Anyone happen to know what a small Mazda rotory engine and manual tranny weighs?

Anyone though of using these on an ultra light rig?

Yes I do, infact howabout a turbo-charged rotary

Rich

Originally posted by Big Rich
Yes I do, infact howabout a turbo-charged rotary

Rich

Well sure, what's it weigh?

I had a Mazda in my early years, and that little tiny motor was something like 71 Cubic Inches, but that car hualed ass!

Nice wide power band, too with a high readline.

rotorys have great power to weight ratio. but the fucken apex seals are shit and go about every 75 000 miles to 120 000 miles. which is a pain in the ass. if u get a rotory, buy one that needs a rebuild, because it will in a short while anyway, my friend has put 4 into his rx7 and none will pass aircare:mad: but the redline is sweet:eek:

get a hold of rotozuk,wayne knows alot about this subject.

Originally posted by Chris Geiger
Anyone happen to know what a small Mazda rotory engine and manual tranny weighs?

Anyone though of using these on an ultra light rig?

Hell, I might actually be able to provide some usefull tech for once.


A fully dressed 12A rotary with flywheel is about 185lbs. I would estimate the manual trans at about 60 lbs (I can bench press one into place without too much trouble). The 12A is the older motor (I believe that's pre '88). As far as I know the 12A was only available naturaly aspirated. Once they went turbo they went to the 13B which is a bit heavier but not that much. These motors make very little torque below about 3800RPM or so. The turbo motors of course are quite a bit better in the torque department.

Someone posted a response with apex seal issues. A properly maintained and sainly driven rotary will take just as much abuse and mileage as any piston engine. The problems comes when people learn how well the spin up and then they hammer the piss out of the motor.

I think with some tuning one of these motors would work great in a buggy. It's going to take some getting used to driving because of the need to keep the RPM's up but other than that...the skys the limit.


Oh, and the newer 13B with the twin sequencial turbos is 320bhp stock. 400hp is just a few mods away...

You can also stack 'cylinders'. I had a 2nd Gen RX-7 with 3 13B 'cylinders' Better torque and HP.

Jim

Originally posted by TLCObsession
You can also stack 'cylinders'. I had a 2nd Gen RX-7 with 3 13B 'cylinders' Better torque and HP.

Jim


When you say stack "cylinders" do you mean adding a third chamber (epi-trokoid) so that you are running three rotors instead of the standrad 2???

so if you had low enough gearing you could keep the rpm's up and still have some control, hey I finally see a need for the 200 to 1 gears:D

so what red line for thies things

and HP rating and FP ratings at what RPM

dont waste your time, a guy down here did it into a zuki, seemed all good in theory, wasnt.


NICK

There was a guy here on the trails last year that had one in his Zuk. Worked really well. I was really impressed with the way it worked. He did one of the hardest trails around here on 33's with very little problem, especially when near vertical.

Erin

What about an all-aluminum 4-cylinder like they use in USAC Midget cars? You could easily detune them with a different cam & milder heads to make more torque. Keep the compression high & run good fuel. Seems like an aluminum SBC is about 350 lbs, so a 4-cylinder would be roughly 200????


TEX

the aluminum V4 is an excelent motor. My buddy runs one w/turbo in his long travel buggy, est 850 hp :eek: . Dont know the weight but the manufacture is SCAT.

Originally posted by it'll fit
the aluminum V4 is an excelent motor. My buddy runs one w/turbo in his long travel buggy, est 850 hp :eek: . Dont know the weight but the manufacture is SCAT.

Or, what about a V4 from a Honda or Yamaha? Or a big thumper Harley V-twin with loads of low-end? Hmmmmm.......


TEX

Originally posted by TEX
What about an all-aluminum 4-cylinder like they use in USAC Midget cars? You could easily detune them with a different cam & milder heads to make more torque. Keep the compression high & run good fuel. Seems like an aluminum SBC is about 350 lbs, so a 4-cylinder would be roughly 200????


TEX

Keep in mind that a "Sprint car" aluminum SBC is about 350lbs... for those of us in the real world that same motor is going to weigh about 500 lbs. They do some crazy crap to the Sprint car motors to keep the weight down (gun drill the cam, A/N washers, machine the excess off of head studs, crazy crap like that) and it's going to cost you around $40K for one of those motors...

Actually, you are correct in stating that a sprint car SBC has some crazy stuff done to keep weight down (lots of Titanium too), but an all-iron SBC is only about 550, so even w/o getting crazy you're gonna be way lighter with all aluminum - especially once you drop 4 of those cylinders off :)

TEX

Originally posted by TEX


Or, what about a V4 from a Honda or Yamaha? Or a big thumper Harley V-twin with loads of low-end? Hmmmmm.......


TEX



can you say turbocharged HAYABUSA?:cool:

I've been thinking about using a yamaha v-max and adapting it to a toyota transmission.
Then I would have 10 fowards a 1 reverse.
Could use a goldwing motor and have 10 fowards and 2 reverse.
But I am a little concerned about the clutch holding up in the motorcyle engine.

Originally posted by TEX


Or, what about a V4 from a Honda or Yamaha? Or a big thumper Harley V-twin with loads of low-end? Hmmmmm.......


TEX


mmmmm Harley stroker mmmmmmm.....

Everyone would know it was you. :D :D

Originally posted by TEX
Actually, you are correct in stating that a sprint car SBC has some crazy stuff done to keep weight down (lots of Titanium too), but an all-iron SBC is only about 550, so even w/o getting crazy you're gonna be way lighter with all aluminum - especially once you drop 4 of those cylinders off :)

TEX

Just curious, when your talking motor weight are you talking fully dressed or just a long block. I ask because a production cast iron small block fully dressed is 722lbs.


Regaurdless.... it's still a hell of a lot lighter... :)

Originally posted by NIC
dont waste your time, a guy down here did it into a zuki, seemed all good in theory, wasnt.


NICK

i know a guy that did a very similar thing and it went awesome on the street, could even get the front wheels up, tyre fryin

but he rolled it a lot, especially on roundabouts :flipoff2: :eek: :smokin:

i think there is even a dude, who does the conversions

.....i think the major downfall is the torque, not much available and needs to be in a high rpm bracket to get it, and when you are pnuching it you are more likely to break stuff

I know this is a little off topic but where are some good rotary sites with engine specs? such as length width HP Weight ETC??? I was thinking about putting a 12A or 13B in a 3 seater jet ski if it would fit.

Originally posted by Priest





Oh, and the newer 13B with the twin sequencial turbos is 320bhp stock. 400hp is just a few mods away...

it's 275 hp, and it's a 20b:flipoff2:

Originally posted by SeaBass44


it's 275 hp, and it's a 20b:flipoff2:

20b rew is a 3 rotor twin turbo, rated between 275-320hp depending on who you're talking to. He was talking about the 13b rew, twin turbo and it makes 255hp:flipoff2:
Oh and mazda also has a 4 rotor version :D

Tass

Originally posted by Tass


20b rew is a 3 rotor twin turbo, rated between 275-320hp depending on who you're talking to.
lol


He was talking about the 13b rew, twin turbo and it makes 255hp:flipoff2:
lol ok

Oh and mazda also has a 4 rotor version :D

Tass


only in japan, lol you can't get one, he he

where can i get a 20B?

Originally posted by SeaBass44



only in japan, lol you can't get one, he he
There are a few importers in the staes that do bring them in. Check some of the rotory sites!!!

Originally posted by Krylon..

There are a few importers in the staes that do bring them in. Check some of the rotory sites!!!

Well sure you can get almost anything at a cost$$$$$$$$$$:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :p :p :p

Hmmm.... and I've been wondering what to do with that old VW transaxle in the yard. I bet that wouldn't take much of an adapter. Not 4wd, but in a light tube frame and 'glass skin it'd probably do the twisty mountain roads nicely - at least in summer.

there is a couple of 3 rotor motors up here.
I have seen 1 in a road race car and it eats V8s in the straights, actually it kills them everywhere on track.

You guys are of course correct.... I don't know where I got the 320hp number for the 13b... (mental note...stop smoking crack). I've been out of the rotary loop for quite some time. I knew that Mazda had run a 4 rotor motor quite awhile ago in their IMSA GT car before IMSA went defunct. Are the "20B" motors a production motor or are guys building them on their own. I'd like to see one.

Originally posted by Priest


Oh, and the newer 13B with the twin sequencial turbos is 320bhp stock. 400hp is just a few mods away...

I'm looking at possibly buying a 93 RX-7. They have the twin sequential turbos and are rated at 270 hp. Go to the RX-7 forum they have lots of valuable wankel info.

The 13B is supposedly ~190 lbs.

I think the 320hp one is the tri rotar or bi rotar offered in the Japanese Mazda Cosmo. You can import these and they have been built to 800hp.

Originally posted by SeaBass44


Well sure you can get almost anything at a cost$$$$$$$$$$:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :p :p :p

Ya, I wish everythign were free! :) I checked an online source yesterday and the 20B can be had for $3999 + shipping.(used/low mileage engine with injection and turbo)

Originally posted by Priest
You guys are of course correct.... I don't know where I got the 320hp number for the 13b... (mental note...stop smoking crack). I've been out of the rotary loop for quite some time. I knew that Mazda had run a 4 rotor motor quite awhile ago in their IMSA GT car before IMSA went defunct. Are the "20B" motors a production motor or are guys building them on their own. I'd like to see one.

20B's are prduction engines...

Here is a pic of one from the top: 20B (http://www.corksport.com/cgi-bin/test.cgi?gfx=/20bt.jpg&text=20BT+Engine&back=jengine.html)

About $3999 + shiping for everythign you see!

A rotory powered rock crawler?? Are you serious? Have you ever heard one of those things wound up? You'd have to hand out ear plugs before anyone would go wheeling with you:D. That's one of the most irritating sounds that I can think of.

To get better low end torque, what about swapping out the Turbo for a Supercharger??? Or adding a Supercharger on top of the Turbo?

Originally posted by Angie
more torque... add the racing flywheel and a manual adj for the turbo boost...

superchargers are for huge hp jumps not torque...

Reason I suggested the torque is a Superchargers powers is on from off idle, where it takes a little bit for the turbo to spool(unless you tune and get the turbo lag to a minimum...

Is it possible on these to put a supercharger on first and the have the turbo pushing into the supercharger? We had a Detroit diesle that was like that...

Man, all this rotary talk, I am thinking about building a Rotary powered Sammi!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Angie
THe rotary by design needs a lot of air.. I have seen drag racing setups withboth but Idoubt its reliability...

Do you have a rotary power Sammi? I thought I saw somewhere that you do... Have any pics of the whole rig and the engine in the bay?