Been thinking a bit about comparing different buggies, and trying to get some idea how different ones would perform, without having the ability to get them side by side. Ill use an example, with some estimations:

buggy 1
300hp v8
4100 lbs
40's
4.88 gears
auto
~200 lb per corner wheel/tire

buggy 2
150 hp 4cyl
2700 lb
37's
5.29 gears
5 speed
~96 lb wheel/tire

Both motors are NA if it matters.

The discussion is how to compare these rigs. Thoughts were 0-60 times, 1/4 mile time, and 1/8 mile time. 0-60 I shot down since no one has a speedo. 1/4 mile was shot down as the v8 rig we're thinking no one would be nuts enough to drive WOT for 1/4, it would be going scary fast (owners thoughts).

Curious if anyone has found a way to compare stats like these and have some idea where the 2 would run against each other? Something like "if buggy 1 takes 1 minute to X distance from a stop, buggy 2 would take Y times X time to do the same distance". Y could be .9 if buggy 2 was after, or 1.3 if slower.

Any guesses? To much snow and at least one needs work to even get out at al anyway!

Call me crazy, but the V-8'd buggy would do about 14.8 in the 1/4.

Mine was 3800 lbs, 37's, 300 hp, 4.88's, auto and about 146 lbs per corner. Last year.


It's pretty fun to suprise mustangs at the strip.

I'd say that the 1/8th would be the best comparo.
I'm gonna bet that the V-8 is gonna eat the 4 cyl. :D

Im figuring the v8 will have lunch on the 4cyl rig, or rather the driver of the 4cyl will have a dust lunch!

The question, by how much though? We talking 2:1 1.5:1 10:1? Im the clown in the 4cyl, Im wondering if Ill see taillights after 5 miles or will the dust have settled by then?!

My thoughts are, Brian even though I dig you, you have WAY TOO much time on your hands.:D:D


With your thought process you lost me at hello!

you talking about acrossed the lakebed? through the whoops? on the trail? parking structure at the mall?

leaves? links? coilovers? bypasses? airbumps? a bypassed/bumped ftoy can keep up with most linked rigs at the hammers. even a tuned 2.0 or 2.5 resivored shock would be a huge upgrade for em. just comes down to tuning time

you can have all the power in the world and unless you can back it up with the suspension in the dezert its pointless. im sure shannons KOH rig had the balls enough for 100+ mph but he said it gets squirelly above 80.

150hp has a better power to wieght ratio of 18 to 13.667. smaller tires, lighter corners, and deeper gears give it a better acceleration physics. but then you get into auto/manual efficency numbers which will be reflected at the wheels and powerband numbers.

KOH split times are going to give you the best indication. lots of different setups in power and suspension.

seems like something that can be settled at a family get together. thanks for giving me something to think about on my trek back to socal this weekend.

you talking about acrossed the lakebed? through the whoops? on the trail? parking structure at the mall?

thanks for giving me something to think about on my trek back to socal this weekend.

Thats what I keep doing, is thinking of this sillyness while driving around! Im hoping someone has a reasonable way "textbook" to compare. Are we apples to apples, oranges, or shoelaces? :laughing:

As for where, call it lake bed. Driving in both rigs, I think whoops,washboard and curbs will perform similarly, or at least close enough not to matter in this arguement. And on the trail, 4cyl will be faster, since he'll be too busy messing with the rear steer while I pass him!

I don't think a 1/4 mile shot will give you a good idea of which rig is faster on the lake bed.

How often do you accelerate from a stop?

I would measure by how well the rigs 'pick themselves up' from mid throttle. Let say you back off of the pedal for a second to counter steer around a turn, after which you have to peg the throttle to clear a whoop... Which one is going to get to the target speed faster?

Just a thought.

150hp has a better power to wieght ratio of 18 to 13.667. smaller tires, lighter corners, and deeper gears give it a better acceleration physics. but then you get into auto/manual efficency numbers which will be reflected at the wheels and powerband numbers.


um, the 150hp setup is worse. you've got your numbers reversed.

the 300hp rig has 13lbs per hp
the 150hp rig has 18lbs per hp

less lbs per hp is better, so get under 10-12lbs per hp and you'll be much happier.

rig 3 3500lbs at 350hp. :D

:)

um, the 150hp setup is worse. you've got your numbers reversed.

the 300hp rig has 13lbs per hp
the 150hp rig has 18lbs per hp

less lbs per hp is better, so get under 10-12lbs per hp and you'll be much happier.

rig 3 3500lbs at 350hp. :D

:)

So the gear/tire advantage and lower rotating weight, and less drag 5spd vs. auto are not factors in what youre looking at. Is it that simple, am I just over thinking this? :confused:

Not sure if this helps or not ????

http://www.nationaldrivetrain.com/calcs/dragcalc.html

:)

brian,

hit up the homegrown crew. the raisin vs. sawzall is pretty close to the comparison you are looking for. both on leaves, v8 vs. 4cyl,auto vs, manual, 44s vs. 38s. since the both wheel together they should have a pretty good idea of what you are trying to quantify.

Thats a good idea Chris, except both are heavy, Id guess both in the 3500-3800 neighborhood.

true but it would be something to work with or you could just go wheel with em and see it for yourself

Not sure if this helps or not ????

http://www.nationaldrivetrain.com/calcs/dragcalc.html

:)

Now THATS what Im talking about! I knew someone had to have played with this stuff!

Interesting enough it comes back estimates for:
buggy 1: 1/4 mile, 13.3sec
speed at 1/4, 98mph
1/8 mile, 8.5sec

buggy 2
1/4 mile, 14.6sec
speed at 1/4, 89mph
1/8 mile, 9.3sec

So after that 5 mile increment, assuming both stay at 1/4 mile speed (assuming both are nuts enough to run that!) buggy 2 would be ~30 seconds behind buggy 1. This is a total "lab" comparison as there are many other factors, but interesting nonetheless.

most cars with a 10lbs per hp are considered "street fast". Mid size sport bikes run about 2lbs per hp. NHRA well under <1lb per hp. My zuk is 45lbs per hp. stay away from that number. :homer:

Whoa, Brian, will FT044 do 89 mph?! :eek:

Whoa, Brian, will FT044 do 89 mph?! :eek:

I need a tach. Ive had it wound out in 3rd gear, guessing 4-4500 rpm high range, running 5.29's and 37's. Thats around 70-75 mph, with this "just wont quite blow up" knocking, blowby equipped squirrel holder! We're working on the remedy, and man do I wish turbos were legal, 200+hp!

Once we add another CV to the front shaft, we'll be running 4wd at speed as well. :evil: Bender Jambo ought to be FUN this year.

Quick stat from KOH.

EZ Rick was the 3rd fastest overall in the desert sections (of the finishers).

He has a stock 22re ;)

Quick stat from KOH.

EZ Rick was the 3rd fastest overall in the desert sections (of the finishers).

He has a stock 22re with ~6psi ;)

fixed for ya

Not sure if this helps or not ????

http://www.nationaldrivetrain.com/calcs/dragcalc.html

:)

Pretty cool calculator Chris, thanks for the link.

It pretty neat to see how much the results can vary just from making little changes.

3000lb w/ 200 hp:
1/4 mile ET - 13.7
Speed- 94.97

2800lbs w/ 240hp:
1/4 mile ET - 12.61
Speed- 103

Drop to 2500lbs, but keep the 240hp:
12.15 ET
107 mph

Keep the 2800lbs and add 40 more HP:
11.99 ET
108 mph

So after that 5 mile increment, assuming both stay at 1/4 mile speed

WTF, is it forbidden to accelerate anymore past a 1/4 mile ?

WTF, is it forbidden to accelerate anymore past a 1/4 mile ?

No, but neither rig has a driver/suspension capable of running 80-100 across the desert! :D

Great thread. I believe the weight issue is big and you guys are putting numbers to the real world performace charactistics :beer:

Now get rid of the mud in the South so I can go super-bare-bones buggy :homer:

Drag Racing Calculator


Vehicle Weight (in pounds): 2600
Vehicle Horsepower: 550
RPM through lights (finish line): 6400
Tire Diameter (Hght.) in Inches: 40
1/4 Mile ET: 9.56
1/4 Mile Top End Speed: 139.5
Ideal 1/4 Mile Gear Ratio: 5.45
1/8 Mile ET: 6.09

Pretty cool calculator, but I doubt the drivelines would let me get her up to 140MPH in the desert or the drag strip.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/2007-XRRA-National-Championships-Colorado-Springs/07_XRRA_Finals_Co_Springs_022.sized.jpg

Drag Racing Calculator


Vehicle Weight (in pounds): 2600
Vehicle Horsepower: 550
RPM through lights (finish line): 6400
Tire Diameter (Hght.) in Inches: 40
1/4 Mile ET: 9.56
1/4 Mile Top End Speed: 139.5
Ideal 1/4 Mile Gear Ratio: 5.45
1/8 Mile ET: 6.09

Pretty cool calculator, but I doubt the drivelines would let me get her up to 140MPH in the desert or the drag strip.

http://www.sjmembers.com/gallery/albums/2007-XRRA-National-Championships-Colorado-Springs/07_XRRA_Finals_Co_Springs_022.sized.jpg


only one way to find out ... HAHA

It would be pretty cool to pull up to my local drag strip and join the 9 sec club in my rock racer. :grinpimp:

hmmm... It did do 0-50 in 1.6 sec on the dyno, but I'm thinking something would explode before the end of the 1/4 mile.

Probably my huevos. :laughing:

Quick stat from KOH.

EZ Rick was the 3rd fastest overall in the desert sections (of the finishers).

He has a stock 22re ;)


Sorry Dave i cant give this one to ya. How are you averagin all desert sections?

I didt go over all the desert sections but in the large desert sections that was the first 17.5 miles he was not even in the top 8.

Leaders at the check points...I think this is accurate!

CP1 - Brad Lovell (split time 12:10), Casie Currie (12:44), Tom Wayes (13:14), Ian Plaine (13:16), Shannon Campbell (13:33), Drew Burroughs (13:38), JR (13:39), Randy Slawson (13:48)

CP2 - Brad Lovell (split time 12:10), -37 seconds Drew Burroughs (11:19), -7 seconds Casie Currie (12:20), -16 seconds Tom Wayes (12:06), -28 seconds Ian Plaine (12:32), -17 seconds JR (12:26), -4 seconds Shannon Campbell (12:36), -31 seconds Randy Slawson (12:52)

CP3 - Casie Currie (split time 4:12), -9 seconds Drew Burroughs (4:28), -45 seconds Shannon Campbell (4:01), -16 seconds JR (4:21), -10 seconds Ian Plaine (4:48), -6 seconds Tom Wayes (5:22), -2 seconds Randy Slawson (4:04)



Ian