it's actually a little better.

i'm not the smartest guy, but i do work in commercial construction......what is the need for the 20,000 dollar retaining wall? they overbuilt that, you should have built your walls on that thing. i mean that wall is way over done! it's amazing you got contractors to give you money back and come back and fix their mistakes....that's a rareity....

did you think about tearing out the dividing wall and replacing it with a big beam? that would really open that shop up.... i know it would cost you, but it would be pennies compared to that bling bling retaining wall

You're ABSOLUTELY correct. The wall was my biggest mistake. But by the time I realized how badly the scope/price on the wall was off, they'd already poured the footers and I was committed to THAT wall. Setbacks wouldn't allow me to put the walls on top of it, and I still like the extra flat space. And you are right it's WAY over done, but my goal was to build a wall I would NEVER have to fuck with or worry about again. The original spec was for a 10" thick wall with a single matt of steel, but I bumped it up to a 12" thick with a double matt, just because the cost was negligable by that point, it was worth the extra peace of mind.

I thought about tearing out the wall, but I like the idea of closed-off area, more wall-space to park stuff and allows me to keep the grinding dust/fab-gunk localized.

Nice build!

With the wall down in the middle, I like it! Lots of wall space for storage, and gives you a 'clean side' and 'dirty side'. Keep the grinding, welding, sanders, etc on the dirty side. I have one open shop and hate having everything covered in grinding dust.

Nice build!

With the wall down in the middle, I like it! Lots of wall space for storage, and gives you a 'clean side' and 'dirty side'. Keep the grinding, welding, sanders, etc on the dirty side. I have one open shop and hate having everything covered in grinding dust.



my thoughts exactly.

Wow! We've been looking for a house since April, and I want something very similar to what you're building. Being a Georgia boy, you'll understand exactly when I say, "I have lust in my heart."

Mark

been watching this build on the garage junkies forum...nice

HOLY RETAINING WALL BATMAN! it that a footing for a mulit-level building? lol

good call on the concrete! even if they would have mopped off the water the water cement ratio would have been so fawked it would have cracked all to hell on you. i cant believe you got them to tear it out. i also cant believe they placed that, i would have told them to send me a new batch!

but hey, that bitch aint going anywhere!

EDIT: i just read that they didnt remove all of it...mmm i bet that stuff would not pass a 3000PSI test.

"Durability increasesthe less permeable the concrete mix is.

Strength improves with lower water cement ratios. A .45 water cement ratio most likely will hit 4500 psi (pounds per square inch) or greater. A .50 water cement ratio will likely reach 4000 psi or greater.

For complete Uniform Building Code information regarding concrete construction, review with your architect, your ready mix supplier, or at your local library.

The water to cement ratio is calculated by dividing the water in one cubic yard of the mix ( in pounds) by the cement in the mix (in pounds). So if one cubic yard of the mix has 235 pounds of water and 470 pounds of cement- the mix is a .50 water to cement ratio."

that is not 100% accurate but it is close, i didnt want to drag out my ACI book

i see people get taken all the time when it comes to shitty batched concrete / dirtwork. if that is not right then your build will never be right epically with all that clay you have. people need to educate themselves on some basic field testing of concrete to see if what they have is quality stuff or shit. its all very simple to do. or pay the few bucks to have someone come out and do some QC testing.

concrete is kinda my job, i am ACI certified technician and going for form design.

Hey, if this project can survive critiques on Pirate, and the worst folks have to say is that the wall is overbuilt, then I'm a happy man!!!

Update as of today, been outta town since Tuesday:

Came back to a completed roof on Thursday night and siding guys showed up this morning
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0322.jpg

Siding went up pretty fast, they did all the siding and the soffit/fascia work in one day:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0330.jpg

As you can see in this pic and the prior, we did find an exact match on the siding, but putting the new directly next to the old is a BAD match. I'm not going to worry too much about the rear because in the long term it's all coming off anyways, but I'm going to get a price to have the front finished with the new stuff. Also the previous owner didn't wrap the place with anything so we'll take that opportunity to re-do the wrap on the exterior when it's clean.

Also it's hard to see here, but I had them add 8 total mounting points front/rear top/bottom/left/right on the vinyl install, so I would have a place to mount security lights up top and exterior outlets down low.

I'll also get some better pics later, but some friends came over and we mounted the meter base and the disconnects so they could do some nice J-channel cutouts around the boxes. You can see them waaaay in the back on the left side of the building.

for those that are saying the wall is over-designed....how about you whip out your professional engineer's seal and give him a design that you'll stand behind with 10' of fill plus a surcharge load. Typically, a good rule of thumb is one inch of wall thickness for each foot of height, so 12" wall for surcharge loaded 10' wall seems about right. Typically, once you get to a 12" wall, you jump up to two mats of rebar in the wall. I would figure you probably have #6 or so vertically at 10" on center...you can go with larger bars further apart or smaller bars at closer spacing.

I didn't think the wall looked over-built...I was thinking how it was nice to finally see a project that looked like it was done correctly - I was a little concerned until I saw that you had them do a turned down slab around the perimeter...all to often, people think you just pour a slab and put the building on it (I guess if you don't get frost, you could)

just a dumb professional engineer's perspective....

bk

Great looking build so far.
Sorry to hear about their screw up on the foundation.
Glad to see that they took ownership and got it fixed for you.
Can't wait to see the finish project.

Hey, if this project can survive critiques on Pirate, and the worst folks have to say is that the wall is overbuilt, then I'm a happy man!!!

...I didn't think the wall looked over-built...I was thinking how it was nice to finally see a project that looked like it was done correctly...

I too don't think you over built the wall. In fact I agree with the above, because when I do something, I want it overbuilt. Most contractors are only trying to keep THEIR costs down, not do what you want...Unless you're there to watch them. Yeah, maybe you could've saved a few dollars by going with the a thinner wall...But like you posted the price difference was small.

Only thought is like before...I would've made them tear the entire slab out and start again. But we get a bunch of freeze/thaw up here, perhaps you'll be okay.

Here's the promised update on the electrical. It's a start. Here's a 400 Amp meter base and the mounting pads for 2 (left/right) 200 Amp disconnects. I'll take that into 2 Square-D QO series 200 Amp panels inside.

Once again, we come back to "overkill". I can't tell you how many arguments I've gotten into with people who tell me I could never POSSIBLY use that much capacity. And you know every one of them is probably right. But I can guarantee you that I won't ever need to dig up my driveway to do it again with heavier conductor or replace the meter with something beefier.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0337.jpg

Typically, a good rule of thumb is one inch of wall thickness for each foot of height, so 12" wall for surcharge loaded 10' wall seems about right. Typically, once you get to a 12" wall, you jump up to two mats of rebar in the wall. I would figure you probably have #6 or so vertically at 10" on center...you can go with larger bars further apart or smaller bars at closer spacing.

I didn't think the wall looked over-built...I was thinking how it was nice to finally see a project that looked like it was done correctly - I was a little concerned until I saw that you had them do a turned down slab around the perimeter...

Yep, you're right, it's got a set of #6 dowels every 18" on center for shear, then a #5 on a 12" square matt inside and a secondary #4 matt on the outside to control cracking.

I would've made them tear the entire slab out and start again. But we get a bunch of freeze/thaw up here, perhaps you'll be okay.

I pushed for this pretty hard, but they weren't budging, so I had them do a separate turn-down at the joint and pin it into the existing slab. With the way things worked out, it turned out to be better than the original design in that the caissons for the lift wopund up being about twice the size I had spec'd them for before.

I figured I would also post this here, since it's all part of the "Master Plan"... The wife had all kinds of non-car junk up in my space, so I bought her a 10X12 tractor shed, for HER tractor and various yard accoutrements I get pissed off tripping over. I keep telling her garages are made for MY cars and TOOLS!!!

You can see the complete gallery here: http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/TractorBarn

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0215.jpg

Here we see a part of The Great Wall Project in the back-ground:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0218.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0228.jpg

Told her to pack her sh!te and just GET OUT!!! Here are the before pictures of my attached garage on the house:

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0244.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0245.jpg

Here are the after pic on the attached garage:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0251.jpg

Of course, I made sure to fix up her new domain some first. They finished the whole thing in about 2 days, and we painted the floor with some Sherwinn Williams porch/deck paint I've had good luck with. Did 2 coats of primer and 3 coats of paint. It's got a good finish that will now allow me to wipe up any residue without it working into the plywood of the floor. Added a couple of baker's racks from Sam's, about 8' of Gladiator Gear Hangers for the shovels and rakes and implements of destruction (name that reference!). Aside from removing the genreal clutter, I was VERY happy to remove our supply of domestic gasoline OUTside the house AND my shop.

Here's the finished product:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0252.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0253.jpg

Here's the promised update on the electrical. It's a start. Here's a 400 Amp meter base and the mounting pads for 2 (left/right) 200 Amp disconnects. I'll take that into 2 Square-D QO series 200 Amp panels inside.

Once again, we come back to "overkill". I can't tell you how many arguments I've gotten into with people who tell me I could never POSSIBLY use that much capacity.

The electrician that did my wiring told me that he's done a few 'mega' houses that had 600 and 800 amp service. Better to have more than less.

You won't get an argument from me. But are you saying that you're going to get the power company to provide 400 amp service 'just to your garage' not split 200/200 house/garage? Wow. If you can get 400 amp service 'off the street', then (sorry) More Power To Ya.

My 200 amp home service is split with a 100 amp box in my garage. When my 7.5hp compressor cycles, it will briefly dim the lights in the house. The ultimate would be, like it appears you are doing, have separate service to the home/garage.

I think you're on the right track.

You won't get an argument from me. But are you saying that you're going to get the power company to provide 400 amp service 'just to your garage' not split 200/200 house/garage? Wow. If you can get 400 amp service 'off the street', then (sorry) More Power To Ya.

My 200 amp home service is split with a 100 amp box in my garage. When my 7.5hp compressor cycles, it will briefly dim the lights in the house. The ultimate would be, like it appears you are doing, have separate service to the home/garage.

Yep, you got it. 400 Amp separate service for JUST the shop. As for "off the street", our situation is a little strange. We're way back off the road. We're not in a subdivision. To my knowledge we're the only house on our transformer. We're part of a smaller electric company (Jackson, not Georgia Power). The engineer responsible for our area gave me his direct cell when I laid all this out, even asked me if I was SURE I didn't want 3 phase "just in case.

Here's how we are in relation to the road:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/Plat.jpg

Here's a pic that shows where the transformer is located. This is a pic of what will ultimately be the front door of my shop. From here to the meter is about 150' or so. Based on what I understand, if I tell them it's going under concrete (it eventually will be), they will even provide conduit free.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0199PowerLocation.jpg

Overbuilt or not on the wall, that is some sexy rebar work. It's a damn shame it had to be covered up. lmao.

Nice build.

....I was VERY happy to remove our supply of domestic gasoline OUTside the house AND my shop.

Here's the finished product:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/TractorBarn/DSCF0253.jpg

Looking great -- really amazed of the number of gas cans you had in your garage.
No wonder you told your wife to get it out! :eek:
Hope no one you knew smoked!

Looking great -- really amazed of the number of gas cans you had in your garage.
No wonder you told your wife to get it out! :eek:
Hope no one you knew smoked!

HaHa... they aren't all full (at least not in the winter)... But between the tractor and 2 other mixes, plus backups, it's really not that much, typically we go through it all in a month or two when we're in full swing on yardwork, we have about 1.6 acres with most of it in grass. But neither of us smokes and I wanted it all as far from the welder as possible.

Yep, you got it. 400 Amp separate service for JUST the shop. As for "off the street", our situation is a little strange. We're way back off the road. We're not in a subdivision. To my knowledge we're the only house on our transformer. We're part of a smaller electric company (Jackson, not Georgia Power). The engineer responsible for our area gave me his direct cell when I laid all this out, even asked me if I was SURE I didn't want 3 phase "just in case.

Not really what I meant when I said 'off the street', more like what the power company was willing/able to deliver to you. Suprising with the underground utilities they can even offer three phase. Nice to hear there is still some 'service minded people' left in the utility sector.

First off, nice garage!

Second, if you can get 3-phase power to the shop, why not? 3-phase welders/lathes/mills go cheap because most all of us dont have the power to run them at home. Just curious.


Chris:cool2:

if you can get 3-phase power to the shop, why not? 3-phase welders/lathes/mills go cheap because most all of us dont have the power to run them at home. Just curious.

Several reasons actually:
1) All the gear I would have to buy for 3 phase is much more expensive than the heavy duty grade standard stuff I am getting (Square-D QO series).

2) I can't just pick up 3 phase stuff at my local big-box (or at least not a great selection).

3) While I DO intend to have a lathe/mill at some point (after the checkbook cools), I think a rotary phase converter will handle my basic 3-phase needs. Being a single worker I don't see a need to have more than one 3-phase source working at one time.

4) 3 phase gets charged commercial rates which is a much higher monthly, just to have it on, regardless of use.

BELIEVE me, I thought long and hard about it before I turned the engineer down, and I just couldn't justfiy it.

So what are turndowns when it comes to foundations?!?

and implements of destruction (name that reference!

Alice's Restaurant! (http://www.arlo.net/resources/lyrics/alices.shtml) Man, you've even got the 8x10 color glossies!! :D

Seriously nice shop you're building.

Mark

So what are turndowns when it comes to foundations?!?

A turn-down equates to a footer for a mono-slab. Since a mono-slab is poured all at one time, as opposed to pouring footers first, then pouring the slab, you still need something to go below the frost-line. A turn-down is just a 2' deep trench around the outside of a mono-slab that replaces the footers.

Very nice build, and having all that power WILL come in handy, and make you rest at ease you wont blow a breaker :)

-Todd

Here's the promised update on the electrical. It's a start. Here's a 400 Amp meter base and the mounting pads for 2 (left/right) 200 Amp disconnects. I'll take that into 2 Square-D QO series 200 Amp panels inside.
.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0337.jpg

Who makes the meter base? I wanted to go bigger than 200 but everything got way too big. That looks about the size of my 200 amp meter main combo

I am with you on over siziing it

Who makes the meter base? I wanted to go bigger than 200 but everything got way too big. That looks about the size of my 200 amp meter main combo

Not sure who makes it off the top of my head, but I can take a look tomorrow. If if helps, I bought it directly from the electric company (Jackson EMC).

looks great......more pics

BELIEVE me, I thought long and hard about it before I turned the engineer down, and I just couldn't justfiy it.


Makes sense. Out here if your in an outlaying area you can get 3-phase under an "agricultural" unbrella. (tell them you putting in an ag well)

Not sure on the rates though. I might look into that.


VERY nice buildup.


Chris:cool2:

240 volt three phase panels aren't that expensive, you just need to go to an electrical supply instead of a big box store. 480 volt stuff is where it gets expensive. you can also pull 110 and 240 single phase out of the 3 phase panel, you just use single and double breakers.
that said, the cost of 3 phase is only less in a industrial/commercial site (or possibly ag) they also may require a minimum billing to supply you with 3 phase.
that negates the deal you can get on 3 phase equipment.
it looks to me like you have thought out your plan pretty well, the 400 amp service may be overkill, but you should never need more, and i think the panels jump from 200-400, so that would be the next step over 200. the real money is in the breakers, the bigger they are the more expensive. with the size of your shop, and your lift in there, you don't really have room for much large equipment, so i would stick with single phase equipment and not worry about a phase converter. the real savings on three phase equipment is the big stuff, equipment up to 6 hp you can change to a single phase motor relatively cheaply. Doug

Nice build :smokin:

You turned down 3-phase, what type of shop is that. :flipoff2: With that much power you can easily run VFD's off the single phase for everything you need (except those cheap 3 phase welders that keep turning up on CL)

I was going to do 400Amp, but the base rate was $$$$ higher. Ended up with 200A for house, 200A for shop. 400A for just the shop is :smokin:

Good call on the garden shed.... ended up doing mine as a 18' x 24' building. Plenty of room for all my wife's stuff and the kids bikes, and the pool stuff, and all that other 'doesn't belong in the shop stuff' :evil:

very nice build....... I bet you struggled with that 3-phase-or-not decision.

I think I would have cost-justified it somehow-! I get tired of cables on my

floor running to my rotary..........

--Sherpa

Updates since last: The siding guys came and re-did the front face so it ALL matches, and re-did the back so the color doesn't look striped. The garage door guys are on their FOURTH service call and everything is STILL not functional and installed correctly.

As promised, pics of the roll-up door:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0350.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0353.jpg

Then these nice gentlemen showed up this morning (on time, prepared, and as promised, is that REALLY so hard?)...
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0361.jpg

They worked fast, the $300 I spent on installation was worth EVERY penny.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0363.jpg

And by 11:00, this is what my new garage looked like this:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0365.jpg

Then is was off to HomelyDesperate for supplies, some BBQ lunch, and back in time for the FIFTH (and still not final) service call from the garage door guys.

Later this afternoon we got the knockout boxes all mounted, both of the 200 amp load centers mounted, and one complete wall worth of wire pulled. I'll get some pictures of this and more info as we get more done tomorrow. We should finish the rough-out on electrical this weekend.

Its official, you suck :flipoff2: I want your lift.

congrats on the new shop.

Is that lift an SP10a? If so I have the same one :smokin:

Is that lift an SP10a? If so I have the same one :smokin:

Yeah it's the SPOA10... I think it's the same lift, 10K 2 post asymmetric, standard height?

So far haven't done much with it, but it makes a BITCHEN construction/table! We spent the day yesterday and today roughing in the electrical in the shop so we threw a 4X8 sheet of OSB up on the arms and voila, a GREAT workbench.

Yeah it's the SPOA10... I think it's the same lift, 10K 2 post asymmetric, standard height?

So far haven't done much with it, but it makes a BITCHEN construction/table! We spent the day yesterday and today roughing in the electrical in the shop so we threw a 4X8 sheet of OSB up on the arms and voila, a GREAT workbench.

Yep, same one, I love it and wish I would of had one years ago. There are many uses for it that's for sure.

Some updates:

Been having a heck of a time with the garage door guys. Thankfully my GC is dealing with it and making things right. They are supposed to come by tomorrow and finish the install (put up trim moulding to seal it, give me the correct controls for my LM3800, etc) and it ONLY took SIX trips to get it all right!!!

Tomorrow the power company is supposed to show for burying the power feed and setting up the meter base.

Last weekend after the lift guys vacated we got a good portion of the electrical done for rough-in.

Two 200Amp services.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0384.jpg

Right bay-wall. It works out to be a 2-gang box about every 3' or so.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0386.jpg

Left bay-wall (opposite above) looking at it from the rear:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0385.jpg

Just add a sheet of OSB and voila, you have a very cool adjustable-height work table.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0392.jpg

Right now, it's looking like we'll be doing the driveway sometime in the next couple of weeks as well, so more updates soon.

Today was a big day, the garage door guys showed up and FINALLY finished everything to my satisfaction.

Then the power company came out to dig the trench for the power, put in the conduit, and reburried it all. WAY ahead of schedule.

While all that was going on, a friend of mine played hookey and we spent the afternoon mounting the rest of the stuff for the meterbase and disconnects. That's now 95% done (thanks to not having parts).

THEN because all THAT got done, my GC bumped up the driveway work and I've got a crew showing up here at 8:00AM in the morning. If things stay dry (yeah, RIGHT) I may have a driveway sometime this week!

At the very least I should have some update pics come daylight.

Another big day... As promised, I had a crew here at 8:00AM this morning to start prepping my driveway. We also spent some significant time dressing out the site to finish things off.

First we took about 8" of material out in the space of the new concrete (about 1600 SF worth).
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0393.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0405.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0410.jpg

We took the spare dirt from where we'll be doing the concrete pour and filled in more between the wall and the buiding. It's hard to tell from the pictures, but this really finishes out the area more nicely.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0399.jpg

We took it around the back to where we've already planted some winter rye to prevent erosion. In some areas we filled in more than about a foot, you can see here some of the deepest.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0398.jpg

Then put in a butt-load more gravel to prep for the pour and dress-out the site a little better. I cannot express how happy I am to not be dragging red mud everywhere on my shoes when I step outside! As a bonus, also have plenty of parking now too.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0413.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0415.jpg

After the grading crew left, we got the disconnects mounted and setup. Set the ground rods in, and prepped everything for some inside work tomorrow.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0403.jpg

Kick ass!!

Very nice build, carry on. :smokin:

Kick ass!!

Very nice build, carry on. :smokin:

Thanks for the compliment, but you're really just stuck on the 715, aren't you Taco?:grinpimp:

(you are the same Taco from The 'Zone, right?)

We HAVE driveway!!!

Woke up this morning to a crew who was on time and by the time I got outside, they had already setup protective coverings for my new vinyl, garage-doors, and existing driveway. I can hardly believe the amount of care and attention these guys put into the work. I have to say this is certainly a VERY nice crew to finish the project with (electrical and inspections to go, but this is the last paid crew). They even cleaned up after themselves, how rare is THAT?!?!

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0416.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0417.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0420.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0421.jpg
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0423.jpg

This is becoming one of my all time favorite threads. Keep those pics coming!

Mark

No steel reinforcing in that driveway??

Unreal on the concrete!! Was that a 1/2 slump!!! New shop area is looking great! Amazing how a lift can eat square footage isnt it.

No steel reinforcing in that driveway??

Based on what I saw here, I would have thought rebar would be more common in dirveways here too.

In checking around, and looking at a lot of the driveways poured without it many people (at least locally) consider rebar overkill. The ones I've looked at have lasted quite well. You have to remember Georgia isn't generally as geologically active as say California, we don't have frost that heaves rocks up through the soil like up north, and the area I put this in has been well established and compacted under an existing gravel drive for years.

I know my existing driveway doesn't have any rebar in it and it's survived well throughout the entire project. If you want to figure the load bearing, the existing drive has seen about 30 tandem loads with 18 tons each, 2 construction rollbacks, 2 track-hoes, 2 bobcats, and 140 yards worth of concrete deliveries. I mean with THIS kind of load on it, I only had one small (probably 2 sf) cracked area:

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0057_001.jpg

Based on the additional cost, I elected not to go with rebar. I may live to regret it, but based on what I know at the moment (which may be proven wrong later), I think I'll be happy.

Unreal on the concrete!! Was that a 1/2 slump!!! New shop area is looking great! Amazing how a lift can eat square footage isnt it.

Based on what the concrete guy told me when we were talking about it, that's 3500PSI with a 5 inch slump. He also had an accelerator put into it because it was fairly chilly here yesterday.

Another thing I forgot to mention about the slab: I talked with the guy about how much I work on my junk on the driveway, how I hate trying to clean the metal out of a brushed finish, and how hard a rough finish is on hands/knees. So based on that, we put a trowel finish on the area closest to the two bays, then where we go over the control-joint to the existing drive they brushed it lightly to match the existing drive.

Finally, YES, it's amazing that lift pretty much occupies the full 17X24 interior space in the new bay. There's still plenty of room to walk around, and there's still areas I can use for storage against the walls, but not as much as you would think. I think what I'm going to do is use the 4 areas around the front/rear door returns for small stuff like blast cabinet, parts washer, bolt bins, etc. then rig some pulleys in the rafters for storing items that see infrequent use up near the ceiling.

I was thinking at least some 4"x4" wire mesh, but hey if it's working for you why change. :D

Anyways, the shop is looking awesome can wait to see some interior finished shots!!

When they poured my 6" slab in my garage, they used rebar AND fiber reinforced concrete, WAY overkill from what my concrete guy said.

You probably have fiber reinforced in your driveway.

OK, I am now OFFICIALLY ruined for working in lesser shops.

Had a friend over this weekend for the first project in the new space and break the cherry on my lift. Essentially he had to replace the steering system on his XJ, replace a u-joint on the front d/s, and he had spun a nut inside the frame for the X member mounting plate. Basically some little stuff to prep for an upcoming trip.

Things started out balmy enough on Saturday, but by the time we ended up it was NASTY, about 40* and pouring rain. The kind of cold that just seeps into your bones. The kind of shit that would give you pneumonia if you were on the cold concrete floor...

But inside, with the little propane heater going, up under the lift things were still pretty livable.

On the X-member repair, we had to cut open the uni-body, peel it back, put in a plate and weld it all back. In years past this would have involved welding on my back, getting hot slag dropping onto my neck, into my ears and the like. I HATE welding on my back under junk. This was a pleasant change. When I finished running my 1st series of tacks, I looked over at my buddy and told him "This lift is worth EVERY penny, and I'd build this WHOLE damned garage again...:flipoff2:

I'll try to snap some working pics later tonight.

No doubt, I do not know how I did without a lift all these years.

it is possible that the bad batch of concrete was hot and they threw some water in there, either on the road by the driver or at the plant if they anticipate a hot load. this is done to get the temperature down when the concrete has been in the truck for a while and starts curing. it is dishonest but definitely happens. so it may or may not be crappy QC at the plant. how far away is the plant they came from and what type of traffic were they fighting? and was anyone QC'ng the load for temp and slump? I bet you would have had a pretty big slump. at least you got the plant to own up to the "screwup.":shaking:

i was wondering why you had a pump truck for pouring the driveway, but i'm assuming that you also had the rear slab poured at the same time, and it doesn't look to accessable to a mixer.
i do hope you are going to put some sort of a roll stop at the end of the slab! or at least post the OOPS! pics of the first rig to go over the retaining wall:eek:
My wife was laughing hysterically about your surprise at how much room your lift takes up and how your shop seems smaller now that you are starting to use it!
(she has been through this several times with me)
are you going to insulate the shop? not working on the floor is great, but warm is good even when you are standing up. it will make your propane last a lot longer as well.
Doug

i was wondering why you had a pump truck for pouring the driveway, but i'm assuming that you also had the rear slab poured at the same time, and it doesn't look to accessable to a mixer.
i do hope you are going to put some sort of a roll stop at the end of the slab! or at least post the OOPS! pics of the first rig to go over the retaining wall:eek:

are you going to insulate the shop? not working on the floor is great, but warm is good even when you are standing up. it will make your propane last a lot longer as well.
Doug

Good points all there Doug.

The boom-truck was a picture I took out of sequence to show the load/stress the existing driveway has taken. They used the boom to pour the back section of the retaining wall. The truck they used for the 1st part of the driveway pour was actually a conveyor-truck so they could boom-out to the corner (longer than standard chutes) without having to shovel.

Yes, that wall scares the shit outta me. I had to put in a safety fence to get my CO (see the update below).

Yes! Insullation and OSB walls with galv-alum along the bottom 4', is in the plans, but I need to get the inspectors done and let the check-book recover a bit.

Time for another update. Things have slowed down a bit due to the Holidays AND the now defunct budget.

Since last post, we had gutters put on:
(also note the pine-beds we finished in the never-ending fight against red-mud.
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0442.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0443.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0444.jpg


New fence is going in today:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0432.jpg

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0433.jpg

AND probably MOST exciting, got to do my FIRST project up on the lift!!! A friend had spun the mounting bolts inside the unibody in his XJ. Normally this would have involved MUCH cursing and pain as I hate welding out of position on my back/under stuff. This was most pleasant, set the lift to the correct height and voila, we were DONE in a flash (pun intended).
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0436.jpg

Here's where we cut and peeled open the unibody:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/GardnerXJ/DSCF0438weld_detail.jpg

Here's the finished product:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/GardnerXJ/DSCF0438.jpg

that fence will keep someone from falling off the top, but will it stop a rolling wheeler? i think i would still put in a bump stop. a couple railroad ties and a few 2 ft. pieces of 1/2 in. pipe work well and don't dent the wallet too bad. i just drill a hole through the rr tie, and drive the pipe through it. this will give you about 16 in. of pipe in the ground to keep it in place. i would use 3 pipes per rr tie. Doug

Agreed, it's a safety thing for the moment... happy to have something to keep the drunks safe (myself included). What you're talking about is a good idea, I just haven't gotten that far along yet.

We're gonna step back for a bit after I get the electrical into the shop and get a little perspective. That's when I expect to spend some time on smaller/detail stuff like this.

Updates?

Thanks for the interest... It's a rather timely request.

I've finally finished pulling wire (over 1700 feet of wire in my install). All the electrical is finally functional with the exception of lights in the new bay. For those, I'm waiting on the interior sheathing to go up.

Before I could do interior sheathing, I had to do insulation. I'm done with the wall insulation on the new bay (R-19). We put up the 1st run of OSB inside today, all the way around, so now I have something on all the walls to 4' up. Tomorrow we'll be putting up more wall sheathing and I'll get some pics.

Still to do:
I'm hiring out the ceiling sheathing, cause I can't find a drywall lift tall enough to do a 15' ceiling and honestly when the guy told me what he'd do it for, I was ready to write the check to just not fawk with it.

Once the top goes in, I'll drop in some R-30 for top insulation and mount the lighting.

Then its back to the old bay for more insulation work and sheathing.

Finishing touches for now will include some paint on the OSB.

I'll get some pics tomorrow.

OH, and almost forgot!!! We had our second project today while we were hanging OSB, a buddy came over and we welded up/installed 4 wheel discs in his CJ-7... Working under a lift instead of rolling around on the floor is HIGHLY ADDICTIVE!!! We did the whole thing in about 1/2 the time we've done similar projects.

I was ok until I saw the pictures of the lift! Now I’m officially jealous :)

Nice lift and supper nice shop, one more envious person on here now.

as promised here's an update:

Completed insulation on all the walls (kraft-faced R-19). Finished all the wiring (FINALLY). This weekend was hanging OSB. Got a good chunk of the walls done. Also finally got a chance to hang some LIGHTS and put away my halogen work-lights (YEEE-HAW).

A couple of notes on the plan for OSB:
1) I have a wall that's 14' plus top/bottom plates, so I laid the first course down horizontally.
2) Then we came in and laid the top course vertically. While this may not be the most efficient way to do things, it leaves the centers open.
3) The area where you see still everything open is where all my cable chases are done, so if I ever need to change/service/add electrical, I only need to pull the middle panels.
4) This middle section will get a colored stripe much like I've seen in a couple of shops here already.
5) Everything on the lower 48" will get covered by corrugated metal (another idea swapped here, thank you).

A couple of notes on lighting:
1) I KNOW I'm doing overkill here, but I HATE not having enough light to work by.
2) The ceiling will get two rows of 4 fixtures, one in the front, one in the middle, and the rear (covered by garage door) will get two on either side of the tracks. These will all be on the main switch for the bay. This is also a 3-way so it can be controlled from either bay.
3) The first set of supplimental lights are 4' T-8 weather-proof fixtures on the walls about 7' off the floors. There will be 1-2 fixtures on the front/rear of each wall on both the left/right sides. These are on their own switch. You can see we have 2 of these mounted now.
4) The second set of supplimental lights are on the front wall to either side of the door. The thought here is to provide AMPLE light for under-hood activities. I HATE not being able to see stuff under the hood. These are both done as well.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0466.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0477.jpg


http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0475.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0474.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0472.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0471.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0467.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0469.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0470.jpg

So I pulled together my first attempt at an electrical/lighting plan...
It's a little busy... I think I might have to add some more outlets though... :lol_hitti FYI, each of those outlets is either a 2-gang quad receptacle box or a dedicated 50AMP 240V welding outlet. On some of the longer runs (like the ones on the center and far right walls) we put 2 welding outlets on the same feeder, it would not be common to be welding on opposite sides of the same wall, but the extra positions are nice. #6 wire is FREAKIN' expensive these days!!!

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/ElectricalDesign.jpg

Here's the basic floor-plan to give you an idea on scale:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/BasicFloorplan.jpg

I hear you on the lighting issue but I dont think its over kill, my past two shops and my garage both have had terrible lighting.

I hear you on the lighting issue but I dont think its over kill, my past two shops and my garage both have had terrible lighting.

In total I think it's ovekill. But when you look at the main lighting, it's adequate. Each of the auxillaries I think are adequate on their own for the task or specific area alone. I don't have to put my :smokin: on unless I want to turn them all on at the same time for some reason. :grinpimp:

In looking at it, the new bay alone will have 20+/- 4' T8 fixtures to cover just over 400SF.

wow, great project, you could write a text book on how to do it right the first time

sidenote: is that your frontier? its nice

wow, great project, you could write a text book on how to do it right the first time

Now THAT is some FunNAY chit right there! I feel like I've made every mistake in the book, but I've learned from every one of them. Some were costly, some weren't. This build originally started in April of '07. Happily once I got to the point where the BUILDING was up, it's been pretty smooth sailing.

Oh, and yes, the Frontier is my daily beater, thanks for the compliment.

Very nice build. I like that you will have the separate bay and that the other garage could be shut off. That would be very nice to have a 'dirty' side for welding, grinding and working on the rig and still have a 'clean' side for most other shop projects. :smokin: I get tired of cleaning grinding dust off all my chit every few months...

well at least its the way you want it now lol

check out frontierboard.com, we just started ti up, but some real good info

AND probably MOST exciting, got to do my FIRST project up on the lift!!! A friend had spun the mounting bolts inside the unibody in his XJ. Normally this would have involved MUCH cursing and pain as I hate welding out of position on my back/under stuff. This was most pleasant, set the lift to the correct height and voila, we were DONE in a flash (pun intended).
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0436.jpg

Here's where we cut and peeled open the unibody:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/GardnerXJ/DSCF0438weld_detail.jpg

Here's the finished product:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/GardnerXJ/DSCF0438.jpg

Off topic, although your add on makes me jealous, do you still have the pics of the correction on the uni body? Thanks.

Off topic, although your add on makes me jealous, do you still have the pics of the correction on the uni body? Thanks.

yessir, pm me an address and i'll email you full-size pics.

Very nice build. I like that you will have the separate bay and that the other garage could be shut off. That would be very nice to have a 'dirty' side for welding, grinding and working on the rig and still have a 'clean' side for most other shop projects. :smokin: I get tired of cleaning grinding dust off all my chit every few months...

That is EXACTLY where I'm coming from. Want to be able to close the door, NOT hear the compressor run, NOT hear the grinder in the next bay, NOT get all the gunk and stuff on everything.

With the R-19 in the 2X6 walls on the new side and the combined R-13 in the walls on the OLD side (it's a common wall double built), I can BARELY hear the compressor kick on/off... It's more background noise than anything...

Weekend update...
Still hanging OSB... most of the high stuff and the ceiling is done. Paid to have a couple of guys do the 15' ceiling, and it was worth every penny!!! The only thing left up high in the new bay is the area above the roll-up door. Then the last set is the trough about eye-level where all the electrical is run, that'll be the last sections.

Also managed to get 7 out of the 8 fixtures on the walls hung, there's pretty good light inside now. I'll hold off on any of the ceiling fixtures until I get some paint done.

pics:
Hard to tell in the pics, but the parking area is football-stadium bright from a number of angles. Nice for those evenings where you have to look at something outside. Oh, and the municipal airport called to ask me to shut down my "runway, it was confusing pilots... :shocking:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0490-1.jpg

Rear lighting.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0484.jpg

View standing in the front door (you can see the unfinished bit that remains above the roll-up).
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0491.jpg

View from rear door with front closed
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0492.jpg

Oh, and the municipal airport called to ask me to shut down my "runway, it was confusing pilots... :shocking:

Seriously?!? If so that's badass! :laughing:

that is pretty funny, so you are near Briscoe Field, Charlie Brown or McCollum unless I am missing one or you are further outside ATL..

Shop looks great, plenty of parking, tall doors, lift, etc. :beer:

that is pretty funny, so you are near Briscoe Field, Charlie Brown or McCollum unless I am missing one or you are further outside ATL..

Haha... no it was a joke, but I'm near Briscoe, up in Lawrenceville...

How are you planning on finishing the exposed OSB? Are you just going to leave it as is? I was thinking of doing the same thing, but was curious what others are doing?

How are you planning on finishing the exposed OSB? Are you just going to leave it as is? I was thinking of doing the same thing, but was curious what others are doing?

I'll caulk the seams so larger ones look better (I have a couple 1/4" to 3/8" gaps, just cause of how things fit together).

Then I'll prime it with KILZ, the consensus I've seen for those who paint OSB is that you want something that will dry quickly (either latex or oil) so the moisture doesn't affect the OSB. Once I have a good primer-coat on, I'll do the topcoat with a good exterior bright-white down to about 8' from the floor. Then I'll go with some color that'll hide dirt well, and finish the bottom 4' with some corrugated/galvanized sheet.

Are you using screws or just nailing the OSB?

Are you using screws or just nailing the OSB?

I'm just using 2" course drywall screws with 7/16 OSB. It works well and sucks the board tight to the wall. I can take the panels doen later if I need to.

OK, so I've been slowly toiling away with insulation and OSB on the walls. I have a couple of thoughts here based on my experience:

1) OSB is cheap and getting cheaper. When I started the project, it was running a bit over $5 per sheet, as of the last purchase I made, it was down to $4.30 a sheet.

2) I had a LOT of cut-ins to do with my outlets (20-30 per bay). It really helped to make the panels with the outlets as small as possible. See earlier pics, I made a belt-line about 30" wide in the center of the wall. My outlets are about 52" off the floor, so not only was it easier to make these panels, if I ever need to get at the wiring, I can take these off and easily get to the wiring troughs without taking the whole wall apart.

3) Tools:
Light-weight cordless drill -- I used a smaller Makita lithium 18v, you will put up a LOT of screws and it pays to have something easy to handle for extended periods. Also something easy to work one-handed.
Deck-screw-driver -- This is the type with the magnetic tip and slip-down collar. Again, you will be putting in a LOT of screws, so something you can use one-handed is a must.
Chalk line -- unless you are lucky enough to have 100% straight/square building, you'll need to snap some off-angles for appropriate cutting.
Screws -- I just bit the bullet and bought the BIG bucket of 2" course drywall screws, they are cheaper by the bucket and you can always find uses for them.
Circular saw with rip-fence -- I'm sure there are better ways to do this, but I did all my cutting with a chalk-line and circular saw.
Jig-saw -- a MUST for cutting in boxes.
1/2" Spade drill bit -- Used to make holes at corner of box cut-outs.
Sample box for tracing outline of cutouts.
Framing square -- lots of uses.
Caulk-gun -- get the good/drip-less one, you will be using it a LOT.
Caulk scraper -- I got a plastic triangle-shaped tool, with a rubber tip, this is one of the most useful tools I found for this project. See more on this later.


4) Process -- This is pretty straight forward. But some pointers:

Try for the best/closest seams possible.
There are two distinct sides of OSB, a smooth side where the labels are printed on, and you can feel the glue/laminate, and a very rough side, where they typically print lines to help you find the studs. I kept the rough side out. I'm not sure there is a difference, but I say this only to point out that you want to be consistent, as they will look/feel different when painting later.
Make sure every edge is supported. If you need to, screw in some 2X2 stock, so every edge can be secured.
I found about every 18-20" was good spacing for screws. A good way to tell if it's secure enough is to hit the panel and see if it has a solid thud or if the panel bounces/rattles. If it bounces, put in another screw.
If you can't get a good/straight seam, caulk will hide a multitude of sins.


5) Finishing -- AKA Caulk-it-up!!!
I used a little over a case of caulk for both my bays and ceiling on one side. I just got the fast-dry, latex caulk in brilliant white.
Caulk in this project plays the same role as joint-compond does for drywall. No matter how good a joint is, a little caulk smoothed over it will make it look better especially with some paint.
Put a liberal bead of caulk down each joint, making sure to fill all the crevices/gaps at least level with the boards to either side.
Scrape the excess smooth with a rubber edged caulk-scraper. This WILL generate a LOT of wasted caulk, but it's OK, you can just wipe it off with a paper-towel. I tried early on to re-use some of it in trowel like application, but that was WAY too painful, so I just trashed most of the excess.


6) Painting --
Based on what I've seen here, I chose to prime with Kilz2 latex primer. It worked well, covered well, in one coat, and I would recommend it for easier clean-up than the oil-based kilz.
For the ceiling down to the area where my outlets are, I just went with a cheap Olympic exterior latex semigloss from Lowes.
For the working area around the outlets, I went with an interior latex semi-gloss tinted to about 50% gray so it would hide the dirt.
Rollers -- VERY important here: I stared out with a 3/4" nap roller, and it brought the suck. On a recommendation from a friend, I changed over to a 1.25" nap roller and rolled it out of a bucket with a screen. MUCH easier to do. It easily fills all the nooks/crannies in the OSB without killing yourself.
On recommendation from the same friend, I picked up a roll of tar-paper to serve as a floor covering near the walls. It worked GREAT, it's cheap too.
I've gotten about 90% of one side done, and about 25% of the other side done, I'll post some pics when I can.


7) Outlets/Boxes -- I have some very definitive feelings about how plugs "feel". I HATE it when they feel loose/flimsy.
I originally wanted metal boxes for my stuff, but they were prohibitively expensive for the number I wanted to put in.
Boxes -- As a compromise I went with the Carlon Super-Blue series plastic boxes they seemed to be a bit more rigid than normal boxes.
On some of the later boxes and larger welder plugs (which take a LOT of pulling) I put a couple of drywall screws through the side of the box, into the stud. This stiffens them up very nicely.
Receptacles -- On the outlets themselves, I used pro-grade gray Leviton back-feed 20A receptacles, mounted upside-down like hospitals. I always liked the idea of having the ground on TOP in case a plug pulls partially out.
Plates -- I originally was going to do stainless plates, but they were too expensive. I bought and put up the nylon plates and they were VERY flimsy. I then found some galvanized plates from HD for $0.94 each theses are super stiff and will look good with the galvanized/corrugated that I will be putting on the lower 4' of wall as "wainscoting".

Looks great! I can't wait to see it finished...

Just curious why you went rough side out with the sheeting? I'm getting close to the same step in my shop project and I was planning to show the smooth side, but I don't really have a reason why.:confused:

Just curious why you went rough side out with the sheeting? I'm getting close to the same step in my shop project and I was planning to show the smooth side, but I don't really have a reason why.:confused:

I don't know that there's a good reason other than consistency. We started with the lines marked on the outside (makes it easier to find studs on 16" centers) and just kept it up. The only thing I might say on the smooth side is that it has a lot of writing on it, so you may need multiple coats if you are using light primer/paint.

If anybody has other compelling arguments, I'd like to hear them too.

Here are some pic updates:

Galvanized outlet covers for Non-GFI boxes:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0503.jpg

Setup for GFI boxes:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0504.jpg

New bay with caulked seams:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0499.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0498.jpg

New bay primed, lower:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0501.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0500.jpg

Old bay nearing completion:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0496.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/DSCF0497.jpg

Note: in pics above, I will be adding galvanized aluminum up to the 4' mark, topped by chair railing, so the lower edge isn't very clean. On the upper edge I tried to tape it off, but it bleeds under the tape, so I'll be adding some mill-work above to maintain a clean line there too.

personally i think the smooth resin side should cover better. there are many more wood edges on the rough side. i prefer plywood to osb, but with the price difference i would probably buy osb too. you are going to need to air it out really well to get the resin smell out of your shop.
Doug

i prefer plywood to osb, but with the price difference i would probably buy osb too. you are going to need to air it out really well to get the resin smell out of your shop.

You can say THAT again... 7/16 OSB is running $4.30 a sheet here now. I ran about 60-80 sheets total for everything I did. Comparable plywood here was running in the $16/18 per sheet price last time I looked. I would have LOVED to have been able to afford plywood, but it just wasn't in the cards.

Ventillation isn't really a problem I run a ridge-vent in the attic, and there are 10X10 doors front/rear when I open both the cross-vent is very good.

so i think you need some more outlets lol

great build bro, iiiwish i had one

nice shop. only have one suggestion.

Instead of corrugated tin around the bottom, which will look like shit in a few years from dents and what-not....go to a sheet metal shop and have them brake a 1/2" 180* lip to one long side and 1 short side of regular 18 gauge sheet metal. It comes in 12' lengths and will mount flat against your OSB. Run the fold to the top and overlap the non-bent side with the fold so you have no sharp edges. I even had them brake my corners so I had no seams.

I will try to get pics in the next day or two. I think you would be much happier with the outcome of this.

nice shop. only have one suggestion.

Instead of corrugated tin around the bottom, which will look like shit in a few years from dents and what-not....go to a sheet metal shop and have them brake a 1/2" 180* lip to one long side and 1 short side of regular 18 gauge sheet metal. It comes in 12' lengths and will mount flat against your OSB. Run the fold to the top and overlap the non-bent side with the fold so you have no sharp edges. I even had them brake my corners so I had no seams.

I will try to get pics in the next day or two. I think you would be much happier with the outcome of this.

That certainly sounds good, and you have my attention. I'm not fully getting the seam/brake setup though, if you could snap a couple of close-ups of the setup I'd appreciate.

Also a question here: Are you using regular steel or some kind of galvanized? I'm looking for something with low-maintenance/low-effort (read as: I hate painting), but I also hate rust (humidity is killer here) so how do you keep it from rusting?

so i think you need some more outlets lol

Funny you should say that. I've had plenty of people kid me about that, but at the same time, magically my extension cords haven't been used in a MONTH. Even better: wherever I've used my welder recently, it gets plugged into the WALL (no extension from the factory pigtail), and I can reach EVERYwhere in the shop with NO extension!!!:grinpimp::flipoff2::smokin:

Funny you should say that. I've had plenty of people kid me about that, but at the same time, magically my extension cords haven't been used in a MONTH. Even better: wherever I've used my welder recently, it gets plugged into the WALL (no extension from the factory pigtail), and I can reach EVERYwhere in the shop with NO extension!!!:grinpimp::flipoff2::smokin:

You may have answered this elsewhere in the thread, but how many 4 gang outlets do you have on each (20a?) circuit? How many 240v outlets per circuit? What kind of receptacle did you use for the 220v outlets?

Thanks! You've got a great shop there...

Mark

You may have answered this elsewhere in the thread, but how many 4 gang outlets do you have on each (20a?) circuit? How many 240v outlets per circuit? What kind of receptacle did you use for the 220v outlets?

On average, I was STUPIDLY conservative in outlets per breaker. 70% of the boxes in the new bay are on their own dedicated circuits (one box, each with it's own breaker and wire-run). The outlets for 110V are Spec Grade 20Amp outlets run on 12-2, with a 20 Amp breaker per box (overkill, I know, but I HATE tripping breakers when you're working with multiple tools). Due to code/inspection EACH box/ckt has it's own GFCI outlet in it.

In the old bay I have some run on a common wall between the bays where I shared existing runs through the back of the wall. On these I went with two boxes per ckt/wire run this is about 20% of my outlets.

All light banks are also on separate/dedicated 20 Amp ckts.

On the 240V Outlets, I used a Pass & Seymour brand NEMA 6-50R outlet (this is a standard welder plug on most average machines. I put this plug on ALL my 240V stuff for simplicity sake with extension cords. I like the P&S better than others, it's a little beefier (get them at Home Depot).
http://assets.twacomm.com/assets/1982003507/product_images/18830.jpg

They are run on 6 gauge wire. I have 4 dedicated 50 amp outlets in the new bay. I have 2 dedicated 30 amp outlets for lift/compressor on 10 gauge wire.

Because of the extremely high cost of wire 6 ga. wire, I compromised on the farthest walls and put in two other 50 amp ckts that each have a junction box and 2 outlets (for an additional 4 240V outlets). It's not the optimum setup, but I can use my welder/plasma at any point in my shop (both bays) without an extension cord, besides how often am I going to be going full-tilt on both machines in the same bay, at the same time?

Sheetmetal on walls:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2382/2487175508_2d0929aac6_b.jpg

A few more pics here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/hutchew/sets/72157605021838359/

Hutchew: thanks for the replly, I really like the way that looks.

Is there some sort of coating on that, or did you do something special to keep it from rusting?

It's just regular galvanized sheet metal with no other coating. Those pictures are of a 5 year old wall. Still looks good, I think.

request for completed pics as well as some wrenching shots and perhaps a floorplan layout of tools and such.

It's been a while since I updated, since then mainly been working IN the shop, rather than ON the shop, so other than it getting dirtier, not a whole lot to talk about there. But I HAVE been enjoying having a place to park my daily driver inside too. Nice to have on those cooler mornings and no scraping ice.

The new projects:
1) When I built my great-big-freakin-wall, I got tired of buying dirt, so there's a section where I left the grade lower along the wall than I would like. This project will finish out the area along the wall and cover it with crush-n-run so I have a better parking area, no grass to cut, and just dress it out a little nicer. It will also help remove some drainage/erosion issues I've been having as well.

2) The original plan way-back when was to add a 10' bump-out to the entire back of the shop. This is the area where I'll have a bathroom (one day), and put the machine-area. I'm not ready to start laying out cash to pour the foundation yet, so I'm having it built as an open lean-to area. I'll have 6X6 posts on piers to support it, then come back later (over the next couple of years) and pour the slab. Once the slab is complete, then I can just frame it all in.

As many have asked, you will all be happy to know I'm also making arrangements to better situate the stairs/entry-way up to the second story as part of this.

Before:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0415.jpg

More Before:
http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/album59/DSCF0432.jpg


Pics from lunch today:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0604.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0605.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0606.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0607.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0608.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0609.jpg

request for completed pics as well as some wrenching shots and perhaps a floorplan layout of tools and such.

Sorry, I missed this one, I'll snap some pics over the weekend. At the moment I've got a friend's 1/2 ton chevy tow-pig in there, so wrenching shots won't be an issue, but I can't claim to really have any kind of organization at the moment. Mainly, I just try to keep the crap pushed back against the walls so I can work and everything is on casters, so I can move it all around as I need to. This is both good and bad.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/BasicFloorplan-1.jpg

Note: it's not anywhere NEAR as clean as this makes it look.

Some more progress this week:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0610.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0611.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0612.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0613.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0614.jpg

sweeeet

Why so short on the roof line? It seems weird to get in that walk through door, plus it looks several feet shorter than the garage door, which seems self defeating...

I'm just curious on the reasons behind it.

Why so short on the roof line? It seems weird to get in that walk through door, plus it looks several feet shorter than the garage door, which seems self defeating...

You're right on both counts Nissan, but there were reasons behind it...
1) that was the roof-line required so we weren't building ABOVE the threshold of the second-floor entry. It also lined up better with the existing eve/soffits a little better than other solutions.

2) We went with the shallowest pitch I felt comfortable with (12/3), but the rear door was still "only" a seven footer after we hung the header (normal home-garage-size).

In a perfect world I'd have 10' doors all the way through, but it's not entirely necessary. The rear door is only for short wheelbase vehicles, lawn tractor, etc (sharp turn coming out the back up against the wall now), light and ventilation.

The rear space will eventually be a machine-shop, clean-room, bathroom, physical plant, etc. once I pour a slab and frame it in. So the rear shop door really becomes more about isolating the "clean" area from the dirty/fabrication area since there's no insulation on that door.

Looks like fun Herb! Coming along nice.

Looks like fun Herb! Coming along nice.

Thanks for the kind words, sir! But I've seen your garage/shop space, when are you gonna post up some pics of your place? As I remember it was something on the order of 5 bays plus a drive-under basement? Even if you ain't started on your BIG shop space, I'll bet there are a lotta guys around here who have never seen crown-moulding in a garage! :grinpimp:

Progress at lunch today:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0621.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0620.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0616.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0615.jpg

A little more progress today:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0622.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0624.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0625.jpg

This is my foundation inspector.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0626.jpg

She says: "It's all good, Dad."
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0627.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0629.jpg

Here's a finished pick of my bigAss WALL with the garage in the background.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0630.jpg

We're long overdue for an update here:

Took some time off for the rains while Noah lined up animals 2 X 2.

We're mostly finished with the Vinyl, but ran out before covering the old wall up above the roof. The soffit and fascia work is done too. Gutters are supposed to go on this week.

Last but certainly not least, the stairs got started this week before the rains came back, and I'll actually be able to start on and use my 2nd story now (and all the jokes about the door up there will of course come to a stop after only 2 years).

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0642-1.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0643.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0644.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0645.jpg

Looks good Herb. I didn't read it all, but are you planning on closing in the are under the 6x6s and eve. Either way it looks like a nice place to have a cold one on a hot day.

Looks good Herb. I didn't read it all, but are you planning on closing in the are under the 6x6s and eve. Either way it looks like a nice place to have a cold one on a hot day.

Yeah, when it's all said and done (when I get the cash), I'll pour a slab back there and frame it all in. That's where I'll put the bathroom, compressor, and machine room. It'll probably sit a couple of years like this while I save my pennies for the next step.

if you wake up and find that your garage has been stolen ... im likely responsible.


kick ass shop man, very well done. this is similar to the setup i have been dreaming about for years.

Things are getting pretty close to finished for now... Gutters on, stairs complete.

Also need to do something about moving the fence around at this point too. (obviously)
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0649.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0651.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0652.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0653.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0657.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0658.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0662.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0667.jpg

One bad thing, now that the stairs are complete and I've spend a little more time upstairs, I've found some significant issues left by the original owner/construction crew. The floor is going to need some pretty significant additional bracing and the ridge-beam on the old side is cracked pretty significantly in several places. :roll:

if you wake up and find that your garage has been stolen ... im likely responsible.

Haha! I'd like to meet the man who has some technology that can move about 120 yards of concrete while I'm asleep.:laughing:

As for it being gone, well let's just say my friends have learned to call ahead :grinpimp:

Glad you've enjoyed the build, this has been a lot of years coming for me too.

This is the thread that inspired my build. Thanks, man. Enjoy it.

Mark

Been a while since the last update. This one is a bit more fru-fru than in the past, but been working on organization, cleaning, storage, and usability issues. One of the issues I've had is that I've got PLENTY of power, but I'm constantly tripping over, boxes, air hoses and cords. This week we solved ALL that shit.

My parents just left, they came and stayed for a week and I put Dad to work. Man he did he whine about putting together all 21 gladiator cabinets!!!

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0679.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0682.jpg

Hanging one wall. Did 2X6's into the studs then lagged into the stringers. I considered the Gladiator geartrack mounting systems, but that cost more than I paid for the cabinets!!!

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0685.jpg

Second wall hung.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0688.jpg

Also hung my wire rack and other cord reel that I have been tripping over for a while.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0690.jpg

Finished product with the daily-putt-putt parked in.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0697.jpg

Also mounted 3 hose reels.
2 of those are Lowes specials (50 footers with 3/8" hose).
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0691.jpg

The other Lowes reel, another cord reel, and a single cabinet, nice place to put wallet, keys, ipod, sound station while working.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0694.jpg

This is the main hose-reel, it's a Cox-Reel, 100 footer with 1/2" line above the blast cabinet.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Cabinets/DSCF0695.jpg

Also got a chance to do some much needed maintenance work on my bender, drill-press, and bandsaw. It's a GREAT feeling to get things cleaned up and in proper working order again.

Looks good, I like the lean to add on, will be building something very similar on my 20x30 block shop. Question, what are the post against the main structure for? Support of the wall plate?

Why the couple inch gap between each cabinet?

Question, what are the post against the main structure for? Support of the wall plate?

Normally they would not be necessary, but the original structure (if you go back to the beginning of this post you will see it was built in 3 separate stages) wasn't done by me. The PO, did a lot of stuff half-assed, so at every point I've built all my stuff to stand on it's own, even if everything else fell down. Overkill? Probably. When I close/frame in the rear part, I'll also frame a 2X6 wall there too, it makes for a GREAT sound barrier too.

Why the couple inch gap between each cabinet?

Several reasons actually:
1) the cabinets have button-head screws, so unless you assemble them all together, there's still at least 1/4" gap between them, looks like shit and I didn't want to assemble an entire row at the same time.

2) There's a second shelf behind the door. On half of my boxes, I put it in, on half I left it out. Time will tell which is more useful. In order to change the configuration you need to be able to get a screwdriver in there.

3) I haven't run hard airline drops around the shop yet. When I do, it'll be easier to drop a run or two between the cabinets for use on benches.

4) The space gives me a good place to put up a nail and store things like levels, rulers, and other long/skinny annoying shit.

5) I like the evenly spaced approach vs. haviing a big gap at either end.

I like the idea of puttin the hose reels up higher, Thanks, now I gonna be incorporating it in now.

Just read the whole thread start to finish!! Damn Nice shop man!! I keep kicking myself for settling on the bigger house with the 1 car garage. Can I ask what you do to afford a shop that nice?

-Dane

Just read the whole thread start to finish!! Damn Nice shop man!! I keep kicking myself for settling on the bigger house with the 1 car garage. Can I ask what you do to afford a shop that nice?

-Dane

I herd cats for a living. Which is to say I manage software developers. Aside from the issues around The Great Wall, everything you see here has been pretty affordable. The wife (teacher) and I made a conscious decision to get what we wanted and we don't regret it, but we're not in the average suburban neighborhood either. We bought less house, more land. We bought less into the neighborhood vibe, more into the country.

We're comfortable, but not wealthy. We live well below our means. The original purchase on the house was around $300K, the shop, has been about $30K all-in, since the start. Some of that was equity from selling our first house, much of it has been paid out of pocket over time as the projects are done. For example, our 2008 tax return paid for the latest addition in its entirety.

There's also sweat-equity. Everything I can effectively do on my own I do, with the help of friends. I put in all the wiring myself, all the insulation, and all the OSB, painting, etc. The electrical alone saved me probably $10K the way I wanted things done.

There are also things I will NOT do myself because I can pay what I feel is a reasonable cost to get it done properly in a fraction of the time it would take me to fuck it up completely. My time is valuable, if to nobody else but me. Things like siding, roofing, framing, etc.

Even things like the lift aren't THAT expensive, once you start researching. I spent about $3K on mine, and it is top-of the line. If I had known about it, at the time, there is a local place you can get them for about HALF that. I always tell people, if I had the SPACE, I would have had a lift YEARS ago.

So in short... I think a LOT of people could do what I did, if they understood some of the choices. Obviously we don't live in an area where land is prohibitively expensive, but then again, the last time I checked, things were pretty reasonable in Colorado, as long as you don't have to live in-town.

Wow, it's been a while since my last update. First off, my old image hosting site went down so a lot of the links here are broken. I've reposted them in my photobucket account, but I'm not going back to fix all the links. Here's a link to the album:

http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Shop%20build/

The latest project I've been working on is shop air, and some general use/livability issues.

For the shop air, I am using 3/4" copper for all my main lines with 1/2" drops. Every drop/vertical run has a ball-valve for moisture control. Here is a basic layout, I've currently got the large bay done, with stubs ready for the new bay. A plumber friend has been doing this for me in trade for some work, so it's been slow going, but it's all under pressure and it sure is nice to plug in where ever I need to.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/ShopAir.jpg

You'll note there's a large number of hose-reels. My main reel is a ReelCraft 100' 1/2" all metal, and I have 3 other, smaller Lowes Taskforce 50' X 3/8" hoses I got on super-special for $29.99 a while back. The goal here is to have a retractable reel and/or a short whip available for all my major project areas so I don't have to have a bunch of hose on the floor to trip over.

The main line is a 3/4" push-lock hose to a 3/4" Speed-Air regulator and coalescing filter. I'm not entirely happy with this setup, and we'll probably clean it up a bit just to keep things closer to the wall.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0860.jpg

Here we have the 3/4" feed up to the mainline.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0859.jpg

Each of the drops has a 4" drip-leg with a ball-valve below it. I would have liked to make longer drip-legs but wanted to keep everything above 4' off the floor for plywood/sheet metal storage and still keep a good working height for the connectors. I used Milton M-Style 3/8" male connectors for all my drops.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0861.jpg

Right wall (ignore the mess/project stuff):
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0857.jpg

Back wall, near compressor. Note the stub to feed the next bay over:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0858.jpg

Left wall up to hose-reel. Also note the Husky cord reel, in addition to outlets, I also have three cord reels around for retractable electric too:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0862.jpg

Here's the blast cabinet, it sits on the other side of the wall from the compressor. With the doors closed, I can barely hear the compressor run (and certainly not over the vacuum/dust collector). The plan is to drop a 3/4" line directly to the the blast cabinet with it's own filter plumbed into it at the point of use. I've had a chance to run the blast cabinet off the copper lines and there is a MARKED difference in the dryness of the air as the compressor cycles over extended usage compared to connecting directly to the compressor with a hose.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Tools/DSCF0855.jpg

The next phase started this week...

The covered area in the back is getting a slab. This will be the area I put my machine shop into. Not doing the whole thing, the remainder is where the bathroom will go, but I'm not ready to start fooling with plumbing yet. Here's the slab drawing:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/RearSlabDrawing.jpg

I'll be framing this in and building a compressor room under the stairs.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0874.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0875.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0877.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0878.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0879.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0880.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0882.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0883.jpg

Here's the new walk door that I had framed into the old part of the shop.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0885.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0887.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0888.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0889.jpg

In the afternoon, it's awaiting the finish...
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0898.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0899.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0900.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0901.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0902.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0904.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0905.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0906.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0907.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0910.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0912.jpg

Nice to see some still have the ability to build during these times..:D
Shop is looking great keep up the great work.

Nice to see some still have the ability to build during these times..:D
Shop is looking great keep up the great work.

Thanks for the kind words. It's exactly BECAUSE of these times that I'm able to build. There are a lot of guys out there that are looking for work just to keep their crews paid. The pricing I got to do this was so good I couldn't afford NOT to do it. For comparison, it was less than half the cost I paid for the last slab I had poured, and it used commercial 400PSI concrete instead of 3500PSI I used on the last one.

So how will this lay out? I know you got a mill, did you get a lathe too? Are you planning on closing the rest in, or leaving it open? Looks good, I can only dream now. The added bonus is once you get your mill back there it can be used as a winch point. :grinpimp:

edit: one more question, I'm guessing the ball valves are the lowest point on the drop leg so you just turn the valve and let the water out? Do you get much water in the rest of the system with a pre-water seperator after the compressor?

So how will this lay out? I know you got a mill, did you get a lathe too? Are you planning on closing the rest in, or leaving it open? Looks good, I can only dream now. The added bonus is once you get your mill back there it can be used as a winch point. :grinpimp:

edit: one more question, I'm guessing the ball valves are the lowest point on the drop leg so you just turn the valve and let the water out? Do you get much water in the rest of the system with a pre-water seperator after the compressor?

The mill was an acquisition of opportunity, I had just started looking and founf one for $150 about 20 miles from me. Couldn't pass it up, but really didn't have a place to put it. I've been looking for that same type of deal for a lathe, and will get more serious about it and/or consider paying more for one when I have a spot for it (i.e. when the back area is closed in). I've been looking for something with at least a 1.5" spindle-bore so I can chuck up an axle if I want to. Those are difficult to find, overly large, or prohibitively expensive. I figure one of the 14X40's should work nicely.

As for the plan, yes, I'll close in the rest and pour a slab once I get to the point where I can deal with the plumbing for the bathroom. My septic is under the FRONT yard which will require cutting the original driveway. I REALLY want to have a shitter, slop-sink, and to build the mother of all showers for cleaning up after working in the shop. I'm talking like a 5' X 5' stall with 2 heads, jets, and a bench. May investigate a steam option too.

On the air system, you are correct sir. At every low-point I have a valve/drip leg. I make it a point to empty them all at least once per weekend. As for volume of water, I do a LOT of blasting and running high-volume air tools (die grinders and the like). Last weekend I was stripping my bandsaw down for paint and I probably ran the compressor for about an hour straight. At the end of the evening, I got about a full 16oz. bottle between the compressor (75%), the separator (20%), and the drops (5%). The farther from the compressor, the drier it tends to be. I also run a secondary separator/filter at the point of use drop for my blast cabinet to keep as much moisture out of the air as possible for high volume loads llike blasting. If you're asking are they worth it, then my answer would have to be they cost a bit more to do that way, but yes, they are worth it.

I was just curious how much water they actually can let out. I would have never thought of doing that, but it's a great idea.

As for the lathe, that a pretty healthy size. I believe bill's is a 13x50 or so with a 1.5 through hole. Somewhere around there. Are you wanting to cut splines? Because that can be done on a mill with a rotary table. Keep in mind that you can't use your actual length if you are going to center bore with a tail stock type configuration. We were drilling/taping links the other day, I think we were doing them at 30", and figured we could get about 6" more out of the bed. When you add in the length of the tailstock plus drillbit, it eats up space pretty fast. That said, I can't remember the last time we were working with something small enough to go all the way through the head.

Sounds like you got a smoking deal on the mill, but I'm sure you've found the tooling can get expensive. Look on ebay to find whole lots of tooling someone is selling. Usually it's mixed up stuff, but we've got a lot of good tooling cheap that way.

One more question, I'm guessing you're using sand for your blast cabin, and that is the concern for water? Have you thought of going to a different media, like cilica beads or the like?

bump, any updates on this project? its like the mother of all garages

Yeah, funny this should pop up now... I've been working on a few new things and was going to get some pics later, since I'm off today. I'll chack back in when I have something this afternoon.

One more question, I'm guessing you're using sand for your blast cabin, and that is the concern for water? Have you thought of going to a different media, like cilica beads or the like?

Sorry, I missed this question... Yes, I'm using pool filter sand. The determining factor had nothing to do with water. I have VERY dry air now that I'm using copper lines (and a LONG run of them). I also have a filter at the point of use too, so the blaster stays dry.

No, I used the sand, cause it's CHEAP. $6 per 50# at home depot. It works too. Most of the stuff I blast is NOT delicate and has lots of crud, the sand is the perfect grit to clean it fast. I have glass bead and walnut media too, but rarely do delicate stuff that requires that. You do need to let the sand dry when you get it though, typically their bags sweat and it's all wet when you get it.

I also have a filtered vaccum (I run drywall filters in my shop vac, so it's triple filtered). With regular sand you need to make sure you aren't breathing the stuff, it's dangerous (silicosis).

These aren't 100% current, I didn't get a chance to take pics before it got dark on me. I was actually off work today, so I got a chance to get some stuff done.

Things complete since last update:

90% of the framing complete. Just have to rough-in an internal doorway and about 3' of common wall for sound/insulation.
Exterior is fully sheathed and I put the house wrap on as my last thing this evening.
I hired out framing the compressor room, and I'm glad I did, it was more complicated than my meager skillz could handle. It turned out great.
Garage door is in, ready to hang the opener.
About 1/2 of the electrical boxes are hung, just need to start pulling wire.
While it's mostly weather tight, I still need to hang 3 more doors (only one exterior), a buddy is helping out with that one.
Oh, and I burned through a metric shit-ton of lumber. It's all 2X6 framing and already used 30 sheets of OSB.

Since the sheathing went on, it's MUCH more suited to working when it's nasty outside.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0922.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0923.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0924.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0925.jpg

I'll try to get some more updated pics this week if I can get home before dark.

One thing I might point out here: I'm using all exterior doors, even internally, they are heavier, deaden sound better, and are energy star rated. In addition to that I went with a double walled insulated garage door, SUPER quiet for grinding and whatnot late at night, WAY beefy, I'll never buy a cheapie again. If you look at the tax stuff for 2009/2010 the gubmint will evengive you some money back since it's "energy efficient".

Looking great Herb. You should feel the jealousy through the computer.

Some updates here, nothing huge, mainly been working inside now that things are buttoned up and weather tight. 3 out of the 4 doors are mounted.

Here's the door to the compressor room.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0952.jpg

Here's the framed-in wall. The gravel area will be the bathroom. That will be commencing in the near future, once the tax returns come in.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0949.jpg

Here you can see the electrical in the far wall. It's ready for insulation and buttoning up.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0950.jpg

Looking back in the opposite direction.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0951.jpg

Have Tyvek on the outside, and it'll probably stay that way until the bathroom is complete and I can side the whole thing at one time. Here you can also see the compressor room is complete/roofed.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0953.jpg

As a shameless tool gloat, I found a lathe and have been dealing with it so I have a easier time getting the machine room finished. Finally got it unloaded off the trailer, had it all parked in my shop. Man that's one HEAVY chunka lathe...

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Hercules/DSCF0944.jpg

Did I mention that I LOVE my lift? There's no way I could have dealt with this or some of the other heavy stuff in my shop without it.

So I took some time this weekend to make the lathe a little more mobile. We built a HD pallet. We used 3 rails of 4X6 as the base with decking built out of 2X6's and 2X10's, didn't even move when we dropped the full weight onto it.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Hercules/DSCF0956.jpg

On the tailstock side I got two furniture dollies from Northern Tool. Both rated for 1000 pounds. I tied them together with screws and 2X6's.
Surprisingly enough when we lifted up the headstock end, the tailstock side had ZERO weight on it, and lifter off the dollies.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200318267_200318267

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Hercules/DSCF0954.jpg

Last but not least, here's the rigging we used to get the lathe off the trailer. On the tailstock side we were able to the a full 1.5" rod through the body to the lift arms. On the headstock side, the HOLES would support a 1.5 bar, but there was a piece of casting junk inside that occluded the hole. As the next best thing, I had an old axle (about 1-3/8") that I used instead.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Hercules/DSCF0955.jpg

Thats a big ass lathe

God i want my own garage.. But i guess I need my own place 1st

Awsome

what brand lift you got there how you like it ?

Thats a big ass lathe

S'ok, I gotta big-ass, so it fits right in. :grinpimp:

what brand lift you got there how you like it ?

It's a Rotary 10K lift. I really like it, there is stuff like this that would be a SERIOUS PITA without it. It's definitely worth the money, but in retrospect, I'm not sure I wouldn't have gotten a lift from Greg Smith Equipment. They are local to me and I think they're good enough for hobbiests like us, and a lot cheaper.

It's a Rotary 10K lift. I really like it, there is stuff like this that would be a SERIOUS PITA without it. It's definitely worth the money, but in retrospect, I'm not sure I wouldn't have gotten a lift from Greg Smith Equipment. They are local to me and I think they're good enough for hobbiests like us, and a lot cheaper

Ive looked at several but I really like how the arms are braced on that lift. That thing looks healthy.....Kudos for the writeup now let see something turned down on that big ass lathe....:D

Ive looked at several but I really like how the arms are braced on that lift. That thing looks healthy.....Kudos for the writeup now let see something turned down on that big ass lathe....:D

It's the standard Rotary assymetric arm config. After living with it, I wouldn't buy a lift that wasn't assymetric. Makes getting in/out easier. The normal junk I have is an FSJ (M-715, 5-quarter ton truck) and it handles it just fine, lots of people say symetrical arms are good for big trucks, but I just don't see it.

Haha :flipoff2: you'll have to wait a while to see some lathe-product. I gotta finish the machine shop interior/electrical first. After that I have to build out a shower/shitter for the shop.
Then I have to fawk with this:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Do%20All%20Saw/DSCF0890.jpg

Then I have to fawk with this:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Mill/DSCF0873.jpg

And it'd be nice if my junk RAN this year... shit, I just have too many projects.:laughing:

So in between the rain and all the other distractions, I HAVE been able to make a little more progress.... BUT in a different direction. This month saw tax refunds come back, so I started back on the bathroom.

Slab/layout design:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/BathroomLayout.jpg

Stubbed up for everything:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0984.jpg

When your plumber has issues with the layout/walkthrough, sometimes you gotta go low-tech:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0985.jpg

Floor drain:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0997.jpg

Formed:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0998.jpg

Shower formed (yes, at 5'X5' interior dimensions, it IS huge, it'll have two separate heads with body sprays on each):
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0996.jpg

Completed Slab with curbs poured in for the shower enclosure:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0999.jpg

Septic got trenched and hooked in today. While we were at it, I had the guys tie my gutter downspouts into an existing line that empties into our pond.

As I can, I'll get this framed in, but two critical areas I need to figure out first is what I need to have open for the ac/heat/ptac unit in the wall for rough framing, and what I'm going to do for a dog door and how to frame around it.

When your plumber has issues with the layout/walkthrough, sometimes you gotta go low-tech:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF0985.jpg


Im still not sure you're plumber will get the hint. Ive met him.

If I had this shop, I could sell my house and dis-own the family:D
Very nice

Im still not sure you're plumber will get the hint. Ive met him.

uhhhh... I got nothing for ya on that one man... :homer:

If I had this shop, I could sell my house and dis-own the family:D
Very nice

Thanks for the kind words, but I couldn't have done all this without my wife. She's been a huge help from a morale, support, and logistical perspective. I wouldn't have this if it weren't for her, she's my enabler, I'm her :grinpimp: Besides, once I'm done, she's already gone on record as saying she would live in it!!!

bumb for updates....

Well past due for some updates....

The wife and I just finished another little project in the attached garage... It was sadly in need of attention, other than some additional wiring, we hadn't really touched it since we moved in so we took advantage of some good weather to get in a quick project:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Attached%20Garage/DSCF0893.jpg

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Attached%20Garage/DSCF0894.jpg

The downside of this is that now that my garage is clean and fresh, the garage fridge I got for free and runs just FINE seems wholely inadequate. It also underscores the need for some work on the floor and epoxy. The UP side is that since it's where 90% of our guests enter through, the wife is 110% onboard with the idea.

I got a killer Black Friday deal on it at Sears.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Attached%20Garage/DSCF0896.jpg

The old fridge is still awaiting haul-off, but it still seems a LOT smaller now that it's not empty.

Here it is with the wife's grocery getter:

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Attached%20Garage/DSCF0897.jpg

Now back to the real work in the shop...

Got the ceilings and upper walls insulated painted and lights hung up in the machine shop (no pics yet, it's a mess).

Got the windows installed before that. I particularly liked these, they are only about 10" wide and I got all three of them for $60 from a local supply house.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF1132.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF1131.jpg

Got the siding finished so now most of the external work is done.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0969.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0966.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/New%20Addition/DSCF0964.jpg

So now we move on to the main meat of the interior for the shop... BUT I got side swiped into another issue with the wife (again). New decks this time.

So we have an existing deck that we're extending to attach to the back of the shop, adding two arbors for some comfy hammock time, and extending accross the entire back of the house.

First step: strip the old rails off the existing deck.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0956.jpg

Next step start framing the far side addition.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0963.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0962.jpg

Granted we won't be able to enjoy the deck at this point until it starts to warm up some, but a) it makes the wife happy b) you can get a SCREAMIN' deal on a deck in the winter time when the deck companies are sitting on their hands.:pimpflash

:beer:The uprights for the arbors are mostly in, and all the framing is done... The shop is there on the far right.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0981.jpg

Little better view of the back of the shop.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0977.jpg

Looking from off the left side of the house back towards the shop
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0974.jpg

From the top of the stairs in the 2nd story of the shop down on to the deck.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0972.jpg

Yeah... That's right bitches... DECKS... PIRATE style... I see a party in the future...:beer:

nice

Well, we've been having some rain, but the deck guys have still been kicking ass and taking names. Things have gone so well thus far that I've thrown them my secondary/DIY project to re-deck the existing/old deck. They're doing a pretty cool herringbone patern on it. Still not 100% complete but should be close by the end of the day.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0997.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0994.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0992.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0991.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0989.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0985.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/DSCF0984.jpg

:beer: You need a few. For all this hard work your making me sweat

So when we contracted having the decks built, there were several things we specifically wanted them to leave off, both for cost savings and because I wanted them done very specifically. The first was the rails.

We have a GREAT backyard with a pond and some woods. We frequently have deer and other wildlife and like to be able to see off the deck even when seated. I looked into cable railing systems but they were all stupidly expensive. Especially with the amount I had to run. There's a little over 400' of cable in these rails.

So with a little research I found that Lowes had about the best deals on hardware and turnbuckles, all aluminum/galvanized with vinyl coated galvanized 3/16" cable. Based on local codes, we had to space them 3.5" apart, so the top and bottom rail helped take up some space too.

It's kind of hard to see the cables because they disappear into the background just like we planned on.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/7cce27e1.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/532f857c.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/b7b5b348.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/c68ff78d.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/c8365e7c.jpg

In addition to that, we have a neighbor on one side, and we don't want to look at her house when we're out there, plus the lattice does a nice job of blocking the later afternoon sun.

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Deck%20building/e3cfed2b.jpg

All in all I don't consider myself much of a wood-guy, but I think this turned out pretty well. Two tools I could NOT have done this without I picked up especially for this: a Lowes/Kobalt sliding compound miter saw, and a Makita impact driver.

The for the price the saw did everything I could have asked and more, it's no snap-on, but it's a solid little workhorse. For those of you who haven't used an impact driver vs. a drill OH MY GAWD!!! Never knew there was such a difference (and I have NICE drills), get thee to the tool-store!!!

All in all I don't consider myself much of a wood-guy, but I think this turned out pretty well. Two tools I could NOT have done this without I picked up especially for this: a Lowes/Kobalt sliding compound miter saw, and a Makita impact driver.

The for the price the saw did everything I could have asked and more, it's no snap-on, but it's a solid little workhorse. For those of you who haven't used an impact driver vs. a drill OH MY GAWD!!! Never knew there was such a difference (and I have NICE drills), get thee to the tool-store!!!

First off, the deck turned out beautifully! :grinpimp:

I also second the miter saw and impact drivers(currently have an older Bosch). The miter saw works well, especially for the price. Also, with it being a 10" saw, blades are reasonable, as compared to 12" miter saw blades. I bought one about 3 years ago to do my kitchen flooring with. I have moved it up to fine work, and relegated my other compound miter saw to framing/rough work.

Now it's just waiting for me to get a place cleared for it in the new shed:shaking:

I love impact drivers for framing, plumbing, and electrical, because their smaller size makes them great for fitting into tighter stud bays, mounting panel boxes, strapping pipes, conduit, etc.

hell of a deck

hell of a deck

Well, this being Pirate, I figured, it was a "go big or go home" kinda crowd. Now we have :massey:deck

To teh PBB. Gentlemen,

I give you: MAN-wash.

Shower-wall#1:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF10252.jpg

To the right of that, shower-wall#2:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF10232.jpg

Have you ever had one of those stupidly expensive projects that turns out to be TOTALLY worth it? My wife says this shower is one of them. :beer::pimpflash

Here we have the beginnings of MAN-vanity:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF10202.jpg
things that should describe most man-accoutrements: stainless, roller-bearing drawers, on casters. I plan on framing this area out after the drywall goes up, mounting the sink up on the wall, and putting in some nice counter material to finish it properly.

Last but not least we have the MAN-Towel-bar:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF10192.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Bathroom/DSCF10262.jpg
Much like the TP dispenser previously showcased, this was my solution to the wimpy selection of towel bars out there. It can be used to hold towels, as a chin-up bar for midgets, or something to chain a pit-bull to. Speaking of which note the dog door for my killer-hounds:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/zoe/DSCF1012.jpg

Things are still in a very rough state for most of it. I need to finish the electrical and insulation and then get the sheetrock guys to come out, then I'll be ready for the floor. I think I've decided on Epoxy for in here.

I officially declare it a 'Compound'. :eek:

I officially declare it a 'Compound'. :eek:

gotta keep the zombies, tweekers, and zombie-tweekers out somehow... the moat, pungi-stakes, and concertina are on-order... :mr-t:

gotta keep the zombies, tweekers, and zombie-tweekers out somehow... the moat, pungi-stakes, and concertina are on-order... :mr-t:

When you say Atlanta, I'm assuming way north of the loop?

When you say Atlanta, I'm assuming way north of the loop?

Oh hell yes. I couldn't live ITP...
We're up between Lawrenceville and Dacula, not far from the Mall of Ga.

My wife says this shower is one of them.

Ok, now that is just teasing... :p

Ok, now that is just teasing... :p

Abso-frikken-lutrely...
8 body jets means no cold spots outta the water when you're ummm errrrr well YOU KNOW.... :flipoff2:

Gonna take 8 jets to wash the spooge outta my shorts over your setup there man!!! haha

OK, I'm getting ready to put down my epoxy floor this weekend. Prepped last weekend, and wanted to share some thoughts.

Specs:
My garage is a 2 car attached to my house (not my shop). It is 424 square feet plus about a 3-4" concrete lip around the base of the walls.

Material
I bought 2 full grey kits of EPOXY-COAT locally from Lowes about $160each. This is 100% solids epoxy. The good shit, not that rustoleum crap. Depending on how the concrete soaks up the epoxy, I want the option to roll out a thicker coat if I so desire. I also have a small shop bathroom I will be doing as a later project, so I wanted some extra material on hand just in case.

Prep:
Last weekend, I emptied out the garage.
1) Blew out the whole thing with a leaf blower.

2) Sprayed the floor down with purple-power degreaser from a garden sprayer. I love this stuff. It works wonders.

3) Rinse/squeegee/dry.

4) Hit grease spots (armor-all) with acetone and lightly grind surface with wire-cup brush on a drill.

5) Pressure wash with concrete cleaning solution. Paid special attention to any spots with pressure washer using rotating nozel, this created a more "porous" area around the spots.

6) Rinse/dry.

7) Apply Muratic acid from kit with garden sprayer, mixed per instructions. One bottle per 1 gallon of water. When it went on, there was some slight "smoking" for a second or two, but not a lot of foaming on the concrete itself. NOTE: when mixing the acid MAKE SURE you put the water into the tank FIRST, and be careful with pouring from the bottle, it will tend to spill down the side and/or splash. WEAR SAFETY GOGGLES AND GLOVES. Brush acid solution in with a stiff-bristle broom.

8) Wet floor after letting sit 10 minutes or so, then apply baking soda to neutralize acid. NOTE: Sam's club has a very large container of baking soda that works well for this type of thing for about $5-6.

9) Scrub baking soda around with slurry of water using a stiff bristle broom.

10) Rinse/clean out baking soda/squeegee/dry.

Thoughts on kit materials and tools

There have been many other discussions about what comes in the kits. My take, based on their advice:

1) The squeegees are a joke (they are from Ikea). They would be great for a shower door, but ineffective to work on a floor. No facility to put a handle on them. Get a real squeegee, in fact, get a couple, they are cheap. http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100169091/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

2) Rollers. Based on what others have said get one roller cover for each section you plan on doing. Nothing fancy, just a cheapie 3/8" knap roller cover.

3) Brushes Same story as the rollers. You can get the cheapie chip-brushes at depot for $1 or less each, for the 3".

4) Buckets get one set of measuring buckets for EACH section I plan on doing for accurate measurement, you can get them cheaply at $1-2 each for just the measuring containers for quart and 2.5 quart sizes.

5) Spatulas Sams club has large disposable spatulas (2 for $8), to ensure you get all the material out of each bucket and onto the floor to minimize waste.

6) Spike shoes -- found a place locally that sells them for $15. You can also buy from them if you're not an Atlanta local, they have a web site and an ebay store as well http://troweltrades.net/

Stuff already laying around

1) Painters tape.
2) drop cloths and cover for area outside of garage so as not to get paint on concrete.
3) box-fan for window to keep airflow up.
4) 9" roller and extendable poll.
5) food scale for dividing chips into equal lots.
6) grinders and wire cup brushes for problem spots.
7) pressure washer.

OK, we finished up today... It's done.

Here's the floor after all the prep was complete:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1064.jpg

Here's the prep area we setup outside the garage to handle the mixing, tools and rest breaks:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1068.jpg

Prep table and tools:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1072.jpg


Here are several shots of the finished product. As many others have noted, No in-between pics cause we were cooking and while we were staying ahead of the epoxy, there wasn't much luxury time.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1085.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1084.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1083.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1078.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1076.jpg

Lessons Learned

Environment:
When we started, it was approximately 75 degrees in the shade, and progressed up to a high of about 88*, with high humidity. Most of the garage was in shade, but portions in the sun/warmer needed to be worked faster. We made it a point to keep the components out of the direct sunlight so they did not get "pre-heated".

Labor:
We did this with two people. My wife did one helluva job today helping me. Ideally you would want 3-4. One person just to mix. One person just to cut-in. And one person just to back-roll. Flaking was pretty easy, and could be shared among 3. For larger floors, you'd probably want at least 4 so you don't have to scramble as much. On a 424 square foot 2-car garage, we were busy, but not overly so.

Epoxy:
Read the directions, watched the video, and have read ad nauseum here on the forum. I really thought it was going to be harder. This was pretty simple if you are prepared.

Coverage: This project was 424 square feet plus a 4" concrete stem-wall all the way around that had to be cut-in. I feel like one full kit covered it very well. There are a couple of thin-spots, but those are my fault during the application, not the lack of material.

Opted NOT to get the clear-coat and am glad I didn't. This stuff has a good finish on it, and I'm not sure the extra work and the expense would have been worth it.

Also opted NOT to use the extra grit for traction, and just flaked it. I think I will like this better in the long run. Easier to clean, and better finish.

Flakes: We used all the flakes from one kit and about 1/4 of the flakes from the backup kit we had on-hand. I think it's a good amount, but it could have been a little heavier for my taste. Advice for future customers, buy an extra pound or so of flake, I think you'll like it better.

Mixing: I had a very hard time getting all the color/solids up off the bottom of the PART A bucket. The included mixer worked fine once I got the junk off the bottom, but that was particularly hard. When I finished there was still some stuck to the bottom of the bucket. I got good color, but think it could have been just a tad darker. My advice is to have a heavy stick/scraper tool handy to get all the gunk from the bottom of the bucket. You might also try taking the PART A back to Lowes or a paint store and have them shake it for you prior to trying to stir it.

Mixing process: The measuring buckets worked GREAT. We broke it into 4 equal parts, thus we mixed 1 quart of the PART B to 2 quarts of PART A. This broke it out to 4 equal batches.

Tools:
Spikes: get them. They work and are handy.

MVP tool: Spatulas. Good for really cleaning out the buckets to the last drop.

Squeegee: I got a larger/heavy duty squeegee. It did the job TOO well. When I pulled epoxy back it SCRAPED the concrete clean. The idea is to leave a little material down to work with. I had better results PUSHING the material or holding the blade up slightly. In this case, the lighter blade included may have been a bit better.

Tape: We used blue painter's tape and it SUCKED. Epoxy got under it and there wasn't a clean line in the place. Figure out something better, it's NOT blue tape.

Roller covers: While we didn't use a separate cover for each section as I thought we might need, we used several as they started getting crusty and curing, indicating a change. Have spares on hand.

Brushes: Same as rollers.

Random Thoughts:

Puddles:There are a couple of places where we set down things like rollers and stuff. I know it's pretty clear in retrospect, but if you have a "puddle that starts to harden/cure, you'll be stuck with it. Have a PLASTIC area where you can lay used tools while you are doing the next step.

Drop cloths: We used a fabric drop cloth. Don't. Cardboard or something covered by plastic.

Poles: Make sure you get a good extension pole so your back-roller can reach everything necessary, or plan to do it from up on spikes (not my bag).

OK, we finished up today... It's done.

Here's the floor after all the prep was complete:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1064.jpg

Here's the prep area we setup outside the garage to handle the mixing, tools and rest breaks:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1068.jpg

Prep table and tools:
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1072.jpg


Here are several shots of the finished product. As many others have noted, No in-between pics cause we were cooking and while we were staying ahead of the epoxy, there wasn't much luxury time.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1085.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1084.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1083.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1078.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj91/bluesman2a/Floors%20and%20prep/DSCF1076.jpg

Lessons Learned

Environment:
When we started, it was approximately 75 degrees in the shade, and progressed up to a high of about 88*, with high humidity. Most of the garage was in shade, but portions in the sun/warmer needed to be worked faster. We made it a point to keep the components out of the direct sunlight so they did not get "pre-heated".

Labor:
We did this with two people. My wife did one helluva job today helping me. Ideally you would want 3-4. One person just to mix. One person just to cut-in. And one person just to back-roll. Flaking was pretty easy, and could be shared among 3. For larger floors, you'd probably want at least 4 so you don't have to scramble as much. On a 424 square foot 2-car garage, we were busy, but not overly so.

Epoxy:
Read the directions, watched the video, and have read ad nauseum here on the forum. I really thought it was going to be harder. This was pretty simple if you are prepared.

Coverage: This project was 424 square feet plus a 4" concrete stem-wall all the way around that had to be cut-in. I feel like one full kit covered it very well. There are a couple of thin-spots, but those are my fault during the application, not the lack of material.

Opted NOT to get the clear-coat and am glad I didn't. This stuff has a good finish on it, and I'm not sure the extra work and the expense would have been worth it.

Also opted NOT to use the extra grit for traction, and just flaked it. I think I will like this better in the long run. Easier to clean, and better finish.

Flakes: We used all the flakes from one kit and about 1/4 of the flakes from the backup kit we had on-hand. I think it's a good amount, but it could have been a little heavier for my taste. Advice for future customers, buy an extra pound or so of flake, I think you'll like it better.

Mixing: I had a very hard time getting all the color/solids up off the bottom of the PART A bucket. The included mixer worked fine once I got the junk off the bottom, but that was particularly hard. When I finished there was still some stuck to the bottom of the bucket. I got good color, but think it could have been just a tad darker. My advice is to have a heavy stick/scraper tool handy to get all the gunk from the bottom of the bucket. You might also try taking the PART A back to Lowes or a paint store and have them shake it for you prior to trying to stir it.

Mixing process: The measuring buckets worked GREAT. We broke it into 4 equal parts, thus we mixed 1 quart of the PART B to 2 quarts of PART A. This broke it out to 4 equal batches.

Tools:
Spikes: get them. They work and are handy.

MVP tool: Spatulas. Good for really cleaning out the buckets to the last drop.

Squeegee: I got a larger/heavy duty squeegee. It did the job TOO well. When I pulled epoxy back it SCRAPED the concrete clean. The idea is to leave a little material down to work with. I had better results PUSHING the material or holding the blade up slightly. In this case, the lighter blade included may have been a bit better.

Tape: We used blue painter's tape and it SUCKED. Epoxy got under it and there wasn't a clean line in the place. Figure out something better, it's NOT blue tape.

Roller covers: While we didn't use a separate cover for each section as I thought we might need, we used several as they started getting crusty and curing, indicating a change. Have spares on hand.

Brushes: Same as rollers.

Random Thoughts:

Puddles:There are a couple of places where we set down things like rollers and stuff. I know it's pretty clear in retrospect, but if you have a "puddle that starts to harden/cure, you'll be stuck with it. Have a PLASTIC area where you can lay used tools while you are doing the next step.

Drop cloths: We used a fabric drop cloth. Don't. Cardboard or something covered by plastic.

Poles: Make sure you get a good extension pole so your back-roller can reach everything necessary, or plan to do it from up on spikes (not my bag).

updates