How do I determine when buying welding bottles whether they are stolen or not?
I know it's supposed to say something on the collar but what?

I don't know...but I'm pretty sure that they won't say "STOLEN" :flipoff2:

they have a number..I guess if they have a suplier name to you could call and see if they show that number cylinder as being stolen

Look on the collar to see what it says. If the collar is plain and without any marking, then it is customer owned. If it has a welding company on it, see what it says and call around to see if you can get it filled. Some of the older cylinders with company names on it are okay if they've been bought out and are considered customer owned.

Mine says Western Welding Supply but I called around and none of the shops have heard of these guys.

I just take mine in and they give me a new bottle lol .

Guess what, we have covered this before. However, I will repeat some of it for you. Most bottles are not filled at the shop you take them too, they are exchanged. It takes a large chemical processing facility to make, store, and fill all the different types of gases your welding supply sells.

What this means to you. You can buy a brand new bottle with absolutely no stamp, take it into the welding supply to be "filled" and leave with a stamped bottle because they swapped it out. The stamp means almost nothing. Welding gas suppliers who lease bottles keep paper as well as electronic records of the lease term and holder. If the lease holder sells the bottle to you, he is still responsible for the lease, if it goes over term, and he does not return it, he is responsible, unless he signed the lease over to you. I have not yet run into a supplier that keeps track of serial numbers on tank exchange. I am not saying it is honest, or right, but after you buy the bottle, there is a 99.9% chance that the bottle cannot be tracked to an original owner, or lease holder. If someone is dumb enough to sell something that they have leased, they are going to have to pony up in the end.

Anyhow, I have gotten bottles that are stamped with gas companies that further than 500 miles away. I live near two major chemical plants though and 100's of bottles go through there a day, so it is likely my supplier sees more traffic then some. It also helps to have a good relationship with your local guys. I set a bottle on the dock when I need exchanged and when I come back out there is a fresh one there, no numbers, stamps or any other BS, just the gas.

Later,
Jason

Leasing and purchasing are two different things.

Around here (industrial haven) the shops will not sell you full size bottles, only lease them.

For the smaller bottles that most of us use, they'll do either. The lease/rental bottles typically have a thicker collar just below where the cap screws on and often have the name of the company stamped there. Owner bottles shouldn't have this.

I have yet to get a stamped/lease-type bottle when trading in my owner bottles. I wouldn't accept it if they tried to give it to me.

Guess what, we have covered this before. However, I will repeat some of it for you. Most bottles are not filled at the shop you take them too, they are exchanged. It takes a large chemical processing facility to make, store, and fill all the different types of gases your welding supply sells.

What this means to you. You can buy a brand new bottle with absolutely no stamp, take it into the welding supply to be "filled" and leave with a stamped bottle because they swapped it out. The stamp means almost nothing. Welding gas suppliers who lease bottles keep paper as well as electronic records of the lease term and holder. If the lease holder sells the bottle to you, he is still responsible for the lease, if it goes over term, and he does not return it, he is responsible, unless he signed the lease over to you. I have not yet run into a supplier that keeps track of serial numbers on tank exchange. I am not saying it is honest, or right, but after you buy the bottle, there is a 99.9% chance that the bottle cannot be tracked to an original owner, or lease holder. If someone is dumb enough to sell something that they have leased, they are going to have to pony up in the end.

Anyhow, I have gotten bottles that are stamped with gas companies that further than 500 miles away. I live near two major chemical plants though and 100's of bottles go through there a day, so it is likely my supplier sees more traffic then some. It also helps to have a good relationship with your local guys. I set a bottle on the dock when I need exchanged and when I come back out there is a fresh one there, no numbers, stamps or any other BS, just the gas.

Later,
Jason


same situation for me in Denver. I own all my bottles in arying sizes. It's a simple exchange and I pay for the gas only when swapping them out. No records of serial numbers ever occur.

I've got bottles from all over, and even traded a C02 I bought from someone here on PBB for a N02, I had to pay like $4 more to fill it since it cost more than a straight swap but that was it. I just take them in, and get new ones I've never leased or 'purchased' a new bottle in my life only used and as long as the same place keeps swapping them I don't see a reason to worry.

I had a set of oxy/acet bottles given to me with some company stamped on the neck. Went into the local praxair by my shop in pittsburg and asked if they could look at them to see if they could be refilled/exchanged. He said bring them in but DO NOT take them out of the truck. If the bottles touch the ground and they are stolen/thier property, they can take them and I couldnt do a damn thing about them. I took them over, brought him outside, he looked at them and said Ive never heard of that company, back up to the dock and we'll exchange them. All I paid for was the gas.

Mine says Western Welding Supply but I called around and none of the shops have heard of these guys.


I represent WWS and will pick up the bottle from you. We have been looking for that one. :flipoff2:

Just make sure the last hydro stamp is less than ten years old. Old bottles require a fresh hydro so figure about another $45 for a hydro test if you find old bottles at a garage sale or something. I've never had an issue trading out any bottle in but the company I work for buys their welding supplies by the truck load so they like us.
John..

I know the serial numbers aren't recorded, but AirGas here in OKC uses bar coded bottles. they scan the sticker at the loading dock and it feeds the computer inside. seems like it's at least a start to knowing where every bottle is.

Just an FYI from my experience.

There are apparently sizes that are "always" customer owned, and they don't worry about them.

However, I was purchasing some bottles, and I have a good relationship with the local welding store. He said to me that he would look at them for me. Sure enough, both bottles were "owned" by a welding store. One was the one up the street. They exchanged it for me with a customer owned. One down.

The other bottle was owned by the store that I went to. It was theirs. He let me take it home and use it and when I am done with it, I will be out of luck I guess....I told him I would bring it back.

He said that their store will not fill bottles from other stores etc.

I've heard all the stories about , "just exchange it, they don't know" etc.

For me, in my profession I took the safe route and it probably will cost me some money.

They did have a book of what markings meant what for the local area. Ideally there is some type of nationwide record of all the cylinders by ID number, but he said that it really does not happen.

From what I understand, there are literally thousands of cylinders out there and the exact ownership is unclear on some of them.

If you really want to be safe, I would just take the seller with you to the store and have them looked over, and if purchased, get a bill of sale.

Oh, and definately make sure that you get a customer owned cylinder back when you exchange them. You don't want to go in there with your own, and then get theirs back and be hassled later.........heard that story from a pal.

Sorry for being long-winded.

ROB

Just make sure the last hydro stamp is less than ten years old. Old bottles require a fresh hydro so figure about another $45 for a hydro test if you find old bottles at a garage sale or something.
John..



Not an issue with an exchange. Ever


Edit; Yotajeep, you need to find another supplier. Don't let them screw you out of a bottle. Go look in their rack and you will see many different names on the bottles.
I've bought all my bottles new (6) and they are just exchanged for a full when empty.
To prove how full of crap your guy is, I brought all my bottles out here from N.Calif and have swapped them all out since I've been here and never had an issue. FWIW

I think he is a bit "extra-careful" if you know what I mean.

It is hard to argue though, when the markings on the cylinder in my truck are the same ones for his company. There was no question that he owns the cylinder.

I do agree though. I may just go up the street. It definately was not something worth making waves over considering all parties know each other.

My buddy says that I asked for it by asking. He said to just back up to the dock and get a new one without asking anything.

What is done is done. My dad has a cylinder or two he will give me so it will work out.

ROB

I just called a welding gas company, and they said that I should bring the bottle over and the manager will decide if it's good or not. I guess I'll be doing that next week.