i have a 1991 ford 351 windsor motor that im goin to carb, all emisons is gone, bought an intake manifold what do i have to do for the distibutor? wire the stock one or what? it was an efi origonaly. thanks

boom

the easy way would be to put on a ebay HEI conversion - one wire hook up -







thats what i have on my 460 -

any way to keep the stock one? i can wire it thats not a problem

not the tfi distributor - the ignition pick up and the module are made for an computer controlled vehicle


you could get an older ( 86 carbed ) dizzy and wire up the early ford duraspark

iight i might do that then, thanks

just get a distributor for a pre efi motor amd wrecking yard prowl for the harness.
HEI is chevy junk.
duraspark is a far better system IMO.

just get a distributor for a pre efi motor amd wrecking yard prowl for the harness.
HEI is chevy junk.
duraspark is a far better system IMO.

that what ive been reading, so do i need one wiht points or how dose it know when to spark? is it prosble to do crank triggier ignation?

what if i did sumthign like this? http://webpages.charter.net/1bad6t/dswmpt.html

that what ive been reading, so do i need one wiht points or how dose it know when to spark? is it prosble to do crank triggier ignation?

*BZZZZZT!*

If you don't understand the difference between points and electronic ignition, you need to go to a different forum than this one.

better luck here. (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=43)

what if i did sumthign like this? http://webpages.charter.net/1bad6t/dswmpt.html

That will work. Good find. Get the Ford DS II distributor and wire all that in. If you want to save a little dough, you can use the same stuff, but OEM from the wrecking yard and parts store. You may want to start with cheap wrecking yard stuff till you see if you can get it to work. If you can't, the one wire HEI distributor is a no-brain deal. I'm pretty sure you are not going to exceed the mechanical limits of the unit, or you would have already known the difference between points and electronic ignition to start with, and the difference between a technical forum and a newbie forum.

i know the differince between points and electroinc, im jsut tryin to figure it out im only 17 so im not a genius jsut tryin to swap a motor into my jeep thats all, i cant go out buyin thousands of dollors of parts only to not work. jsut tryin to figure out what would work best for my set up.

i know the differince between points and electroinc, im jsut tryin to figure it out im only 17 so im not a genius jsut tryin to swap a motor into my jeep thats all, i cant go out buyin thousands of dollors of parts only to not work. jsut tryin to figure out what would work best for my set up.

Emmm hmmmm. Yeah, sure. Whether to go points or not on a '91 351W. Right! If you don't know how the spark is triggered, how could you possibly understand how to wire it up like you said you could? We're supposed to explain how the system works, then you just magically grasp it from there and go do it, huh?

OK, well the magnetic field of the trigger wheel on the distributor shaft passes through the field in the pick-up coil stator, which is also housed in the distributor, which triggers the firing of the coil through the ignition module by breaking the current to the coil, causing it to seek ground through the spark plug that is engaged to the rotor via the distributor cap, pretty much in the same manner as which the points used to do it via a mechanically opened switch riding on the octagonal drive on the ditributor shaft.

All of these components are also housed in the HEI distributor, including the module and the coil by the way, so there is only one wire to hook up to it, instead of the dozen or so you'll need to get from the ignition switch, to the module and relay solenoid, then back to the module, then over to the distributor, then back to the module, and then over finally to the coil.

Now, you know how it works, and you have the diagram. Should be able to take it from there, right? Or is there another problem?

so if jsut get a msd box like a 6a it will work or not?

this thread (http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8370045&posted=1#post8370045) has a parts list on ds2 from auto zone. I believe, but most likely I'm wrong, that DS2 dizzys are different from Non-egr to egr models. something about the spring being different tensions inside.

here is a good knowledge source if you haven't already checked it out
http://www.ford-trucks.com/

you could go with an all-in-one aftermarket (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching&viewitem=&item=250229781591&_trksid=p3907.m32) package to get the project fired up and upgrade later

so if jsut get a msd box like a 6a it will work or not?

you need a new dizzy either way. you cannot use a dizzy meant for efi.

I believe, but most likely I'm wrong, that DS2 dizzys are different from Non-egr to egr models. something about the spring being different tensions inside.

I believe the EGR system predated even the original DS system in 75/76, prior to the DS II system which is what you would want if going that way. Maybe you have it confused with the catalyst and non-catalyst engines, which would be any truck over 6000 lbs GVWR(except CA) until 78, and the F-350 after 1978. The F-100 is the only truck that got smogged from 75 on like the cars, thus creating the F-150 that could still classify as a 1/2 ton truck, but still exceed the smog cut-off limit of the day.

ok so i need a new dizzy, prolly goin junk yard diving whats the best one to get?

whats the differnece between the catalyst and non? all i know is that thing has more smog shit that i thought was possible

ok so i need a new dizzy, prolly goin junk yard diving whats the best one to get?

whats the differnece between the catalyst and non? all i know is that thing has more smog shit that i thought was possible

If you are serious, which I doubt, then you would want to look for a heavy car from 75 to 85 thereabouts like an LTD, Thunderbird, Country Squire, Lincolns and Mercury's with a 351W or a 302. I wouldn't be too concerned on smog or not to just get it running. You can upgrade it with specific parts like a curve kit once you see what you have. I've never worked on, looked at, owned, or even sneezed at a 351W, but if its like the other fuel injected engines, a carb intake is not going to match up to EFI heads. Are you also replacing the heads?

When junk yarding for your dist you just need one for either a 351w or 302 as they are the same. What I look for is first remove the "brain box" from the inner fender and look at the plastic molded over the wires going into it. There are different colors indicating different ECM's. I ONLY use blue! Not black or brown or yellow. Pretty much any 302-351 after 1975 till 85/86 could potentialy have what you are looking for. But the big cars like lincolns and LTD's seem to always have the more complicated yellow ECM wich has an extra set of wires and plug. For the blue box you only need to get the harness that goes between the ECM and the dist. Wich will have one wire hooked up to the clip that snaps over the coil and plugs into both the dist and ECM. I cut about 6 inches of the two pin connector that powers the ECM with 12 volts and only hook up the red wire to the ecm and I use the same power source to run 12V to the coil. This only takes a total of 5 wires. Three go from the ecm to the dist those are orange,purple,black-w/greenstripe. The light green wire from the ecm goes to the - on the coil. Power the + side of the coil and the red wire for the ecm and it should run.

I edited my previous post. I was thinking 351M/400/460, and forgot the dizzy would not work in a small block. I specified 351W and 302, and got rid of the trucks due to most having 351M/400 from 1977 to 1980. I believe you want 77 or later to get DS II. The only difference may be the wider dizzy body and cap to reduce cross-fire, but there may be other changes as well. I believe the yellow plug box mentioned by jr4x is just an extra plug for a barometer for high-elevation areas, and can still be operated w/o anything plugged into it.

i wanst planing on changing the heads, so the intake wont fit the stock heads?

No, you need a 351W dist. A 302 dist will not work. He'll be pretty frustrated when the 302 1/4" oil pump drive in it's dist won't go onto the 351W 5/16" hex drive.

The stock E7 heads will take a carb'd intake just fine.

iight sweet, and i reed that i need a 351 windsor dist. any need to change the cam? or will that one due ok?

No, you need a 351W dist. A 302 dist will not work. He'll be pretty frustrated when the 302 1/4" oil pump drive in it's dist won't go onto the 351W 5/16" hex drive.

The stock E7 heads will take a carb'd intake just fine.


OK I stand corrected. I didnt know they have different oil pump drive shafts. So make sure you get one out of a windsor to be certain!

I believe the EGR system predated even the original DS system in 75/76, prior to the DS II system which is what you would want if going that way. Maybe you have it confused with the catalyst and non-catalyst engines, which would be any truck over 6000 lbs GVWR(except CA) until 78, and the F-350 after 1978. The F-100 is the only truck that got smogged from 75 on like the cars, thus creating the F-150 that could still classify as a 1/2 ton truck, but still exceed the smog cut-off limit of the day.

thanks, I didn't want to be misleading. I always use either a 79 e350, 79 f350 or torino for parts reference.

which dizzy should be used? dual or single vacuum

any way to keep the stock one? i can wire it thats not a problem

You can use a TFI distributor without computer controls as long as you don't mind having fixed timing.

dual is complicated, requires a few thermo vacuum switches

You can use a TFI distributor without computer controls as long as you don't mind having fixed timing.

what would fixed timeing do to it? can i run like the efi spark but no fuel injectors? like an efi motor jsut dosnt deliver fuel or would that be a pain in the ass?

- he was being a smart ass when he said you can use the TFI dizzy - Fixed timing means NO advance at all - only set at 10 deg - thats it - it will not run with that


you need to get a new dizzy - and it must be a 351w dizzy due to the diffrent oil pump drive size - for the time and money get a HEI from ebay - they are like 59.99 plus shipping - you are going to to save yourself time and frustration - as it is only one wire - no crank triggers - no msd box - one wire -


if you must get one from a JY find a late 80s 351w and steal all the parts - the dizzy - the ignition box - and the harness -


but it sounds like you need a simple answer and a simple solution

- he was being a smart ass when he said you can use the TFI dizzy - Fixed timing means NO advance at all - only set at 10 deg - thats it - it will not run with that

I was and I wasn't... You can set the timing for whatever you want, but it will not advance or retard as needed. I've seen several people running fixed timing in the 20 degree range without issues.

It isn't the way I would do it, but it can be done.

well yes you are right :flipoff2: - it will run - with fixed timing - is it right ? no, no its not





































now dont distract this poor kid anymore - he needs all the help he can get :flipoff2:

well yes you are right :flipoff2: - it will run - with fixed timing - is it right ? no, no its not





































now dont distract this poor kid anymore - he needs all the help he can get :flipoff2:

fuckin amen, so ill look for a HEI and slove that and be done. thanks alot guys and for the sarcasum :smokin:

fuckin amen, so ill look for a HEI and slove that and be done. thanks alot guys and for the sarcasum :smokin:


you spelled "solve" wrong:flipoff2:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300211328349&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=300208409025&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m183&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3 DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D4#ebayphotohosting

i spell like every other word wrong

let us know how it works and what route you go, GL

ordered the dizzy today, intake should be here tomarrow, i was thinkin running on propane. anyone have any input for this motor? ive been researching jsut tryin to figure out some different options.

boom

what are you doing for engine mounts?

pane will run fine on it - but it likes higher compression, as pane is 100-110 octaine - your engine should be around 8.5 - but it will work fine - and you can advance the timing a bit for some more umph -

pm " propane " on here or at gotpropane.com - he can help you out on tuning -

prolly half assin mounts like i half ass everyother thing i do. so if i put in higher comp. pistons it will like it more? or should i not even bother? im not lookin to run 9's but maybe 10's? (jokin) im just lookin for the cheapist thing posible, and once i get it on the road i dotn have to worry bout emmisons so its good.

leave it alone - it will work fine - unless you want to do it right and spend some $ on a rebuild

if i was to redo it id go with forged pistons and rods, have everything x-rayed, what models have a vbelt insted of serpintine belt? i need a water pump. thanks and what should the static advance be? ive read about 11 degrees?

v belts stopped with efi - so go find one with a carb


10 deg is spec for a efi - but with pane you bump it to 13-14 with no problem

for right now im gunna run 87 gas till i deside what im gunna do i might mix it with turbo blue imnot sure yet. what years would have the carb like models or what. thanks