I have a 77 dodge truck with a 2 inch body lift and 33 inchers, and like yall know bigger is better, im looking for good (cheaper) mods that i can get away with from other year trucks or other models, unload what ya know on me, the truck is a 360/727/np203 mix with stock axles ie 44and 9.25

what i would like to do is about 4 inches of lift, a flat bed, half cab w/full cage, cut fenders and 38s or so, looking for more power out of the 360, i can pick up a 76 f-250 for cheap (free) was thinking of building a sub-frame for its spring width, mate the 360 with the t-18 / np435 and 205 and running the drive shafts to the 3/4 ton 44 and dana 60 in the rear, with plans for an ORD doubler in the future, sound good or am i looking for a flaming??

Why bother with a sub-frame? Inboard the stock rear springs directly under the frame for more flex; with a shackle flip and the mounts at more or less the same altitude as stock you'll get 4" there. You can also run 73-87 GM front lift springs up front if you can find those easier/cheaper; I did ($75/pair). Bushings will need to be "customized" on a lathe, and while I was at it I added grease zerks, upped the bolt size, and made longer shackles out of 3/8" plate.

If you really want flex, use 63" springs from a half-ton Chevy/GM, '88-up. Unfortunately the front mounts for the rear springs may interfere with the fuel tank; but I'm sure there's a way around this - probably spacing the tank away from the frame just a little would be easiest. Running these springs up front will require extending the front mount - frame horns some, and hurt approach angle (unless that's already been compromised by a winch).

im looking to run the 3/4 ton fords driveline in my truck so i can use my 203 for the ORD doubler, the sub-frame would be for the front not the rear, so i can mount the fords dana up front and just re-do spring pads in the rear for the dana 60

whats the advantage/reason your using the ford running gear? if its for the ford dana 44 its a big waste of time. with a V-8, doubler and 38's your gonna be on spicer's mailing list with the amount of axles you go through. if its for a rev. cut ford dana 60 then i'd say go for it. just my .02 ;)

see the deal is the f-250 is a great price, its free, and as for the dana 60, its in the plans, i just gotta get the funding on a college student budject, so it will be a while, also, i have my machineists degree and am a Mech Engineering major so i have design software and a nice machine shop at my disposal, how hard would it be to duplicate the ORD doubler adaptor??

Reasons for the ford no c-clips in the rear axle, full floater rear no more full-time 4x4, Twin stick the 205, no more shitty unit bearing design that i have to pull the wheels to grease any more, a gear driven transfer case with the chance of a 32 spline front out-put, granny gear

also the man im getting the 250 from has a pto adaptor for a bed mounted winch that used to be on a wrecker, any ideas what i should offer for the adaptor and the winch, its a large one thats still in fairly good shape, also, any way i can tell if the trans is a t-18 or a np435, also, if there is not a tag on the rear axle, which i dont think there is, how do i tell the diffrence between a 60 and 70 since they use the same diff cover

if you just have to get out here right now i say go for it, but i'm sticking to what i said ealier. its seems free for a little while til you start adding up the cost of axles, agrevation, etc............;)

on the 70 the housing should extend further than the cover, and it may be marked on the 3rd member.

Why don't you just wheel the Ford? ;) Or the Dodge, for that matter?

I agree with Fullsize. Don't mean to flame, just expressing my opinion here. 60's are great, but you're going from a much larger axleshaft in the 9-1/4 to a pretty weak 30-spline - photos in this section a while back. In the webbing on the passenger side of the diff there should be a casting number that will tell you what it is (a 30-spline 60 unless previously swapped - no 70's in F250's, except maybe the rare "snowfighter" trucks with HP kingpin front 60's). The fix here is to bore out the spindles and go with 35-spline shafts, which adds ~$400 just for the shafts.

How do you plan to grease the bearings on that Ford axle without pulling the wheels? That's gotta be a neat trick. While the inner shafts are the same diameter and spline, you'd be losing 1.5" 35-spline outers for small 19-spline stubs on the Ford axle, and adding something else to break (manual lockouts - aka hub fuse). With 38's on a 44 you'll be blowing up all sorts of parts (if you wheel it) until getting 4340 shafts and CTM joints - which, for the Ford axle, will set you back about a kilobuck. Going with the big Dodge stub shafts and alloy inners / CTM joints will save you $3-400.

I don't like subframes at all; but that's just my subjective opinion.

Mating the Dodge 203 to the Ford transmission will not be straightforward. Ford bolt pattern is 6-bolt round, with a 31-spline shaft; your Dodge looks like \_/ with a round top, seven bolts, and a 23-spline input. Sure it can be done (since you said that you have access to a good machine shop) but it won't be quick or easy.

Adapting the Ford transmission to a Dodge bellhousing could be the least troublesome part of what you've suggested. A friend of Ramstein's did this a while back; I don't have the details but it seemed to happen pretty quickly.

That PTO winch is the only part that I find mildly interesting; I'd try to snag that and incorporate it into what you're already running.

When I was in college, my time to work on stuff like this was rather limited. You think you'll have a lot of time, now that it's summer - just wait until your first 20-unit semester. And believe me when I say that you have not known pain and suffering until you meet the second-order nonlinear partial differential equations. IMHO what you're proposing is so involved that you won't be able to finish it, let alone wheel it - and the cost/benefit analysis REALLY sucks. I've seen too many grand projects started and abandoned to not say that this sounds very much like one.

My suggestion: ditch the body lift, make some rear spring hangers for a shackle flip (cheap/free in your shop), and get some cheap soft 4" front springs ($50-100 in junkyard). 4340 inners and CTM's for your 44 for now ($700), lockers ($1K), tires ($800), and when you have time try bobbing the shaft and making the adapter for a doubler - you can pick up a spare Dodge 203 and a GM/Dodge 205 cheap ($50-150 each). This approach minimizes cost, down-time, and allows you to wheel a pretty capable and durable rig while working on the hard/expensive parts.

If this sounds expensive, remember you'll be buying all of this stuff to go with the Ford running gear, plus extras (just a couple listed above). Just my thoughts. :beer:

ok.. now that ford f-250 shoudl have a leaf sprung d44 front, right? if so, arent the spring pearches 32" wide, the same as a chevy d60, which is only like 1" off of a dodge d60? Assuming so.. that d44 should just bolt in place of your current d44. Then take that 205, custom build an adapter (no, i dont think they are that hard to build if you are good in a machine shop.. just need to re-spline the 203 shaft) to mate it to the dodge 203. Then forget about that rear axle.. same some $$$ and buy a GM 14 bolt. then hook up your driveshafts, get a steering box off a 2wd dodge, hook up a new pitman arm.. and you'll have a good truck. Thats how I woudl do it if i had that equiptment. And where did big dodge stub shafts come from? mine are 1.31" 19 spline..
but thats just my $0.02

Garrett

Originally posted by Hick
And where did big dodge stub shafts come from? mine are 1.31" 19 spline..
Garrett

Fulltime '70s axles have the big stub shafts.

i guess it is because i have the milemarker part time kit in my 77 d44

F250's gonna be a dana 60 rear, the dana 70 will say "70" on the lower right side of the Diff. IT will also have an axle tube that narrows at the wheels. The spring perches are 40in center to center on the dana 70s.

Sorry no d60 tech help.

TTT :massey: <who is that, run a shop or something?