i live in california, and was wondering what the law says about tieing a vehical to a trailer. when i tie my rig down i use a strap and go under the axle, over the 3rd member, and back under the axle and to the trailer. i do that both front and rear. i have done that for years never any problems, and so have some friends of mine. im thinking that this isn't leagal though. with a new wheeling seson on us, and a lot more law enforcment around these trails, i wanna pull up to the trail leagal and not have to give anyone anymore reasones to shut trails down. does anyone know or can post the california and nevada laws for towing vehicals on trailers. also any trailer requiormnets.

i herd but am not shure, one chain per axel, or two straps per axle. what about placement of straps or chains?

In Michigan, you need 2 independent tie-downs both front & rear. Farmers are getting written up for hauling tractors exactly how you're describing.

in Cali, you need 4 independent tie down points, so you need 4 binders when using chains and two chains will usually work. i use axles strap and cross the rear chains using the binders as the anchor point on the trailer and then adjust each side of the chain as necessary then lock her down with a bar. the front chains are always strait shot from the corner to the axles using axle straps and chains to maximize triangulation. Been using this setup on bobcats and trucks and all manner or things for a while not one problem.it make it really easy if you have stake pockets for anchors on your trailer. hope that makes sense...

Who cares what your state's requirements are... find out what the most overkill you can do and do it that way. IE one chain or strap ( your preference I guess) to each corner.

Your first mistake is being paranoid of the popo,Fawck them.
Lets worry about being safe for the other drivers and their kids. For the luv of god,Use 4points when straping down..:shaking:
And learn some english

4 chains at the corners should cover you with no problems. I doubt your rig is long enough to require center chains. Ratchet binders only on chains now, no pull types allowed.

Trailer requirements. Brakes definitely. Breakaway system. Safety chains, lights. Mostly fairly simple. The one biggie that gets some guys is not exceeding 10K max trailer wt without a class A licence. I don't know CA., but I do know PA, NJ, DE, VA and NY all have this requirement and the cops look for this hard.

4 chains at the corners should cover you with no problems. I doubt your rig is long enough to require center chains. Ratchet binders only on chains now, no pull types allowed.

Trailer requirements. Brakes definitely. Breakaway system. Safety chains, lights. Mostly fairly simple. The one biggie that gets some guys is not exceeding 10K max trailer wt without a class A licence. I don't know CA., but I do know PA, NJ, DE, VA and NY all have this requirement and the cops look for this hard.

CA has a 10k limit as well, but you can get an edorsement to cover up to 15k (5th wheel recreational only, but the vehicle code only defines 5th as trailer mount forward of the rear axle, so that should cover goosenecks as well)

in case anyone cares, its "Restriction 41" and requires only a written test that is the same as the non-commercial Class A written test. No driving test needed.

Your first mistake is being paranoid of the popo,Fawck them.
Lets worry about being safe for the other drivers and their kids. For the luv of god,Use 4points when straping down..:shaking:
And learn some english

so leaving the rig in gear with parking brake on isn't enough? :flipoff2:

i do ratchet straps up front, straight to the corners and pair of chains with ratchet binders crossed in the rear.

so leaving the rig in gear with parking brake on isn't enough? :flipoff2:
.
You would not believe how many rollbacks that come to our yard with only the front latched with their winch!!:eek:
If it's over 4k or so,I'll cross (X) my tie downs.

In Oregon for non commercail applications there really is no law for equipment/vehicle tie downs... I even went to the top to be sure. So that mini van on the snow mobile trailer tied down with rope is probably legal as long as it is not over weight.... :shaking:

But if you look at the commercail laws - the feds are in charge of everyone and there laws are pretty clear on tie downs. But they generally only apply to loads over 10K....

In Oregon for non commercail applications there really is no law for equipment/vehicle tie downs... I even went to the top to be sure. So that mini van on the snow mobile trailer tied down with rope is probably legal as long as it is not over weight.... :shaking:

But if you look at the commercail laws - the feds are in charge of everyone and there laws are pretty clear on tie downs. But they generally only apply to loads over 10K....

The Feds very much care about vehicles less than 10K lbs:

§ 393.128 What are the rules for securing automobiles, light trucks and vans?
top

(a) Applicability. The rules in this section apply to the transportation of automobiles, light trucks, and vans which individually weigh 4,536 kg. (10,000 lb) or less. Vehicles which individually are heavier than 4,536 kg (10,000 lb) must be secured in accordance with the provisions of §393.130 of this part.

(b) Securement of automobiles, light trucks, and vans. (1) Automobiles, light trucks, and vans must be restrained at both the front and rear to prevent lateral, forward, rearward, and vertical movement using a minimum of two tiedowns.

(2) Tiedowns that are designed to be affixed to the structure of the automobile, light truck, or van must use the mounting points on those vehicles that have been specifically designed for that purpose.

(3) Tiedowns that are designed to fit over or around the wheels of an automobile, light truck, or van must provide restraint in the lateral, longitudinal and vertical directions.

(4) Edge protectors are not required for synthetic webbing at points where the webbing comes in contact with the tires.


From here: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=583fca98804baa8abc8db5e26ff3ba37&rgn=div5&view=text&node=49:5.1.1.2.36&idno=49#49:5.1.1.2.36.9.12.4

For Clarification, in NY you can Tow a trailer with a GVW over 10k lbs if the Combined GVWR is less then 26k. There is no Non-CDL Class C license anymore in New York :)

Source: http://www.nysdmv.com/ncdlc.htm

The Feds very much care about vehicles less than 10K lbs:

§ 393.128 What are the rules for securing automobiles, light trucks and vans?
top

(a) Applicability. The rules in this section apply to the transportation of automobiles, light trucks, and vans which individually weigh 4,536 kg. (10,000 lb) or less. Vehicles which individually are heavier than 4,536 kg (10,000 lb) must be secured in accordance with the provisions of §393.130 of this part.

(b) Securement of automobiles, light trucks, and vans. (1) Automobiles, light trucks, and vans must be restrained at both the front and rear to prevent lateral, forward, rearward, and vertical movement using a minimum of two tiedowns.

(2) Tiedowns that are designed to be affixed to the structure of the automobile, light truck, or van must use the mounting points on those vehicles that have been specifically designed for that purpose.

(3) Tiedowns that are designed to fit over or around the wheels of an automobile, light truck, or van must provide restraint in the lateral, longitudinal and vertical directions.

(4) Edge protectors are not required for synthetic webbing at points where the webbing comes in contact with the tires.


From here: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=583fca98804baa8abc8db5e26ff3ba37&rgn=div5&view=text&node=49:5.1.1.2.36&idno=49#49:5.1.1.2.36.9.12.4


Good point - thanks for the link. But all that section only applies to commercial operators:

§ 393.1 Scope of the rules in this part.

(a) The rules in this part establish minimum standards for commercial motor vehicles as defined in §390.5 of this title. Only motor vehicles (as defined in §390.5) and combinations of motor vehicles which meet the definition of a commercial motor vehicle are subject to the requirements of this part. All requirements that refer to motor vehicles with a GVWR below 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) are applicable only when the motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles meets the definition of a commercial motor vehicle.

http://www.highwaystarmagazine.com/images/Driver_Handbook.pdf

Two tie downs at each end, sum of all working load limits from tiedowns must be at least 50% of the weight of cargo.

Personally, I run 4 5/16" G70 chains. I'm running around 400% of the weight of cargo. There's no such thing as a tie-down that's too strong, though.

Mine go like this:
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f56/chevyman_57/trailer/chain.jpg

http://www.highwaystarmagazine.com/images/Driver_Handbook.pdf

Two tie downs at each end, sum of all working load limits from tiedowns must be at least 50% of the weight of cargo.

Personally, I run 4 5/16" G70 chains. I'm running around 400% of the weight of cargo. There's no such thing as a tie-down that's too strong, though.

Mine go like this:
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f56/chevyman_57/trailer/chain.jpg
So what does your crawler weight 2350# ? :p

Problem is in a direct tie down situation you can only count 50% of the wll of the tie-down -- so your 4700# rated 5/16 chain just became a 2350# rated chain. Giving you an aggregate working load limit of 9400# .

Still super safe and plenty of beef for a crawler....

uglyscout I'm curious about how you figured this. :confused: I never see heavy equipment tied down in any way other than the way nissancrawler posted. Granted you sometimes need more chains if it goes longer than a certain length or weight.

uglyscout I'm curious about how you figured this. :confused: I never see heavy equipment tied down in any way other than the way nissancrawler posted. Granted you sometimes need more chains if it goes longer than a certain length or weight.

The manual says that in a direct tie down (where the chain/etc goes directly from the equipment to the trailer) you only get 50% of the WLL....

BUT then they say you only have to have enough capacity for 50% of the total load. It doesn't make much sense but those are the rules. So if you throw out the 50% WLL and the 50% of total load and shoot for 100% you'll be fine.

I am not disagreeing with the tie down method or his capacity - just trying to out think the room... :D If I have to sit through another DOT equipment transport class my head will explode so I am doing some exploding here.

There are two tie down methods - direct as described above - and indirect where the tie down is attached to the trailer at both ends and passes through/over the equipment.

In direct you get 50% of the WLL
In indirect you get 100% of the WLL (Seems backwards doesn't it?)

BUT you must always start with 4 direct tie downs if your load is over 10,000 -- then add more of either to get to your desired limit.

So what does your crawler weight 2350# ? :p

Problem is in a direct tie down situation you can only count 50% of the wll of the tie-down -- so your 4700# rated 5/16 chain just became a 2350# rated chain. Giving you an aggregate working load limit of 9400# .

Still super safe and plenty of beef for a crawler....

Wrong.

Page 29 says: "To calculate Aggregate Working Load Limit, add together:

50% of the WLL for each end section of a tiedown that is attached to an anchor point.

50% of the WLL for each end section that is attached to the cargo.

Each end of the G70 chain is rated for 4700 pounds. 50% of that is 2350. and 50% of the other side (2350) and that makes 4700 pounds for each chain. x 4 chains = 18,800 WLL. My rig is about 5,000 pounds, which is roughly 1/4 of the WLL I have, which means 8x as strong as need be.

Ok it makes sense now what you were originally saying.

There are two tie down methods - direct as described above - and indirect where the tie down is attached to the trailer at both ends and passes through/over the equipment.

In direct you get 50% of the WLL
In indirect you get 100% of the WLL (Seems backwards doesn't it?)

As far as the indirect that makes sense also. Think of it like a line if you were pulling a vehicle out of the mud. A single line would be good for X weight in a straight line. If you added a snach block the line would only have 1/2 of X on each side. So in effect you have doubled the strength. Why they use 1/2 on each end is beyond me.

If you attach one end of the chain to the axle, and the other to the trailer the reg will let you have 2350# for the tie down. If you were to loop the axle and tie back to the trailer you should get the full 4700# for the tie down. IF I understand correctly what they are saying.

In direct you get 50% of the WLL
In indirect you get 100% of the WLL (Seems backwards doesn't it?)


Until someone can come along and explain the rational/physics behind it, it sounds more retarded than anything else.

I now use G43(?) 3/8" chain. WLL of chain and binders are now 5,400lbs each. (vs. WLL 3,300lbs for 2" straps).

Rig weighs about 4600lbs now, I've got no worries in either method. :laughing:

Good point - thanks for the link. But all that section only applies to commercial operators:

§ 393.1 Scope of the rules in this part.

(a) The rules in this part establish minimum standards for commercial motor vehicles as defined in §390.5 of this title. Only motor vehicles (as defined in §390.5) and combinations of motor vehicles which meet the definition of a commercial motor vehicle are subject to the requirements of this part. All requirements that refer to motor vehicles with a GVWR below 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) are applicable only when the motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles meets the definition of a commercial motor vehicle.

Good point.

I guess that means that all those cretins that tie down their junk with one flopping strap in the back and one 5/16" "no-grade" chain in the front are actually legal? :)


Joking aside, I would think that it would be good engineering and prudence to tie down in accordance with Fed DOT standards, commercial or not. In the case of the accident, if you can show that you met or exceeded commercial transport safety standards (i.e. 49 CFR 393.xx), then your potential legal liability is lessened.

Plus it's just good common sense.

Thanks,

Al

Joking aside, I would think that it would be good engineering and prudence to tie down in accordance with Fed DOT standards, commercial or not. In the case of the accident, if you can show that you met or exceeded commercial transport safety standards (i.e. 49 CFR 393.xx), then your potential legal liability is lessened.

Plus it's just good common sense.

Thanks,

Al

Agreed. Exact reason my trailer meets DOT lighting, and has reflective tape on over 50% of its length. I also figure if I meet FED DOT standards, I *should* be covered traveling from state to state for most laws.

(2) Tiedowns that are designed to be affixed to the structure of the automobile, light truck, or van must use the mounting points on those vehicles that have been specifically designed for that purpose.



So if you want to be legalistic - then tying down to the axles doesn't fit this, does it?

Anyone got a clue who gets to determine when a mounting point has "specifically been designed for that purpose"?



I've been tying mine down for years the same way:
One strap or chain across the rear axle from one side of the trailer to the other
One strap across the front axle from one side of the trailer to the other
Trailer winch to the front axle

I've never seen it move, or had a single strap come loose.

23 posts and no one said "search"

maybe this should be "sticky" now???????????????????

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=616072

















oh yeah, search bitches:flipoff2:

So if you want to be legalistic - then tying down to the axles doesn't fit this, does it?

Anyone got a clue who gets to determine when a mounting point has "specifically been designed for that purpose"?




There is some room for interpretation. The text you quoted is referring to the oval shaped holes punched in vehicle frames that are designed for the tow truck operator to insert his special "T" shaped anchor into. These holes are just a tease to anyone else because they are perfectly positioned for use as tiedown points, but normal chain hooks won't fit into them.

My truggy has large loops welded to the axles that are "specifically designed for that purpose" and easily accept any standard slip hook. I only run 2 binders, but there are 4 independent chains. The back two are tensioned by driving forward 4 inches and the front two use lever-action binders. Once it's all tied down, THEN I put the tranny in Park. I learned the hard way why lever-action is no longer permitted for commercial guys when I hit a bump hard enough to put slack in the chain. Now I make damn sure to wire-tie the binder handle to the chain every time I tie down. That event was also the reason I switched from tying the frame to tying the axles. I put a little tension on it with the trailer winch as an extra safety measure, but never as a primary anchor.

I learned the hard way why lever-action is no longer permitted for commercial guys when I hit a bump hard enough to put slack in the chain. Now I make damn sure to wire-tie the binder handle to the chain every time I tie down.

See here: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8284064#post8284064

When did they outlaw lever binders for commercial transport? Links?