Hey guy's...

Does it matter which direction the pan-hard (track-rod) is mounted...Right side or left side of the frame?

I'm *thinking* that I should put it on the drivers side (left) and down to the axle because of the torque effect of the front axle under driving loads...Then again it sure would be easier to mount it on the right side of the frame for diff clearance and ease of mounting the lower on the axle tube. Either way I'm having a hard time seeing any difference at all considering the fact that I'll have no drag-link.

O'yea...And what size speakers can I fit in my dash area with the stock radio? :flipoff2:

Anyone got a good source for 'fantasy fur'? I'm thining about covering my dash in hot pink 2" deep fur...:flipoff2: :flipoff2:

I always thought that the panhard rod or trac-bar needed to run parallel with the draglink for proper steering and axle alignment. So unless your steering box is on the passenger side I would say it needs to come off the frame from the drivers side.

No drag link...

Originally posted by onsafari
I always thought that the panhard rod or trac-bar needed to run parallel with the draglink for proper steering and axle alignment. So unless your steering box is on the passenger side I would say it needs to come off the frame from the drivers side.

full hydro steering :eek:

On my truck the Panhard rod comes off of the frame right next to the steering drop arm (Drivers side), and mounts to the axle on the passenger side of the differential. I am assuming this answers your question?

No...(thanks though)...I'm wondering about the dynamics of the axle movement relative to the torque effect of the drive-shaft. That is to say, would the pan-hard mounting point (left or right) have a significant effect in this regard. (I honestly can't see were it would have any effect what so ever...)

Too much roll-center/axis and CG talk lately...Got me thinking again.

-D

hmmm. good question Doug? I have never considered that before. I will have to think about this for a little while.

Sean

I cant see it making a big difference either if you are talking about mounting it at the same point on either side of the frame with the same angle traveling down to the axle. It still passes throught the same centlerline of the vehicle, right. Does it affect more than lateral axle location and bumpsteer? Sam may know how it feels, I think his is mounted reverse of ours(based on the fact that I can see his drag link mounted opposite ours). May be a good Q for the general forum.

Johnathan

I think you will be fine either way. I would run it from the frame on the passenger side down to the axle on the drivers side. With all of your articulation you may run into clearance issues trying to mount it around the diff. Mine (run in stock type location) has very little clearance at full stuff (maybe 1/2"ish). I imagine that you will want to run it high from the ground for clearance and I cannot see this being done if mounted in the conventional manner.

Way

P.S. a nice touch after the furry dash will be some pink handcuffs with fur on them hanging from the rear view. Remember the key to making it look good is to make everything coordinate....:flipoff2:

Thanks guy's...Adam I think your right...Looking at it, it's gonna' be a heck of a lot easier to mount like you stated. I'll have to put a bend in it anyway (I think) because I plan on running it over the axle tube itself (less frame clearance issues there). During full stuff (passenger side) I might contact the top of the pumpkin...The 60 is F'in' huge and my oil filter is almost kissing the top/front of the pig. Pics soon to follow.

--D

i don't think it really matters which side it's mounted form.

LHD and RHD rovers have them on different sides, but it only seems that way due to the mounting bracket, which is part of the steering box mount, so i assume that LR do this to save $$$$

the axle casings have both LH and RH mountings for the panhard rod too, so obviously must be swappable.

on a similar note, does it make much difference if the panhard rod isn't parrallel with the axle? on a 'stock' vehicle (havn't seen one of those for a while!) the rod is virtually horizontal, but as you lift the vehicle the rod starts to angle down.

has anyone lengthened and bent the rod to keep it on the horizontal at all? any difference in handling?

Jamie

Jamie, I'll give you what little info I know about the panhard rod. It's supposed to be parallel with the draglink, and as close to parallel with the ground (axle) as possible. Both of these help to prevent bump steer.

I'm in the process of making a dropped drag link along with a matching dropped panhard rod. I'm hoping this will cure the bump steer that I have. I'll post an update once I get them on.

Not to complain....but....this post is about panhard rod placement on a vehicle with full hydraulic steering. All this talk of being parallel to the drag link is true (although Doug could probably talk for hours on the subject and wouldn't post about it).

One thing to consider is you could have your panhard rod do a loopty loop and it wouldn't make one hell of a difference. It is where it attaches that makes a difference. Putting a bend in a panhard rod is for clearance issues and does not help bump steer at all.

Where I think relevant information to THIS post will be found is discussing forces placed on the bracketry by having the panhard rod on different sides. Doug will build everything overkill, so that is not much of a concern. As far as where he chooses to attach etc., might be an area to discuss.

Way

I know we're steering off topic from the original question, but I wanted to add this and then I'll hush.

The bend in the panhard won't be to counter the bump steer, it will be to keep it parallel with the draglink, which WILL counter the bump steer. I was simply answering someone's question. None of this has shiat to do with the original question, so I'm done.:)

Originally posted by Greg Davis
I know we're steering off topic from the original question, but I wanted to add this and then I'll hush.

The bend in the panhard won't be to counter the bump steer, it will be to keep it parallel with the draglink, which WILL counter the bump steer. I was simply answering someone's question. None of this has shiat to do with the original question, so I'm done.:)

You really didn't understand what Way just said did you?

The bend in the Panhard bar had nothingt to do with how it makes the suspension move. If you put a bend in your Panhard to make it parallel with your draglink, you have done nothing to remove bump steer. It is not the actuall path that the Panhard take from point A to point B, it is the straight line connecting point A to point B that matters.

If you need to adjust your panhard posion to match your drag link you need to do that by moving the mounting locations either on the axle or frame.

Sean

You explained it much better than I did. But your are absolutely correct.

Way

Next thing you know, someone will prolly say they dont have to be black to work just as good. :rolleyes:

Actually the one on the crew cab is white! :flipoff2:

I should attatch a pic of the bracket Coop made for me to allow the panhard rod to clear the Saginaw pump.

Does anyone want to see it? I'd have to dig it up on one of the 4 80-gig hard drives I have packed away.

BTW, it places the end of the panhard rod in the same location, it just curves around from the inside of the frame rail rather than the outside.

I painted it sexy red Hammerite too! :cool2:

OK, Ok, due to the overwhelming response here it is.

:flipoff2:

Wow, that is some excellebt fabrication. Either you are rich, or you are nat paying this guy nearly enough, because that is some top notch work.

Sean

I guess I just don't get it. I've always thought the draglink and panhard have to be parallel. If not, then they travel through different arcs which will contribute to bump steer. If that's not the case, then why bother to keep them parallel at all?

Doug, sorry for horning in on your topic, but now I need to know so I don't waste time building something that won't affect my suspension.

Greg,

I think we have you confused. To explain it as simple as possible. Doug is running full hyraulic steering. Full hydraulic steering uses a hydraulic ram to move the knuckles. There is no drag link used in this set-up therefore there are no geometry issues.

If you are going to build a pan hard bar and are looking to improve your bump steer. The first step to take is to make a new brackets that either drops the frame mount and/or raises the axle mount.

A bend in the pan hard (a.k.a. trac bar) with NO change in the frame and/or axle mount WON'T do anything. Once you move the mounts, you will most likely have to build a custom panhard bar with bends for clearance reasons. There is no need to go to all of the work of bending a panhard if you are not having clearance problems. In some cases the bar is weakened by bending it. Sooooo.......move your brackets and make a straight panhard rod if possible. By moving the brackets you make the mounting points more parallel to the drag link thus solving the geomtery issues you caused by lifting your vehicle. IT IS NOT THE BAR THAT YOU NEED TO WORRY ABOUT, IT IS THE MOUNTS.

Way

Don't worry about the post...The pan-hard is going on the PS down to the axle.

I think Adam and Greg are saying the same thing. Yes they should be II. No, bending won't fix anything, but I don't think that's what Greg was trying to do in his original post.

Lifting your rig, shouldn't significantly change the geometry between the pan-hard and the drag-link...At least not enough to worry about...It has basically the same attachment points. And besides, what's all this talk about bump-steer anyway? I've been over 4" on my "old" 90 and never had a noticable problem (notice "my" noticable is a lot less than the "standard" Rover owners noticable). I've seen TJ's almost leave the road with 5" lift and a good compression...Now THAT's bumpsteer!

On thing worth mentioning, at 4" of lift (or so) your front axle will be over about 1"-1.5" to the left...So building an adjustable pan-hard is a great idea if you like to change ride heights often.

--D