I got bumped up two classes in my local comps. First because I will be a "professional driver" when I compete in a werock event. Second because my rig does not have 55% of the body panels.
So my questions are:
1) Will the Ftoy compete with V8 rigs, coil over suspension, 39-44" tires, basically super trick trail rigs.
2) Is the Ftoy that much more capable than a Toyota truck with the same set up and a body with no bed?
I dont know. I have only driven the truck about 3-4 hours.

trail capable and competition capable are 2 different things. if its a conventional rock crawling competition, the ftoy with 37's with kill the stereotypical full width one ton 44" swamper v8 jeeps out there.

on the trail, they will be more even...one will do better one obstacle and the other will do better on the other.

This is a rock competition. But, keep in mind it is east coast wheeling. We have a combo of dirt and rock everywhere. There are cones. If they are spaced for fullsize rigs, I should be able to ease through very easily.

off topic, but what comps are these? location?

Gulches ORV park in Laurens S.C. maybe?

1) Will the Ftoy compete with V8 rigs, coil over suspension, 39-44" tires, basically super trick trail rigs.



2) Is the Ftoy that much more capable than a Toyota truck with the same set up and a body with no bed?
I dont know. I have only driven the truck about 3-4 hours.


1)Yes it will. If the driver is willing and capable. F toys are built to be tuff, beat the shit out of it, but get it thru the cones:D "super trick trail rig" guys wont plan a 3/4 roll to get across the finish like Hobie does.
Either way, being the underdog allways fun. Cal rocks is the same way. I had alot of fun going up against the more equiped rigs. We placed 5th, but had a good shot ( I believe) at 2nd. Just made a few errors. We made a climb that killed most the pro mod rigs:D




2)Yes!! lighter way more visibility, less maint and worries. When built right, after rolls, driving on your roof, or sliding down backdoor upsidedown you just flip it over and keep on going!

off topic, but what comps are these? location?

Yes Gulches ORV.

1)Yes it will. If the driver is willing and capable. F toys are built to be tuff, beat the shit out of it, but get it thru the cones:D "super trick trail rig" guys wont plan a 3/4 roll to get across the finish like Hobie does.
Either way, being the underdog allways fun. Cal rocks is the same way. I had alot of fun going up against the more equiped rigs. We placed 5th, but had a good shot ( I believe) at 2nd. Just made a few errors. We made a climb that killed most the pro mod rigs:D




2)Yes!! lighter way more visibility, less maint and worries. When built right, after rolls, driving on your roof, or sliding down backdoor upsidedown you just flip it over and keep on going!

Excellent answer. Hopefully there will be a few capable rigs in the D Class. D Class is basically 38" tires and up.
I dont mind being the underdog. I just want competition. I dont want to get the crap beat out of me and I dont want to run away with an easy win either.

i am trying to be more user friendly, so I wont say anything to this post, other than , just do it and learn .

i am trying to be more user friendly, so I wont say anything to this post, other than , just do it and learn .

Come on, spill the beans. Constructive criticism is always good, and we're big kids here!!!

In a similar local comp up here, I ended up 3rd out of 18 rigs in our class, and I was the only one running leafs front and back. I was running Sx's, and we were technically driving better than the others, actually running the courses making it through with no cone hits. If we had sacrificed a cone and saved ourselves 30 seconds so we didn't DNF we would of won.

On the trails I can keep up with any of your typcal trail rigs and in alot of cases out perform them due to the ftoy being light and very stable.

The Ftoy is as capable as almost any other rig out there, although you may be at a disadvantage if they have front digs and you do not. The key to the Ftoy is a productive TEAM of driver and spotter. If you have an experienced spotter then you should do very well.

Any other good stories or video about "my Ftoy did this but the linked v8 with 60's couldn't"? Makes me happy when I think about mine being done :)

No pics, but we got one waterfall up here that, out of the a few dozen trucks, and numerous try's, I have made it up twice on nonsticky tires, and the only other rig that has made it was a single seater front and rear stear with 39"redlabels. I have been there twice to climb and both times i got up up after a couple attempts but then went back the same day to try again and got denied.

I know now with my sticky's it'll be easier.

Any other good stories or video about "my Ftoy did this but the linked v8 with 60's couldn't"? Makes me happy when I think about mine being done :)

I had alot of fun on walkin up backdoor with the sx's.

One busy weekend in particular on backdoor, I watched a guy linked up coilovers, v8 and 42"s try for like 15 min+ he was getting denied, was pissed and seemed annoyed that I was there waiting for him to get out of the way, like, what was I gonna do on it in my leaf sprung 4cyl?.

Finally he backed off it and was talking shit that I would never make it up.........

I think I bumped right up it faster than I ever had before!
It was awsome!!!!!

fuck that guy!!! hahahahah

Hobies got a ton of these storys,

Just ask Tim Florian:flipoff2:

I had alot of fun on walkin up backdoor with the sx's.

One busy weekend in particular on backdoor, I watched a guy linked up coilovers, v8 and 42"s try for like 15 min+ he was getting denied, was pissed and seemed annoyed that I was there waiting for him to get out of the way, like, what was I gonna do on it in my leaf sprung 4cyl?.

Finally he backed off it and was talking shit that I would never make it up.........

I think I bumped right up it faster than I ever had before!
It was awsome!!!!!

fuck that guy!!! hahahahah


I have walked right up the first fall too, Second fall took some work though :homer:

With the Marlin ftoy we placed 4th overall in a fully unlimited class at the Hammers Race last year. In the right hands, it can do well.

This seems to be a fun topic. I love the stories.
werock will be priority one. Second will be running as many of the local comps as possible. I will let you know how we do.
My spotter is amazing. We took third last season in a piece of srud Samurai. We missed second by one point and first by 4-5. Both of these rigs had front digs and 37 vs my 35" tires. We were thrilled. I owe it all to my spotter. He has a sixth sense as to how a vehicle is going to react to an obstacle.

ask east john , last time i went wheelin, i was in ark, and i went up a waterfall like backdoor and the other V8 linked buggys wouldn even try it.:laughing:


i cant tell you how many times, i have gotten over and around stuff because of the breakover angle on my ftoy. i have left so many linked buggies behind because they sit lower than my ftoy. that is so much because it really pisses them off.


that said, i still want links and v8:laughing:

Hobies got a ton of these storys,

Just ask Tim Florian:flipoff2:

Eat shit!!!!!:flipoff2:

fuck that guy!!! hahahahah

That part makes me giggle:D

I believe that 4-5 F-Toys showed up at PUSU last year - we didn't finish last either. Finished 2 courses and didn't break too bad. Not bad for a run what you brung comp against some of the best rigs around! :smokin:

FIRST COMPETITION IN F TOY 507
I thought I would pull up this old thread as I competed yesterday in my local comp. My competition was stiff. 3 jeeps on 42s with atlas/300, full link suspension, v8, / 3 truggys based off toyota with 42s or better, one with dana 60s, all with crawler gears and lockers.
We took first place. We beat second place by 20 points. (scoring is different than werock, highest points out of 150 points per run wins) The only addition I had to add was a rear disconnect. We must have front dig to be competitive in this series. (no it will not be used in f toy series)
With this win I am sorry to say we may not make KY in April. The event is a four part series with $1500-2000 cash grand prize, plus gift certificates for first place. The next comp is the same weekend as the April Fools day run in KY. Cash payout depends on number of competitors. I will verify cash payout for my class next week. If we can win cash. No KY. If we cannot win cash. We will be in KY.

YES THE FORMULA TOYOTA IS VERY VERY CAPABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Congrats on the 1st place finish :beer:

Doing more with less ;)

Congrats on the win! Awesome! :beer:

Thanks.
We are very pleased with the results and the car.

Cool! congrats! :smokin:

wow!!! way to represent!!! good job!

I have been toying with the idea of a v8, one ton f-toy.

Would I be wrong in thinking it would be the best of both worlds.

I have been toying with the idea of a v8, one ton f-toy.

Would I be wrong in thinking it would be the best of both worlds.


not sure what you mean? toy axles are strong enough, so having 1 tons doesnt help anything unless you want to run 42's...but 42's wont fit on an ftoy anyways.

the v8 cool, but doesnt help in competition.

i would think the other world, would be linked suspension and full hydro steering and atlas (but you can put a disconnect in for the same effect).

making an ftoy comp legal makes the ftoy worth more money.

if you want a v8 buggy, i would build an X chassis and skip the whole ftoy thing so you dont have to do leafs.

not sure what you mean? toy axles are strong enough, so having 1 tons doesnt help anything unless you want to run 42's...but 42's wont fit on an ftoy anyways.

the v8 cool, but doesnt help in competition.

i would think the other world, would be linked suspension and full hydro steering and atlas (but you can put a disconnect in for the same effect).

making an ftoy comp legal makes the ftoy worth more money.

if you want a v8 buggy, i would build an X chassis and skip the whole ftoy thing so you dont have to do leafs.


X2

If it wasn't for being comp legal so I can compete in a easier to afford class, I'd have ditched the leafs and stock frame along time ago.

That being said it wouldn't be because the ftoy can't keep up on the trails with the linked buggy's. It's just because I'd want more.

Nice job :smokin:

Link suspension, atlas, (disconnect may be weak in the long term) strong/built 20r. No need for a V8. Lightweight and enough horsepower will serve you well.


Thanks for the input on the win.

Congrats man. Any video or pictures?

How about linked with a Toy 2.28/flipped D300 case setup to get true twinsticking and avoid the disco?

Atlas seems heavy for the torque a Toy 22R puts out.

....not to take away from your win, ftoy507.....you beat the v8's! :D

Good job in the F-toy....

if I can add my .02 worth of dribble:D

I still believe that the driver has more to do with how one does in a comp, than the rig itself, at least overall. Now a certain rig might give one an advantage here or there, but overall, it come dow to driver and spotter.....

Hell, I've even seen a Rhino RTV do pretty good once in awhile :laughing::laughing::flipoff2:

Big

*smack*

Reality check to the FToy forum! :laughing:

Big, not even links vs. leafs?

*smack*

Reality check to the FToy forum! :laughing:

Big, not even links vs. leafs?


I've seen Cody in his old cj-5, hang for one day of comp with Tiny and with Tracy jordan and whoop on the rest of the field, it depends on the courses, and the teams on those courses.....

I had to throw the other thing in there just to get a rise of of the f-toy guys :laughing::laughing::D

Hell, I've even seen a Rhino RTV do pretty good once in awhile :laughing::laughing::flipoff2:

Big


Exactly when was that?:laughing:

Exactly when was that?:laughing:



Follow the leader at TDS in 07 :laughing::flipoff2: of course, those were not courses, hell you'll never see me drive courses, that only for the crazies :eek:

After Dave and I argued :laughing::laughing::D

And there is a couple of comps, I'll have to look up them scores, but like I said it comes down to the driver and spotter and what the course is

I would have to agree that there are areas where a Ftoy does exceptionally well and others where it doesn't. Personally I like them for simplicity and bang for the buck. If I had $50k to spend I'd build a whoopass v6 Pro-Mod but for under $15k I'll take my Ftoy any day and do 90% of what most Pro-Mods will do.:D:flipoff2::D

Big, thanks for stopping by to smack us around.:D See ya'll in Hannibal.

I would have to agree that there are areas where a Ftoy does exceptionally well and others where it doesn't. Personally I like them for simplicity and bang for the buck. If I had $50k to spend I'd build a whoopass v6 Pro-Mod but for under $15k I'll take my Ftoy any day and do 90% of what most Pro-Mods will do.:D:flipoff2::D

Big, thanks for stopping by to smack us around.:D See ya'll in Hannibal.


Not really smack'n :D just having some fun.....

I like the f-toys, especially the 4 seaters, maybe someday :smokin:

Not really smack'n :D just having some fun.....

I like the f-toys, especially the 4 seaters, maybe someday :smokin:


that was fun rich. you in the rino vs 5 or more ftoys...it was pretty funny bombing all around ocotillo wells.

good times!

Not really smack'n :D just having some fun.....

I like the f-toys, especially the 4 seaters, maybe someday :smokin:

Say the word and I'll start building you one tommorrow.

Say the word and I'll start building you one tommorrow.


Well, all my $$$'s go into putting on the events, that's what I don't have a rig yet :(

but I'll remember that someday

Big

Big, I think there's still one for sale for $8k, ready to go! Needs new tires, and could use Longs.

Big, I think there's still one for sale for $8k, ready to go! Needs new tires, and could use Longs.


Still out of my price range :(

Here is a link to a you tube video. This part of the course was different than in the past. We usually have 5 mins to clear 4-5 technical gates. In this one we had 1.5 minutes and 5 gates I could drive the motorhome through. (Similar to rock racing) The course started about 200 feet back. That is third gear in 4.7 reduction until I hit the tree. I made it in 32 seconds. I wish there was stopwatch in the rig. I would have launched to the rocks then crawled the rest.

Hope the link workshttp://s60.photobucket.com/albums/h8/blackpanter6250/?action=view&current=Wes.flv

I think the driver is important. But, I feel the spotter and his understanding of the rig and driver are more important.

Big, the 042 can can be bought, everything is for sale,..the price wont be in the 4 digit range but we can talk.

,..the price wont be in the 4 digit range but we can talk.

I got $998 for you right now, and I'll even come pick it up:D

Big, the 042 can can be bought, everything is for sale,..the price wont be in the 4 digit range but we can talk.


Great, but I could never commit to something that is not already in hand, if you know what I mean....

W.E.ROCK and Rock Crawling come first:D

Big you should fit in the Front Range ftoy, Dave does, comfortably!

Anytime its not on course, you're welcome to drive!

Here is a link to a you tube video. This part of the course was different than in the past. We usually have 5 mins to clear 4-5 technical gates. In this one we had 1.5 minutes and 5 gates I could drive the motorhome through. (Similar to rock racing) The course started about 200 feet back. That is third gear in 4.7 reduction until I hit the tree. I made it in 32 seconds. I wish there was stopwatch in the rig. I would have launched to the rocks then crawled the rest.

Hope the link workshttp://s60.photobucket.com/albums/h8/blackpanter6250/?action=view&current=Wes.flv

I think the driver is important. But, I feel the spotter and his understanding of the rig and driver are more important.

I am going to look at a few video cameras today. Maybe I can post some better footage after the next event.

The recorder is probably more important. Most DV (tape)-based or mini-DVD-based recorders are not all that shock resistant.

There are some pretty good helmet cam systems on eBay for ~$150 with card-based recorders and bullet cams with multiple lenses so you can select your field of view.

I got $998 for you right now, and I'll even come pick it up:D
Let me check with the co-owner... but that wouldnt cover the nitrogen in the tires, but thanks for the offer.

Great, but I could never commit to something that is not already in hand, if you know what I mean....

W.E.ROCK and Rock Crawling come first:D

I hear ya.

Follow the leader at TDS in 07 :laughing::flipoff2: Yeah, weren't you following me :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :D :D

That's Awesome man! Conrats as well. I have been debating whether or not to build an F-Toy lately, and this just makes me want to more. As much as i have beat my truck over the years, and it has stayed together (somewhat) i imagine these things are even more bulletproof, and the fact that people don't expect much alot of times makes it that much better when you do great, of course that's not just an F-Toy characteristic, but a Toyota characteristic in general.

Good luck at the next comp.

That's Awesome man! Conrats as well. I have been debating whether or not to build an F-Toy lately, and this just makes me want to more. As much as i have beat my truck over the years, and it has stayed together (somewhat) i imagine these things are even more bulletproof, and the fact that people don't expect much alot of times makes it that much better when you do great, of course that's not just an F-Toy characteristic, but a Toyota characteristic in general.

Good luck at the next comp.

Just do it

Big you should fit in the Front Range ftoy, Dave does, comfortably!

Anytime its not on course, you're welcome to drive!


Thanks Brian, but you should see me drive first :laughing::laughing:

Big

Yeah, weren't you following me :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :D :D

As a matter of fact I was following you in the notches early in the day, then the whole group into the night, from what I remember :eek::laughing::laughing:

Tom Clarks little bro was riding with me and it he won't forget the trip for a long time :smokin:

Big

Found this and I figured I would give some input as a guy being beat by the F-toy. :flipoff2:

On the trail there didnt seem to be a real clear advantage to 507 or my Jeep, however once you throw gates into the matter and such the f-toy is killing us. As for the f-toy itself its not as wide, so I think that helps. Wes is doing a killer job at working with his spotter and driving, even though the last comp was a waste of time he came very close to beating us in conditions that should have heavily favored the big HP and big tires. The f-toy was the only other one to finish a course after it was slicked up. Ive been impressed in comp conditions about how its going, but its hard to say how driving/spotting and such it playing into all this.
________
Sunny (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/Sunny)

I cannot believe a JEEP guy admits that a Toyota is awesome.:flipoff2:



Thanks for the praise. I am actually smiling ear to ear. I have been thrilled with the rig and this post makes me feel that much better.

On a side note I really didnt finish that other course. My front tires cleared the gate. I timed out before I could get the rear tires through, and there is no doubt that the timing and scoring system is absolutely perfect in these comps.:D:mad3::evil::shaking: Its not like I was hung up. I was on full throttle traveling at 15 mph or so.
Ever heard of tie goes to the runner??????????????????????????????

It is probably better we did not make that run. We would have earned a 60-80 point lead. That would have reduced the fun. I love to win but, I really like the close competition. When there are 2-3 points seperating each car and every move is crucial.

I cannot believe a JEEP guy admits that a Toyota is awesome.:flipoff2:



Thanks for the praise. I am actually smiling ear to ear. I have been thrilled with the rig and this post makes me feel that much better.

On a side note I really didnt finish that other course. My front tires cleared the gate. I timed out before I could get the rear tires through, and there is no doubt that the timing and scoring system is absolutely perfect in these comps.:D:mad3::evil::shaking: Its not like I was hung up. I was on full throttle traveling at 15 mph or so.
Ever heard of tie goes to the runner??????????????????????????????

It is probably better we did not make that run. We would have earned a 60-80 point lead. That would have reduced the fun. I love to win but, I really like the close competition. When there are 2-3 points seperating each car and every move is crucial.

In WE-Rock front tires stops the clock.

I cannot believe a JEEP guy admits that a Toyota is awesome.:flipoff2:



Thanks for the praise. I am actually smiling ear to ear. I have been thrilled with the rig and this post makes me feel that much better.

On a side note I really didnt finish that other course. My front tires cleared the gate. I timed out before I could get the rear tires through, and there is no doubt that the timing and scoring system is absolutely perfect in these comps.:D:mad3::evil::shaking: Its not like I was hung up. I was on full throttle traveling at 15 mph or so.
Ever heard of tie goes to the runner??????????????????????????????

It is probably better we did not make that run. We would have earned a 60-80 point lead. That would have reduced the fun. I love to win but, I really like the close competition. When there are 2-3 points seperating each car and every move is crucial.

Well I am pretty sure that you and me are the only ones who made it out that gate within a reasonable time. I had a huge advantage of being the first over the course though. Be careful though because a lot on this jeep is changing before the next comp, figure if I cant drive it better I can at least try to make the rig a little better. :flipoff2:
________
Children paxil (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/paxil/)

I saw your posts on Gulches. Good luck. I think you are heading in the right direction. Cant drive????????? Are you crazy? You are an excellent driver. You did great with a spotter who knows very little if anything about wheeling.
If only you could drive as well as you fabricate. Your fab skills are amazing!

I cannot believe a JEEP guy admits that a Toyota is awesome.:flipoff2:

Ok how about a comment from thee Jeep guy.First time here, I always thought this forum might be in Japanese:flipoff2:

I just checked out the WERock Perris coverage and scores and John James and Mark Carter did a killer job getting their Ftoys out in front of the stock mod winners. Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention but from what I remember "those things" were never beating the Stock mods before on the same courses.

And before anyone else says it, yes at least two of them kicked my ass at KOH too.

:d

Ok how about a comment from thee Jeep guy.First time here, I always thought this forum might be in Japanese:flipoff2:

I just checked out the WERock Perris coverage and scores and John James and Mark Carter did a killer job getting their Ftoys out in front of the stock mod winners. Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention but from what I remember "those things" were never beating the Stock mods before on the same courses.

And before anyone else says it, yes at least two of them kicked my ass at KOH too.

This is so cool that I did a little break down on some scoring.

I was judging course C2. Day 1 gate 3 was about a 4-5 foot drop off with a nasty rock jutting up on the right side. Only 3 out of 9 Stock Mods finished the course (many rolled off the drop) while 8 out of 10 F-Toys finished.

Day 2 the course was reversed and you had to climb the same obstacle. There was an undercut on the left and the ground at the bottom was powdery silt that offered no traction. Only 2 out of 9 Stock Mods made it up the obstacle. 6 out of 10 F-Toys made it up (but Bernie ran out of gas and didn't finish the course :( )

If you were to combine the two classes the finishing order would have been...

1) F-Toy 028 Team Marlin Crawler
2) F-Toy 50
3) Mod Stock 17 Tim Florian (former Pro Modified driver)
4) F-Toy 20
5) F-Toy 35
6) Mod Stock 963
7) Mod Stock 15
8) F-Toy 42 (tie)
8) F-Toy 22 (tie)
10) F-Toy 30

I hope I can perform as well as these teams have.

Ok how about a comment from thee Jeep guy.First time here, I always thought this forum might be in Japanese:flipoff2:

I just checked out the WERock Perris coverage and scores and John James and Mark Carter did a killer job getting their Ftoys out in front of the stock mod winners. Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention but from what I remember "those things" were never beating the Stock mods before on the same courses.

And before anyone else says it, yes at least two of them kicked my ass at KOH too.

This is kinda cool, and I hope you'll come back to our little Jap hideout to continue the conversation jeff.

When "these things" first hit the comp circut there was a huge learning curve going on. We found out early on that we needed to really think out crazy options on the courses because we didn't have the tools that you guys have availible to us. Those big tools being front dig and cutting brakes. Stratigity became extremely important to us.

On some courses like this weekend our longer wheelbase helped us, but at other comps it was a serious handicap (especially when you consider that front dig deal).


I strongly believe that the Stock Mod class relies too much on thier tools, and that is hurting thier scores. They need to start looking at these courses smarter, and I'll give you a perfect example.....

Goldendale last year had a course with a bonus gate through a big straight crack that you had to make a SHARP left turn to get. We watched like 5 Stock Mod rigs go into that thing and do the exact same thing as the previous did with the same results, that result was total failure. Our class is all standing there watching and we couldn't believe that after the first one failed , the rest of them tried the same thing. WTF were they thinking? The only real difference in thier rigs was the color, so why did they think they could make the same line when the rest failed?:shaking:

Same course, F-Toy teams all walked it together (we're a pretty tight group) and saw that there was this HUGE parking lot outseide the bonus line that we could use to turn around in with one back and clean the bonus laughing all the way, we were absoutly stupified that the Stock Mod guys never even considered it.

Afterwards I talked to Lil Rich about the scores between the two classes and he straight up said that the Stock Mod guys are so addicted to that front dig that it actuially hurts them cause they get lazy and dont THINK the courses through.


I firmly believe you can take a F-Toy team that has a couple years under thier belts, put them in a Stock Mod rig and the F-Toy guys will fully clean that classes clocks.

Ok how about a comment from thee Jeep guy.First time here, I always thought this forum might be in Japanese:flipoff2:

Aaah, soo, Jeff-san, wewcome to owr folum!





:flipoff2:

Hmm...interesting.
I hear you about watching the Buffalo jump off a cliff, happens in all types of racing, :shaking:crazy.

When I was still running SM I couldn't figure the desire for FToy. Why would so many guys want a trailer only, 4 cly? I understand Toyota has a great brand loyalty and some just won't get a Jeep but there were other options. I had heard that they cost more than my Jeep and they didn't do the job as well?

Admittedly Ftoys were still in their infancy last time I paid attention to the scores. So do you guys typically beat the best scores in th SM class these days?

I wonder if courses have changed I remember some weekends it just seemed like they were making the "C" courses tight twisty cone squeezing obstacles and the cool wheeling was missing. That would have definatley favored shorter digger mobiles.

You guys have to run Toy cases right so no twin stick and I assume cutting brakes are illegal from your words but can you still do things like unlock hubs and pull your E-brake? r How about line locks and proportioning valves?. Surely you can unlock lockers and place "pivot rocks" under the tire right?
What's a race prepped FToy weigh?
What is the cost range of one from say 1st place last weekend to a built on the cheap barely ready to race one?
What else have I missed?


Thanks for the info in advance.

I wonder if courses have changed I remember some weekends it just seemed like they were making the "C" courses tight twisty cone squeezing obstacles and the cool wheeling was missing. That would have definatley favored shorter digger mobiles.


That pretty much summed up Vegas for me last year. I didn't like the Vegas courses at all. Not at all the case in Donner. I really enjoyed the courses there.

I wasn't at Perris, but from what I'm hearing it sounds like they have stepped up the courses.

Hi Jeff,

I'm just building mine. FToys have come a long, long, long way in the past 4-5 years. I've read through most of the buildup threads, and there's a big difference in common practices between the first ones and the ones being built (or recently modified) today.


You guys have to run Toy cases right so no twin stick and I assume cutting brakes are illegal from your words but can you still do things like unlock hubs and pull your E-brake?

Correct, and yes, as far as I've read.

r How about line locks and proportioning valves?

Both OK if they lock both tires on the rear axle

Surely you can unlock lockers and place "pivot rocks" under the tire right?

Yes

What's a race prepped FToy weigh?

Brian Ellinger's FToy 44 is one of the lightest at ~2,800 lbs.

What is the cost range of one from say 1st place last weekend to a built on the cheap barely ready to race one?

That Marlin one would probably cost $30k to have someone build.

I'm building mine to comp specs, but I won't run all the comps....fits the "built on the cheap, barely ready to race". I've bartered for a lot of my parts, and my goal is to do it for under $8k. I've got frame, chassis, axles, lockers, gears, tires, tranny, t-case, gears, doubler, motor, steering, brakes, etc. accounted for, and I'm at $4,500.

W're 2740, and planning to add a little here, loose more though. I would say, with careful thought and planning 2900 or less is easily attained, though I would bet few running currently are under 3k. some of the numbers Ive seen are either guesses, or someone's very uncalibrated scale. Ours was on a CAT cert. scale. However, these scales are designed to weigh at the 80k mark, so who knows how accurate they are at under 5% of that!

As for cost, parts 10-15 to build a nice one. 8k or less to build a welded diffs, stock gears, 4.10's, no hydro, etc, but get you on trail. Double those figures for labor if someone is building it. (15k parts, 15k labor)

Hi Jeff,

I'm just building mine. FToys have come a long, long, long way in the past 4-5 years. I've read through most of the buildup threads, and there's a big difference in common practices between the first ones and the ones being built (or recently modified) today.

As for cost, parts 10-15 to build a nice one. 8k or less to build a welded diffs, stock gears, 4.10's, no hydro, etc, but get you on trail. Double those figures for labor if someone is building it. (15k parts, 15k labor)

I've busted my ass to barter for parts for my rig, so it will have e-lockers F&R, 5.29's, 4.7's, duals, and Surplus Center hydro. I'll be really close to $8k with a very nice parts list.

It all comes down to time and money. I've spent a lot of time, and haven't spent a lot of money, but the rig is only 30% complete.

Here's my budget update:
Budget update:

Budget: $8,000
Chassis: $1,199
Shipping: $490
Frame(s): Free from sponsor
22RE: Free--traded for Toy parts from friend
Getting it rebuilt...will have ~$400 in parts, labor free
W56: Free--junkyard clearance
Donor cases: Free--junkyard clearance
84 front: $100
90 rear: Free from sponsor
Used 5.29 e-locker built by Zuk: $550
2nd e-locker $225
5.29 Gears/install kit: $230 (Davez)
Install: barter--trade for 90 R151
Long hub gears: $130
30-spl longs--used from M1: $550
IFS Box: Free
Tapped: Barter--trade for 4Runner doors
Surplus Center assist: $115
Davez arms: $129
Blackbirds TRE inserts: $26
1.5" DOM TRE: $60
3/4T Chev rod ends: $80
FJ40 Discs: $60
IFS Calipers: Free from sponsor 1990
Steering wheel: Free--was on 1990 xtracab
Steering wheel QD: $30
Square drivelines: Free--using xtracab shafts for donor joints
36" Iroks: $700
4.7 TG case gear: bartered for Toy parts
TG rock ring knuckle felt protectors: bartered for Toy parts
Brake lines, traction bar ends, ubolts, gusset kits, twinstick: bartered for Toy parts

Total in so far: $5,074

Remaining:
Marlin MC07-R10: $400
Homemade beadlocks: $150
Misc. wiring: $200
Misc. Hardware: $500
Plus a buncha other shiat I haven't thought of yet.

I agree with Brian. I tell everyone that asks, you can build one yourself on the cheap for around $10,000. If you want to go big, with everything that is allowed to have a top notch comp rig, plan on $20,000 in parts. If you want it built for you, double the parts cost.

I agree with Brian. I tell everyone that asks, you can build one yourself on the cheap for around $10,000. If you want to go big, with everything that is allowed to have a top notch comp rig, plan on $20,000 in parts. If you want it built for you, double the parts cost.

Even better start with a built truck! I dont know what we spent to build ours from having a truck to teardown.

Things we bought:
chassis
tabs, dzus
seats
hydro parts
st. pump
housings
Longfields
sheetmetal
lexan
springs
shocks
wheels
tires
tubing
a few other smaller items I cant think of!


We already had:
2 built 3rds
rear brakes, stock shafts, front outers, brakes
motor, trans, marlin dual cases
a couple EFI setups
frame
st. box
a bunch of other parts...


We're now adding Marlin 4.7 gears, and Marlin/Alloy rear shafts, only the best parts for us!

On topic, I think Ive said before. Ours at least (havent driven others) peforms and acts VERY similar to Pro Mod buggy I used to drive. That buggy has changed a bit, so give it ~10-12 days and I should now how it compares now!

Mine weighs 2860lbs, also on cat scales. I am not a fabricator.
My cost is close to $18K and still spending. On a positive note: I seem to be running out of things to buy. I tried to do everything right and overboard. rebuilt cases and new gears from marlin, 5:29 arb hi pinion front & arb v6 rear built by TG, chromos rear, PRP seats, FROR studs/ crossmember/twin stick(axles soon), Longfields front

Thanks everybody for the answers, great info.
It seems like the costs are very similar to SM.
I have about 7 in mine but alot has been sponsored and that doesn't consider the four stereos and 3 seats and two bumpers and all the stuff that was put into previous incarnations, just what's there now. I think I could reproduce my Jeep w/o the cool aluminum tub for about $7-8k scrounging everything. Or it would take up to $20k to build a sweet version.

Both have good trail and comp return on investment.

The body is a double edge sword. I hate fixing it after comps and worrying about trashing it but I like the look.

There is no way I can get my 7 under 3000 pounds (I don't think) It's at about 3300-3500 now that's a huge FToy advantage IMO.

The 37" most of you run are also a big advantage especially when you have to follow a 37" car with a 35" car on the same dug out lines.

I guess for me the big differences are that even though mine hasn't been on the street in years (as far as Danville PD knows) I like the fact that I "could" still street mine and pick up college girls. And the V8. When I'm in the dunes it's nice to have that "buck eighty" of pure AMC fine engineering to unleash.

One more question: what's the deal with FI/ carb/ propane with those things?

I went propane for the ease of installation. One wire to propane soleniod, one wire to the coil and I am running. Second no fuel containment issue at comps. Last I can run the vehicle upside down or any incline. (assuming oil pressure is present)

Downside: Many people say you lose 10% of the horsepower. I have never noticed the car is plenty powerful.

Toyota carbs seem to have a lot of angle issues. EFI has a ton of wiring, computers and sensors.

but FI is legal?

Yes efi is legal.

FI and propane were a 5- or 10? point penalty in the first couple seasons, but they're on a level playing field now.

Great, but I could never commit to something that is not already in hand, if you know what I mean....

W.E.ROCK and Rock Crawling come first:D

quoted

I got bumped up two classes in my local comps. First because I will be a "professional driver" when I compete in a werock event. Second because my rig does not have 55% of the body panels.
So my questions are:
1) Will the Ftoy compete with V8 rigs, coil over suspension, 39-44" tires, basically super trick trail rigs.
2) Is the Ftoy that much more capable than a Toyota truck with the same set up and a body with no bed?
I dont know. I have only driven the truck about 3-4 hours.


Heres some pics from a cal rocks event we did last year. The class is 37"tire pro class. We were up against some real pro mod rigs. We ended up in 5th place (pretty good) but could of done alot better.
I dont think anybody else made it up the climb in these picks, at least without taking out a cone(s) Every rig I saw ended up on its roof or broke trying. We were one of the last ones to go, and adviced not to even try the climb and try some kind of 3 wheel action around it.

Well, a 5k clutch dump in the 2.28 box put the F Toy straight up and thru the gate:D

I started this thread way back when I finished the rig. I did not think the F toy would compete with pro mod quality rigs with V8 power, link suspension and 40+ inch tires.

I WAS WRONG.
We finished first place in my local comps yesterday. With four first place finishes in this series we dominated. We beat second place by over 75 points.

THE F TOY IS INSANELY CAPABLE.

We won $1350 cash / a $350 gift certificate to Quadratec / $250 gift certificate to driveline specialties.
Of course I will cut my spotter in on some of the loot. He kicked ass all season.

Thanks for your feedback in the past. You were right.

Congrats man!

i Started This Thread Way Back When I Finished The Rig. I Did Not Think The F Toy Would Compete With Pro Mod Quality Rigs With V8 Power, Link Suspension And 40+ Inch Tires.

I Was Wrong.
We Finished First Place In My Local Comps Yesterday. With Four First Place Finishes In This Series We Dominated. We Beat Second Place By Over 75 Points.

The F Toy Is Insanely Capable.

we Won $1350 Cash / A $350 Gift Certificate To Quadratec / $250 Gift Certificate To Driveline Specialties.
Of Course I Will Cut My Spotter In On Some Of The Loot. He Kicked Ass All Season.

Thanks For Your Feedback In The Past. You Were Right.



Nice Job!!

Congrats on the win, sorry I didnt stick around for awards.
________
Laguna Bay II Condo (http://pattayaluxurycondos.com)

Just to put it out there, here was the scoring going into the last event. Wes is Ftoy507. The rest of us have full width trail rigs. The higher the points the better, a back-up takes 3 points away and a gate was worth 10 points.

Wes 297 80 + 25 171# First 573
Travis 278 80 + 25 120* Second 503
Bach 268 80 + 25 120 493
Austin 268 80+ 25 128@ Third 501

As you can see the f-toy had a pretty sizable lead going into the event, in fact he had the farthest lead of any of the different classes. We pretty much got spanked :flipoff2:
________
AVANDIA SICKNESS (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/avandia/)

I started this thread way back when I finished the rig. I did not think the F toy would compete with pro mod quality rigs with V8 power, link suspension and 40+ inch tires.

I WAS WRONG.
We finished first place in my local comps yesterday. With four first place finishes in this series we dominated. We beat second place by over 75 points.

THE F TOY IS INSANELY CAPABLE.

We won $1350 cash / a $350 gift certificate to Quadratec / $250 gift certificate to driveline specialties.
Of course I will cut my spotter in on some of the loot. He kicked ass all season.

Thanks for your feedback in the past. You were right.

Congratulations man. True bang for your buck and (at least some) return on investment that's what it's all about!
I watched the Ftoys at WeRock Donner a little more closely and they worked great, I saw alot of spots I know my Jeep would have struggled or DNFed.

Hey Mello,

Go switch to an F-toy so I have one less better competitor to try and beat!

"one less better"... is that a double positive? Not sure what that means but I ain't switchn' any time soon. I'm not saying you couldn't pay me to drive one though.